Chat log from the meeting on 2022-01-04

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[10:59] Motoko.Karu hihi everyone.. hi Ubit.. Hi Gavin.. Happy New years to you as well
[10:59] Gavin.Hird Happy New Year Andrew
[11:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, everyone.
[11:00] Jamie.Jordan Hey everybody Happy New Year
[11:00] Gavin.Hird Andrew is still winter pale in the new year
[11:00] Ubit Umarov: happy new year everyonr
[11:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Happy new year, Gavin.
[11:00] Motoko.Karu =)
[11:00] Ubit Umarov: yeah he is
[11:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Gavin, not surprising considering how cold it is outside.
[11:00] Andrew Hellershanks: :)
[11:01] Gavin.Hird :-)
[11:01] Gavin.Hird How cold is that?
[11:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Um... yesterday it was -18C.
[11:01] Ubit Umarov: some tell stories about the monsters hidding on teleports space
[11:01] Ubit Umarov: and work hg
[11:01] Ubit Umarov: how they can eat ones' colors
[11:01] Jagga Meredith: `-36 windchill here
[11:02] Andrew Hellershanks: It has warmed up today. It is now right at the freezing mark.
[11:02] Gavin.Hird where might that be Jagga?
[11:02] Gavin.Hird Sounds like Norther Norway these days
[11:02] Jagga Meredith: Edmonton
[11:02] Gavin.Hird Northern*
[11:02] Andrew Hellershanks: oh, another Canuck is at the bar. :)
[11:03] Gavin.Hird Yesterday a bus full of Italian tourists blew off the road in -18C and full gale wind
[11:03] Ubit Umarov: outch
[11:04] Gavin.Hird Happy New Year Selby
[11:04] Selby.Evans hi everyone
[11:04] Ubit Umarov: hi welcome to 2022
[11:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, Selby.
[11:05] Motoko.Karu Hihi Selby
[11:05] Selby.Evans Happy New Year, everyobe
[11:05] Selby.Evans everyone
[11:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Here we are for the first meeting of a new year. Let's hope we see things returning to something resembling "normal" before this year is out.
[11:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Happy New year, Selby.
[11:06] Motoko.Karu what's 'normal' these days? I've forgotten
[11:06] Ubit Umarov: uff meanwhile worse still to come
[11:06] Motoko.Karu ^_^
[11:06] Ubit Umarov: possible..
[11:06] Andrew Hellershanks: yeah, getting hard to remember as it has been almost two years since we had "normal".
[11:08] Ubit Umarov: yeah well
[11:08] Ubit Umarov: what about opensim? what news?
[11:08] Gavin.Hird There is this lenghty interview by Joe Rogan with the inventor of the mRNA vaccines people might want to listen to. It was scrubbed from YT and Twitter.
[11:09] Ubit Umarov: ty
[11:09] Gavin.Hird Opensim
[11:10] Gavin.Hird I have tested all your changes except those submitted today
[11:10] Gavin.Hird seems to work fine
[11:10] Kayaker Magic: When is OSGrid going to fix the assets? Half of my inventory cannot rez any more.
[11:10] Ubit Umarov: todays one is just some minor speedups
[11:10] Ubit Umarov: can suffer at most for typos
[11:10] Gavin.Hird isn't the ETA on that mid January or something?
[11:11] Ubit Umarov: i did read commits a few times..  but that does not mean much :)
[11:11] Ubit Umarov: sometimes it takes like 6 months to my typos to became visible to me ;)
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: osg assets no idea
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: guess the move still going on
[11:12] Gavin.Hird there has been some interesting typos in the viewer code too lingering for years
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: and we have another big crash yesterday
[11:12] Andrew Hellershanks: I haven't seen any progress reports or estimates on when the migration will be done.
[11:12] Gavin.Hird big crash?
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: yeah assets services failed,. grid services where all disable just in case
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: a few hours.. again
[11:13] Gavin.Hird oh
[11:13] Jagga Meredith: ok was wondering about all the red on my console
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: guess operation is on the last stage
[11:14] Ubit Umarov: but going slow and having, lets say glitchs like yesterday
[11:14] Gavin.Hird hopefully not terminal stage
[11:14] Andrew Hellershanks: :)
[11:14] Ubit Umarov: yeah lets hope not that kind of terminal
[11:15] Motoko.Karu hehe
[11:15] Gavin.Hird VT102
[11:15] Motoko.Karu wyse... amber...
[11:15] Andrew Hellershanks: hehe
[11:15] Ubit Umarov: well new assets boxes are new..  on a good datecenter.. and even cheaper
[11:15] Ubit Umarov: that's also nice to grid finances
[11:16] Jagga Meredith: Gavin heh
[11:16] Andrew Hellershanks: Hope they are still close to the other servers used by the grid. I've seen problems when servers are split across continents.
[11:16] Jagga Meredith: /'
[11:16] Ubit Umarov: just the kind of assets service is not benn proving that good, and the transfer, well sloow
[11:16] Jagga Meredith: (cat)
[11:16] Ubit Umarov: they are andrew
[11:16] Andrew Hellershanks: Good
[11:16] Andrew Hellershanks: jagga, :)
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: but on a gird like osgrid that means they are not far from other regions
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: left in texas :)
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: are now..
[11:17] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, Jamie
[11:17] Gavin.Hird Don't mess with Texas
[11:17] Motoko.Karu lol
[11:17] Andrew Hellershanks: I wonder how many GB of asset data they have (had) to move.
[11:18] Gavin.Hird you can up that to TB
[11:18] Jagga Meredith: there's big network pipe from Texas to Canada, unlike Germany
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: think bulk data move was done
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: but now assets need to be "injected" on the new thing
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: but jsut guessing.. no details
[11:19] Andrew Hellershanks: Gavin, TB? ok. No wonder it is taking a while. I had to move around 85GB or more between servers and that took a while.
[11:19] Gavin.Hird as long as it does not need boosting after...
[11:19] Ubit Umarov: guess raw data was like 5TB
[11:20] Andrew Hellershanks: Ouch. That's when you want really a fast Internet connection between servers.
[11:20] Motoko.Karu don't use dms-services.. <shudders>
[11:21] Motoko.Karu *aws-dms-services
[11:21] Gavin.Hird load the data on a smartphone, fly/drive to the new location, unload the data
[11:21] Ubit Umarov: hard to fly with covid
[11:21] Gavin.Hird it is still possible here
[11:21] Ubit Umarov: well and can be drive in this case
[11:21] Motoko.Karu we had to perform a client export where the data was copied to a drive..and shipped to said client.. cause they couldn't figure out how to use sftp... or s3
[11:21] Andrew Hellershanks: Not that hard. I hear a lot more planes flying overhead now than a year ago.
[11:22] Kayaker Magic: Your smarphone holds terrabytes of data?
[11:22] Gavin.Hird not mine, but...
[11:22] Ubit Umarov: did ear that 1st Lor was carried on hard disks
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: one  day the guy carring the disks got the idea he was been followed :)
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: scary.. the main master copy of the thing :)
[11:24] Andrew Hellershanks: I have one OpenSim question. Has anyone tried contacting an inworld object using an external (HTTP) request? I'm thinking specifically of when using YEngine, although the scripting engine may not have an impact on if it works or not.
[11:24] Ubit Umarov: but no net transfers.. plain physical move of hardisks
[11:24] Ubit Umarov: yeap ppl do that
[11:24] Kayaker Magic: I use llRequestURL a lot, it does work
[11:24] Andrew Hellershanks: I know someone who is interested in having status from a real world device show up on a virtual display inworld.
[11:25] Kayaker Magic: Also llHTTPRequest
[11:25] Gavin.Hird Initial backup loads is often by shipping disks to offsite backup provider
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: you do need to set that thing at opensim.ini
[11:25] Motoko.Karu aws has their snowball service.. which ships around a drive/nas-pack for data-transfer(s)
[11:25] Andrew Hellershanks: ok. I haven't used it for some time, Kayaker. I have the scripts I used to use. I have scripts that call out but I don't quite remember the set up for doing inbound.
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: ;# {ExternalHostNameForLSL} {} {Hostname to use for HTTP-IN URLs. This should be reachable from the internet.} {}
    ;; Hostname to use in llRequestURL/llRequestSecureURL
    ;; if not defined - llRequestURL/llRequestSecureURL are disabled
    ;ExternalHostNameForLSL =
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: this thing
[11:26] Kayaker Magic: llRequestURL requires a setting in Regions.ini to tell it the base URL....
[11:26] Andrew Hellershanks: Ubit, I remember that part. It has been set, IIRC.
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: i just pasted that
[11:26] Kayaker Magic: Yeah, that setting
[11:27] Ubit Umarov: the should work with good script :)
[11:27] Ubit Umarov: then
[11:27] Andrew Hellershanks: I'll have another go at it later. First step was to send a message to an inworld object using my standalone to remember how it needs to be done.
[11:28] Gavin.Hird and port numbers also work with that address?
[11:28] Kayaker Magic: You can have a script poll an external server with llHTTPRequest if you don't do it too often and your data is not real time.
[11:28] Andrew Hellershanks: Gavin, IIRC, you need the port number of the OS instance.
[11:28] Gavin.Hird ...if you need to nAT it through to the right host
[11:28] Gavin.Hird NAT*
[11:28] Ubit Umarov: the region tells tou the port
[11:29] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, Michael.
[11:29] Ubit Umarov: if i remember
[11:29] Bill's Chair whispers: This is Bill's Chair
[11:29] Gavin.Hird Bill's chair has spoken
[11:29] Kayaker Magic: Some server hosting systems balk at URLs with port numers.
[11:30] Andrew Hellershanks: Michael, You can have a seat on the other side of the bar.
[11:30] Ubit Umarov: "HTTP-in is not on the usual http port number; the url it provided in the http_request event includes the correct port number."
[11:30] Bill's Chair whispers: This is Bill's Chair
[11:30] Ubit Umarov:
[11:30] Gavin.Hird ok, thanks Ubit
[11:31] Gavin.Hird so it is the same port number the simulator http address is on
[11:32] Ubit Umarov: ops port is fixed
[11:32] Kayaker Magic: Welcome Lyr!
[11:32] Ubit Umarov: string url = "http://" + ExternalHostNameForLSL + ":" + m_HttpServer.Port.ToString() + "/lslhttp/" + urlcode.ToString();
[11:32] Lyr.Lobo grins
[11:32] Andrew Hellershanks: Gavin, the page says the URL returned includes the port number to use.
[11:32] Lyr.Lobo thanks....and hello!
[11:33] Michael.Christopher hi! :)
[11:33] Gavin.Hird Happy New Year Lyr
[11:33] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, Lry.
[11:33] Andrew Hellershanks: um... Lyr.
[11:33] Lyr.Lobo Happy New Year! *grins*
[11:33] Gavin.Hird fixed, Ubit?
[11:33] Andrew Hellershanks: :)
[11:33] Ubit Umarov: hi Lyr, welcome to 2022
[11:33] Michael.Christopher Yes, Happy New Year all!
[11:33] Ubit Umarov: it is the region main http port gavin.Hird
[11:33] Motoko.Karu hihi Lyr
[11:33] Gavin.Hird Happy New Year Michale
[11:34] Lyr.Lobo grins at the warm welcome
[11:34] Gavin.Hird I think you mean simulator
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: region
[11:34] Gavin.Hird a multi region simulator only has one http address, right?
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: just happens it is the same :p
[11:34] Selby.Evans Hi Lyr
[11:34] Gavin.Hird :-)
[11:35] Kayaker Magic: I have a region setup question: How is the viewer search implimented? Is there a helper PHP script? Where is the setup documented?
[11:35] Ubit Umarov: no idea why that port was not made configurable
[11:35] Gavin.Hird depedns on which search you are talking about Kayaker
[11:35] Andrew Hellershanks: The viewer needs to know the URL of an external page that will handle the search.
[11:35] Ubit Umarov: it is a external web service
[11:35] Ubit Umarov: you can get the osgrid module and see
[11:36] Kayaker Magic: The spyglass icon button at the bottom of the viewer.
[11:36] Gavin.Hird agent and group are searchable directly from the viewer to the grid
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: think andrew there may have a idea how that works.. i wonder why...
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: ;)
[11:36] Andrew Hellershanks: I started working on a search page to go along with the ossearch module but didn't finish it.
[11:36] Gavin.Hird the rest is via external php
[11:37] Ubit Umarov: wel we don't have it on core
[11:39] Kayaker Magic: Same question about classifieds: Those done with a PHP helper?
[11:40] Gavin.Hird yes
[11:40] Kayaker Magic: How does the viewer know where to send these? Is there a protocol to the server and the server has an INI setting to point to the helper?
[11:41] Ubit Umarov: we tell them on simulator features i think
[11:41] Ubit Umarov: gridinfo can also have it
[11:43] Gavin.Hird in Robust.HG.ini
[11:43] Gavin.Hird ; Url to search service
[11:43] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, The viewer has an entry for Grid Search (that is the name shown in Firestorm). Classifieds is part of the profile module. They are supported using the addon OpenSimProfile module I maintain. I haven't tested classifieds using the built in profile module.
[11:43] Gavin.Hird example for XMIR: SearchURL =
[11:44] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, You will need an external cron job to handle expiry of old classified ads or ones for which a user no longer has sufficient local currency to renew the add.
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: <key>search-server-url</key>
[11:44] Gavin.Hird and it is set up under [LoginService]
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: for example on a osgrid region
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: simulator features
[11:45] Michael.Christopher Expecting our new developer systems in this friday finally, did anyone else get to enabling https for OS core yet?
[11:45] Gavin.Hird I also have this in my OpenSim.ini fies:
[11:45] Gavin.Hird [Search]
    SearchURL =
    ;;OpenSimSearch module 
    SearchModule = "OpenSimSearch"
[11:46] Andrew Hellershanks: Thanks. I found the PHP file I started. The calls to an external search page are XMLRPC based.
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: no rush on https for opensim
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: it is a pure useless waste of resouces
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: you can protect grid using a proxy than can do https and tunnel to robust
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: i did run regions with full ssl..
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: but still needs some work
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: and did nothing robust side
[11:47] Michael.Christopher did you write a tutorial on that already?
[11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: The XMLRPC call includes a setting "panel=" for type of panel being requested. I've seen "showcase_panel" and "q" (show all panels).
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: ofc not
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: :p
[11:48] Motoko.Karu :)
[11:48] Michael.Christopher ok, sounds like there is where i should pick up then lol
[11:48] Gavin.Hird you also need a wildcard ssl certificate potentially
[11:48] Michael.Christopher we have that part
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: as i said the code can use more clean up
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: and nothing on robust side
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: configuration on robust will be.. lets say..  funny
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: and for no use
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: ssl is useless
[11:49] Gavin.Hird LL tried turning off TLS 1.0 and 1.1
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: you are no back :p
[11:49] Gavin.Hird they ahd to turn it on again
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: and no bank either
[11:50] Michael.Christopher we use enough subdomains that a wildcard was essential - and thank you ubit.
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: yeha only tls 3 is "legal now"
[11:51] Ubit Umarov: and as i said grids can put robust behind a firewall that does ssl for relevant services like login
[11:51] Ubit Umarov: thing osgird has that
[11:51] Ubit Umarov: wel cloudfare seems to be offering such service and more for free now
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: opensimFest had all visible robust on https
[11:54] Andrew Hellershanks: Less than 10 minutes to the top of the hour. Any other questions for today?
[11:54] Michael.Christopher im good, anyone else got anything?
[11:54] Gavin.Hird too early in the year to start thinking
[11:55] Michael.Christopher lol
[11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Any viewer news, Gavin, or were you just enjoying a break from coding over the holidays?
[11:55] Ubit Umarov: oh i was thinking it was already 2 late to start thinking gavin :)
[11:55] Gavin.Hird there is always some changes going in but not much to write home about quite yet
[11:56] Gavin.Hird I had an interesting experience with the LL viewer after upgrading a machine to the latest version of macOS
[11:56] Ubit Umarov: you don't need to write home gavin..  jut git
[11:56] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, If you are interested in a PHP based search I can share the PHP file I started. It has some information about the data passed to it from the viewer.
[11:56] Michael.Christopher @gavin - interesting how?
[11:56] Gavin.Hird The system threw up a message saying: This app will not work on future versions of the system. Please contact the developer for a new version.
[11:56] Andrew Hellershanks: Ubit,:)
[11:56] Kayaker Magic: Aren't there working versions of that in Wifi or somewhere?
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: diva?
[11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, not that I recall.
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: Diva will release her things for
[11:57] Michael.Christopher Gavin - i'll bet it has something to do with switching over to the M1 chip over intel
[11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: oh, the Diva wifi. I was thinking of opensimwi. Completely different beast.
[11:57] Gavin.Hird no
[11:58] Gavin.Hird In their depseration to notraize the viewer, they have given themselves socalled entitlements that has left a gaping security hole that Apple has said will not work on future system versions
[11:58] Michael.Christopher oh
[11:58] Michael.Christopher oops
[11:58] Gavin.Hird so rather than writing the code as it sahll be written, they procastinate and try to weasel their way out of it, making it worse and worse over time
[11:59] Michael.Christopher smh
[11:59] Ubit Umarov: procastinate is a fun word, and a very actrative practice
[11:59] Gavin.Hird lol
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: hmm my stream now seems to like moolight shadow a lot
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: keeps playing it
[12:01] Lyr.Lobo grins
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: ie the stream here
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: well at least it is working :)
[12:01] Gavin.Hird I have not hear Mike Oldfiled since the 1980s
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: i did a few times on this stream :p
[12:02] Lyr.Lobo grins
[12:02] Lyr.Lobo Tubular Bells
[12:02] Gavin.Hird I have the vinyl album
[12:02] Andrew Hellershanks: That's the only thing I think of when i hear that name.
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: well think i didn't add tubular bells to playlist
[12:02] Lyr.Lobo yes
[12:03] Lyr.Lobo hehe no worries, just knew that was how most associate his work
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: it was a tsfh and sabaton only stream :)
[12:03] Andrew Hellershanks: Last call for any other OpenSim related comments or questions to end this first meeting of 2022.
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: opps yes.. meeting
[12:04] Andrew Hellershanks: I'm not seeing anyone typing so that will do it for today.
[12:04] Ubit Umarov: so .. opensim.. yes..
[12:04] Motoko.Karu :)
[12:04] Selby.Evans bye all
[12:04] Motoko.Karu see ya
[12:04] Ubit Umarov: cya sleby
[12:04] Kayaker Magic: RL is calling me.
[12:04] Andrew Hellershanks: I hope you all enjoyed the holidays. Let's hope for a better year this year than the last couple. Thank you all for coming. See you again next year.
[12:04] Kayaker Magic whispers: Merry New Year all!
[12:04] Ubit Umarov: selby also
[12:04] Andrew Hellershanks: Bye, Selby.
[12:04] Gavin.Hird Bye to all departing agents
[12:05] Lyr.Lobo Goodbye *smiles*  Merry New year!
[12:05] Michael.Christopher bye@!
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