Chat log from the meeting on 2019-07-30

[11:09] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: We have a good attendance here now with most of the regular attendees. Time to get this show on the road. :)
[11:09] Ubit Umarov: ok, so andrew, what are the topics for today ?
[11:09] Ubit Umarov: ;)
[11:09] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Welcome to another of the weekly OpenSim developer meetings.
[11:09] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org grins at Ubit.
[11:10] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Let see what Gavin and/or Kayaker have in the way of questions.
[11:10] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Gavin, do you have any other questions left over from last time?
[11:10] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I am not sure I have much for entertainment today
[11:10] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: ok. np.
[11:11] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: How about you, Kayaker?
[11:11] Kayaker Magic: The 0.8 code had terrible hysteresis on aiming weapons in mouse-look mode, 0.9 is a lot better but not perfect. Where in the code would I look to see how that is done?
[11:11] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: hm... Good question.
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: avatar rotation is confusing
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: it does rotate the head, only then the body
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: there are special animations that we can't replace, that improve that, moving the torso also, so a gun does point closer to the target
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: the sl aim ones
[11:13] Kayaker Magic: But the cursor is drawn in the right place, how can I find out where the cursor is placed?
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: those trigger special code on viewers to do that
[11:14] Ubit Umarov: but we can't tell any other to do the same
[11:14] Ubit Umarov: at least as far as i know
[11:15] Ubit Umarov: so without those, a gun is moved with the main avatar body, thats a few degrees off
[11:16] Kayaker Magic: Oh, I never expect the gun to look like it is pointing in the right direction.
[11:16] Kayaker Magic: But I wish I could find out where the cursor was really pointing.
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: we only get a direction
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: lookat etc
[11:17] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Did you ask in SL forums?
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: i would like to that the focal point of the camera.. but nahh
[11:18] Kayaker Magic: It works very well in SL, so nothing to ask there.
[11:18] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: ok
[11:20] Ubit Umarov: i think shots do go to where you point here
[11:21] Kayaker Magic: To look at the code, I should start looking at the implimentation of llGetCameraRot?
[11:21] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: They did the last time I was trying out a snowball thrower device.
[11:21] Ubit Umarov: possible yes kayaker
[11:22] Ubit Umarov: main issue i see it guns pointing in other direction.. odd effect :)
[11:22] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: you can use a ray to find out exactly where it is going , visually
[11:22] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: or even a particle stream
[11:23] Kayaker Magic: Hmm, I'm running an old test script and llGetCameraRot is working better than I recall.
[11:23] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: I should say where it is pointing as opposed to the avatar/crosshairs
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: 0.9 as changes on those things
[11:24] Kayaker Magic: Isnt the direction the weapon mesh pointing adjustable like any attachment?
[11:26] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: yeah you can adjust it, but sometimes the axis gets mussed up if your rays or bullets are set to leave via a certain point
[11:28] Kayaker Magic: Here's a question for Gavin: Is there a mantis for submitting questions to you about your viewer?
[11:28] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: especially with mesh the visual look is not always lined up with the axis
[11:28] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Right now you can do on the forum
[11:28] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: there is a JIRA, but not public yet
[11:29] Kayaker Magic: url to the forum please?
[11:29] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: https://www.dayturn.com/viewer/index.php?forums/support.15/
[11:30] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Any other questions, Kayaker?
[11:31] Kayaker Magic: I haven't been back long enough to accumulate questions. I'll do better next week!
[11:31] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: ok. :)
[11:32] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Does someone else have a question or topic of discussion about OS?
[11:33] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: Well Ubit has not broken anything lately so topics are slim ...  :P
[11:33] Kayaker Magic: Any news on the new viewer project?
[11:33] George Equus: Got one Q..
[11:34] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Not really apart from the small release last week
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: no kayaker
[11:34] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: George, you're up next.
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: well i did those "cosmetics" commits today.. did you tested them? :p
[11:34] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Kayaker, do you mean the one that was meant to be an OS only release?
[11:34] George Equus: Almost always crash when trying to HG in to my own regions on osgrid. Cause unknown, need to go
to a plaza or other region on the grid first b4 tp to mine. Any ideas? something I need to do on my setup?
[11:36] Kayaker Magic: A related issue: I often cannot HG to my own regions, but if I go to Wright Plaza then HG to my own land it works.
[11:36] George Equus: Or is it just because of a slow server, it is very very old
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: thats kinda odd
[11:36] George Equus: running for 9 years now
[11:37] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: My first thought would be a nat/loopback issue but since you can get to your own regions by going somewhere else first I don't think that has anything to do with the problem.
[11:37] Ubit Umarov: possible some issue on the negociation with grid on first hg login
[11:38] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: How far do you get through the TP process before the viewer crashes?
[11:38] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I think I had similar problems when I had OSG regions in 2014, but it came down to dns issues
[11:38] George Equus: And going from any other region on the grid rarely give problems. just HG, most of the time.
[11:38] Ubit Umarov: yeha dns can be critical
[11:38] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Funny you should mention that, George. A DNS issue was my next thought.
[11:38] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: yeah if the region, or grid have cached bad DNS HG can be a pain ...
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: or if they don't :)
[11:39] George Equus: HG in general is fine, seldom problematic
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: google dns does not like dyndns
[11:39] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: not at all
[11:40] Ubit Umarov: also does not like many requests, and opensim does a ton
[11:40] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: If you know the IP address for your region you could use it in a TP and see if that avoids crashing all the time. Not ideal but would be worth trying.
[11:40] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: It could help identify a DNS related issue.
[11:40] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: well in reality it is not dynDNS per-say it is short TTL that they hate and tend to ignore updates that happen too fast ..
[11:41] Ubit Umarov: dyndns can have 1minute ttl.. and it hates that
[11:41] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: for sure
[11:41] George Equus: I usually get "incoming avatar" in console then viewer crash
[11:41] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: 1 minute TTL? Wow. I would say that is way too short.
[11:41] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: what machine are you running as server?
[11:41] George Equus: a relog mostly state I am already logged in so it seem to register partly.
[11:42] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: or operating system on your server rather
[11:43] Sheera Khan: Metro has similar issues since the change of the grid-URL - some HG-TPs work others fail without any specific and fully reproducible pattern
[11:43] George Equus: In reality a minor problem, just need to go via another region on Osgrid first  :) I can live with it, but maybe is a common problem?
[11:44] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: windows itself can have a crappy dns cache, if I am forced to use a windows box I put in a scheduled job that runs every 20 minutes to do a "ipconfig /flushdns"
[11:44] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: is that to get to a home hosted region George?
[11:44] Royale.Mobian @grid.mobiusgrid.us:8002: or change the DNS windows is using like i do
[11:45] Bill.Blight @hg.osgrid.org: well yeah you can do that, but most people use their ISP's dns ..
[11:45] George Equus: Compac nc6400 Gavin, running Windows 7
[11:45] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: ok
[11:45] George Equus: 15? Y old..
[11:45] Ubit Umarov: ppl should use the ISP dns :p
[11:45] Ubit Umarov: ( and it should be good )
[11:46] Arielle Popstar: is it me or is it these seats?
[11:46] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: they should Ubit
[11:46] Royale.Mobian @grid.mobiusgrid.us:8002: i use opendns as my ISPs DNS is bad
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: but thats the logic od DNS
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: ( the tree etc etc )
[11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: Royale, are they the ones that have DNS servers with addresses of something like 222.222 in them?
[11:47] Royale.Mobian @grid.mobiusgrid.us:8002: i think so been awhile since i set them
[11:47] Royale.Mobian @grid.mobiusgrid.us:8002: i set my computer and router to opendns ages ago
[11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: ok. I have used them myself when I was having an issue with a more local DNS.
[11:48] Kayaker Magic: I use Dyndns to get to linux servers in my barn. Any experience with speed of dyndns?
[11:48] Arielle Popstar: are those the google dns things like 8.8.8.8 and 4.4.2.2?
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: yes arielle
[11:49] Sheera.Khan @hypergrid.org:8002: you could try the cloudflares at 1.1.1.1 and 1.0.0.1
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: also many linux distros set to use it by default
[11:49] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Dyndns has a special updater you can install https://dyn.com/updater-windows/
[11:49] Arielle Popstar: i use those. Way faster then my isp's
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: i used another one
[11:50] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I used to use the Mac version and it worked fine on OSG
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: ( have it set also plus my isp ones )
[11:50] Bill Blight: google is 8.8.8.8 8.8.4.4 4.4.4.4 and 4.2.2.2 is verizon
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: i used the second most used on a list of free dns i found on google ( first was google )
[11:51] Bill Blight: I'd suggest OpenDNS if you are going to use something other than your ISP ..
[11:51] Bill Blight: https://use.opendns.com/
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: did the sits get changed here?
[11:52] Bill Blight: nothing has changed on this region for ages
[11:52] Sheera.Khan @hypergrid.org:8002: what do you mean Arielle?
[11:53] Sheera.Khan @hypergrid.org:8002: the hovering height?
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: see me sitting 10 inches abouve the stool?
[11:53] Sheera.Khan @hypergrid.org:8002: I'm floating too since ages here
[11:53] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: did you change your viewer or upgrade it since last time?
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: oh duh right. that was fixed :)
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: i forgot
[11:54] Arielle Popstar: the hover height slider was fixed
[11:54] Bill Blight: there are only two chairs here that are not just copies of the others and that is mine and Andrews
[11:55] George Equus: I like floating.. got a skinny ars  :)
[11:55] Arielle Popstar: that can be fixed!
[11:55] George Equus: Botox?
[11:56] Sheera.Khan @hypergrid.org:8002: setting the hover height in FS works
[11:56] Arielle Popstar: it does
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: think i did a commit on avatar hover
[11:57] Arielle Popstar: yes the region flag
[11:57] Bill Blight: yeah
[11:57] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: you did
[11:57] Bill Blight: works good between places that have it, go someplace or come from some place that doesn't and it can be funky
[11:58] George Equus: works fine here
[11:59] Arielle Popstar: well can make it work on regions that dont have it by TP'ing to another region and then back
[11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: Any last minute questions before we wrap up todays gathering?