Chat log from the meeting on 2019-01-15

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[11:02] Andrew.Hellershanks I'm now using FS 6.0.1 beta so I see that animated mesh character that is walking around on bar island.
[11:02] Ubit.Umarov well mantis about a issue on recent version and one says is on
[11:02] Sheera Khan: funny thing is: I saw him walking last week
[11:03] Sheera Khan: this week he is standing in a T-Pose
[11:03] Ubit.Umarov hg i guess
[11:03] Sheera Khan: and it is the same 6.0.1 Beta
[11:03] Ubit.Umarov yr viewers asked metro for the anim
[11:04] Ubit.Umarov its a timing thing like the avatar names etc
[11:04] Ubit.Umarov well guessing..
[11:05] Ubit.Umarov no.. viewer just forgets the anim
[11:05] Sheera Khan: sorry, I thought about my sissy who could see the anim
[11:05] Ubit.Umarov unless by miracle metro also has it
[11:06] Sheera Khan: shouldn't this region serve the anim?
[11:06] Ubit.Umarov see it dancing now ?
[11:06] Sheera Khan: nopes :-(
[11:06] Ubit.Umarov grrr it is a old hg issue
[11:06] Bill Blight: It should, but the FS cache is easily borked
[11:06] Ubit.Umarov well not on this
[11:06] testObjAnim: animation VAGUARDst11danceRoot
[11:06] testObjAnim: Stop
[11:06] testObjAnim: animation VAGUARDst11
[11:06] testObjAnim: Starting
[11:06] Gavin.Hird but it allowed me to reset the skeleton, so now it has long legs
[11:06] testObjAnim: animation VAGUARDst11danceRoot
[11:06] testObjAnim: Stop
[11:07] Sheera Khan: no change for me ...
[11:07] Ubit.Umarov look to fs version again with glasses.. says 5 or 6 ?
[11:07] Andrew.Hellershanks I see the animesh sliding around on the counter top more than it walks.
[11:08] Sheera Khan: Firestorm 6.0.1 (56538) Dec 8 2018 09:22:04 (64bit) (Firestorm-Betax64) mit OpenSimulator-Unterstützung
[11:09] Ubit.Umarov well dunno .. i do see it ( and that Beta on version may mean something)
[11:10] Gavin.Hird Ubit der Zerstörer
[11:10] Bill Blight: I see it fine too , so it just does not like Sheera
[11:12] Sheera.Khan Using the same viewer on the same computer I can see the little man running around
[11:12] Sheera Khan: and I don't - funny, isn't it?
[11:14] Bill Blight: so something is not making the round trip to Metro, I'd guess
[11:16] Bill Blight: So other than random errors on the Mantis that are really hard to replicate, anything to talk about?
[11:17] Gavin.Hird Not much. New viewer builds here:
[11:17] Bill Blight: cool
[11:17] Andrew.Hellershanks There have been some updates to the OpenSimProfile module based on findings by djphil.
[11:18] Andrew.Hellershanks I still have a couple of remaining issues still to be worked on.
[11:20] Andrew.Hellershanks Leigthon, we have just been talking about animated mesh.
[11:20] Ubit.Umarov aniwhat??
[11:20] Andrew.Hellershanks and issues related to it.
[11:20] Bill Blight: Not-Animesh
[11:20] Bill Blight: can you see the little one on the bar island walking around?
[11:22] Andrew.Hellershanks I couldn't see it last week as I was still on FS 5. I see it this week. If that isn't an animated mesh what is it?
[11:23] Ubit.Umarov in case you didn't notice, scaling the mesh in world does nothing
[11:23] Bill Blight: I'ts not Animesh, animesh is owned by LL .. :P
[11:23] Leighton.Marjoram Animesh is a TM name for SL
[11:23] Ubit.Umarov animation puts it back to uploaded size
[11:23] Sheera Khan: So it's called: Ani-What?
[11:23] Leighton.Marjoram *assuming they TM's it*
[11:23] Andrew.Hellershanks ok. What are you calling it?
[11:23] Ubit.Umarov object animation
[11:25] Andrew.Hellershanks hm... Might need to say mesh object animation as not all objects could be animated.
[11:25] Andrew.Hellershanks Or mesh animation?
[11:25] Bill Blight: ROAM
[11:25] Bill Blight: Rigged Object Animated Mesh
[11:25] Bill Blight: LOL
[11:25] Andrew.Hellershanks :)
[11:26] Andrew.Hellershanks That works, Bill.
[11:26] Bill Blight: little guy is roaming around
[11:26] Bill Blight: LOL
[11:27] Ubit.Umarov ok see my monster ?
[11:27] Andrew.Hellershanks I was almost about to say it is only January. :)
[11:27] Bill Blight: Kayaker, can you go buy your parcel over on fest so we can clear the number and get our spreadsheets updated ..
[11:28] Kayaker Magic: What did I miss? Any discussion about Vivox?
[11:28] Ubit.Umarov going to ser anim
[11:28] Bill Blight: Vivox server move is still not done
[11:28] Ubit.Umarov see?
[11:28] Andrew.Hellershanks We haven't gotten to Vivox yet, Kayaker.
[11:28] Ubit.Umarov inworld scale does nothing
[11:28] Gavin.Hird is there a support page or contact for Vivox?
[11:28] Bill Blight: Contacting them will do nothing
[11:28] Sheera Khan: I can see it standing still in T-Pose
[11:28] Gavin.Hird I'd be interested to know what client version to put in the viewers
[11:28] Andrew.Hellershanks A grid notice went out in the GCG that voice was back then they sent out another notice to say it was not working again.
[11:28] Bill Blight: they sent out an email that that they were moving servers
[11:29] Bill Blight: "Hi Folks,

We are writing to you since, during the past 2 years, you have registered to utilize Vivox's Free Virtual World Voice Service, and to inform you that over the coming days, we will be migrating this service ( from one data center to another. This will involve a DNS address change and there should be no changes required on your part. We do expect Vivox services to be sporadically unavailable during this transition.

Best Regards,
Vivox Operations"
[11:29] Kayaker Magic: The gold mesh was walking around and the red one in the T pose, but the red one just started dancing!
[11:29] Gavin.Hird MONSTA!
[11:30] Bill Blight: so Vivox will be back when Vivox gets back
[11:30] Ubit.Umarov odd why they don't apply inworld scale also
[11:30] Bill Blight: LOL
[11:31] Ubit.Umarov and confusing
[11:31] Gavin.Hird the skeleton can be somewhat scaled, but the rigging determines the size basically
[11:31] Ubit.Umarov yeap
[11:32] Gavin.Hird can't you use the sliders on it?
[11:32] Ubit.Umarov no
[11:32] Bill Blight: How would you use sliders on a object?
[11:32] Gavin.Hird you should be able to
[11:32] Gavin.Hird the sliders work on the rigging
[11:32] Bill Blight: you could if you wore it
[11:32] Ubit.Umarov no they don't
[11:32] Gavin.Hird like for a normal avatar
[11:33] Leighton.Marjoram wouldnt you need to be wearing it
[11:33] Bill Blight: but objects don't have a slider interface
[11:33] Ubit.Umarov objects have no visualparameters
[11:33] Andrew.Hellershanks You are saying you have to set the object size on import? It can't be changed after it is in world?
[11:33] Bill Blight: correct Andrew
[11:33] Bill Blight: it snaps to the rig size
[11:33] Ubit.Umarov look this
[11:34] Andrew.Hellershanks That could become annoying. Is that a temporary problem? Shouldn't the rigging scale with the object?
[11:34] Ubit.Umarov see its inworld size ?
[11:34] Ubit.Umarov well even a mess lol
[11:34] Ubit.Umarov ignored once active.. back to uploaded size
[11:35] Bill Blight: it is the same as worn rigged mesh, it snaps to the rig/skeleton size, but as Ubit said objects don't have the ability to set visual params
[11:35] Bill Blight: for skel
[11:35] Bill Blight: ugg I can't type
[11:35] Ubit.Umarov ugggg would had been worse
[11:36] Gavin.Hird actually it does but there is no official interface for it
[11:36] Ubit.Umarov visualparams are part of bodyparts
[11:36] Ubit.Umarov objects do not have those
[11:36] Gavin.Hird I think you can do it with the viewer python test scripts
[11:37] Ubit.Umarov well ll no slides on wiki
[11:37] Ubit.Umarov says..
[11:37] Gavin.Hird visual paramas are also part of the rigging since Bento
[11:38] Gavin.Hird there are lots of bones added for that purpose
[11:38] Ubit.Umarov and mk sense they are avatar wearables
[11:38] Ubit.Umarov bones, not the modifiers
[11:38] Ubit.Umarov ie the values avatar app slides change
[11:38] Ubit.Umarov and are stored on body parts
[11:39] Ubit.Umarov namely body
[11:39] Gavin.Hird and there are a lot of bones added in Bento that does the same for rigged meshes
[11:40] Gavin.Hird also for animated meshes
[11:40] Ubit.Umarov bones != visualparameters
[11:41] Gavin.Hird what you call visual paramaters I call morph targets
[11:41] Gavin.Hird which is what they are
[11:41] Ubit.Umarov the values you do set on edit appearance
[11:41] Ubit.Umarov that are morphs etc parameters
[11:42] Ubit.Umarov and as i said on avatars are stored on body
[11:42] Gavin.Hird the same parameters does to a large degree work on the Bento additional rigging to simulate the same on worn meshes
[11:42] Ubit.Umarov and other body parts.. don' remember
[11:42] Ubit.Umarov they are applied to bones etc
[11:43] Ubit.Umarov deforming the mesh acording to vertices weights
[11:43] Gavin.Hird the animated objects have the Bento skeleton and can be changed accordingly
[11:43] Ubit.Umarov well whatever
[11:43] Gavin.Hird but there is no exposed interface for it right now
[11:44] Bill Blight: (I think that is what I said earlier)
[11:44] Bill Blight: :P
[11:44] Gavin.Hird ;-)
[11:44] Kayaker Magic: I am hoping that I can make my own armatures that are not bento or legacy avatar. For example a flag with an armature that waves in the wind.
[11:44] Ubit.Umarov don't think that will happen
[11:44] Ubit.Umarov see this is just a reuse of avatar engine, not that new
[11:44] Gavin.Hird you have to use the Bento rigging, but you can use as few bones as you want
[11:44] Kayaker Magic: Dang.
[11:46] Gavin.Hird for something waving in the wind, probably the tail bones can be used
[11:46] Kayaker Magic: HiFi has animated mesh and even allows you to change the bone angles in a script (do the animation in an in-world script). But they keep changing the API every few months so my scripts stop working and I have to start over. Every few months.
[11:46] Ubit.Umarov thats overdoing
[11:46] Andrew.Hellershanks I could imagine some interesting effects that could be done if it was possible to adjust the rigging or the size of bones via a script.
[11:46] Ubit.Umarov totally killing real time performance
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: lsl already allows changes it should not
[11:47] Gavin.Hird you can change both, but I am not sure there is LSL for it right now
[11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, that's annoying.
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: like child prims positions on a physical object
[11:47] Gavin.Hird as I said, I believe the viewer test python scripts can do it
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: thats heavy.. should not be possible
[11:48] Ubit Umarov: well unless basic toy physics
[11:48] Kayaker Magic: HiFi has scripts that run in the viewer, but is still messed up in other ways. Let's get back to OpenSim.
[11:48] Gavin.Hird I don't think you can make an animated mesh physical
[11:49] Leighton.Marjoram will it go phantom like attachments?
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: i was talking about a dif thing
[11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: No bumping in to them?
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: worse
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: we do collide with it on its original position
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: see??
[11:50] Gavin.Hird I think you will cut through them
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: im colliding the the monster
[11:50] Bill Blight: yes just like avatars that are being animated
[11:50] Kayaker Magic: For example, during the time that Vivox was completely down, the region simulator code was waiting 30 seconds synchronously to connect to vivox. During that time TP and many other things stalled. Is there a setting to change that timeout? Can it be made asynch?
[11:50] Gavin.Hird you have to test it in SL for the reference implementation
[11:51] Gavin.Hird new viewer code disconnects voice during TP
[11:51] Bill Blight: if you ever go to dances, when people are animating they pass right through you, now if you add actual movement to the item such as "Walking in a direction" I'm sure you'd run into it ..
[11:52] Bill Blight: Pretty sure he did test in SL Gavin
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: avatar dances are sits
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: play a dance is not
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: if you play withou sit, we colide with you on original position
[11:53] Kayaker Magic: Yeah, animations do not move the avatar at all.
[11:53] Gavin.Hird here is the commit for disconnecting voice
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: for that sl recomends that animations should not move the thing 2 far
[11:54] Ubit Umarov: it suposed to disc
[11:54] Ubit Umarov: it is a big channel change
[11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Five minutes remaining before the top of the hour. Any other topic for discussion?
[11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: If there is nothing more for today we can head out a few minutes early. :)
[11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: I don't see anyone typing so that will do it for today. You have a whole two minutes extra time to do something. :)
[11:58] Ubit Umarov: we can.. but you must stay andrew to do the proper work hours
[12:00] Ubit Umarov: all animations and sounds are a bit critical
[12:00] Ubit Umarov: a bit of lag and viewer gives up
[12:01] Gavin.Hird I have disabled the cap for OpenSim right now
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: what cap ?
[12:01] Gavin.Hird animated mesh cap
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: not exactly a cap
[12:01] Gavin.Hird that's what LL calls it
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: hack
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: its a flag
[12:02] Gavin.Hird whatever it is, it is disabled for Opensim in my viewer right now
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: they had no where else where tell region about viewer suport
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: so made that hack
[12:03] Andrew Hellershanks: Gavin, why have you disabled it?
[12:03] Gavin.Hird because the implementation here is highly experimental
[12:03] Andrew Hellershanks: ok
[12:03] Gavin.Hird and I need a stable environment to test against when building viewer versions
[12:04] Gavin.Hird so not taking that serverside code for the time being
[12:05] Ubit Umarov: well ppl does use fs mainly
[12:05] Bill Blight: Yeah so most people will have the function
[12:05] Gavin.Hird when the time comes to test animesh also on the Windows version I will do on aditi
[12:06] Gavin.Hird the macOS version pass all tests there

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