Chat log from the meeting on 2016-11-01

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[11:05] James.Atlloud I have a quick IRC question - do folks pretty much stay logged-in all the time?
[11:05] Marcus Llewellyn: It's the land of the lurkers, yup
[11:06] Marcus Llewellyn: Ask a question, and someone may answer two hours later. Heh.
[11:06] James.Atlloud huh interesting. IRC is pretty lightweight though so staying logged-in isn't an issue?
[11:07] Marcus Llewellyn: Nope, not really. I use weechat as a relay on one of my linux boxes, so even if I don't have a client open, I'm there.
[11:08] James.Atlloud need to think on that... guess I should figure out what a relay is.
[11:09] Marcus Llewellyn: It's a sort of bouncer, if you've heard of that. A fancy proxy that keeps you in IRC, and also keeps all the chat logged for you to see if you're not currently running a proper client.
[11:09] Andrew Hellershanks: James, If my computer is on I have an IRC client that runs automatically. I may or may not be paying attention to the IRC channels to which my client is connected.
[11:10] Marcus Llewellyn: I'd venture that is simply what most people do. I love complicating my life. ;)
[11:10] James.Atlloud Ok - lol. complexity adds interest, eh?
[11:10] Marcus Llewellyn: It does for me. lol
[11:11] Andrew Hellershanks: I responded to one comment directed to me as much as 8 hours or so later. :)
[11:11] Marcus Llewellyn: yeah, that's prettyy much the culture in the opensim channels.
[11:12] Andrew Hellershanks: yeah. I have had a ping response that was about a day later. :)
[11:12] James.Atlloud oh - how is a message directed to a person - just by name?
[11:12] Marcus Llewellyn: A private one?
[11:12] James.Atlloud uh, I don't think so.
[11:13] Marcus Llewellyn: Oh, the conventions vary, but usually just start a libe with the nick you want to get attention from.
[11:13] Andrew Hellershanks: Just say the persons name (optionally followed by comma or colon)
[11:13] Marcus Llewellyn: Many people have their clients set to alert them if their full nickname appears in chat.
[11:14] James.Atlloud OK, sorta like a twitter @tag then.
[11:14] Marcus Llewellyn: Often, someone will just "ping" to see if someone's alive. "ping MarcusLlewellyn" for example, and wait a reasonable amount of time for a response.
[11:14] Marcus Llewellyn: Like knocking on their door. ;)
[11:15] Andrew Hellershanks: If I ping someone is because I want to pass on info or ask them something.
[11:16] James.Atlloud OK wild - and in Hexchat there's some options by right-click on a name. huh, thanks!
[11:16] Marcus Llewellyn: Yeah. That's sorta our equivalent of a twitter @.
[11:17] Kayaker Magic: I went to the MOSES meeting on Friday and have some interesting things to report
[11:17] James.Atlloud Hey, it's Ubit!  :)
[11:18] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, Go ahead and get this meeting back on its main topic. :)
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: Ubit ?? where ? where?
[11:18] Kayaker Magic: 1) The MOSES WEB viewer is going to be view only, no build tools. If you need to build, get a real viewer.
[11:19] Marcus Llewellyn: Makes sense, really.
[11:19] Andrew Hellershanks: Interesting. What benefits will their viewer offer vs a "real" viewer?
[11:19] Kayaker Magic: 2) MOSES is gleefully throwing out the LL protocol already, so their viewer is not going to be SL or OpenSim compatible.
[11:20] Kayaker Magic: I should have asked, but I think they are going to hack a copy of firestorm to match, to be able to build there.
[11:20] James.Atlloud hmm
[11:21] Marcus Llewellyn: And since they're using Halcyon, we prolly can't even have a compatible module to support their protocol.
[11:21] Kayaker Magic: So if we want to try their WEB viewer here, someone is going to have to port their protocol to a version of OpenSim
[11:21] Andrew Hellershanks: If they do that then it is unlikely they will be able to pass along any future code changes for OpenSim.
[11:22] Ubit Umarov: about that i can only say i can't say anything about something that does not exist for me
[11:22] Kayaker Magic: 3) MOSES has a vision of moving away from prims, requiring everything to be made externally from mesh.
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: when there is something that is under a license we can use... we will see
[11:23] Andrew Hellershanks: That rather explains item 1
[11:23] James.Atlloud indeed
[11:23] Marcus Llewellyn: They're giving up a lot of content, or at least making it harder to import, but I can understand why they'd make that choice.,
[11:24] Kayaker Magic: there are tools for converting existing content to Mesh to get started.
[11:24] Marcus Llewellyn nods.
[11:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Their viewer needs the ability to move things around and scale them at least.
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: well if they are doing something diferent, then mb is no longer a discution for opensim
[11:25] Marcus Llewellyn: Here come neb
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: like the SL new thing isn't
[11:25] James.Atlloud thought the same Ubit
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: but i realy prefer to see real hard facts.. not words in the wind...
[11:26] Marcus Llewellyn: Just going with the Halcyon codebase makes them estranged from us in a significant way.
[11:26] Kayaker Magic: If we add their protocol for their viewers, we would have several better viewer options than we do today.
[11:27] Kayaker Magic: A viewer made for something closer to, if not the same as, OpenSim.
[11:27] Nebadon Izumi: we need to see their viewer first
[11:27] Nebadon Izumi: before determing if its worth the effort
[11:27] Marcus Llewellyn: I do think independence from the LL viewer is a good thing. But we need someone who's interested in implementing the protocol.
[11:27] Nebadon Izumi: I have done extensive testing on WebGL
[11:27] Ubit Umarov: yeap we need to see real things.. not words
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: and I can tell you right here right now, 75% of OpenSim regions will not work in WebGL
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: no matter what framework you choose
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: I'm testing with Unity3D
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: and most regions i test just will not work in webgl
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: WebGL really sucks
[11:28] Marcus Llewellyn: You're just holding it wrong. ;)
[11:29] Nebadon Izumi: but if they can some how manage to proove me wrong we will definitely review what they do, but we need to see something first
[11:29] Nebadon Izumi: before anything can be decided or evaluated
[11:29] Nebadon Izumi: until then not much to say really
[11:29] Kayaker Magic: Neb: I've been reporting what I heard at the MOSES meeting Friday.
[11:29] Nebadon Izumi: yea
[11:30] Marcus Llewellyn: They've made it clear that *their* project goals outweigh any broader priorities that something like the OpenSimulator project seeks to support.
[11:30] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim Dev 7c4f2b0: 2016-10-25 20:44:41 +0100 (Unix/Mono)
[11:30] Andrew Hellershanks: Using their protocol will be more complicated if they don't include building in-world. A viewer would need to support their protocol and the existing protocol for building operations.
[11:30] Nebadon Izumi: I definitely would love to see a webgl interface, but unfortunately until WebGL2 and Web Assembly come
[11:30] Nebadon Izumi: i dont see it happening
[11:30] Nebadon Izumi: another problem i see with WebGL is avatars
[11:31] Nebadon Izumi: that's a difficult one to solve for sure
[11:31] Ubit Umarov: from what i have seen they possibly will add a translator middle thing
[11:31] Ubit Umarov: like those things to play games on tablets etc
[11:32] Nebadon Izumi: did they give any kind of indication of when they might have something to see
[11:32] Nebadon Izumi: even just a demo
[11:32] Ubit Umarov: but well not my concern now, until that is something really working and under a civilian software license
[11:32] Kayaker Magic: No, vague on that...
[11:32] Nebadon Izumi: yea
[11:33] Nebadon Izumi: well I do hope they get something to show sooner than later
[11:33] Nebadon Izumi: my preference in the meantime is to dull the excitment
[11:33] Nebadon Izumi: hype right now isn't healthy
[11:33] Marcus Llewellyn: MOSES isn't known for vaporware from what I've seen. But they've also become the new realXtend... forked off so far that they're ceasing to have much in relation to us.
[11:33] Ubit Umarov: for now i just would like to see kokuaOS moving on
[11:34] Nebadon Izumi: you mean Improving Ubit?
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: it's still in early stages and with a few problems
[11:34] Nebadon Izumi: yea I need to download the latest and give it a try
[11:34] Nebadon Izumi: i downloaded it a month or two ago but didnt use it too much
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: well not big problems..
[11:35] Nebadon Izumi: I'm mostly still just using singularity
[11:35] Ubit Umarov: most where fixed on singu.. so its mainly porting :)
[11:35] James.Atlloud Will the only VWorlds with in-world building become Opensim and Minecraft?
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: no one likes in-world building
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: bc thats a reason for low performance
[11:36] James.Atlloud :( no? OK
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: in world building really does mean low performance builds
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: unfortunately
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: i mean companies.. not me and you :)
[11:36] James.Atlloud OH <whew/>
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: unless someone can manage to incorporate like blender or something into their interface
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: prims are definifely one of the reasons webgl will suck for opensim
[11:37] Andrew Hellershanks: Um... that's not likely to happen. That sort of building is too complicated to add on to a standard viewer.
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: a cube in opensim is 96 verts?
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: something like that
[11:37] Ubit Umarov: nahh
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: when it could just be 4 vertice
[11:37] James.Atlloud Is the same true for scripting in non-prim worlds?
[11:37] Ubit Umarov: it needs a few more
[11:38] James.Atlloud eg. users can't script behaviors?
[11:38] Ubit Umarov: for example the CUT faces need to be there to make texturing easier
[11:38] Andrew Hellershanks: What's the reason for it being turned in to 96 verts? Viewer, back end code, or the need to be able to support prim torture?
[11:38] Ubit Umarov: not sure about that 96 verts
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: its 54 verts
[11:39] James.Atlloud "prim torture" <beavis laugh>
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: 96 edges
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: at least without skew
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: 48 triangles
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: for a single cube
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: you could make the same cube in blender
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: but that can be made as needed
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: 8 verts / 18 edges / 12 triangles
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: physics boxes are the same
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: and you figure many builds have 100s or 1000s of cubes in them
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: you can see how inefficient prims become
[11:40] Ubit Umarov: simple box == physics primitive
[11:40] Ubit Umarov: tortured box == mesh with complexity depending on torture
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: yea it gets even worse for sure then
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: a Torus is horrible
[11:40] Ubit Umarov: yeap torus is the worse
[11:41] Nebadon Izumi: 450 triangles
[11:41] Nebadon Izumi: in a prim torus
[11:41] Ubit Umarov: but that isn't much of a problem
[11:41] Ubit Umarov: is just coding
[11:41] Nebadon Izumi: well no here in opensim its not so bad
[11:42] Nebadon Izumi: but if your converting that to a mesh for webgl
[11:42] Nebadon Izumi: its super nasty
[11:42] Ubit Umarov: in fact just porting dahlia meshmerizer
[11:42] Ubit Umarov: it has the visual part generator still ( that i removed on ubMesh..)
[11:42] Andrew Hellershanks: Is Collada format a good choice for mesh formats or is there a better format? It would be nice if some other formats were supported.
[11:42] Nebadon Izumi: yea Dahlia wrote a webgl viewer for Encitra, and it works ok
[11:43] Ubit Umarov: collada is heavy i think
[11:43] Nebadon Izumi: but performance was really slow
[11:43] Nebadon Izumi: json is the best
[11:43] Nebadon Izumi: for webgl
[11:43] Nebadon Izumi: there is a new format coming
[11:43] Ubit Umarov: games use one from nvidia.. or 3ds or another i don't remember :)
[11:43] Andrew Hellershanks: Support for STEP format would be nice as an alternative
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: well LL viewer is a optimized viewer
[11:44] Nebadon Izumi: Unity generates json i think
[11:44] Nebadon Izumi: webgl mostly boils down to javascript at the moment
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: a lot better than what ppl now say
[11:44] Nebadon Izumi: yea LL viewer is pretty good
[11:45] Nebadon Izumi: it can access a lot more memory too though
[11:45] Nebadon Izumi: webgl is limited to a total of around 512mb in the web browser
[11:45] Nebadon Izumi: before you start making things incompatible with about 90% of the planet
[11:45] Ubit Umarov: it does contain specific optimizations...
[11:45] Ubit Umarov: like the 16bit resolution on meshs etc
[11:46] Nebadon Izumi: things like raycasting suck in webgl
[11:46] Nebadon Izumi: its so sloow
[11:47] Nebadon Izumi: i can show you a demo of a opensim model i put into three.js one sec
[11:47] Nebadon Izumi:
[11:48] Ubit Umarov: well i whould just like current viewers did had the issues they have now bc of blind following of LL code
[11:48] Kayaker Magic: Raycasting sucks HERE! Especially on vrs. Why is that ubit?
[11:48] Nebadon Izumi: that model above is not reading from opensim
[11:48] Kayaker Magic: I raycast a short distance and it takes 1.2 SECONDS in a var.
[11:48] Nebadon Izumi: but it was created in opensim
[11:48] Ubit Umarov: it should not be that long
[11:48] Nebadon Izumi: i have dumped it out to collada files in three.js
[11:48] Ubit Umarov: at least with ubode
[11:48] Nebadon Izumi: using some basic controls, it's totally standalone no multi-user
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: well i can't take that long
[11:49] Kayaker Magic: I have some mantises about 1.2 second llCastRays in ubODE.
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: our cameras are making raycasts here now
[11:49] Nebadon Izumi: some of it comes down to how heavy your script load is too
[11:49] Nebadon Izumi: in the region
[11:50] Nebadon Izumi: if your using .net vs mono
[11:50] Kayaker Magic: In a 1x1 llCastRay is OK, switch to a var and it is USELESS
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: hmm this is on bullet ?
[11:50] Nebadon Izumi: this region is bullet yes
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: yeap bullet.. so no physics raycasts
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: yea unfortunately my server is down at the moment
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: being a pain in the ass booting up
[11:51] Ubit Umarov: that 1.2s is with ubOde ?
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: you have mantis # kayaker?
[11:52] Kayaker Magic: looking it up
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: well if not using ubOde.. forget lsl raycasts.. they are plain slow
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: those V2 of V3 things...
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: we need to push Robert to add raycasts to bullet :)
[11:53] Nebadon Izumi: yea if i recall he said something about needing to upgrade to next version of bullet to do that
[11:54] Nebadon Izumi: don't quote me on that though
[11:54] Nebadon Izumi: i may be misremembering
[11:55] Ubit Umarov: ( actually a damm thing to code in asm :) )
[11:55] Kayaker Magic: Ubit: Mantis 07851 is one of mine about llcastray and ubODE
[11:56] Kayaker Magic: Mantis 7850 is the slow in vars one.
[11:56] Ubit Umarov: think i seen that but i don't repo it
[11:56] Ubit Umarov: at least in my 3x3 var they are ok
[11:56] Kayaker Magic: I'll re-run the tests and get back to you.
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: you are testing in Windows ubit?
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: now amazing fast... they do take time.. :)
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: yeap win7, i7 3.5G
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: ok mono may be the difference
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: it would not surprise me
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: don't think so
[11:58] Kayaker Magic: I am usually under mono
[11:58] Ubit Umarov: time in on the code lib
[11:59] Ubit Umarov: well in ubode they are used by the camera, for sits, for objects rez, for avatar position change on tp arrival and lsl
[11:59] Ubit Umarov: hmm make sure that option use V3 or something is false
[12:00] Ubit Umarov: not sure im really overiding it if ubode is active
[12:00] Ubit Umarov: ( on lsl )
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: yea it is possible to run the v2 or v3 with ubode still
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: that would kill it for sure
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: I actually did that myself initially
[12:01] Kayaker Magic: What is the ini file setting for V3?
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: forgot to disable it
[12:01] Kayaker Magic: I recall the spelling was wierd.
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: is somthing raycast v2 or v3
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: i may kept it active bc there is a problem with physics raycasts
[12:02] Andrew Hellershanks: UseLlCastRayV3
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: they only work on things physics see
[12:02] Andrew Hellershanks: It has a default setting in OpenSimDefaults
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: ie don't see shape type none
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: but builders should know that ;)
[12:04] Ubit Umarov: if they build a house that should protect from raycast guns.. then better physics knows about the walls ;)
[12:05] Ubit Umarov: well keep getting ppl telling ubode meshs are broken,,, grrr
[12:06] Ubit Umarov: don't know what to say more about that
[12:07] Ubit Umarov: what about 0.9.. having issues with it ? ( other than that meshs thing)
[12:09] Andrew Hellershanks: I've found it uses more memory under mono than in Windows but that's not 0.9 specifc.
[12:10] Ubit Umarov: memory use is a complex thing.. depends a lot on the GC
[12:10] Andrew Hellershanks: It first seemed it used double the memory but the actual usage has settled down now so it isn't as bad as that.
[12:11] Ubit Umarov: ubode for example does cache meshs in memory for a few mins
[12:11] Ubit Umarov: ( well think bullet also does similar.. )
[12:12] Andrew Hellershanks: Ok. I'm using BulletSim.
[12:12] Kayaker Magic: Why not switch to ubODE Andrew?
[12:13] Andrew Hellershanks: I would want to know the differences between the two. What works in one vs the other.
[12:13] James.Atlloud What does 'switch' mean? Recommended or Required?
[12:14] Ubit Umarov: well if you have a lot of old broken meshes stay with bullet.. stop bothering me :p
[12:14] Kayaker Magic: lol
[12:14] Andrew Hellershanks: James, I think Kayaker was asking why don't I switch to using ubODE vs BulletSim when I'm running OpenSim.
[12:14] James.Atlloud OK, ty.
[12:14] Kayaker Magic: I've heard reports that lots of old vehicle scripts from SL work in ubODE when they would not work in BulletSim
[12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: I have a bunch of objects that are bad. I forget if it's just bad textures or mesh issues. I think some are mesh issues.
[12:15] Ubit Umarov: the main issue it the wrong use on visual mesh where there is no physics one.. that bullet decided to so grrr
[12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: Aren't there some features that only work in BS and not in ubODE?
[12:16] Ubit Umarov: ( double side collisions can be a issue.. but old ODE was already like that )
[12:16] Ubit Umarov: yeap the broken meshs :p
[12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: What happens with ubODE when it encounters broken mesh?
[12:17] Ubit Umarov: you set physics shape type to NONE and they collide with full resolution on bullet
[12:17] Ubit Umarov: you can't get inside some houses for example
[12:18] Andrew Hellershanks: Don't make mesh houses? ;)
[12:18] Ubit Umarov: nah just upload the mesh with correct settings
[12:18] Ubit Umarov: or add a few prims
[12:19] Andrew Hellershanks: We need a good tutorial on uploading mesh for the OS wiki, or an easily findable page if there is one there.
[12:19] Ubit Umarov: there are several
[12:19] Ubit Umarov: even an email from me i think
[12:20] Ubit Umarov: but this issue is simple
[12:20] Ubit Umarov: if you want a mesh to show the PRIM option.. then select a mesh for physics..
[12:20] Ubit Umarov: just that
[12:20] Andrew Hellershanks: It would be good if someone would combine them in to a single page. There might be missing, wrong, or incomplete information on some of those pages.
[12:21] Nebadon Izumi: yea that's even recommend really for Bulletsim
[12:21] Nebadon Izumi: even though it will use a convex if you don't, it's still less efficient
[12:21] Ubit Umarov: actually viewers should have that more clear
[12:21] Andrew Hellershanks: IIRC, I tell it to use physics from file and point to the original mesh file.
[12:21] Ubit Umarov: you can point to a visual LOD
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: yea you can even upload a second reduced mesh
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: say it's a house with curtains and doors and lots of little detail
[12:22] Ubit Umarov: yeap pros upload a special mesh
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: you can save a second version of that same mesh minus all those small detail pieces
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: just walls and floors only
[12:22] Ubit Umarov: that's the right way of doing it :)
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: i do that often
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: yea
[12:23] Nebadon Izumi: or if you really dont want physics
[12:23] Ubit Umarov: BUT you can also not select any THAT is LEGAL
[12:23] Nebadon Izumi: best to use a second mesh that is nothing but a tiny triangle only
[12:23] Nebadon Izumi: instead of specifying none at all
[12:23] Ubit Umarov: nahh type none is the best option
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: doesn't Bullet throw an error still though?
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: a box is a fast collider
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: maybe that was fixed
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: a single tri is an ODD thing for physics
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: well ya i generally turn it phantom anyway
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: better none and add a box inworld
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: but i kind of remember bullet atleast throwing a red error on console about missing physics mesh
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: or something
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: if you selected none
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: maybe thats been fixed though
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: none works with bullet i think
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: i pretty much never upload mesh without physics though
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: ok cool
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: well unless on those meshs
[12:26] Ubit Umarov: on them NONE == PRIM
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: ah ya maybe if its only if you make no choice
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: that you get that red error
[12:26] Ubit Umarov: hmm think you only get a error if something is broken
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: ok yea its been a while since i've seen it
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: Wright plaza gets tons of them
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: when it starts up lol
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: most of the plazas do though hehe
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: tons of old crap here though
[12:27] Ubit Umarov: odd.. osg never lost assets :p
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: haha well it's a very specific physics message
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: about the physics mesh is missing
[12:28] Ubit Umarov: ie like no asset found ;)
[12:28] Nebadon Izumi: similar but it's definitly not a missing asset message
[12:28] Ubit Umarov: well someone gave me a odd oar
[12:28] Nebadon Izumi: it's more like the asset never existed
[12:28] Ubit Umarov: no errors.. but i can't see half the meshs
[12:28] Nebadon Izumi: wierd
[12:29] Ubit Umarov: no idea what happened to those meshs
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: maybe serialization stuff or something, you would think it would throw errors though if it was
[12:30] Nebadon Izumi: i have a ton of mesh from the first few weeks we were testing mesh before LL changed it up
[12:30] Nebadon Izumi: none of those rez anymore
[12:30] Ubit Umarov: well that oar has all types of mesh problems :)
[12:30] Ubit Umarov: but one viewer doesn't display but is seen by physics is a first to me
[12:32] Ubit Umarov: well it's a issue on osgrid foruns dan asked me to check
[12:32] Ubit Umarov: another " Meshs are broken with ubODE" ;)
[12:32] Nebadon Izumi: ah heh
[12:33] Ubit Umarov: don't understand also why ppl tell "uploaded with bullet or ubODE"
[12:34] Ubit Umarov: physics engines take no part on the upload process
[12:34] Nebadon Izumi: yea
[12:34] Ubit Umarov: testing.. well ok..
[12:34] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, Nebadon. I'm going to go out for a while then add some more pieces to a 3D model I'm working on once I return.
[12:34] Nebadon Izumi: nice, someone will post todays chat log?
[12:34] Nebadon Izumi: i would but i don't have the whole thing
[12:35] Ubit Umarov: but even on Maria's someone told meshs uploaded with ubODe wiill not work with bullet.. nonsense
[12:35] Nebadon Izumi: yea unfortunately Maria says a lot of wrong things
[12:36] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, Sheera posts the chat logs after the meeting.
[12:36] Nebadon Izumi: yea was Sheera here whole time though?
[12:36] Ubit Umarov: well she doesn't need to be here.. just her pc :)
[12:36] Nebadon Izumi: yea I wasn't sure if she was loggged in or not
[12:37] Nebadon Izumi: well if not maybe someone can pass it along
[12:37] Nebadon Izumi: OSCC is coming up soon too reminder
[12:37] Nebadon Izumi: about 5 weeks away
[12:37] Nebadon Izumi: I added banner to front page of the wiki
[12:37] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon: No, but I've passed along the part she missed.
[12:37] Nebadon Izumi: ok thanks
[12:37] Nebadon Izumi: Andrew and Ubit I hope you guys can take part in the dev panel
[12:37] Andrew Hellershanks: oh, right. Before you go, nebadon, some people were asking about an update re: the OSCC last week.
[12:38] Ubit Umarov: not sure
[12:38] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, always depends on when the panel is being run.
[12:38] Ubit Umarov: 2 much misinformation on the air for my bad english now
[12:38] Nebadon Izumi: hehe
[12:38] Nebadon Izumi: ok I am not sure schedule is up yet, but soon I will try to have more info next week
[12:38] Nebadon Izumi: if not James will im sure
[12:38] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, ty.
[12:39] Nebadon Izumi:
[12:39] Marcus Llewellyn: dev panel is on sat 7pst
[12:39] Andrew Hellershanks: I haven't done any coding on OS for a while now.
[12:39] Nebadon Izumi: thanks Marcus
[12:39] Marcus Llewellyn: I
[12:40] Nebadon Izumi: well really it's just the core devs, regardless of what code you contributed
[12:40] Andrew Hellershanks: I need to make time to finish going through the code dump changelog.
[12:40] Marcus Llewellyn: I'm talking top joyce now. lol
[12:40] Nebadon Izumi: it's kind of just an open chat about opensimulator in general
[12:40] Nebadon Izumi: ah cool thanks Marcus
[12:40] Marcus Llewellyn: it is am, btw
[12:41] Nebadon Izumi: Melanie and Crista will be there, probably Robert as well
[12:41] Nebadon Izumi: any of the core devs are welcome to sit on the panel
[12:42] Kayaker Magic: Great meeting today!
[12:42] Kayaker Magic: I will re-test llCastRay and come repared to beat Ubit up about it next wek!
[12:42] Kayaker Magic: hehe
[12:42] Ubit Umarov: or update that mantis
[12:42] Kayaker Magic: yes
[12:42] Andrew Hellershanks: Ubit, do you have anything to say about any code changes this past week?
[12:43] Ubit Umarov: if i could remember them lol
[12:43] Andrew Hellershanks grins
[12:43] Ubit Umarov: well a nasty merge issue on the IAR password
[12:43] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, nebadon. Thanks for dropping in and the update on the OSCC.
[12:44] Ubit Umarov: it was ignored ...
[12:44] Andrew Hellershanks: Ubit, yes. I saw that in the changelog.
[12:44] Ubit Umarov: a bug still on the physics prim sizes checks
[12:44] Ubit Umarov: type none where not ignored...
[12:45] Andrew Hellershanks: The code was change to mention 0.9.1 which I found odd as we haven't release 0.9
[12:45] Ubit Umarov: only that i think
[12:46] Ubit Umarov: guess that problem with the site delayed the release a bit more
[12:46] Andrew Hellershanks: I gather that 0.9-post-fixes branch was created in advance of a release and is considered stable
[12:47] Ubit Umarov: guess that will be the source of the release
[12:48] Ubit Umarov: well im waiting for the release to break master
[12:48] Andrew Hellershanks: Are the most recent two fixes also in the PF branch?
[12:48] Ubit Umarov: merging httptests into it
[12:48] Andrew Hellershanks: ok
[12:48] Ubit Umarov: ( but http is far far far from what it needs :( =
[12:49] Andrew Hellershanks: If there isn't anything more for today we can head our separate ways until next week finds us back here again.
[12:49] Ubit Umarov: but not sure we can use the ssl extra lag
[12:50] Andrew Hellershanks: Thank you all for coming. See you next week.

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