Chat log from the meeting on 2016-08-23

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[11:01] Dayna Bedrosian: This is the first time in a while that I have even had a physical form
[11:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello everyone
[11:07] Kayaker Magic: andrew, has that Selby guy talked to you about his OpenSim foundation ideas?
[11:07] James.Atlloud heh - wondered the same
[11:08] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, No. I haven't heard anything from anyone about that.
[11:08] James.Atlloud
[11:09] Kayaker Magic: Well, that guy. He also suggested using his non-profit to find ways to fund opensim development
[11:09] Kayaker Magic: Hire programmers to fix bugs in hypergrid
[11:10] Andrew Hellershanks: That page is a discussion about HG security.
[11:10] James.Atlloud yeah - I'm looking for the post about New Media and opensim
[11:10] stiofain nbmcmedia: he is sprightly and very active for the oldest man in OS
[11:10] Kayaker Magic: He has another page about funding OpenSim, I can never find his previous blogs on that site.
[11:10] James.Atlloud
[11:11] James.Atlloud lol - was in the body of the first link
[11:13] James.Atlloud no longer seems to be serving (as in serving web pages)
[11:13] Andrew Hellershanks: I'll have to read the rest of that later. Some of the comments I've heard before but he doesn't back up any of his claims.
[11:14] Andrew Hellershanks: The part I just read also doesn't mention what the suggestions have been for OpenSim that were made by the community and which were alledgedly discounted.
[11:15] Andrew Hellershanks: Overt doesn't exist any more, IIRC.
[11:15] stiofain nbmcmedia: i don't think so kayak but disabled it now
[11:16] James.Atlloud also recall that about overte
[11:17] Kayaker Magic: Which article are you reading? The first one was about MOSES, the second one was very short, just suggested that there will be some information collected about OpenSim development.
[11:17] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, who are you asking?
[11:18] Kayaker Magic: Andrew, you said you would read it later, but the article I was thinking about says very little.
[11:18] Kayaker Magic: No need to read later...
[11:18] Andrew Hellershanks: It was a long page.
[11:18] Kayaker Magic: Bottom of the page is all links to older stuff.
[11:19] Andrew Hellershanks: There is a section of comments by Maria, and by Seth to look at.
[11:20] James.Atlloud Is this the right meeting for... what would you call this topic?
[11:20] James.Atlloud governance?
[11:22] Andrew Hellershanks: If its something related to OpenSim it would be a valid topic for this meeting. As to the right one, that might depend on the actual information and discussion.
[11:22] Andrew Hellershanks: If some information needs to be discussed amongst the core developers I can pass the info along.
[11:22] James.Atlloud ty - I'm such a novice to open source-ery.
[11:22] Kayaker Magic: Who are the core developers now?
[11:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Melanie, Ubit, myself, nebadon, misterblue, AliciaRaven
[11:25] Andrew Hellershanks: I might have missed one or two. That is who is in the core developer IRC chat at this time.
[11:26] Andrew Hellershanks: Melanie and Ubit are the most active in terms of actual code development.
[11:28] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, Kayaker asked who are the core developers. I mentioned the ones currently in the core group in IRC. Not sure if I missed someone.
[11:28] Andrew Hellershanks: Hippo, the log of the meeting is posted online so you can read what you missed once its available.
[11:29] Hippo Finesmith: true :) ty for reminding me
[11:29] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, some meetings are more lively than others. :)
[11:29] Kayaker Magic: Diva is officialy not a core developer now?
[11:29] Andrew Hellershanks: As I said, I may have missed someone. I don't keep track of the list of members.
[11:29] James.Atlloud Who posts the logs? I am thankful for them.
[11:30] Andrew Hellershanks: Sheera posts the meeting notes most of the time.
[11:31] Andrew Hellershanks: I'm still dealing with some issues related to an upgrade of a grid plus some social activities so I haven't been around as much this past week to watch the changes in the code.
[11:32] Andrew Hellershanks: There were some changes related to thread locking and to fixing possible memory leaks.
[11:32] stiofain nbmcmedia: any news on OS community conf?
[11:32] James.Atlloud Dates are decided.
[11:33] Kayaker Magic: And the dates are?
[11:33] Andrew Hellershanks: I committed one change related to collecting group join fees.
[11:34] Andrew Hellershanks: I only applied the changes to the xmlrpc groups as I'm not set up to test collection of fees for v2 groups.
[11:35] James.Atlloud Dec 9,10 - Friday/Saturday with sunday spillover
[11:35] Nebadon Izumi: sorry got a phone call, so you said ask me if you missed something?
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: oh I see Core Developers
[11:36] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, Kayaker asked who are the current core developers
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: they are listed on the Wiki
[11:36] Andrew Hellershanks: Ah, there you go. :)
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi:
[11:36] Andrew Hellershanks: I didn't remember there was a list posted.
[11:37] James.Atlloud ugh - just reviewed notes - OSCC is Dec 10/11 - Saturday/Sunday
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: are you on the planning committee James?
[11:37] Andrew Hellershanks: Right. There are 9 people on the list
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: i wasn't able to attend the last meeting
[11:37] stiofain nbmcmedia: and is it true it will be run on .8 x ?
[11:38] James.Atlloud Yes Neb, I attended the kickoff
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: OSCC is generally ran on the current release stiofain
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: and also its heavily dependent on Diva's Wifi module
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: so that also would need to be release ready
[11:38] stiofain nbmcmedia: ok neb just some one told me they wouldn't use 9x
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: so if time grows to short then yes, it will remain on 0.8.2-post-fixes branch
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: 0.9 is still in development
[11:39] stiofain nbmcmedia: ok cool is prob for best
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: we try to avoid having the actual event on bleeding edge
[11:39] Nebadon Izumi: OSCC15 ran awesome on 0.8.2
[11:40] James.Atlloud agreed
[11:40] Andrew Hellershanks: There have been discussions about getting 0.9 released this summer. That would result in a new stable version well before the OSCC.
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: we didn't experience a single region crash the entire event
[11:40] stiofain nbmcmedia: yea was solid
[11:40] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, that's great for such a busy set of regions.
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: yea
[11:41] Nebadon Izumi: we had something like 500-600 unique visitors in total
[11:42] Andrew Hellershanks: I need to go afk for a few minutes. James, why don't you ask your question now.
[11:43] James.Atlloud I express my love for Opensim by participating on Mal Burns' weekly program, Inworld Review.
[11:43] James.Atlloud I would like to report on this meeting - just a summary of what's going on.
[11:43] James.Atlloud I'd like your opinions on this.
[11:43] James.Atlloud I know the logs are public, but also want to respect the group.
[11:44] Nebadon Izumi: sure
[11:44] James.Atlloud I think the summary would not need to mention any names - just give a sense of things/topics.
[11:45] Nebadon Izumi: Feel free to relay anything you hear at this meeting
[11:45] James.Atlloud The show seems to have a modest, but regular following.
[11:45] Nebadon Izumi: like you said its totally public logs
[11:46] Nebadon Izumi: and our goal here is to interface with people who are using the software
[11:46] Nebadon Izumi: talk about bugs and development
[11:46] Nebadon Izumi: really anything that relates to opensimulator is fair topic
[11:46] Melanie Milland: there are no bugs
[11:46] James.Atlloud Thanks Nebadon.
[11:46] Melanie Milland: they are all features! ;)
[11:46] Kayaker Magic: I am anxious to hear what you have to report from the review.
[11:47] James.Atlloud anxious-good or anxious-terrified?
[11:47] stiofain nbmcmedia: i watch every week james
[11:47] James.Atlloud Cool Stiofain
[11:47] Nebadon Izumi: This meeting is generally about giving people who are not core developers a chance to talk about anything that are trying to get an answer too
[11:48] Nebadon Izumi: it's fairly open ended discussion so you may find it difficult to have a consistent structure to any report
[11:48] Nebadon Izumi: but I think its great if you do
[11:48] James.Atlloud I've attended for a couple months now and I think there's always something of interest in the logs.
[11:48] Andrew Hellershanks: Hey, Melanie. Haven't seen you here in a long time. Nice to see you.
[11:49] Nebadon Izumi: great, ya I think the more people can hear about what is going on the more interest we can develop
[11:49] Melanie Milland: i've been very busy
[11:49] Melanie Milland: life gets that way sometimes
[11:49] James.Atlloud agree @ more interest - good for opensim
[11:49] Melanie Milland: and then 1 was living out of hotel rooms for over a month
[11:49] Nebadon Izumi: yea same here I have been super busing with Encitra Grid
[11:49] Melanie Milland: then another 2 weeks only mobile internet
[11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: James, if there wasn't something of interest each week we wouldn't be getting a lot of people continuing to come to these meetings.
[11:50] James.Atlloud so true.
[11:50] Nebadon Izumi: on thing to mention, Ubit has brought the Warp3D Maptiler up to date with the latest version of Warp3D
[11:50] James.Atlloud @melanie - I hear a choking sound when I think of mobile only interent.
[11:50] Andrew Hellershanks: Melanie, I know how that is. I'm in the middle of a few projects and have a house guest this month so the social calendar is adding to the todo list.
[11:50] Nebadon Izumi: i tested it this morning and it seems to work quite well, you might notice a slight memory increase
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: but for me it wasn't bad I tested it with Universal Campus
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: which is pretty heavy prim/mesh load
[11:51] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim Dev 08c1dff: 2016-08-22 20:43:47 +0100 (Unix/Mono)
[11:51] Kayaker Magic: Is the Saturday meeting still happening?
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: OSgrid release will have it soon, not quite there yet probably next few days
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: I believe the Saturday OSgrid meeting is still happening yes
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: i see G+ postings about it
[11:51] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, great. I noticed that just now in the git log. I'll update my standalone and test it.
[11:52] Nebadon Izumi: the Saturday meeting is more directly related to OSgrid operations though
[11:52] stiofain nbmcmedia: yea sat meet is quite popular
[12:13] Sheera.Khan The logs of the saturday town hall meetings are in the OSG-forum
[12:13] Sheera.Khan
[11:52] Andrew Hellershanks: I've forgotten who asked about posting of these meetings. Sheera is here now if you want to pass on your comments/thanks to her directly.
[11:53] James.Atlloud I feel like many grids have a problem serving map tiles. Is this something most folks turn off?
[11:53] Nebadon Izumi: not that I am aware of
[11:53] Nebadon Izumi: its probably more of an HG issue
[11:53] James.Atlloud OH YEAH - thanks to Sheera for posting the logs :)
[11:53] stiofain nbmcmedia: still working on viewer melanie?
[11:53] Melanie Milland: well, a lot of grids have old config files, despite the fact that we tell thm to merge new changes
[11:53] Melanie Milland: so there may actually be some that still don't have a maptile server
[11:53] Nebadon Izumi: there may be some maptile issues when you are HG'ing
[11:53] Andrew Hellershanks: James, the problem with Warp3D generation of tiles is that it was a known source of memory leaks. Sometimes the module is disabled or just set to generate a tile on region start.
[11:54] James.Atlloud ah ty.
[11:54] Melanie Milland: and yes, most grids use warp as a 1-shot or use the standard maptiler (which sucks)
[11:54] Melanie Milland: the viewer project is on hold pending new funding
[11:54] Andrew Hellershanks: Having just received an update to the module it needs testing to determine what issues it still has, or what new ones it may have.
[11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Melanie, Indeed. The warp3d module generates much better looking tiles.
[11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: James, You referenced the Mal Burns show. Would you provide some information about it and how to find information on it or how to listen to it for those not faimliar with the show?
[11:58] James.Atlloud Sure - Mal Burns has been recording a variety of programs about virtual worlds with a focus on SL and OpenSim. The best list of episodes is here:
[11:58] James.Atlloud
[11:58] stiofain nbmcmedia: this week
[11:58] James.Atlloud The show is LONG but covers a lot of ground.
[11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: James, ok ty.
[11:58] Nebadon Izumi: Mal is also heavily involved in the planning of OSCC usually
[11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: These meetings can be long somedays
[11:59] James.Atlloud Yes, he again this year.
[11:59] Nebadon Izumi: Great, my time will be somewhat limited in the planning of the event this year
[11:59] Nebadon Izumi: but I will be as available as I can to make sure the environment is ready to go
[12:00] Nebadon Izumi: I will be traveling the last 2 weeks of September
[12:00] Nebadon Izumi: will be in Belgium
[12:00] James.Atlloud Rhiannon/Joyce is also chair again. ah, Belgium. nice
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: so I wont have much time at all during those weeks, but up to and after that I should have as much time as needed to get things smooth
[12:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, the OSCC also relies on assistance from many other people. When should people interested in helping with the running of the OSCC step forward?
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: maybe James can answer that better
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: soon we will have a volunteer form on the website
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: I am sure they have already begun reformatting the website for this year
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi:
[12:01] James.Atlloud I'm not certain - I'll mention it at the next meeting to get a solid answer.
[12:01] Nebadon Izumi: keep checking in there
[12:02] Nebadon Izumi: and as we find out more we will keep making updates here and on IRC
[12:02] Nebadon Izumi: there is probably an OSCC Twitter feed you can follow as well
[12:02] Nebadon Izumi: as well as Facebook
[12:02] Nebadon Izumi: those details should be on the website
[12:03] James.Atlloud The proposed due date for proposals is October 9 and announcements should be appearing in mid September.
[12:03] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, which IRC channel will provide updates? The opensim-devel channel or another one?
[12:03] Nebadon Izumi: opensim-dev
[12:03] Nebadon Izumi: i'll try to relay any details I get
[12:03] Nebadon Izumi: I am sure diva will too
[12:03] Nebadon Izumi: she is also involved she was able to attend the last meeting
[12:04] Nebadon Izumi: We will likely have a core developer panel again this year
[12:04] Nebadon Izumi: so keep that in mind
[12:04] Melanie Milland: well, i'm around :)
[12:05] Andrew Hellershanks: We are just past the hour and some people can't stay much past the hour. Any other topics to discuss before we start losing a few people from this meeting?
[12:05] Nebadon Izumi: I will see if I can get Joyce to attend this meeting in the coming weeks
[12:05] James.Atlloud oh good idea.
[12:05] Nebadon Izumi: but probably better to wait until things are a bit more developed
[12:05] Nebadon Izumi: then she can answer questions etc..
[12:06] marti soundsgood: will there be a chance to ask for advice in this meeting before it end?
[12:06] Nebadon Izumi: ask away marti
[12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: marti, Not everyone drops out around the top of the hour. Go ahead.
[12:07] marti soundsgood: i can wait till you have completed your business
[12:07] Nebadon Izumi: thats ok go for it
[12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: mari, there is no particular order to the meeting here. Go ahead.
[12:08] Nebadon Izumi: better to ask when we are still responding :)
[12:08] marti soundsgood: ok ..i have been asked to upgrade an existing opensim grid. there was some existing functionality already added to it ..ossl functions
[12:09] Hippo Finesmith: just incase anyone has any input , i am currently playing with making a auction module wich will allow parcels to be auctioned
[12:09] marti soundsgood: the person who added that to the grid is unavailable for assistance in the upgrade process
[12:09] marti soundsgood: sooo..
[12:09] Hippo Finesmith: i have it currently able to set an auction id and set the land status properly but havent done much more
[12:10] Hippo Finesmith: just tinkering and playing really
[12:10] marti soundsgood: I've decompiled 3 dll files ..found what i think is the right elements for the functions ..and tried to apply them to the right files in the right places for the latest version of the os to say im getting errors
[12:11] Nebadon Izumi: do you have IRC client marti?
[12:11] Andrew Hellershanks: marti, are these custom DLL's used only in your grid that you decompiled? If they are part of OpenSim the full source is available.
[12:11] Nebadon Izumi: I would suggest you hop on freenode and join the #opensim-dev channel
[12:11] marti soundsgood: ...i hope to verify that im getting the data from the right dll files and putting them into the right cs files etc
[12:12] Andrew Hellershanks: Hippo, that sounds interesting. I don't know how many people have wanted to run land auctions.
[12:12] marti soundsgood: these are open sim files and they have had ossl functions added
[12:12] Nebadon Izumi: marti those are definitely not easily answered questions
[12:13] Nebadon Izumi: ok opensim is 100% open source
[12:13] Nebadon Izumi: so you should not have to decompile anything
[12:13] Nebadon Izumi: oh i see you are saying someone modified OSSL
[12:13] Nebadon Izumi: but never shared the source of that
[12:13] marti soundsgood: bingo
[12:13] Andrew Hellershanks: marti, You should have the source for the OSSL function in OSSL_Api.cs that you can compare to the version supplied with the version of code you are using.
[12:13] Nebadon Izumi: ok well I would really suggest you join us in our IRC development channel
[12:14] Andrew Hellershanks: ah, the good old mod but not share issue. :P
[12:14] Dayna Bedrosian: Basically added some scripting functions which we want to be open source, but we had to backward engineer them to figure them out
[12:15] marti soundsgood: i'd be happy to join you in the irc development channel ..what application do you currently use to access irc and what is the irc adress you use
[12:15] Nebadon Izumi: ya unfortunately not quite my area of expertise, but I know there are definitely a few people who could answer your questions in the dev channel
[12:15] Nebadon Izumi: i recommend hexchat
[12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: marti, different people use different programs. Depends in part which operating system you are using.
[12:15] marti soundsgood: can you provide the contact details ..and a name or two for me to ask?
[12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: I run Linux so I use pidgin
[12:15] Nebadon Izumi: for Windows and Linux i use hexchat
[12:15] marti soundsgood: i use windows
[12:15] Nebadon Izumi:
[12:15] marti soundsgood: i havent used irc in two decades
[12:16] Andrew Hellershanks: pidgin is also available for Windows.
[12:16] Nebadon Izumi: the server is "Freenode"
[12:16] Nebadon Izumi: the channel is #opensim-dev
[12:16] Andrew Hellershanks: There is a web page about the IRC channels in the wiki.
[12:16] marti soundsgood: thanks
[12:16] marti soundsgood: thanks for the advice peeps
[12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: marti, just ask your question on IRC and wait for a response. Answers can be a while in coming.
[12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: tc, stiofain. Thanks for droping by
[12:17] Nebadon Izumi: no proplem marti, I am "Nebadon" on IRC and Andrew is "Plugh"
[12:18] Andrew Hellershanks: We are starting to lose more people now. I think we can close the meeting for today and continue the discussion with marti on IRC.
[12:18] Nebadon Izumi: yea sounds good, I need to get back onto Encitragrid and finish up some modeling
[12:18] Nebadon Izumi: but I will try to keep an eye on IRC too
[12:21] Sheera.Khan may I still toss in the question of Project Bento Bones in OpenSimulator?
[12:21] Nebadon Izumi: sure Sheera, I can not say if we will or will not support Bento at this point
[12:21] Sheera.Khan is there anything that would be needed to do on the server side?
[12:21] Nebadon Izumi: generally until those features hit TPV
[12:21] Nebadon Izumi: we can't even start thinking about it
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: someone will need to update Libomv as well
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: we just don't know yet
[12:22] Andrew Hellershanks: Bento Bones. Isn't that one of those newer LL things?
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: probably though
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: I don't think it will be anything major but we may have to accomodate new attach points
[12:22] Sheera.Khan yes, those are additional bones for all sorts of mesh-avatars...
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: is that grid wide in SL yet?
[12:22] Nebadon Izumi: or still in testing?
[12:23] Andrew Hellershanks: yea. The code that does the data being saving/reading will need to be updated.
[12:23] Nebadon Izumi: I am fairly certain the Third Party Viewers do not have it yet, but perhaps im wrong
[12:23] Sheera.Khan to my knowledge it is on that grid but only the specific project viewer renders it completely (no it's not - I just looked it up)
[12:24] Andrew Hellershanks: As that is a new feature for SL is it even likely to hit the OS version of a TPV any time soon?
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: right
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: so until its in their main viewer
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: and the TPV's are allowed to pick it up
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: OpenSim won't even be able to use it
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: ok well I am sure we can start looking closer at it soon
[12:24] Nebadon Izumi: 1st step will of course be updating Libomv
[12:25] Sheera.Khan that would be great :-)
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: but knowing viewer devs like Cinder
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: and a few others
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: there will probably be great interest in getting it working
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: they might even provide patches for us
[12:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Which viewer does Cinder work on?
[12:25] Nebadon Izumi: but as of right this moment, i can say we haven't looked into it at all
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: Alchemy viewer
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: which is sister project of Singularity viewer
[12:26] Sheera.Khan getting 0.9.0 ready for the show is priority I agree
[12:26] Andrew Hellershanks: I would hazard a guess that any support required in the back end code wouldn't be added until after 0.9 is released.
[12:26] Andrew Hellershanks: ah, right.
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: right
[12:26] Nebadon Izumi: i doubt bento would make the 0.9 release at this point
[12:27] Andrew Hellershanks: No. I don't think we should try unless the implementation turned out to be trivial.
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: it could turn out though that we have only minimal changes required also
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: its all kind of speculation at this point though
[12:27] Andrew Hellershanks: Still, it would be better to not add any thing more that is new to the code until we get 0.9 out.
[12:27] Nebadon Izumi: storing of new assets is trivial
[12:28] Nebadon Izumi: it may end up being in a seperate branch initially anyway
[12:28] Andrew Hellershanks: yes, but it is making sure it can handle reading of a larger block.
[12:28] Andrew Hellershanks: Right.
[12:28] Nebadon Izumi: the important thing is we make sure LL isnt going to change it at the last minute
[12:28] Nebadon Izumi: like what happened with Mesh
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: we did a lot of work to accomodate having mesh almost simultanously with LL
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: and they ended up changing it a few weeks later
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: and breaking 100% of our content
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: i still have a few dozen mesh objects in my inventory i cant rez anymore
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: haha
[12:29] Nebadon Izumi: so always good to let them work out the bugs first
[12:30] Sheera.Khan I agree, that would be a waste of precious ressources and development efforts
[12:30] Andrew Hellershanks: indeed
[12:30] Nebadon Izumi: then we can have a safer approach to doing it right
[12:31] Andrew Hellershanks: Once the project has deployed in SL and adopted by TPV's for their SL viewers someone could start seeing what needs to be done in OS to support the feature.
[12:32] Nebadon Izumi: ok I really do need to get back to work for a few more hours
[12:32] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, could you save the mesh object data and work out how to fix the data to allow the objects to rez?
[12:32] Andrew Hellershanks nods
[12:32] Andrew Hellershanks: I should get going too.
[12:32] Nebadon Izumi: no they really changed the format a lot
[12:32] Nebadon Izumi: it just wasnt worth the effort
[12:32] Andrew Hellershanks: ok
[12:32] Andrew Hellershanks: If you still have the original data used to create the mesh you can always reimport the models.
[12:33] Nebadon Izumi: sometimes better to just cut your loss and move on :)
[12:33] Nebadon Izumi: that was the general agreement
[12:33] Nebadon Izumi: it was only a couple weeks at most
[12:33] Andrew Hellershanks nods
[12:33] Nebadon Izumi: mostly just a few hardcore folks like myself effected
[12:33] Nebadon Izumi: and most of us were used to broken content :)
[12:33] Andrew Hellershanks: hehe
[12:34] Sheera.Khan so I can still hope for those bones :-)
[12:34] Andrew Hellershanks: ok. I'm going to get going as well. I'll be at my workbench for a few minutes.
[12:34] Nebadon Izumi: ok talk soon everyone, thanks for coming
[12:35] Andrew Hellershanks: Thank you to everyone for dropping by. See you next week.

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