Chat log from the meeting on 2013-10-29

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[11:00] Nebadon Izumi is online.
[11:00] Richardus Raymaker is online.
[11:01] Robert Wood21: DNS, remote desktop
[11:01] Robert Wood21: FTP?
[11:01] Vivian Klees: hi Justin
[11:01] Nebadon Izumi: doubt there will be a preset for 9000
[11:01] logger sewell: Hey Justin
[11:01] Tiffany Magic: Hello Justin
[11:01] Justin Clark-Casey: hello folks
[11:01] Nebadon Izumi: hello Justin
[11:02] Arielle Popstar: Hi Justin
[11:02] Richardus Raymaker: lucky.. i folloowed my nose :)
[11:02] Arielle Popstar: Hi Rira
[11:02] Richardus Raymaker: forgot the wintertime
[11:02] Richardus Raymaker: hi all
[11:02] Vivian Klees: time change is this weekend
[11:02] Justin Clark-Casey: It will only be an hour earlier this week for us Europeans
[11:02] Richardus Raymaker: well. we just done it here
[11:02] Richardus Raymaker: yes.
[11:03] Arielle Popstar: would think time change wouldnt be hard to coordinate
[11:04] Richardus Raymaker: i have only found 1 problem :O
[11:04] Robert Wood21: i'm getting timely logouts from my sim, the server runs fine but logs me out after specific time
[11:05] Robert Wood21: what to do
[11:05] Richardus Raymaker: if you shutdown region clean, robust dont delete the maptile.
[11:05] Richardus Raymaker: hi robert
[11:05] Vivian Klees: that might be the viewer
[11:05] Robert Wood21: tried 3 to 4 viewers
[11:06] Richardus Raymaker: is the logout a bit fixt time interval ?
[11:06] Nebadon Izumi: its possible it is something with your router Robert
[11:06] logger sewell: we have ghosted regions with all viewers except the new cool viewer
[11:06] Nebadon Izumi: stuff like SPI (Stateful Packet Inspection) and Packet Shaping can have strange effects
[11:08] Richardus Raymaker: or DOS protection ?
[11:08] Richardus Raymaker: logger. i have my own grid. well redoing it . because linux is not good the way i used it. but robust dont delete the maptiles. als after i knew that i could get soem tiles removed from other grid to
[11:08] Nebadon Izumi: yea that is usually SPI but some routers might label it differently
[11:09] Robert Wood21: oh k
[11:09] Richardus Raymaker: i just think when you move your region from rebust. it never delete the maptiles. (not implemented?)
[11:10] logger sewell: ah ok Richard is see what you mean
[11:10] Justin Clark-Casey: wouldn't surprise me if maptile deletion on deregistration has never been implemented
[11:10] Richardus Raymaker: i remove dthe maptiles from the robust aptile directory and the problem where instant fixt with wrong tiles
[11:10] Richardus Raymaker: must be justin :O
[11:11] Richardus Raymaker: hello robert a
[11:11] Justin Clark-Casey: richardus; though I'm surprised new map tiles do not replace old
[11:11] Richardus Raymaker: the do.. but the old one dont get removed
[11:12] Richardus Raymaker: btw there's mantis about that one to from someone.
[11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: but how would replace not removed them?
[11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: don't they have the same filenames?
[11:12] Richardus Raymaker:
[11:12] Nebadon Izumi: old v2 map tiles do not get erased
[11:12] Richardus Raymaker: my maptiles have coordinates as filename
[11:13] Nebadon Izumi: we have a crontask here on OSgrid that purges tiles occasionally
[11:13] Richardus Raymaker: so the chane when you move the region
[11:13] Nebadon Izumi: they get regerenerated when region restarts
[11:13] Richardus Raymaker: change
[11:13] Justin Clark-Casey: you didn't tell me you were talking about actually moving regio nlocations
[11:14] Richardus Raymaker: i figured out nebadon :O. its beter if tiles get removed when you dereistrate the region from grid
[11:14] Justin Clark-Casey: Does anybody else see problems with downloading textures?
[11:14] Richardus Raymaker: Ok. my fault...
[11:15] Arielle Popstar: possibly as ome wearables i imported last week are white now
[11:15] Arielle Popstar: some^
[11:15] Richardus Raymaker: i did add that as note justin
[11:16] Arielle Popstar: running opensim 5be8f66
[11:17] Justin Clark-Casey: ok. it's a pain to remove maptiles since you have to either have the grid service communicate with the maptile service or somehow have the smiulator do it directly
[11:17] Nebadon Izumi: ya and the maptile levels are quite complicated too
[11:17] Nebadon Izumi: there is like 6 levels of zoom
[11:17] Justin Clark-Casey: I have a bunch of textures seemingly waiting forever to download. though I have also recently updated to fs 4.4.2
[11:17] Richardus Raymaker: ohhh. the are split in the codee. right.. i have seen the amount of levels yes.
[11:17] Nebadon Izumi: which most of the levels are a composite of several regions
[11:18] Nebadon Izumi: and then those composites can also be cached at the region level
[11:18] Nebadon Izumi: so until everything gets restarted you might continue to see old tiles for some time
[11:18] Richardus Raymaker: justin, but robust get the message this region is shutdown. but you know the code better
[11:18] Richardus Raymaker: Restart dont fix it sofar i know. only manual remove works nebadon
[11:19] Robert Adams: pretty sure the maptiles are not deleted when a region shuts down
[11:19] Richardus Raymaker: so the only way then is tou run a process that check things with opensi database and compare it with the maptile names
[11:19] Richardus Raymaker: 100% sure robert
[11:20] Richardus Raymaker: i would say delete the maptile with region name <bla> when region get shutdown. but seems that need to be in maptile service
[11:20] Robert Adams: the Simian grid service stores the maptiles in the filesystem... there you could just delete old files
[11:20] Richardus Raymaker: and the different zoom levels is only io check when you delet. but i talk simple
[11:21] logger sewell: our problem is when moving a region to another location we get the ghosts even when we do a complete server reboot
[11:21] Justin Clark-Casey: for v3 map, robust also stores them on the filesystem
[11:21] Richardus Raymaker: logger, because the tiles dont get deleted
[11:21] logger sewell: yes
[11:21] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, really the grid service should ask the map tile servie to remove them on dereg, or possibly the simulator should do it directly
[11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: the latter would probably be simpler, tbh
[11:22] Richardus Raymaker: anuway. its a problem i found and would solve many bad TP's
[11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: but I'm not sure how that affects v1 map problems
[11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: a tp is not going to be allowed to a regio nthat is not online, even if it has a maptile
[11:23] Richardus Raymaker: i use singularity justin. and i could delete the maptile live. when the are all remove dfrom the region. i did not see them anymore. but need to recheck it the next time
[11:23] Robert Wood21: i have running opensim on virtual private server but i cant tp to the region , any soultion ?
[11:23] Richardus Raymaker: yes justin. but i mean i TP much on what i see on the map.
[11:23] Robert Wood21: its win 2012 server OS
[11:23] Richardus Raymaker: Robert, check your firewall
[11:24] Richardus Raymaker: udp & tcp
[11:24] Robert Wood21: firewall is off
[11:24] Robert Wood21: for both private and public network
[11:24] Robert Adams: do you get the dreaded "cannot create presence"?
[11:24] Arielle Popstar: play around with tyhe location setting
[11:25] Arielle Popstar: Home, Last location
[11:25] logger sewell: @ Robert Wood are you trying to Hyper grid into it ?
[11:25] Arielle Popstar: of the viewer
[11:25] Robert Wood21: no just want to tp to osgrid region
[11:25] Arielle Popstar: i am noticing on the one i am running that Home does not work
[11:26] Dahlia Trimble is online.
[11:26] Nebadon Izumi: that sounds like network not configured properly or something to me
[11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't know why, but I get the temptation to write a tool to probe the udp and tcp ports after reading from the regio nand opensim.ini files
[11:26] Robert Adams: "cannot tp" could be many things... what error are you getting?
[11:27] Robert Wood21: request timeout
[11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: just a simple python script to at least check all the right ports are open
[11:27] Richardus Raymaker: There's one other problem. you maby readed. why do you not see maptiles when you HG ?
[11:27] Robert Wood21: when i checked for 9000 port it said refusing connection
[11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: then that's your problem
[11:27] Richardus Raymaker: Robert, try differnet port number. or its still blocked
[11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: your 9000 port is not reachable with the IP that you have in regions.ini
[11:27] Robert Adams: +10 Justin... a tool that 'verifies/ the configured connectivity has been needed for a long time
[11:27] Nebadon Izumi: ya maybe router is not port forwarding properly
[11:27] Nebadon Izumi: you cant just "Open" ports on the roter
[11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: alright, I might just knock up a really rough python script to at least poitn people to
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: they need to be forwarded to local IP in your lan
[11:28] Dahlia Trimble: hi
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: every router is a bit different
[11:28] Arielle Popstar: what you have set for externalhostname= in region.ini?
[11:28] Nebadon Izumi: hello Dahlia
[11:28] Robert Wood21: well this is bit funny when i check ip in command promt its diffrent and on the whatismyip website its diffrnt
[11:28] Richardus Raymaker: uhmm local vs external ?
[11:29] Robert Wood21: may be
[11:29] Robert Wood21: which one i shuld put for region.ini from command promt or feom whatismyip?
[11:29] Robert Adams: 'timeout' usually means the viewer can't talk to the region... 'cannot create presence' usually means the gird service could not talk to the region
[11:29] Richardus Raymaker: no idea;s why maptiles are not visible from other grids in viewer ?
[11:30] Robert Adams: when the region starts it registers its IP address with the grid service
[11:30] Robert Adams: when you TP, the grid service give that IP address to the viewer to connect to
[11:30] Justin Clark-Casey: hi dahlia
[11:30] Richardus Raymaker: Robert A, how is progress with the problems ?
[11:30] logger sewell: Hi Dahlia
[11:30] Arielle Popstar: Justin I would like to play around with the sit positioning and wondering where i would do that in source. Assuming it is in Region/Framework/Scenes/ScenePresence.cs?
[11:30] Dahlia Trimble: hi :)
[11:30] Robert Adams: which 'problems', Richardus... there are many :)
[11:31] Richardus Raymaker: cpu / memory useage
[11:31] Justin Clark-Casey: heh, a never-ending cascade of problems
[11:31] Richardus Raymaker: thats your main one sofar i know
[11:31] Arielle Popstar: Hi Dahlia, dress looks cute on you
[11:31] Dahlia Trimble: :)
[11:31] Fred.Appleby ScriptInstances uses throw new EventAbortException() can these be encapsulated in a try catch, the exceptions are a pain when debugging under VS, works on windows, will it screw up on mono?
[11:31] Robert Wood21: what wud be the endpoint for the trafic coming from osgrid ?
[11:32] Robert Adams: reduced memory to 'usable'... some people with many regions in one simulator (especially 32 bit) might to be able to use BulletSim -- it uses more memory than ODE
[11:32] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: yes, specifically HandleAgentSit()
[11:32] Robert Wood21: DNS, HTTP or powershell?
[11:32] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: they are ain try catch
[11:32] Arielle Popstar: ok ty Justin
[11:32] Nebadon Izumi: its none of those Robert Wood, there is not going to be a preset for opensim
[11:32] Richardus Raymaker: aha. so you can betetr run 25 simulators on 1 system then 5 with 5 regions on it ? :O
[11:32] Fred.Appleby not at present
[11:32] Nebadon Izumi: you will have to manually forward the ports
[11:32] Robert Adams: the worst of the CPU problem has been resolved... you will see move CPU than with ODE if you have lots of prims (like > 30K)
[11:33] Arielle Popstar: is there a particular reason why sits do not mimic what is in S/L/
[11:33] Nebadon Izumi: I updated last night and tested my racer, its still using about 180%+ cpu
[11:33] Robert Wood21: how i can forward port on virtual machine runing win 2012 server
[11:33] Robert Adams: totally fixing the large prim CPU problem will take patching Bullet
[11:33] Richardus Raymaker: Intressting info robert.
[11:33] Fred.Appleby look at line 1040 in ScriptInstance.cs
[11:33] Dahlia Trimble: I get bazillions of "unable to mesh" messages, could they all be accurate?
[11:34] Nebadon Izumi: Robert Wood are you running Openbsim in a virtualmachine?
[11:34] Richardus Raymaker: Robert W, with virtual box the only solution where for me to add a second adapter in bridge modem in the virtual machien if it runs windows
[11:34] Robert Wood21: yes
[11:34] Nebadon Izumi: that can get complicated, depending on what VM software your running
[11:34] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: They are caught in ScriptIstance.EventProcessor()
[11:34] Robert Adams: your cars also had a script overhead problem, Nebadon
[11:34] Nebadon Izumi: if your using NAT that really complicates it
[11:34] Richardus Raymaker: Nebdon i tried to run opensim in virtualbox (linux guest) but im reverting bck to normal windows.. no comments
[11:35] Robert Adams: I will look into that again... I think there is some propblem with filtering of collision messages withing large linksets
[11:35] Fred.Appleby VS breaks aou, say they are not being processed
[11:35] Robert Wood21: its virtual machine from Windows azure account
[11:35] Robert Wood21: the virtual machine is remote desktop client
[11:35] Nebadon Izumi: ah ok, ya unfortunatly i have never used Azure, I have no idea how their firewall works
[11:35] Richardus Raymaker: huh?
[11:35] Richardus Raymaker: Azure is new for me.
[11:35] Robert Wood21: ok
[11:35] Nebadon Izumi: im pretty certain your problem is there though
[11:36] Robert Wood21: its from microssoft
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: firewall not configured properly
[11:36] Dahlia Trimble: isnt Azure kinda pricey?
[11:36] Richardus Raymaker: best if you can set the VM in bridged mode
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: its not a VM
[11:36] Robert Wood21: firewall is off
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: its a VPS
[11:36] Richardus Raymaker: or its some cloud virtual machine ?
[11:36] Nebadon Izumi: yes cloud
[11:36] Richardus Raymaker: ahh. sorry.
[11:36] Robert Wood21: yes cloud
[11:36] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: okay, I think I see waht you mean. They don't cause a critical issue but could probably be caught in EventProcessor()
[11:36] Richardus Raymaker: but.. vps have normally i Real ip
[11:36] Arielle Popstar: thinks Justin may have passed out from all the questions ;)
[11:37] Dahlia Trimble: lol
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: I would suggest contacting the Azure support on help with configure the firewall
[11:37] Fred.Appleby yes Justin, sorry for my poor terminology
[11:37] Robert Wood21: so turning off the firewall is not solution?
[11:37] Richardus Raymaker: i need to find a few resources for 1 region in osgrid.. :O betetr with testing.
[11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: hm, no actually I think they should be caught by the exception catch
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: no the windows firewall is not the propblem
[11:37] Richardus Raymaker: Rbert, turning off firewall is neve rgood idea
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: is likely the VM itself, but its hard to say
[11:37] Nebadon Izumi: i have no idea how they do itl
[11:37] Fred.Appleby Anytime debugging scripts with state change or script reset
[11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't mind questions, it's complaints that make me pass out :)
[11:37] Andrew Hellershanks is online.
[11:38] Arielle Popstar: :)
[11:38] Richardus Raymaker: I only serve bugs justin :)
[11:38] Dahlia Trimble complains about all the questions
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: if its anything like Amazon is a level of firewall / routing outside of your server you have to contend with as well
[11:38] Andrew Hellershanks waves hello
[11:38] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: are you able to add a catfch where you find it necessary? Would be happy to see a patch on that
[11:38] Richardus Raymaker: hi andrew
[11:38] logger sewell: Hey Andrew
[11:38] Justin Clark-Casey: otherwise would be quite some time before I can check things
[11:38] Nebadon Izumi: hello Andrew
[11:38] Andrew Hellershanks forgot it was meeting day
[11:39] Fred.Appleby I add the patches to my local copy, and works ok
[11:39] Robert Wood21: oliveira virtual lands in osgrid runs on azure
[11:39] Justin Clark-Casey: richardus: it's alright, I know you're trying to help. Sometimes all the bugs just get on top of me :)
[11:39] Justin Clark-Casey: soooo complicated
[11:39] Fred.Appleby never added to a mono install
[11:39] Robert Wood21: anybody know whos the person i shuld contact?
[11:39] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: if you put the patch on mantis I can take a look at it
[11:39] Richardus Raymaker: I know justin. sometimes make small programs myself
[11:39] Andrew Hellershanks wonders what he missed
[11:39] Arielle Popstar: ask Fernando thern. He is always helpful
[11:39] Fred.Appleby ok thankyou Justin
[11:40] Fred.Appleby another question Justin?
[11:40] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: sure
[11:40] Richardus Raymaker: nebadon. can you not make asome avatr for just in the shape of paper pile ? reaching above the head. then we know the status :)
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: Robert I dont know anyone who has run OpenSim in Azure, I am sure someone has but I dont recall anyone mentioning they have before
[11:40] Justin Clark-Casey: ha, seeing a graphical represntation of all the mantis bugs in -world would be neat :)
[11:40] Justin Clark-Casey: we might be snowed out of this room though
[11:40] Nebadon Izumi: lol
[11:40] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: simudyne are
[11:40] Fred.Appleby using an empty list as a bool, while(listthing), not working, works on SL. Is there any known reason?
[11:41] Nebadon Izumi: ah cool, I really meant someone that Robert could talk to about it
[11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: I think deficiencies in opensim's lsl parser
[11:41] Richardus Raymaker: lol
[11:41] Nebadon Izumi: im not sure simudyne is very accessible in terms of helping out here
[11:41] Arielle Popstar: Fernando
[11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: true
[11:41] Robert Wood21: oliveira virtual land has posted its image on twitter
[11:41] Fred.Appleby so a deficiency, not really a bug or something?
[11:42] Justin Clark-Casey: fred: doesn't bug == deficiency ?
[11:42] Andrew Hellershanks: I was interested to work on the OS parser but since it converts LSL to C#, I'm not sure I'm as interested.
[11:42] Dahlia Trimble: is it documented to work?
[11:42] Justin Clark-Casey: I would call it a bug which could be fixed - just the parser is a pita to work with
[11:42] Justin Clark-Casey: or the parser generator, rather
[11:42] Fred.Appleby in some camps no
[11:42] Nebadon Izumi: you might try contacting them then, he may be of some help
[11:42] Robert Wood21:
[11:42] Robert Wood21: ok :)
[11:42] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: you would prefer it to convert lsl directly to il?
[11:43] Dahlia Trimble: isnt that what is indirectly happening anyway
[11:43] Arielle Popstar: Justin, my question was is there a particular reason why sits do not mimic what is in S/L? --when you have a moment :)
[11:43] Andrew Hellershanks: yeah, something like that if il means "interpreted language".
[11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: il is the intermediate language of .net
[11:43] Richardus Raymaker: Andrew that sounds slow
[11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: conversion to an interpreted language would be worse than to a compiled one... :)
[11:43] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, ah, ok.
[11:43] Richardus Raymaker: If you used basic on C64 you know whay
[11:44] Richardus Raymaker: why
[11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: I believe because it's complicated to do - you have to start ray-tracing the point where you should be sitting
[11:44] Andrew Hellershanks: The il would be something like how Pascal is handled. Compiled to an intermediate language.
[11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: And there was some grief last time we changed the sit position
[11:44] Richardus Raymaker: pascal is nice
[11:44] Arielle Popstar: is ray tracing working in opensim?
[11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: yes
[11:44] Allen Kerensky: raycasting works to a point Arielle
[11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: there is ray-tracing code, as used by llCastRay() and raytracing to place one prim on top of another
[11:44] Arielle Popstar: ok Allen...was reading that
[11:44] Andrew Hellershanks: One of these days I'll do more digging around in the LSL engine.
[11:44] Richardus Raymaker: sofar i know the llRaytrace exists. only never understanded that command
[11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: e.g. so that when you hit create on a prim surface it puts the new prim on top
[11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: afair all the mechanisms are slightly different unfortunately
[11:45] Arielle Popstar: this would be used by the viewer?
[11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: llCastRay makes use of the physics engine I think whilst the ray-casting to build prims is native c# code...
[11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: no, it's all server side
[11:46] Arielle Popstar: hmm ok
[11:46] Dahlia Trimble: llCastRay is done in c# and only collides against bounding boxes
[11:46] Allen Kerensky: yeah CastRay is an LSL bit that relies on the server to do the work to deliver the answers
[11:46] Dahlia Trimble: so llCastRay is not very accurate
[11:46] Arielle Popstar: my understanding from an s/l office hours a few years back was that viewers also had a part to play in sit positioning
[11:47] Allen Kerensky: its pretty usable Dahlia - I have a maze-solver NPC that worked better than I expected
[11:47] Dahlia Trimble: the viewer can do a raycast but Im not sure if its used in sit positioning
[11:47] Allen Kerensky: It did have a problem finding the "floor prim" when it was large and linked to other prims
[11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: Allen: I could put that to the text. I made a raw file that turned a region in to a giant maze.
[11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: s/text/test/
[11:48] Arielle Popstar: i did pl;ay about in opensim and noticed that moving the pointer to different areas of a prim affected the avatars sit position
[11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: they do give an offset
[11:48] Arielle Popstar: the viewer?
[11:49] Arielle Popstar: ok
[11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: yes
[11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: bbiab. The cat is calling for me.
[11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: comes in via ScenePresence.HandleAgentRequestSit()
[11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: may only apply to prims without a sit position set
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: yes that is the part i am interested in
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: ok ty all for the info
[11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: yw
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: will do more research and play about more
[11:50] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.8.0 Dev          5be8f66: 2013-10-25 00:54:33 +0100 (Unix/Mono)
[11:51] Fred.Appleby Another meeting, thanks for the input.
[11:51] Nebadon Izumi: Teravus is a good person to talk with as well if you have questions about raycast
[11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: richardus: so did you see the note I added to
[11:51] Arielle Popstar: yes noticed he was at the meeting in s/l about it
[11:51] Richardus Raymaker: Not yet. not recieved mail. let me look
[11:51] Arielle Popstar: was hoping he would have been here today
[11:52] Richardus Raymaker: Oh sorry yes that one i have seen justin
[11:52] Richardus Raymaker: we just need to give robert some time to look at it
[11:54] Richardus Raymaker: little bit computer choas here last time. try to configure / figure out the right setup. my worse enemy is the energy bill
[11:55] Dahlia Trimble: my worst enemy is the windows 8.1 upgrade
[11:55] Nebadon Izumi: haha that worked quite well for me
[11:55] logger sewell: ha ha now that is truew
[11:55] Arielle Popstar: better get some solar panels and convert those wind mills to electric generating ones
[11:55] Richardus Raymaker: Lol dahlia. i cant get the 8.1 upgarde.
[11:55] Nebadon Izumi: the only thing that totally broke for me was virtualbox
[11:55] Richardus Raymaker: there's no download
[11:55] Dahlia Trimble: the upgrade worked ok but now I cant get my fonts set up so I can read them
[11:56] logger sewell: i put 8 on a backup to test with i really really hate that program
[11:56] Richardus Raymaker: not 125dpi ?
[11:56] Dahlia Trimble: it wiped all my custom settings from win8
[11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: robert: did you see ?
[11:56] Nebadon Izumi: i had to totally uninistall and re-install virtualbox to get it to work again, lukckily all my virtualmachines survivided
[11:56] Richardus Raymaker: i love 8 desktop. its better then win7. shame MS screwed it a bit with modern
[11:56] Andrew Hellershanks is still trying to upgrade his machine to a pair of 1TB drives.
[11:56] Nebadon Izumi: oh you know i probably didnt notice anything like that cause i was running pretty stock configuration dahlia
[11:56] Nebadon Izumi: that sucks
[11:57] Richardus Raymaker: Well, nebadon. i cant find a way to install it. the iso i downloaded from MS dont accept the key bla bla.
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: there is a patch
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: shouldnt be any iso
[11:57] Richardus Raymaker: Anfrew. explain. whats the problem ?
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: the patch installs from the windows store
[11:57] Richardus Raymaker: Nebnadon. i worl with local account.
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: so do i
[11:57] Dahlia Trimble: I remember it took weeks for me to figure out how to get win8 fonts set up so I could see them
[11:57] Nebadon Izumi: it will still download from windows store no problem
[11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, issues with the bootloader and I can't get it to boot Windows on the new drives.
[11:57] Richardus Raymaker: i refuse to use to windows store. its sill how the do the update
[11:58] Nebadon Izumi: you dont need an account for the 8.1 upgrade
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