[Opensim-dev] Thoughts....

[The Burnman]

On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 3:47 PM, Cristina Videira Lopes <lopes at ics.uci.edu>
wrote:

 Hello Christine,

>  Burnman,
>
> Technically your comments are off, as Michael already pointed out. They
> are so off that I think they are directed at the Open Sourced LL viewer,
> i.e. at the ability for clients to get complete information about the
> objects inworld to the point of being able to store them locally and to
> replicate them. Note that this has nothing to do with OpenSim, strictly
> speaking. But let me comment on that.
>
Actually, there has been discussion in the OpenSim IRC channels as well as
on this list about using client side asset storage for users to move from
grid to grid with their inventory.  THAT is what I was discussing.  That
DOES have to do with OpenSim.  The libSL fiasco with CopyBot has nothing to
do with what I am discussing.

> All clients get that information, or else they wouldn't be able to render
> it; there is no way around that:  a representation of the couch you see on
> your screen must be sent to your computer, period. In a context where you do
> want to show your objects to the world, ensuring that people don't use the
> LL viewer to "steal" them is impossible with technology alone.
>
 I am aware of that.  It's the same with a web page.  The browser can't
display what it can't see.  Though PHP does a wonderful job to prevent
people seeing the websites source code, since HTML is passed to the
browser.  This is one of the benefits of scripting in Second Life.  It's run
server side, stored server side, and the client doesn't get access to
scripts it doesn't have permission to see.

>  Other contexts are possible, however. One could add a PGP feature in
> which all inworld objects would be encrypted with their owner's private key,
> so they looked like garbage for everyone, except for those clients who had
> the object owner's public key. There's a neat research project right there!
> I bet it could be added very easily :-)
>
While the solution is technically feasible, what sense would it make to go
> around the world seeing garbage everywhere?? Plus anyone who wanted to see
> the decrypted objects would have to use an extended version of the LL
> viewer, one that does decryption. Not to mention the added performance
> overhead. … Again, I doubt massive adoption, but this could definitely be
> done, technically.
>
I am not sure how effective encryption would be...  but it is an interesting
thing to ponder.

> I'm on the camp that thinks that these kinds of **technological**
> solutions are silly, paranoid, and ultimately unreliable, because given
> enough motivation to break the encryption, it will be broken. But at the
> same time I have a lot of sympathy for your position. One cute thing about
> LL's SL is that it enabled ordinary people to suddenly feel like famous
> entrepreneurs and millionaires, simply by creating virtual objects that
> other people want.
>
Cute?  :D  SL gained most of it's popularity because of that "cute" little
concept.  And while most people don't make that much money with their little
virtual ventures...  many of them at least cover their own expenses.  That's
more than most can say about their entertainment.  The whole "own IP rights
to your creations, have a business in SL" thing is probably where most of
LL's success has come from.

> This is part of the fantasy-game designed by LL, along with the forced
> pseudonyms, the Linden "dollars", etc. I understand you want to protect that
> feeling, and someone ought to protect it. I sincerely hope that will survive
> in some grids, because it's empowering! Technology is the wrong approach to
> do it, though, it has to be something else.
>
 I don't see how textures, or prims for that matter, will be truly protected
with OpenSim... nor do I think with Second Life now that open-source is
making it so much easier to steal people's IP.  Scripts, however, are
another matter.  Client side storage negates what protection they currently
have, however, which was my concern from the start of this conversation.

> However, if these fantasies are all there is to the metaverse, we'll be in
> really bad shape. We might as well wrap-up OpenSim altogether, and let LL
> continue to do its thing.
>
While you may not really see people's little web ventures as more than
fantasies...  they are the driving force behind the expansion of LL's grid.
Some of those "fantasies" are comprised of people paying thousands of
dollars per month in tier and making profit beyond their cost as a result of
their efforts.  Should be interesting to see what happens to those people
and the money they bring to SL as time moves on and projects like OS
progress.

<off topic>
>
> The thought of going around a virtual world where everything is garbage
> due to encryption is a powerful, almost artistic, visualization of
> real-world paranoia and distrust. Picasso's Guernica comes to mind.
>
> </off topic>
>
Hmmm...  I think a better example of real-world paranoia and distrust would
be television commercials.  Products sold based on fear.  You're not pretty
enough unless you wear this make-up... you're not a man if you have grey
hair... you're less of a person if your fat... etc etc.  Protecting one's
own property from people who are going to try and steal it one way or the
other is human nature.  Dying your hair is paranoia.  :)
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