[11:18 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: they week i did just did accept a code contribution from Adil that adds some certificates convertion from pem to p12, useful for certs from let's encript etc
[11:18 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: hello
[11:18 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: well that was it..
[11:19 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: the floor is yours :)
[11:20 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I haven't done anything more than adding more changes to my viewer code, testing it on latest macOS and Win 11 and upgraded MySQL
[11:21 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: I wonder should I upgrade mySQL?
[11:21 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: nad on rust front?
[11:21 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: still the rubber band issues in opensim?
[11:23 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Oh, for me? Yes. I understand the problem now. All my fault. Still fixing my code. Had some other stuff to do last week.
[11:23 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: Oh... good you found the cause :)
[11:24 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: I discovered an interesting difference in lsl timer() behavior between SL and OS
[11:24 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: if you set a script to not running while it's timer is going
[11:24 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: only one? mnot bad ;;)
[11:24 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: :)
[11:25 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: and what is it?
[11:25 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: if you have 2 scripts with time set to, say, 2 minutes, and use one script to set the other not running
[11:25 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: then set it running again 2 minutes later
[11:25 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: the script in SL will think the 2 minutes is up. it checks the current time against the original time
[11:26 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Yes, found it. Working on new approach to extrapolation. Extrapolate from the point the server gives me, but apply an offset to correct any errors from the last move. Reduce the offset to zero over one average time between updates. Should produce smooth movement without rubber banding unless overshoot is huge.
[11:26 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: In OS, the script starts counting down when it is set to running. Setting to not running delays the countdown
[11:27 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: guess i prefer os way
[11:27 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Yeah
[11:27 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: me too
[11:27 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: was about to say
[11:27 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: not a problem for me, I wouldn;t call it a bug, but I did have to adjust some scripts imported from SL
[11:27 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Internally I think this is similar to doing a yeng suspend on the script, just halts processing for that "thread"
[11:27 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: seems a odd use case to worry.. just fun to know, thx :)
[11:28 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: OS way makes more sense for me
[11:28 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: yeah one of those 'good to know' things
[11:28 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: why would you even use scripts like that?
[11:28 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: ( gavin :) )
[11:28 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: SL sounds like when you set it to running again it almost does a full reset or something
[11:28 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: I have a use case that it makes sense
[11:28 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Do tell
[11:29 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: ( i was avoiding to ask that gavin ;) )
[11:29 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: it would take a few mins
[11:29 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: lol
[11:29 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: :_)
[11:29 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: for Demolition derby
[11:29 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: want me to tell? itys a longish story
[11:29 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: errr no no thanks :)
[11:29 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: ( hihihi )
[11:30 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: if you are dying top know why, come to my region and I'll show the example
[11:30 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: just give us the one liner
[11:31 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: I use a modular script system where an add-on script adds tow-truck capabilities, being towed. It has to set the main car script to not running so that people can;t get in the car and drive off after it;s crashed
[11:32 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: i didn;t want to merge the scripts because there are cases where i can just delete one of the scripts when I don;t need tow truck capabilities
[11:32 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: end of short version
[11:32 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: lol
[11:33 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: So set an internal enable variable and do a link message. Stopping the whole script seems a bit overkill if all you want to prevent is a script from acting on an input
[11:33 AM PT] Joe Magarac: I wish SL and OS had real hierarchies with attach points. We can't lift or carry anything without very complex coordination.
[11:33 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: Joe's stuff is more important than mine :)
[11:34 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: Vincent come by sometime and it will make sense
[11:34 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: moving it to OS I just had to change the timer on one of the scripts from 2 minutes to 1 sec
[11:35 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: I'll end up just wanting to fix it, damn adhd
[11:35 AM PT] Lyr Lobo smiles in greeting
[11:35 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: then i'll have to change ny scripts again lol
[11:35 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: If you setup hierarchies for anything then to make changes you have to crawl them and doing that vs. flat structures is always going to be more expensive in computations
[11:35 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: This is a case where fixing it might break others' scripts in OS
[11:35 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: so I don;t know if it should be fixed
[11:36 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: or 'changed
[11:36 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: think slç has some hiear.. on something
[11:36 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: well sure on rendering
[11:36 AM PT] Joe Magarac: I have a plan for hierarchies but it was lost when SL converted from JIRA to Canny.
[11:36 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Take inventory nesting for example. You can brick it to the point you can't login if you setup say 100 nested folders
[11:37 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: err you mean as on chained attachments?
[11:38 AM PT] Lyr Lobo: How deep can nested folders safely go? obviously not 100 levels, but where is the sweet spot?
[11:38 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: well guess the gltfBlaBla things will have internal hiearchy
[11:38 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: is there a nesting limit for inv?
[11:38 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I hope there is
[11:38 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: guess not well defined depth Lyr
[11:39 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: some fetch AISv3 function sets a limit of 50..
[11:39 AM PT] Joe Magarac: SL is not going to a full hierarchy before they put in glTF loading. I asked.
[11:39 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: but thats only.. "only fetch up to 50 levels down ...)
[11:39 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Which is a pain, because glTF has a full hierarchy.
[11:40 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: well and a total change to sl
[11:40 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: duhhh
[11:40 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: sansar V0.1x
[11:41 AM PT] Joe Magarac: It's not that bad, actually. You can make prim numbers backwards compatible.
[11:42 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: whatever that means lol
[11:42 AM PT] Joe Magarac: It's mostly a UI thing in the viewer. Object updates are already a full hierarchy.
[11:42 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: nahh they only have a parent entry
[11:43 AM PT] Joe Magarac: That's all you need.
[11:43 AM PT] Joe Magarac: When you have vehicle/avatar/attachment, there's a hierarchy.
[11:43 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: not sure, anyways that is only on one message
[11:43 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Worth thinking about. How hard is it server side?
[11:43 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: yeah there are those basic ones
[11:44 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: I donlt think it ever goes beyond those three
[11:44 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: like a rewrite on all prims relations login
[11:44 AM PT] Joe Magarac: The point is that it's a 3-deep case that already works.
[11:44 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: and Postion/rotatations math
[11:45 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: ie adding the proper parecnt/child chains..
[11:45 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: and pay tge cpu price ;)
[11:45 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Pos/rot already handles it. Attach a non-rigged prim to an avatar and sit it on something and you're seeing it work now.
[11:46 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: i mean internal to a link set
[11:46 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: i do not want that
[11:46 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Why not?
[11:46 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: i would prefer leavign them as they are adding a containr
[11:46 AM PT] Joe Magarac: I'm suggesting that link sets should be trees.
[11:46 AM PT] Joe Magarac: For glTF compat.
[11:47 AM PT] Joe Magarac: But SL has to do it first.
[11:47 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: the container could have several linsets attache by physics joints etc
[11:47 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: and be part or a hiear...
[11:48 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: hei would keep all the linkset code, basicly as is..
[11:48 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: see?
[11:48 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Hm. LL gave up physics joints.
[11:49 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: i know don't fir on linksets only
[11:49 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: we had some test code.. that i did remove
[11:49 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Let me find my old proposal and show it next time.
[11:50 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: but even without those..
[11:50 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: that other entety allows to keep linksets as they are
[11:51 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: things with flat hiearchy goued by ( almost) rigid "joints" ie local offset and local rotation
[11:52 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Then, when you import glTF with a hierarchy, it comes in as one root prim and a zillion children.
[11:52 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: theh gltf is that :p
[11:52 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: a very bad idea
[11:53 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: but well its lindens
[11:53 AM PT] Joe Magarac: We'll have to see what LL does.
[11:53 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: guess at a point they wil just kill prims
[11:53 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Lindens sperging out on Unity
[11:54 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: bahh all that is a lot worse than unity
[11:54 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: sl pbr is a broken subset of what unity has
[11:54 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: and other engines
[11:54 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: cannot Unity handle gltf?
[11:54 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: they import it like import fbx
[11:54 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Yes. I'm trying to nag LL into doing PBR good enough to load the bistro scene.
[11:55 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: that is what sl should be doing
[11:55 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: but they are not.. they are making glft things primary things
[11:55 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: who else does that?
[11:55 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: what?
[11:55 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: sane ppl jsut see gltf as another file format
[11:56 AM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: use gltf as primary thing
[11:56 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: no one
[11:56 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: it is a file format
[11:56 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Because COLLADA is going away.
[11:56 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: is just collada replacement
[11:56 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: You gotta respect the consistency of it. They have been poorly implementing standards only to create their own versions for decades now. Case in point collada in blender still has a "for SL" option
[11:56 AM PT] Joe Magarac: It's "legacy" support in COLLADA now.
[11:57 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: gltf is jsut a file format for blender
[11:57 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: more people use that than gLTF
[11:57 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: you import and export from/to it
[11:57 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: blender did not change theirs formats
[11:57 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: that is the proper way to handle it.. apparentsly not the sl way
[11:58 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: they just the glft json and put into assets
[11:58 AM PT] Joe Magarac: Gotta go soon, next meeting.
[11:58 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: that thwy send to viewers was it ( pbr )
[11:59 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: have fun
[11:59 AM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: tc Joe
[11:59 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: well dunno... just don't like what i saw and not following that close
[11:59 AM PT] Ubit Umarov: any other opensim issue?
[11:59 AM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Unfortunately Andrew ain't here today I got something
[12:00 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Third time now I have seen a parcel uuid collision in search causing entry failure in the parser
[12:01 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: I still don't know why that happens. I have a hunch it might be due to copying regions either directly or via oar and it restoring the parcel including the uuid, but I can't find code that does that in oars
[12:01 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Something really odd going on. The chances of that happening once, sure, but three times
[12:01 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: maybe he is using our fakeIDs
[12:01 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: not the global IDs that are unique
[12:01 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: could be sloppy manual editing of Regions
[12:01 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: .ini
[12:01 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: The one from land table
[12:02 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: That's the parcel uuid, actual one not the fake one
[12:02 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: guess we have both there :)
[12:02 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: ahh
[12:02 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: well the global should nto have collisos
[12:02 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: but dunno...
[12:02 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: need go rl
[12:02 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: any other issue?
[12:03 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: In search it collides because the parcel list has a key on the uuid. Now whether that actually makes sense I don't know
[12:03 PM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: no
[12:03 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: none here
[12:03 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Technically it's wrong given that there is no global check, but yeah first have to work out why it collides in the first place
[12:03 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: wel you can try to talk with him at irc, etc
[12:04 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: Once I know more I will yeah
[12:04 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: :)
[12:04 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: or here, next week :)
[12:04 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: stil getting occasional HTTP request that kills dotnet 8 HTTP server. Going to set up proxy to see whats going on
[12:04 PM PT] Kayaker Magic: I have to go do RL chores, Buy all!
[12:04 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: outch
[12:04 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: let us know your findings
[12:04 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: anyone know if dotnet server can do logging?
[12:04 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: are there docs
[12:04 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: You can enable debug http in 6
[12:05 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: tehre are some http debug things
[12:05 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: ok I'll google
[12:05 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: see help http ( maybe ..)
[12:05 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: That's gonna spam logs a bit with the inbound requests
[12:05 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: It's console command
[12:05 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: it might not be recording the offending request anyway
[12:05 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: "debug http in 6" full inbound http logging
[12:05 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: ok i need to go
[12:05 PM PT] Vincent.Sylvester @hg.zetaworlds.com: It'll spam a lot of stuff though so just be aware
[12:05 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: thanks good to know
[12:05 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: yeah big spam :)
[12:06 PM PT] Cuga.Rajal @rajal.org:9000: cant do just http requests
[12:06 PM PT] Ubit Umarov: hope to see you all next week :)
[12:06 PM PT] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: cheers
