Chat log from the meeting on 2017-12-05

Announcement OSCC
Announcement OpenSimSearch and OpenSimProfile modules
Announcement PHP based mutelist
List of modules for the simulator on the wiki
Singularity has issues with unmuting


[11:08] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I'll wait 2 more minutes before we get things underway.
[11:10] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I think we can get started now.
[11:11] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I have one reminder and a couple of announcements for this week.
[11:11] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: OSCC
[11:12] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: The OSCC starts in a few days. The website for the OSCC states it is running on Saturday and Sunday. However you should check the schedule as there is one event this Thursday and two on Friday before the main two days for the conference.
[11:14] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I don't see Marcus here today so no one is here to give any updates on the event.
[11:15] James.atLLOUD @hg.osgrid.org: I will check on the organizer channels if there is anything to report.
[11:15] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I have a family birthday this weekend so I don't expect to make it to the main Saturday morning keynotes.
[11:15] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Now for the news items.
[11:16] Misterblue.Waves @hg.osgrid.org: I think they are streaming the presentations and recording them for later viewing
[11:16] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: yes, they have done that in the past. I expect it will be done again this year.
[11:17] James.atLLOUD @hg.osgrid.org: Yes - I'm a streamer (as opposed to a streaker)
[11:17] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: The past few days I've been going over the bug report for the OpenSimSearch and OpenSimProfile modules. I have pushed some changes to both modules.
[11:17] steve Franklin: It is I am on the stream team
[11:18] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: will that have an affect on current implementations Andrew
[11:18] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: There were some minor issues in both modules arising from the change from the use of mysqli in the PHP files to the use of PDO. I have one person who has been doing some testing of the modules and will tell me if there are any remaining issues.
[11:18] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I think I have all of the issues sorted now for both of them.
[11:19] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Arielle, no changes to how the modules are used. Just some minor bug fixes.
[11:20] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org grins at James
[11:20] James.atLLOUD @hg.osgrid.org: :)
[11:20] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Any other questions about the changes to those two addon modules?
[11:22] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: The other bit of news for today is to announce that a few days ago I pushed the code for a PHP based mutelist module to github. One person reported some minor issues with it that I have already addressed.
[11:22] steve Franklin: excellent!
[11:22] James.atLLOUD @hg.osgrid.org: wow
[11:22] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: As with the other two modules the mutelist module is an addon for Open Simulator and not part of the core code.
[11:23] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: this allows for a persistent mutelist vs the temporary one we have now?
[11:23] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: It uses a database to permanently store requests to mute avatars and objects. The mute information is maintained between relogs.
[11:24] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Arielle, correct. When you log in to the grid your list of avatars/objects to mute will be retrieved from the database.
[11:24] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: The code for the module is available at https://github.com/kcozens/OpenSimMutelist.
[11:25] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: is there a central place where people can find these add on modules?
[11:25] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: wasnt there a forge thingy at one time for that?
[11:25] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: Heh. The forge is pretty much just a relic at this point.
[11:25] Misterblue.Waves @hg.osgrid.org: there used to be forge.opensimulator.org but it is not supported any more
[11:26] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: is it accessable Marcus?
[11:26] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: Github is a pretty centralized point for all things for any type of code
[11:26] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: i remember Mel saying she needed to put it back online
[11:26] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: Doesn't seem to be. I think it used SVN for one thing... dunno that it ever supported git.
[11:26] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Arielle, There used to be a forge site but that shutdown ages ago. I don't recall if a replacement was created. What can be done is to have a wiki page listing various addon modules. There may already be such a page. I would have to check the OS website for one.
[11:27] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: It was using SVN at one time.
[11:27] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I haven't thought about the forge site in quite a while.
[11:27] Misterblue.Waves @hg.osgrid.org: needs someone to keep up a page of pointers on the wiki
[11:28] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: i just remember an interview with Mel late last year where she mentioned the stuff was on her hardrive and she needed to find and repost it
[11:28] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: just wondered if that had ben done
[11:28] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I just checked the website. I thought I remembered there was a page listing other modules for OS. There is a page of related modules for OS available at http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Related_Software
[11:29] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I will add a link to my mutelist module to that page.
[11:29] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: So much that was there is so out of date is just isn't funny. We're talking pre-ROBUST times.
[11:29] Misterblue.Waves @hg.osgrid.org: that's a good page.... just needs some updating
[11:29] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org nods
[11:30] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I should also point out a couple of other things about the mutelist module.
[11:31] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I have only tested it with the git master version of OpenSimulator. There were other changes to OS related to mutelist support. My module may, or may not, need to additional changes.
[11:32] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: The second item relates to the use of viewer. I was testing the mutelist module using Firestorm and it works perfectly. I ran in to a problem when I tried to use Singularity.
[11:32] steve Franklin: Oh Oh
[11:33] steve Franklin: Sing is behind a bit- especially Mac!
[11:33] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: In Singularity you can mute an avatar or object. What I discovered is that you can't unmute anything in Singularity. The Unmute entry in the pie menu is always grayed out.
[11:33] Unknown.UserUPUUI @thekaz.ddns.net:8002: @ Andrew what about using the Context menu instead of the Pie menu ?
[11:33] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: can you unmute that thing in FS even if you muted it in Sing?
[11:34] steve Franklin: interesting thought...
[11:35] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Unknown.User, I haven't looked for an unmute menu entry in Singularity. Viewers have different places for menu entries. I'm not sure where I would look in Sing. I'll see if I can track down Unmute.
[11:36] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: There was a way to enable some menu entries by changing an xml(?) file that shipped with the program. That might be another way to permanently enable the feature (if it is supported by the rest of the Singularity code).
[11:37] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Arielle, It doesn't matter which program requested a mute. You could do the unmute in FS if you muted in Sing.
[11:37] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: ok so there is a workaround
[11:37] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: yes.
[11:39] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I will look and see if a bug report about unmute has already been filed against Sing. If not I will report the issue. I won't hold out hope on a quick fix.
[11:39] Unknown.UserUPUUI @thekaz.ddns.net:8002: :_)
[11:40] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Singularity doesn't seem to have much development activity these days.
[11:40] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: tried with alchemy or Kokuah?
[11:40] Unknown.UserUPUUI @thekaz.ddns.net:8002: they had 3 Alpha updates in rapid release 2 weeks ago
[11:41] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Arielle, I haven't. I do have Kokua, CoolVL, Replex, and Radegast viewers on my machine. I can test the mute/unmute feature in those viewers.
[11:41] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: just curious
[11:42] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: never muted anyone in my time here
[11:42] steve Franklin: I never have either, but I can think of a couple where that would be handy! lol
[11:42] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: Unknown.User, ok, thanks. I just checked and the latest Sing is build 6966. The version I have is 6866. I'm downloading the latest now.
[11:43] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: giggles @ Steve
[11:43] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org: I did wind up muting one person in SL. I haven't needed to mute anyone or anything in OS.
[11:43] Arielle.Popstar @hg.osgrid.org: i know a few who will use it for me ;)
[11:43] Andrew.Hellershanks @hg.osgrid.org grins at Arielle
[11:45] Andrew Hellershanks: Marcus, before you came in I mentioned the OSCC this weekend and the events being held on the two days before the 9th. Is there anything you would like to say about the OSCC?
[11:45] James atLLOUD: For recording I sometimes need to mute objects. I do the rest of my muting in my brain.  :)
[11:46] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: We hope everyone attends, of course. :) And there's still time to get on the schedule if you'd like to host a social event. I can put the links to the schedule and the form for the events here shortly.
[11:47] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: Schedule: http://conference.opensimulator.org/2017/program/
[11:47] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: I am looking forward to it Marcus
[11:47] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: Community Event Signup: http://conference.opensimulator.org/2017/community-event-sign-up/
[11:48] Arielle Popstar: Marcus, what do you believe the benefits of these annual conventions are for Opensim?
[11:48] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: I always feel inspired after hearing what people are doing with OpenSim.
[11:49] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: Not to mention they just bring people and Ideas together than may not meet under normal circumstances
[11:49] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: It's a great opportunity to see what people are doing with OpenSimulator. Educators, Academics, businesses, artists, etc... all creating great work and sharing their ideas.
[11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: I have heard some interesting talks about how people are using Open Simulator.
[11:49] steve Franklin: It is incredible the places it is being used!
[11:49] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: Will be my 3-4 conference this year ... one day I hope to present
[11:50] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002 smiles happily. :)
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: Ty all for your responses. I asked for a specific purpose and for a response to a poster in G+ who questioned it
[11:50] steve Franklin: you definitely should Leighton!
[11:50] Andrew Hellershanks: It is probably a bit late to think about it now but I could have had a ridable ferris wheel on display at the OSCC.
[11:50] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: smiles @ Steve
[11:51] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: oh that would be fun Andrew
[11:51] Kayaker Magic: Put it up in the sandbox at OSCC
[11:51] James atLLOUD: Andrew, there's room in my sponsor area!
[11:52] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: Andrew -- you could put that ferris wheel on the display sims -- They will be part of the Virtual worlds fair now
[11:52] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: I know that some people see it as a bloated waste of resources, and just a money making scheme, but that is their prerogative , People see things how they want to .. For me the best part is having many people to share ideas, and these people may only come together once a year . I wish people would share ideas more freely and support each other, but sadly there is too much promotion of , "This grid is better than that grid" ..
[11:53] Andrew Hellershanks: James, It has a big footprint depending on which version I would bring in.
[11:53] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: That is why this conference is so valuable Bill
[11:53] Unknown.UserUPUUI @thekaz.ddns.net:8002: @ Bill / I second that :_)
[11:53] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: Heh. Nobody makes money from it. Things like Sched.org and Evenbrite aren't cheap.
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: ty Bill
[11:54] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: (I know nobody makes money from it, but perception of some people can't be changed)
[11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Selby, I'll have a look. i need to make a control box for the wheel so others could operate it. As it is now, you have to know how to turn it on/off.
[11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Back to the mutelist for a moment...
[11:56] Andrew Hellershanks: Bill, have you been doing some testing of the mutelist module in the last few days?
[11:56] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: Good -- The fair will have year round promotion
[11:56] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: at least from me
[11:56] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: I tested on my small test grid, but will put it on my main grid this weekend after OSCC and really beat it up
[11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: Bill, ok. Just check you have the latest version. There were a few small changes in the last couple of days.
[11:57] Leighton.Marjoram @grid.opensim.life:8002: We can spend some time muting each other Bill
[11:57] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: I have plenty of alts that I wish would shut up from time to time , so that keeps me busy
[11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: I just checked the 6966 build of Sing. It still has unmute grayed out in the pie menu. If you mute an object you will see a dialog box that lists everything you muted. You can unmute objects there so it has a work around.
[11:58] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: :P
[11:58] Kayaker Magic: I have been doing some testing of the BulletSim mantusi that I submitted. Misterblue reported to me last week that they should be fixed.
[11:58] James atLLOUD: "ok - you can un-mute me now. OK.. OK?"
[11:58] Sunshine Szavanna: ☻
[11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: Mute some other object to get the dialog box, unmute it from the dialog box, then unmute the item you really wanted to unmute from the same dialog box.
[11:58] Kayaker Magic: And they have! I am going to have to take back some of the nasty things I said about BulletSim! :-)
[11:58] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: I'm not
[11:58] Arielle Popstar: lol at Kay
[11:58] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002 flüstert: LOL
[11:58] Bill.Blight @grid.opensim.life:8002: :P
[11:59] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: You don't need a physics engine anyway. ;)
[11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: Marcus, thanks for the information about the OSCC. Two events I wanted to attend on the Saturday I may not get to because I have a familiy birthday that day.
[11:59] Kayaker Magic: Bullets are reliably reporting collisions with prim and the terrain.
[11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: oh, good. I need to retest my snowball thrower.
[11:59] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: The only person I ever muted was myself -- that was not fun
[11:59] Kayaker Magic: And even the problem of bullets passing through target prims is greatly reduced.
[12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: I used to have snowballs bouncing of the items they hit
[12:00] Sunshine Szavanna: lol Selby
[12:00] Arielle Popstar: yay better bullets
[12:00] Marcus.Llewellyn @cc.opensimulator.org:8002: You'll be missed on the core dev panel, Andrew. But hope to see you around at the conference. :)
[12:00] Arielle Popstar: even more important then mute lists :)
[12:00] Kayaker Magic: I have a non-physical snowball tosser set up in the OSCC sandbox.
[12:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Marcus, ty. I'll be there in spirit. Perhaps I could just login my avatar and have it sitting on the panel while I'm dealing with the birthday stuff.
[12:04] Andrew Hellershanks: The time can pass quickly at these meetings and it did today. We are already just past the hour. Any other last minute questions or comments before we wrap it up?