[Opensim-users] Announcement of inventory tool (MyInventory), mostly of interest to grid operators/grid nauts

Snowcrash Short snowcrash.short at gmail.com
Fri Nov 16 06:45:22 UTC 2012 

On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 1:51 AM, Teravus Ovares <teravus at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> SnowCrash says:
> "There is no if about it, the code is ready for release, currently I'm
> working on a windows installer and documentation. Initially the code will
> be released under AGPL, once the code base is more mature I intend to
> change the licence to BSD.  I have decided to wait for two weeks after my
> initial announcement, because I wanted to give grid operators a heads up
> before releasing the code."
>
> Sorry fleep, That's a gauntlet, that's not a 'working with the community'
> statement.   That's 'I'm releasing it whether you like it or not'.
>
> The truth is, there are many options that would make something like this
> legitimate if done correctly...   but as the 'code is ready for release'
> and he's just working on installers and documentation now, 'the pool is
> closed'...  so naturally, the reactions are not going to be good after that
> statement.
>
>
Sorry if you consider this a gauntlet, but the sentence was used in reply
to a suggestion not to release the application. The application will be
released and it will be released as open source, having said that I am
definitely willing to listen to suggestions and co-operate with the
community.

> -Teravus
>
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 5:14 PM, Fleep Tuque <fleep513 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I would encourage everyone to try to keep the conversation civil and
>> respectful.  Heated rhetoric generally helps no one and can quickly derail
>> honest efforts to communicate about difficult topics.
>>
>> I interpreted Snowcrash's communications as an effort to dialogue with
>> the community.  He asked for feedback, he stated repeatedly that his
>> intention is not to aid content theft, and he said he was open to
>> suggestions for protecting grid operators' and content creators' rights.
>>  Nothing has been released yet, so I'm assuming good faith on Snowcrash's
>> part, and hope we can continue to have that conversation in a polite way.
>>
>> I'd also point out again that there are many kinds of content creators
>> with many kinds of intents for our content.  My desire to widely share and
>> openly license the content I create is as important to me as another
>> creator's desire to control access to their content is to them.  As I said
>> before, I often feel that those of us who prefer to open source our content
>> are in some ways held hostage by the concerns of the latter group, which I
>> happen to agree with Snowcrash, is to the detriment of the Opensim
>> community as a whole.
>>
>> IMO, the goal should be to design systems and tools that give ALL
>> creators the ability to clearly communicate and attach their
>> intentions/license terms to assets in a way that is respected and enforced
>> as much as possible by the Opensim code and through policies and
>> configuration settings available to grid operators.
>>
>> I would love to see a tool that aids the portability of _legitimately
>> licensed_ assets between grids, but unfortunately we're still stuck with
>> the problem that content creators' intentions and license terms are NOT
>> attached to existing objects.  If there's no license, I don't see a way to
>> safely, legally allow the portability of assets from one grid to another en
>> masse through a tool like this  :(
>>
>> Respectfully,
>>
>> - Chris/Fleep
>>
>>
>> Chris M. Collins (SL/OS: Fleep Tuque)
>> Center for Simulations & Virtual Environments Research (UCSIM)
>> UCIT Instructional & Research Computing
>> University of Cincinnati
>> 406A Zimmer Hall
>> 315 College Drive
>> PO BOX 210088
>> Cincinnati, OH 45221-0088
>> chris.collins at uc.edu
>> (513) 556-3018
>>
>> http://ucsim.uc.edu
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 3:54 PM, dz <dz at bitzend.net> wrote:
>>
>>> "It took me 2 days to copy stuff to a new grid" is not justification for
>>> the harm this tool will do to the OpenSim content creation community.
>>>
>>> There is only one proper response to this "declaration of disregard" for
>>> the policies and efforts of this community to prevent the distribution of
>>> tools designed to subvert the rights of content creators....  Otherwise,
>>> those IAR files you want to load will never have the quantity and quality
>>> of legal assets you desire.
>>>
>>> There are a multitude of ways to resolve these asset sharing/transfer
>>> issues,  and a LOT of good work has been done.
>>>      Yes,  we need an easier way to load IAR files....
>>>                      Why don't you implement this as a first step and
>>> start the process of working WITH the community?
>>>                      (Instead of proclaiming your intent to implement
>>> something that requires us to react in a publicly negative way)
>>>
>>>      Yes,  we probably need to implement some kind of license tagging to
>>> assets to properly identify those place in the PD BY the creator.
>>>                     Even so,  I lend my voice to the chorus of  "IANAL
>>> BUT.... I hope you confer with proper legal counsel before you jump off the
>>> liability cliff " ....
>>>
>>> I hope my response to your request for grid operators to participate in
>>> this discussion is clear....
>>>       I will disconnect and ban anyone who attempts to connect to any of
>>> the grids I administer using this tool.
>>>       I will publicly identify those users and share all the information
>>> I am able to collect with all of the operators of any other grid I can
>>> communicate with .
>>>
>>> Those of us who have been here a while have seen this all before, and
>>> I'm sure we will see it again.
>>> The response can only be "We do NOT want your tool as designed,  we WILL
>>> NOT tolerate its use."
>>>
>>> NO, there are NO valid reasons to welcome a tool that incorporates a
>>> disregard for an important part of the Opensim community (creators)
>>> Public pressure was enough to thwart the public release of the last
>>> "OpenSource sim copy utility".
>>> I continue to hope that the vocal opposition we expressed as a community
>>> to that effort is brought to bear here as well..
>>>
>>> d
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Opensim-users mailing list
>>> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de
>>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>>
>>
>>
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