[Opensim-users] Banning "bad" viewers was Re: Can this be done?

[Imago]

Mostly I want this because of piece of mind, but also because I am 
considering compiling a viewer on Hippo code that will have a different 
channel code altogether that I will probably use for the sim. If I can lock 
off viewers that don't have my exact channel or code then I can be sure only 
official viewers can get in. Right now the sim is only for friends but if I 
open it up to more I wouldn't want idiots coming in and mucking about the 
place. Which is why I was asking. I know that some opensim *shaking head* I 
wish I could remember who and where banned certain viewers from logging in. 
I'm not sure how she/he did it, though, but it got me curious as to how it's 
done. That and I wouldn't really want someone using something like Cryo or 
even Meerkat, but as you said... They probably all have the same default 
code. But if I put in another code and compiled it off of hippo or Linden's 
viewer I could put in my own channel and have others not able to enter. I 
like security and peace of mind, but security in this day and age is a myth. 
(Like those stupid broadcasting things that were supposed to stop copybot.)

But I was just curious if anyone had done it or heard of it. I want to say 
openlifegrid did it, but I can't remember so I don't want to say for sure 
until I find it again. (computer crashes suck.)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Karen Palen" <karen_palen at yahoo.com>
To: <opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 11:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Banning "bad" viewers was Re: Can this be done?


> As I think of it the answer is the same.
>
> The Linden Labs viewer does send an identification and version number, bat 
> that really does very little. Almost every viewer out there is based on 
> the current LL viewer and many people don't bother changing this code for 
> their experimental versions.
>
> For example I just checked and I have a customised LL viewer where the 
> only change is that it will log on to my private sim by default. The ID 
> codes are identical to the original since I never bothered to change them.
>
> I use it to make sure that my private sim will run OK with the "official" 
> viewer.
>
> I am not really sure why you would want that restriction though. Should I 
> be considering that for my sim? Have I missed something here?
>
> Sorry.
>
> Karen
>
> --- On Mon, 1/11/10, Imago <imagorabbit at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> From: Imago <imagorabbit at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Banning "bad" viewers was Re: Can this be 
>> done?
>> To: opensim-users at lists.berlios.de
>> Date: Monday, January 11, 2010, 10:05 PM
>> I don't think anyone is
>> understanding. :D It's not just Cryo. I want only
>> Linden Lab viewers to be able to login. I've seen it done
>> on other
>> opensim's. I know people can get around that. But the point
>> is... Not
>> everyone is a coder. So, while they could compile and make
>> it look like a
>> Linden Lab viewer then so be it. I just want to know if
>> there's a mod or
>> string that I can put in to opensim to see what channel the
>> viewer is
>> sending, and if it's not the right one than to display an
>> error message that
>> would tell them to download an official release in order to
>> login.
>>
>> Maybe I should have chosen my words better. Mentioning Cryo
>> is like
>> mentioning copybot, and responses only seem to be based on
>> theft and copy
>> protection. I just want to know if there's a string to
>> block a viewer. I
>> know people have done it I just can't remember what opensim
>> I saw it done
>> on. I also know that if I had Cryo source code I could
>> compile and make it
>> look like a Second Life release viewer. But not everyone is
>> a hacker or a
>> coder or both. Most people don't know how or can't compile
>> a viewer or are
>> too lazy to. So, they go look for one, and that's the basis
>> for my thinking
>> most theives are too lazy to try to figure out a way and
>> will move on to the
>> next target.
>>
>>
>> So, the question I'm asking is:
>> Is there a way for OpenSim to check a viewer string and
>> allow or disallow
>> based on that, and if so please let me know where that code
>> is, and if
>> not... Then I'll be burning the midnight oil again coding
>> one up.
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Karen Palen" <karen_palen at yahoo.com>
>> To: <opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
>> Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 10:44 PM
>> Subject: [Opensim-users] Banning "bad" viewers was Re: Can
>> this be done?
>>
>>
>> > The short answer is no.
>> >
>> > The more complete answer is that you while can easily
>> detect some
>> > characteristic of a viewer (or other software) which
>> identifies that
>> > viewer and use that to ban it, nothing can stop the
>> authors of that viewer
>> > from changing whatever characteristic you use.
>> >
>> > Worse yet, whatever characteristic you select to
>> identify the "bad"
>> > software will inevitably turn up in some other
>> (innocent) viewer sooner or
>> > later and will cause them to be banned for no reason.
>> >
>> > The best you could hope to achieve is some sort of
>> "arms race" between
>> > "bad" viewer creators and sim operators.
>> >
>> > In addition any viewer could be adapted for piracy.
>> The original
>> > experiments that resulted in
>> libsecondlife/openMetaverse were based on
>> > analysing the data stream between the Second Life
>> Servers and the viewer
>> > software (at the time ONLY the Linden Labs viewer) and
>> had access to all
>> > of that information. This was all done without
>> modifying the viewer in any
>> > way - it was proprietary at the time.
>> >
>> > Sadly the lesson of the endless failures of DRM
>> schemes elsewhere shows
>> > that the real losers are the honest/innocent users who
>> are unable to do
>> > the things that they really should expect to do with
>> the content that they
>> > have purchased.
>> >
>> > For example, I have completely stopped buying anything
>> in Second Life
>> > since I want to use the inventory I buy in my private
>> sims as well. Sure I
>> > can use pirate tools to do this, but if I have to do
>> that to use my
>> > purchases where I want to use them then why not just
>> steal the stuff in
>> > the first place?
>> >
>> > This is very similar to the situation with music CDs
>> and DVDs, why build
>> > an expensive collection if you will just have to
>> re-purchase it in a few
>> > years for the next technology and some DRM scheme
>> tries to keep me from
>> > playing my collection on the new equipment?
>> >
>> > There are several efforts being directed at come sort
>> of "portable"
>> > content. I hope that one or more actually proves to
>> work, but I have no
>> > illusions about that actually happening any time
>> soon.
>> >
>> > My opinion is that the best we can do at present is
>> similar to the real
>> > life piracy situation: stop the commercial marketing
>> of pirated
>> > merchandise as it is detected and reported. Ban anyone
>> who engages in such
>> > activities and if they persist bring real world law
>> enforcement to bear.
>> >
>> > For once Linden Labs seems to be using a reasonable
>> version of this when
>> > they state that the viewer is not the problem, it is
>> the use of the
>> > viewer. They have promised to act promptly to ban
>> anyone using any viewer
>> > for piracy.
>> >
>> > Karen
>> >
>> > --- On Mon, 1/11/10, Imago <imagorabbit at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Is it possible to stop
>> >> certain viewers from logging
>> >> in to your opensim? Like Cryo?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
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