[Opensim-dev] [Non-DoD Source] Re: Still on Sim and Phys Frames per Second (FPS)

Thu Nov 12 17:18:12 UTC 2015

I would also like to remind everyone that MOSES does not run stock
OpenSimulator code, they use the back end Simiangrid and are making
decisions about core code based on this, I have done extensive testing and
even helped try to make the MOSES grid run better, took part in their FCVW
Conference, I and the entire build team experienced issues on this grid
that I could not recreate on any other grid.  I personally do not want
decisions being made that will effect core services by a team of developers
who are not even using these services but what do I know according to doug
I of all people should not be part of this conversation anymore.  This is
the last thing I have to say about this, I am done talking about MOSES and
their needs.

On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 11:58 AM, Michael Emory Cerquoni <
nebadon2025 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Doug seriously, if you think I do not understand that you are crazy, the
> fact that you could not explain that before now means you should not be
> involved in this conversation either, but don't worry I am done discussing
> anything with the MOSES team, as far as I am concerned I am not very
> interested and would prefer that MOSES work on their own fork for their own
> needs.  I still have not seen any kind of improvements on the MOSES grid,
> good luck with that.
>
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 9:26 AM, Maxwell, Douglas CIV USARMY RDECOM ARL
> (US) <douglas.maxwell3.civ at mail.mil> wrote:
>
>> We looked into modifying the client about a year ago as part of our
>> initial design reviews.  The licensing issues surrounding the client were
>> so complex, we simply abandoned the effort.  This is why we are working on
>> the HTML5/WebGL JavaScript version, to eliminate the client problem
>> altogether.
>>
>>
>>
>> Michael, the fact that you don't understand how proper simulator
>> statistics reporting would benefit those who are trying to improve
>> simulator performance means you should probably not be involved in the
>> discussion.
>>
>>
>> Douglas Maxwell, Ph.D.
>> Science and Technology Manager
>> Virtual World Strategic Applications
>> U.S. Army Research Lab
>> Human Research & Engineering Directorate
>> (c) (407) 242-0209 <%28407%29%20242-0209>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* opensim-dev-bounces at opensimulator.org [
>> opensim-dev-bounces at opensimulator.org] on behalf of Michael Emory
>> Cerquoni [nebadon2025 at gmail.com]
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, November 10, 2015 12:06 PM
>> *To:* opensim-dev at opensimulator.org
>> *Subject:* [Non-DoD Source] Re: [Opensim-dev] Still on Sim and Phys
>> Frames per Second (FPS)
>>
>> All active links contained in this email were disabled. Please verify the
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>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>>
>> I think the big problem is the viewer teams are slow to pickup these
>> changes and fixes, most of the viewer projects seem quite dead to me at the
>> moment, there have been major fixes we have all been waiting quite a very
>> long time for Singularity to do, I cant speak with certainty but this
>> project seems at best to be on pause.  Replex is no longer being updated,
>> Kokua is no longer being updated, I can not say what is really happening
>> with Firestorm as their involvement has always been through what seems to
>> be a high power telescope from very far away.  Most of the other viewers
>> all seem to serve a niche purpose.  We have OnLook viewer now which is
>> designed with the intention of serving only the needs of OpenSimulator and
>> not Second Life, but quite literally no one has volunteered to be
>> involved.  What bothers me about saying get the viewer teams to fix it
>> there is only one response, what viewer teams?  Also if that was the
>> intended goal why was this not coordinated prior to the break, to just go
>> ahead break something and then call it progress while leaving stuff broken
>> and then say oh someone else should fix that is quite unprofessional in any
>> setting.  We need to resolve this problem of viewer development or quite
>> honestly this whole thing is dead in its tracks, without a constantly
>> improving viewer OpenSim is looking more and more like a dead end.  That
>> said its never to late to revive things and start wallking the path to
>> improvement, but as a group we need to stop focusing on the wrong things.
>> What i see is people chasing ghosts of problems that are not the real core
>> problems of what this project has and needs, with little to zero
>> improvements as a result.  Can anyone name a single improvement that has
>> come from changing the stats?  Where are the patches, where are the
>> scientific write ups showing that this was a success, so far to me this
>> whole thing with stats seems like a big distraction that is not only not
>> beneficial so far, its causing strife between the developers.  Personally I
>> don't have the solutions, my time is very limited anymore and I cant spend
>> the time I have in the past testing things and coordinating people like I
>> have, we need more people to step up and do the right thing without making
>> people feel like its being shoved down their throats.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 11:48 AM, GarminKawaguichi <
>> garmin.kawaguichi at magalaxie.com < Caution-mailto:
>> garmin.kawaguichi at magalaxie.com > > wrote:
>>
>>> I quite agree with what Seth wrote.
>>>
>>> GCI
>>>
>>> Le 09/11/2015 16:05, Seth Nygard a écrit :
>>>
>>> Let the FPS wars begin so there can be confusion everywhere...
>>> Now those that want to can set a ridiculous fudge factor and show
>>> 11000000FPS - WOW, look, waaaaaaay faster than "that other grid"!
>>>
>>> I firmly disagree in adding anything that allows artificially inflated
>>> metrics for any value.  At this stage the configurable fudge factor is an
>>> even worse "fix" IMHO.
>>>
>>> The correct fix is really to communicate the correct value(s) and put
>>> pressure on the viewer developers to fix their lag calculation(s).  People
>>> can be expected to update their viewer(s) which is not an unrealistic
>>> expectation.  People running old and/or unsupported viewers already have a
>>> plethora of issues they need to be aware of and things that don't work
>>> right, so why is the lag indicator any different?
>>>
>>> If we must have this user configurable then, instead of a fudge factor
>>> value it should be a simple boolean setting such as;
>>> ShowArtificiallyInflatedAndIncorrectFPS = false;
>>> ShowArtificiallyInflatedAndIncorrectFPS = true;
>>>
>>> On my grid I have made it a point to inform everyone that the calculated
>>> lag indicator is broken and the 11FPS is in the correct and normal value.
>>> I also point out that what used to be shown was in fact a falsified and
>>> artificially inflated value to make things look like "that other grid".
>>> Most people simple say "Oh yeah, I never paid attention to that anyhow.  It
>>> doesn't work right any of the time anyhow".  Many then say they looked at
>>> the wiki but couldn't find any information on what to expect.
>>>
>>> If whenever people ask for documentation the standard reply from the dev
>>> community is "read the code" then why is it so hard to ask for, and expect
>>> the viewers to be fixed and updated?
>>>
>>> -Seth
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Michael Emory Cerquoni
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> Michael Emory Cerquoni
>

-- 
Michael Emory Cerquoni
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