[Opensim-dev] Currency

Wed Jul 8 05:54:04 UTC 2009

Rock,

An implementation of a functional monetary system has been declared as out
of scope for OpenSim. It is something that has to go into the custom
implementation/third party provider layer.

There is a live and ongoing discussion as of where to draw the line for what
goes into the core, and what should be left to external module creators and
custom implementation.

It is within scope of OpenSim to provide hooks so that such a module,
tailored for the specific use case, be created.

As a project we need to draw a scope line somewhere, and often it's a case
of weighting several variables against each other.

In this case, it's been a long standing stance that implementation of a
monetary system is outside of the scope of the OpenSim core distribution.

We did provide the SampleMoneyModule, but the problem was that people was
using this unsafe and immature example code directly in live and production
environments. Though we could swear ourselves free from that with a  "suit
yourself, it was wholly at your own risk", it's not only a legal case, but
also a case of us not wanting to expose our users to unsafe and immature
code that could cause them direct economic damage. We generally don't want
to take decisions for our users, but this one would be considered a
real-world risk policy decision.

I believe that the very absence of a money implementation outside of core
would be an indication that it's right not having one inside; if there is no
external module being maintained and used, it either means nobody see value
enough to work on it, or that any implementation is too use case specific
for there to be any value for the general public.

At any rate, it is my opinion that the whole economy domain needs a lot more
work and reach a much higher level of maturity before anything could be
considered for inclusion into the core distribution.

/Stefan

From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de
[mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de] On Behalf Of Colin B. Withers
Sent: den 7 juli 2009 15:27
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Currency

If ReactionGrid uses no currency, and has no plans to ever have it, and does
not wish to get involded in virtual commerce, using either core solutions or
external solutions, then indeed it is a 3D chatroom. 3D chatrooms are well
suited to Educational purposes, and indeed my own Opensim grid has been used
by a US college for educational purposes. 

However, for a virtual space to take on the mantle of a virtual world, then
commerce is an essential element, and currency is essential to that.

I think the argument that there is a risk in providing a currency module in
core, from those who might complain "your code ate my money" is a specious
argument. This charge could be levelled whenever opensim is used as a
platform for a virtual world providing virtual real estate, for real world
money (whether a  currency module is implemented in core or external) as if
the grid goes down due to software bugs the grid owner stands to lose rental
income, or be liable for the claims of others.

This can all be mitigated against (in territotories that allow it) by use of
a carefully worded TOS.

Should the development of opensim be halted because someone might claim
"your software crashed my hard-drive, and I have lost US$$$" or "the bugs in
your software have contributed to me losing several tenants this week,
losing US$$$ in the process"?

The software is used 'as is', with no claims as fitness for any particular
purpose, and this would apply to any core currency module.

Rock

PS Another grid, that the owner ploughed 1000s of dollars into, has
collapsed recently, due to lack of a viable currency solution.

From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de
[mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de] On Behalf Of Chris Hart
Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 3:50 PM
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Currency

Couldn't disagree more - ReactionGrid has no inworld currency and no plans
to ever have it. Encouraging creativity, sharing, and collaborative learning
has proved more than worthwhile to us. And quite frankly, the legal and tax
issues around running a currency system should require dedicated qualified
experts to manage correctly. You can do a huge amount without play money
inworld - and if you want to pay someone money for a product, there are many
solutions out there that are properly regulated by financial services
authorities.

Money should be something you can add in yourselves if you want (hence I
believe it's on Forge these days), but I completely understand core
developer reluctance to have code in trunk that could potentially come back
to haunt with "your code ate my money" complaints.

Chris

From: Colin <mailto:Colin.Withers at eumetsat.int>  B. Withers 

Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 1:30 PM

To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de 

Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Currency

Has this always been the case? Why was SampleMoney and OpenCurrency removed?

Without currency opensim regions and grids devolve into nothing more than 3D
chatrooms.

Rock

-----Original Message-----
From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de
[mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de] On Behalf Of Melanie
Sent: Monday, July 06, 2009 11:47 AM
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Currency

OpenSim and the OpenSim project don't provide a grid currency
implementation.

Melanie

Melvin Carvalho wrote:
> Will currencies be distributed accross grids?
>
> On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 6:43 AM, Jason Fisher<bikcmp2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi, as of revision 9000 or so, SAMPLEMONEY was removed, meaning my
>> grid no longer has currency based of wiredux. I also saw OPENCURRENCY
>> has been removed. I really want currncy on my grid, and need help.
>> Anyone know something I can use on a later revision? THANKS
>> bikcmp2 at gmail.com
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-dev mailing list
>> Opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev
>>
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>
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