[Opensim-dev] Opensim-dev Digest, Vol 20, Issue 10
DZO
dzo at cybertalon.net
Fri Apr 3 17:37:48 UTC 2009
Guys
Leave it
Your doing a great job and everything is brilliantly thought out.
Hopefully I will also be contribuing code in the near future, in the mean
time thank you to everyone that has contributed.
Don't let this kind of negativity get to you.
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Sent: 03 April 2009 19:00
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Subject: Opensim-dev Digest, Vol 20, Issue 10
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Mono considered harmful (Eugen Leitl)
2. Re: Mono considered harmful (Nebadon Izumi)
3. Re: Mono considered harmful (Kyle)
4. Re: Mono considered harmful (Diva Canto)
5. Re: Mono considered harmful (Sean Dague)
6. Re: Mono considered harmful (Mike Dickson)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2009 17:48:09 +0200
From: Eugen Leitl <eugen at leitl.org>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Message-ID: <20090403154809.GX11917 at leitl.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Fri, Apr 03, 2009 at 10:13:47AM -0500, Mike Dickson wrote:
> won't go into details) the worst case scenarios is that you'd not be
> able to run it on Linux using Mono. If you're inclined towards
> floating
So you're saying the worst case (which is I think is arguably likely,
actually) is that OpenSim only runs on proprietary systems.
OpenSim becoming Windows-only, eventually.
> anxiety then this is something to worry about. Otherwise from an
> OpenSim perspective there are bigger fish to fry. Like getting to 1.0...
Becoming ghetto and then long-term insignificant is less important than
getting 1.0 out of the door. Mmmh, okay. If you say so.
--
Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org
______________________________________________________________
ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org
8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2009 08:49:43 -0700
From: Nebadon Izumi <nebadon2025 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Message-ID:
<d319543f0904030849g2fe1cf8eo246ba608a29c02fc at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
your argument is 100% speculation and not based in any facts sorry to say,
you can assume all you like, doesnt make what your saying true.
Neb
On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Eugen Leitl <eugen at leitl.org> wrote:
> On Fri, Apr 03, 2009 at 10:13:47AM -0500, Mike Dickson wrote:
>
> > won't go into details) the worst case scenarios is that you'd not be
> > able to run it on Linux using Mono. If you're inclined towards floating
>
> So you're saying the worst case (which is I think is arguably
> likely, actually) is that OpenSim only runs on proprietary systems.
> OpenSim becoming Windows-only, eventually.
>
> > anxiety then this is something to worry about. Otherwise from an OpenSim
> > perspective there are bigger fish to fry. Like getting to 1.0...
>
> Becoming ghetto and then long-term insignificant is less important
> than getting 1.0 out of the door. Mmmh, okay. If you say so.
>
> --
> Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org
> ______________________________________________________________
> ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org
> 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-dev mailing list
> Opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev
>
--
Nebadon Izumi @ http://osgrid.org
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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2009 11:54:16 -0400
From: "Kyle" <create at reactiongrid.com>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
To: <opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de>
Message-ID: <010401c9b474$71c19d90$5544d8b0$@com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Microsoft is also supporting OpenSim though indirectly. They have offered
internal resources and have recently made some big commitments for huge
events to be hosted on ReactionGrid including their official presence there.
We are working with them on possibly adding Windows Media player to the
client along with SQL Server 2008 improvements from our internal team. We
will be announcing some of these big projects soon along with news about 2
case studies on ReactionGrid/OpenSim that are about to be posted on their
site. We hope to get them more involved this year than ever before & both
our team and Microsoft has huge respect for what the developers have created
here using C#/.NET. Some collaboration is even forming between MS, Intel &
IBM that should help development as well.
Thanks Neb for the usually lacking opposing view. Microsoft doesn't always
make the best choices but there is a lot they do that never reaches the
press and one of those is their amazement and support of OpenSim which
should start showing better in 2009. Again thanks to everyone for this
incredible project ReactionGrid exists due to your efforts and some great
tools by Microsoft.
Thanks again everyone for creating OpenSim-Kyle G
From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de
[mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de] On Behalf Of Nebadon Izumi
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 11:43 AM
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
Ya its likely Microsoft probably took it further than it needed to go, but
chances are there was just no communications between the two companies, and
this is what happens when communications break down between companies,
likely there was some other reason for Microsoft and TomTom fighting and
this was just the reason they picked to bring the hammer down. But to me
this just seems like 2 companies who had a dispute and communications simply
broke down, and Microsoft had to do what they had to do, lacking the
complete details we are all doing a bit of assuming, but in this case the
decision made was not made because of technical reasons, that we do know.
And also to say microsoft is against opensourcing in anyway is just simply
false, SuSe is virtually propped up by microsoft, microsoft has dumped
millions of dollars into SuSe and Linux development, as well as offered many
opensource portals from their website, they are very supportive of mono,
because in the end it allows microsoft products to be run in Linux, so for
microsoft to cut their linux legs off too me seems unlikely, but you should
expect that when microsoft gets on the war path, the other party is likely
in trouble. but seriously when it comes to terms of OpenSource promotoers
the only company i can think of that rivals microsoft in thier open source
initiatives would be IBM. and I could be wrong but i thought at one point
microsoft was actually tinkering with OpenSim, but not really sure that
ended up.
Neb
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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 2009 08:56:59 -0700
From: Diva Canto <diva at metaverseink.com>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Message-ID: <49D631CB.9000803 at metaverseink.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Can you please take this discussion elsewhere. This doesn't belong here.
Start a forum somewhere, go to Slashdot, post comments on that blog, etc
etc.
OpenSim *is* written in C#. People who don't want to take any risks
being sued by Microsoft, should simply not use it. Very simple.
Eugen Leitl wrote:
> On Fri, Apr 03, 2009 at 10:13:47AM -0500, Mike Dickson wrote:
>
>
>> won't go into details) the worst case scenarios is that you'd not be
>> able to run it on Linux using Mono. If you're inclined towards floating
>>
>
> So you're saying the worst case (which is I think is arguably
> likely, actually) is that OpenSim only runs on proprietary systems.
> OpenSim becoming Windows-only, eventually.
>
>
>> anxiety then this is something to worry about. Otherwise from an OpenSim
>> perspective there are bigger fish to fry. Like getting to 1.0...
>>
>
> Becoming ghetto and then long-term insignificant is less important
> than getting 1.0 out of the door. Mmmh, okay. If you say so.
>
>
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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 2009 11:57:42 -0400
From: Sean Dague <sdague at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
Message-ID: <49D631F6.8030001 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Eugen Leitl wrote:
> What was the original reason for the decision to pick .Net/C#/Mono?
>
> http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090401152339514
This isn't really a development thread, can we keep this list on topic
please.
-Sean
--
Sean Dague / Neas Bade
sdague at gmail.com
http://dague.net
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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 03 Apr 2009 11:00:11 -0500
From: Mike Dickson <mike.dickson at hp.com>
Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] Mono considered harmful
To: "opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de" <opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de>
Message-ID: <1238774411.3565.105.camel at localhost.localdomain>
Content-Type: text/plain
Sigh...
Then go pick some other platform to work on. OpenSim seems pretty
solidly committed to the C#/Mono choice it made when it was started.
And yes, of course my argument is speculation. Unless you have a
crystal ball and know for certain you're going to get sued how can it be
anything but that.
Companies use patents for leverage all the time. In this day and age
that's probably their highest value (fwiw, I personally don't believe
software patents are a good thing, or even sensible, copyright law seems
more appropriate to me).
Seriously, all I was saying is this is a storm in a teacup. It shouldn't
stop useful work from getting done. Or cloud the excellent work that's
been done to date.
Mike
On Fri, 2009-04-03 at 15:49 +0000, Nebadon Izumi wrote:
> your argument is 100% speculation and not based in any facts sorry to
> say, you can assume all you like, doesnt make what your saying true.
>
> Neb
>
> On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Eugen Leitl <eugen at leitl.org> wrote:
> On Fri, Apr 03, 2009 at 10:13:47AM -0500, Mike Dickson wrote:
>
> > won't go into details) the worst case scenarios is that
> you'd not be
> > able to run it on Linux using Mono. If you're inclined
> towards floating
>
>
> So you're saying the worst case (which is I think is arguably
> likely, actually) is that OpenSim only runs on proprietary
> systems.
> OpenSim becoming Windows-only, eventually.
>
> > anxiety then this is something to worry about. Otherwise
> from an OpenSim
> > perspective there are bigger fish to fry. Like getting to
> 1.0...
>
>
> Becoming ghetto and then long-term insignificant is less
> important
> than getting 1.0 out of the door. Mmmh, okay. If you say so.
>
> --
> Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a>
> http://leitl.org
> ______________________________________________________________
> ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com
> http://postbiota.org
> 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> Opensim-dev mailing list
> Opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev
>
>
>
>
> --
> Nebadon Izumi @ http://osgrid.org
--
Mike Dickson <mike.dickson at hp.com>
BladeSystem infrastructure R&D
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