<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 12 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0in;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0in;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
span.EmailStyle18
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><a name="_MailEndCompose"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de [mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Guardian<br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, August 21, 2011 12:54 PM<br><b>To:</b> opensim-users@lists.berlios.de<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting region handshake<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p>OK, back to the topic, I went to the install site, set up the new router and found it doesn't support PPPoA which is the only way of getting DSL in NZ!!!<o:p></o:p></p><p>I'm returning the router today so its back to square one with finding a router that supports NAT Loop back and PPPoA.<o:p></o:p></p><p>I'm working both days next weekend so the next outage won't be until at least the 4th of september.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Aug 21, 2011 4:35 AM, "Wayne" <<a href="mailto:lppwayne@gmail.com">lppwayne@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>> Thanks, Gary.<br>> I guess some people just need a life.<br>> It's all good.<br>> <br>> Peace<br>> On Aug 20, 2011 12:34 PM, "Gary Beck" <<a href="mailto:gab4gab@gmail.com">gab4gab@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>> actually this thread derailed much further back - it once was about<br>> 'Awaiting region handshake'<br>>> ----- Original Message -----<br>>> From: Shaun Erickson<br>>> To: <a href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> Cc: <a href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 12:31 PM<br>>> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting region handshake<br>>><br>>><br>>> Then you should have started a new thread, rather than hijacking this one.<br>> You know, there used to be a thing called nettiquette.<br>>><br>>> -ste<br>>><br>>> On Aug 20, 2011, at 12:17 PM, Wayne <<a href="mailto:lppwayne@gmail.com">lppwayne@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>>><br>>><br>>> Hi Diva,<br>>> I''ve been running the diva version of opensim for a week now and kudos to<br>> you for a simple setup and solid config.<br>>> I am having trouble in one area though and that is in getting the groups<br>> module working. Nothing had worked and I am caught in the confirmation<br>> screen over and over-the group never creates, no record in database,<br>> nothing.<br>>> Can you please offer an example of how the setup should look for groups<br>> and what and where should files be?<br>>> Thank you.<br>>> I know this Has nothing to do with this thread but I saw your name and<br>> jumped to ask this question.<br>>><br>>> Wayne<br>>><br>>> On Aug 20, 2011 12:06 PM, "Diva Canto" <<a href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com">diva@metaverseink.com</a>> wrote:<br>>> > Let me rephrase your question: can you start with a standalone and a<br>>> > MySQL DB, and add more simulator servers running standalones [connected<br>>> > to that same DB] to obtain a grid? The answer is yes -- that's a<br>>> > serverless grid ("serverless" means that it runs without the Robust or<br>>> > other resource server(s) in between the simulators and the DB server).<br>>> > It doesn't work with the configuration that comes out-of-the-box for<br>>> > standalones, but it's just a matter of changing a few connectors for<br>>> > this configuration in the .inis.<br>>> > I use use such configuration on my grids.<br>>> ><br>>> > On 8/19/2011 6:28 PM, Guardian wrote:<br>>> >> This then leads to the question, can a standalone be changed over to<br>> grid?<br>>> >> If you use a mysql backend for the standalone, can it just be changed<br>>> >> over to grid in the configs?<br>>> >><br>>> >> On Sat, Aug 20, 2011 at 3:52 AM, Diva Canto <<a href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com">diva@metaverseink.com</a><br>>> >> <mailto:<a href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com">diva@metaverseink.com</a>>> wrote:<br>>> >><br>>> >> See basic definitions here, which is the model that has been<br>>> >> guiding OpenSim development for a while:<br>>> >> <a href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Virtual_World_Model">http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Virtual_World_Model</a><br>>> >><br>>> >> In principle, the concept of grid is orthogonal to the concept of<br>>> >> simulator trust domain. In practice, and in the vast majority of<br>>> >> cases, they are unified (i.e. 1 grid = 1 trust domain), but in a<br>>> >> few but famous cases, they aren't -- that's the case of OSGrid,<br>>> >> which is a grid with several simulator trust domains in it. If the<br>>> >> concept of "simulator trust domain" is too abstract, substitute<br>>> >> the expression "multiple simulator trust domains" by "connecting<br>>> >> someone else's simulator to a grid".<br>>> >><br>>> >> Technically, what makes a grid being a grid is having multiple<br>>> >> simulator servers serving different portions of the virtual space,<br>>> >> instead of just one simulator server -- that's all. One can run a<br>>> >> grid with an external resource server (Robust, Simian) or without,<br>>> >> using only simulator servers and a shared DB; the latter<br>>> >> configuration is what I call serverless grids:<br>>> >> <a href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Serverless_Grids">http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Serverless_Grids</a> -- that article is<br>>> >> outdated, but it explains the concept.<br>>> >><br>>> >> When there are multiple simulators (=grid), whether the simulators<br>>> >> are operated by the same authority or decentralized by several<br>>> >> authorities is a different issue. For example, the Avination grid<br>>> >> and the SL grid are each operated entirely by one authority; the<br>>> >> OSGrid grid is operated by a multitude of authorities [that must<br>>> >> implicitly trust each other at the moment].<br>>> >><br>>> >><br>>> >><br>>> >> On 8/19/2011 8:13 AM, Bob Wellman wrote:<br>>> >>> I have run Opensim both standalone as standalone and for the last<br>>> >>> three years PMgrid in grid mode so I understand the differences<br>>> >>> very well.<br>>> >>><br>>> >>> However I can see where newcommers get confused when we talk<br>>> >>> about grids beings a collection of regions and then use the term<br>>> >>> "grid mode" to mean running using several servers or service<br>>> >>> instances in collaberation to run a grid.<br>>> >>><br>>> >>> I have often wondered if it wouldnt be better to coin a different<br>>> >>> term for what we currently call grid mode to avoid confusion.<br>>> >>> Maybe we could use Cooperative mode or Multi Service mode or<br>>> >>> Distributed mode to describe the alternative mode to Standalone.<br>>> >>> Something that better decribes the mode of operation rather than<br>>> >>> "grid" which I think should be used just to describe the region<br>>> >>> arrangement. Just a thought!<br>>> >>><br>>> >>> When Intels DSG work hits mainstream (soon I hope) we will need<br>>> >>> to distinguish grids that run using the current central<br>>> >>> Robust.exe(s) and one or more Opensim.exe instances (i.e. what we<br>>> >>> now call "Grid mode") to those that run the new even more<br>>> >>> Distrubuted services provided by DSG.<br>>> >>><br>>> >>> Getting good clear terminology for mdes of operation defined now<br>>> >>> would help a lot in future I think.<br>>> >>><br>>> >>> Like I say just my thoughts. Any one else have thoughts on this?<br>>> >>><br>>> >>><br>>> >>><br>>> >>> > Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 11:11:25 +0100<br>>> >>> > From: <a href="mailto:t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk">t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk</a><br>>> >>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk">t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk</a>><br>>> >>> > To: <a href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> >>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >>> > Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting region handshake<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > Thanks for the clarification Diva, me jumping in too quickly I<br>>> >>> guess.<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > I didn't think a standalone accepted region registration<br>>> >>> requests from<br>>> >>> > other opensim.exe's, but that you needed robust.exe to accept<br>>> >>> > registrations from other opensim.exe's. I know that opensim.exe<br>>> >>> > handles all the services when in standalone - but thought it<br>>> >>> was "cut<br>>> >>> > down" and didn't support external region registrations. I take<br>>> >>> it from<br>>> >>> > what you say it can do that? I've never even tried tbh.<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > What you say about owners not supporting ad-hoc regions being<br>>> >>> connected<br>>> >>> > is of course true but that is a policy issue and enforced by<br>>> >>> firewall<br>>> >>> > rules. As far as I am aware robust.exe WILL accept a registration<br>>> >>> > request from other opensim.exe's if the port to it is left open. Of<br>>> >>> > course, I may well be wrong with that but when I asked about<br>>> >>> this before<br>>> >>> > (if there was any way to stop people registering with my grid -<br>>> >>> I was<br>>> >>> > told I had to block the port and that would be the way to do it).<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > -----Original Message-----<br>>> >>> > From: <a href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> >>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >>> > [mailto:<a href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de</a>] On Behalf Of<br>>> >>> Diva Canto<br>>> >>> > Sent: 18 August 2011 20:56<br>>> >>> > To: <a href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> >>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >>> > Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting region handshake<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > > I believe you can create as many regions as you like in a<br>>> >>> standalone<br>>> >>> > > but you are the only person that can go there I have created<br>>> >>> both and<br>>> >>> > > to have other ppl come to visit you need to be a grid<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > This is not correct. Standalones can handle users from anywhere<br>>> >>> in the<br>>> >>> > world, as long as the routers are configured for that.<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > > Basically, a standalone does not allow others to connect<br>>> >>> their region<br>>> >>> > > to your simulator, while a grid does. This has nothing to do<br>>> >>> with<br>>> >>> > > people visiting it.<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > This is also not correct.<br>>> >>> > Most grids are operated by one single organization/person and don't<br>>> >>> > support the attachment of ad-hoc regions operated by others.<br>>> >>> OSGrid is<br>>> >>> > an exception in this respect.<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > The difference between a standalone and a grid is simply the<br>>> >>> number of<br>>> >>> > components (usually hardware) involved. A standalone has all<br>>> >>> services<br>>> >>> > running in one single process in one single machine; a grid has<br>>> >>> many<br>>> >>> > simulator processes, usually on different machines, and it<br>>> >>> typically<br>>> >>> > centralizes resource management in yet other machine(s).<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > So if you just want a small world with a few thousand objects<br>>> >>> in world<br>>> >>> > at any given time, stay with a standalone; if you plan to scale<br>>> >>> up, look<br>>> >>> > into the grid configuration.<br>>> >>> ><br>>> >>> > _______________________________________________<br>>> >>> > Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> >>> > <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> >>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >>> > <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><br>>> >>> > _______________________________________________<br>>> >>> > Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> >>> > <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> >>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >>> > <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><br>>> >>><br>>> >>><br>>> >>> _______________________________________________<br>>> >>> Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> >>> <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >>> <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><br>>> >><br>>> >><br>>> >> _______________________________________________<br>>> >> Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> >> <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a>><br>>> >> <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><br>>> >><br>>> >><br>>> >><br>>> >><br>>> >> _______________________________________________<br>>> >> Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> >> <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> >> <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><br>>> ><br>>><br>>> _______________________________________________<br>>> Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><br>>><br>>><br>>><br>>><br>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------<br>>><br>>><br>>> _______________________________________________<br>>> Opensim-users mailing list<br>>> <a href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</a><br>>> <a href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></body></html>