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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>actually this thread derailed much further back -
it once was about 'Awaiting region handshake'</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=ste@smxy.org href="mailto:ste@smxy.org">Shaun Erickson</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=opensim-users@lists.berlios.de
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A
title=opensim-users@lists.berlios.de
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, August 20, 2011 12:31
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting
region handshake</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Then you should have started a new thread, rather than hijacking this
one. You know, there used to be a thing called nettiquette.<BR><BR>-ste</DIV>
<DIV><BR>On Aug 20, 2011, at 12:17 PM, Wayne <<A
href="mailto:lppwayne@gmail.com">lppwayne@gmail.com</A>>
wrote:<BR><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV>
<P>Hi Diva,<BR>I''ve been running the diva version of opensim for a week now
and kudos to you for a simple setup and solid config.<BR>I am having trouble
in one area though and that is in getting the groups module working. Nothing
had worked and I am caught in the confirmation screen over and over-the
group never creates, no record in database, nothing.<BR>Can you please offer
an example of how the setup should look for groups and what and where should
files be?<BR>Thank you.<BR>I know this Has nothing to do with this thread
but I saw your name and jumped to ask this question.</P>
<P>Wayne</P>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On Aug 20, 2011 12:06 PM, "Diva Canto" <<A
href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com"><A
href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com">diva@metaverseink.com</A></A>>
wrote:<BR type="attribution">> Let me rephrase your question: can you
start with a standalone and a <BR>> MySQL DB, and add more simulator
servers running standalones [connected <BR>> to that same DB] to obtain a
grid? The answer is yes -- that's a <BR>> serverless grid ("serverless"
means that it runs without the Robust or <BR>> other resource server(s)
in between the simulators and the DB server). <BR>> It doesn't work with
the configuration that comes out-of-the-box for <BR>> standalones, but
it's just a matter of changing a few connectors for <BR>> this
configuration in the .inis.<BR>> I use use such configuration on my
grids.<BR>> <BR>> On 8/19/2011 6:28 PM, Guardian wrote:<BR>>>
This then leads to the question, can a standalone be changed over to
grid?<BR>>> If you use a mysql backend for the standalone, can it just
be changed <BR>>> over to grid in the configs?<BR>>><BR>>>
On Sat, Aug 20, 2011 at 3:52 AM, Diva Canto <<A
href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com"><A
href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com">diva@metaverseink.com</A></A>
<BR>>> <mailto:<A href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com"><A
href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com">diva@metaverseink.com</A></A>>>
wrote:<BR>>><BR>>> See basic definitions here, which is the
model that has been<BR>>> guiding OpenSim development for a
while:<BR>>> <A
href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Virtual_World_Model"><A
href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Virtual_World_Model">http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Virtual_World_Model</A></A><BR>>><BR>>>
In principle, the concept of grid is orthogonal to the concept
of<BR>>> simulator trust domain. In practice, and in the vast majority
of<BR>>> cases, they are unified (i.e. 1 grid = 1 trust domain), but
in a<BR>>> few but famous cases, they aren't -- that's the case of
OSGrid,<BR>>> which is a grid with several simulator trust domains in
it. If the<BR>>> concept of "simulator trust domain" is too abstract,
substitute<BR>>> the expression "multiple simulator trust domains" by
"connecting<BR>>> someone else's simulator to a
grid".<BR>>><BR>>> Technically, what makes a grid being a grid
is having multiple<BR>>> simulator servers serving different portions
of the virtual space,<BR>>> instead of just one simulator server --
that's all. One can run a<BR>>> grid with an external resource server
(Robust, Simian) or without,<BR>>> using only simulator servers and a
shared DB; the latter<BR>>> configuration is what I call serverless
grids:<BR>>> <A
href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Serverless_Grids"><A
href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Serverless_Grids">http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Serverless_Grids</A></A>
-- that article is<BR>>> outdated, but it explains the
concept.<BR>>><BR>>> When there are multiple simulators (=grid),
whether the simulators<BR>>> are operated by the same authority or
decentralized by several<BR>>> authorities is a different issue. For
example, the Avination grid<BR>>> and the SL grid are each operated
entirely by one authority; the<BR>>> OSGrid grid is operated by a
multitude of authorities [that must<BR>>> implicitly trust each other
at the moment].<BR>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>>> On 8/19/2011
8:13 AM, Bob Wellman wrote:<BR>>>> I have run Opensim both
standalone as standalone and for the last<BR>>>> three years PMgrid
in grid mode so I understand the differences<BR>>>> very
well.<BR>>>><BR>>>> However I can see where newcommers get
confused when we talk<BR>>>> about grids beings a collection of
regions and then use the term<BR>>>> "grid mode" to mean running
using several servers or service<BR>>>> instances in collaberation
to run a grid.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I have often wondered if it
wouldnt be better to coin a different<BR>>>> term for what we
currently call grid mode to avoid confusion.<BR>>>> Maybe we could
use Cooperative mode or Multi Service mode or<BR>>>> Distributed
mode to describe the alternative mode to Standalone.<BR>>>>
Something that better decribes the mode of operation rather
than<BR>>>> "grid" which I think should be used just to describe
the region<BR>>>> arrangement. Just a
thought!<BR>>>><BR>>>> When Intels DSG work hits
mainstream (soon I hope) we will need<BR>>>> to distinguish grids
that run using the current central<BR>>>> Robust.exe(s) and one or
more Opensim.exe instances (i.e. what we<BR>>>> now call "Grid
mode") to those that run the new even more<BR>>>> Distrubuted
services provided by DSG.<BR>>>><BR>>>> Getting good clear
terminology for mdes of operation defined now<BR>>>> would help a
lot in future I think.<BR>>>><BR>>>> Like I say just my
thoughts. Any one else have thoughts on
this?<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> >
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 11:11:25 +0100<BR>>>> > From: <A
href="mailto:t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk"><A
href="mailto:t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk">t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk</A></A><BR>>>>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk"><A
href="mailto:t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk">t.gildersleeve@bradfordcollege.ac.uk</A></A>><BR>>>>
> To: <A href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A><BR>>>>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>><BR>>>>
> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting region handshake<BR>>>>
><BR>>>> > Thanks for the clarification Diva, me jumping in
too quickly I<BR>>>> guess.<BR>>>> ><BR>>>>
> I didn't think a standalone accepted region
registration<BR>>>> requests from<BR>>>> > other
opensim.exe's, but that you needed robust.exe to accept<BR>>>> >
registrations from other opensim.exe's. I know that
opensim.exe<BR>>>> > handles all the services when in standalone
- but thought it<BR>>>> was "cut<BR>>>> > down" and
didn't support external region registrations. I take<BR>>>> it
from<BR>>>> > what you say it can do that? I've never even tried
tbh.<BR>>>> ><BR>>>> > What you say about owners not
supporting ad-hoc regions being<BR>>>> connected<BR>>>>
> is of course true but that is a policy issue and enforced
by<BR>>>> firewall<BR>>>> > rules. As far as I am aware
robust.exe WILL accept a registration<BR>>>> > request from
other opensim.exe's if the port to it is left open. Of<BR>>>> >
course, I may well be wrong with that but when I asked about<BR>>>>
this before<BR>>>> > (if there was any way to stop people
registering with my grid -<BR>>>> I was<BR>>>> > told I
had to block the port and that would be the way to do it).<BR>>>>
><BR>>>> > -----Original Message-----<BR>>>> >
From: <A href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de</A></A><BR>>>>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de</A></A>><BR>>>>
> [mailto:<A href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users-bounces@lists.berlios.de</A></A>]
On Behalf Of<BR>>>> Diva Canto<BR>>>> > Sent: 18 August
2011 20:56<BR>>>> > To: <A
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A><BR>>>>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>><BR>>>>
> Subject: Re: [Opensim-users] Awaiting region handshake<BR>>>>
><BR>>>> > > I believe you can create as many regions as
you like in a<BR>>>> standalone<BR>>>> > > but you
are the only person that can go there I have created<BR>>>> both
and<BR>>>> > > to have other ppl come to visit you need to be
a grid<BR>>>> ><BR>>>> > This is not correct.
Standalones can handle users from anywhere<BR>>>> in
the<BR>>>> > world, as long as the routers are configured for
that.<BR>>>> ><BR>>>> > > Basically, a standalone
does not allow others to connect<BR>>>> their
region<BR>>>> > > to your simulator, while a grid does. This
has nothing to do<BR>>>> with<BR>>>> > > people
visiting it.<BR>>>> ><BR>>>> > This is also not
correct.<BR>>>> > Most grids are operated by one single
organization/person and don't<BR>>>> > support the attachment of
ad-hoc regions operated by others.<BR>>>> OSGrid is<BR>>>>
> an exception in this respect.<BR>>>> ><BR>>>> >
The difference between a standalone and a grid is simply the<BR>>>>
number of<BR>>>> > components (usually hardware) involved. A
standalone has all<BR>>>> services<BR>>>> > running in
one single process in one single machine; a grid has<BR>>>>
many<BR>>>> > simulator processes, usually on different
machines, and it<BR>>>> typically<BR>>>> > centralizes
resource management in yet other machine(s).<BR>>>>
><BR>>>> > So if you just want a small world with a few
thousand objects<BR>>>> in world<BR>>>> > at any given
time, stay with a standalone; if you plan to scale<BR>>>> up,
look<BR>>>> > into the grid configuration.<BR>>>>
><BR>>>> >
_______________________________________________<BR>>>> >
Opensim-users mailing list<BR>>>> > <A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A><BR>>>>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>><BR>>>>
> <A href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users"><A
href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</A></A><BR>>>>
> _______________________________________________<BR>>>> >
Opensim-users mailing list<BR>>>> > <A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A><BR>>>>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>><BR>>>>
> <A href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users"><A
href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</A></A><BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>>
_______________________________________________<BR>>>>
Opensim-users mailing list<BR>>>> <A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>
<mailto:<A href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>><BR>>>>
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href="https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users">https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users</A></A><BR>>><BR>>><BR>>>
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mailing list<BR>>> <A href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de"><A
href="mailto:Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de">Opensim-users@lists.berlios.de</A></A>
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