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Toni Alatalo wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Dzonatas kirjoitti:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap=""><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.collada.org/mediawiki/index.php/Portal:Conditioners_directory">http://www.collada.org/mediawiki/index.php/Portal:Conditioners_directory</a>
I'd imagine you wonder about how to go from a mesh to a parametric model
(if the external application doesn't support all the parametric data).
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
and back. i don't think there is a sensible way for such a roundtrip,
e.g. for bringing SL data to vanilla Blender for editing. what good
would prims converted to meshes do you in a modelling app? i guess you
can get them today with the meshmerizer if you want. but that way you
won't be able to edit them for loading back to SL, so i see no use.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
There may be no need to go back to Second Life's parametric data. It
depends on the end-user of the DAE. Further, one could build the mesh
model, and the textures could be modified even if the model can be
modified. That would be a simple implementation for modelers that just
only want to paint and reimport textures.<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Blender could be extended to support the same parametric data that is
used in SL/opensim. <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.google.com/search?q=blender+parametric">http://www.google.com/search?q=blender+parametric</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
that would be possible, if you really wanted to use Blender (or some
other app) for SL building, but not a small job.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
I think it would be easier to modify both Blender and the viewer to
handle arbitrary parametric data then to only modify Blender (or any
other 3d modeler) to adapt to the specific parametric data that has
been used in Second Life so far.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap=""></pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">For example, maybe include a script in the DAE file that generates the
mesh from the parametric data. The applications collada plug-in could
run the script any time the parametric data is modified to regenerate
the model. This is not too different of an idea from being able to store
shaders in the DAE file, which exists now.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
what would that script run against, and how would the parametric data be
modified?
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
Here we could start with CIL, javascript, or python. With Ironpython
being able to compile Blender, it would be possible for it to bring in
CILs. An API would need to be developed that the scripts have to
conform to.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
it would in principle possible to include e.g. Blender script code
there, and make a tool for Blender that could edit that data. the major
2.5 refactor that's well under way should make it easier to do such
custom tools soon. but this all would be Blender specific, and would
have basically nothing to do with Collada anymore. it would be possible
to include that data in a DAE file, but i don't see any benefit there
really, as it would be a custom solution for dealing with a specific
kind of data (SL prims) in a specific application (Blender).
</pre>
</blockquote>
Guess I have been thinking beyond SL but in a way that could
incorporate previous SL data.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
to summarize my understanding of these talks:
[...] So far I don't see
anyone actually working on this, and it's not a small job either.
</pre>
</blockquote>
At this point it is more of interest. I believe the basics of the
software already exists and just needs to be put together in innovative
ways. Opensim is much further along now that it is a very viable
platform to see immediate results of such innovation.<br>
<br>
Based on past research, I'd say it would be a +1 for the viewer and
opensim to handle arbitrary parametric data by portable scripts even if
it is not a +1 on collada at this time.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
Someone asked for my strategy for dealing with 3d data. Well for us at
Playsign it's pretty simple, we have models made for games and some
other things, and the plan has been to keep everything in Blender
trusting that we can import anything and export to everywhere from
there. I've participated in Blender development myself so it's easy to
trust it. So far have used mostly Soya3d and Ogre, for which there are
direct exporters, and looked at e.g. Papervision3d (that would use via
the Collada export). There is also an Ogre importer. We don't use SL,
but are looking at Rex and working on it 'cause might be able to use it.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
So, it sounds like your business would prefer to export from Blender
and tools and later import in-world.<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid4952087B.5000006@kyperjokki.fi" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
The SL prims and parametric modelling in general (procedural trees and
plants, but perhaps also cities and walls and whatnot) are interesting
though and there's very much potential for the richness of VWs there. I
don't know how good the SL model actually is, and hence how good it
would be have parametric modelling in Blender similar to that, or how
similar it is to whatever there is in existing procedural modelling
apps. Looking forward to learn more about that next year, but off for
holidays now! :)
cheers,
~Toni</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
Happy Holidays<br>
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