[Opensim-users] Some questions about recreating history in OpenSim

Tue Aug 21 16:21:46 UTC 2012

Hi Alan,

Thank you very much for your email, this is inspiring stuff! 
Unfortunately my time is so limited because I'm at home looking after my 
two year old daughter most of the day, but I'm going to try and spend 
some time looking at some of the virtual worlds people have pointed out 
to me in the next few days. I'm looking forward to it :)

I think being able to tell the funding panel that there's the potential 
for students in Australia to go on a virtual trip to St Andrews 
Cathedral and a castle in Scotland would work very much in my favour.

Cheers,

Lisa

On 08/21/2012 04:43 PM, Alan Miller wrote:
> Hi Lisa,
>
> I've been following your discussions with some interests. I am based 
> at the University of St Andrews in Scotland and we have done some work 
> with similar goals to the ones that you describe.
>
> We have been developing historical reconstructions with the goals of 
> supporting learning and promoting cultural heritage. I think that all 
> the things that you describe are possible, with sufficient resource.
>
> Please feel free to have a look at some of the resources that we are 
> developing. Be aware that they are all work in progress ... in fact 
> reconstructing the past may by definition be a work in progress!
>
> There is a reconstruction of St Andrews Cathedral. The most important 
> religious building in Scotland from the 12th to the 16 
> Centuries,inextricably tied up with the wars of independence and the 
> reformation and associated with historical characters such as Robert 
> the Bruce.
>
> A reconstruction of Linlithgow Palace, an important residence for the 
> Stewart Kings of Scotland and closely associated with MAry Queen of 
> Scots.
>
> There is also a reconstruction of a 5th Century Spartan Basilica, 
> which is part of a Virtual Excavation game aimed at archeaologists.
>
> A reconstruction of a 16th Century Salt Pan and a reconstruction of 
> the related excavation site - developed through imnporting points 
> cloud data into opensim.
>
> CErtainly connecting with web resources is a powerful way of enriching 
> these 3D reconstructions. Within the Cathedral their is a virtual 
> exhibition of rare books that links to web and library resources and 
> the Linlithgow Palace resources makes extensive use of linking to 
> online videos images and other resources. Connecting with social media 
> to enable visitors to contribute to the resources is also possible.
>
> It occurs to me that it would be excellent to create some kind of 
> "Virtual Grid" which enabled navigation through virtual world/opensim 
> historical reconstructions.
>
> If you want to have a look at some other information related to this 
> work have a look at our blog:
>
> http://blogs.cs.st-andrews.ac.uk/openvirtualworlds/
>
> There is also a face book page, you can like if you feel so inclined!
> http://www.facebook.com/OpenVirtualWorlds
>
> If you want to crate an avatar, login and have a look around then try:
> http://openvirtualworlds.org/cathedral/
>
> There are some pre installed images of resources mainly for windows 
> boxes here:
> http://www.openvirtualworlds.org/demiurge/sticks.html
>
> Hope this helps and would be happy to cooperate in taking historical 
> reconstruction and education in virtual worlds forward.
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>> This is actually the kind of thing I was imagining we would do. First 
>> of all divide the grids up by historical eras, but within an era 
>> there would still be a lot of jumble, with different stories 
>> happening in the same spot at different times with the same buildings 
>> but people wearing different kinds of clothes and so on. I envisioned 
>> that you should be able to work out what date you want to visit, and 
>> only load the stories that are current at that date, with "permanent" 
>> structures always loading. I'm glad you suggested that independently 
>> of me bringing it up :)
>>
>> On 08/21/2012 04:25 AM, Mic Bowman wrote:
>>> Just to throw something out...
>>>
>>> What about a region module that can play a "log" of events by adding
>>> and removing objects according to some script (add this object here,
>>> remove that one, ...). There are certainly temporal databases that can
>>> determine the "state" of the elements at a particular time...
>>>
>>> --mic
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 10:27 AM, Miller, Peter 
>>> <pmiller at liverpool.ac.uk> wrote:
>>>> Q: My main issue right now is trying to work out how you create 
>>>> sims that
>>>> represent not only a region in space but also a period in time. 
>>>> I've been
>>>> thinking that I would have a grid that contains regions in which only
>>>> stories from, say, 1950 to 2000 were created. Then another grid would
>>>> represent the same real world area, but contain stories from 
>>>> 1900-1950. The
>>>> further you go back in time, the longer the time intervals would 
>>>> get, along
>>>> an approximately logarithmic scale, so if you were telling stories 
>>>> about the
>>>> dinosaurs one grid would represent the entire Jurassic era, for 
>>>> example.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> A: There's theoretically nothing to stop you doing this as far as I 
>>>> know.
>>>> Different grids use the same coordinate space. In practice there 
>>>> have been
>>>> reports that teleporting to identical locations in two grids can be
>>>> problematic -- to quote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "You can’t hypergrid teleport from one destination to another one 
>>>> that has
>>>> exactly the same grid coordinates. This can be a problem for 
>>>> standalones,
>>>> since many use the default 1000,1000 coordinates."
>>>> http://www.hyperica.com/how-to-travel/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have no idea whether that is still the case. Of course, 
>>>> incorporating an
>>>> offset would not be difficult.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> One nice thing you can do with OpenSim is to merge regions derived 
>>>> from OARs
>>>> so you could in theory superimpose a succession of eras in a single 
>>>> region.
>>>> Again, there's probably a little more to it than that but it's an
>>>> interesting place to start :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Best wishes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Peter
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: opensim-users-bounces at lists.berlios.de
>>>> [opensim-users-bounces at lists.berlios.de] on behalf of Lisa Evans
>>>> [lisa.p.evans at gmail.com]
>>>> Sent: 19 August 2012 18:18
>>>> To: opensim-users at lists.berlios.de
>>>> Subject: [Opensim-users] Some questions about recreating history in 
>>>> OpenSim
>>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> I'm very new to OpenSim and just signed up to this list to ask a few
>>>> questions. Sorry if I come across as a bit of a newbie, although 
>>>> I've been
>>>> studying OS for a few days and I have my own standalone grid up and 
>>>> running
>>>> at home.
>>>>
>>>> I'm putting together a proposal for this educational portal run by 
>>>> the ABC
>>>> here in Australia:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.abc.net.au/learn/proposals.htm
>>>>
>>>> My project is all about teaching history, the idea being that 
>>>> students and
>>>> history classes could put together simple sims telling stories 
>>>> about the
>>>> history of their own local area, linking them up with videos, photos,
>>>> essays, etc (which you could hopefully launch from within the sim). 
>>>> Their
>>>> sims would all be linked up in a hypergrid, so students from all over
>>>> Australia (later maybe the world) could get into a virtual time 
>>>> machine and
>>>> visit different places at different times, to see what was happening.
>>>> Students would be able to chat with each other and show each other 
>>>> around
>>>> their creations. Hopefully the act of collaborative world building 
>>>> would
>>>> engage them in learning about history, but I would want them 
>>>> focussed on
>>>> just telling small stories, involving a small number of characters 
>>>> (which
>>>> would be created as NPCs if that's possible, with simple, looping 
>>>> animations
>>>> if not more complex behaviour) and buildings, objects, etc. (I have 
>>>> ideas
>>>> about how to source lots of 3D content, which I need to explore more).
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure none of this is an original idea, but it seems like a good
>>>> opportunity to put an idea like this forward. I just was wondering 
>>>> if anyone
>>>> could tell me whether it would work in OpenSim or if there are some 
>>>> big
>>>> barriers to creating something like this.
>>>>
>>>> My main issue right now is trying to work out how you create sims that
>>>> represent not only a region in space but also a period in time. 
>>>> I've been
>>>> thinking that I would have a grid that contains regions in which only
>>>> stories from, say, 1950 to 2000 were created. Then another grid would
>>>> represent the same real world area, but contain stories from 
>>>> 1900-1950. The
>>>> further you go back in time, the longer the time intervals would 
>>>> get, along
>>>> an approximately logarithmic scale, so if you were telling stories 
>>>> about the
>>>> dinosaurs one grid would represent the entire Jurassic era, for 
>>>> example.
>>>>
>>>> Would this be the right way to go? I've been reading about regions 
>>>> and grids
>>>> and hypergrids but I'm pretty sure there's a lot I don't understand.
>>>>
>>>> My own background is that I've been working in 3D animation for 
>>>> film, TV and
>>>> games for the past decade, as a 3D all rounder and a technical 
>>>> artist. I've
>>>> worked on one big MMO for three years that was never released. So I 
>>>> know
>>>> about 3D modeling, animation, worldbuilding, etc. but I've never 
>>>> spent much
>>>> time around Second Life or OpenSim, so a lot of this is new to me.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for any help!
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Lisa Evans
>>>>
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