[Opensim-users] List of banned viewers for config files?
Justin Clark-Casey
jjustincc at googlemail.com
Mon Aug 20 22:38:57 UTC 2012
Just to remind people, these 'bans' are no more secure than banning a web-browser from a web-site via the User Agent
string. All somebody has to do is change the string that the viewer is passing to OpenSimulator.
I still think it's a useful facility but please don't rely on this as a method to securely prevent a particular viewer
from connecting.
On 19/08/12 14:30, Sarge Misfit wrote:
> R Gunther, you said that "Banning a viewer is just stupid, ..."
>
> Well, I guess you don't know anything about when the Emerald Viewer developers seriously violated the SL ToS, gathered
> info on users, conducted a DDoS attack against a detractor, all of which resulted in the viewer being banned from SL?
> Given such black-hat hacker behviour by those developers, wouldn't you ban such a viewer from your grid, or would you
> rather put visitors at risk?
>
> Sarge
>
> On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 5:00 AM, Akira Sonoda <akira.sonoda.1 at gmail.com <mailto:akira.sonoda.1 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> As you might notice. http://www.flickr.com/photos/akirasonoda/7814375104/ A majority of the OSGrid residents using
> those "buggy" viewers. And i guess there is possibly no one in OSgrid who does not have installed one of them in
> addition to his favorite experimental viewer...
>
> As you might know Amazon has datacenters located at different places. One is located in Ireland. I have chosen that
> one, because the goal of that party was to have a profiler running in parallel in order to have an idea to see what
> is going wrong.
>
> I am really not that comfortable with banning viewers. And I hope to open this region as sooon as we have evidence
> the sim can support all those viwers with a lot of people (15 to 30) simultaneously partying with a decent amount of
> lag and no forced logoff because of ACK timeouts, failing presence service calls etc.
>
>
>
> 2012/8/18 R.Gunther <rigun at rigutech.nl <mailto:rigun at rigutech.nl>>
>
> Banning a viewer is just stupid, especially because the newer viewers work better.
> But what i dont understand is that you blame the distance from region to grid server.
> I can remember something that you did have the same problems in EC2 cloud on windows server.
> and the EC2 cloud is in usa. So that dont explain much. You now lock people out of a region only because the
> dont use imprudence or some other "buggy" viewer.
>
>
> On 2012-08-18 17:07, Akira Sonoda wrote:
>> Should be fine... is the correct wording :-) It works fine for Sims with 1 to 5 Avatars simultaneously which
>> is possibly 99.9% of the whole Landmass served by OpenSim, but on crowded spaces very distant (Europe) from
>> the Asset- Inventory etc. Severs ( California ) it does not... especially if the Cache Hit Ratio is low. Since
>> November 2011 when those caps were introduced we only had problems which could be mitigated by disabling those
>> caps and with the viewer bans in place we had quite a successful OSG5B Friday Party with 37 Avatars
>> simultaneously partying without restart ( okie by the end of the party at around 01:00 CET the presence
>> service went somehow corrupt and it was no longer possible to join the party ). Failed to verify presence or
>> something like that was the message in the log. Yestertday again 22 People with the viewer restrictions i have
>> in place plus disabled lindencps: http://www.flickr.com/photos/akirasonoda/7803972118/ no major problem ...
>> feedback was: Rezzing is better, less clouds ...
>>
>> But for sure we'd like to welcome all Viewers at the party... enabling getMesh ... should not be that much of
>> an issue, because not too many Avatar wear Meshes... on the other hand, most of the visitors still use the
>> imprudence especially if we enforce it somehow by banning most other viewer capable of rendering meshes,
>> therefore there is no big rush to enable getMesh again...
>>
>> Right now I am thinking of factoring the whole HTTP stuff out of the OpenSim into a separate Process, in order
>> to have OpenSim doing what it can best, acting as a Region Server calculating physics and executing scripts
>> and serving legacy UDP Packets to the Viewers. I hope to be able to start a Proof of Concept rather soon. In
>> parallel I will do further testing with the different viwers and the different combination in order to get
>> further insights.
>>
>> take care
>> Akira
>>
>>
>> 2012/8/14 Justin Clark-Casey <jjustincc at googlemail.com <mailto:jjustincc at googlemail.com>>
>>
>> GetMesh and GetTexture should be fine in 0.7.4-rc1 (and probably earlier).
>>
>> I think the "may lead to poor performance" was rather cautious. If anything, fetching via HTTP should
>> lead to better performance since it's not generating lots of UDP messages that have to traverse
>> OpenSimulator's UDP client stack (and hence appear to be able to hold up/crowd out other UDP messages in
>> the process).
>>
>>
>> On 13/08/12 18:42, Akira Sonoda wrote:
>>
>> Hi Word,
>>
>> Because with those caps
>>
>> Cap_GetTexture=""
>> Cap_GetMesh=""
>> Cap_FetchInventoryDescendents2=""
>> Cap_FetchInventory2=""
>>
>> you won't see any textures on prims ... meaning all prims will be
>> invisible. Only Singularity 1.7 has this problem and is therefore
>> banned
>> The same applies for the experimental Cool VL Viewer which will be on
>> the banned list as well.
>>
>> Once I am certain at least GetTexture and GetMesh won't harm, they
>> possibly can be also allowed. But right now i do what is written in
>> the comment of the OpenSim.ini:
>>
>> ; This is disabled by default. Change if you see fit. Note that
>> ; serving this cap from the simulators may lead to poor performace.
>>
>> Poor Performance ... I am sensitive on that .... and it is even worse...
>>
>> Take care
>> Akira
>>
>> 2012/8/13, drwhiet at spacefriends.de <mailto:drwhiet at spacefriends.de> <drwhiet at spacefriends.de
>> <mailto:drwhiet at spacefriends.de>>:
>>
>> Hi Akira,
>>
>> Why are you banning Singularity ?
>>
>> Best regards
>> Wordfromthe Wise
>>
>> On 13.08.2012, at 00:25, Akira Sonoda <akira.sonoda.1 at gmail.com <mailto:akira.sonoda.1 at gmail.com>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Fleep,
>>
>> First, banning viewers is not a good thing, especially not on osgrid,
>> because osgrid is here for testing the OpenSimulator under real life usage
>> and as far as i know OpenSim wants to support all of the viewers floating
>> around.
>>
>> Buuuuut ... it is really annoying to have a sim crashing when you have a
>> party with some 15 to 30 people partying. Therefore I enabled on one of
>> the 50 sims i am maintaining, the following rules:
>>
>> AllowedClients="Phoenix|Imprudence|Cool|Singularity|Firestorm|0.6.3"
>> BannedClients="Singularity 1.7"
>>
>> Those should support most of the used viewers:
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/akirasonoda/7769188218/
>>
>> Firestorm is in, because many people use it. This is the riskiest part
>> because with my avatar i crash ( or at least produce ACK timeouts for all
>> viewers ) the sims all the time using the latest Firestorm.
>>
>> If you have your own grid, then you can apply viewer restrictions on grid
>> level.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Akira
>>
>>
>> 2012/8/9 Fleep Tuque <fleep513 at gmail.com <mailto:fleep513 at gmail.com>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I was wondering if anyone was willing to share their list of banned
>> viewers used in the config files for Opensim? I don't know what the
>> latest and greatest bad viewers are (or really any of them since I don't
>> use them!), but if anyone has a good list, I for one would appreciate the
>> info.
>>
>> For the record, I understand that the banned viewer list in the config can
>> be overridden by a savvy griefer, so it's not air tight security, but I
>> figure any effort to combat it doesn't hurt..
>>
>> Thanks in advance!
>>
>> - Chris/Fleep
>>
>>
>> Chris M. Collins (SL/OS: Fleep Tuque)
>> Center for Simulations & Virtual Environments Research (UCSIM)
>> UCIT Instructional & Research Computing
>> University of Cincinnati
>> 406A Zimmer Hall
>> 315 College Drive
>> PO BOX 210088
>> Cincinnati, OH 45221-0088
>> chris.collins at uc.edu <mailto:chris.collins at uc.edu>
>> (513) 556-3018 <tel:%28513%29%20556-3018>
>>
>> http://ucsim.uc.edu
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Justin Clark-Casey (justincc)
>> http://justincc.org/blog
>> http://twitter.com/justincc
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Opensim-users mailing list
>> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
>> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de <mailto:Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de>
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Opensim-users mailing list
> Opensim-users at lists.berlios.de
> https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
>
--
Justin Clark-Casey (justincc)
http://justincc.org/blog
http://twitter.com/justincc
More information about the Opensim-users
mailing list