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    I would like to hear from people who have either monitoring tools or
    bots that rely on the incorrect physics FPS. If these people exist,
    let's hear what pain it would cause them to correct the number.
    Otherwise, I don't see any reason to continue to report  an
    incorrect number, and I see many reasons for fixing it: several PhD
    students have now either wasted a lot of their time or even made
    wrong data analysis because of this.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/24/2015 9:08 PM, Michael Emory
      Cerquoni wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAF5=rqWTnnqJ_SSahCs12ExB_iA+C2bqE9dNOT8L_63tupAsrQ@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">It is more than just bots that worry me, many
        people have written custom monitoring tools to monitor region
        performance to automatically restart regions, not to mention
        script that could potentially rely on <a moz-do-not-send="true"
          href="http://opensimulator.org/wiki/OsGetRegionStats"
          title="OsGetRegionStats">osGetRegionStats >
          http://opensimulator.org/wiki/OsGetRegionStats</a>   we could
        be potentially breaking all of this content if we are talking
        about long term leaving the statistics at these lower numbers,
        if we are talking about eventually having them resume to the
        normal levels etc.. that is something else, and if that is the
        case I would suggest we start a new branch for that work that
        would eventually merge into master once the work was complete. 
        Like i said I am not against doing this work, but not at the
        expense of causing mass chaos amongst important users and
        testers of this software, how can we say we are improving the
        software if we are rushing into breaking stuff people may be
        very reliant on. <br>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Apr 25, 2015 at 12:01 AM, Diva
          Canto <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:diva@metaverseink.com" target="_blank">diva@metaverseink.com</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> I'm +1 on the
              changes. I find it very unsettling to be shown a physics
              fps that is incorrect, and some of my students have been
              very confused about it in the past. I don't think the
              changes will affect bots in any significant way, but if
              someone can point me to a bot that will be affected, I
              would like to know.
              <div>
                <div class="h5"><br>
                  <br>
                  <div>On 4/24/2015 6:23 PM, Dahlia Trimble wrote:<br>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote type="cite">
                    <div dir="ltr">
                      <div>
                        <div>I like the idea of a multiplier for physics
                          fps, however I see no need for altering the
                          value. If a reported number is linearly
                          scaled, then any change in that number is also
                          scaled proportionally. For example, if I have
                          55 fps reported for a real fps of 11 due to a
                          scale factor of 5, all I need to do is divide
                          by 5 to get the 11 back. If the 55 decreases
                          by 10%, the 11 will also decrease by 10%. It
                          really shouldn't matter as either value will
                          provide the same indication of change in
                          performance.<br>
                          <br>
                        </div>
                        As far as SL compatibility goes, I usually see a
                        physics fps of 45 for a well running region in
                        SL, not 55. In that case if such compatibility
                        was desired, the factor would be 45/11 or
                        approximately 4.1 rather than 5.</div>
                    </div>
                    <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                      <div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at
                        6:06 PM, Michael Emory Cerquoni <span dir="ltr"><<a
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:nebadon2025@gmail.com"
                            target="_blank">nebadon2025@gmail.com</a>></span>
                        wrote:<br>
                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0
                          0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                          solid;padding-left:1ex">
                          <div dir="ltr">Also sounds like a reasonable
                            solution as well, If the goal is to improve
                            performance in general I am not sure it
                            matters what is actually reported to the
                            viewer , since i would assume any kind of
                            real analysis would be done on the back end
                            and not via the viewer #'s<br>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <div>
                              <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                <div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Apr 24,
                                  2015 at 9:04 PM, Mike Chase <span
                                    dir="ltr"><<a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:mike.chase@alternatemetaverse.com"
                                      target="_blank">mike.chase@alternatemetaverse.com</a>></span>
                                  wrote:<br>
                                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                    style="margin:0 0 0
                                    .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                                    solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                    <div text="#000000"
                                      bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Why not just
                                      introduce a new counter and
                                      function to fetch the value.  The
                                      current one can always return the
                                      SL adjusted value.<span><font
                                          color="#888888"><br>
                                          <br>
                                          Mike</font></span>
                                      <div>
                                        <div><br>
                                          <br>
                                          <div>On 04/24/2015 08:59 PM,
                                            Michael Emory Cerquoni
                                            wrote:<br>
                                          </div>
                                          <blockquote type="cite">
                                            <div dir="ltr">What do you
                                              think about making the
                                              multiplier a modifiable
                                              variable in OpenSim.ini? 
                                              This will allow anyone who
                                              wants to improve
                                              performance and use the
                                              stock #'s and in the
                                              meantime people can
                                              continue to use the code
                                              in a meaningful way
                                              without having to rewrite
                                              scripts and monitoring
                                              tools to continue testing
                                              other code that may be
                                              pushed into core,
                                              especially if the end goal
                                              is to get statistics to
                                              report back at the
                                              original numbers?  I am
                                              mostly just trying to
                                              understand the end goal
                                              myself.  If that is not
                                              possible I would suggest
                                              this work be moved into a
                                              development branch until
                                              we can get statistics back
                                              to the normal numbers
                                              again?  Otherwise we are
                                              talking about locking the
                                              code down to all other
                                              development until this
                                              process is complete, and
                                              no one has discussed any
                                              kind of time frame for
                                              this level of changes to
                                              complete, I would hate to
                                              put a complete halt to
                                              development in order for
                                              this to happen.  I am not
                                              against doing what you
                                              suggest, I just want to
                                              make sure we do it in the
                                              most efficient way
                                              possible.  Would be good
                                              to hear what others in the
                                              core development have to
                                              say, hopefully Justin and
                                              Diva and Melanie,
                                              Misterblue, BlueWall, you
                                              guys can chime in here as
                                              well, as I am only one
                                              person here and for the
                                              record just voicing my own
                                              concerns, I am far from
                                              the final say on any of
                                              this stuff.<br>
                                            </div>
                                            <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                              <div class="gmail_quote">On
                                                Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at
                                                8:33 PM, Maxwell,
                                                Douglas CIV USARMY ARL
                                                (US) <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:douglas.maxwell3.civ@mail.mil"
                                                    target="_blank">douglas.maxwell3.civ@mail.mil</a>></span>
                                                wrote:<br>
                                                <blockquote
                                                  class="gmail_quote"
                                                  style="margin:0 0 0
                                                  .8ex;border-left:1px
                                                  #ccc
                                                  solid;padding-left:1ex">Folks,

                                                  before we can make any
                                                  meaningful progress in
                                                  performance
                                                  enhancements to the
                                                  open simulator we have
                                                  to be able to rely on
                                                  the simulator
                                                  statistics.  Currently
                                                  they are
                                                  (purposefully)
                                                  misreported to make
                                                  the simulator look
                                                  like it is performing
                                                  better than it really
                                                  is.  This is not
                                                  acceptable if we are
                                                  to dig in and begin to
                                                  assist.<br>
                                                  <span><br>
                                                    Douglas Maxwell,
                                                    MSME<br>
                                                    Science and
                                                    Technology Manager<br>
                                                    Virtual World
                                                    Strategic
                                                    Applications<br>
                                                    U.S. Army Research
                                                    Lab<br>
                                                  </span>Human Research
                                                  & Engineering
                                                  Directorate<br>
                                                  <span>Simulation &
                                                    Training Technology
                                                    Center<br>
                                                  </span>(c) <a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%28407%29%20242-0209" value="+14072420209" target="_blank">(407)
                                                    242-0209</a><br>
                                                  <br>
________________________________________<br>
                                                  From: <a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org</a>
                                                  [<a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org</a>]
                                                  on behalf of Melanie [<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:melanie@t-data.com" target="_blank">melanie@t-data.com</a>]<br>
                                                  Sent: Friday, April
                                                  24, 2015 5:56 PM<br>
                                                  To: <a
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                  Subject: Re:
                                                  [Opensim-dev] MOSES
                                                  patch submitted
                                                  (UNCLASSIFIED)<br>
                                                  <div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                      It is also my
                                                      opinion that this
                                                      change isn't fit
                                                      for core. If and<br>
                                                      when additional
                                                      stats, like "real
                                                      fps" and "physics
                                                      engine fps" can<br>
                                                      be shown in the
                                                      viewer, then that
                                                      would be good but
                                                      the viewer stats<br>
                                                      window should
                                                      continue to show
                                                      the fudged figures
                                                      indefinitely. This<br>
                                                      is because people
                                                      don't only use
                                                      scripts but also
                                                      bots to do<br>
                                                      monitoring and
                                                      bots receive the
                                                      same data the
                                                      viewer receives.<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      - Melanie<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      On 24/04/2015
                                                      23:42, Michael
                                                      Emory Cerquoni
                                                      wrote:<br>
                                                      > ok so just so
                                                      I understand we
                                                      should now see
                                                      this actually just
                                                      display<br>
                                                      > 11fps?
                                                      Personally I think
                                                      this is a bad
                                                      idea, alot of
                                                      people may be
                                                      using<br>
                                                      > monitoring
                                                      apps and scripts
                                                      that look for low
                                                      fps and restart
                                                      the region,<br>
                                                      > we would
                                                      basically be
                                                      forcing everyone
                                                      to rewrite a lot
                                                      of code to<br>
                                                      > accommodate a
                                                      singular purpose?
                                                      Not quite sure how
                                                      this improves the<br>
                                                      > project as a
                                                      whole.<br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      > On Fri, Apr
                                                      24, 2015 at 5:40
                                                      PM, Michael Emory
                                                      Cerquoni <<br>
                                                      > <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:nebadon2025@gmail.com" target="_blank">nebadon2025@gmail.com</a>>


                                                      wrote:<br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      >> ok I will
                                                      continue testing
                                                      this for now, we
                                                      should try to
                                                      resolve the<br>
                                                      >> white
                                                      space issues
                                                      before it hits
                                                      core, we can worry
                                                      about that later<br>
                                                      >> though. I
                                                      hope others can
                                                      start testing this
                                                      patch as well we
                                                      need to<br>
                                                      >> really
                                                      make sure this
                                                      does not break any
                                                      scripts or
                                                      monitoring apps
                                                      before<br>
                                                      >> this
                                                      changes the core
                                                      code, so anyone
                                                      who has the time
                                                      please do test
                                                      this<br>
                                                      >> and let
                                                      us know if you
                                                      notice anything
                                                      change or break,
                                                      thanks!<br>
                                                      >><br>
                                                      >> On Fri,
                                                      Apr 24, 2015 at
                                                      3:38 PM, Maxwell,
                                                      Douglas CIV USARMY
                                                      ARL (US) <<br>
                                                      >> <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:douglas.maxwell3.civ@mail.mil" target="_blank">douglas.maxwell3.civ@mail.mil</a>>


                                                      wrote:<br>
                                                      >><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Classification:
                                                      UNCLASSIFIED<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Caveats: NONE<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>> What
                                                      you saw were just
                                                      warnings about
                                                      white spaces.  The
                                                      patch should<br>
                                                      >>> still<br>
                                                      >>> apply
                                                      and work.  We
                                                      follows the open
                                                      simulator patch
                                                      creation guidance<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      explicitly, if you
                                                      guys have updated
                                                      instructions for
                                                      how you want this<br>
                                                      >>> done
                                                      -<br>
                                                      >>> let
                                                      us know. 
                                                      Otherwise, you can
                                                      ignore the
                                                      warnings.<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>> v/r
                                                      -douglas<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Douglas Maxwell,
                                                      MSME<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Science and
                                                      Technology Manager<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Virtual World
                                                      Strategic
                                                      Applications<br>
                                                      >>> U.S.
                                                      Army Research Lab<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Simulation &
                                                      Training
                                                      Technology Center
                                                      (STTC)<br>
                                                      >>> (c) <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:%28407%29%20242-0209"
                                                        value="+14072420209"
                                                        target="_blank">(407)
                                                        242-0209</a><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      -----Original
                                                      Message-----<br>
                                                      >>> From:
                                                      <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      [mailto:<a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">opensim-dev-bounces@opensimulator.org</a>]
                                                      On Behalf Of
                                                      Michael Emory<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Cerquoni<br>
                                                      >>> Sent:
                                                      Friday, April 24,
                                                      2015 2:38 PM<br>
                                                      >>> To: <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:opensim-dev@opensimulator.org"
                                                        target="_blank">opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Subject: Re:
                                                      [Opensim-dev]
                                                      MOSES patch
                                                      submitted<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      please check the
                                                      mantis, i had some
                                                      trouble applying
                                                      patch for testing,<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      thanks<br>
                                                      >>> guys!<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>> On
                                                      Fri, Apr 24, 2015
                                                      at 1:30 PM,
                                                      Michael Heilmann
                                                      <<a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mheilman@ist.ucf.edu" target="_blank">mheilman@ist.ucf.edu</a>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      wrote:<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         Opensim Devs<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         Just an FYI,
                                                      mantis bug #7540
                                                      is the first code
                                                      submission from<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      project<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      MOSES.  Thanks.<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         --<br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         Michael
                                                      Heilmann<br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         Research
                                                      Associate<br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         Institute for
                                                      Simulation and
                                                      Training<br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         University of
                                                      Central Florida<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                       
                                                       _______________________________________________<br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         Opensim-dev
                                                      mailing list<br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      >>>     
                                                         <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                                        target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      <blockedhttp://<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
                                                        href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                                        target="_blank">opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>> --<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Michael Emory
                                                      Cerquoni<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Classification:
                                                      UNCLASSIFIED<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Caveats: NONE<br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      _______________________________________________<br>
                                                      >>>
                                                      Opensim-dev
                                                      mailing list<br>
                                                      >>> <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      >>> <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                                        target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >>><br>
                                                      >><br>
                                                      >><br>
                                                      >> --<br>
                                                      >> Michael
                                                      Emory Cerquoni<br>
                                                      >><br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      ><br>
                                                      >
                                                      _______________________________________________<br>
                                                      > Opensim-dev
                                                      mailing list<br>
                                                      > <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      > <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                                        target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                                      Opensim-dev
                                                      mailing list<br>
                                                      <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                                        target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                                      Opensim-dev
                                                      mailing list<br>
                                                      <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                                      <a
                                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                                        target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                  </div>
                                                </blockquote>
                                              </div>
                                              <br>
                                              <br clear="all">
                                              <br>
                                              -- <br>
                                              <div>Michael Emory
                                                Cerquoni</div>
                                            </div>
                                            <br>
                                            <fieldset></fieldset>
                                            <br>
                                            <pre>_______________________________________________
Opensim-dev mailing list
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev" target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a>
</pre>
                                          </blockquote>
                                          <br>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </div>
                                    <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                                    Opensim-dev mailing list<br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org"
                                      target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                                    <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                                      target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
                                    <br>
                                  </blockquote>
                                </div>
                                <br>
                                <br clear="all">
                                <br>
                                -- <br>
                                <div>Michael Emory Cerquoni</div>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                          <br>
_______________________________________________<br>
                          Opensim-dev mailing list<br>
                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org"
                            target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
                          <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                            href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
                            target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
                          <br>
                        </blockquote>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                    </div>
                    <br>
                    <fieldset></fieldset>
                    <br>
                    <pre>_______________________________________________
Opensim-dev mailing list
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org" target="_blank">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev" target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a>
</pre>
                  </blockquote>
                  <br>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
            <br>
            _______________________________________________<br>
            Opensim-dev mailing list<br>
            <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a><br>
            <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev"
              target="_blank">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a><br>
            <br>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
        <br clear="all">
        <br>
        -- <br>
        <div class="gmail_signature">Michael Emory Cerquoni</div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
Opensim-dev mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org">Opensim-dev@opensimulator.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev">http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev</a>
</pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>