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I also don't know much about the details of realXtend's design on this,
I only know the general goal.<br>
<br>
My thoughts about this are as follows: we want organizations to control
who visits their regions, no question about that. There will be
organizations (like role-playing games, for example) that will require
accounts with them for people to play, and that's perfectly fine. This
also happens on the web: if you want to "play" in facebook, you need to
get an account with them. But there will be organizations who will
welcome visits from accounts in other worlds, or accounts served from
"identity services", which don't exist yet. As I said, from where I
stand, I see this as a *major* need. I'm working with a lot of people
who want to use virtual worlds like that. They want to build useful
services in 3D, and they need people to visit. If people need to
get accounts with them, the whole idea stops in its tracks at the
station -- or else they do it in Linden Lab's grid.<br>
<br>
I don't see any need for *automatic* selection of one of several
possible accounts associated with a real world person -- that's a level
of sophistication that's unnecessary at this point and in the forseable
future. I think that goal is blurring the much simple things that can
be done relatively easily.<br>
<br>
What I see is the need for identity services that are independent of
any particular grid. Here's the usage scenario:<br>
<br>
1. People get accounts with one (or more) identity services. For
example, I (Crista Lopes) get an account in an hypothetical identity
service provided by VeriSignVW; that account is called
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:crista@verisignvw.com">crista@verisignvw.com</a>. Besides my ID, VeriSigVW gives me storage space
for my <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:crista@verisignvw.com">crista@verisignvw.com</a> inventory.<br>
2. I login to some virtual world, say OSGrid, using that account.
OSGrid must accept avatars from VeriSignVW. Maybe OSGrid is more
generic than that; maybe it accepts accounts from
any identity service that complies with a standard ID protocol, TBD.<br>
3. As I visit regions in OSGrid, all comms with inventory and user go
to VeriSignVW.<br>
4. At some point I want to visit some other grid, say IBM's public
grid. I TP to it under my representation which is <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:crista@verisignvw.com">crista@verisignvw.com</a><br>
5. The IBM grid must accept avatars from VeriSignVW. If it does,
swoosh! there I go. If it doesn't, I
can't TP to it. I must logout, and login under some IBM account. The
extra work of automatically selecting between my VeriSignVW account and
my IBM account is completely unnecessary at this point. I can do that
manually. But having the ability to surf under one single account
between grids that accept that 3rd-party accounts is a major step
forward.<br>
<br>
Michael Wright wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid617074.6446.qm@web23014.mail.ird.yahoo.com"
type="cite">I haven't been able to find too much on how the RealXtend
avatar system is really going to work. And while in some ways I think
its a step in the right direction, it also seems to limit a lot of
things. I'm not so sure you should alway have the same avatar for
everything. Or should completely cut the "region servers" out of the
whole process. If I teleport to a region that has a role playing game,
maybe my avatar should automatically change (at least clothes, but
maybe body as well) to fit into that game. So the region has to be able
to have some say over the avatar. <br>
<br>
I have the same sort of thoughts about inventory. While it should not
be centralised, the regions do need to be able to (with permission) do
certain things, like maybe a region gives you a extra set of folders
for use in that region, but they disappear when you leave it. I am also
not sure there should be just one inventory set for each user. Why not
a number of sub sets that can be combined etc. Maybe the region could
restrict access to only a certain set, which might be a set that it
provides, when in that region; no space ships when in that serious
business region.. Inventory really needs to swap to a more url based
system. <br>
<br>
Also we need to remember not everything will be interconnected. There
will be some applications (or possible grids) that want to be separate
from everything else. <br>
<br>
So I don't think we should be forcing any centralised system on people.
And yes from what I've read, I actually think the realxtend avatar
system sounds too centralised, but that could be because I don't know
enough details of what is planned. I'm not saying its wrong, it just
doesn't fit all possible uses. So we need things to at least be
modular. <br>
<br>
Having said all that, of course I think a lot of people and
applications will want to have shared resources like these. Just we
have to be careful in how they are implemented. And for opensim at
least, that should be a open process/design that everyone can be part
of. <br>
<br>
<b><i>Sean Dague <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sean@dague.net"><sean@dague.net></a></i></b> wrote:
<blockquote class="replbq"
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;">
On Thu, Apr 10, 2008 at 08:50:33AM -0700, Diva Canto wrote:<br>
> Hi,<br>
> <br>
> What happened to realXtend's "avatar system"? Is it being
integrated <br>
> with OpenSim?<br>
<br>
Short answers. I don't know, and no. The process for code coming into<br>
OpenSim is to put a patch in mantis. I haven't seen any proposed<br>
patches in this area in mantis.<br>
<br>
> From where I stand, that, or something like that, is a major <br>
> architectural requirement for virtual worlds to get serious.
Without the <br>
> ability for people to get an identity+inventory that they can port
<br>
> around through different organization's grids, this is not going
to be <br>
> that useful. I see a lot of interest from organizations to set up
their <br>
> own virtual worlds under their control (so, their own grid'ed
regions), <br>
> but if people have to get accounts with them to visit, this is
just not <br>
> going to work for serious usages - period.<br>
<br>
Hence you've created the paradox. :)<br>
<br>
* We want everything connected<br>
* We don't want to trust a single authoritative source for info<br>
(otherwise you'd be on Second Life)<br>
<br>
Honestly, this is a hard problem to solve, and one that seems a bit<br>
beyond the current scope. That being said, implementations and research<br>
in this area which work with OpenSim are always welcomed.<br>
<br>
> I understand there's a ton of stability work to be done, but this <br>
> particular architectural decision is really important, even <br>
> (especially?) at this early stage; we all trust stability will
happen <br>
> over time.<br>
> Is there anything that I can do to boost the efforts in that
direction, <br>
> besides sending this email?<br>
<br>
Sample peer based User services that allow cross talk would be useful.<br>
The moral equivalent of OpenID for virtual worlds (because you need more<br>
than just what openid provides).<br>
<br>
-Sean<br>
<br>
-- <br>
__________________________________________________________________<br>
<br>
Sean Dague Mid-Hudson Valley<br>
sean at dague dot net Linux Users Group<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://dague.net">http://dague.net</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://mhvlug.org">http://mhvlug.org</a><br>
<br>
There is no silver bullet. Plus, werewolves make better neighbors<br>
than zombies, and they tend to keep the vampire population down.<br>
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