[Opensim-dev] Supplying IScene instead of Scene for the future region modules mechanism

[Justin Clark-Casey]

Melanie wrote:
> Looks like you didn't read my post. I said, as a mid to long range 
> goal, yes. I didn't say we should never have it. I said it would 
> block critical fixes if it were forced onto the new region module 
> interface now.

In your earlier posts you vehemently decried any notion of supplying a scene interface.  I hope you haven't forgotten 
these already.

> I'm not bullying anyone. You have not yet had the pleasure of seeing 
> me bully anyone. :)

And I've no interest in trying to discuss something with someone who uses extreme statements without any hint that they 
can see the other person's point of view.

> 
> Melanie
> 
> Justin Clark-Casey wrote:
>> Sean Dague wrote:
>>> Melanie wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> as a mid to long range goal, +1, actually.
>>>>
>>>> but in the short run, the ability to load and unload regions is 
>>>> blocked by the existing module API, and to fix this basic piece of 
>>>> functionality, they need to be migrated to the new API, asap.
>>>>
>>>> If this is dragged into a long architectural discussion, we won't 
>>>> get region restarts for many more months.
>>>>
>>>> So, I'd rather see this iteration of the region module API pass 
>>>> Scene, and remove the old API very soon, and then think about 
>>>> architecting and refactoring when that is not a blocker to 
>>>> adding/repairing basic functionality.
>>> I'd agree with Mel here about lets keep it a bit more open and sloppy
>>> for now, and start to lock that down once we're on the other side of the
>>> loader issue.
>>>
>>> We all come to this from different perspectives.  Mine is a lot of scars
>>> and lost time due to IScriptHost a year ago.  Just about every LSL
>>> commit required changing IScriptHost and adding back in functions for
>>> SOP.  Eventually, I just threw out IScriptHost, as it was clear that
>>> interface was far too premature.
>>>
>>> I think we're a bit premature on IScene at this point.  We know what we
>>> all would do with it, but leaving the barn door open to other random
>>> folks abusing the interfaces in ways that we didn't expect is probably
>>> reasonable at this stage, so we make sure we don't lock off a piece of
>>> function that's very reasonable to want.
>>>
>>> That being said, breaking Scene into more digestable parts would be a
>>> *very good thing*.
>> Definitely.  I've spent quite some time moving things out of Scene myself.  Much of what remains are the much more 
>> indigestible bits (e.g. land/terrain management, inventory).  I plan to look at these in the course of my normal 
>> attempts to chip away at the big ball of mud but any help here would be much appreciated.
>>
>> Switching the region module mechanism seemed to me to be a good opportunity to introduce a Scene interface without 
>> causing a separate bout of pain later on.  But on hearing some of the rational feedback, I accept that it could still be 
>> too early to do this.  If people were to treat this interface as a contract they could build against, as Teravus pointed 
>> out, then it needs to be stable.
>>
>> Nonetheless, I'm seeing that with the exception of Melanie, the core developers who have posted are in favour of having 
>> an interface eventually (I presume before 1.0).  So it is coming and if people have to endure some update pain later on, 
>> well that's the price of building against alpha code.  It's not a huge upheaval either, in most cases it is simply a 
>> search and replace of Scene with IScene.  When this happens later on I will point back at this discussion as warning.
>>
>> I'm quite happy to hear arguments against a scene interface, but I will forcefully counter and later ignore any attempt 
>> by Melanie to bully me off the point with completely exaggerated statements.  We're here to discuss, negotiate and 
>> compromise in good faith, not to shout at each other across the mailing lists.
>>
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Justin Clark-Casey
http://justincc.wordpress.com