[Opensim-dev] region status tracking in GridServer
Brian Wolfe
brianw at terrabox.com
Sun Feb 10 18:24:21 UTC 2008
if you use the latest release client, firstlook, or RC you'll get a
pop-up window notifying you that the region you are entering is running
a beta, or different version of the sim software on LL's grid now.
I've had it come up when I entered havok4 beta regions.
On Sun, 2008-02-10 at 13:03 -0500, Aldon Hynes wrote:
> To the best of my knowledge, LL does not notify the client when you move
> from one version of a region to another, and it seems to be assumed that the
> user does not know or care about the version of the region they are
> connecting to. To the extent that a grid is controlled by a single provider
> (e.g. LL), this may well be a valid assumption. Yet as we move to open sims
> where the region could be hosted by anyone, this becomes more of a concern.
>
> It would see that adding sim_version to the table and the RegisterRegion
> XMLRPC would be a good thing.
>
> Aldon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de
> [mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de]On Behalf Of Brian Wolfe
> Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 12:52 PM
> To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] region status tracking in GridServer
>
>
> Well, we could add a new field called "sim_version" to the table and to
> the RegisterRegion XMLRPC. That would be the most straightforward way
> that I know of.
>
> How does LL notify the client currently that the region you are moving
> into is running a different version?
>
>
> On Sun, 2008-02-10 at 08:48 -0500, Aldon Hynes wrote:
> > Not to hijack the discussion, but this gets to a meta issue that I'm
> > becoming more concerned about. It came up when we were discussing how
> > currency should work, ties into this discussion and probably has
> > broader implications. That is, what can we know about the regions we
> > are in? In Second Life, we currently assume that the grid and the
> > region are both hosted by LL and are using the same latest version of
> > the software.
> >
> > However, with OpenSim, when I move from one region to another, I may
> > be moving not only from one server to another, but to different
> > versions of the OpenSim software, to a different hosting service,
> > perhaps to a region that has been hacked or customized in some weird
> > way.
> >
> > As far as I can tell, there is nothing available to get details about
> > the region I'm entering. Are there ways to get such information?
> > Should there be? If so, what might that look like?
> >
> > Aldon
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de
> > [mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de]On Behalf Of
> > Stefan Andersson
> > Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 3:11 AM
> > To: brianw at terrabox.com
> > Cc: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> > Subject: Re: [Opensim-dev] region status tracking in
> > GridServer
> >
> >
> > I would not say this is 'fatally flawed' just because it can
> > be the result of one clients connectivity problems; it's still
> > an indication that somebody somewhere had troubles reching the
> > target. That's why it should only be seen as a ping trigger,
> > not as status authoritative.
> >
> > Also, it's not the client that reports on the trouble, it's
> > the source region - which means, that if the client can
> > re-connect to the source region but not to the target, chances
> > are that there's something wrong with the target.
> >
> > If a grid server is the authority for say 6000 servers,
> > frequent grid wide pings becomes quite the task, not to
> > mention the fact that the grid server itself can (and in an
> > heterogenous grid setting, will) experience connectivity
> > problems, just as the client can.
> >
> > Best,
> > /Stefan
> >
> >
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> >
> > > Subject: RE: [Opensim-dev] region status tracking in
> > GridServer
> > > From: brianw at terrabox.com
> > > To: stefan at tribalmedia.se
> > > CC: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> > > Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2008 18:22:45 -0600
> > >
> > > Unfortunately this is fatally flawed since teleports can
> > fail due to
> > > internet routing issues taht affect only one person, amongst
> > other
> > > movement failures that would cause the client to think a
> > region is
> > > offline vs the server knowing it's offline or online.
> > >
> > > I'm posting a patch to mantis that lays the foundation for
> > regions beign
> > > online or offline and when they were last heard from by the
> > grid server.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, 2008-02-09 at 21:25 +0100, Stefan Andersson wrote:
> > > > Ok, I was to do some research before I replied on this
> > thread, but off
> > > > the top of my head;
> > > >
> > > > first of all, we should define what we want the region
> > status data
> > > > for; the data should guide choice of implementation.
> > > >
> > > > That said, there is quite a distinct possibility that we
> > can use the
> > > > _clients_ as our agents for detecting offline region
> > servers.
> > > >
> > > > Whenever someone tries to teleport off a region, the
> > source region is
> > > > informed of this, to be able to downgrade avatar presence
> > to child.
> > > >
> > > > If the teleport fails (the target region is unresponsive)
> > the
> > > > connection comes back to the region so it should upgrade
> > the avatar
> > > > presence to root again.
> > > >
> > > > (Incidentally, I've filed a mantis on this, since we
> > actually don't
> > > > handle that, and failed teleports results in you coming
> > back to a
> > > > region, but as a 'child' ie being stuck there and possibly
> > causing all
> > > > kind of havoc with the ClientView)
> > > >
> > > > Now, if we handled the failed teleport correctly, this
> > could also
> > > > notify the grid service that a failed teleport has
> > occurred.
> > > >
> > > > The grid service could then ping the target region, to
> > check on its
> > > > state.
> > > >
> > > > This is an alternative or complement to grid-wide ping
> > sweeps; you
> > > > probably want both, but could do the sweeps much less
> > frequently.
> > > >
> > > > Combine this with proper region signon/signoff and I say
> > you got
> > > > options.
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > /Stefan
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> ______________________________________________________________________
> > > >
> > > > > From: brianw at terrabox.com
> > > > > To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> > > > > Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2008 12:56:10 -0600
> > > > > Subject: [Opensim-dev] region status tracking in
> > GridServer
> > > > >
> > > > > After much IRC discussion I would like to make a couple
> > changes to
> > > > the
> > > > > regions table.
> > > > >
> > > > > online bool NOT NULL deafult false
> > > > > last_seen int(11) NULL
> > > > >
> > > > > The online column would be updated as a region logs in
> > and out of
> > > > > GridServers. This way an external management/status
> > application
> > > > doesn't
> > > > > have to pester the grid server for the full list of
> > regions and
> > > > their
> > > > > status. This would also provide data to regions
> > requesting map
> > > > blocks as
> > > > > to the status of a region (a.ka. LL's Red Regions in the
> > map view).
> > > > >
> > > > > The last_seen column would be of asistance to these same
> > management
> > > > apps
> > > > > in helping the administrator to determine which regions
> > were long
> > > > term
> > > > > MIA or just plain not wanted anymore by walk away grid
> > members.
> > > > >
> > > > > My main concern is load placed on the grid server and
> > having to ping
> > > > > regions by external applications having to probe every
> > region
> > > > currently
> > > > > to tell if it's still around or not.
> > > > >
> > > > > To acomplish this i'm workign on a patch to implement
> > region_logout
> > > > > XMLRPC that would be called via
> > > > Region.Communications.DeregisterRegion
> > > > > (which is currently empty).
> > > > >
> > > > > I woudl also add an update of RegionProfileData as each
> > RPC call si
> > > > made
> > > > > by a region to GridManager. Database updates would only
> > happen
> > > > > periodicly as regions login and logout.
> > > > >
> > > > > Are there any objections or reasons not to implement
> > this?
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Opensim-dev mailing list
> > > > > Opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> > > > > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev
> > > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Opensim-dev at lists.berlios.de
> > https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev
>
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