[Opensim-dev] UGAIM++ (Re: rex auth & avatar systems)

Mon Dec 15 09:20:40 UTC 2008

Over time,

the winning strategy is to allow for easy implementation of case-specific architectures - as you yourself saw with being able to (realtively) easily implement 'hypergrid' on OpenSim.

OpenSim will 'win' by being the thing that allows the winning architecture to be built upon it, and not by pushing any specific set of architecture design solutions (but this).

So, trying to do something 'better than the web' is a precarious stance, as the web was proofed by use, and is, in its own right, the best solution.

That said, I do agree 100% with the 'home' and 'home grid' concept - we have played with letting regions add and remove inventory items and permissions depending on what region you're on - so yes, in your 'home' region, you would have full access to all your items, and would be able to create a new avatar appearance, but if you did it in another region (untrusted) any profile, inventory and appearance updates would not get stored. Or vice versa, if you landed in the medieval fantasy sim, you would get an inventory node with region-specific themed items. We think this approach holds promise.
Also, on 'putting it on apache' - that's _exactly_ what we've been trying to do since the beginning of OpenSim. Or rather, enable people to do so, reasonably easy. The http server architecture was, with the streamhandlers, meant to be able to be portable to other production environments - it's REALLY easy to do an asp.net ashx generic web handler that acts as a service in-place drop-in by just forwarding the request/response streams to their respective handlers, allowing you to keep the 'business logic' of the protocol handlers whilst delegating the actual communications to another layer. The UGAIM service exes were thought of as 'the reference implementations'.

As always, there's the API, the protocols and the services as _reference_implementations_.
Best regards,Stefan AnderssonTribal Media AB

Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 20:46:19 -0800From: lopes at ics.uci.eduTo: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.deSubject: [Opensim-dev] UGAIM++ (Re: rex auth & avatar systems)About the picture below. In OpenSim, the login process could be made more decoupled if only the user server didn't assume anything about the map (grid) server. On the other hand, I don't see a problem in giving users "homes", that is, default regions where they always land upon logging in. The home concept is actually quite important, I think. In VWs users should probably have homes. A "home" is the place where users can do everything without fear of being robbed -- that's my definition of "home."Also, the User Service could be decoupled from inventory and assets. It already is, to some extent. However...I think there's something really interesting about the set UGAIM++ (the ++ is for additional user-centered services), and although they serve different purposes, their total decoupling is not necessarily a good thing. I came to that conclusion after having thought first that the decoupling was definitely the way to go. I'm not so sure it is anymore, but I can see both ways. I think we can do a lot of interesting things with peer-to-peering sets of UGAIMs instead of decoupling the individual services. Here's why.I really like the idea of designing a global infrastructure centered on people ("people", not "avatars"). The question we should be asking is: what do people need to go around this global infrastructure? They need an identity to login to (U), a home (G), raw storage (A), storage organization and ACL (I), a way to talk to other people (M), ... and maybe other things. Yes, we can certainly spread these different services among different service providers, but what are the advantages of doing so? I came to formulate these questions as I started to understand the architecture of OpenSim a little better. What if... we packed a bunch of user-centered services into Apache? Wouldn't that make Apache a lot more interesting? What if... every computer would come with an associated user-centered web server, a "standalone"? Wouldn't that make a lot of things a lot easier on the web?Before we blindly copy the web, and the practices on it, we should consider ways to make something *better* than the web, and this goes way beyond the 3D-ness of VWs. The UGAIM++ collection made me stop and think about this.Crista
Frisby, Adam wrote: 

My understanding of the structure is the Rex system is closer to a decoupled system than the Hypergrid.

Hypergrid involves teleporting along known links – ie you teleport to a hypergrid region which connects you to other regions. The Rex model is closer to a web browser, where you move along via URL-equivilents, and it will disconnect/reconnect you from the current/next sims – sort of ala a more seamless Meerkat. 

The Rex auth server basically acts as an identity broker – when you request access to a sim on a different network (“grid”-ish), you get authorised by your auth server. Your auth server acts very similarly to the OGP Agent Domain, in that it is responsible for routing messages to you, assigning sessions, etc.

At risk of using outlook’s HTML here, allow me to draw a diagram...

This diagram shows a user logging into the first sim, then teleporting to a second sim on another network. AuthAlpha.com isn’t prescribed anywhere on any sims – they don’t know it exists until a user attempts to login, in which case it is contacted and asked to cough up some info about the user.

The rex server operates under two modes here, you can either lock to particular pre-authorised auth servers (the OGP ‘internal network’ use case – ie, corporate intranets, etc), or you can open up to any avatar on any auth server (public grids, etc).

Regards,

Adam

From: opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de [mailto:opensim-dev-bounces at lists.berlios.de] On Behalf Of Cristina Videira LopesSent: Monday, 8 December 2008 9:37 AMTo: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.deSubject: Re: [Opensim-dev] rex auth & avatar systems (Re: future rexviewer merger)

To be precise, the comparison is not really between the hypergrid and Rex's avatar server; it's about comparing Rex's avatar server with OpenSim's User+Asset+Inventory trio. The hypergrid is simply adding the capability of region servers interacting with several of those trios instead of just one.So, the unclear spot, really, is why Rex felt the need to substitute UAI with something else. Charles Krinke wrote: 

I'm sorry. This is an OpenSim discussion channel. So, we are interested in what OpenSim is doing and where we are going.We have two different teleporting methods in OpenSim already. One is the AWG/OGP which allows teleporting from the LL betagrid to an OpenSim region. The other is the "HyperGrid", which allows teleporting between OpenSim grids or regions.We certainly can consider a third, and that certainly could be Rex. Or, certain Rex features may be added to the existing two interop technologies we already support.So, with that in mind, lets move forward and discuss the technical details of how the Rex technology works and how some or all of it is appropriate to add to OpenSim.Charles

From: Lc <lcc1967 at gmail.com>To: opensim-dev at lists.berlios.deSent: Monday, December 8, 2008 9:11:05 AMSubject: Re: [Opensim-dev] rex auth & avatar systems (Re: future rexviewer merger)"Rex avatar server was out and TPing from SL to a Rex grid was donebefore LL made the gridnaughts. The Rex group is ahead of the curve.It probably will not hard for them to retool and go backwards to becompatible with others are doing. But you have to remember that Rexserver is really the leader, the others are just following and notacknowledging the work that has been done already."Please don't speak in the name of ReX pple particularly when you don't know what you are talking about.Sm 

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