Chat log from the meeting on 2012-08-14

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[2012/08/14 11:03]  Bri Hasp: reading... no shit OsGrid is 5 now?
 
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Bri Hasp: reading... no shit OsGrid is 5 now?
 
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Sarah Kline: Hi Justin
 
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Sarah Kline: Hi Justin

Revision as of 17:24, 21 August 2012

[2012/08/14 11:03]  Bri Hasp: reading... no shit OsGrid is 5 now?
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Sarah Kline: Hi Justin
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Andrew Hellershanks: Don't know what is different between Imprudence and Sinularity but I may be switching viewers.
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Richardus Raymaker: bri, huh ?
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Bri Hasp: where did the years go
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi sarah, folks
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Richardus Raymaker: Andrew, singularity shows mesh
[2012/08/14 11:04]  dan banner: hey justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Richardus Raymaker: hi justin.
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Bri Hasp: Hiya Justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, a definite bonus
[2012/08/14 11:04]  dan banner: hey robert
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: there is a thread on the mailing list about banned viewers
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Robert
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: seems like they dont' like V3 viewers?
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Robert Adams: hello all
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: Ya i saw that BlueWall
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Robert
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Bri Hasp: SL ?
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: it appears Akira did not realize you actually have to change your OpenSim.ini
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: to make those viewers work
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Andrew Hellershanks: Not a problem I am mostly happy with the SL V3 viewer for SL use.
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Richardus Raymaker: Yes. keeps upsetting me. but still keep reading.. nebadon proof ed already its not with opensim
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Bri Hasp: yep thats what I use now
[2012/08/14 11:05]  dan banner: i told her about the changes
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Richardus Raymaker: im happy when i can dump sl1
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Andrew Hellershanks: I customized the buttons across the bottom of the screen so that helped.
[2012/08/14 11:05]  BlueWall Slade: the OSG5B sim held up for hours with a capacity crowd
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Bri Hasp: nice
[2012/08/14 11:06]  BlueWall Slade: all kinds of viewers
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Richardus Raymaker: i know blue
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Andrew Hellershanks: I stil have some friends in SL and a small copule of stores so I still go to SL once in a while.
[2012/08/14 11:06]  dan banner: and scripts enabled
[2012/08/14 11:06]  BlueWall Slade: time for people to give up their tin-foil hats
[2012/08/14 11:06]  dan banner: yup
[2012/08/14 11:06]  BlueWall Slade: 0.0
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Richardus Raymaker: only question that remain is whats the difference between both servers ?
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: ya what kind of upsets me a bit, is they will take the time to figure out how to ban viewers
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: but not actually look into why it wasnt working in the first place
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Richardus Raymaker: i think lots of problems you can point back to network related
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: it actually would have taken less time to fix the problem
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: than figure out what viewers to ba
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: ban*
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Andrew Hellershanks: D'oh. I missed the OSG birthday again
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: oh well
[2012/08/14 11:07]  BlueWall Slade: I considered making a patch to ban regions from connecting to the grid if they ban certain viewerers, lol
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: the Birthday Sims are still up
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: though i did hear some people took down their displays
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Bri Hasp: I had a great time at #1
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: just search for OSG5B
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: on the map
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: you can see the regions and displays that are still up
[2012/08/14 11:08]  BlueWall Slade: I tell you, the things there were all impressive
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, ok thanks. Been busy the last couple days doing a major OS installation upgrade.
[2012/08/14 11:08]  BlueWall Slade: beat the daylights out of anything I saw in the SL birthday
[2012/08/14 11:08]  dan banner: the particle show spoiled me
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Andrew Hellershanks: Still have one machine that isn't running the monitoring process properly but its all up and running again.
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Bri Hasp: ty will TP later and check them out
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: mnebadon are this pillows linked or just seperate pirms
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: hmm not linked, ok
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: seperate Richardus
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: becuase of that bug
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: when in mouse look
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: that explains why camera works fine
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: also a bug when you stand
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: from a linkset
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: you dont stand up where you should
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: so for now i keep all the chairs unlinked
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: the linkset camera bug can start to get a problem
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: even on Lbsa Plaza too
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Sarah Kline: HI Robert
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Robert Adams: howdy, Sarah
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: Just a heads up to everyone, there is a new Zen viewer out
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: i just updated before meeting
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Sarah Kline: Hows Bullet )
[2012/08/14 11:10]  BlueWall Slade: Hi VivK - Dashlia
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: and to my surprise the Animated texture bug in the viewer seems fixed
[2012/08/14 11:11]  BlueWall Slade: Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Dahlia Trimble: hi
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: the fireplace no longer looks all screwed up here
[2012/08/14 11:11]  VivK Lowlag: yes and the shadows in it are even more amazing
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:11]  VivK Lowlag: hi Blue
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Bri Hasp: is Diva's D2 in current use?
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Master Dubrovna: Hi everyone
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Dahlia Trimble: Justini is bacl :)
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Robert Adams: coming along.... still working on vehicles and linksets
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Andrew Hellershanks: hey, justin
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Dahlia Trimble: back
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: I am back from my retreat :)
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: catching up with e-mail and the rest now
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Sarah Kline: great
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Bri Hasp: welcome back
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Robert Adams: BulletSim now has an entry to select it in mantis you feel free to add bugs :-)
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Andrew Hellershanks: There are so many viewers out for OS/SL these days that it gets hard to keep up with all of them.
[2012/08/14 11:12]  BlueWall Slade: Did you get to relax Justin?
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Sarah Kline: how would mesh ones work...presumably no prop with linkset
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Sarah Kline: oks
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: yes, thuogh it's hard to come back now :)
[2012/08/14 11:12]  BlueWall Slade: Haaa
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Bri Hasp: seems fewer now to me
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Bri Hasp: so many great viewers are gone
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Robert Adams: anything the meshmerizer will mesh, BulletSim will physicalize
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Bri Hasp: 'or not used
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Richardus Raymaker: oh cool. i go update zen later
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Dahlia Trimble: all rested and 5 kilos heavier? ;)
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Sarah Kline: k
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: Yes! I decided to take a gym break too
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Dahlia Trimble: oops
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Justin Clark-Casey: hopefully that's reversible...
[2012/08/14 11:14]  Dahlia Trimble: only with pain and sweat
[2012/08/14 11:14]  Bri Hasp: well I'll load a D2 for sailboat work and see
[2012/08/14 11:14]  Bri Hasp: was a super project a year ago
[2012/08/14 11:15]  Richardus Raymaker: hope you can swim :)
[2012/08/14 11:15]  Bri Hasp: after playing with vehicles for 4 years I better know how to sink
[2012/08/14 11:15]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah vehicles are a continuing issue
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Nebadon Izumi: i just updated OSgrid download page for new version of Zen viewer
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Justin Clark-Casey: but I know robert is doing work on them in bullet :)
[2012/08/14 11:16]  dan banner: cool
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Nebadon Izumi: ya hopefully vehicles will improve in Bullet
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Bri Hasp: yep.. it's the physics engine that torked us
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Richardus Raymaker: i now have a pretty smooth now phyical movement :O verhicles gave me to many accidents and headaces. lol
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: I think it is possible to make it work with ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: problem is not many people understand it
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Robert Adams: hopefully get all the vehicle types working
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Justin Clark-Casey: Yes, I think so too
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: and pretty much no one is working on ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: thats the only real problem with ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2012/08/14 11:17]  BlueWall Slade: you know we had scripted prims crossing region boundaries in around 0.6.7 or so?
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Justin Clark-Casey: I just haven't had the time to extend my understanding for these issues. It's not just ODE but I need to understand more about bassic trig, etc.
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Bri Hasp: no dev on physics?
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: not on ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Justin Clark-Casey: so if Robert can get things working in bullet in the future it's possible we could just switch default physics engines
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Richardus Raymaker: are there not a view university classes that can jump in the ode stuff :O
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Bri Hasp: yes we did bluewall
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: Robert is working on Bulletsim now
[2012/08/14 11:18]  BlueWall Slade: I wonder what happend to change that?
[2012/08/14 11:18]  BlueWall Slade: Anyone know?
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: I think its a setting BlueWall
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Justin Clark-Casey: I thought scripted prims were still crossing boundaries?
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: its not safe to have that enabled i dont think
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: in OSgrid
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Bri Hasp: Diva made some changes and we could sail across the line for almost a week
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Justin Clark-Casey: there is a setting to push the actual binary code but that is a very danagerous setting on anyt open grid
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: in a private grid its more doable
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Bri Hasp: then mega happened and we didn't care
[2012/08/14 11:19]  BlueWall Slade: I think it doesn't work now
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Nas Messing: HI guys
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Nas Messing: and lady
[2012/08/14 11:19]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Nas
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Nebadon Izumi: ya not sure BlueWall, i actually never used it
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Justin Clark-Casey: It might also be a dangrerous setting for a hypergrid region
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Andrew Hellershanks: Hey, Nas
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi nas
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Bri Hasp: I know it doesn't
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: I am guessing that doesnt work over HG
[2012/08/14 11:20]  BlueWall Slade: yeah - not talking about attachments keeping state, etc. - I'm talking about prims moving themselves around
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Bri Hasp: I made a YouTube.. was callled the HG Sailor...went around with a boat
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Richardus Raymaker: still like to see more with megaregions... offcorse thats viewerside a bit painfull maby
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: well even if we did get scripts crossing the borders
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: physics does not
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Richardus Raymaker: Bri, its not a mega ?
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Bri Hasp: nope
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nas Messing: HI Neb
[2012/08/14 11:20]  BlueWall Slade: yeah, it was non-phys movement
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Bri Hasp: can't be done now
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: in SL physics settings get stored in a prim property I beleive
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: like velocity etc..
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: I think i remember Melanie saying that
[2012/08/14 11:21]  BlueWall Slade: that SL train script uses non-phys movement
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: ah ya non phys should work
[2012/08/14 11:21]  BlueWall Slade: they don't
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: but like Justin said, you dont actually want to be passing the binaries
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Justin Clark-Casey: that's a bug :)
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: its very unsafe
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Justin Clark-Casey: in that case
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Bri Hasp: Kitty Flora had a train semi working here
[2012/08/14 11:21]  BlueWall Slade: they wrap (if they run at all) and come across at the other side
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, allwoing random people to execute binary code on your system is kindof a security risk
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Robert Adams: there are a lot of new physics properties... it looks like you can not specify the type of physics representation per prim
[2012/08/14 11:22]  BlueWall Slade: I have it all on here - doens't work anymore
[2012/08/14 11:22]  BlueWall Slade: in my dev grid
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: there are ways to cheat non physical stuff crossing teh border
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Bri Hasp: but that was all hacks and Kitty mods
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Robert Adams: does anyone know if that stuff is getting added to libomv and/or OpenSim?
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: the way I have seen people do it here on OSgrid
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: is tehy have a controller prim in each sim
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: once the object crossed the border
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Andrew Hellershanks: Is anyone looking any further at the problem with vertical velocity on prims?
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: the controller prim in the sim it entered took over
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: the scripts were not actually in the train
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: the train just listens
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: for commands
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Justin Clark-Casey: robert: I don't know - I'm not aware of what the new properties are
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Bri Hasp: aha
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: each sim has its own controller module
[2012/08/14 11:23]  dan banner: seen tour ballons like that too
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: if you want the train to house the entire script
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: that gets a lot more tricky
[2012/08/14 11:24]  BlueWall Slade: no, this is different
[2012/08/14 11:24]  BlueWall Slade: 1 sec, will paste a script
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Neovo Geesink: Is that why vehicles planes and balloons cannot cross a SIM border?
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: there are several reasons Neovo
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nas Messing: Doeas anyone know that start home region dont work
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Dahlia Trimble: Robert I had a way to have phantom and non-phantom in linksets a while back but I think it may have been subsequently "corrected"
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: the biggest reason is we do not pass physics data on objects from sim to sim
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Richardus Raymaker: how you want to pass sitting people with control prims to new sim ?
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Bri Hasp: yes Neb
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Nebadon Izumi: even if we do get scripts working right, physical vehicles will still not work over border
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Andrew Hellershanks: I talked to the person that did the tour vehicles in SL and they used impulses
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Robert Adams: do you want that feature, dahlia?
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Dahlia Trimble: its a feature in SL now
[2012/08/14 11:25]  BlueWall Slade: http://pastebin.com/QW85HuXq
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Dahlia Trimble: it wasnt when I added it
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Robert Adams: it should be easy to do once I get the collision flags cleaned up (volume detect is such a kludge)
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Richardus Raymaker: i know more simulators work better then 1 mega full of prims. both have its good and bad sides
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Richardus Raymaker: i wish collisions worked with llSetPos style prims to
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Dahlia Trimble: I used the same logic that makes flexible prims in a linkset phantom
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Hiro Protagonist: Last I heard from Melanie_T, she actually had vehicles working intersim, and said there were some things she needed to clean up but that it's in the pipeline
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Richardus Raymaker: you mean more regions on 1 simulator hiro ?
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Bri Hasp: really ? James
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Arielle Popstar: you mean across region boundaries?
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Hiro Protagonist: Hiya Bri :D
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Bri Hasp: Mlanie hated vehicles for years
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: that's what she told me
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Neovo Geesink: In SL they had that with the SL9B event, but sometimes those tourpods went kapoffie across a SIM border, so it is still flaky.
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Bri Hasp: used to ask me why we like them
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: even if she hates 'em, she has to have them working to get feature parity
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: and she does at avination
[2012/08/14 11:29]  BlueWall Slade: they are supposed to work on Avn, yeah
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Bri Hasp: my point too
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: or so she's told me
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Robert Adams: she now has customers to keep happy
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Nebadon Izumi: Vehiles work pretty good on Avination is my understanding
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Arielle Popstar: Ubit had it working in opensim
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Dahlia Trimble: I thought the stuff Melanie was working in waw related to serialization, not necessarily physics
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Richardus Raymaker: oh bri, verhicles are cool. if the dont eat so much phyical time...
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: and I've no reasopn to doubt her
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Justin Clark-Casey: customers tend to conventrate the mind :)
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Nebadon Izumi: and i suspect eventually some of that stuff might end up in core
[2012/08/14 11:30]  BlueWall Slade: I think I heard that the scripts are SL compatible
[2012/08/14 11:30]  Hiro Protagonist: she told me six months, six month ago; she told me a few weeks ago she'd run into a few issues she had to work out, but its definitely on the way
[2012/08/14 11:30]  Bri Hasp: whats Mel using for Physics?
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Hiro Protagonist: ODE AFAIK
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Bri Hasp: Hmmm
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Neovo Geesink: Some.... Not all. A MediaPanel which works in SL is absolute inoperable here.
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Arielle Popstar: customized i think i heard
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Andrew Hellershanks: Was it the same person providing the SL9B tour vehicles as last year? They worked great last year.
[2012/08/14 11:31]  BlueWall Slade: SL crossings aren't so good atm
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Nebadon Izumi: I know Ubit is working for Avination now
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Dahlia Trimble: I think she has a modded ODE
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Justin Clark-Casey: neovo: a mediapanel?
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Justin Clark-Casey: neovo: using shared media/media on a prim?
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Neovo Geesink: I dont think. SL8B was a Linden event, and the SL9B event was not.
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Richardus Raymaker: Media On Prim is more viewer problem hgere
[2012/08/14 11:32]  BlueWall Slade: the train, using non-phys is ok, but lags at crossings. + sometimes you hit regions that aren't responsive.
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Bri Hasp: awww.. I love mop
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Nebadon Izumi: ya latency will be one of those issues we will probably not be able to fix
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Justin Clark-Casey: I haven't heard of any viewer problems with moap
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Bri Hasp: it's broken now?
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Justin Clark-Casey: but then I mainly have been using the official LL viewers
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Richardus Raymaker: Nothing can beat a megaregion. an di think that always stay the same.
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Neovo Geesink: Yes Justin. ASnyone can drag on textures pr photo's and it displayed it in the size of that Prim. Comes with slideshow commands and all.
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: moap works great from everything I've heard
[2012/08/14 11:33]  dan banner: 99% of the regions in AVN dont have neighbors?
[2012/08/14 11:33]  BlueWall Slade: it works with teapot
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: I have not a few clients making good use of it
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: Ya I am not sure either, to be honest I do not really like Moap
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: i have been sticking with the old media methods still
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Bri Hasp: it was working fine here a year ago
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: Dan, what's up with that surfable wave and surfboard amigo
[2012/08/14 11:33]  BlueWall Slade: you can make some cool user interfaces with it
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: I am sure it still works ok
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: this one: http://i.imgur.com/73IeZ.png
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Bri Hasp: needs a V2 + viewer
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Hiro Protagonist: yeah
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: found waves in osgrid
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: lol
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: there was one thing if I recall we had to do differently though
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: having to drag the URL from a web browser
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: or something
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Richardus Raymaker: oh dan, if you have a working surf wave. tell koni. i think she wants one for at least a year
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: sarah found them
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: its been so long since i used it though
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Hiro Protagonist: where are they?
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: lemme find the lm
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Bri Hasp: I had one... some kind soul dropped one in our old sailing mega
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Bri Hasp: I may have it in an oar
[2012/08/14 11:35]  dan banner: no rich, not me
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Hiro Protagonist: I'll be back
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Mike Kayaker: I got my non-physics based waves and surfboards working in OpenSim
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Bri Hasp: kk
[2012/08/14 11:36]  Sarah Kline: guy who made Dans one sells the stuff in SL
[2012/08/14 11:36]  Mike Kayaker: I could use something like llSetKeyframedMotion to make them move smoother though...
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Arielle Popstar: test
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Tiffany Magic: Thanks to Mike, we have an active surfing community in Virtual Highway.
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Justin Clark-Casey: any big issues been cropping up in the past week?
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Nebadon Izumi: anyone else have anything they wanted to talk about?
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Arielle Popstar: still here :)
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Tiffany Magic: Attachment points not sticking.
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Justin Clark-Casey: I'm amazed one can surf at all in OpenSim to be honest
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Nebadon Izumi: Dan Banner came across what seems to be a HG bug in standalones
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: what do you mean?
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Nebadon Izumi: rezzing inventory
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Mike Kayaker: I have an issue" Is llGiveInventoryList broken?
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Richardus Raymaker: well. think i have done my list :)
[2012/08/14 11:39]  dan banner: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6157
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: mike: it shouldnt' be
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Tiffany Magic: Justin... if you have shoes or hair and have to set them out to edit them, when you take them back into inventory and wear them, they rezz on your hand.
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: really need dvia to look at these issues
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Mike Kayaker: I already have a test script, I'll submit a mantis report.
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Nebadon Izumi: yes
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: I spoke to Diva yesterday
[2012/08/14 11:40]  dan banner: ya maybe next week sometime
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: she plans to be back around like next week
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: maybe this weekend
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Tiffany Magic: And things imported don't hold.
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: what version of opensim is this happening in?
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: has some papers she needs to wrap up this week
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: cool beans
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Tiffany Magic: 7.4
[2012/08/14 11:40]  BlueWall Slade: nice
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: tifffany: dev master or 0.7.4.rc1?
[2012/08/14 11:40]  BlueWall Slade: I thought she was hanging out with Jimmy Hoffa for a while
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Tiffany Magic: But, it's been happening... did in 7.1 also.
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, basically 0.7.4-post-fixes
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: mmmm, that sounds like an old bug then
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Tiffany Magic: 7.4rlc
[2012/08/14 11:41]  dan banner: thats always happened to me, rezzing an attachment on the ground loses the attachment point
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Andrew Hellershanks: I suppose that's the same as the RC now
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: I haven't noticed that issue myself - when I edit and rerez it came back to the right place
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: dan: that doesnt' surprise me but that would be a bug too
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Sarah Kline: Thats always been the way
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: which viewer do you see that with?
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Bri Hasp: same for me in Net
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Arielle Popstar: yes it has
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Tiffany Magic: All of them, Justin.
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: is there an open mantis for this?
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Arielle Popstar: have to reattach to proper spot
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Tiffany Magic: Imp... Firestorm... Singularity...
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Richardus Raymaker: I have seen that problem a few time sto justin.
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Bri Hasp: that would be a pain with some attachments
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Arielle Popstar: though it was that way by design
[2012/08/14 11:42]  dan banner: wb hiro
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Tiffany Magic: However... it is worse in 0.7.4rlc than it was in 0.7.1
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Hiro Protagonist: ty ty
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Justin Clark-Casey: I need a bug report in mantis for this
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: all your doing is rezzing it on the ground?
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Tiffany Magic: We could rezz shoes, as an example, change the texture, pick them up and wear them. They held position. Now they don't.
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: your not making any changes to it?
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Richardus Raymaker: Well if you rezz it you change it :O
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: oh, you're actually rezzing these things to the region?
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Arielle Popstar: oh never seen it do that in opensim
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: changing a linkset in anyway would reset attach points i suspect
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Bri Hasp: afk
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Sarah Kline: lol
[2012/08/14 11:43]  dan banner: yes
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Justin Clark-Casey: not just editing as attachments?
[2012/08/14 11:44]  dan banner: correct
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Sarah Kline: noo
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Tiffany Magic: Yes... set them on the ground to retexture and they don't attach to the right place when you pick them up.
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Richardus Raymaker: well justin, you know its dangerous to edit a wering prim set
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Richardus Raymaker: wearing ^
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Sarah Kline: same probably happens on LL grid
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: out of curiousity, why not edit them as attachments?
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Richardus Raymaker: The exploded in the past justin
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Sarah Kline: cos they explode lol
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Tiffany Magic: Editing when attached can cause all kinds of problems. Hit the root prim and it takes off to another region.
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Arielle Popstar: i edit lots of clothes and attachments while wearing them
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: That shoudl be better now - i know I fixed at least one bug in that area
[2012/08/14 11:45]  VivK Lowlag: alpha textures tend to explode while worn
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: yes that i have seen
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: but it's probably still the case that region rezzed items should retain their attachment point
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: when you edit an attachment your wearing
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Richardus Raymaker: lol VivK, but you know wwhen there's alpha when its to late
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: though that would probablyi require persistence........
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: it shoots way off the sim
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Sarah Kline: I lost a whole belt and was left wearing one prim bit )
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: never do that
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: still?
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Simulator Version v0.5: shouts: OpenSim 0.7.4 Dev          6ee17f5: 2012-07-26 21:39:53 -0400 (Unix/Mono)
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: when did you fix that
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: ?
[2012/08/14 11:46]  VivK Lowlag: lol
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Sarah Kline: )
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: recently-ish,. and probably with more fixes in the last month or so for the attachment persistence stuff
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Tiffany Magic: It is keeping large hair creators like Damselfly from coming to our grid.
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: I clo0sed off some race conditions in tha tarea
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Nebadon Izumi: lets find out
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Richardus Raymaker: Thats my experience with wearing things. only safe thing is chang position while wearing.
[2012/08/14 11:46]  BlueWall Slade: I checked it on my grid and it clears it
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Sarah Kline: hehe edit some hair too
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Tiffany Magic: They won't bring in hundreds of styles and colors and have to reset all the attachment points.
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany:: It may be relatively easy to preserve the attachment point wheilst the sim is up, but much more involved to persist it across restarts
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Tiffany Magic: However.... he can bring all his inventory into Avination with no problem. So, Melanie has done something on her grid to make it work.
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Richardus Raymaker: It would be nice if that get fixt.. understand you tiffany
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: hrmm
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: actually its not flying away
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: thats good
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: it was probably a little over a month ago
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: i last experienced it
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: on Lbsa Plaza
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: that Dance ball you made Dan
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: if it's occasional then it's hard to tell, but I did fix up some problems in this area to do with race conditions
[2012/08/14 11:48]  dan banner: oh ya
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: due to the fucked up way we store some data
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Richardus Raymaker: its only 4 prims nebadon. find soemthing with more
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: pardon my french
[2012/08/14 11:48]  dan banner: i always rezzed it in the region to edit it
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: rut roh
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: i changed a cube to a sphere
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: and it flew away
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: ah, ok
[2012/08/14 11:48]  dan banner: oops
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Tiffany Magic: We brought in linksets of 5 from SL... using Second Inventory... and the position held. Then tried linksets of about 150 because that's what hair is, and they didn't hold position.
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Richardus Raymaker: hee where did that go to
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Sarah Kline: no Neb
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: ya that sucker is gone
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: i cant even move anything now
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: this linkset is fubar
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: alright, good to know
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Arielle Popstar: i have been having problems with one of your race cars Neb
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Sarah Kline: over to you Justin lol
[2012/08/14 11:49]  dan banner: good think it wasnt your 2500L hair
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Arielle Popstar: had a couple diappear last night on the sandbox
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Richardus Raymaker: what happens arielle ?
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Andrew Hellershanks: SI creates a script that needs to run when the item is imported to set various properties. That may include the attachment point.
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: meh, unfortunatley this probably isn't something I'm going to get to fo r a while
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: can't say I am completely surprised Arielle
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Richardus Raymaker: ohh
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: but I may take a quick look at the attachment point stuff - really that should persist at least before region restart
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Sarah Kline: teasing
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: its probably up at 5 bajillion meters
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Arielle Popstar: it only rezzes in one of ubits releases
[2012/08/14 11:50]  dan banner: look in the db for 'object'
[2012/08/14 11:50]  dan banner: lol
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Richardus Raymaker: well nebadon proof why we rezz attachments :)
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: Ya
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Andrew Hellershanks: In my "spare time" (um... what is that again?) I can check the scripts created by SI during upload.
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: now
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: let me test something else
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: huh
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: rezzing it to the ground obliterates the attach point
[2012/08/14 11:51]  dan banner: goes to your hand
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: that doesnt seem right
[2012/08/14 11:52]  dan banner: thats always been like that afaik
[2012/08/14 11:52]  BlueWall Slade: it should keep that in the properties, I guess
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Arielle Popstar: been that way here as long as i can remember
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Richardus Raymaker: or it deletes the attachment point or it dont transfer it to the new object
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Nebadon Izumi: has anyone tested that in SL?
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Nebadon Izumi: it doesnt do same thing there right?
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: yes, there are threee points where SOG.ClearPartAttachmentData() is being called
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: In theory one could just comment thuose out and see if there are bad effects, but one needs to be careful since I know there are some ways that viewers will crash if they recieve bad attachment data
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Tiffany Magic: It doesn't do the same in SL, Nebadon.
[2012/08/14 11:53]  dan banner: actually in sl the attachement point is stored
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Neovo Geesink: In SL its the same.... IF i ever rezz an Object to Ground which I wore earlier, the next time I have to reset its attachment point, or it is going to one of my hands if I do not select an attachment point.
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Richardus Raymaker: Justin, do you know whats bad attachment data ?
[2012/08/14 11:53]  dan banner: no neovo
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: anything non-zero
[2012/08/14 11:53]  dan banner: i just tested
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Neovo Geesink: Oh, I got it several times...
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: I would guess the trick is to keep the attachment data without telling the viewre about it
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Andrew Hellershanks: what? rezzing an item to ground deletes attachment point? That's bizarre
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: which would be more complex then simply not clearing it
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Andrew Hellershanks: Isn't it a prim property?
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: not really - if viewers recieve attachmenbt data they're not expecting they can crash
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: e.g. an attachment poitn for an object that isn't actually attached
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Andrew Hellershanks: oh and we don't want that happening
[2012/08/14 11:54]  BlueWall Slade: it keeps it in SL
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: there has to be a better way to deal with that
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: the trick would probably be to keep that data without sending it to the viewer
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: then to destroy everything
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: yes
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: SOmething that would be nice to get fixed before official release of 074
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Richardus Raymaker: SO you need to remeber old uuid and new rezzed prim uuid. and when you take it back transfer attachment point. eep.
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew:: that's not going to happen as this is a very old bug
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: not a recent regression
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: SI rezzes items inworld during upload.
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: oh, well. One can always hope.
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: it's fixable but I don't think it's going to be a one (three) liner
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Tiffany Magic: How is Avination able to do it?
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Richardus Raymaker: does SI remeber atatchment point when you restore SI object ?
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Andrew Hellershanks: Tiffany, at least you now know what's happening. Fixing it is another issue.
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: I tested that the other day
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Justin Clark-Casey: as I said, it's doable but not a one-liner
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: and it did for me
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: but others say it doesnt
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Arielle Popstar: uncrippled viewers can send imported attachments back to the original point
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: my test was very basic
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: i made 5 cubes in SL
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: attached them to different places
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: put them all in a box
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: and transfered here with SI
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: probably not the best test
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Andrew Hellershanks: Might have been protected by being in a box?
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: I amazed SI still works
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: isn't it abandonware now?
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Dahlia Trimble: gtg, bye all :) *waves*
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: they stil sell it
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: bye dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Andrew Hellershanks: bye, Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok :)
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: and its still on the LL TPV list
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nas Messing: bye sweetie
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: but there has not been an update in years
[2012/08/14 11:57]  BlueWall Slade: bye Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Robert Adams: bye dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Sarah Kline: Bye Dahila
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: see you Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Richardus Raymaker: Thats what you call get sleeping rich ?
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, they tightened up the permissions checks in SI so that is why SL still accepts it in the grid.
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: that was the last update they did
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Tiffany Magic: Nebadon... did you talk to Melanie about how she does it in Avination?
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Sarah Kline: back in 2010
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Andrew Hellershanks: I have stuff backedup in SI that I can no longer (re)upload
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: right
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: though i think you can still upload that stuff into OpenSim
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Richardus Raymaker: ?? ANdrew ?
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: just not SL
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: my SI backup is huge
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Richardus Raymaker: Woulkd mean my SI havbe some stuff to. long time i looked into there
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: its like 3gb on my hard drive
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, I had SI backup some of my directories that had my stuff and stuff made by others. With the extra perms checks, I'm not creator so it won't reupload some of the items I had backed up.
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Sarah Kline: I think I've run out of resets
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, I need to pop off, thanks for the conversation folks
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Sarah Kline: bye Justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  dan banner: ok justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Nebadon Izumi: ok see you justin! thanks for coming
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Richardus Raymaker: i think that problem have many with old SI
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Mike Kayaker: bye all, back to RL
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Richardus Raymaker: bye justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: Justin Clark-Casey waves
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: Now we can start cracking the whip again on you, Justin :-)
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: oh man
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Arielle Popstar: ;)
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: hehe
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Sarah Kline: ))
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: Take care.
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Tiffany Magic: Nebadon?
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Arielle Popstar: vacation over
[2012/08/14 12:00]  BlueWall Slade: bye Justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: yea, welcome back.
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Bri Hasp: reading... no shit OsGrid is 5 now?
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Sarah Kline: Hi Justin
[2012/08/14 11:03]  Andrew Hellershanks: Don't know what is different between Imprudence and Sinularity but I may be switching viewers.
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Richardus Raymaker: bri, huh ?
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Bri Hasp: where did the years go
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi sarah, folks
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Richardus Raymaker: Andrew, singularity shows mesh
[2012/08/14 11:04]  dan banner: hey justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Richardus Raymaker: hi justin.
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Bri Hasp: Hiya Justin
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, a definite bonus
[2012/08/14 11:04]  dan banner: hey robert
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: there is a thread on the mailing list about banned viewers
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Robert
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: seems like they dont' like V3 viewers?
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Robert Adams: hello all
[2012/08/14 11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: Ya i saw that BlueWall
[2012/08/14 11:04]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Robert
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Bri Hasp: SL ?
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: it appears Akira did not realize you actually have to change your OpenSim.ini
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: to make those viewers work
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Andrew Hellershanks: Not a problem I am mostly happy with the SL V3 viewer for SL use.
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Richardus Raymaker: Yes. keeps upsetting me. but still keep reading.. nebadon proof ed already its not with opensim
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Bri Hasp: yep thats what I use now
[2012/08/14 11:05]  dan banner: i told her about the changes
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Richardus Raymaker: im happy when i can dump sl1
[2012/08/14 11:05]  Andrew Hellershanks: I customized the buttons across the bottom of the screen so that helped.
[2012/08/14 11:05]  BlueWall Slade: the OSG5B sim held up for hours with a capacity crowd
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Bri Hasp: nice
[2012/08/14 11:06]  BlueWall Slade: all kinds of viewers
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Richardus Raymaker: i know blue
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Andrew Hellershanks: I stil have some friends in SL and a small copule of stores so I still go to SL once in a while.
[2012/08/14 11:06]  dan banner: and scripts enabled
[2012/08/14 11:06]  BlueWall Slade: time for people to give up their tin-foil hats
[2012/08/14 11:06]  dan banner: yup
[2012/08/14 11:06]  BlueWall Slade: 0.0
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Richardus Raymaker: only question that remain is whats the difference between both servers ?
[2012/08/14 11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: ya what kind of upsets me a bit, is they will take the time to figure out how to ban viewers
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: but not actually look into why it wasnt working in the first place
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Richardus Raymaker: i think lots of problems you can point back to network related
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: it actually would have taken less time to fix the problem
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: than figure out what viewers to ba
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: ban*
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Andrew Hellershanks: D'oh. I missed the OSG birthday again
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: oh well
[2012/08/14 11:07]  BlueWall Slade: I considered making a patch to ban regions from connecting to the grid if they ban certain viewerers, lol
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: the Birthday Sims are still up
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: though i did hear some people took down their displays
[2012/08/14 11:07]  Bri Hasp: I had a great time at #1
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: just search for OSG5B
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: on the map
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: you can see the regions and displays that are still up
[2012/08/14 11:08]  BlueWall Slade: I tell you, the things there were all impressive
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, ok thanks. Been busy the last couple days doing a major OS installation upgrade.
[2012/08/14 11:08]  BlueWall Slade: beat the daylights out of anything I saw in the SL birthday
[2012/08/14 11:08]  dan banner: the particle show spoiled me
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Andrew Hellershanks: Still have one machine that isn't running the monitoring process properly but its all up and running again.
[2012/08/14 11:08]  Bri Hasp: ty will TP later and check them out
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: mnebadon are this pillows linked or just seperate pirms
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: hmm not linked, ok
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: seperate Richardus
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: becuase of that bug
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: when in mouse look
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: that explains why camera works fine
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: also a bug when you stand
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: from a linkset
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: you dont stand up where you should
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: so for now i keep all the chairs unlinked
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Richardus Raymaker: the linkset camera bug can start to get a problem
[2012/08/14 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: even on Lbsa Plaza too
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Sarah Kline: HI Robert
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Robert Adams: howdy, Sarah
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: Just a heads up to everyone, there is a new Zen viewer out
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: i just updated before meeting
[2012/08/14 11:10]  Sarah Kline: Hows Bullet )
[2012/08/14 11:10]  BlueWall Slade: Hi VivK - Dashlia
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: and to my surprise the Animated texture bug in the viewer seems fixed
[2012/08/14 11:11]  BlueWall Slade: Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Dahlia Trimble: hi
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: the fireplace no longer looks all screwed up here
[2012/08/14 11:11]  VivK Lowlag: yes and the shadows in it are even more amazing
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:11]  VivK Lowlag: hi Blue
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Bri Hasp: is Diva's D2 in current use?
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Master Dubrovna: Hi everyone
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Dahlia Trimble: Justini is bacl :)
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Robert Adams: coming along.... still working on vehicles and linksets
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Andrew Hellershanks: hey, justin
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Dahlia Trimble: back
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: I am back from my retreat :)
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: catching up with e-mail and the rest now
[2012/08/14 11:11]  Sarah Kline: great
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Bri Hasp: welcome back
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Robert Adams: BulletSim now has an entry to select it in mantis you feel free to add bugs :-)
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Andrew Hellershanks: There are so many viewers out for OS/SL these days that it gets hard to keep up with all of them.
[2012/08/14 11:12]  BlueWall Slade: Did you get to relax Justin?
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Sarah Kline: how would mesh ones work...presumably no prop with linkset
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Sarah Kline: oks
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: yes, thuogh it's hard to come back now :)
[2012/08/14 11:12]  BlueWall Slade: Haaa
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Bri Hasp: seems fewer now to me
[2012/08/14 11:12]  Bri Hasp: so many great viewers are gone
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Robert Adams: anything the meshmerizer will mesh, BulletSim will physicalize
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Bri Hasp: 'or not used
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Richardus Raymaker: oh cool. i go update zen later
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Dahlia Trimble: all rested and 5 kilos heavier? ;)
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Sarah Kline: k
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: Yes! I decided to take a gym break too
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Dahlia Trimble: oops
[2012/08/14 11:13]  Justin Clark-Casey: hopefully that's reversible...
[2012/08/14 11:14]  Dahlia Trimble: only with pain and sweat
[2012/08/14 11:14]  Bri Hasp: well I'll load a D2 for sailboat work and see
[2012/08/14 11:14]  Bri Hasp: was a super project a year ago
[2012/08/14 11:15]  Richardus Raymaker: hope you can swim :)
[2012/08/14 11:15]  Bri Hasp: after playing with vehicles for 4 years I better know how to sink
[2012/08/14 11:15]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah vehicles are a continuing issue
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Nebadon Izumi: i just updated OSgrid download page for new version of Zen viewer
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Justin Clark-Casey: but I know robert is doing work on them in bullet :)
[2012/08/14 11:16]  dan banner: cool
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Nebadon Izumi: ya hopefully vehicles will improve in Bullet
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Bri Hasp: yep.. it's the physics engine that torked us
[2012/08/14 11:16]  Richardus Raymaker: i now have a pretty smooth now phyical movement :O verhicles gave me to many accidents and headaces. lol
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: I think it is possible to make it work with ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: problem is not many people understand it
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Robert Adams: hopefully get all the vehicle types working
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Justin Clark-Casey: Yes, I think so too
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: and pretty much no one is working on ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: thats the only real problem with ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2012/08/14 11:17]  BlueWall Slade: you know we had scripted prims crossing region boundaries in around 0.6.7 or so?
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Justin Clark-Casey: I just haven't had the time to extend my understanding for these issues. It's not just ODE but I need to understand more about bassic trig, etc.
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Bri Hasp: no dev on physics?
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Nebadon Izumi: not on ODE
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Justin Clark-Casey: so if Robert can get things working in bullet in the future it's possible we could just switch default physics engines
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Richardus Raymaker: are there not a view university classes that can jump in the ode stuff :O
[2012/08/14 11:17]  Bri Hasp: yes we did bluewall
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: Robert is working on Bulletsim now
[2012/08/14 11:18]  BlueWall Slade: I wonder what happend to change that?
[2012/08/14 11:18]  BlueWall Slade: Anyone know?
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: I think its a setting BlueWall
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Justin Clark-Casey: I thought scripted prims were still crossing boundaries?
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: its not safe to have that enabled i dont think
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: in OSgrid
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Bri Hasp: Diva made some changes and we could sail across the line for almost a week
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Justin Clark-Casey: there is a setting to push the actual binary code but that is a very danagerous setting on anyt open grid
[2012/08/14 11:18]  Nebadon Izumi: in a private grid its more doable
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Bri Hasp: then mega happened and we didn't care
[2012/08/14 11:19]  BlueWall Slade: I think it doesn't work now
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Nas Messing: HI guys
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Nas Messing: and lady
[2012/08/14 11:19]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Nas
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Nebadon Izumi: ya not sure BlueWall, i actually never used it
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Justin Clark-Casey: It might also be a dangrerous setting for a hypergrid region
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Andrew Hellershanks: Hey, Nas
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi nas
[2012/08/14 11:19]  Bri Hasp: I know it doesn't
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: I am guessing that doesnt work over HG
[2012/08/14 11:20]  BlueWall Slade: yeah - not talking about attachments keeping state, etc. - I'm talking about prims moving themselves around
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Bri Hasp: I made a YouTube.. was callled the HG Sailor...went around with a boat
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Richardus Raymaker: still like to see more with megaregions... offcorse thats viewerside a bit painfull maby
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: well even if we did get scripts crossing the borders
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: physics does not
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Richardus Raymaker: Bri, its not a mega ?
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Bri Hasp: nope
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nas Messing: HI Neb
[2012/08/14 11:20]  BlueWall Slade: yeah, it was non-phys movement
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Bri Hasp: can't be done now
[2012/08/14 11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: in SL physics settings get stored in a prim property I beleive
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: like velocity etc..
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: I think i remember Melanie saying that
[2012/08/14 11:21]  BlueWall Slade: that SL train script uses non-phys movement
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: ah ya non phys should work
[2012/08/14 11:21]  BlueWall Slade: they don't
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: but like Justin said, you dont actually want to be passing the binaries
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Justin Clark-Casey: that's a bug :)
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: its very unsafe
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Justin Clark-Casey: in that case
[2012/08/14 11:21]  Bri Hasp: Kitty Flora had a train semi working here
[2012/08/14 11:21]  BlueWall Slade: they wrap (if they run at all) and come across at the other side
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, allwoing random people to execute binary code on your system is kindof a security risk
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Robert Adams: there are a lot of new physics properties... it looks like you can not specify the type of physics representation per prim
[2012/08/14 11:22]  BlueWall Slade: I have it all on here - doens't work anymore
[2012/08/14 11:22]  BlueWall Slade: in my dev grid
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: there are ways to cheat non physical stuff crossing teh border
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Bri Hasp: but that was all hacks and Kitty mods
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Robert Adams: does anyone know if that stuff is getting added to libomv and/or OpenSim?
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: the way I have seen people do it here on OSgrid
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: is tehy have a controller prim in each sim
[2012/08/14 11:22]  Nebadon Izumi: once the object crossed the border
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Andrew Hellershanks: Is anyone looking any further at the problem with vertical velocity on prims?
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: the controller prim in the sim it entered took over
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: the scripts were not actually in the train
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: the train just listens
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: for commands
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Justin Clark-Casey: robert: I don't know - I'm not aware of what the new properties are
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Bri Hasp: aha
[2012/08/14 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: each sim has its own controller module
[2012/08/14 11:23]  dan banner: seen tour ballons like that too
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: if you want the train to house the entire script
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: that gets a lot more tricky
[2012/08/14 11:24]  BlueWall Slade: no, this is different
[2012/08/14 11:24]  BlueWall Slade: 1 sec, will paste a script
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Neovo Geesink: Is that why vehicles planes and balloons cannot cross a SIM border?
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: there are several reasons Neovo
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nas Messing: Doeas anyone know that start home region dont work
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Dahlia Trimble: Robert I had a way to have phantom and non-phantom in linksets a while back but I think it may have been subsequently "corrected"
[2012/08/14 11:24]  Nebadon Izumi: the biggest reason is we do not pass physics data on objects from sim to sim
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Richardus Raymaker: how you want to pass sitting people with control prims to new sim ?
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Bri Hasp: yes Neb
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Nebadon Izumi: even if we do get scripts working right, physical vehicles will still not work over border
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Andrew Hellershanks: I talked to the person that did the tour vehicles in SL and they used impulses
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Robert Adams: do you want that feature, dahlia?
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Dahlia Trimble: its a feature in SL now
[2012/08/14 11:25]  BlueWall Slade: http://pastebin.com/QW85HuXq
[2012/08/14 11:25]  Dahlia Trimble: it wasnt when I added it
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Robert Adams: it should be easy to do once I get the collision flags cleaned up (volume detect is such a kludge)
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Richardus Raymaker: i know more simulators work better then 1 mega full of prims. both have its good and bad sides
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Richardus Raymaker: i wish collisions worked with llSetPos style prims to
[2012/08/14 11:27]  Dahlia Trimble: I used the same logic that makes flexible prims in a linkset phantom
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Hiro Protagonist: Last I heard from Melanie_T, she actually had vehicles working intersim, and said there were some things she needed to clean up but that it's in the pipeline
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Richardus Raymaker: you mean more regions on 1 simulator hiro ?
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Bri Hasp: really ? James
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Arielle Popstar: you mean across region boundaries?
[2012/08/14 11:28]  Hiro Protagonist: Hiya Bri :D
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Bri Hasp: Mlanie hated vehicles for years
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: that's what she told me
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Neovo Geesink: In SL they had that with the SL9B event, but sometimes those tourpods went kapoffie across a SIM border, so it is still flaky.
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Bri Hasp: used to ask me why we like them
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: even if she hates 'em, she has to have them working to get feature parity
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: and she does at avination
[2012/08/14 11:29]  BlueWall Slade: they are supposed to work on Avn, yeah
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Bri Hasp: my point too
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: or so she's told me
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Robert Adams: she now has customers to keep happy
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Nebadon Izumi: Vehiles work pretty good on Avination is my understanding
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Arielle Popstar: Ubit had it working in opensim
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Dahlia Trimble: I thought the stuff Melanie was working in waw related to serialization, not necessarily physics
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Richardus Raymaker: oh bri, verhicles are cool. if the dont eat so much phyical time...
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Hiro Protagonist: and I've no reasopn to doubt her
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Justin Clark-Casey: customers tend to conventrate the mind :)
[2012/08/14 11:29]  Nebadon Izumi: and i suspect eventually some of that stuff might end up in core
[2012/08/14 11:30]  BlueWall Slade: I think I heard that the scripts are SL compatible
[2012/08/14 11:30]  Hiro Protagonist: she told me six months, six month ago; she told me a few weeks ago she'd run into a few issues she had to work out, but its definitely on the way
[2012/08/14 11:30]  Bri Hasp: whats Mel using for Physics?
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Hiro Protagonist: ODE AFAIK
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Bri Hasp: Hmmm
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Neovo Geesink: Some.... Not all. A MediaPanel which works in SL is absolute inoperable here.
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Arielle Popstar: customized i think i heard
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Andrew Hellershanks: Was it the same person providing the SL9B tour vehicles as last year? They worked great last year.
[2012/08/14 11:31]  BlueWall Slade: SL crossings aren't so good atm
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Nebadon Izumi: I know Ubit is working for Avination now
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Dahlia Trimble: I think she has a modded ODE
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Justin Clark-Casey: neovo: a mediapanel?
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Justin Clark-Casey: neovo: using shared media/media on a prim?
[2012/08/14 11:31]  Neovo Geesink: I dont think. SL8B was a Linden event, and the SL9B event was not.
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Richardus Raymaker: Media On Prim is more viewer problem hgere
[2012/08/14 11:32]  BlueWall Slade: the train, using non-phys is ok, but lags at crossings. + sometimes you hit regions that aren't responsive.
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Bri Hasp: awww.. I love mop
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Nebadon Izumi: ya latency will be one of those issues we will probably not be able to fix
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Justin Clark-Casey: I haven't heard of any viewer problems with moap
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Bri Hasp: it's broken now?
[2012/08/14 11:32]  Justin Clark-Casey: but then I mainly have been using the official LL viewers
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Richardus Raymaker: Nothing can beat a megaregion. an di think that always stay the same.
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Neovo Geesink: Yes Justin. ASnyone can drag on textures pr photo's and it displayed it in the size of that Prim. Comes with slideshow commands and all.
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: moap works great from everything I've heard
[2012/08/14 11:33]  dan banner: 99% of the regions in AVN dont have neighbors?
[2012/08/14 11:33]  BlueWall Slade: it works with teapot
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: I have not a few clients making good use of it
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: Ya I am not sure either, to be honest I do not really like Moap
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: i have been sticking with the old media methods still
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Bri Hasp: it was working fine here a year ago
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: Dan, what's up with that surfable wave and surfboard amigo
[2012/08/14 11:33]  BlueWall Slade: you can make some cool user interfaces with it
[2012/08/14 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: I am sure it still works ok
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: this one: http://i.imgur.com/73IeZ.png
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Bri Hasp: needs a V2 + viewer
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Hiro Protagonist: yeah
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: found waves in osgrid
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: lol
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: there was one thing if I recall we had to do differently though
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: having to drag the URL from a web browser
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: or something
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Richardus Raymaker: oh dan, if you have a working surf wave. tell koni. i think she wants one for at least a year
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: sarah found them
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Nebadon Izumi: its been so long since i used it though
[2012/08/14 11:34]  Hiro Protagonist: where are they?
[2012/08/14 11:34]  dan banner: lemme find the lm
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Bri Hasp: I had one... some kind soul dropped one in our old sailing mega
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Bri Hasp: I may have it in an oar
[2012/08/14 11:35]  dan banner: no rich, not me
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Hiro Protagonist: I'll be back
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Mike Kayaker: I got my non-physics based waves and surfboards working in OpenSim
[2012/08/14 11:35]  Bri Hasp: kk
[2012/08/14 11:36]  Sarah Kline: guy who made Dans one sells the stuff in SL
[2012/08/14 11:36]  Mike Kayaker: I could use something like llSetKeyframedMotion to make them move smoother though...
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Arielle Popstar: test
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Tiffany Magic: Thanks to Mike, we have an active surfing community in Virtual Highway.
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Justin Clark-Casey: any big issues been cropping up in the past week?
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Nebadon Izumi: anyone else have anything they wanted to talk about?
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Arielle Popstar: still here :)
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Tiffany Magic: Attachment points not sticking.
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Justin Clark-Casey: I'm amazed one can surf at all in OpenSim to be honest
[2012/08/14 11:38]  Nebadon Izumi: Dan Banner came across what seems to be a HG bug in standalones
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: what do you mean?
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Nebadon Izumi: rezzing inventory
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Mike Kayaker: I have an issue" Is llGiveInventoryList broken?
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Richardus Raymaker: well. think i have done my list :)
[2012/08/14 11:39]  dan banner: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6157
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: mike: it shouldnt' be
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Tiffany Magic: Justin... if you have shoes or hair and have to set them out to edit them, when you take them back into inventory and wear them, they rezz on your hand.
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: really need dvia to look at these issues
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Mike Kayaker: I already have a test script, I'll submit a mantis report.
[2012/08/14 11:39]  Nebadon Izumi: yes
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: I spoke to Diva yesterday
[2012/08/14 11:40]  dan banner: ya maybe next week sometime
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: she plans to be back around like next week
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: maybe this weekend
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Tiffany Magic: And things imported don't hold.
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: what version of opensim is this happening in?
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Nebadon Izumi: has some papers she needs to wrap up this week
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: cool beans
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Tiffany Magic: 7.4
[2012/08/14 11:40]  BlueWall Slade: nice
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: tifffany: dev master or 0.7.4.rc1?
[2012/08/14 11:40]  BlueWall Slade: I thought she was hanging out with Jimmy Hoffa for a while
[2012/08/14 11:40]  Tiffany Magic: But, it's been happening... did in 7.1 also.
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, basically 0.7.4-post-fixes
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: mmmm, that sounds like an old bug then
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Tiffany Magic: 7.4rlc
[2012/08/14 11:41]  dan banner: thats always happened to me, rezzing an attachment on the ground loses the attachment point
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Andrew Hellershanks: I suppose that's the same as the RC now
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: I haven't noticed that issue myself - when I edit and rerez it came back to the right place
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: dan: that doesnt' surprise me but that would be a bug too
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Sarah Kline: Thats always been the way
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: which viewer do you see that with?
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Bri Hasp: same for me in Net
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Arielle Popstar: yes it has
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Tiffany Magic: All of them, Justin.
[2012/08/14 11:41]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: is there an open mantis for this?
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Arielle Popstar: have to reattach to proper spot
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Tiffany Magic: Imp... Firestorm... Singularity...
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Richardus Raymaker: I have seen that problem a few time sto justin.
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Bri Hasp: that would be a pain with some attachments
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Arielle Popstar: though it was that way by design
[2012/08/14 11:42]  dan banner: wb hiro
[2012/08/14 11:42]  Tiffany Magic: However... it is worse in 0.7.4rlc than it was in 0.7.1
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Hiro Protagonist: ty ty
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Justin Clark-Casey: I need a bug report in mantis for this
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: all your doing is rezzing it on the ground?
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Tiffany Magic: We could rezz shoes, as an example, change the texture, pick them up and wear them. They held position. Now they don't.
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: your not making any changes to it?
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Richardus Raymaker: Well if you rezz it you change it :O
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: oh, you're actually rezzing these things to the region?
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Arielle Popstar: oh never seen it do that in opensim
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: changing a linkset in anyway would reset attach points i suspect
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Bri Hasp: afk
[2012/08/14 11:43]  Sarah Kline: lol
[2012/08/14 11:43]  dan banner: yes
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Justin Clark-Casey: not just editing as attachments?
[2012/08/14 11:44]  dan banner: correct
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Sarah Kline: noo
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Tiffany Magic: Yes... set them on the ground to retexture and they don't attach to the right place when you pick them up.
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Richardus Raymaker: well justin, you know its dangerous to edit a wering prim set
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Richardus Raymaker: wearing ^
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Sarah Kline: same probably happens on LL grid
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: out of curiousity, why not edit them as attachments?
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Richardus Raymaker: The exploded in the past justin
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Sarah Kline: cos they explode lol
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Tiffany Magic: Editing when attached can cause all kinds of problems. Hit the root prim and it takes off to another region.
[2012/08/14 11:44]  Arielle Popstar: i edit lots of clothes and attachments while wearing them
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: That shoudl be better now - i know I fixed at least one bug in that area
[2012/08/14 11:45]  VivK Lowlag: alpha textures tend to explode while worn
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: yes that i have seen
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: but it's probably still the case that region rezzed items should retain their attachment point
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: when you edit an attachment your wearing
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Richardus Raymaker: lol VivK, but you know wwhen there's alpha when its to late
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: though that would probablyi require persistence........
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: it shoots way off the sim
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Sarah Kline: I lost a whole belt and was left wearing one prim bit )
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: never do that
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: still?
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Simulator Version v0.5: shouts: OpenSim 0.7.4 Dev          6ee17f5: 2012-07-26 21:39:53 -0400 (Unix/Mono)
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: when did you fix that
[2012/08/14 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: ?
[2012/08/14 11:46]  VivK Lowlag: lol
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Sarah Kline: )
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: recently-ish,. and probably with more fixes in the last month or so for the attachment persistence stuff
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Tiffany Magic: It is keeping large hair creators like Damselfly from coming to our grid.
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: I clo0sed off some race conditions in tha tarea
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Nebadon Izumi: lets find out
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Richardus Raymaker: Thats my experience with wearing things. only safe thing is chang position while wearing.
[2012/08/14 11:46]  BlueWall Slade: I checked it on my grid and it clears it
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Sarah Kline: hehe edit some hair too
[2012/08/14 11:46]  Tiffany Magic: They won't bring in hundreds of styles and colors and have to reset all the attachment points.
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany:: It may be relatively easy to preserve the attachment point wheilst the sim is up, but much more involved to persist it across restarts
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Tiffany Magic: However.... he can bring all his inventory into Avination with no problem. So, Melanie has done something on her grid to make it work.
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Richardus Raymaker: It would be nice if that get fixt.. understand you tiffany
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: hrmm
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: actually its not flying away
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: thats good
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: it was probably a little over a month ago
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: i last experienced it
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: on Lbsa Plaza
[2012/08/14 11:47]  Nebadon Izumi: that Dance ball you made Dan
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: if it's occasional then it's hard to tell, but I did fix up some problems in this area to do with race conditions
[2012/08/14 11:48]  dan banner: oh ya
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: due to the fucked up way we store some data
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Richardus Raymaker: its only 4 prims nebadon. find soemthing with more
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: pardon my french
[2012/08/14 11:48]  dan banner: i always rezzed it in the region to edit it
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: rut roh
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: i changed a cube to a sphere
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: and it flew away
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: ah, ok
[2012/08/14 11:48]  dan banner: oops
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Tiffany Magic: We brought in linksets of 5 from SL... using Second Inventory... and the position held. Then tried linksets of about 150 because that's what hair is, and they didn't hold position.
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Richardus Raymaker: hee where did that go to
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Sarah Kline: no Neb
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: ya that sucker is gone
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2012/08/14 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: i cant even move anything now
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: this linkset is fubar
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: alright, good to know
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Arielle Popstar: i have been having problems with one of your race cars Neb
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Sarah Kline: over to you Justin lol
[2012/08/14 11:49]  dan banner: good think it wasnt your 2500L hair
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Arielle Popstar: had a couple diappear last night on the sandbox
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Richardus Raymaker: what happens arielle ?
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Andrew Hellershanks: SI creates a script that needs to run when the item is imported to set various properties. That may include the attachment point.
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: meh, unfortunatley this probably isn't something I'm going to get to fo r a while
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: can't say I am completely surprised Arielle
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Richardus Raymaker: ohh
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: but I may take a quick look at the attachment point stuff - really that should persist at least before region restart
[2012/08/14 11:49]  Sarah Kline: teasing
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: its probably up at 5 bajillion meters
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Arielle Popstar: it only rezzes in one of ubits releases
[2012/08/14 11:50]  dan banner: look in the db for 'object'
[2012/08/14 11:50]  dan banner: lol
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Richardus Raymaker: well nebadon proof why we rezz attachments :)
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: Ya
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Andrew Hellershanks: In my "spare time" (um... what is that again?) I can check the scripts created by SI during upload.
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: now
[2012/08/14 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: let me test something else
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: huh
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: rezzing it to the ground obliterates the attach point
[2012/08/14 11:51]  dan banner: goes to your hand
[2012/08/14 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: that doesnt seem right
[2012/08/14 11:52]  dan banner: thats always been like that afaik
[2012/08/14 11:52]  BlueWall Slade: it should keep that in the properties, I guess
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Arielle Popstar: been that way here as long as i can remember
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Richardus Raymaker: or it deletes the attachment point or it dont transfer it to the new object
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Nebadon Izumi: has anyone tested that in SL?
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Nebadon Izumi: it doesnt do same thing there right?
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: yes, there are threee points where SOG.ClearPartAttachmentData() is being called
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: In theory one could just comment thuose out and see if there are bad effects, but one needs to be careful since I know there are some ways that viewers will crash if they recieve bad attachment data
[2012/08/14 11:52]  Tiffany Magic: It doesn't do the same in SL, Nebadon.
[2012/08/14 11:53]  dan banner: actually in sl the attachement point is stored
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Neovo Geesink: In SL its the same.... IF i ever rezz an Object to Ground which I wore earlier, the next time I have to reset its attachment point, or it is going to one of my hands if I do not select an attachment point.
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Richardus Raymaker: Justin, do you know whats bad attachment data ?
[2012/08/14 11:53]  dan banner: no neovo
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: anything non-zero
[2012/08/14 11:53]  dan banner: i just tested
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Neovo Geesink: Oh, I got it several times...
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: I would guess the trick is to keep the attachment data without telling the viewre about it
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Andrew Hellershanks: what? rezzing an item to ground deletes attachment point? That's bizarre
[2012/08/14 11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: which would be more complex then simply not clearing it
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Andrew Hellershanks: Isn't it a prim property?
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: not really - if viewers recieve attachmenbt data they're not expecting they can crash
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: e.g. an attachment poitn for an object that isn't actually attached
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Andrew Hellershanks: oh and we don't want that happening
[2012/08/14 11:54]  BlueWall Slade: it keeps it in SL
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: there has to be a better way to deal with that
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: the trick would probably be to keep that data without sending it to the viewer
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: then to destroy everything
[2012/08/14 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: yes
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: SOmething that would be nice to get fixed before official release of 074
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Richardus Raymaker: SO you need to remeber old uuid and new rezzed prim uuid. and when you take it back transfer attachment point. eep.
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew:: that's not going to happen as this is a very old bug
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: not a recent regression
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: SI rezzes items inworld during upload.
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: oh, well. One can always hope.
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: it's fixable but I don't think it's going to be a one (three) liner
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Tiffany Magic: How is Avination able to do it?
[2012/08/14 11:55]  Richardus Raymaker: does SI remeber atatchment point when you restore SI object ?
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Andrew Hellershanks: Tiffany, at least you now know what's happening. Fixing it is another issue.
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: I tested that the other day
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Justin Clark-Casey: as I said, it's doable but not a one-liner
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: and it did for me
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: but others say it doesnt
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Arielle Popstar: uncrippled viewers can send imported attachments back to the original point
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: my test was very basic
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: i made 5 cubes in SL
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: attached them to different places
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: put them all in a box
[2012/08/14 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: and transfered here with SI
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: probably not the best test
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Andrew Hellershanks: Might have been protected by being in a box?
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: I amazed SI still works
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: isn't it abandonware now?
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Dahlia Trimble: gtg, bye all :) *waves*
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: they stil sell it
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: bye dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Andrew Hellershanks: bye, Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok :)
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: and its still on the LL TPV list
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nas Messing: bye sweetie
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: but there has not been an update in years
[2012/08/14 11:57]  BlueWall Slade: bye Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Robert Adams: bye dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Sarah Kline: Bye Dahila
[2012/08/14 11:57]  Nebadon Izumi: see you Dahlia
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Richardus Raymaker: Thats what you call get sleeping rich ?
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, they tightened up the permissions checks in SI so that is why SL still accepts it in the grid.
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: that was the last update they did
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Tiffany Magic: Nebadon... did you talk to Melanie about how she does it in Avination?
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Sarah Kline: back in 2010
[2012/08/14 11:58]  Andrew Hellershanks: I have stuff backedup in SI that I can no longer (re)upload
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: right
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: though i think you can still upload that stuff into OpenSim
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Richardus Raymaker: ?? ANdrew ?
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: just not SL
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: my SI backup is huge
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Richardus Raymaker: Woulkd mean my SI havbe some stuff to. long time i looked into there
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: its like 3gb on my hard drive
[2012/08/14 11:59]  Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, I had SI backup some of my directories that had my stuff and stuff made by others. With the extra perms checks, I'm not creator so it won't reupload some of the items I had backed up.
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Sarah Kline: I think I've run out of resets
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, I need to pop off, thanks for the conversation folks
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Sarah Kline: bye Justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  dan banner: ok justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Nebadon Izumi: ok see you justin! thanks for coming
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Richardus Raymaker: i think that problem have many with old SI
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Mike Kayaker: bye all, back to RL
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Richardus Raymaker: bye justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: Justin Clark-Casey waves
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: Now we can start cracking the whip again on you, Justin :-)
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: oh man
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Arielle Popstar: ;)
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: hehe
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Sarah Kline: ))
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: Take care.
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Tiffany Magic: Nebadon?
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Arielle Popstar: vacation over
[2012/08/14 12:00]  BlueWall Slade: bye Justin
[2012/08/14 12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: yea, welcome back.
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