OpenSimulator - User contributions [en]

User talk:DaveCoyle

2012-05-05T20:43:30Z

DaveCoyle:

== BIG thanks!!! ==

Thank you for upgrading the wiki. I think that it will help a lot in combatting spam, but also may add some functionality towards the user that will reflect well on us.

I will now go an play around a little, and see what's new :-))

Can we bother you in the future for other wiki-related updates/upgrades and such?

--[[User:Fritigern|Fritigern]] 00:41, 21 October 2011 (PDT)

== SRAS in performance page ==

Hi Dave, I'm a little surprised you removed the reference to SRAS in http://opensimulator.org/index.php?title=Performance&action=historysubmit&diff=29536&oldid=29533. My intention here was to mention a service that was more efficient than OpenSimulator's bundled asset service whilst still implementing the 'protocol' used by the default services. I might not have been very clear.

In either case, you're quite right to mention Simiangrid - I had completely forgotton about that. -- [[User:Justincc|Justincc]] 09:40, 10 April 2012 (PDT)

== foo ==

bar

Performance

2012-04-10T19:48:32Z

DaveCoyle: add SRAS back 'possible solutions' section

{{Quicklinks}}

= Introduction =
OpenSimulator performance is a very complex issue. Performance can be affected by any number of things, including the number of prims on a region, number of regions, number of avatars, network quality between server and viewer, network quality between simulator and grid services, etc.

We can break down a performance discussion into simulator issues (e.g. script performance, region database performance) and grid issues (chiefly scaling services such as asset, inventory, etc to serve more simulators and users).

= General Tips =

Where at all possible, don't assume something is a performance bottleneck, measure it! You might think your asset database is large, for example, but even large asset database seldom cause real issues.

It can be hard to perform measurement at the moment since not a lot of tools exist. However, one such is [[pCampbot]] which is bundled with OpenSimulator. This can instantiate a number of simultaneous libomv clients on a simulator that can take certain actions such as clicking things and bouncing aroud. Apects of it (e.g. appearance) are currently rather buggy and generate a lot of logging guff.

= Simulator =

== Hardware Requirements ==
Unfortunately, this is a very difficult question in light of all the factors mentioned in the introduction.

However, we can say that OpenSimulator does not run well when it only has access to a single CPU core - you should regard a dual-core machine as the minimum.

Below are some examples of hardware people use/have used. Please feel free to add to the list, or to add any reports to the performance studies and blog posts section. '''These are examples to help you in your selection, not recommendations.'''

Object Parts ~= # prim

Sensors and Timers are generally more intensive then regular scripts, so please specify quantity of each.

{| border="1"
!Description
!Operating System (please add Mono version if appropriate)
!OpenSimulator version
!RAM/AVG_USE_%
!CPU
!#/type of regions
!# simultaneous avs
!#scripts/timers/Sensors
!Location
!#objectparts
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Intrepid (8.10)
|Unknown
|540MB/?
|1x quad-core 2.5GHz Xeon (L5420)
|1 region + 9 voids
|generally 1-2
|few
|Knifejaw Atoll & surrounding on OSGrid
|?
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04)
|Unknown
|360MB/?
|2x dual-core 2.0GHz Xeon (5130)
|1 void
|generally 1-2
|none
|Knifejaw Road on OSGrid
|?
|-
|Dedicated Server from A+
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1 Meg
|1x single-core 2.8GHz Celeron
|2regions per server
|6 at once with no issues
|Waterfalls, texture anims, window texture switchers, lots of sound loops
|Pleasure Planet Welcome center & Region Pleasure Planet in OSGrid
|20000 prims per region
|-
|Amazon EC2 "high-CPU medium instance" (Xen VM)
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1.7GB
|1x dual-core 2.3GHz (Intel E5345)
|1 region with sailing race course
|7 avs, 4 in boats
|scripted start line
|Castle Rock, OSGrid
|
|-
|Dedicated Server from simhost.com
|SuSe 11.2 x64
|Unknown
|8gb / 50%
|4x Core2Quad Q9300 2.6ghz
|1 region (Wright Plaza) uses approx 4gb ram
|20-25 users
|Freebie Stores / Meeting Center / Video Theater
|@osgrid.org Heavy Use Sim
|17500 prims aprox 1500 scripts
|-
|Home machine
|Windows XP SP3
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|3GB / 15-40% incl. Opensim and MySQL
|4x Core2Quad Q6600 2.4 GHz. Use: generally, 0-10%
|11 regions
|1-6 users
|Many scripted objects (1934 scripts)
|[http://zonjacapalini.wordpress.com/2010/08/25/condensation-land-a-status-report/ Condensation Land]
|38,065 prims
|-
|Home machine
|Ubuntu Lucid 10.04 (32 bit pae)
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|160Mb no users, add 5Mb/user incl Opensim and MySQL
|I7-920 (dual threaded quad core), 3.8Ghz, 6Gb RAM, 0-10% Load
|4 regions (Diva default config)
|1-4 users (approx 20Kb/sec bandwidth/user)
|Few scripted objects (<10)
|[http://mars-simulator.hobby-site.org:9000/wifi Mars Simulation]- Based on [http://metatek.blogspot.com/2010/06/mars-simulation-for-distribution.html Erik Nauman's Open Blackboard]
|158 prims
|-
|Hosted Parallels Virtuozzo 4.5
|Win/Net (32 run)
|0.7.0.2 (D2)
|420Mb total, incl OS, Opensim and MySQL
|i7 Quad 950 (Bloomfield) 3.07GHz, 8 Core, 2Gb RAM, 0-2% Avg Load
|16 regions (4x4 mega-region)
|<6 users
|vehicle scripted objects (<5)
|[http://metaversesailing.com:9000/wifi Metaverse Sailing]
|<1000 prims
|-
|VPS
|Debian Lenny 5 (mono 2.4.2.3)
|OSgrid 0.7.1 (Dev) cd4d7a7: 2010-10-15
|655MB average out of 1722MB RAM, incl. MySQL
|Intel Quadcore 2.5 Ghz (1 core assigned to vps) average use: 40-45%
|20 regions
|<4 users
|about 20 different light scripts, but we're also experimenting with heavier HUD scripts (timers, lots of ll(Get/Set)PrimitiveParams and large lists) and custom IRC relay
|Phoenix Rising Isles on OsGrid
|3727 prims
|}

== Database ==

By default, OpenSimulator is configured to use the SQLite database. This is very convenient for an out-of-the-box experience since it requires no configuration. However, it's not designed for heavy usage, so if you build very quickly or have more than a few people on your simulator then you will start to see performance issues.

Therefore, we recommend that you switch to MySQL as soon as possible. This will provide a much better experience but will take a little bit of work to set up.

There is also a database plugin for MSSQL but this is not well maintained between OpenSimulator releases.

Unfortunately, tools for migrating OpenSimulator SQLite data to MySQL are currently limited. Migration is also possible by saving OARs/IARs of your data from sqlite and loading them up once you've reconfigured to use MySQL.

== Configuration tweaks ==

There are a couple of OpenSimulator configuration tweaks that you can do to significantly improve script loading performance in certain situations. These tweaks can be made in your OpenSim.ini config file. These apply to current OpenSimulator development code (0.7.3-dev) and may also apply to 0.7.2, though certainly not any earlier.

===Set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false===

[XEngine]
DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false

This means that OpenSimulator will not delete all the existing compiled script DLLs on startup (don't worry, this setting doesn't touch the actual LSL scripts in your region). This will significantly improve startup performance. However, if you upgrade OpenSimulator in place (e.g. you regularly update your installation directly from development code) then you may occasionally see problems if code changes and your previously compiled DLLs can't find their old references.

In this case, you can either set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = true for one restart in order to clean out and recompile script DLLs or you can manually delete the relevant bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid>/*.dll.* files, which will force OpenSimulator to recompile them. You could also delete the entire bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid> directory but this would lose all persisted script state (which is kept in the <script-item-id>.state files).

===Set AppDomainLoading = false===
[XEngine]
AppDomainLoading = false

By default, OpenSimulator loads every script DLL into its own AppDomain. If this is set to false, then all scripts are loaded into OpenSimulator's default AppDomain instead.

This will significantly improve script startup times and reduce initial per-script memory overhead.

However, setting this to false will also prevent derezzed script DLLs from being removed from memory (only whole AppDomains can be unloaded). This might cause an OutOfMemory problem over time, as avatars with scripted attachments move in and out of the region. Whether this is a problem for you will depend on factors such as the avatar population of your grid.

In addition, Windows users have reported script loading problems with AppDomainLoading = false, though I (justincc) haven't been able to replicate this with current OpenSimulator code on my WindowsXP machine.

= Grid =

Scaling a grid is a very complex task and only for the very technically inclined. It is also an area under active investigation. The advice below will change considerably over time as OpenSimulator and its environment changes and we learn more about perfomrnace issues.

When would you start to meet grid scaling issues? As an extremely rough and really quite arbitrary and pessimistic rule of thumb, you will probably start to have to think about things when you exceed 50 regions containing a large number of prims or 50 simultaneous users with large inventories. But this will very a tremendous amount depending on your situation. If you have thousands of regions with very few prims that much more supportable than 50 regions with 45000 prims each.

You are likely to encounter issues in two areas - database and services.

== Database ==

=== Assets ===

==== The problem ====

Due to the architecture of distributed architecture of OpenSimulator, where regions are running on a number of different machines over a network, it's extremely hard to identify assets that are not in use and hence can be deleted. Equally, the fact that assets are immutable leads to continual growth in the asset database.

In theory, one could identify unused assets if one could identify all references in simulators and in user inventory. However, this is extremely hard to do where machines are distributed over a network. If a grid only has a few simulators all running on machines that are controlled by the same entity running a grid, then it becomes a little more tractable but even then would almost certainly involve significant downtime. No public tools exist yet to achieve this.

Asset deletion would be easier for a one simulator grid or a standalone. However, even code to implement asset deletion on standalones has not yet been implemented and would certainly require significant simulator downtime.

A promising area of research involves improving OpenSimulator's recording of asset access times (e.g. recording access periodically). Then assets which aren't accessed for a long time (e.g. a year) could be deleted or moved to cold storage (e.g. DVD). One is left with the problem of not deleting assets permanently cached by simulators but perhaps this could be solved by the simulators occasionally 'pinging' the asset service with notification of what assets they cache.

Another step to reduce asset database size is to eliminate duplicate assets by hashing. There is [[Deduplicating Asset Service|an experimental development asset service]] for this. Third party services such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]] also do this.

==== Possible solutions ====

* Do nothing. MySQL can store a very large amount of data before encountering issues - it's used for extremely large websites and other applications after all. This assumes you have the disk space.

* Use an external asset service such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]]. SRAS, in particular, is a third party asset service that does deduplication, asset compression, and stores assets on disk rather than in a database. It also has some nice features like preventing assets being served without deleting them. It's used by OSGrid, for instance. However, it does work in a different way from the bundled OpenSimulator asset service (e.g. backup of on-disk assets involves some extra steps compared to just backing up a database). It also requires a migration step that may take a considerable time if you have an existing asset collection.

* Save every region to an OAR and every user's inventory to an IAR. We believe this is equivalent to finding all referenced assets and can be done manually. However, it's very laborious for installations with a large number of users and requires grid downtime. Tools could be written to improve this, particularly in systematically saving all user inventories to IARs.

=== Other databases ===

The space required by assets far outweighs other data storage requirements so only asset data is generally an issue.

== Services ==

=== The problem ===

The other problem is with handling the number of requests to services when the number of simulators and users grow. The asset service isn't generally a problem since simulators cache all assets used, though it can form a bottleneck on OAR upload. The biggest issue is generally caused by users, chiefly due to inventory access and perhaps update last user positions in the GridUser service (and database table).

ROBUST uses an embedded [[http://webserver.codeplex.com/ C# HttpServer]]. Performance comparisons to other Webservers (e.g. Apache) have not been carried out (?) but responses appears to be much, much slower. As it has been discontinued it's also rather unlikely to have it's performance improved. In future, OpenSimulator may embed a different HTTP server but this is extremely unlikely in the short term.

=== Possible solutions ===

* Split up services. By default, ROBUST runs every service in one process. However, because services are separate from each other, you could run some services (e.g. inventory in one ROBUST instance and other services (e.g. asset) in a different instance, even if they both point to the same database. Because the embedded C# webserver is slow and possibly not very concurrent, this can achieve significant performance improvements even if all ROBUST instances are running on the same machine.

* Instantiate extra ROBUST copies of problem services (e.g. inventory). Because services are stateless (akin to a webservice), you can load balance requests between multiple instances using a reverse proxy such as nginx. Again, because the embedded webserver is probably inefficient, you can achieve performance improvements by running multiple copies of services on the same machine.

* Use an external service based on a more efficient HTTP server, e.g. [https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS] (asset service only) or [http://code.google.com/p/openmetaverse/ SimianGrid]. Please be aware that SimianGrid uses a different set of simulator <-> service protocols than used by ROBUST. The necessary SimianGrid adaptors are part of the core OpenSimulator distribution.

* Write your own services to run on an external webserver. This wouldn't be too hard to do in something like PHP, though one would need to work out the currently undocumented wire formats. If you do this, please do let us know :)

= Performance studies and blog posts =

These provide some interesting data on the performance limitations of OpenSimulator at various points in time.

* [https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html] - Some interesting information from Mr Blue. Physical objects and max avatars are limited by single thread performance in OpenSimulator.
* [http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start] - Links to ScienceSim performance studies, including some very recent ones.
* [[Improving Performance]] - An old page from July 2009 detailing some performance issues on OpenSimulator. Some of these issues are still valid (e.g. ODE issues).
* [[NHibernate Performance Testing]] — SQLite and MySQL performance tests with NHibernate.
* [[LibSecondLife performance problems]] - Another old page from November 2007 detailing issues with libsecondlife (now called libopenmetaverse).
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=71 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 1]
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=104 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 2]

Performance

2012-04-08T02:36:49Z

DaveCoyle: /* Possible solutions */

{{Quicklinks}}

= Introduction =
OpenSimulator performance is a very complex issue. Performance can be affected by any number of things, including the number of prims on a region, number of regions, number of avatars, network quality between server and viewer, network quality between simulator and grid services, etc.

We can break down a performance discussion into simulator issues (e.g. script performance, region database performance) and grid issues (chiefly scaling services such as asset, inventory, etc to serve more simulators and users).

= General Tips =

Where at all possible, don't assume something is a performance bottleneck, measure it! You might think your asset database is large, for example, but even large asset database seldom cause real issues.

It can be hard to perform measurement at the moment since not a lot of tools exist. However, one such is [[pCampbot]] which is bundled with OpenSimulator. This can instantiate a number of simultaneous libomv clients on a simulator that can take certain actions such as clicking things and bouncing aroud. Apects of it (e.g. appearance) are currently rather buggy and generate a lot of logging guff.

= Simulator =

== Hardware Requirements ==
Unfortunately, this is a very difficult question in light of all the factors mentioned in the introduction.

However, we can say that OpenSimulator does not run well when it only has access to a single CPU core - you should regard a dual-core machine as the minimum.

Below are some examples of hardware people use/have used. Please feel free to add to the list, or to add any reports to the performance studies and blog posts section. '''These are examples to help you in your selection, not recommendations.'''

Object Parts ~= # prim

Sensors and Timers are generally more intensive then regular scripts, so please specify quantity of each.

{| border="1"
!Description
!Operating System (please add Mono version if appropriate)
!OpenSimulator version
!RAM/AVG_USE_%
!CPU
!#/type of regions
!# simultaneous avs
!#scripts/timers/Sensors
!Location
!#objectparts
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Intrepid (8.10)
|Unknown
|540MB/?
|1x quad-core 2.5GHz Xeon (L5420)
|1 region + 9 voids
|generally 1-2
|few
|Knifejaw Atoll & surrounding on OSGrid
|?
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04)
|Unknown
|360MB/?
|2x dual-core 2.0GHz Xeon (5130)
|1 void
|generally 1-2
|none
|Knifejaw Road on OSGrid
|?
|-
|Dedicated Server from A+
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1 Meg
|1x single-core 2.8GHz Celeron
|2regions per server
|6 at once with no issues
|Waterfalls, texture anims, window texture switchers, lots of sound loops
|Pleasure Planet Welcome center & Region Pleasure Planet in OSGrid
|20000 prims per region
|-
|Amazon EC2 "high-CPU medium instance" (Xen VM)
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1.7GB
|1x dual-core 2.3GHz (Intel E5345)
|1 region with sailing race course
|7 avs, 4 in boats
|scripted start line
|Castle Rock, OSGrid
|
|-
|Dedicated Server from simhost.com
|SuSe 11.2 x64
|Unknown
|8gb / 50%
|4x Core2Quad Q9300 2.6ghz
|1 region (Wright Plaza) uses approx 4gb ram
|20-25 users
|Freebie Stores / Meeting Center / Video Theater
|@osgrid.org Heavy Use Sim
|17500 prims aprox 1500 scripts
|-
|Home machine
|Windows XP SP3
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|3GB / 15-40% incl. Opensim and MySQL
|4x Core2Quad Q6600 2.4 GHz. Use: generally, 0-10%
|11 regions
|1-6 users
|Many scripted objects (1934 scripts)
|[http://zonjacapalini.wordpress.com/2010/08/25/condensation-land-a-status-report/ Condensation Land]
|38,065 prims
|-
|Home machine
|Ubuntu Lucid 10.04 (32 bit pae)
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|160Mb no users, add 5Mb/user incl Opensim and MySQL
|I7-920 (dual threaded quad core), 3.8Ghz, 6Gb RAM, 0-10% Load
|4 regions (Diva default config)
|1-4 users (approx 20Kb/sec bandwidth/user)
|Few scripted objects (<10)
|[http://mars-simulator.hobby-site.org:9000/wifi Mars Simulation]- Based on [http://metatek.blogspot.com/2010/06/mars-simulation-for-distribution.html Erik Nauman's Open Blackboard]
|158 prims
|-
|Hosted Parallels Virtuozzo 4.5
|Win/Net (32 run)
|0.7.0.2 (D2)
|420Mb total, incl OS, Opensim and MySQL
|i7 Quad 950 (Bloomfield) 3.07GHz, 8 Core, 2Gb RAM, 0-2% Avg Load
|16 regions (4x4 mega-region)
|<6 users
|vehicle scripted objects (<5)
|[http://metaversesailing.com:9000/wifi Metaverse Sailing]
|<1000 prims
|-
|VPS
|Debian Lenny 5 (mono 2.4.2.3)
|OSgrid 0.7.1 (Dev) cd4d7a7: 2010-10-15
|655MB average out of 1722MB RAM, incl. MySQL
|Intel Quadcore 2.5 Ghz (1 core assigned to vps) average use: 40-45%
|20 regions
|<4 users
|about 20 different light scripts, but we're also experimenting with heavier HUD scripts (timers, lots of ll(Get/Set)PrimitiveParams and large lists) and custom IRC relay
|Phoenix Rising Isles on OsGrid
|3727 prims
|}

== Database ==

By default, OpenSimulator is configured to use the SQLite database. This is very convenient for an out-of-the-box experience since it requires no configuration. However, it's not designed for heavy usage, so if you build very quickly or have more than a few people on your simulator then you will start to see performance issues.

Therefore, we recommend that you switch to MySQL as soon as possible. This will provide a much better experience but will take a little bit of work to set up.

There is also a database plugin for MSSQL but this is not well maintained between OpenSimulator releases.

Unfortunately, tools for migrating OpenSimulator SQLite data to MySQL are currently limited. Migration is also possible by saving OARs/IARs of your data from sqlite and loading them up once you've reconfigured to use MySQL.

== Configuration tweaks ==

There are a couple of OpenSimulator configuration tweaks that you can do to significantly improve script loading performance in certain situations. These tweaks can be made in your OpenSim.ini config file. These apply to current OpenSimulator development code (0.7.3-dev) and may also apply to 0.7.2, though certainly not any earlier.

===Set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false===

[XEngine]
DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false

This means that OpenSimulator will not delete all the existing compiled script DLLs on startup (don't worry, this setting doesn't touch the actual LSL scripts in your region). This will significantly improve startup performance. However, if you upgrade OpenSimulator in place (e.g. you regularly update your installation directly from development code) then you may occasionally see problems if code changes and your previously compiled DLLs can't find their old references.

In this case, you can either set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = true for one restart in order to clean out and recompile script DLLs or you can manually delete the relevant bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid>/*.dll.* files, which will force OpenSimulator to recompile them. You could also delete the entire bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid> directory but this would lose all persisted script state (which is kept in the <script-item-id>.state files).

===Set AppDomainLoading = false===
[XEngine]
AppDomainLoading = false

By default, OpenSimulator loads every script DLL into its own AppDomain. If this is set to false, then all scripts are loaded into OpenSimulator's default AppDomain instead.

This will significantly improve script startup times and reduce initial per-script memory overhead.

However, setting this to false will also prevent derezzed script DLLs from being removed from memory (only whole AppDomains can be unloaded). This might cause an OutOfMemory problem over time, as avatars with scripted attachments move in and out of the region. Whether this is a problem for you will depend on factors such as the avatar population of your grid.

In addition, Windows users have reported script loading problems with AppDomainLoading = false, though I (justincc) haven't been able to replicate this with current OpenSimulator code on my WindowsXP machine.

= Grid =

Scaling a grid is a very complex task and only for the very technically inclined. It is also an area under active investigation. The advice below will change considerably over time as OpenSimulator and its environment changes and we learn more about perfomrnace issues.

When would you start to meet grid scaling issues? As an extremely rough and really quite arbitrary and pessimistic rule of thumb, you will probably start to have to think about things when you exceed 50 regions containing a large number of prims or 50 simultaneous users with large inventories. But this will very a tremendous amount depending on your situation. If you have thousands of regions with very few prims that much more supportable than 50 regions with 45000 prims each.

You are likely to encounter issues in two areas - database and services.

== Database ==

=== Assets ===

==== The problem ====

Due to the architecture of distributed architecture of OpenSimulator, where regions are running on a number of different machines over a network, it's extremely hard to identify assets that are not in use and hence can be deleted. Equally, the fact that assets are immutable leads to continual growth in the asset database.

In theory, one could identify unused assets if one could identify all references in simulators and in user inventory. However, this is extremely hard to do where machines are distributed over a network. If a grid only has a few simulators all running on machines that are controlled by the same entity running a grid, then it becomes a little more tractable but even then would almost certainly involve significant downtime. No public tools exist yet to achieve this.

Asset deletion would be easier for a one simulator grid or a standalone. However, even code to implement asset deletion on standalones has not yet been implemented and would certainly require significant simulator downtime.

A promising area of research involves improving OpenSimulator's recording of asset access times (e.g. recording access periodically). Then assets which aren't accessed for a long time (e.g. a year) could be deleted or moved to cold storage (e.g. DVD). One is left with the problem of not deleting assets permanently cached by simulators but perhaps this could be solved by the simulators occasionally 'pinging' the asset service with notification of what assets they cache.

Another step to reduce asset database size is to eliminate duplicate assets by hashing. There is [[Deduplicating Asset Service|an experimental development asset service]] for this. Third party services such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]] also do this.

==== Possible solutions ====

* Do nothing. MySQL can store a very large amount of data before encountering issues - it's used for extremely large websites and other applications after all. This assumes you have the disk space.

* Use an external asset service such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]]. SRAS, in particular, is a third party asset service that does deduplication, asset compression, and stores assets on disk rather than in a database. It also has some nice features like preventing assets being served without deleting them. It's used by OSGrid, for instance. However, it does work in a different way from the bundled OpenSimulator asset service (e.g. backup of on-disk assets involves some extra steps compared to just backing up a database). It also requires a migration step that may take a considerable time if you have an exists asset collection.

* Save every region to an OAR and every user's inventory to an IAR. We believe this is equivalent to finding all referenced assets and can be done manually. However, it's very laborious for installations with a large number of users and requires grid downtime. Tools could be written to improve this, particularly in systematically saving all user inventories to IARs.

=== Other databases ===

The space required by assets far outweighs other data storage requirements so only asset data is generally an issue.

== Services ==

=== The problem ===

The other problem is with handling the number of requests to services when the number of simulators and users grow. The asset service isn't generally a problem since simulators cache all assets used, though it can form a bottleneck on OAR upload. The biggest issue is generally caused by users, chiefly due to inventory access and perhaps update last user positions in the GridUser service (and database table).

ROBUST uses an embedded [[http://webserver.codeplex.com/ C# HttpServer]]. Performance comparisons to other Webservers (e.g. Apache) have not been carried out (?) but responses appears to be much, much slower. As it has been discontinued it's also rather unlikely to have it's performance improved. In future, OpenSimulator may embed a different HTTP server but this is extremely unlikely in the short term.

=== Possible solutions ===

* Split up services. By default, ROBUST runs every service in one process. However, because services are separate from each other, you could run some services (e.g. inventory in one ROBUST instance and other services (e.g. asset) in a different instance, even if they both point to the same database. Because the embedded C# webserver is slow and possibly not very concurrent, this can achieve significant performance improvements even if all ROBUST instances are running on the same machine.

* Instantiate extra ROBUST copies of problem services (e.g. inventory). Because services are stateless (akin to a webservice), you can load balance requests between multiple instances using a reverse proxy such as nginx. Again, because the embedded webserver is probably inefficient, you can achieve performance improvements by running multiple copies of services on the same machine.

* Use an external service based on a more efficient HTTP server, e.g. [http://code.google.com/p/openmetaverse/ SimianGrid].

* Write your own services to run on an external webserver. This wouldn't be too hard to do in something like PHP, though one would need to work out the currently undocumented wire formats. If you do this, please do let us know :)

= Performance studies and blog posts =

These provide some interesting data on the performance limitations of OpenSimulator at various points in time.

* [https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html] - Some interesting information from Mr Blue. Physical objects and max avatars are limited by single thread performance in OpenSimulator.
* [http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start] - Links to ScienceSim performance studies, including some very recent ones.
* [[Improving Performance]] - An old page from July 2009 detailing some performance issues on OpenSimulator. Some of these issues are still valid (e.g. ODE issues).
* [[NHibernate Performance Testing]] — SQLite and MySQL performance tests with NHibernate.
* [[LibSecondLife performance problems]] - Another old page from November 2007 detailing issues with libsecondlife (now called libopenmetaverse).
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=71 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 1]
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=104 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 2]

Performance

2012-04-08T02:34:28Z

DaveCoyle: mention simiangrid

{{Quicklinks}}

= Introduction =
OpenSimulator performance is a very complex issue. Performance can be affected by any number of things, including the number of prims on a region, number of regions, number of avatars, network quality between server and viewer, network quality between simulator and grid services, etc.

We can break down a performance discussion into simulator issues (e.g. script performance, region database performance) and grid issues (chiefly scaling services such as asset, inventory, etc to serve more simulators and users).

= General Tips =

Where at all possible, don't assume something is a performance bottleneck, measure it! You might think your asset database is large, for example, but even large asset database seldom cause real issues.

It can be hard to perform measurement at the moment since not a lot of tools exist. However, one such is [[pCampbot]] which is bundled with OpenSimulator. This can instantiate a number of simultaneous libomv clients on a simulator that can take certain actions such as clicking things and bouncing aroud. Apects of it (e.g. appearance) are currently rather buggy and generate a lot of logging guff.

= Simulator =

== Hardware Requirements ==
Unfortunately, this is a very difficult question in light of all the factors mentioned in the introduction.

However, we can say that OpenSimulator does not run well when it only has access to a single CPU core - you should regard a dual-core machine as the minimum.

Below are some examples of hardware people use/have used. Please feel free to add to the list, or to add any reports to the performance studies and blog posts section. '''These are examples to help you in your selection, not recommendations.'''

Object Parts ~= # prim

Sensors and Timers are generally more intensive then regular scripts, so please specify quantity of each.

{| border="1"
!Description
!Operating System (please add Mono version if appropriate)
!OpenSimulator version
!RAM/AVG_USE_%
!CPU
!#/type of regions
!# simultaneous avs
!#scripts/timers/Sensors
!Location
!#objectparts
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Intrepid (8.10)
|Unknown
|540MB/?
|1x quad-core 2.5GHz Xeon (L5420)
|1 region + 9 voids
|generally 1-2
|few
|Knifejaw Atoll & surrounding on OSGrid
|?
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04)
|Unknown
|360MB/?
|2x dual-core 2.0GHz Xeon (5130)
|1 void
|generally 1-2
|none
|Knifejaw Road on OSGrid
|?
|-
|Dedicated Server from A+
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1 Meg
|1x single-core 2.8GHz Celeron
|2regions per server
|6 at once with no issues
|Waterfalls, texture anims, window texture switchers, lots of sound loops
|Pleasure Planet Welcome center & Region Pleasure Planet in OSGrid
|20000 prims per region
|-
|Amazon EC2 "high-CPU medium instance" (Xen VM)
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1.7GB
|1x dual-core 2.3GHz (Intel E5345)
|1 region with sailing race course
|7 avs, 4 in boats
|scripted start line
|Castle Rock, OSGrid
|
|-
|Dedicated Server from simhost.com
|SuSe 11.2 x64
|Unknown
|8gb / 50%
|4x Core2Quad Q9300 2.6ghz
|1 region (Wright Plaza) uses approx 4gb ram
|20-25 users
|Freebie Stores / Meeting Center / Video Theater
|@osgrid.org Heavy Use Sim
|17500 prims aprox 1500 scripts
|-
|Home machine
|Windows XP SP3
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|3GB / 15-40% incl. Opensim and MySQL
|4x Core2Quad Q6600 2.4 GHz. Use: generally, 0-10%
|11 regions
|1-6 users
|Many scripted objects (1934 scripts)
|[http://zonjacapalini.wordpress.com/2010/08/25/condensation-land-a-status-report/ Condensation Land]
|38,065 prims
|-
|Home machine
|Ubuntu Lucid 10.04 (32 bit pae)
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|160Mb no users, add 5Mb/user incl Opensim and MySQL
|I7-920 (dual threaded quad core), 3.8Ghz, 6Gb RAM, 0-10% Load
|4 regions (Diva default config)
|1-4 users (approx 20Kb/sec bandwidth/user)
|Few scripted objects (<10)
|[http://mars-simulator.hobby-site.org:9000/wifi Mars Simulation]- Based on [http://metatek.blogspot.com/2010/06/mars-simulation-for-distribution.html Erik Nauman's Open Blackboard]
|158 prims
|-
|Hosted Parallels Virtuozzo 4.5
|Win/Net (32 run)
|0.7.0.2 (D2)
|420Mb total, incl OS, Opensim and MySQL
|i7 Quad 950 (Bloomfield) 3.07GHz, 8 Core, 2Gb RAM, 0-2% Avg Load
|16 regions (4x4 mega-region)
|<6 users
|vehicle scripted objects (<5)
|[http://metaversesailing.com:9000/wifi Metaverse Sailing]
|<1000 prims
|-
|VPS
|Debian Lenny 5 (mono 2.4.2.3)
|OSgrid 0.7.1 (Dev) cd4d7a7: 2010-10-15
|655MB average out of 1722MB RAM, incl. MySQL
|Intel Quadcore 2.5 Ghz (1 core assigned to vps) average use: 40-45%
|20 regions
|<4 users
|about 20 different light scripts, but we're also experimenting with heavier HUD scripts (timers, lots of ll(Get/Set)PrimitiveParams and large lists) and custom IRC relay
|Phoenix Rising Isles on OsGrid
|3727 prims
|}

== Database ==

By default, OpenSimulator is configured to use the SQLite database. This is very convenient for an out-of-the-box experience since it requires no configuration. However, it's not designed for heavy usage, so if you build very quickly or have more than a few people on your simulator then you will start to see performance issues.

Therefore, we recommend that you switch to MySQL as soon as possible. This will provide a much better experience but will take a little bit of work to set up.

There is also a database plugin for MSSQL but this is not well maintained between OpenSimulator releases.

Unfortunately, tools for migrating OpenSimulator SQLite data to MySQL are currently limited. Migration is also possible by saving OARs/IARs of your data from sqlite and loading them up once you've reconfigured to use MySQL.

== Configuration tweaks ==

There are a couple of OpenSimulator configuration tweaks that you can do to significantly improve script loading performance in certain situations. These tweaks can be made in your OpenSim.ini config file. These apply to current OpenSimulator development code (0.7.3-dev) and may also apply to 0.7.2, though certainly not any earlier.

===Set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false===

[XEngine]
DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false

This means that OpenSimulator will not delete all the existing compiled script DLLs on startup (don't worry, this setting doesn't touch the actual LSL scripts in your region). This will significantly improve startup performance. However, if you upgrade OpenSimulator in place (e.g. you regularly update your installation directly from development code) then you may occasionally see problems if code changes and your previously compiled DLLs can't find their old references.

In this case, you can either set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = true for one restart in order to clean out and recompile script DLLs or you can manually delete the relevant bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid>/*.dll.* files, which will force OpenSimulator to recompile them. You could also delete the entire bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid> directory but this would lose all persisted script state (which is kept in the <script-item-id>.state files).

===Set AppDomainLoading = false===
[XEngine]
AppDomainLoading = false

By default, OpenSimulator loads every script DLL into its own AppDomain. If this is set to false, then all scripts are loaded into OpenSimulator's default AppDomain instead.

This will significantly improve script startup times and reduce initial per-script memory overhead.

However, setting this to false will also prevent derezzed script DLLs from being removed from memory (only whole AppDomains can be unloaded). This might cause an OutOfMemory problem over time, as avatars with scripted attachments move in and out of the region. Whether this is a problem for you will depend on factors such as the avatar population of your grid.

In addition, Windows users have reported script loading problems with AppDomainLoading = false, though I (justincc) haven't been able to replicate this with current OpenSimulator code on my WindowsXP machine.

= Grid =

Scaling a grid is a very complex task and only for the very technically inclined. It is also an area under active investigation. The advice below will change considerably over time as OpenSimulator and its environment changes and we learn more about perfomrnace issues.

When would you start to meet grid scaling issues? As an extremely rough and really quite arbitrary and pessimistic rule of thumb, you will probably start to have to think about things when you exceed 50 regions containing a large number of prims or 50 simultaneous users with large inventories. But this will very a tremendous amount depending on your situation. If you have thousands of regions with very few prims that much more supportable than 50 regions with 45000 prims each.

You are likely to encounter issues in two areas - database and services.

== Database ==

=== Assets ===

==== The problem ====

Due to the architecture of distributed architecture of OpenSimulator, where regions are running on a number of different machines over a network, it's extremely hard to identify assets that are not in use and hence can be deleted. Equally, the fact that assets are immutable leads to continual growth in the asset database.

In theory, one could identify unused assets if one could identify all references in simulators and in user inventory. However, this is extremely hard to do where machines are distributed over a network. If a grid only has a few simulators all running on machines that are controlled by the same entity running a grid, then it becomes a little more tractable but even then would almost certainly involve significant downtime. No public tools exist yet to achieve this.

Asset deletion would be easier for a one simulator grid or a standalone. However, even code to implement asset deletion on standalones has not yet been implemented and would certainly require significant simulator downtime.

A promising area of research involves improving OpenSimulator's recording of asset access times (e.g. recording access periodically). Then assets which aren't accessed for a long time (e.g. a year) could be deleted or moved to cold storage (e.g. DVD). One is left with the problem of not deleting assets permanently cached by simulators but perhaps this could be solved by the simulators occasionally 'pinging' the asset service with notification of what assets they cache.

Another step to reduce asset database size is to eliminate duplicate assets by hashing. There is [[Deduplicating Asset Service|an experimental development asset service]] for this. Third party services such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]] also do this.

==== Possible solutions ====

* Do nothing. MySQL can store a very large amount of data before encountering issues - it's used for extremely large websites and other applications after all. This assumes you have the disk space.

* Use an external asset service such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]]. SRAS, in particular, is a third party asset service that does deduplication and stores assets on disk rather than in a database. It also has some nice features like preventing assets being served without deleting them. It's used by OSGrid, for instance. However, it does work in a different way from the bundled OpenSimulator asset service (e.g. backup of on-disk assets involves some extra steps compared to just backing up a database). It also requires a migration step that may take a considerable time if you have an exists asset collection.

* Save every region to an OAR and every user's inventory to an IAR. We believe this is equivalent to finding all referenced assets and can be done manually. However, it's very laborious for installations with a large number of users and requires grid downtime. Tools could be written to improve this, particularly in systematically saving all user inventories to IARs.

=== Other databases ===

The space required by assets far outweighs other data storage requirements so only asset data is generally an issue.

== Services ==

=== The problem ===

The other problem is with handling the number of requests to services when the number of simulators and users grow. The asset service isn't generally a problem since simulators cache all assets used, though it can form a bottleneck on OAR upload. The biggest issue is generally caused by users, chiefly due to inventory access and perhaps update last user positions in the GridUser service (and database table).

ROBUST uses an embedded [[http://webserver.codeplex.com/ C# HttpServer]]. Performance comparisons to other Webservers (e.g. Apache) have not been carried out (?) but responses appears to be much, much slower. As it has been discontinued it's also rather unlikely to have it's performance improved. In future, OpenSimulator may embed a different HTTP server but this is extremely unlikely in the short term.

=== Possible solutions ===

* Split up services. By default, ROBUST runs every service in one process. However, because services are separate from each other, you could run some services (e.g. inventory in one ROBUST instance and other services (e.g. asset) in a different instance, even if they both point to the same database. Because the embedded C# webserver is slow and possibly not very concurrent, this can achieve significant performance improvements even if all ROBUST instances are running on the same machine.

* Instantiate extra ROBUST copies of problem services (e.g. inventory). Because services are stateless (akin to a webservice), you can load balance requests between multiple instances using a reverse proxy such as nginx. Again, because the embedded webserver is probably inefficient, you can achieve performance improvements by running multiple copies of services on the same machine.

* Use an external service based on a more efficient HTTP server, e.g. [http://code.google.com/p/openmetaverse/ SimianGrid].

* Write your own services to run on an external webserver. This wouldn't be too hard to do in something like PHP, though one would need to work out the currently undocumented wire formats. If you do this, please do let us know :)

= Performance studies and blog posts =

These provide some interesting data on the performance limitations of OpenSimulator at various points in time.

* [https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html] - Some interesting information from Mr Blue. Physical objects and max avatars are limited by single thread performance in OpenSimulator.
* [http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start] - Links to ScienceSim performance studies, including some very recent ones.
* [[Improving Performance]] - An old page from July 2009 detailing some performance issues on OpenSimulator. Some of these issues are still valid (e.g. ODE issues).
* [[NHibernate Performance Testing]] — SQLite and MySQL performance tests with NHibernate.
* [[LibSecondLife performance problems]] - Another old page from November 2007 detailing issues with libsecondlife (now called libopenmetaverse).
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=71 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 1]
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=104 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 2]

Performance

2012-04-08T02:31:34Z

DaveCoyle: Remove info that referred to a very old version of SRAS

{{Quicklinks}}

= Introduction =
OpenSimulator performance is a very complex issue. Performance can be affected by any number of things, including the number of prims on a region, number of regions, number of avatars, network quality between server and viewer, network quality between simulator and grid services, etc.

We can break down a performance discussion into simulator issues (e.g. script performance, region database performance) and grid issues (chiefly scaling services such as asset, inventory, etc to serve more simulators and users).

= General Tips =

Where at all possible, don't assume something is a performance bottleneck, measure it! You might think your asset database is large, for example, but even large asset database seldom cause real issues.

It can be hard to perform measurement at the moment since not a lot of tools exist. However, one such is [[pCampbot]] which is bundled with OpenSimulator. This can instantiate a number of simultaneous libomv clients on a simulator that can take certain actions such as clicking things and bouncing aroud. Apects of it (e.g. appearance) are currently rather buggy and generate a lot of logging guff.

= Simulator =

== Hardware Requirements ==
Unfortunately, this is a very difficult question in light of all the factors mentioned in the introduction.

However, we can say that OpenSimulator does not run well when it only has access to a single CPU core - you should regard a dual-core machine as the minimum.

Below are some examples of hardware people use/have used. Please feel free to add to the list, or to add any reports to the performance studies and blog posts section. '''These are examples to help you in your selection, not recommendations.'''

Object Parts ~= # prim

Sensors and Timers are generally more intensive then regular scripts, so please specify quantity of each.

{| border="1"
!Description
!Operating System (please add Mono version if appropriate)
!OpenSimulator version
!RAM/AVG_USE_%
!CPU
!#/type of regions
!# simultaneous avs
!#scripts/timers/Sensors
!Location
!#objectparts
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Intrepid (8.10)
|Unknown
|540MB/?
|1x quad-core 2.5GHz Xeon (L5420)
|1 region + 9 voids
|generally 1-2
|few
|Knifejaw Atoll & surrounding on OSGrid
|?
|-
|hosted Xen VPS
|Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04)
|Unknown
|360MB/?
|2x dual-core 2.0GHz Xeon (5130)
|1 void
|generally 1-2
|none
|Knifejaw Road on OSGrid
|?
|-
|Dedicated Server from A+
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1 Meg
|1x single-core 2.8GHz Celeron
|2regions per server
|6 at once with no issues
|Waterfalls, texture anims, window texture switchers, lots of sound loops
|Pleasure Planet Welcome center & Region Pleasure Planet in OSGrid
|20000 prims per region
|-
|Amazon EC2 "high-CPU medium instance" (Xen VM)
|Windows Server 2003
|Unknown
|1.7GB
|1x dual-core 2.3GHz (Intel E5345)
|1 region with sailing race course
|7 avs, 4 in boats
|scripted start line
|Castle Rock, OSGrid
|
|-
|Dedicated Server from simhost.com
|SuSe 11.2 x64
|Unknown
|8gb / 50%
|4x Core2Quad Q9300 2.6ghz
|1 region (Wright Plaza) uses approx 4gb ram
|20-25 users
|Freebie Stores / Meeting Center / Video Theater
|@osgrid.org Heavy Use Sim
|17500 prims aprox 1500 scripts
|-
|Home machine
|Windows XP SP3
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|3GB / 15-40% incl. Opensim and MySQL
|4x Core2Quad Q6600 2.4 GHz. Use: generally, 0-10%
|11 regions
|1-6 users
|Many scripted objects (1934 scripts)
|[http://zonjacapalini.wordpress.com/2010/08/25/condensation-land-a-status-report/ Condensation Land]
|38,065 prims
|-
|Home machine
|Ubuntu Lucid 10.04 (32 bit pae)
|0.7.0.1 (Diva r13558)
|160Mb no users, add 5Mb/user incl Opensim and MySQL
|I7-920 (dual threaded quad core), 3.8Ghz, 6Gb RAM, 0-10% Load
|4 regions (Diva default config)
|1-4 users (approx 20Kb/sec bandwidth/user)
|Few scripted objects (<10)
|[http://mars-simulator.hobby-site.org:9000/wifi Mars Simulation]- Based on [http://metatek.blogspot.com/2010/06/mars-simulation-for-distribution.html Erik Nauman's Open Blackboard]
|158 prims
|-
|Hosted Parallels Virtuozzo 4.5
|Win/Net (32 run)
|0.7.0.2 (D2)
|420Mb total, incl OS, Opensim and MySQL
|i7 Quad 950 (Bloomfield) 3.07GHz, 8 Core, 2Gb RAM, 0-2% Avg Load
|16 regions (4x4 mega-region)
|<6 users
|vehicle scripted objects (<5)
|[http://metaversesailing.com:9000/wifi Metaverse Sailing]
|<1000 prims
|-
|VPS
|Debian Lenny 5 (mono 2.4.2.3)
|OSgrid 0.7.1 (Dev) cd4d7a7: 2010-10-15
|655MB average out of 1722MB RAM, incl. MySQL
|Intel Quadcore 2.5 Ghz (1 core assigned to vps) average use: 40-45%
|20 regions
|<4 users
|about 20 different light scripts, but we're also experimenting with heavier HUD scripts (timers, lots of ll(Get/Set)PrimitiveParams and large lists) and custom IRC relay
|Phoenix Rising Isles on OsGrid
|3727 prims
|}

== Database ==

By default, OpenSimulator is configured to use the SQLite database. This is very convenient for an out-of-the-box experience since it requires no configuration. However, it's not designed for heavy usage, so if you build very quickly or have more than a few people on your simulator then you will start to see performance issues.

Therefore, we recommend that you switch to MySQL as soon as possible. This will provide a much better experience but will take a little bit of work to set up.

There is also a database plugin for MSSQL but this is not well maintained between OpenSimulator releases.

Unfortunately, tools for migrating OpenSimulator SQLite data to MySQL are currently limited. Migration is also possible by saving OARs/IARs of your data from sqlite and loading them up once you've reconfigured to use MySQL.

== Configuration tweaks ==

There are a couple of OpenSimulator configuration tweaks that you can do to significantly improve script loading performance in certain situations. These tweaks can be made in your OpenSim.ini config file. These apply to current OpenSimulator development code (0.7.3-dev) and may also apply to 0.7.2, though certainly not any earlier.

===Set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false===

[XEngine]
DeleteScriptsOnStartup = false

This means that OpenSimulator will not delete all the existing compiled script DLLs on startup (don't worry, this setting doesn't touch the actual LSL scripts in your region). This will significantly improve startup performance. However, if you upgrade OpenSimulator in place (e.g. you regularly update your installation directly from development code) then you may occasionally see problems if code changes and your previously compiled DLLs can't find their old references.

In this case, you can either set DeleteScriptsOnStartup = true for one restart in order to clean out and recompile script DLLs or you can manually delete the relevant bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid>/*.dll.* files, which will force OpenSimulator to recompile them. You could also delete the entire bin/ScriptEngines/<region-uuid> directory but this would lose all persisted script state (which is kept in the <script-item-id>.state files).

===Set AppDomainLoading = false===
[XEngine]
AppDomainLoading = false

By default, OpenSimulator loads every script DLL into its own AppDomain. If this is set to false, then all scripts are loaded into OpenSimulator's default AppDomain instead.

This will significantly improve script startup times and reduce initial per-script memory overhead.

However, setting this to false will also prevent derezzed script DLLs from being removed from memory (only whole AppDomains can be unloaded). This might cause an OutOfMemory problem over time, as avatars with scripted attachments move in and out of the region. Whether this is a problem for you will depend on factors such as the avatar population of your grid.

In addition, Windows users have reported script loading problems with AppDomainLoading = false, though I (justincc) haven't been able to replicate this with current OpenSimulator code on my WindowsXP machine.

= Grid =

Scaling a grid is a very complex task and only for the very technically inclined. It is also an area under active investigation. The advice below will change considerably over time as OpenSimulator and its environment changes and we learn more about perfomrnace issues.

When would you start to meet grid scaling issues? As an extremely rough and really quite arbitrary and pessimistic rule of thumb, you will probably start to have to think about things when you exceed 50 regions containing a large number of prims or 50 simultaneous users with large inventories. But this will very a tremendous amount depending on your situation. If you have thousands of regions with very few prims that much more supportable than 50 regions with 45000 prims each.

You are likely to encounter issues in two areas - database and services.

== Database ==

=== Assets ===

==== The problem ====

Due to the architecture of distributed architecture of OpenSimulator, where regions are running on a number of different machines over a network, it's extremely hard to identify assets that are not in use and hence can be deleted. Equally, the fact that assets are immutable leads to continual growth in the asset database.

In theory, one could identify unused assets if one could identify all references in simulators and in user inventory. However, this is extremely hard to do where machines are distributed over a network. If a grid only has a few simulators all running on machines that are controlled by the same entity running a grid, then it becomes a little more tractable but even then would almost certainly involve significant downtime. No public tools exist yet to achieve this.

Asset deletion would be easier for a one simulator grid or a standalone. However, even code to implement asset deletion on standalones has not yet been implemented and would certainly require significant simulator downtime.

A promising area of research involves improving OpenSimulator's recording of asset access times (e.g. recording access periodically). Then assets which aren't accessed for a long time (e.g. a year) could be deleted or moved to cold storage (e.g. DVD). One is left with the problem of not deleting assets permanently cached by simulators but perhaps this could be solved by the simulators occasionally 'pinging' the asset service with notification of what assets they cache.

Another step to reduce asset database size is to eliminate duplicate assets by hashing. There is [[Deduplicating Asset Service|an experimental development asset service]] for this. Third party services such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]] also do this.

==== Possible solutions ====

* Do nothing. MySQL can store a very large amount of data before encountering issues - it's used for extremely large websites and other applications after all. This assumes you have the disk space.

* Use an external asset service such as [[https://github.com/coyled/sras SRAS]]. SRAS, in particular, is a third party asset service that does deduplication and stores assets on disk rather than in a database. It also has some nice features like preventing assets being served without deleting them. It's used by OSGrid, for instance. However, it does work in a different way from the bundled OpenSimulator asset service (e.g. backup of on-disk assets involves some extra steps compared to just backing up a database). It also requires a migration step that may take a considerable time if you have an exists asset collection.

* Save every region to an OAR and every user's inventory to an IAR. We believe this is equivalent to finding all referenced assets and can be done manually. However, it's very laborious for installations with a large number of users and requires grid downtime. Tools could be written to improve this, particularly in systematically saving all user inventories to IARs.

=== Other databases ===

The space required by assets far outweighs other data storage requirements so only asset data is generally an issue.

== Services ==

=== The problem ===

The other problem is with handling the number of requests to services when the number of simulators and users grow. The asset service isn't generally a problem since simulators cache all assets used, though it can form a bottleneck on OAR upload. The biggest issue is generally caused by users, chiefly due to inventory access and perhaps update last user positions in the GridUser service (and database table).

ROBUST uses an embedded [[http://webserver.codeplex.com/ C# HttpServer]]. Performance comparisons to other Webservers (e.g. Apache) have not been carried out (?) but responses appears to be much, much slower. As it has been discontinued it's also rather unlikely to have it's performance improved. In future, OpenSimulator may embed a different HTTP server but this is extremely unlikely in the short term.

=== Possible solutions ===

* Split up services. By default, ROBUST runs every service in one process. However, because services are separate from each other, you could run some services (e.g. inventory in one ROBUST instance and other services (e.g. asset) in a different instance, even if they both point to the same database. Because the embedded C# webserver is slow and possibly not very concurrent, this can achieve significant performance improvements even if all ROBUST instances are running on the same machine.

* Instantiate extra ROBUST copies of problem services (e.g. inventory). Because services are stateless (akin to a webservice), you can load balance requests between multiple instances using a reverse proxy such as nginx. Again, because the embedded webserver is probably inefficient, you can achieve performance improvements by running multiple copies of services on the same machine.

* Use an external service based on a more efficient HTTP server. Unfortunately, currently only an external asset service is available.

* Write your own services to run on an external webserver. This wouldn't be too hard to do in something like PHP, though one would need to work out the currently undocumented wire formats. If you do this, please do let us know :)

= Performance studies and blog posts =

These provide some interesting data on the performance limitations of OpenSimulator at various points in time.

* [https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/opensim-users/2010-August/005189.html] - Some interesting information from Mr Blue. Physical objects and max avatars are limited by single thread performance in OpenSimulator.
* [http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start http://www.sciencesim.com/wiki/doku.php/vwperf/start] - Links to ScienceSim performance studies, including some very recent ones.
* [[Improving Performance]] - An old page from July 2009 detailing some performance issues on OpenSimulator. Some of these issues are still valid (e.g. ODE issues).
* [[NHibernate Performance Testing]] — SQLite and MySQL performance tests with NHibernate.
* [[LibSecondLife performance problems]] - Another old page from November 2007 detailing issues with libsecondlife (now called libopenmetaverse).
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=71 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 1]
* [http://opensim.cybertechnews.org/?p=104 Experiences from Operating a 3D Region Server in OSGrid - Part 2]

Jenkins

2011-11-11T05:30:46Z

DaveCoyle: add more to re-enabling panda instructions

= Jenkins build server=

<del>Bamboo is dead. Long live Panda.</del>

Panda is dead. Long live [http://jenkins.opensimulator.org Jenkins].

After 4,200 builds, Panda has been retired. The [http://jenkins-ci.org/ Jenkins CI server] is now handling OpenSimulator builds. Presently a push to the master branch will trigger a Jenkins build. You can track its progress at http://jenkins.opensimulator.org , though status will be announced in the #opensim-dev and #opensim IRC channels. If NUnit tests fail it'll announce that in IRC along with a URL which you can follow to see which tests failed, etc.

=== Reenabling Panda ===

If for whatever reason Panda should need to be revived:

* <tt># a2enmod passenger</tt>
* edit <tt>/etc/apache2/sites-enabled/panda.opensimulator.org</tt> and follow the instructions in it
* <tt># apache2ctl restart</tt>
* uncomment the line which contains the reference to <tt>post-receive-panda-driver</tt> in <tt>/var/git/opensim/.git/hooks/post-receive</tt>
* uncomment the three entries in user panda's crontab and it should come back to life within 15 minutes or so.

Jenkins

2011-11-11T05:12:23Z

DaveCoyle:

= Jenkins build server=

<del>Bamboo is dead. Long live Panda.</del>

Panda is dead. Long live [http://jenkins.opensimulator.org Jenkins].

After 4,200 builds, Panda has been retired. The [http://jenkins-ci.org/ Jenkins CI server] is now handling OpenSimulator builds. Presently a push to the master branch will trigger a Jenkins build. You can track its progress at http://jenkins.opensimulator.org , though status will be announced in the #opensim-dev and #opensim IRC channels. If NUnit tests fail it'll announce that in IRC along with a URL which you can follow to see which tests failed, etc.

If for whatever reason Panda should need to be revived, uncomment the line which contains the reference to <tt>post-receive-panda-driver</tt> in <tt>/var/git/opensim/.git/hooks/post-receive</tt> and uncomment the three entries in user panda's crontab and it should come back to life within 15 minutes or so.

Jenkins

2011-11-11T05:06:45Z

DaveCoyle: basic info about Jenkins

= Jenkins build server=

<del>Bamboo is dead. Long live Panda.</del>

Panda is dead. Long live [http://jenkins.opensimulator.org Jenkins].

After 4,200 builds, Panda has been retired. The [http://jenkins-ci.org/ Jenkins CI server] is currently handling OpenSimulator builds. Presently a push to the master branch will trigger a Jenkins build. You can track its progress at http://jenkins.opensimulator.org , though status will be announced in the #opensim-dev and #opensim IRC channels. If NUnit tests fail it'll announce that in IRC along with a URL, which you can follow to see which tests failed, etc.

If for whatever reason Panda should need to be revived, uncomment the line which contains the reference to <tt>post-receive-panda-driver</tt> in <tt>/var/git/opensim/.git/hooks/post-receive</tt> and uncomment the three entries in user panda's crontab and it should come back to life within 15 minutes or so.

Groups

2011-11-06T16:02:24Z

DaveCoyle: replacing with redirect to the more complete Enabling_Groups

#REDIRECT [[Enabling_Groups]]

User:DaveCoyle

2011-10-13T04:45:34Z

DaveCoyle:

Hi.

* freenode: coyled
* coyle /at/ knifejaw /dot/ com

Location: New York City (UTC-5)

ROBUST

2010-03-19T14:37:46Z

DaveCoyle: added some notes re: new services

==Redesigned OpenSim Basic Universal Server Technology (ROBUST)==
===Concepts===
ROBUST leverages the system of in and out connectors and services that was developed for the Hypergrid and OpenSim. It replaces OGS1 with a modular architecture that can be easily extended using core and 3rd party modules.

ROBUST is a flexible server shell that can load the same modules already used by regions. This allows for nearly 100% code reusability and great flexibility.

The ROBUST server loads "in" connectors as specified in the configuration file. These connectors then load the required processing and storage modules and/or "out" connectors. Through this architecture, each ROBUST server can run any or all grid services, and/or act as a proxy for grid services.

===Configuration===
The server reads a configuration file at startup, which defaults to the name of the assembly with .ini appended. The default name for the ROBUST server is OpenSim.Server.exe, therefore the default configuration file is OpenSim.Server.ini. An OpenSim.Server.ini.example file is provided with the OpenSim kit. The default port for all services running in ROBUST is 8003 as you can see below.

; * The startup section lists all the connectors to start up in this server
; * instance. This may be only one, or it may be the entire server suite.
; * Multiple connectors should be seaprated by commas.
; *
; * These are the IN connectors the server uses, the in connectors
; * read this config file and load the needed OUT and database connectors
; *
[Startup]
ServiceConnectors = "OpenSim.Server.Handlers.dll:AssetServiceConnector,OpenSim.Server.Handlers.dll:InventoryServiceInConnector"

; * This is common for all services, it's the network setup for the entire
; * server instance
; *
[Network]
port = 8003

; * As an example, the below configuration precisely mimicks the legacy
; * asset server. It is read by the asset IN connector (defined above)
; * and it then loads the OUT connector (a local database module). That,
; * in turn, reads the asset loader and database connection information
; *
[AssetService]
LocalServiceModule = "OpenSim.Services.AssetService.dll:AssetService"
DefaultAssetLoader = "OpenSim.Framework.AssetLoader.Filesystem.dll"
AssetLoaderArgs = "assets/AssetSets.xml"
StorageProvider = "OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll"
ConnectionString = "Data Source=localhost;Database=grid;User ID=grid;Password=grid;"

; * This configuration loads the inventory server modules. It duplicates
; * the function of the legacy inventory server
; *
[InventoryService]
LocalServiceModule = "OpenSim.Services.InventoryService.dll:InventoryService"
UserServerURI = "http://127.0.0.1:8002"
SessionAuthentication = "false"
StorageProvider = "OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll"
ConnectionString = "Data Source=localhost;Database=grid;User ID=grid;Password=grid;"

===Command Line Arguments===
*-inifile
:Specify the location of the .ini file to read instead of the default
*-console
:Specify console type, one of basic, local or rest
*-logfile
:Specify the logfile this server will log to
*-prompt
:Override the server prompt

==Configuration File==
===Section [Startup]===
*ServiceConnectors
:Comma separated list of service IN connectors. The format of each entry is <dllname>:<classname>. If a dll contains only one suitable class, the class name can be omitted.
*Prompt
:Override the server prompt
*Console
:Specify console type, one of basic, local or rest
*Logfile
:Specify the logfile this server will log to

===Section [Network]===
*Port
:Set the network port to listen on. All services will run on this port.

==Connector Configurations==
These configurations are provided by the connector modules and are not an integral part of the ROBUST server. Documentation to all possible options can be found in the documentation of the connector. This manual only lists the options present in the sample configuration file.

===Section [AssetService]===
* LocalServiceModule [Connector option]
:A module specification (<dll>:<class>) that provides the services for this connector
* DefaultAssetLoader [Service option]
:A dll containing the asset loader to use for loading the default asset set
* AssetLoaderArgs [Service option]
:Path to load assets from (for the file system asset loader)
* StorageProvider [Service option]
:Dll containing the database provider code
* ConnectionString [Service option]
:Connection string to be passed to the database provider

===Section [InventoryService]===
* LocalServiceModule [Connector option]
:A module specification (<dll>:<class>) that provides the services for this connector
* UserServerURI [Connector option]
:URI to reach the user server at
* SessionAuthentication [Connector option]
:Authenticate inventory sessions (default false!)
* StorageProvider [Service option]
:Dll containing the database provider code
* ConnectionString [Service option]
:Connection string to be passed to the database provider

Additional connectors may need additional sections to be added.

==An Example Conversion From UGAIM To UGRM==

'''This section will apply if you're migrating an existing OpenSim 0.6.6 installation to OpenSim 0.6.7.'''

Converting from UGAIM to UGRM:

Kudos to diva and Melanie_t for helping and tolerating me (smxy).

My initial setup:

Full HG-enabled, Internet-accessible, Grid Mode system, using MySQL and split over two servers.

UGAIM and MySQL 5.0 run in two separate 32-bit CentOS 5.3 Xen VMs on a 64-bit CentOS 5.3 system. 
Each region runs in its own instance of OpenSim.exe on a 32-bit Windows XP SP3 Home system. 
OSWI runs on the Windows system too.

Bring down the regions. Bring down UGAIM.

Then, the port for the inventory server needs to be changed from 8004 to 8003 in

OpenSim.ini: "inventory_server_url" - For all regions and the UGRM server. 
GridCommon.ini: "InventoryServerURI" - For all regions and the UGRM server. 
UserServer_Config.xml: "default_inventory_server" - For the UGRM server.

In the MySQL database, in the "users" table, the userInventoryURI field needs to be updated for all users.

In OSWI's config file, update "$userInventoryURI".

AssetServer_Config.xml and InventoryServer_Config.xml can be deleted from the UGRM server.

On the UGRM server, copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to OpenSim.Server.ini and edit it, changing the "ConnectionString" entries appropriately, in the [AssetService] and [InventoryService] sections.

Bring up UGRM. Bring up regions.

Semi-unrelated Note: According to Melanie_t, any of the UGRM servers can be restarted independently,
without needing to restart the other three. However, if you restart the UserServer, you must issue
the command "register" (without the quotes) at the MessagingServer console, afterwards.

==An Example Conversion From UGRM To URM==

'''This section will only apply if you're migrating from OpenSim 0.6.7 to 0.6.8

Converting from UGRM to URM:

This is a continuation of my "UGAIM to UGRM" example above. I may merge the two examples, eventually.

Bring down the regions. Bring down UGRM.

'''Make sure that you don't override any of these files - they should be used as they come out of the repository:'''
config-include/Grid.ini
config-include/GridHypergrid.ini
config-include/Standalone.ini
config-include/StandalioneHypergrid.ini

'''Also make sure that you include new additions in config-include/*Common.ini.example into your config-include/*Common.ini'''

Then, the port for the grid server needs to be changed from 8001 to 8003 in

UserServer_Config.xml: "default_grid_server" - For the URM server. 
MessagingServer_Config.xml: "default_grid_server" - For the URM server.

On the URM server, save a copy of your existing OpenSim.Server.ini. Copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to OpenSim.Server.ini. Edit it to reflect any changes you made in the previous version. Then edit the "ConnectionString" entry, appropriately, in the [GridService] section.

GridServer_Config.xml can be deleted from the URM server.

Bring up URM. Bring up regions.

==An Example Conversion From URM To R==

'''This section will only applies if you're migrating to the very latest Git master OpenSim code (since commit a9580eb on Tue Mar 2nd 2010)

Starting in the presence-refactor branch, the default configuration is one single server running ALL resource services, plus whatever number of simulators you have.

Bring down the regions. Bring down URM.

'''Make sure that you don't override any of these files - they should be used as they come out of the repository:'''
config-include/Grid.ini
config-include/GridHypergrid.ini
config-include/Standalone.ini
config-include/StandalioneHypergrid.ini

'''Also make sure that you include new additions in config-include/GridCommon.ini.example into your config-include/GridCommon.ini'''

On the R server, copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to OpenSim.Server.ini. Edit it to reflect your setup. In particular edit the "ConnectionString" entry, appropriately. Also notice new configuration variables in the [GridService] section, where you can now define default and fallback regions for your grid.

If you want your grid to support the Hypergrid functionality -- both letting your users go out and letting outside users come in -- use OpenSim.Server.ini.HG.example as the basis of your setup instead of OpenSim.Server.ini.example. Copy it to OpenSim.Server.ini, and make the changes there.

All *_Config.xml files are now obsolete and can be removed.

Start your services:
$ [mono] OpenSim.Server.exe

Note that the default configuration starts '''2''' processes, one listening in port 8002 and the other listening in 8003. We have placed the services that need to be exposed to the internet in port 8002; all services that don't need to be exposed are in port 8003. To secure your grid you can now put port 8003 behind your firewall. '''Unless you know what you are doing, leave the port numbers exactly as they come out of the package; change only the host names everywhere they need to be changed.'''

=== Tips ===
If you're using MySQL in a standalone, you might see an error like this when you first start OpenSim after updating.

18:27:39 - [SERVICE BASE]: Failed to load plugin OpenSim.Data.IFriendsData from OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll with args URI=file:friends.db,version=3, FriendsSystem.Reflection.TargetInvocationException: Exception has been thrown by the target of an invocation. ---> System.ArgumentException: Keyword not supported.
Parameter name: uri

...

18:27:39 - Error loading plugin from OpenSim.Services.FriendsService.dll, exception System.Exception: Could not find a storage interface IFriendsData in the given StorageProvider OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll

This is because the new StorageProvider parameters in config-include/Standalone.ini are all for SQLite. If you comment these out then things should work again.

== Explanation of some services ==

* GatekeeperService
** Hypergrid v1.5-related
** for control of incoming foreign users
* UserAgentService
** Hypergrid v1.5-related
** for control of outgoing local users
* HGInventoryService
** Hypergrid v1.5-related
** optional
** accompanies UserAgentService
** allows access to home inventory in a "special" way
*** doesn't send root folder to outside grids
*** doesn't allow delete operations
* AvatarService
** formerly known as avatar appearance

==Moving any service to its own ROBUST shell ==

'''This section contains advanced material. Normally you can ignore this.'''

If you have a large grid, you may want to run different sets of services in their own ROBUST shell in separate machines, instead of all in one. For example, you may want to single out the Login Service with all the other outside-the-firewall services in its own machine; the Grid Service in its own machine; the Asset Service in its own machine; etc. With ROBUST any service, or any combination of services, can be easily grouped into their own ROBUST shells. If so, do this:

* Copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to your own copy in each machine you want to run of these servers.
* Edit each. Pay attention to all the server connectors that are given in the [Startup] section. Pick & choose whichever you want in that particular machine.
* In each configuration section you now need to pay attention to the auxiliary service connectors, and, maybe, change them appropriately. For example, the Login Service needs to access the Inventory Service in order to get the user's inventory upon login. In the default configuration, that dependency is given under the [LoginService] section by the variable
InventoryService = "OpenSim.Services.InventoryService.dll:InventoryService"
If you separate the login service from the inventory service, the corresponding 'InventoryService' variable under [LoginService] should be changed to
InventoryService = "OpenSim.Services.Connectors.dll:InventoryServicesConnector"
Then in the [InventoryService] section of this Login server config, you'd have
[InventoryService]
InventoryServerURI = "http://myinventoryserver.com:myport"
instead of what you have by default.
* Save the configuration and start the server as normal
* Note that you can start the server like this:
$ OpenSim.Server.exe -inifile=OpenSim.MyServer.ini -logfile=/some/path/to/some/file
* Start all other ROBUST servers you may want to have
* In your simulators, make sure to update GridCommon.ini to point to the correct URLs
* Start your sims

ROBUST

2010-03-19T14:36:33Z

DaveCoyle: added some notes re: new services

==Redesigned OpenSim Basic Universal Server Technology (ROBUST)==
===Concepts===
ROBUST leverages the system of in and out connectors and services that was developed for the Hypergrid and OpenSim. It replaces OGS1 with a modular architecture that can be easily extended using core and 3rd party modules.

ROBUST is a flexible server shell that can load the same modules already used by regions. This allows for nearly 100% code reusability and great flexibility.

The ROBUST server loads "in" connectors as specified in the configuration file. These connectors then load the required processing and storage modules and/or "out" connectors. Through this architecture, each ROBUST server can run any or all grid services, and/or act as a proxy for grid services.

===Configuration===
The server reads a configuration file at startup, which defaults to the name of the assembly with .ini appended. The default name for the ROBUST server is OpenSim.Server.exe, therefore the default configuration file is OpenSim.Server.ini. An OpenSim.Server.ini.example file is provided with the OpenSim kit. The default port for all services running in ROBUST is 8003 as you can see below.

; * The startup section lists all the connectors to start up in this server
; * instance. This may be only one, or it may be the entire server suite.
; * Multiple connectors should be seaprated by commas.
; *
; * These are the IN connectors the server uses, the in connectors
; * read this config file and load the needed OUT and database connectors
; *
[Startup]
ServiceConnectors = "OpenSim.Server.Handlers.dll:AssetServiceConnector,OpenSim.Server.Handlers.dll:InventoryServiceInConnector"

; * This is common for all services, it's the network setup for the entire
; * server instance
; *
[Network]
port = 8003

; * As an example, the below configuration precisely mimicks the legacy
; * asset server. It is read by the asset IN connector (defined above)
; * and it then loads the OUT connector (a local database module). That,
; * in turn, reads the asset loader and database connection information
; *
[AssetService]
LocalServiceModule = "OpenSim.Services.AssetService.dll:AssetService"
DefaultAssetLoader = "OpenSim.Framework.AssetLoader.Filesystem.dll"
AssetLoaderArgs = "assets/AssetSets.xml"
StorageProvider = "OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll"
ConnectionString = "Data Source=localhost;Database=grid;User ID=grid;Password=grid;"

; * This configuration loads the inventory server modules. It duplicates
; * the function of the legacy inventory server
; *
[InventoryService]
LocalServiceModule = "OpenSim.Services.InventoryService.dll:InventoryService"
UserServerURI = "http://127.0.0.1:8002"
SessionAuthentication = "false"
StorageProvider = "OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll"
ConnectionString = "Data Source=localhost;Database=grid;User ID=grid;Password=grid;"

===Command Line Arguments===
*-inifile
:Specify the location of the .ini file to read instead of the default
*-console
:Specify console type, one of basic, local or rest
*-logfile
:Specify the logfile this server will log to
*-prompt
:Override the server prompt

==Configuration File==
===Section [Startup]===
*ServiceConnectors
:Comma separated list of service IN connectors. The format of each entry is <dllname>:<classname>. If a dll contains only one suitable class, the class name can be omitted.
*Prompt
:Override the server prompt
*Console
:Specify console type, one of basic, local or rest
*Logfile
:Specify the logfile this server will log to

===Section [Network]===
*Port
:Set the network port to listen on. All services will run on this port.

==Connector Configurations==
These configurations are provided by the connector modules and are not an integral part of the ROBUST server. Documentation to all possible options can be found in the documentation of the connector. This manual only lists the options present in the sample configuration file.

===Section [AssetService]===
* LocalServiceModule [Connector option]
:A module specification (<dll>:<class>) that provides the services for this connector
* DefaultAssetLoader [Service option]
:A dll containing the asset loader to use for loading the default asset set
* AssetLoaderArgs [Service option]
:Path to load assets from (for the file system asset loader)
* StorageProvider [Service option]
:Dll containing the database provider code
* ConnectionString [Service option]
:Connection string to be passed to the database provider

===Section [InventoryService]===
* LocalServiceModule [Connector option]
:A module specification (<dll>:<class>) that provides the services for this connector
* UserServerURI [Connector option]
:URI to reach the user server at
* SessionAuthentication [Connector option]
:Authenticate inventory sessions (default false!)
* StorageProvider [Service option]
:Dll containing the database provider code
* ConnectionString [Service option]
:Connection string to be passed to the database provider

Additional connectors may need additional sections to be added.

==An Example Conversion From UGAIM To UGRM==

'''This section will apply if you're migrating an existing OpenSim 0.6.6 installation to OpenSim 0.6.7.'''

Converting from UGAIM to UGRM:

Kudos to diva and Melanie_t for helping and tolerating me (smxy).

My initial setup:

Full HG-enabled, Internet-accessible, Grid Mode system, using MySQL and split over two servers.

UGAIM and MySQL 5.0 run in two separate 32-bit CentOS 5.3 Xen VMs on a 64-bit CentOS 5.3 system. 
Each region runs in its own instance of OpenSim.exe on a 32-bit Windows XP SP3 Home system. 
OSWI runs on the Windows system too.

Bring down the regions. Bring down UGAIM.

Then, the port for the inventory server needs to be changed from 8004 to 8003 in

OpenSim.ini: "inventory_server_url" - For all regions and the UGRM server. 
GridCommon.ini: "InventoryServerURI" - For all regions and the UGRM server. 
UserServer_Config.xml: "default_inventory_server" - For the UGRM server.

In the MySQL database, in the "users" table, the userInventoryURI field needs to be updated for all users.

In OSWI's config file, update "$userInventoryURI".

AssetServer_Config.xml and InventoryServer_Config.xml can be deleted from the UGRM server.

On the UGRM server, copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to OpenSim.Server.ini and edit it, changing the "ConnectionString" entries appropriately, in the [AssetService] and [InventoryService] sections.

Bring up UGRM. Bring up regions.

Semi-unrelated Note: According to Melanie_t, any of the UGRM servers can be restarted independently,
without needing to restart the other three. However, if you restart the UserServer, you must issue
the command "register" (without the quotes) at the MessagingServer console, afterwards.

==An Example Conversion From UGRM To URM==

'''This section will only apply if you're migrating from OpenSim 0.6.7 to 0.6.8

Converting from UGRM to URM:

This is a continuation of my "UGAIM to UGRM" example above. I may merge the two examples, eventually.

Bring down the regions. Bring down UGRM.

'''Make sure that you don't override any of these files - they should be used as they come out of the repository:'''
config-include/Grid.ini
config-include/GridHypergrid.ini
config-include/Standalone.ini
config-include/StandalioneHypergrid.ini

'''Also make sure that you include new additions in config-include/*Common.ini.example into your config-include/*Common.ini'''

Then, the port for the grid server needs to be changed from 8001 to 8003 in

UserServer_Config.xml: "default_grid_server" - For the URM server. 
MessagingServer_Config.xml: "default_grid_server" - For the URM server.

On the URM server, save a copy of your existing OpenSim.Server.ini. Copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to OpenSim.Server.ini. Edit it to reflect any changes you made in the previous version. Then edit the "ConnectionString" entry, appropriately, in the [GridService] section.

GridServer_Config.xml can be deleted from the URM server.

Bring up URM. Bring up regions.

==An Example Conversion From URM To R==

'''This section will only applies if you're migrating to the very latest Git master OpenSim code (since commit a9580eb on Tue Mar 2nd 2010)

Starting in the presence-refactor branch, the default configuration is one single server running ALL resource services, plus whatever number of simulators you have.

Bring down the regions. Bring down URM.

'''Make sure that you don't override any of these files - they should be used as they come out of the repository:'''
config-include/Grid.ini
config-include/GridHypergrid.ini
config-include/Standalone.ini
config-include/StandalioneHypergrid.ini

'''Also make sure that you include new additions in config-include/GridCommon.ini.example into your config-include/GridCommon.ini'''

On the R server, copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to OpenSim.Server.ini. Edit it to reflect your setup. In particular edit the "ConnectionString" entry, appropriately. Also notice new configuration variables in the [GridService] section, where you can now define default and fallback regions for your grid.

If you want your grid to support the Hypergrid functionality -- both letting your users go out and letting outside users come in -- use OpenSim.Server.ini.HG.example as the basis of your setup instead of OpenSim.Server.ini.example. Copy it to OpenSim.Server.ini, and make the changes there.

All *_Config.xml files are now obsolete and can be removed.

Start your services:
$ [mono] OpenSim.Server.exe

Note that the default configuration starts '''2''' processes, one listening in port 8002 and the other listening in 8003. We have placed the services that need to be exposed to the internet in port 8002; all services that don't need to be exposed are in port 8003. To secure your grid you can now put port 8003 behind your firewall. '''Unless you know what you are doing, leave the port numbers exactly as they come out of the package; change only the host names everywhere they need to be changed.'''

=== Tips ===
If you're using MySQL in a standalone, you might see an error like this when you first start OpenSim after updating.

18:27:39 - [SERVICE BASE]: Failed to load plugin OpenSim.Data.IFriendsData from OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll with args URI=file:friends.db,version=3, FriendsSystem.Reflection.TargetInvocationException: Exception has been thrown by the target of an invocation. ---> System.ArgumentException: Keyword not supported.
Parameter name: uri

...

18:27:39 - Error loading plugin from OpenSim.Services.FriendsService.dll, exception System.Exception: Could not find a storage interface IFriendsData in the given StorageProvider OpenSim.Data.MySQL.dll

This is because the new StorageProvider parameters in config-include/Standalone.ini are all for SQLite. If you comment these out then things should work again.

=== Explanation of some services ===

* GatekeeperService
** Hypergrid v1.5-related
** for control of incoming foreign users
* UserAgentService
** Hypergrid v1.5-related
** for control of outgoing local users
* HGInventoryService
** Hypergrid v1.5-related
** optional
** accompanies UserAgentService
** allows access to home inventory in a "special" way
*** doesn't send root folder to outside grids
*** doesn't allow delete operations
* AvatarService
** formerly known as avatar appearance

==Moving any service to its own ROBUST shell ==

'''This section contains advanced material. Normally you can ignore this.'''

If you have a large grid, you may want to run different sets of services in their own ROBUST shell in separate machines, instead of all in one. For example, you may want to single out the Login Service with all the other outside-the-firewall services in its own machine; the Grid Service in its own machine; the Asset Service in its own machine; etc. With ROBUST any service, or any combination of services, can be easily grouped into their own ROBUST shells. If so, do this:

* Copy OpenSim.Server.ini.example to your own copy in each machine you want to run of these servers.
* Edit each. Pay attention to all the server connectors that are given in the [Startup] section. Pick & choose whichever you want in that particular machine.
* In each configuration section you now need to pay attention to the auxiliary service connectors, and, maybe, change them appropriately. For example, the Login Service needs to access the Inventory Service in order to get the user's inventory upon login. In the default configuration, that dependency is given under the [LoginService] section by the variable
InventoryService = "OpenSim.Services.InventoryService.dll:InventoryService"
If you separate the login service from the inventory service, the corresponding 'InventoryService' variable under [LoginService] should be changed to
InventoryService = "OpenSim.Services.Connectors.dll:InventoryServicesConnector"
Then in the [InventoryService] section of this Login server config, you'd have
[InventoryService]
InventoryServerURI = "http://myinventoryserver.com:myport"
instead of what you have by default.
* Save the configuration and start the server as normal
* Note that you can start the server like this:
$ OpenSim.Server.exe -inifile=OpenSim.MyServer.ini -logfile=/some/path/to/some/file
* Start all other ROBUST servers you may want to have
* In your simulators, make sure to update GridCommon.ini to point to the correct URLs
* Start your sims

Dependencies

2010-03-09T15:22:23Z

DaveCoyle: the "best" or "easiest" Linux distro is a religious argument. It's really up to personal preference.

__NOTOC__ {{Template:Quicklinks}} In addition to the OpenSim code itself, certain other packages need to be installed on different platforms in order to get OpenSim binaries to run.

As well as the information on this page (which should be expanded), you may find more information on dependencies in [[Build Instructions]] though this will also contain dependencies required only for building. This are also more hints in [[Troubleshooting]]

== Windows ==

When using OpenSim on Windows XP ensure it is updated to at least Service Pack 2 (SP2).

When using OpenSim on Windows XP, VISTA, Win-7, Server 2003 & 2008, You need to have the newest version of the .NET Framework 3.5 sp1 (3.51), available from Microsoft Download Centre: [http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=ab99342f-5d1a-413d-8319-81da479ab0d7&displaylang=en www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx] [[|]]

32-Bit Operating System:  Start/Run OpenSim.exe

64-Bit Operating System:  Start/Run OpenSim.32BitLaunch.exe

Depending on your installation, you may have to run the program as administrator. (right click run as a administrator)

NOTE:  Windows Versions prior to XP such as NT, 2000 are not supported.  NET Framework 4.0 not officially supported by OpenSim yet.

== Linux ==

[[Image:Imbox content.png]] '''SECTION REQUIRES UPDATING  ''''''(''MONO Version 2.4.2.x is the MINIMUM Required Version of Mono to run OpenSim.)'''''

 

Note: For people who have mono 2.0.1 or later installed, it may not be necessary to install the libmono-oracle2.0-cil package detailed below separately.

 

=== Ubuntu 8.04 (Hardy) / 8.10 (Intrepid) / 9.04 (Jaunty) ===

sudo apt-get install subversion nant mono-gmcs libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil libmono-oracle2.0-cil ruby

''Note for Ubuntu 8.04 (Hardy) users'': You can use the built in packages for mono. However, for better performance, you may want to [http://xyzzyxyzzy.net/2008/05/08/updated-mono-build-script-for-hardy-heron-and-mono-191/ upgrade mono to 1.9.1] ([http://tempvariable.blogspot.com/2008/04/installing-mono-191-on-ubuntu-804-hardy.html Other simple method])

 

=== CentOS 5.2 (Final) ===

You made need to include libmono-oracle2.0-cil will check tonight - Kane

yum install subversion nant mono-gmcs libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil ruby

 

 

== Additional Resources ==

OSGrid Technical Support Forum with many installation tutorials:  [http://osgrid.org/forums/viewforum.php?f=14 osgrid.org/forums/viewforum.php]

MONO Project:  [http://www.mono-project.com/Main_Page www.mono-project.com/Main_Page]

Public Hypergrid Nodes

2009-11-21T13:53:42Z

DaveCoyle: rmoved incorrect info

{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 

__TOC__

== Hypergrid-enabled sims ==

The following is a list of hypergrid-ready nodes that you can use for testing your installation and for linking your world. Please add your public node here if you wish to help build a web of opensims!

For the time being, and until the security concerns are addressed, we advise you to be careful about who you link to.

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
![[Hypergrid|link-region server and port]]
!Organization
!Description
!Grid Location
|-
|'''osl2.nac.uci.edu:9006'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The "UCI Welcome" region connected to OSGrid. It is run by Diva (Crista Lopes) on a machine owned by the University of California, Irvine. You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''osl3.nac.uci.edu:9000'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The "UC Irvine" region connected to OSGrid, neighboring Wright Plaza. You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''ucigrid02.nacs.uci.edu:9000'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid
|UCIGrid is centered at 8,888, 8,888

|-
|'''ucigrid04.nacs.uci.edu:9003'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid, region "Gateway 3000". Link your lower-1,000's grid to this node in order to bridge to grids in the 10,000's.
|This node is positioned at 3,000, 3,000

|-
|'''ucigrid04.nacs.uci.edu:9007'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid, region "Gateway 7000". Link your 10,000's grid to this node in order to bridge to grids in the lower-1,000's.
|This node is positioned at 7,000, 7,000.

|-
|'''www.meanduland.com:9124'''
|Grid Meanduland
|[http://www.menduland.com], Meanduland - by Ayana and Frank Northmead. Residential grid and playground for couples. Quite, peaceful and fun. Regular live music concerts and coming soon - rpg's, adventure simulations, private beaches, sail boat racing, dune buggy racing, and much much more. All welcome, no membership or landownership requirements, you just need desire to have fun and be a good neighbor. Regions available at cost during Alpha and Beta development of OpenSim.
|Centered at 8000, 8000

|-
|'''grid.cyberlandia.net:9000'''
|Cyberlandia
|The "Cyberlandia Gw" region. http://www.cyberlandia.net Metaverso italiano 3D, more to 250 region and 1000 users. You can link to it as a way to link to Cyberlandia.
|Cyberlandia is centered at ???

|-
|'''hypergrid.cyberlandia.net:9000'''
|Cyberlandia
|The "Osgrid Gw" region connected to Cyberlandia grid http://www.cyberlandia.net. Search on map "Cyberlandia grid" You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''regions.ralf-haifisch.biz:9000:Sharkland Tropical 1'''
|Ralf Haifisch on osgrid
|The "Sharkland Tropical" region connected to OSGrid. German welcome aerea, Freebie aerea, region rental, pretty tropical regions
|Centered at 10000,10000

|-
|'''joomla-italia.net:9000'''
|Social Network Italia
|The "SNI City" region connected to SNI (Social Network Italia) grid http://www.opensim-italia.net. This grid is connected with Osgrid,Collateral World,Francogrid and Darwin
|Centered at ???

|-
|'''collateral.opensim-italia.net:9000'''
|Part of Social Network Italia
|Collateral World
|Centered at ???

|-
|'''88.191.79.199:9050'''
|Francogrid
|Francogrid node, connected to "City", behind the welcome land of Francogrid "Orion"
|Centered at 1000 1000

|-
|'''94.23.8.158:9300'''
|Le Monde de Darwin
|The Lost World of Darwin http://www.LeMondedeDarwin.com. [[Image:hypergrid.jpg|200px]]
|Centered at 1000 1000

|-
|'''sg.k-grid.com:9000'''
|K-Grid
|The Kool grid for the Kool KidZ . Feel free to visit us. The main Gateway is located at 3700,3700 so take that in account before any HyperJump. Adress updated 02/07/09
|This node is located at 3700,3700

|-
|'''metropolis.hypergrid.org:9000'''
|METROPOLIS-Grid
|The Region "Center-World" connected to the METROPOLIS-Grid http://metropolis.hypergrid.org . German Grid with a lot of free Content and free SIM-hosting. Connected via HG to the most of the Grids listed here
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''ascent.bluewallgroup.com:9910'''
|BlueWall Information Technologies
|This region is in a good proximity @ (6000,6000) for intermediate jumps to OSGrid from grids in the (2000,2000) range, or any region within 4096 units. [[Image:Hypernaut 001.png|150px|none|thumb|Get your Hypernaut here :)]]
|Centered at 6000,6000

|-
|'''http://myopengrid.com:9005/'''
|'''MyOpenGrid'''
|Myopengrid is connected to osl2.nac.uci.edu "Osgrid Gateway" and 88.191.79.199 9050 "Franco Grid"
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''cuonsim1.de:9300'''
|Cuon-Grid
|Cuon-Grid is a little grid and has some Main Sims with linux themes, server are in Germany. To login in to the grid use this http://sim-linuxmain.org:8081/CuonGrid/index.html. There are free sims for testing.
|Centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''metaversesims.net:9000'''
|Metaverse Sims
|6-region standalone hypergrid linked to several other grids.
|Centered at 9000, 9000

|-

|'''grid4us.net:9020'''
|Grid4Us
|Multi cultural Grid with 65 Regions and over 350 Users. Come,look and enjoy.
|Centered at 8500,8500

|-
|'''87.230.89.74:9000 '''
|SCHWARZE WELT
| inworld location of www.schwarze-welle.de , the maybe biggest dark music streaming readio
| 100000 10000

|-
|'''peak.sciencesim.com:9001'''
|ScienceSim
|[http://www.sciencesim.com/ ScienceSim] is a virtual world created for the high performance computing community for scientific visualizations, a number of interesting real world terrains (Mt St Helens and Yellowstone Park) and some astronomical simulations. And some useful, BSD-licensed content.
| Centered at 10000,10000

|-
|'''alpha.bubblecloud.org:9000'''
|Bubble Cloud
|The alpha 00 is the entrance area to bubble cloud grid. Bubble cloud is test grid where anyone can experiment. If you build something please do it in medieval fantasy setting for others to enjoy.
|Centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''opensim.mydyn.de:9090'''
|OpenSIM.de Sim1
|[http://www.opensim.de OpenSim.de], 4 Server (Linux/Windows), hypergrided standalones, 16 Regions, German Users (Deutsche Benutzer), Live-Support, IRC-Gateway, Wiki, FAQ, Howto´s, Downloads. Connected to most of the Grids and some hypergrided standalones.
|Centered at 4400,4400

|-
|'''64.150.180.188:9031'''
|Virtual World Trade Center
|[http://PleasurePlanet.net], The VWTC. A repository for freebie items to share with the OS community. Weekly oar files will be made freely available on 4shared.com.
|VWTC is at 3003, 3003

|-
|'''jamland.de:9300'''
|Grid Jamland
|[http://Jamland.de], German Grid .. 9 regions with Sandbox (Jamland9) Fort (Jamland11) Schloss (Jamland6) Sahara (Jamland5) Office (Jamland2)
|Centered at 8000, 8000

|-
|'''condensationland.com:9000'''
|Zonja Capalini
| Condensation Land Grid, 5 regions and links to several other HG-enabled sims.
|Centered at 7789, 7789

|-
|'''condensationland.com:20000'''
|Zonja Capalini
| The Condensation Gateway region in OSGrid, statically hyperlinked to the Condensation Land Grid.
|Region at 3789,3789

|-
|'''66.240.232.94:9010'''
|Snoopy Pfeffer
| OSGrid, Samsara, freebie shopping region
|Centered at 10006, 9999

|-
|'''66.240.232.94:9011'''
|Snoopy Pfeffer
| OSGrid, Snoopies, dance club and event region
|Centered at 10005, 9999

|-
|'''twistedsky.net:9000'''
|Twisted Sky
| Welcome region on the Twisted Sky World Grid (at 998, 1000) - http://twistedsky.net
|Centered at 1000, 1000

|}

'''PLEASE NOTE The Discussion @ the Top for additional information'''

== External directories of Hypergrid-enabled sims ==

* [http://www.gridhop.net GridHop]

[[Category:Hypergrid]]

Show git version numbers - Linux

2009-11-17T18:18:15Z

DaveCoyle: Undo revision 15740 by DaveCoyle (Talk)

One component required to use this process.

'''1.''' The revtag.sh shell script

'''Usage:'''

Copy the revtag.sh into the git reposity, immediately above the bin folder. NOTE! is you perform a git clean this revtag.sh will be removed from the folder structure therefore you will have to copy it back in, I suggest you have a copy of it handy somewhere.   The Output will be '''6d3d985 - r11191 '''as an example. 

For Example:

/OpenSim_GIT

/OpenSim_GIT/opensim

/OpenSim_GIT/opensim/bin

Place this in '''/OpenSim_GIT/opensim'''

To run the script use the following command '''bash revtag.sh'''

'''The Shell Script:'''  revtag.sh
<blockquote> git log -n 1 --decorate --oneline | sed -e s/,.*$//' -e 's,(r/,- r,'` > bin/.version </blockquote>
 --[[User:WhiteStar|WhiteStar]] 01:54, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Show git version numbers - Linux

2009-11-17T17:58:17Z

DaveCoyle: simplified git command with something 1) shorter and 2) that works with more recent versions of git

One component required to use this process.

'''1.''' The revtag.sh shell script

'''Usage:'''

Copy the revtag.sh into the git reposity, immediately above the bin folder. NOTE! is you perform a git clean this revtag.sh will be removed from the folder structure therefore you will have to copy it back in, I suggest you have a copy of it handy somewhere.   The Output will be '''6d3d985 - r11191 '''as an example. 

For Example:

/OpenSim_GIT

/OpenSim_GIT/opensim

/OpenSim_GIT/opensim/bin

Place this in '''/OpenSim_GIT/opensim'''

To run the script use the following command '''bash revtag.sh'''

'''The Shell Script:'''  revtag.sh
<blockquote> git log -n 1 --pretty='format:%h: %ci' > bin/.version </blockquote>
 --[[User:WhiteStar|WhiteStar]] 01:54, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Build Instructions

2009-11-10T02:04:36Z

DaveCoyle: ubuntu mono stuff was out-of-date

{{Template:Quicklinks}}

[[Category:Users]]
This page covers building OpenSim from source code on multiple platforms. Please help us keep this page up to date as the project progresses.

==Download OpenSim ==
Check out the [[Download]] page for instructions on obtaining an OpenSim source release.

==MS Windows==

OpenSim requires either the .Net framework version 2.0, or the latest Mono. It supports the following compilers:
* [http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/express/aa700756.aspx Microsoft Visual C# Express Edition] (note: not Visual C++)
* [http://www.mono-project.com/ mono]

Additional note: If you like IDE's you will need C# express 2008 or VS 2008.

Additional note: Microsoft C# Express v9 may install .Net 3.5 with resultant path error.
# To avoid install .Net framework version 2.0

Additional note: It is possible to develop on Windows Vista 64 bits with the following tweaks:
# Select OpenSim project properties from solution and choose platform to be x86. Rebuild solution.
# Select OpenSim.exe properties under solution bin folder and choose windows xp sp 2 compatibility mode + run as administrator.

=== Building ===

* In the top-level directory, run the '<tt>runprebuild.bat</tt>' file. This will create a VS2008 solution file, a nant build file and a '<tt>compile.bat</tt>' file.

* Open the resulting sln file with visual studio and build it there, or
* Run the '<tt>compile.bat</tt>' file. This will build the executable using MSBuild.
* if you prefer to use nant, run nant in the same top-level directory. This will build the executables.

If you don't care about physics (walking on prims, etc), ignore the rest of this section.

=== Running ===

Recent versions of OpenSim come without an <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> file. Copy the <tt>OpenSim.ini.example</tt> file to <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> before making any changes.

Double-click on the <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> executable file in the <tt>bin</tt> directory. This will start up OpenSim in standalone mode.

The debugger in VS2005 C# may be used to step through the code. For those that use a Cygwin shell, you may find that one or more dll's have permissions that cause problems running. Most find that a "<tt>chmod 777 *</tt>" from the <tt>bin</tt> directory solves this.

Physics can be invoked by adding the appropriate line to the [Startup] section of <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt>. For ODE, that would be:

physics = OpenDynamicsEngine

You can also add a command line option to a shortcut, or run from a command prompt with:

-physics=OpenDynamicsEngine

'''''Windows Vista'''''

Some people have reported that to run on Windows Vista, you must first disable Windows Firewall. Under the new "Start" button of Vista, select "Control panel". Then double-click "Windows Firewall". In the window that pops up, on the left column, select "Turn Windows Firewall on or off". You will have to give permission for this to run, then select the option "Off (not recommended)". Click "OK" and exit from the Windows Firewall window.

If you have McAfee SecurityCenter, see the description below.

Once all the security features are disabled, right click on <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> and select "Run as administrator". This will pop up a window asking permission, select "Allow". Your OpenSim server should run in a DOS-like window and accept connections.

'''''McAfee Security'''''

McAfee Security does not allow applications to listen on ports not explicitly specified. You have two options: 1) disable firewall protection all together, 2) enable <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> to be able to open ports.

''Disable firewall''

Open McAfee SecurityCenter. Select "Internet & Network". In the lower left corner is a small link to "Configure...". Select this. In the right side of the window, select the bar that says "Firewall protection is enabled". Here you can select "Off".

''Enable <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> to open ports''

Open McAfee SecurityCenter. Select "Internet & Network". In the lower left corner is a small link to "Configure...". Select this. In the right side of the window, select the bar that says "Firewall protection is enabled". Select the "Advanced..." button. This will pop up a new window.

In the new window, on the left side, select "Program Permissions." In the middle on the right side of the window, select the "Add Allowed Program" button. Use the browser that pops up to find the OpenSim executable and select it.

Finally, select "OK" and exit the McAfee SecurityCenter window.

==Linux/Mac OS X/FreeBSD==

The easiest plaform to get running on the Linux side is Ubuntu 8.10, 32bit. This is what most of the developers running Linux use. If you are looking for the quick path, start there.

=== Ubuntu ===

For Ubuntu users on older distributions (7.10, 8.04, etc.) '''you need''' to upgrade your version of mono to at least 2.4.

Ubuntu Karmic (9.10) includes mono 2.4.2.3 packages.

To build:

sudo apt-get install nant mono-gmcs libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil libmono-oracle2.0-cil
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

=== openSUSE 10.3/11/11.1 ===

Install an openSUSE 11.1, 11 or 10.3 with its default options, add the online repositories
when finished installing do an online update with all the latest packages.

In yast install these packages, for running Opensim in standalone mode.
(there is a slight diffrence between 10.3 and 11/11.1 but following should be same)
subversion
nant
mono-jscript
- check that mono-core is installed

just in case you do not already have it installed

sudo zypper install mono-data-oracle

A tip for OpenSuSE 11.1 users - you can install packages from the command line using the 'zypper' tool. For example, to install 'nant', use this command:

sudo zypper install nant

If you just want to use SQLite then jump to last section
within this post.

* Optional mysql - for Opensim running in Grid mode:
Install these mysql packages via yast
mysql
mysql-client
mysql-administrator
mysql-gui-tools
mysql-query-browser

(note that selecting mysql in the Yast2 Installer will select the other packages automatically)

Before building create the mysql database.
/etc/init.d/mysql start
mysql -u root -p -h localhost
(when asked for password just hit enter)

mysql> create database opensim;
mysql> use opensim;
mysql> create user 'opensim'@'localhost' identified by 'thePassword';
mysql> grant all on *.* to 'opensim'@'localhost';
mysql> quit

*note that the '''grant all''' command may differ if you're adding the opensim database to an existing mysql installation.

On current builds set the connection string inside bin/OpenSim.ini after coppying the OpenSim.ini.example file.
If you are changing to MySQL from SQLite, the connection string for mysql also exists in the bin/Region/*xml files.
* It is '''important''' to remember this if you start out using the built-in SQLite database engine.

Build after installation of above in bash terminal. I save it in /opt

su -
cd /opt
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

Or, if you have a current (0.6+), you can simply execute:

make

After this you should be able to continue on starting the diffrent Servers, look in the mysql-config section,or
just run your OpenSim as a Standalone. By - eagleFX

=== Mac OS X 10.5/10.4 ===
* OpenSim is now working on PowerPC Macs! Thanks to DrScofield and those who helped him. Current nightly builds for PowerPC are not working, not sure about Intel so use the 0.5 Build. OpenSim works on Intel Macs. I'm testing on PowerBook G4. Tested these step on 10.5, but not 10.4 but should work --[[User:Mokele|Mokele]] 22:36, 14 February 2008 (PST) (Works on iMac G5 with OS 10.4.11, including expanding to local grid mode. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-15 10:50 (CET))
* Install XCode Developers Tools from DVD/CD Installation Disk or download from http://developer.apple.com/. You have to create an Apple account to access the downloads if you don't have an Apple account.
* Install X11 for 10.4 from the Optional Install from the DVD/CD Installation Disk. X11 for 10.5 is installed by default.
* Install Mono 1.2.5 from http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/archive/1.2.5/macos-10-universal/5/MonoFramework-1.2.5_5.macos10.novell.universal.dmg (The more recent releases Mono 1.2.6, 1.9.1 and 2.0.1 do not appear to work with these installation instructions. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-14 15:56 (CET)) and in Terminal or X11 edit the .profile file and add the following line:
export PKG_CONFIG_PATH="/Library/Frameworks/Mono.framework/Versions/Current/lib/pkgconfig/:${PKG_CONFIG_PATH}"
* Compile OpenSim
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim/tags/0.5.0-release opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

* Download and Compile libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib and libsecondlife.dll
* libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib:
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/old/libsl1550 opensim-libs
cd opensim-libs/openjpeg-libsl
make -f Makefile.osx
cp libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib ../../bin
* Note: The Makefile that creates the libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so does not compile on PowerPC, but works properly on Intel Macs. Looks like a gcc issue with compile options. (It appears to work on iMac G5 with OS X 10.4.11. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-14 15:55 (CET))

* libsecondlife.dll: (for PowerPC Only, see details on this step [http://xyzzyxyzzy.net/2008/02/12/installing-opensim-on-powerpcor-of-eggs-and-virtual-worlds installing OpenSim on PowerPC…or: of eggs and virtual worlds])
cd .. (back into opensim-libs)
nant
cp bin/libsecondlife.dll ../bin

* Edit the libsecondlife.dll.config (PowerPC Only). Remove the cpu="x86" tag in the last dllmap line.

Here is what worked for me (OS X 10.5.7, Intel):

* make sure you have X11 installed
* grab the Apple Dev Tools from [http://developer.apple.com/]
* install Mono Framework 2.4 from [http://www.go-mono.com/mono-downloads/download.html]
* Get OpenSim source:
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim/tags/0.6.5-post-fixes opensim
* Compile OpenSim:
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant
--[[User:Kusako|Kusako]] 08:06, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

Here is what worked for me (OS X 10.5.7 and 10.6, Intel) on (8/9/09):

* make sure you have X11 installed
* Very important to grab the latest Apple Dev Tools (3.2.1 on 8/9/09) (from [http://developer.apple.com/] - You will need a developer account, it is free.
* install Mono Framework 2.4 (version 2.4.2.3 on 8/9/09) from [http://www.go-mono.com/mono-downloads/download.html]
* install Mac Ports from [http://www.macports.org/]
* Mac Ports should update its packages on install, but to be safe, type the following at the Terminal:
sudo port -v selfupdate
* Use mac ports to install nant. (This should pull in everything you need. I think this will also try to install mono, but since I already had it installed, that errored on me. Don't worry about it though, it should install everything else you need.) At the Terminal type:
sudo port install nant

* Get OpenSim source. I downloaded 0.6.6 from [http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Download]
* Uncompress the download.
* Compile OpenSim:
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

*Then of course the issue with the 0.6.6 release.
This release had some bugs with default automatic configuration on the first startup of OpenSim.exe. bin/Regions/default.xml (region configuration file) is not automatically created in the main directory. Therefore, you must manually create this file. Here is an example.
<pre>
<Root>
<Config sim_UUID="UUID" sim_name="NAME" sim_location_x="1000" sim_location_y="1000"
internal_ip_address="IP_ADDRESS_OF_SERVER" internal_ip_port="9000" allow_alternate_ports="false"
external_host_name="DNS_NAME_OF_SERVER" master_avatar_uuid="00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000"
estate_covanant_uuid="00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000" master_avatar_first="FIRST_NAME"
master_avatar_last="SECOND_NAME" master_avatar_pass="PASSWORD" />
</Root>
</pre>
You must change UUID, NAME, IP_ADDRESS_OF_SERVER, DNS_NAME_OF_SERVER, FIRST_NAME, SECOND_NAME and PASSWORD to your own values.
(I noticed than IP_ADDRESS_OF_SERVER should be set to real IP not to 127.0.0.1)

'''Summary''':

*Run OpenSim0.6.6Setup.exe and install OpenSim in Windows
*Run OpenSim.exe and enter default values - record them!
*Shutdown simulator (command: shutdown)
*Create default.xml with copy of above
*Change values in default.xml with recoded values
*Be sure default.xml be in main directory (same with OpenSim.ini)
*Run again OpenSim.exe
*Connect with viewer
--[[User:thart|thart]] 12:00, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

=== FreeBSD 6.2 ===
su
cd /usr/ports/devel/subversion/ && make install clean (you may also need to rebuild apr-svn if this step fails)
cd /usr/ports/lang/mono/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/devel/nant/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/databases/sqlite3/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/x11-toolkits/libgdiplus/ && make install clean
cd /opensim/installation/directory/
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

Note: [http://opensimulator.org/wiki/OpenSim:FAQ#System.DllNotFoundException:_..2Flibopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so|Follow the instructions on the FAQ to fix the]
"System.DllNotFoundException: ./libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so" issue, but use "gmake" instead of "make"

For ODE Physics you must do the following:
cd /usr/ports/graphics/libGL/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/graphics/libGLU/ && make install clean
cd /opensim/installation/directory/
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk opensim-libs
cd opensim-libs/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine2/
sh autogen.sh
./configure --enable-shared --enable-release --disable-demos
make
mv ./ode/src/.libs/libode.so /opensim/installation/directory/opensim/bin/

=== RedHat Enterprise Linux 4 ===
sudo vi /etc/yum.repos.d/mono.repo

[mono]
name=Mono for rhel-4-i386 (stable)
baseurl=http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/download-stable/rhel-4-i386/
enabled=1
gpgcheck=0

sudo yum install mono-complete monodoc-core nant
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

=== RedHat Enterprise Linux 5 ===

The instructions below also work on other RedHat Linux flavors such as CentOS or maybe Fedora.

1. Put the [http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono/RHEL_5/Mono.repo Mono.repo] file in the /etc/yum.repo.d/ directory:
$ sudo su -
$ cd /etc/yum.repos.d/
$ wget http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono/RHEL_5/Mono.repo
Naturally use the most [http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono up-to-date link for your distribution].

2. Install Mono and related tools with yum:
$ yum install mono nant mono-jscript mono-nunit
Make sure to use nunit-console2 to run your tests.

=== Fedora 5 ===
* I needed to build latest mono and nant from sources to build OpenSim successfully, the ones available in yum repository didn't work so I had to uninstall and build and configure the packages.

For detailed instructions go [http://ruakuu.blogspot.com/2008/06/installing-and-configuring-opensim-on.html here]

=== Debian 4 ===

For detailed instructions please see [[Debian 4 Build Instructions]]

=== CentOS 5.2 32bit ===

For detailed instructions please see [[CentOS 5.2 Build Instructions]]

=== CentOS 5.3 32bit ===

For detailed installation and configuration instructions please see this [http://www.linuxtraining.org.uk/blogger4.html blog]

=== 64bit ===
Please note that only 32bit binaries are provided in the bin/ directory of subversion. If you want to use 64bit, you'll need to rebuild these shared objects. See [[Installing and running on x86-64]]

=== Physics (Open Dynamics Engine ODE) ===
As installed from svn, ODE will work on most 32 bit platforms. If you get an ODE-related crash, and/or a libode.so not found type of error, you will need to build libode from source.

Remove <tt>libode.so</tt> from the <tt>./bin</tt> folder. (Note that subsequent svn updates may replace it again; best fix is to copy your built <tt>libode.so</tt> to <tt>bin</tt>). Do NOT remove <tt>ode.net.dll</tt>! Download the latest source from:

svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine

OpenSim requires a couple of patches on top of ODE which are not yet included upstream. When compiling, make sure to use the following configure options:

--with-trimesh=gimpact
--enable-shared

Make sure the configure script confirms these choices, and always compile with single precision (I believe that's the default). Try <code> make -k </code> if you get errors relating to drawstuff, test*, or openGL. <code> make install </code> should put <tt>libode.so</tt> in the proper place (usually <tt>/usr/local/lib</tt>), and it should be seen by opensim (<tt>ode.net.dll</tt>)

'''''Note:''' if OpenSim fails to launch with <tt>Exception: System.DllNotFoundException: ode</tt>, after compiling ODE, just copy <tt>libode.so</tt> from its usual place (probably <tt>/usr/local/lib/</tt>) to ./bin/, as per [http://metafuturing.net/index.php/OpenSim_Notebook_1 this suggestion]''

==== Setting up ODE for 64 Bits systems: ====

HOWTO on setting up and Install OpenSim on SLES10 - SP1 64Bit

1. I installed Mono 2.01, added this installation source in Yast2
This distro supports installing packages via YaST. Add the following installation source to YaST:
* http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/download-stable/SLE_10 [^]
For assistance with using repositories and installing packages with YaST, visit the Yast help page.

"nant" was installed also via this operation.

2. I installed subversion from http://software.opensuse.org/search [^]

SLES/SLED10 ->
subversion-1.5.2-34.2.x86_64.rpm

3. I downloaded and installed the lastest SVN version of opensim as usual (like a 32 bit system):
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Build_Instructions [^]

4. I downloaded and installed the Open Dynamics Engine (ODE) to replace the 32 bit version of ODE with a 64 bit version.

I did that with the following linux commands:
(it is expected that you have all required Linux building tools installed):

# cd
# svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine [^]
# cd OpenDynamicEngine
# chmod a+x ou/bootstrap
# sh autogen.sh

I installed/updated SLES10 with these rpm's for autogen.sh to run properly. http://software.opensuse.org/search [^]

SLES/SLED10 ->
- autoconf-2.61-168.1.x86_64.rpm
- automake-1.10.1-5.3.x86_64.rpm

# CFLAGS="-m64" ./configure --enable-shared
# make

I installed gtk2-devel via yast2, and all its dependancies, because make keept failing.

# cp ./ode/src/.libs/libode.so /opt/opensim/bin/

note:
in this directory it had made several versions of the "libode.so" because of running the previous commands several times
so i had to copy libode.so.1.0.0 to /opt/opensim/bin/libode.so

# vi ../opensim/bin/OpenSim.ini (change av_capsule_standup_tensor_linux to 1700000)

The 'chmod' command is required to fix permissions that are wrong.
The change in OpenSim.ini is required to avoid that avatars have bend legs and/or their feet are in the ground.

==== Running ====
Recent versions of OpenSim come without an <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> file. Copy the <tt>OpenSim.ini.example</tt> file to <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> before making any changes.
<code>
cd bin
mono OpenSim.exe
</code>

Note: if you are running a 32bit Server such as Ubuntu 8.0.4 you need the alternative launcher:

<code>
mono OpenSim.32BitLaunch.exe
</code>

* To invoke ODE, add the option:
-physics=OpenDynamicsEngine
to the <tt>mono OpenSim.exe</tt> line

or add <code> physics = OpenDynamicsEngine </code> to the [Startup] section of <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt>. Same deal for other physics engines, when available.

On mono 1.2.6, some distributions may see
Unhandled Exception: System.NotSupportedException: CodePage 1252 not supported
on startup when using mysql. This can be resolved by installing the package libmono-i18n2.0-cil (see http://bugs.mysql.com/bug.php?id=33938).

== Hardware selection guide ==

An often-asked question is "what kind of hardware do I need to successfully run OpenSim?" Unfortunately, the answer is "it depends". The number of regions hosted on a given machine, number of simultaneous avatars on those regions, number of prims, use of scripts, etc., all affect hardware requirements. So, to help you make a more informed selection, some examples of hardware used are listed in the [[Hardware_Selection_Guide|hardware selection guide]].

[[Category:Users]]
[[Category:Getting Started]]

Download

2009-10-15T04:37:08Z

DaveCoyle: /* Installers */

{{Template:Quicklinks}}
=Source code=
Here are the current released versions of OpenSim.

Please see [[Branches]] for more information on the repository branches and what they are for.

'''Please note:''' As OpenSim is still at an alpha code maturity stage, there is absolutely no guarantee that functionality works or is stable, even in the numbered releases. Certain features may not work either because the code is in rapid evolution, or because functionality expected by the Linden Labs Second Life viewer has simply not been implemented yet. However, constructive feedback is still welcomed.

Also, please be aware that OpenSim requires that you have a fair amount of technical knowledge in order to set it up.

The latest source releases are always hosted at http://dist.opensimulator.org, the current latest releases is '''0.6.7''' and provided as:
* http://dist.opensimulator.org/opensim-0.6.7-release.tar.gz - best for Linux systems
* http://dist.opensimulator.org/opensim-0.6.7-release.zip - best for Windows systems

The only difference between the two is the archive format, the source is exactly the same.

== Release Code via Git ==

Instead of using a source archive release, you can pull specific releases from our git repository. For more information on installing and using Git, please see [[Using_Git]].

In each case you'll want to start with a clone:

git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

Then all other commands are run from inside the checked out directory.

* '''0.6.7 Alpha with post-release fixes''' (preferred)
git checkout -b 0.6.7-post-fixes origin/0.6.7-post-fixes

* '''0.6.7 Alpha release tag'''
git checkout 0.6.7-release

== Release notes ==

These are extracted from the subversion history log and correlated with the tagged releases. It should provide some idea of the changes between each tagged version. How ever, since the tagged releases are moved out of the trunk, the versions aren't an exact correlation. Please read and understand [[Release Cycle]] and [[On revisions, tags and branches]] before using this information.
* [[Recent]] (since last tagged version)
* [[0.6.6-release]] (SVN version 9961)
* [[0.6.5-release]] (SVN version 9667)
* [[0.6.4.1-release]] (SVN version 9009)
* [[0.6.4-release]] (SVN version 8960)
* [[0.6.3-release]] (SVN version 8506)
* [[0.6.2-release]] (SVN version 8068)
* [[0.6.1-release]] (SVN version 7880)
* [[0.6.0-release]] (SVN version 7176)
* [[0.5.11-release]] (SVN version 6676)
* [[0.5.10-release]] (SVN version 6422)
* [[0.5.9-release]] (SVN version 5970)
* [[0.5.8-release]] (SVN version 5111)
* [[0.5.7-release]] (SVN version 4818)
* [[0.5.6-release]] (SVN version 4488)
* [[0.5.5-release]] (SVN version 4239)
* [[0.5.4-release]] (SVN version 3879) (Not sure what happened to 0.5.3 & 0.5.2)
* [[0.5.1-release]] (SVN version 3724)
* [[0.5.0-release]] (SVN version 3184)
* [[0.4.5.3-stable]] (SVN version 2844)
* [[0.4.5.2-stable]] (SVN version 2772)
* [[0.4.5.1-stable]] (SVN version 2610)
* [[0.4.5-release]] (SVN version 2293)
* [[0.4.0-rc]] (SVN version 1953)
* [[0.3.2-release]] (SVN version 1385)
* [[0.3.1-devel]] (SVN version 1226) (Around here things start to get a bit confusing)
* [[0.2.1-release]] (SVN version 1224)
* [[0.3.0-devel]] (SVN version 1126)
* [[0.0.0-release]] (SVN version 1022)
* [[0.1.0-release]] (SVN version 1021)
* [[0.2.0-release]] (SVN version 1020)

=Binaries=
The OpenSim project only does source based releases, which you must [[Build_Instructions|compile]] yourself. Many members of our community provide binary installers that you can used based on those source releases. Links below are provided for convenience.

==Installers==

* '''0.6.6 Windows Installer (Post-fixes version r9993)'''
http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/download/frsrelease/199/588/OpenSim0.6.6Setup.exe

* '''0.6.6 Mac OS X Installer (Post-fixes version r9993)'''
http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/download/frsrelease/198/587/OpenSimulator-0.6.6-post-fixes-r9993.dmg

* '''0.6.6 (and other releases/revs) unofficial Debian and Ubuntu Linux .deb packages
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/UnofficialDebPackages

==Diva Distribution==

* '''Preconfigured hypergrided standalone.''' Easy to setup and to keep up to date. Windows and Linux/Unix. Download the file diva-rNNNN.zip, unzip it, read README.txt and take it from there.
http://github.com/diva/diva-distribution/downloads

= Older Versions Archive =

All older versions of OpenSim are available from the Git repo (this includes fully converted versions of every change that existed in the subversion repository, including all old tags and branches). Please be aware that even if there is zero official support for the latest version, there's even less support for older ones. They are kept here for historical and technological reference only.

The 'official' release tags and branches are all available from:
git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

The named branches are typically extremely experimental offshoots. Stick with recent numbered versions if you expect anything to work.

= Experimental Upstream Code =
'''There Be Dragons Beyond This Point'''

If you are truly feeling dangerous, adventurous, or want to help us test the next version of OpenSim you are welcome to grab the latest unstable code out of our git master repository. Any warnings previous expressed about the alpha nature of the code go double or triple if you are running directly off of master. '''Never, ever, ever, never''' run this in production environments, it is not suitable for that unless you are very familiar with the source code, and can hot fix any piece of it (that probably means you are an OpenSim core member). Feedback and testing on the unstable tree is appreciated, as that helps us make the next release better. If this scares you from using trunk, that was intended.

If it breaks, you get to keep both pieces.

* '''Latest git revision version (bleeding edge)'''
git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

* '''To checkout a specific revision'''
After creating the clone, chnage into the directory and:
git reset --hard ########

Where ######## is the unique hash of the version you are interested in.

Another option for obtaining the code is via subversion with our svn mirror. This mirrors all git changes since the old 10k1 changeset in subversion. It is synchronized every 15 minutes, so may be 15 minutes behind git master.

* '''Latest subversion revision version (bleeding edge)'''
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-track/trunk opensim

=Related Software=
[[Related_Software|Related Software Section - CLICK HERE]] 

''Pages by Category:''[[:Category:Users| User-pages]],[[:Category:Development| Developer-pages]],[[:Category:Scripts| Scripts]] 

[[Category:Users]]
[[Category:Developers]]
<cleanpage title=hide cats=hide />

Download

2009-10-15T04:36:15Z

DaveCoyle: /* Installers */

{{Template:Quicklinks}}
=Source code=
Here are the current released versions of OpenSim.

Please see [[Branches]] for more information on the repository branches and what they are for.

'''Please note:''' As OpenSim is still at an alpha code maturity stage, there is absolutely no guarantee that functionality works or is stable, even in the numbered releases. Certain features may not work either because the code is in rapid evolution, or because functionality expected by the Linden Labs Second Life viewer has simply not been implemented yet. However, constructive feedback is still welcomed.

Also, please be aware that OpenSim requires that you have a fair amount of technical knowledge in order to set it up.

The latest source releases are always hosted at http://dist.opensimulator.org, the current latest releases is '''0.6.7''' and provided as:
* http://dist.opensimulator.org/opensim-0.6.7-release.tar.gz - best for Linux systems
* http://dist.opensimulator.org/opensim-0.6.7-release.zip - best for Windows systems

The only difference between the two is the archive format, the source is exactly the same.

== Release Code via Git ==

Instead of using a source archive release, you can pull specific releases from our git repository. For more information on installing and using Git, please see [[Using_Git]].

In each case you'll want to start with a clone:

git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

Then all other commands are run from inside the checked out directory.

* '''0.6.7 Alpha with post-release fixes''' (preferred)
git checkout -b 0.6.7-post-fixes origin/0.6.7-post-fixes

* '''0.6.7 Alpha release tag'''
git checkout 0.6.7-release

== Release notes ==

These are extracted from the subversion history log and correlated with the tagged releases. It should provide some idea of the changes between each tagged version. How ever, since the tagged releases are moved out of the trunk, the versions aren't an exact correlation. Please read and understand [[Release Cycle]] and [[On revisions, tags and branches]] before using this information.
* [[Recent]] (since last tagged version)
* [[0.6.6-release]] (SVN version 9961)
* [[0.6.5-release]] (SVN version 9667)
* [[0.6.4.1-release]] (SVN version 9009)
* [[0.6.4-release]] (SVN version 8960)
* [[0.6.3-release]] (SVN version 8506)
* [[0.6.2-release]] (SVN version 8068)
* [[0.6.1-release]] (SVN version 7880)
* [[0.6.0-release]] (SVN version 7176)
* [[0.5.11-release]] (SVN version 6676)
* [[0.5.10-release]] (SVN version 6422)
* [[0.5.9-release]] (SVN version 5970)
* [[0.5.8-release]] (SVN version 5111)
* [[0.5.7-release]] (SVN version 4818)
* [[0.5.6-release]] (SVN version 4488)
* [[0.5.5-release]] (SVN version 4239)
* [[0.5.4-release]] (SVN version 3879) (Not sure what happened to 0.5.3 & 0.5.2)
* [[0.5.1-release]] (SVN version 3724)
* [[0.5.0-release]] (SVN version 3184)
* [[0.4.5.3-stable]] (SVN version 2844)
* [[0.4.5.2-stable]] (SVN version 2772)
* [[0.4.5.1-stable]] (SVN version 2610)
* [[0.4.5-release]] (SVN version 2293)
* [[0.4.0-rc]] (SVN version 1953)
* [[0.3.2-release]] (SVN version 1385)
* [[0.3.1-devel]] (SVN version 1226) (Around here things start to get a bit confusing)
* [[0.2.1-release]] (SVN version 1224)
* [[0.3.0-devel]] (SVN version 1126)
* [[0.0.0-release]] (SVN version 1022)
* [[0.1.0-release]] (SVN version 1021)
* [[0.2.0-release]] (SVN version 1020)

=Binaries=
The OpenSim project only does source based releases, which you must [[Build_Instructions|compile]] yourself. Many members of our community provide binary installers that you can used based on those source releases. Links below are provided for convenience.

==Installers==

* '''0.6.6 Windows Installer (Post-fixes version r9993)'''
http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/download/frsrelease/199/588/OpenSim0.6.6Setup.exe

* '''0.6.6 Mac OS X Installer (Post-fixes version r9993)'''
http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/download/frsrelease/198/587/OpenSimulator-0.6.6-post-fixes-r9993.dmg

* '''Unofficial 0.6.6 (and other releases/revs) Linux Debian and Ubuntu .deb packages
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/UnofficialDebPackages

==Diva Distribution==

* '''Preconfigured hypergrided standalone.''' Easy to setup and to keep up to date. Windows and Linux/Unix. Download the file diva-rNNNN.zip, unzip it, read README.txt and take it from there.
http://github.com/diva/diva-distribution/downloads

= Older Versions Archive =

All older versions of OpenSim are available from the Git repo (this includes fully converted versions of every change that existed in the subversion repository, including all old tags and branches). Please be aware that even if there is zero official support for the latest version, there's even less support for older ones. They are kept here for historical and technological reference only.

The 'official' release tags and branches are all available from:
git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

The named branches are typically extremely experimental offshoots. Stick with recent numbered versions if you expect anything to work.

= Experimental Upstream Code =
'''There Be Dragons Beyond This Point'''

If you are truly feeling dangerous, adventurous, or want to help us test the next version of OpenSim you are welcome to grab the latest unstable code out of our git master repository. Any warnings previous expressed about the alpha nature of the code go double or triple if you are running directly off of master. '''Never, ever, ever, never''' run this in production environments, it is not suitable for that unless you are very familiar with the source code, and can hot fix any piece of it (that probably means you are an OpenSim core member). Feedback and testing on the unstable tree is appreciated, as that helps us make the next release better. If this scares you from using trunk, that was intended.

If it breaks, you get to keep both pieces.

* '''Latest git revision version (bleeding edge)'''
git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

* '''To checkout a specific revision'''
After creating the clone, chnage into the directory and:
git reset --hard ########

Where ######## is the unique hash of the version you are interested in.

Another option for obtaining the code is via subversion with our svn mirror. This mirrors all git changes since the old 10k1 changeset in subversion. It is synchronized every 15 minutes, so may be 15 minutes behind git master.

* '''Latest subversion revision version (bleeding edge)'''
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-track/trunk opensim

=Related Software=
[[Related_Software|Related Software Section - CLICK HERE]] 

''Pages by Category:''[[:Category:Users| User-pages]],[[:Category:Development| Developer-pages]],[[:Category:Scripts| Scripts]] 

[[Category:Users]]
[[Category:Developers]]
<cleanpage title=hide cats=hide />

Mono 2 4 on Ubuntu

2009-09-26T17:43:06Z

DaveCoyle: i need to correct this

{{obsolete}}

== Install Mono 2.4 packages on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ==

Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ships with Mono 2.0.1 packages. Here are quick instructions for installing the Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid if you'd rather do that than compile Mono yourself:

* add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list :

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main

* download the file at http://gist.github.com/162751 (easiest way is to click the 'raw' link and save) and save as, or add to if it already exists:

/etc/apt/preferences

* install the Debian package signing keys (you'll get a warning the first time running 'apt-get update'; that's what we're fixing with this step):

apt-get update
apt-get install debian-archive-keyring
apt-key add /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg
apt-get update

* install Mono 2.4 packages:

aptitude install -t unstable libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil \
libmono-oracle2.0-cil mono-gmcs

This assumes you don't already have Mono installed. I didn't check that the package pinning done above in /etc/apt/preferences will work if Mono 2.0.1 packages are already installed. So it may be easiest to remove Mono 2.0.1 first, then do the above.

Grid List

2009-09-17T19:16:22Z

DaveCoyle: removed 4 month old graph

__NOTOC__
{{Template:Quicklinks}}

[[Technical Reference | Technical Reference]] -> [[Grid_List| Grid List]]

=What is the Grid List?=

==About==
At the moment there are a number of sims which we try to keep up 24x7, minus the upgrade times, etc. Remember - there are no guarantees at the moment on the backups of the inventories, landscape, etc. So, treat this as you would treat the beta grid at most. In order to login with opensim-links, you will need to install [http://lab.newworldgrid.com/index.php/OpenSim_Launcher OpenSim Launcher] or add a [[Browser_Protocol_Handler|protocol handler]] to your browser. Otherwise you could simply create a custom [[Connecting|shortcut]] with the right parameters to your Second Life browser.

==Public grids==
<big>IMPORTANT NOTE:</big>The OpenSimulator Project is an Application Platform that can be used by anyone. It is not responsible for any grid listed on this page, nor for any grid's content or activities within them. Grid List Policy: Please only list your grid if your software is based on OpenSimulator.org SVN software code, all other grids will be removed and also please provide a link on your grid website back to this project website, remember link recognition is a two-way street.
 
If you own a grid and are interested in joining a grid association see this page:
[[Grid Associations]]
 
Public grids require you to create an account on their website, which you can then use to log into the grid.
 These grids are listed in the order of their appearance, anyone found inserting a grid up higher in the list will have their entry removed, please add your entry to the very bottom of the list, this is not negotiable.
 The gridlist entries in the main list should just contain the gridname and the plain numbers as defined by the column headers. Please use [[Grid_Lst/Template|this]] template for the subpages to keep the information in a comparable manner. Thanks a lot.
 
Public Grid List Sorted [[Grid_List/Sorted/Alphabetically|Alphabetically]], [[Grid_List/Sorted/ByRegions|By # of Regions]], [http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=rHNVZVIc1-GdXzqx2Ac4NDQ&gid=4 By # of Users], [http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=rHNVZVIc1-GdXzqx2Ac4NDQ&gid=6 By Unique 30 days], [[Grid_List/Sorted/ByHistory|By History]]

 

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
!Name
!Approx # Regions
!Approx # Users
!Unique last 30days
|-
|[[Grid_List/Deepgrid|Deepgrid]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/OSGrid|OSGrid]]
|2200
|21000
|3900
|-
|[[Grid List/Francogrid|Francogrid]]
|~170
|~1304
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/EU-Grid|EU-Grid]]
|~10
|~350
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Le Monde de Darwin|Le Monde de Darwin]]
|73
|83
|36
|-
|[[Grid List/GiantGrid|GiantGrid]]
|169
|261
|157
|-
|[[Grid List/The New World Grid|The New World Grid]]
|~262
|~2089
|~389
|-
|[[Grid List/3rd Rock Grid|3rd Rock Grid]]
|~88
|~1561
|~511
|-
|[[Grid List/Uvatar|Uvatar.com]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/WorldSimTerra|WorldSimTerra]]
|~191
|~910
|~535
|-
|[[Grid List/Cyberlandia|Cyberlandia]]
|185
|~1600
|~269
|-
|[[Grid List/Metropolis|Metropolis]]
|48
|~400
|~50
|-
|[[Grid List/Emerald Network|Emerald Network]]
|9
|~54
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Avatar Hangout|Avatar Hangout]]
|413
|3912
|1680
|-
|[[Grid_List/Your Alternative Life | Your Alternative Life ]]
|~51
|~732
|~524
|-
|[[Grid List/AUGrid|AUGrid]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/German Grid|German Grid]]
|14
|118
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/DGP Grid|DGP Grid]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/LifeSim|LifeSim]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Fantasy World Estates|Fantasy World Estates]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/RMH Design Estate|RMH Design Estate]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Open-Neuland|OpenSimulator-Club Open-Neuland]]
|36
|118
|66
|-
|[[Grid List/Wilder-Westen|OpenSimulator-Club Wilder-Westen]]
|4
|45
|24
|-
|[[Grid List/United Grid|United Grid (CLOSED)]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Social Network Italia|Social Network Italia]]
|24
|500
|100
|-
|[[Grid_List/Low Grid|Nedergrid]]
|3
|17
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/ReactionGrid|ReactionGrid]]
|144
|2180
|307
|-
|[[Grid List/K-grid|K-grid]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Legend City Online|Legend City Online]]
|164
|4412
|600
|-
|[[Grid List/pseudospace|pseudospace]]
|37
|137
|41
|-
|[[Grid List/Yourgrid.de|YourGrid]]
|68
|~110
|33
|-
|[[Grid List/Myopengrid.com|Myopengrid]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/PhoenixSim|PhoenixSim]]
|5
|18
|14
|-
|[[Grid List/Virtual_Sims|VirtualSims.Net]]
|10
|73
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Collateral World|Collateral World '''(CLOSED)''']]
|4
|1
|1
|-
|[[Grid List/Grid4Us|Grid4Us]]
|65
|322
|132
|-
|[[Grid_List/Metapocalypse|Metapocalypse]]
|2
|6
|6
|-
|[[Grid_List/FreshGrid|FreshGrid(casino games)]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/OpenKansai|OpenKansai]]
|9
|120
|100
|-
|[[Grid_List/Schweiz|Schweiz]]
|5
|50
|10
|-
|[[Grid_List/Pleasure Planet|Pleasure Planet Adults only]]
|16
|70
|29
|-
|[[Grid_List/DreamlandGrid | Dreamland Grid]]
|16
|5
|2
|-
|[[Grid_List/NeXtLife | NeXtLife Grid]]
|15
|7
|7
|-
|[[Grid_List/Openvue | Openvue (on Virtual AIAI Grid)]]
|12
|20
|10
|-
|[[Grid_List/ScienceSim | ScienceSim]]
|25
|30
|15
|-
|[[Grid_List/Unica | unica]]
|16
|60
|10
|-
|[[Grid_List/The Gor Grid | The Gor Grid - Your Gorean Life]]
|92
|1340
|428
|-
|[[Grid_List/Cuon Grid | Cuon Grid - Linux and ERP]]
|11
|50
|30
|-
|[[Grid List/Lisat|ArtGridOnLine]]
|12
|48
|15
|-
|[[Grid List/OpenWorld|OpenWorld]]
|17
|140
|55
|-
|[[Grid List/Lisat|Lost In Space And Time]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|-
|[[Grid List/Segarra Private Grid |Segarra Private Grid]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Playneko| Playneko | Just another virtual world]]
|2
|36
|19
|-
||[[Grid List/Xumeo|Xumeo]]
|*
|*
|*
|-
|[[Grid_List/3Dmalls|3dmalls.net]]
|~17
|~350
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/NexTECH Life|NexTECH Life]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/Joopla|Joopla.net]]
| 
| 
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/VirtualFrance|VirtualFrance]]
|4
|15
|12
|-
|[[Grid_List/AnSky|AnSky]]
|11
|39
| 
|-
|[[Grid_List/DSGrid|www.dsgrid.eu]]
|8
|34
|28
|-
|[[Grid_List/Meanduland|www.meanduland.com]]
|25
|23
|6
|-
|[[Grid List/v-Business|v-Business]]
|10
|~70
|~40
|-
|[[Grid List/Twisted Sky|Twisted Sky]]
|20
|20
|5
|-
|[[Grid List/TertiaryGrid|Tertiary grid]]
|14
|2
| 
|-
|[[Grid List/Logicamp|Logicamp]]
|4
|9
|9
|-
|[[Grid List/virtyou|virtyou]]
|63
|326
|65
|-
|[[Grid List/Jamland|Jamland]]
|9
|27
|10
|}

This is a list of Grids that been inactive for a few days and or have claimed to be inactive by the owner. Please also take extra care to write down there last position.

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
!Place
!Inactive Grids
!Approx # Regions
!Approx # Users
!Unique last 30days
|-
|}

To make OpenSim grids and locations known to a wider audience, they may be listed at http://www.yosims.com/.

== Office Hour ==

Each week on Tuesday, OSGrid hosts an official Office Hour where the OpenSim developers meet and discuss the weeks software development activities. This is a good place to get to know what is going on with OpenSim.

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
!Grid
!Region
!Time
|-
|OSGrid
|Wright Plaza
|Tuesday 1900UTC
|-
|EU-Grid
|EU-Grid Central Hub
|Sat 15:00 to 19:00 MET
|-
|AUGrid / Asia Pacific Office Hours
|Norgan Plaza
|Friday's 11am~2pm AEST (GMT/UTC + 10)
|-
|Cyberlandia Grid Italiana
|Cyberlandia, Central Hub
|Mercoledi and Venerdi 22:00 to 23:00 (GMT/UTC + 1)
|-
|WorldSim Terra
|Lusitania Center
|Saturdays 19:00 to 20:00 (GMT/UTC)
|-
|Avatar Hangout - Residents
|Community Center
|Saturdays 2pm to 4pm (InGame Time)
|-
|Avatar Hangout - Estate Owners
|Estate Info
|Sunday 2pm to 4pm (InGame Time)
|-
|Grid4Us
|Grid4Us Marina
|Saturdays 20:00 to 22:00 (UTC+1/MET)
|-
|LISAT
| 
|Saturday midnight "UTC" Wednesday 1400(2pm)UTC "Universal.Time.Coordinated"
|-
|}

== Grid Test Hours ==

Several grids provide valuable testing information for the project, each run a special 'test' hour to test capabilities of the platform. These are run at the same time every week. It may also be a good chance to meet people who can answer questions you may have.

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
!Grid
!Region
!Time
|-
|OSGrid
|Wright Plaza
|Sat 1900UTC
|-
|Apex Grid
|Spaceport 2
|Sat 1800 UTC
|-
|FrancoGrid
|Orion
|Everydays 2100GMT+1
|-
|New World Grid
|Welcome
|Generally Mondays and Thursdays 2200 UTC+2 [http://lab.newworldgrid.com/index.php/Office_hours Next Office Hour]
|-
|AUGrid
|Norgan Plaza
|Generally Tuesdays 11am~1pm and/or 2~5pm AEST (GMT/UTC+10) [http://augrid.org/forum/index.php?topic=9.0]
|-
|WorldSim Terra
|Lusitania Center
|Generally Sundays 19:00 to 22.00(GMT/UTC) [http://www.worldsimterra.com/index.php?option=com_agora&task=viewtopic&id=223 Next Test Hours]
|-
|VirtualFrance
|versailles
|Generally Mondays and Thursdays 2100GMT+1 [http://www.virtualfrance.0rg.fr]
|-
|ReactionGrid
|Tarzan
|Saturdays 6pm Eastern/11pm UK (10pm UTC) - Movie Night load test [http://www.reactiongrid.com/Default/EventsList/RetroMovieNight.aspx Movie Night on ReactionGrid]
|-
|}

== Standalone sims ==

Standalone sims have "generic" logins being from "Testa User" .. "Testz User", with password "test".
<table border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center">
<tr>
<th>Name</th>
<th>Login URI</th>
<th>Maintainer/Site</th>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>Ruth (Zion)</td>
<td>opensim://ruth.petitbe.be:9000/</td>
<td>Dalien Talbot (dalien on IRC, or via blog - http://daltonic.blogspot.com/)</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>CyberSpacia</td>
<td>opensim://cyberspacia.net:9000/</td>
<td>Spun Pty Ltd (mailto:the.grid@cyberspacia.net)</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>janoz</td>
<td>opensim://77.250.27.219:9000/</td>
<td> (mailto:info@janoz.nl)</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<td>Opengrid</td>
<td>opensim://opengrid.fr:9000/</td>
<td>Test grid for http://www.opensimulator.fr - 24/7 available</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>Phrearch</td>
<td>opensim://os-networks.net:9000/</td>
<td>Phrearch: http://os-networks.net</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>Timecatcher Haven Lands( Not online 24/7)</td>
<td>opensim://timecatcher.ath.cx:9000/</td>
<td>Timecatcher: (mailto:anon26841397@hotmail.co.uk)</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>Europeansim (NOW 24/7 ish:-) </td>
<td>opensim://86.2.85.164:8002/ </td>
<td>Edenrealm Sim(mailto:zoon@edenrealm.co.uk) BritGrid SVN 10058 - 26 regions - Hypergrid? - Av creation - http://www.europeansim.thruhere.net Blog http://www.edenrealm.co.uk/europeansim</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>OpenSIM.de / M34-Sim1 (24/7)</td>
<td>opensim://opensim.mydyn.de:9090</td>
<td>German Standalone-Sim for testing with german (deutsch) speaking Live-Support and OpenSIM-Wiki at http://www.opensim.de . No Test User, only personal Accounts. Register before login at http://www.opensim.de</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>OpenSIM.de / M34-Sim2 (24/7)</td>
<td>opensim://grid.mydyn.de:9190</td>
<td>Many Freebies, Copyland, Sandbox, Testing Area (Trunk Versions). No Test User, only personal Accounts. Register before login at http://www.opensim.de</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>[[Grid_List/Birnenland|Birnenland.de - Auf gute Nachbarschaft !]]</td>
<td>opensim://birnenland.de:9040</td>
<td>Eine deutschsprachige 3D Gemeinschaft in der man kostenlos Wohn- und Bauland erhalten kann.</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>Viradu</td>
<td> We have just migrated to OSGrid.org 1/7/2009 </td>
<td>A Science Fiction Themed Virtual World, by Michael McAnally (mailto:mwmcanally@gmail.com) - 12 regions NOTE: Please read Blog for connect instructions ---> http://viradu.com for more info. This world is now open for settlement.</td>
</tr>
</table>

= See Also =

* [[:Category:Getting_Started|Getting Started]]
* [[Status|Main Status Page]]
* [[Technical_Reference|Technical Reference Page]]
* [[Grid_List/Sorted/Alphabetically|Grid List (Sorted Alphabetically)]]
* [[Grid_List/Sorted/ByRegions|Grid List (Sorted By # of Regions)]]
* [http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=rHNVZVIc1-GdXzqx2Ac4NDQ&gid=4 Grid List (Sorted By # of Users)]
* [http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=rHNVZVIc1-GdXzqx2Ac4NDQ&gid=6 Grid List (Sorted By Unique 30 days)]
* [[Grid_List/Sorted/ByHistory|Grid List (Sorted By History)]]
* [[Grid_Associations|Grid Associations]]
* [http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Public_Hypergrid_Nodes HyperGrid-Nodes]

[[Category:Users]]
[[Category:Support]]
[[Category:Tech Reference]]
[[Category:Help]]
[[Category:Configuration]]
[[Category:Getting_Started]]
[[Category:Development]]

Connecting

2009-09-17T19:11:56Z

DaveCoyle: add link to Meerkat

__NOTOC__
{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 
==Compatible Viewers==
Before you can connect to OpenSim, you'll need to have downloaded one of the following clients that can connect to OpenSim.

* [http://get.secondlife.com Linden Client] (release version is the only fully supported viewer.)
* [http://opensim-viewer.sourceforge.net Hippo Viewer] - a fork of the Linden Client with OpenSim specific enhancements
* [[RealXtend]] - a fork of the Linden Client that has specialized features (is not fully supported yet.)
* [http://meerkatviewer.org/ Meerkat Viewer] another LL-based viewer

==Connecting with the Linden Viewer==
Every OpenSim grid or instance will specify a '''loginuri''', which is a uri of the form '''http://someserver:9000''' (standalone mode) or '''http://someserver:8002''' (grid mode). For instance, for osgrid, this is http://osgrid.org:8002. The following sections assume that you have that uri. We'll use http://osgrid.org:8002 as our example url.

A list of major public grids can be found at [[Grid_List]]. OSGrid is just one of many available.

=== Linux ===
* change directory to you viewer (SecondLife_XYZ)
* run <code>./secondlife -loginuri http://osgrid.org:8002</code>

=== Windows ===
* make a copy of the SecondLife icon on your desktop
* rename it to the grid you want to connect to
* edit the properties on the icon and set the command line to <code>...\SecondLife.exe" -loginuri http://osgrid.org:8002</code>

=== Mac ===
* Make a 'somefilename.sh' file, and put this in it:
* /Applications/Second\ Life.app/Contents/MacOS/Second\ Life -loginuri http://osgrid.org:8002/
* set it to executable
* run it

If you have multiple viewers and multiple grids to connect to, you can try the following AppleScript (one could do something similar with a shell script). Feel free to copy and modify for your own use.
--
-- This script selects a viewer and a grid for virtual worlds.
--
--
-- Variables for the two supported viewers. More may be added here.
--
set lindenViewer to "\"/Applications/SecondLife/Second Life.app/Contents/MacOS/Second Life\""

set emeraldViewer to "\"/Applications/SecondLife/GreenLife Emerald Viewer.app/Contents/MacOS/GreenLife Emerald Viewer\""
--
-- Variables for options to select the specified grid. Since the viewers
-- are based on the 2nd life viewer, the options are the same for each
-- viewer. Also, connecting to the Second Life grid is the default option
-- if no other options are provided.
--
-- Currently, four grids are supported. More may be easily added.
--
set lindenOptions to ""

set localStandalone to " -loginuri http://vw.server.lan:9000 -loginpage http://vw.server.lan/opensim/index.html"

set localGrid to " -loginuri http://vw.server.lan:8000 -loginpage http://vw.server.lan/opensim/index.html"

set osGridOptions to " -loginuri http://osgrid.org:8002 -loginpage http://osgrid.org/loginscreen.php -helperuri http://osgrid.org/"
--
-- Display dialog and select the viewer.
--
set dialogResult to display dialog "Choose viewer:
1) 2nd Life viewer
2) Emerald viewer:" default answer "1" with title "Select Viewer" with icon 1

set option to text returned of dialogResult

if option = "2" then
set viewer to emeraldViewer
else
set viewer to lindenViewer
end if
--
-- Display dialog and select the grid.
--
set dialogResult to display dialog "Choose server:
1) 2nd Life grid
2) local standalone
3) local grid
4) OS Grid" default answer "2" with title "Select Grid" with icon 1

set grid to text returned of dialogResult

if grid = "1" then
set options to lindenOptions
else if grid = "2" then
set options to localStandalone
else if grid = "3" then
set options to localGrid
else if grid = "4" then
set options to osGridOptions
else
set options to localStandalone
end if
--
-- Combine the grid and viewer and execute the result.
--
set command to viewer & options
do shell script command

===Linden Viewer options===
The Linden viewer has a number of other options. Some are useful, some are not. The viewer has a help option which produces the following results:
--autologin log in as last saved user
--channel arg n/a
--console arg n/a
--cooperative arg Yield some idle time to local host.
--crashonstartup Crashes on startup. For QA use.
--debugviews n/a
--drop arg n/a
--god Log in a god if you have god access.
--grid arg Specify the name of the grid, local, or an IP address
to connect to.
-h [ --help ] display this help message
--helperuri arg helper web CGI prefix to use
--ignorepixeldepth Ignore pixel depth settings.
--inbw arg n/a
--logfile arg n/a
--login args 3 tokens: first, last and password
--loginpage arg Login authentication page to use.
--loginuri arg login server and CGI script to use
--multiple Allow multple viewers.
--no-verify-ssl-cert n/a
--noaudio n/a
--noinvlib Do not request the inventory library.
--nopreload n/a
--noprobe n/a
--noquicktime n/a
--nosound n/a
--novoice Disable voice.
--outbw arg n/a
--port arg n/a
--purge Delete files in the cache.
--qa Activated debugging menu in Advanced Settings.
--quitafter arg n/a
--rotate n/a
--safe Reset preferences, run in safe mode.
--set args specify the value of a particular
configuration variable that
overrides all other settings

--setdefault args specify the value of a particular
configuration variable which can be
overridden by settings.xml

--settings arg Specify the filename of a configuration file.
--skin arg ui/branding skin folder to use
--slurl arg Startup SLurl
--url arg Startup location
--psn arg MacOSX process serial number

== Alternative Connection Approaches ==

=== Via a Web Browser ===

You can also set up a [[Browser Protocol Handler]] which will make opensim:// links in your browser do the expected thing, and launch the right OpenSim viewer.

** Project site
** http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/project/xenki/
** Xeni Community Site
** http://xenkiviewer.com/

* '''Xenki''' - Xenki is an XBAP 3D application intended to be a browser add-on for OpenSim.
** '''What is Xenki?'''
** http://www.adamfrisby.com/blog/2008/08/what-is-xenki/
** '''Sources:'''
** http://www.adamfrisby.com/blog/2008/08/xenki-010-alpha-sources-posted/

=== Via Rezme ===
TBD

== Known Issues ==
* None at the moment

Chat log from the meeting on 2009-07-07

2009-09-17T17:49:48Z

DaveCoyle: add Chat Logs category

[09:50] Dorothea Lundquist is Online
 [09:50] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Nas Messing to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:50] Nas Messing is Online
 [09:51] Nas Messing: Hi arain
 [09:51] Nas Messing: again
 [09:51] Nas Messing: hihi
 [09:51] Orion Shamroy: Interesting... Crossing regions sets you in the landing point now?
 [09:51] Nas Messing: i crash
 [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: yes
 [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: thats the MRM telehub Orion
 [09:51] Orion Shamroy: COOL! :D I'll have to play round with that :)
 [09:52] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Quarterly Sideshow to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:52] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Rowland Larkham to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:52] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Xingyun.shan 76.188.209.193:9000 to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:52] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002 to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:53] Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002: hi neb
 [09:53] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Adam Frisby to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:53] Nas Messing is Offline
 [09:53] Adam Frisby is Online
 [09:53] Adam Frisby: much better
 [09:54] Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002: hello adam
 [09:54] Adam Frisby: Been getting lots of hypergrid visitors here
 [09:54] Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002: have just change grid coord of cyberlandia
 [09:54] Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002: from 1000.1000 to 7000.7000
 [09:55] Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002: i can teleport here directely
 [09:55] Carlos.Roundel @grid.cyberlandia.net:8002: secondlife://grid.cyberlandia.net:9000/
 [09:55] Adam Frisby: Ah heh. yeah probably a good move.
 [09:55] Nebadon Izumi: welcome back
 [09:56] Justin Clark-Casey is Online
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: hey Adam
 [09:56] Lbsa Plaza Telehub: Welcome Jamiez Rascall to LBSA Plaza.
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: request
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: on peoples profiles
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: if your logged in and its your profile
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: can you have it list the UUIDs
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: of your regions
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: for just you
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: oh crpas
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: meeting
 [09:56] Adam Frisby: meeting?
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: Tuesday Meeting
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: is starting right now
 [09:56] Adam Frisby: oh cool
 [09:56] Richardus Raymaker is Online
 [09:56] Adam Frisby: TP me.
 [09:56] Adam Frisby: what sim?
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: kk
 [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: Wright Plaza
 [09:57] Teleport completed from http://slurl.com/secondlife/Lbsa%20Plaza/120/131/38
 [09:57] The region you have entered is running a different simulator version. Click this message for details.
 [09:57] Penny Lane: LL has a habit of calling a "security risk" everything that they haven't put into SL
 [09:57] WhiteStar Magic: Hey there JCC
 [09:57] Penny Lane: Hiya JCC
 [09:57] Compile successful
 [09:57] Friendly Harbour whispers: grrrr .. am i sitting or standing now???
 [09:57] Compile successful
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Reading notecard (will retry in 30 seconds).
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: NOT ADDED: stand3 - Not found in inventory
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: AO is now active
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Friendly Harbour arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: WhiteStar Magic arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Mojito Sorbet arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Master Dubrovna arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: dz ozb arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Justin Clark-Casey arrived
 [09:57] Nebs AO v0.3: Adam Frisby arrived
 [09:57] WhiteStar Magic: LOL Penny, or more usually something they cannot get to work!
 [09:57] Penny Lane: Standing
 [09:57] Penny Lane: Now sitting
 [09:57] Friendly Harbour: finally
 [09:57] WhiteStar Magic: hence why llTextBox() still is not implemented
 [09:57] dz ozb: my understanding is the volume of notecards is the issue preventing SL from allowing createable/writeable notecards
 [09:58] Nebadon Izumi: hello everyone
 [09:58] Justin Clark-Casey: hey neb
 [09:58] Penny Lane: Hi Neb!
 [09:58] WhiteStar Magic: Hey Neb
 [09:58] Mojito Sorbet: It also changes the Asset Server from a write-one/read-many store
 [09:58] Mojito Sorbet: And thus requires locking, etc
 [09:58] Master Dubrovna: Hi Neb
 [09:58] Penny Lane waves at Mojito :-)
 [09:58] Adam Frisby: The write-once thing is an important one.
 [09:58] Adam Frisby: Because it means you cant do caching anymore.
 [09:58] Adam Frisby: At least caching off UUID
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1:
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 1) ASD Rupture [HD] [demoscene]
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 2) masagin [HD] [demoscene]
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 3) fr 025 final2 720p
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 4) [demoscene] Synesthetics - STS-02 Electric Kool-Aid
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 5) [demoscene] NCE - Demoscene Activist
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 6) [demoscene] plastic - 195-95
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 7) [demoscene] Haujobb - Elements
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 8) [demoscene] MFX - Deities Final
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 9) [demoscene] ASD - Planet Risk
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 10) [demoscene] ASD - Iconoclast
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 11) [demoscene] ASD - Aphorism for the Masses
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: 12) [demoscene] ArtCity - Anadune and Nah-Kolor
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1:
 [09:58] Youtube Video Player v1.1: Enter the title number OR a youtube URL at /4
 [09:58] Penny Lane: Spammer!
 [09:58] Mojito Sorbet: I am, pretty sure THAT is why LL does not allow writing
 [09:58] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [09:59] Adam Frisby: Yeah, not being able to cache is a very significant problem.
 [09:59] Adam Frisby: Especially given the high volume of requests
 [09:59] Adam Frisby: Frankly, if you want R/W db-like access, use a f'ing database. ;)
 [09:59] Mojito Sorbet: Perhaps a new object type, stored separately, JUST for that purpose though..
 [09:59] Adam Frisby: Might be better to ask for something like osRunSql(server, command)
 [09:59] Friendly Harbour: anyone have a url to a webpage/wiki with info about the new ini fileformat for use with regions?
 [09:59] Nebs AO v0.3: Richardus Raymaker arrived
 [10:00] Adam Frisby: or use MRM
 [10:00] Mojito Sorbet: There are outside servces that provide writable storage via HTTP. Seems to work
 [10:00] Adam Frisby: http://maxping.org/technology/platforms/open-simulator/more-experiments-with-mrm.aspx <--- using MySQL with MRM
 [10:00] Nebs AO v0.3: Strawberry Fride arrived
 [10:00] Nebs AO v0.3: Orion Shamroy arrived
 [10:01] WhiteStar Magic: LOL... I was just about to post that
 [10:01] Nebs AO v0.3: Brent Seidel arrived
 [10:01] Penny Lane: VWs don't have a good fit with RDBMSs, they're essentially hierarchical and not table-structured.
 [10:01] WhiteStar Magic: it;'s a great example
 [10:01] Adam Frisby: Hey Strawberry
 [10:01] Strawberry Fride: hi folks :)
 [10:01] Penny Lane: Hi Straw
 [10:01] Justin Clark-Casey: Hello Strawverry
 [10:01] Justin Clark-Casey: oops, Strawberry
 [10:01] Adam Frisby: Neb, your map is up side down.
 [10:01] Charles Krinke is Online
 [10:01] Strawberry Fride: meh - I take whatever's thrown at me :)
 [10:02] Justin Clark-Casey: ha ha
 [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: lol ya
 [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: your right
 [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:02] Adam Frisby: I'm always right. >_> <_<
 [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:02] Richardus Raymaker: hi all
 [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: on could argue the entire sign is upside down
 [10:02] Brent Seidel: Good [morning, afternoon, night] all
 [10:02] Charles Krinke is Offline
 [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: actually i think the upside down signs is the issue
 [10:03] Justin Clark-Casey: hi Richardus
 [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: the photo one keeps returning to 90 rotation too
 [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: not sure why
 [10:03] Justin Clark-Casey: hello brent
 [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: i never noticed the map was doing it too though
 [10:03] Nebs AO v0.3: Warin Cascabel arrived
 [10:03] Penny Lane: Hi Richardus
 [10:03] Mojito Sorbet: Depends on the orientation of the screen when it was created.
 [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: its scripted to update every 15 minutes
 [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: that might be resetting it
 [10:03] Nebs AO v0.3: Charles Krinke arrived
 [10:03] Charles Krinke is Online
 [10:04] Nebadon Izumi: ok cool charles is here
 [10:04] Nebadon Izumi: once he settles in we can get started
 [10:04] Nebs AO v0.3: tx Oh arrived
 [10:04] Nebadon Izumi: hello Charles
 [10:04] Adam Frisby: there we go
 [10:04] Charles Krinke: Morning
 [10:04] Adam Frisby: Morning
 [10:04] Penny Lane: Hiya CK
 [10:04] Justin Clark-Casey: Good morning Mr Krinke
 [10:05] Strawberry Fride: Hi Charles :)
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: everyone remember to rebakke
 [10:05] Richardus Raymaker: moreving charles
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: so your not grey
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: for the meeting photo
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: hehe
 [10:05] Penny Lane: I wonder why my viewer clock says 10:05 AM PST, not 11
 [10:05] Charles Krinke: Ah, yes. Thats a good point.
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: our server is set for UTC
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: its a problem
 [10:05] WhiteStar Magic: hey Wrin, I just setup your visitor list. Marvy code there
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: since the viewer wants PST
 [10:05] Adam Frisby: If anyone is bored and looking for something to do; go put all the weekly meetings into our new event calendar.
 [10:05] Nebadon Izumi: its doing funky math
 [10:05] Warin Cascabel: THanks, WhiteStar. :)
 [10:05] tx Oh: huhu
 [10:06] Richardus Raymaker: hi whitestar
 [10:06] Richardus Raymaker: hi tx
 [10:06] Charles Krinke: Time has always been funky and some time we need to harmonize everything to UTC
 [10:06] Dorothea Lundquist is Offline
 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: i think if our UGAIM was running on PST it would show the correct time
 [10:06] Mojito Sorbet: UTC for a grid clock makes much more sense that PST
 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: but
 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: if we change now
 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: our stats get whacked
 [10:06] Adam Frisby: Nebadon: it's mroe than that.
 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: the website could have issues
 [10:06] Adam Frisby: Our calculator is busted there too
 [10:06] Strawberry Fride: would be lovely if there were a timezone packet thing that could be sent to the client so it reflected grid timezone and time
 [10:07] Charles Krinke: I guess the first question is "How is recent reliability and stability for trunk for everyone?". This leads to the question of advancing the "recommended" release for the week.
 [10:07] Richardus Raymaker: then wait till wintertime and whack it
 [10:07] Strawberry Fride: the 0.6.6 tag looks good - couple of minor issues with it I've seen so far
 [10:07] Hiro Protagonist is Offline
 [10:07] Adam Frisby: I've been seeing mixed results with revisions this week.
 [10:07] Dorothea Lundquist is Online
 [10:07] Penny Lane: UTC is the only way to go. I suspect that SL is going to be small-minded and stay PST-based though.
 [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: ya seems to be some decline on Lbsa with 9960
 [10:07] Adam Frisby: mostly good; but I've been seeing an odd physics bug on lbsa plaza
 [10:07] Adam Frisby: Where ODE shoots to 100% usage
 [10:07] Adam Frisby: after about an hour or two
 [10:07] Adam Frisby: it's nearly completely reproducible.
 [10:07] Adam Frisby: Just leave it alone and it'll die.
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: ya but its related to logins adam
 [10:08] Orion Shamroy: Well, 9975 has been working pretty well for the past few days on my end?
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: if lbsa had no logins
 [10:08] Charles Krinke: Can anyone help confirm ODE CPU usage shooting up for Adam's testing?
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: that wouldnt happen for weeks
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: that ODE issue
 [10:08] Warin Cascabel: I've been having issues with r997x - mostly related to inventory and the region (and neighboring regions) recognizing when an agent has left.
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: its directly related to the number of logins occuring
 [10:08] Nebs AO v0.3: Hiro Protagonist arrived
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: i have no doubt about that
 [10:08] Hiro Protagonist is Online
 [10:08] Strawberry Fride: I have seen CPU rise to 100% for bursts of about 5 seconds and falling on an otherwise idle machine
 [10:08] Charles Krinke: So, last week stability was a bit better then this week?
 [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: IMHO i say its unchanged
 [10:09] tx Oh: i have strange tp issues. halfe here, half there
 [10:09] Richardus Raymaker: looks ok for me, not sure how many visitors i get
 [10:09] Charles Krinke: Leave "recommended" at last weeks 9961 or advance to near trunk?
 [10:09] Warin Cascabel: Last week I didn't have to restart a region just so it would retrieve inventory. Now it'll say "Ignoring repeated requests for inventory" at least a couple of times a day.
 [10:09] Nebadon Izumi: reset list
 [10:09] Penny Lane blinks slowly not to panic the server
 [10:09] Nebs AO v0.3: Nas Messing arrived
 [10:09] Visitor List Recorder v1.1: Script running
 [10:09] Visitor List Recorder v1.1: Visitor List Maker started...
 [10:09] Visitor List Recorder v1.1: The owner can say 'help' for instructions.
 [10:10] Richardus Raymaker: lol penny
 [10:10] Strawberry Fride: melanie fixed the load balancer module after 9961 - not sure when she did that but a fixed load balancer in a tagged branch would be nice
 [10:10] Justin Clark-Casey: do you use the load balancer?
 [10:10] Nebadon Izumi: thats probably not to hard we just need the svn revision #
 [10:10] Adam Frisby: I think load balancing probably isnt as valuable as suggested.
 [10:10] Strawberry Fride: would like to try it
 [10:10] Nebadon Izumi: ya i dont expect it works all that well
 [10:10] Adam Frisby: Give it a shot; but if it's anything ilke the old 3Di one, the cost of balancing is almost as high as the savings.
 [10:11] Strawberry Fride: :)
 [10:11] Charles Krinke: I would concur. I dont recall anyone using the load balancing feature.
 [10:11] Nebadon Izumi: it is the old 3Di one
 [10:11] Nebs AO v0.3: Hiro Protagonist arrived
 [10:11] Nebadon Izumi: its unchanged Adam
 [10:11] Mojito Sorbet: Which load is it attemp@ting to balance?
 [10:11] Nebadon Izumi: she just updated the module code i think
 [10:11] Adam Frisby: Then yeah, the benefit is very minimal.
 [10:11] Adam Frisby: Mojito: It load balances your circuits. (sort of like TCP sessions in LLUDP)
 [10:11] Richardus Raymaker: hi hero
 [10:11] Adam Frisby: it works well for handling packet acks, etc.
 [10:11] Adam Frisby: But they arent the major killer of opensim anymore
 [10:11] Adam Frisby: so the other gains are very minimal
 [10:11] Strawberry Fride: not having tried it I'm unsure exactly on the benefits
 [10:11] Strawberry Fride: but I heard it might help spread chat over a border
 [10:12] Doing HUD: Script running
 [10:13] BlueWall Slade is Online
 [10:13] Nebadon Izumi: i remember at one point we had chat going across the borders
 [10:13] Nas Messing is Online
 [10:13] Adam Frisby: Bordercross capable chat isnt that hard to do
 [10:13] Adam Frisby: just mod the chatmodule
 [10:13] Adam Frisby: it's already a shared region module iirc.
 [10:14] Strawberry Fride: I have alternatives that help with that in place
 [10:14] Strawberry Fride: but that sounds good
 [10:14] Orion Shamroy: I've noticed that if the two sims are on the same OS instance chat will cross? :)
 [10:14] Penny Lane: Is vicinity chat treated like group IM but with a distance parameter? Or totally separate?
 [10:14] Adam Frisby: Vicinity chat is handled via a seperate path
 [10:14] Adam Frisby: Group IM goes via a groups service
 [10:15] Adam Frisby: I'm a little concerned about scalability there; but I guess until it begins affecting things, I'm not going to do much
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: ya i remember long while back we had it going over borders
 [10:15] Nebs AO v0.3: Nas Messing arrived
 [10:15] Charles Krinke: Are we at the point where we need to harmonize OpenSim.ini files a bit on OSGrid to help get more consistent results? Maybe have folks look regularly at the OpenSim.ini for this plaza on the osgrid.org web site?
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: it might even be a configurable option
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: that is not documented
 [10:15] Nas Messing: Hi everyone
 [10:15] Nas Messing: am i invited here too
 [10:15] Justin Clark-Casey: hello nas
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: though that was long ago
 [10:15] Penny Lane: Hi Nas
 [10:15] Charles Krinke: certainly Nas
 [10:15] Nas Messing: or must i go away
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: might be refactored since then
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: no all are welcome Nas
 [10:15] Brent Seidel: It's open to anyone
 [10:15] Nas Messing: thank you
 [10:15] Nebs AO v0.3: BlueWall Slade arrived
 [10:15] Richardus Raymaker: hi nas
 [10:15] Brent Seidel: They let me hang around.
 [10:16] Charles Krinke: Welcome. This is our regular Tuesday "Offce Hour" meeting and things might go a little fast for someone not used to it.
 [10:16] Nas Messing: will we have party
 [10:16] Nas Messing: or just sit here
 [10:16] Nas Messing: hihi
 [10:16] Mojito Sorbet: Hold still, lest the server crash. lol
 [10:16] Nebadon Izumi: we mostly are discussing hot topics of the week
 [10:16] Charles Krinke: Question: "What are the things we can do to tighten up our testing results this week to help the developers?"
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: in relationship to development
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: hello bluewall
 [10:17] Penny Lane: Hi Blue!
 [10:17] BlueWall Slade: Hi
 [10:17] Strawberry Fride: hi Bluewall!
 [10:17] BlueWall Slade: everyone having a good day?
 [10:17] Justin Clark-Casey: hey bluewall
 [10:17] Charles Krinke: Personal aside: "I need to go to a luncheon in a little bit for a fellow leaving the company today"
 [10:17] Penny Lane: Yes thanks :-)
 [10:17] Richardus Raymaker: hi blue
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: ya great day so far :)
 [10:18] Penny Lane: BlueWall += cookie
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: no problem Charles
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: ok
 [10:18] Adam Frisby: I ate all my cookies. :(
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: something i would like us to talk about
 [10:18] Penny Lane: Awww
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: is the OSGrid 2nd Birthday
 [10:18] BlueWall Slade: cookies?
 [10:18] Penny Lane: Adam += cookie
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: we need volunteers
 [10:18] Hiro Protagonist: we shall continue to endeavor to persevere
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: people to have events and coordinate with others who are
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: Adam might have something to add too
 [10:19] Adam Frisby: Oh yeah
 [10:19] Nebadon Izumi: in terms of the Birthhday discussion
 [10:19] BlueWall Slade: nice
 [10:19] Adam Frisby: So we're like 2. We want to get some events organised, etc.
 [10:19] Justin Clark-Casey: will osgrid have a cake?
 [10:19] Adam Frisby: Since no-one else has volunteered for the job, I'll probably take over organising it.
 [10:19] Penny Lane: Neb: perhaps you could outline how testing is done, for those who haven't yet? Is there a test harness, unit tests, regression, etc?
 [10:19] Nas Messing: i am here
 [10:19] Adam Frisby: Penny: that stuff is done by automated means at panda (panda.opensimulator.org)
 [10:19] Nas Messing: i can help
 [10:19] WhiteStar Magic: maybe Nakad Hippo's can jump out of teh cake too
 [10:19] Nas Messing: if anyone wants me
 [10:19] Brent Seidel: I can probably help out. Just tell me what to do.
 [10:19] Penny Lane: Adam: brill! Looking
 [10:20] Nebs AO v0.3: Carlos Roundel arrived
 [10:20] Adam Frisby: For OSG2B - We want to get some events and things organised.
 [10:20] Nebadon Izumi: great, just coordinate with Adam primarily and then me if you cant reach Adam
 [10:20] Adam Frisby: Anything anyone wants to contribute; just throw it up on the osgrid.org event calendar (on the website)
 [10:20] Adam Frisby: I'm off IRC for a few days, because my IRC box kinda died.
 [10:20] Nebadon Izumi: ya start by creating a event on osgrid.org website
 [10:20] Nebadon Izumi: offline messagine works on the plazas
 [10:20] Nebadon Izumi: so if you want to be sure Adam and I get a message on the grid when were offline
 [10:21] Warin Cascabel: Oh, nice.
 [10:21] Nebadon Izumi: go to a plaza then IM us
 [10:21] Hiro Protagonist: that is sweet
 [10:21] Charles Krinke: The pertinence to this meeting of OSG2B is it becomes a giant stress test of the entire grid and successfully making it happen indicates good stability and reliability for OpenSim.
 [10:21] Adam Frisby: Yeah, fingers crossed we can set a concurrency record
 [10:21] Charles Krinke: Those issues that happen during OSG2B should be Mantised with additional notes by those finding similar bugs.
 [10:21] Adam Frisby: Crucial date is the 22nd, but we'll try be running stuff through to the 26th
 [10:22] Nas Messing: am i just ghost here
 [10:22] Nas Messing: sorry
 [10:22] Charles Krinke: Absoslutely, Adam. Concurrency is the key. We have the chance to stress concurrency and see how well OpenSim will hold up under heavy duty concurrency.
 [10:22] Adam Frisby: So yeah; keep an eye on the event calendar. I'll post the opening gala details there in the next day or two
 [10:23] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:23] Adam Frisby: We just need to organise first where we're going to host the official events.
 [10:23] Justin Clark-Casey: I heard that concurrency just hits a wall after 21, at least on mono
 [10:23] Adam Frisby: need to dig up some additional servers.
 [10:23] Nas Messing: nobody need me
 [10:23] Nebadon Izumi: if anyone needs graphics for their sims
 [10:23] Adam Frisby: Justin: definetely true.
 [10:23] Nebadon Izumi: OSGrid logos
 [10:23] Adam Frisby: Mono has issues at 20-30 users
 [10:23] Nas Messing: i am just a problem here
 [10:23] Adam Frisby: Windows can do 30+ fine
 [10:23] Nebadon Izumi: anything just let us know
 [10:23] Nas Messing: sorry to all
 [10:23] Justin Clark-Casey: interesting
 [10:24] tx Oh: what kind of issues are that
 [10:24] Charles Krinke: Justin. I think we are talking concurrency for the UGAIM, but you have a good point. We are seeing UGAIM concurrency pushing 100 at times.
 [10:24] Justin Clark-Casey: oh okay, sorry
 [10:24] Adam Frisby: Yeah, Saturday evening, we get 100+ on OSGrid
 [10:24] Justin Clark-Casey: charles: you mean 100 users with session at once?
 [10:24] Adam Frisby: http://osgrid.org/stats/detail.php?graph=9&tree=&filter=
 [10:24] Strawberry Fride: not had the chance to do a load test in a while but we did get 40 on my sim on ReactionGrid a couple of months ago. Had less stability of late, though tried out 0.6.6 on our event sim at the weekend and all attendees to movie night survived intact for first time in weeks
 [10:24] Charles Krinke: But, we need t know both region and grid concurrency limits. And, Justin, I was talkling about the entire grid.
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: well this event is doing ok
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: we can have a load of this size for a good hour or 2
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: without much issue
 [10:25] Adam Frisby: We've got 71 sessions on the UGIM right now
 [10:25] Adam Frisby: Should hit 20K signups today too.
 [10:25] Strawberry Fride: excellent!
 [10:26] Charles Krinke: Anyone testing HyperGrid lately? Anything to share on success (or not success) ?
 [10:26] Adam Frisby: HG has been working well for me.
 [10:26] Adam Frisby: I've been visiting all over the place since we enabled it on Lbsa
 [10:26] WhiteStar Magic: I'm running 9962 server and HG is certainly working much smoother on this version of OpenSim
 [10:26] Sean Dague is Online
 [10:26] tx Oh: works like normal tp. sometimes it goes, sometime not.
 [10:26] Nebs AO v0.3: Sean Dague arrived
 [10:26] Adam Frisby: Hey Sean
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: I think that's probably due to a lot of the perf work IBM did
 [10:27] WhiteStar Magic: 9964, sorry
 [10:27] Adam Frisby: Justin: Intel
 [10:27] Charles Krinke: Coolness on HyperGrid. Setting up demoes of that for OSG2B is a very good thing. Anyone testing modrex lately? Anything to share on success (or not success) ?
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: diva still working on grider?
 [10:27] Adam Frisby: Intel's been the one doing profiling
 [10:27] Nebadon Izumi: i think so
 [10:27] Sean Dague: afternoon folks
 [10:27] Nebadon Izumi: i think Diva is on summer break
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: hey sean
 [10:27] Nebadon Izumi: probably not much time for opensim
 [10:27] WhiteStar Magic: Actually, if you would like, I could provide updated and revised HG portals for the party
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: ah, lucky her, very sensible :)
 [10:27] BlueWall Slade: Hi Sean
 [10:28] Agnes Chalet is Online
 [10:28] Charles Krinke: Sean. Welcome, oh great grand wizard from the Hudson Valley.
 [10:28] Nebs AO v0.3: Niek Bergman arrived
 [10:28] Adam Frisby: Charles: I have been meaning to test Modrex 0.5 - now that Rex is finally opensim-trunk compatible.
 [10:28] Sean Dague: well at least lesser wizard apprentice
 [10:28] WhiteStar Magic: JCC Diva patched it a little while and let it set till after holidays
 [10:28] Adam Frisby: I wanted to hack it up to work with opensim grid mode earlier, so we could try it on osgrid
 [10:29] Charles Krinke: I am hoping to see some momentum in deploying a few modrex enabled regions on OSGrid and getting reports on modrex and the RexViewer.
 [10:29] Nebs AO v0.3: tx Oh arrived
 [10:29] Adam Frisby: The new rexviewer is interesting.
 [10:29] Adam Frisby: but also, I havent had time to take a look yet properly.
 [10:29] Nebadon Izumi: ya im excited about the new viewer
 [10:29] Nebadon Izumi: i hear it only can render 1 region though
 [10:29] Adam Frisby: It IS nice to see a proper ground up viewer done though.
 [10:29] Adam Frisby: Nebadon: sounds right, it's only 0.1A
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: ya
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: i need to test it
 [10:30] Charles Krinke: Gotta go to a business luncheon, sorry guys.
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: ok Charles
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: no problem
 [10:30] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:30] Charles Krinke is Offline
 [10:30] Brent Seidel: bye Charles
 [10:30] Nebs AO v0.3: dz ozb arrived
 [10:30] tx Oh: a client is just more then a render engine. sighs
 [10:31] Adam Frisby: tx: Yeah, UI is a very important factor
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: i hope we can soo have Rex meshes on osgrid
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: that would be really cool
 [10:31] Nebs AO v0.3: Starky Rubble arrived
 [10:31] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:31] Adam Frisby: Yeah; be nice to get Meshes -- the catch is we've still got the bulk of users logging in with the SL viewer. (alas!)
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: ya
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: the SL based rex viewer still doesent run for me either
 [10:31] Strawberry Fride: pesky SL viewer - now if they only supported meshes
 [10:31] Adam Frisby: The meerkat devs have been interested in adding meshes in.
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: that would be cool
 [10:32] Adam Frisby: actually the meerkat devs seem open to making viewer changes for us
 [10:32] tx Oh: has anyone tried the blender client plugin? that might help to get a builder tool in a new client
 [10:32] Nebs AO v0.3: tx Oh arrived
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: is it possible for us to currently store meshes as a blob?
 [10:32] Sean Dague: Adam, per previous, Dirk's been busy on perf fixes. Hopefully we'll have some more flowing from us
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: if we had a proper viewer
 [10:32] Adam Frisby: nebadon: yes.
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: nice
 [10:32] Adam Frisby: we can upload meshes as assets and they dont get mangled
 [10:32] Adam Frisby: it's how modrex works
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: nice
 [10:32] Adam Frisby: Sean: Oh great.
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: without modification to the asset services adam?
 [10:32] Adam Frisby: Hopefully between that an the Intel/Sciencesim profiling - OpenSim should begin to really soar.
 [10:32] Penny Lane: Snowglobe crashed, OSgrid didn't. OSgrid wins ;-)
 [10:32] Sean Dague: he put in 13 patches already with some of the early stuff that was discovered in the network stack
 [10:33] Adam Frisby: Nebadon: correct.
 [10:33] Niek Bergman is Offline
 [10:33] Adam Frisby: Sean: did you see MS's mono announcement?
 [10:33] Strawberry Fride: great to hear Sean :)
 [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: nice ADam
 [10:33] Sean Dague: yep
 [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: i assumned it would require back end mods
 [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: thats awesome
 [10:33] Adam Frisby: I'm happy to see that finally happened.
 [10:33] Penny Lane: Which announcement Adam?
 [10:33] Nebs AO v0.3: Orion Hax arrived
 [10:34] Sean Dague: yeh, I get sick of answering that question :)
 [10:34] Adam Frisby: MS's adding royalty free patent licenses to the whole C# + .NET standard that's under ECMA.
 [10:34] BlueWall Slade is Online
 [10:34] Penny Lane: Excellent
 [10:34] Brent Seidel: Good
 [10:34] Adam Frisby: So basically MS cant sue anyone using Mono; or at least the subset of mono that opensim uses.
 [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: nice i saw that, but didnt fully understand the implecations of it
 [10:34] Adam Frisby: which clears up a lot of the anti-Mono FUD.
 [10:34] Sean Dague: once the mono split packages are out there we'll need to verify that OpenSim runs under the patent free stuff
 [10:34] Adam Frisby: Sean: the only concern I have is ADO
 [10:35] Adam Frisby: I think we might be using ADO in places; although I'm not sure.
 [10:35] Sean Dague: yeh, but I don't think we need to use it any more
 [10:35] Sean Dague: so it will just be a scrubbing session to clear that out
 [10:35] Adam Frisby: Probably not. Although that might make MSSQL incompatible
 [10:35] Nebs AO v0.3: BlueWall Slade arrived
 [10:35] Strawberry Fride: MSSQL code uses the SQL server specific code in .net for native data comms - not much use for mono there
 [10:35] Adam Frisby: Strawberry: what do you think about moving the MSSQL adapter to the forge?
 [10:35] Richardus Raymaker: use mysql :)
 [10:36] Strawberry Fride: I would maintain it - I understand your concerns - would be a bit disappointed but that's not my call :) if someone can explain to me how the heck to get it back in to opensim then that would be lovely
 [10:36] Nebs AO v0.3: Arthur Valadares arrived
 [10:36] Nebs AO v0.3: tx Oh arrived
 [10:36] Strawberry Fride: and no, would never use MySQL (spits on the floor) ;)
 [10:36] Justin Clark-Casey: strawberry: another MySQL hater? :)
 [10:36] Adam Frisby: pfft. MySQL is fine.
 [10:36] Nebs AO v0.3: Arthur Valadares arrived
 [10:37] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:37] Strawberry Fride: lol - I wrote a book on MySQL, MSSQL, Oracle and Access once
 [10:37] Strawberry Fride: never again
 [10:37] Adam Frisby: Except when InnoDB crashes and we have to de-corrupt a table without tools. (Hi OSGrid UGIM Database circa January)
 [10:37] Penny Lane: Horses for courses. Let everyone use what suits their business and worldview. That's why there are adapters.
 [10:37] Brent Seidel: Hey, anyone for PostgreSQL?
 [10:37] Strawberry Fride: exactly
 [10:37] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:37] Nebs AO v0.3: tx Oh arrived
 [10:37] Nebadon Izumi breifly curls into fetal position at thought of january asset table
 [10:37] Adam Frisby: Irony is that MySQL is now owned by Oracle.
 [10:37] Strawberry Fride: I just know MSSQL and happen to kinda like it - no issues with anything else
 [10:38] BlueWall Slade: it would be good to have PgSQL
 [10:38] Strawberry Fride: yes! Oracle based opensim would be interesting
 [10:38] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam: deal hasn't completed yet though?
 [10:38] Adam Frisby: Justin: I thought it's just being finalized and is all but done?
 [10:38] Adam Frisby: I would like to see PgSQL too
 [10:38] tx Oh: postgres would be nice
 [10:38] Brent Seidel: Oracle should be possible using NHibernate.
 [10:38] Adam Frisby: I think Rex' NHibernate adapter could be easily done.
 [10:38] Adam Frisby: to add PgSQL support
 [10:38] Nebs AO v0.3: Orion Hax arrived
 [10:38] Brent Seidel: I use PostgreSQL at home
 [10:38] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam: yeah, you're probably right - I'm not completely uptodate
 [10:38] Orion Hax: my issue with mssql is it eats everything in sight
 [10:38] Nebadon Izumi: isnt there postgresql support project on forge?
 [10:38] Strawberry Fride: lol
 [10:38] Nebadon Izumi: there was anyway
 [10:38] Penny Lane: Oracle for Linux used to be free (as in beer) for non-commercial use ... is that still so?
 [10:38] Adam Frisby: There was a postgres project on the forge
 [10:38] Brent Seidel: I'm currently running r9961 with pgSQL via NHibernate
 [10:38] Sean Dague: yeh, the nhibernate layer kind of sucks though
 [10:38] Nebadon Izumi: that might have been Fly Mans baby
 [10:39] Adam Frisby: oh there we go
 [10:39] BlueWall Slade: lol, I have always shyed away from projects that didn't support PgSQL
 [10:39] Justin Clark-Casey: so did flyman disappear off the face?
 [10:39] Strawberry Fride: the schema on nhibernate, at least for mssql parts, is bad
 [10:39] dz ozb: penny : i think it is
 [10:39] Strawberry Fride: unnecessarily large column sizes
 [10:39] Sean Dague: I was also disappointed that the nhibernate people bounced my bug report
 [10:39] Adam Frisby: Nebadon: NHIbernate is Mikko from Admino's project
 [10:39] Nebadon Izumi: heh ya long story Justin, but he jumped into the pit of despair
 [10:39] Sean Dague: "mono support is not a primary goal"
 [10:39] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: wow
 [10:39] Richardus Raymaker: PgSQL, dont work well with phpmyadmin i guess.
 [10:39] Adam Frisby: Sean: ugh.
 [10:39] BlueWall Slade: isd a native adapert hard to do?
 [10:39] Adam Frisby: Justin: it was very ..... precious.
 [10:39] tx Oh: linux support is
 [10:40] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:40] Sean Dague: bluewall, not really, it's just time
 [10:40] Sean Dague: we were hoping that nhibernate would save us time there
 [10:40] BlueWall Slade: it is a heavy lifter
 [10:40] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:40] Sean Dague: but the reality is that it seems to just slow things down
 [10:40] Nebs AO v0.3: Strawberry Fride arrived
 [10:40] BlueWall Slade: ya another layer
 [10:40] Sean Dague: which, honestly, isn't a huge deal for a lot of the data persistance, as it's not really the bottleneck (except for assetss)
 [10:41] Adam Frisby: Assets arent too much of a bottleneck
 [10:41] BlueWall Slade: I ran into issues with SQLite on Linux a while back
 [10:41] Brent Seidel: I had to do a dump and restore of my PostgreSQL database this morning (updateing) and everything came back fine. My fountain was even fountaining.
 [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: heh
 [10:41] Adam Frisby: If anyone wants to see scary charts: http://assets.osgrid.org/stats/detail.php?graph=9&tree=&filter=
 [10:41] Adam Frisby: That's running fragstore tho.
 [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya
 [10:42] Strawberry Fride: splendid :)
 [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: we need an accurate dupe count one of these days
 [10:42] Sean Dague: adam, any recent news on vivox relationship?
 [10:42] Adam Frisby: Sean: I can put you in touch with the guys - it needs time and manpower I dont have to give right now.
 [10:42] Adam Frisby: They seem keen
 [10:42] Justin Clark-Casey: adam: 3 milion assets?
 [10:42] Adam Frisby: Yep
 [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: lol ya 3 mill
 [10:42] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:43] Penny Lane: 2.9m of them plywood cubes :-)
 [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:43] Adam Frisby: Nope; I did a plywood cube count actually
 [10:43] Warin Cascabel: Heh :)
 [10:43] Adam Frisby: Only like 200K plywood cubes in the DB. ;)
 [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: ya it was low
 [10:43] Penny Lane: Haha
 [10:43] Richardus Raymaker: the problem is that there so many unused inventory things. that never get deleted
 [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: that's a lot of gb
 [10:43] BlueWall Slade: lol
 [10:43] Strawberry Fride: haha
 [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: my guess Justincc
 [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: under 100gb still
 [10:43] BlueWall Slade: well, they all started as lowly plywood cubes
 [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: I just guesttimated 143gb at average 50kb per asset (which might be a little high)
 [10:43] Adam Frisby: Justin: we do duplicate elimination.
 [10:44] Nebadon Izumi: well we are doing dupe compression
 [10:44] Adam Frisby: So if you upload the same asset twice, it's only stored once.
 [10:44] Nebadon Izumi: so its defiantly under 100gb i think
 [10:44] Adam Frisby: We get about a 30% saving off that.
 [10:44] Nebadon Izumi: its probably close though
 [10:44] Justin Clark-Casey: cool. You're doing dupe compression using hashes?
 [10:44] Nebadon Izumi: i have no doubt im responsible for atleast 50k
 [10:44] Nebadon Izumi: of the assets
 [10:44] Adam Frisby: Justin: 256bit SHA hash
 [10:44] Bri Hasp is Online
 [10:44] Nebs AO v0.3: dz ozb arrived
 [10:44] Adam Frisby: sufficiently long to eliminate the change of a random collision
 [10:44] Adam Frisby: (or deliberate collision for that matter)
 [10:45] Nebs AO v0.3: Arthur Valadares arrived
 [10:45] Penny Lane: A histogram of assets by size vs number would be interesting
 [10:45] Justin Clark-Casey: from the last chart, looks like you're gorowing at about 400,000 assets pe rmonth :)
 [10:45] Adam Frisby: I can fish that data out; we can query the table reasonably safely.
 [10:45] Nebs AO v0.3: tx Oh arrived
 [10:45] Bri Hasp is Offline
 [10:45] Adam Frisby: Justin: It's about 10%/mo give or take
 [10:46] Adam Frisby: It's been that way since near day 1.
 [10:46] BlueWall Slade: lol, that is from debugging scripts
 [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: is that s sustainable rate?
 [10:46] Adam Frisby: Justin: We think so.
 [10:46] Penny Lane: No, lol
 [10:46] Adam Frisby: We think we can keep up for at least 18 months
 [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: cool - I guess strorage _is_ continually getting cheaper....
 [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: :)
 [10:46] Adam Frisby: Yeah
 [10:46] Adam Frisby: In 2 years, we'll have about 3TB of assets we guess.
 [10:47] Adam Frisby: so it's not too bad.
 [10:47] Adam Frisby: Of course, if growth suddenly spikes - we might have more.
 [10:47] Nebadon Izumi: ya 3tb of HD is cheap
 [10:47] Nebadon Izumi: even in 10k SCSI-3
 [10:47] Brent Seidel: Makes backup a bit tricky.
 [10:47] Adam Frisby: yeah dont get me started on that.
 [10:47] Sean Dague: heh
 [10:47] Richardus Raymaker: 24/7 backup :P
 [10:47] Adam Frisby: We're still waiting to get our failover equipment for this.
 [10:47] Justin Clark-Casey: man, sounds like a gargantuan problem :)
 [10:47] Adam Frisby: It's been fun.
 [10:47] Adam Frisby: I've spent the last few weeks focused on getting osgrid going
 [10:48] Nebadon Izumi: id say it was a bigger problem 6 months ago than right now
 [10:48] Penny Lane: There's no centralized DB on the planet that can grow to Internet size nor a tiny fraction of it, so unless OSgrid membership is capped, or the DB is distributed, then it's definitely going to hit the stoppers.
 [10:48] Adam Frisby: Penny: it's highly distributable.
 [10:48] Adam Frisby: We have a 256bit key on everything; with an even distribution of key bits
 [10:48] Adam Frisby: We can very easily cluster that.
 [10:48] Adam Frisby: It's mostly a cost of bandwidth & storage problem, rather than a software one.
 [10:48] Sean Dague: osgrid will be incentive to solve distributed asset services :)
 [10:49] Penny Lane: Hehe
 [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey: ha ha, necessity is the mother
 [10:49] Sean Dague: exactly
 [10:49] BlueWall Slade: and accidents the father :)
 [10:49] Sean Dague: it's always better to solve a problem that's real and in front of you
 [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey grins
 [10:49] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:49] Hiro Protagonist: word, Sean
 [10:49] Adam Frisby: Document storage isnt too bad.
 [10:49] Penny Lane: Well Cable Beach now has a formal reference site, since last week. So that'll help on the asset front.
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: I think our real problems are going to really be in other areas
 [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: a formal reference site?
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: Inventory is growing scary
 [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam: but isn't that order of magnitude less than assets?
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: Inventory has me worried actually; since we could very easily have a table with 1 billion rows.
 [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: orders
 [10:50] Nebadon Izumi: ya its like 1,000th the size
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: No; we've got 1M inventory rows right now.
 [10:50] Nebadon Izumi: but ther ows
 [10:50] Nebadon Izumi: *rows
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: sorry 2M actually
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: I'm a million off.
 [10:50] Hiro Protagonist: :#
 [10:50] Adam Frisby: but that's growing faster than assets.
 [10:50] Penny Lane: JCC: http://code.google.com/p/cablebeach/wiki/CableBeachCore1_0
 [10:50] Niek Bergman is Online
 [10:51] Nebs AO v0.3: Niek Bergman arrived
 [10:51] Adam Frisby: and I have a horrible feeling at about 50M inventory items, something's going to break.
 [10:51] Nebadon Izumi: heh
 [10:51] Justin Clark-Casey: mmmm - time to charge?
 [10:51] Adam Frisby: We've still got a while before hitting that point - probably a year.
 [10:51] Nebs AO v0.3: Penny Lane arrived
 [10:51] Adam Frisby: Justin: I've been giving it a lot of thought
 [10:51] Nebs AO v0.3: Niek Bergman arrived
 [10:51] Adam Frisby: We can switch to other databases; but that only buys us time.
 [10:51] Justin Clark-Casey: penny: thanks
 [10:51] Strawberry Fride: hoping that if HyperGrid goes in the right direction, distributed asset storage would be a nice option
 [10:52] Adam Frisby: We need a new inventory schema that can let us distribute a users inventory across multiple servers.
 [10:52] Strawberry Fride: micro-grids that are more seamless together
 [10:52] Hiro Protagonist: +1 Adam
 [10:52] Adam Frisby: Eg, we have two inventory servers and half the users are on one, half on the other.
 [10:52] Adam Frisby: But yes, Strawberry has the ultimate long term solution - a web of tiny little grids, all alike.
 [10:52] Nebs AO v0.3: Philippe Debevec arrived
 [10:52] Sean Dague: how much load is actually down that inventory path?
 [10:52] Hiro Protagonist: or even, two inv servers and some of my inv is here and some there
 [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: ya sorta of fracture OSgrid into multiple hypergrids
 [10:52] Penny Lane: Yes, the HG model is distribution without the pain, so all you need on top of that is asset caching.
 [10:52] Adam Frisby: of course; I kind of envisage OSGrid being like the gmail of email -- it's there you can get an account easily; and it's convenient.
 [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: that act as 1 major grid
 [10:53] Strawberry Fride: change the terminology actually - grid could be standalone.... however it's worked
 [10:53] Strawberry Fride: that's our thinking on it - encourage splitting out and teleporting between
 [10:53] Adam Frisby: Sean: there's not much load right now - but it could become problematic because some of the indexes can get large.
 [10:53] Adam Frisby: Like the owner_key index could end up being problematic.
 [10:53] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam: I'm a little surprised that's not possible today, behind the inventory service interface
 [10:54] Sean Dague: large indexes shouldn't really be an issue should they?
 [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: I mean, splitting things between two different dbs..........
 [10:54] Adam Frisby: Justin/Sean: Oh it's quite doable today - it just requires some more software to be written for it
 [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: ah ok :)
 [10:54] Adam Frisby: Sean: large indexes can be a problem in cases.
 [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: more of a solvable problem than runaway asset growth, I would have thought
 [10:55] Adam Frisby: I'd say it's slightly less solvable; assets is already solved.
 [10:55] Adam Frisby: We can look at things like distributed filesystems used by Hadoop, etc. and directly employ them.
 [10:55] Penny Lane: Scalability isn't "just more software" though. You've got to have a scalable design, or more software won't prevent meltdown.
 [10:55] Sean Dague: yeh. I'm also hoping to get an informix driver from that team in the next couple of months
 [10:55] Justin Clark-Casey: assets: solved on a technical level but not a monetary level? I guess who cares about the money though... (shades of most web 2.0 companies)
 [10:56] Adam Frisby: Justin: for osgrid, yes. We've had good donations recently and we've got enough to keep us going for a while - which I'm really happy about.
 [10:56] Adam Frisby: But we're going to need to get donations increased for next year.
 [10:56] Adam Frisby: Since no doubt our load will be higher.
 [10:56] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.6.5 (Dev) .9960 (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur)
Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:True
 [10:56] Justin Clark-Casey: adam: yeah, that was a cool thing to see
 [10:56] Adam Frisby: I think OSGrid is beggining to get popular though
 [10:56] Adam Frisby: We've grown 25% in the last month alone.
 [10:56] Adam Frisby: Which is impressive given OSGrid is nearly 2.
 [10:57] Sean Dague: yeh, well the snowball starts small
 [10:57] Adam Frisby: New website has been a fun project too
 [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: ya, we did do quite a bit of promotion this month
 [10:57] Adam Frisby: if anyone hasnt taken a peek yet - go look at www.osgrid.org -- sign in using your avatar name & password
 [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: i have no doubt 1000+ people saw our booth ath SL6B
 [10:57] Adam Frisby: eg; http://www.osgrid.org/elgg/pg/profile/Adam.Frisby
 [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: which acutally
 [10:57] Justin Clark-Casey: oh yeah, it's not every day that something like this comes along :)
 [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: will be erased today
 [10:57] Sean Dague: the twitter stream around opensim has gotten all kinds of fun as well
 [10:58] Penny Lane: Time to think about a scalable design then. If the response to growth is "We'll need more donations", then it's not a scalable design, it's a centralized one.
 [10:58] Sean Dague: I used to know everyone that put opensim in a tweet

[[Category:Chat Logs]]

Chat log from the meeting on 2009-09-15

2009-09-17T17:49:07Z

DaveCoyle: add Chat Logs category

[10:10] Connecting to in-world Voice Chat...
 [10:10] Connected
 [10:10] Adam Frisby: LL's talking about megaregions?
 [10:10] Adam Frisby is Online
 [10:10] Penny Lane: Yep
 [10:10] Kitto Flora: I got a Tako sort-of working last nite, except for the obvious missing stuff and some tuning it sorks fairly well 'out of the box' so far
 [10:10] Hiro Protagonist: heh
 [10:10] Dahlia Trimble: haha
 [10:10] Penny Lane: It's got them panicked
 [10:10] Justin Clark-Casey: penny: LL have noticed?
 [10:10] Hiro Protagonist: awesome Kitto
 [10:10] Richardus Raymaker: LL & megaregions. must be be withg megaprices to
 [10:10] Bri Hasp: yep they are in panic mode over in San Fran
 [10:10] Nebadon Izumi: hello
 [10:10] Nebadon Izumi: sorry im late
 [10:10] Snoopy Pfeffer: hi Neb
 [10:10] Adam Frisby: I know LL were browsing around the simhost website yesterday, I lol'd.
 [10:10] Nebadon Izumi: my 22 inch monitor is dieing
 [10:10] Hiro Protagonist: oh crap
 [10:10] Nebadon Izumi: i had to smack it around to get it to turn on
 [10:11] Adam Frisby: I tried doing a customer service chat with them, and they rejected it. :(
 [10:11] Richardus Raymaker: LL (hehe) dont understand the are to high in price
 [10:11] Justin Clark-Casey: penny: In what way?
 [10:11] Penny Lane: JCC: yep, they've taken Latif's megaregion setup to test
 [10:11] Penny Lane: Funny as hell.
 [10:11] Dahlia Trimble: LL took Latif's?
 [10:11] Justin Clark-Casey: who is Latif?
 [10:11] Kitto Flora: Heehee - LL gets the double-whammy?? OS has super-regions AND vehicles?
 [10:11] Snoopy Pfeffer: I did also hear that LL sees us more and more as a competition
 [10:11] Nebadon Izumi: thats funny Adam
 [10:11] Bri Hasp: I had 2 Lindens sailing on my Sea
 [10:11] Penny Lane: It's great. LL are chasing Opensim tail lights
 [10:11] Snoopy Pfeffer: one reason seems to be that we even support Vivox voice
 [10:12] Adam Frisby: Kitto has been doing some impressive work on Vehicles I hear.
 [10:12] Justin Clark-Casey: I'd rather they saw us as supporters rather than competitors, lift the boats for everyone
 [10:12] Adam Frisby: Justin: it's quite possible if they ever finished the interop work
 [10:12] Hiro Protagonist: I actually have it upmerged with this mornings trunk and up on github kitto :D
 [10:12] Bri Hasp: I am cordial Adam
 [10:12] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, it looks like slow going
 [10:12] Adam Frisby: There'd be a lot of room for LL to make a buck in the 'hypergrid', through currency & exchange services, content marketplaces, etc.
 [10:12] Nebadon Izumi: I think the Lindens are their own worst enemies
 [10:12] Adam Frisby: although their hosting prices would probably be forced into more competitive rates
 [10:12] Penny Lane: JCC: neither supporters nor competition. Opensim is doing something much more important: leading the development of VWs.
 [10:13] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam: competition is always good
 [10:13] Kitto Flora: Hiro: Great! You will have to show me how to upgrade Sea-3
 [10:13] Nebadon Izumi: ya i think the reason SL is the way it is
 [10:13] Nebadon Izumi: no competition for long time
 [10:13] Nebadon Izumi: to spur them into inovation
 [10:13] Penny Lane: Neb++
 [10:13] Justin Clark-Casey: penny: there certainly is a lot of experimentation here - we're freer than LL in that respect
 [10:13] Hiro Protagonist: will do Kitto - btw, I tested it on my mega region this morning, and it was not so good as on a 'normal' region
 [10:13] Penny Lane: Yep
 [10:13] Justin Clark-Casey: we don't need permission to innovate
 [10:14] Hiro Protagonist: we may want to set up a mega for your to work with
 [10:14] Bri Hasp: we can do that easy Hiro
 [10:14] Nebadon Izumi: im ready to test Kittos stuff on Arizona Bay when its ready
 [10:14] Adam Frisby: Btw guys - we are going to need to do a protocol bump on friday
 [10:14] Kitto Flora: What was not so good, Hiro?
 [10:14] Hiro Protagonist: but progres is tremendous nonetheless :D
 [10:14] Penny Lane: And not constrained by the past either. LL are imprisoned by their content creators.
 [10:14] Bri Hasp: I dunno how much Linux can handle
 [10:14] Adam Frisby: I know everyone hates those bumps, but we gotta do it for some inventory related issues.
 [10:14] Kitto Flora: Nebadon: Grab it off Hiro's git
 [10:14] Hiro Protagonist: I think the mega confused the steering somehow, and there was some vehicle tumbling
 [10:14] Nebadon Izumi: ok i will
 [10:14] Adam Frisby: (specifically you lot killing our inventory server)
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: we have a ton of people who have not upgraded sims in long time
 [10:15] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, we're free to upset people
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: and its causing massive spew and occasional crash on inventory server
 [10:15] Richardus Raymaker: oldest i have seen is 10108
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: no doubt those regions cant even access their inventory anymore
 [10:15] Bri Hasp: Kito can test on my Net Super Sim next door
 [10:15] Penny Lane: JCC: hahah :P
 [10:15] paulie Flomar: We're free to upset people. YOu have to PAY LL to upset people. lol.
 [10:15] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:15] Penny Lane: Lucky I wasn't drinking coffee there, the keyboard would have suffered
 [10:16] Justin Clark-Casey: :D
 [10:16] Nas Messing is Online
 [10:16] paulie Flomar: zing :)
 [10:16] Nebadon Izumi: i tell you one thing though
 [10:16] Hiro Protagonist: Bri you should probably pull the merged code for the work from my git site
 [10:16] Adam Frisby: Speaking of mandatory updates
 [10:16] Hiro Protagonist: prolly be easier though to reconfig his
 [10:16] Adam Frisby: now we've got 'revisions' back
 [10:16] Adam Frisby: could a dev who has some free time, please, please, please implement a 'min/max version allowed for connect' option pair into the grid server?
 [10:17] Adam Frisby: It'd be a lot easier if we could say 'revisions from 10,000+ are fine' rather than == NetworkInterface version.
 [10:17] Bri Hasp: give me the link or files
 [10:17] Adam Frisby: therefor we can range some of these transitions better.
 [10:17] Justin Clark-Casey: In mainline OpenSim I think that's a bad idea, since it looks people to our source control system
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: also make it so we cant start dup region names
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: we really need to fix this
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: once and for all
 [10:17] Justin Clark-Casey: Of course, anyone is free to do what they like in a spearate module
 [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: dupe*
 [10:17] Justin Clark-Casey: sorry looks = locks
 [10:17] Adam Frisby: Justin: I'm not particularly caring about 'how' we do it - but the NetworkInterface must == versus > X && < Y is a problem
 [10:17] Hiro Protagonist: Bri here's the url for the git repo: git://github.com/JamesStallings/opensim.git
 [10:18] Hiro Protagonist: the branch is KittoFloraODE
 [10:18] Adam Frisby: It would be nice if we enforced a minimum network interface version (and optionally a maximum), but not a specific one.
 [10:18] Adam Frisby: Then we can update it more regularly wihout so much pain
 [10:18] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.6.6 (Dev)
git# efc43aa 2009-09-13 18:24:00 +0100 (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur)
Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:True
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: nice
 [10:18] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam: certainly the very thing could be improved, but I don't like typing it in to git 'revisions'
 [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: ya be good to have a window of sorts
 [10:18] Justin Clark-Casey: sorry very thing == interface version
 [10:18] Justin Clark-Casey: my head isn't the best today
 [10:19] Baba Sucks: I agree.. git revisions are not the right thing to tie this to
 [10:19] Bri Hasp: overserved Justin?
 [10:19] Nebadon Izumi: we dont do we?
 [10:19] Nebadon Izumi: we have a protocol revision
 [10:19] Nebadon Izumi: we have to code in
 [10:19] Justin Clark-Casey: bri: yeah :)
 [10:19] Nebadon Izumi: the revision just tells you where the break is
 [10:19] Hiro Protagonist: conditionals other than '==' against the protocol version sound like a good idea though
 [10:19] Nebadon Izumi: its not the determining factor for protocol
 [10:20] Justin Clark-Casey: well, the single protocol version was the simplest possible thing that could possibly work
 [10:20] Bri Hasp: 10713 was bad for me earlier.. reverted to 10707
 [10:21] Hiro Protagonist: I running head/master from that same repo right now with no issues
 [10:21] Justin Clark-Casey: if there's a case for making that a range then cool. Or if osgrid wants to implement its own module to enforce OpenSim revisions then that's cool too, though I don't think such a thing should be in core OpenSim
 [10:21] Nebadon Izumi: me to Hiro
 [10:21] Snoopy Pfeffer: Hiro the current git head?
 [10:21] Justin Clark-Casey: possibly we could provide more ifnormation than just the network version when regions attempt to connect to the grid service
 [10:21] Nebadon Izumi: welll couldnt the ragne just be based on the protocol revison
 [10:21] Nebadon Izumi: say v 2 / 3 are allowed
 [10:21] Nebadon Izumi: but 1 is not?
 [10:21] Nebadon Izumi: something like that?
 [10:22] Hiro Protagonist: more or less - it's master from the github repo I made earlier this morning when I got kitto's changed into the fork and pushed it
 [10:22] Justin Clark-Casey: sure - though I would like to see a good use case before we start making things more complicated
 [10:22] Nebadon Izumi: ya
 [10:22] Nebadon Izumi: makes sense
 [10:22] Snoopy Pfeffer: thanks HIro, I will upgrade to that after this meeting
 [10:22] Hiro Protagonist: kitto's stuff is in the branch I gave earlier on that same repo
 [10:23] Bri Hasp: acted like a race situation for me.. red text on grid comm.. took 25 starts to even run
 [10:23] Bri Hasp: then was cloud Av
 [10:23] Salima Barzane is Online
 [10:24] Bri Hasp: reverted all was normal
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: that is odd
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: this was linux or windows box?
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: ive only tested in windows
 [10:24] Bri Hasp: I ONLY run Net these days
 [10:24] Nebadon Izumi: hmm interesting
 [10:25] Penny Lane: Headsup on IBM committing their Agent Domain finally, early version with code on github. http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/project/ogp/ -- nothing of much interest to anyone outside OGP though. Apparently they've hacked Opensim regions to do some kind of asset reflection.
 [10:25] Richardus Raymaker: need to test more linux nebadon :)
 [10:25] Bri Hasp: and a hot server hosted in CA
 [10:25] Justin Clark-Casey: penny: is that new work or just the original code they had way back?
 [10:25] Penny Lane: JCC: the first time their internal code sees light of day
 [10:26] Justin Clark-Casey: I imaigine that stuff is pretty much dead right now waiting for VWRAP to start proper?
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: ping
 [10:27] Penny Lane: Heh, I don't want to get into that. Let's just say it's typical LL ...
 [10:27] Snoopy Pfeffer: lol
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: well, I lurk on the ml - always interesting discussions but I don;t have the time to get involved, unfortunately :)
 [10:27] Justin Clark-Casey: (or always the will ;)
 [10:27] Chris D is Online
 [10:28] Justin Clark-Casey: so anybody want to talk about any other OpenSim issues, or lynch me, or anything liek that? :)
 [10:28] Penny Lane: Personally I don't think it matters at all, because you guys are leaving them miles behind. But gives me something to do :P
 [10:29] Justin Clark-Casey: I think we can do a lot of experimentation, but I suspect getting everything shipshape to a point where people could really rely on it is much more of a challenge
 [10:29] Baba Sucks: That IAR stuff is really great.. It exposes so many flaws
 [10:29] Teravus Ousley is Online
 [10:29] Bri Hasp: is terrain load-tile ok? I had problems but was ok last year
 [10:29] Snoopy Pfeffer: true Justin, the goal should be an opensim 1.0 package, maybe end of this year
 [10:29] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah
 [10:29] Bri Hasp: handy for ther new Super Sims
 [10:30] Justin Clark-Casey: snoopy: I would personally be pessimistic about that, but that's just my opinion
 [10:30] Snoopy Pfeffer: much experimentation is cool, but can cause loosing focus
 [10:30] Ideia Boa: hey all
 [10:30] Dahlia Trimble: 1.0 in 3 months? dont think it's going to happen
 [10:30] Justin Clark-Casey: baba: yeah, can't hide through obscurity forever
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: Bri did you see my notes yesterday on load tile
 [10:30] Snoopy Pfeffer: :)
 [10:30] Baba Sucks: I want to put native super region support into the viewer still ;0
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: load tile changed from 1 year ago
 [10:30] Bri Hasp: yep Neb
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: you no longer put meters
 [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: you put # of regions
 [10:30] Chris D is Online
 [10:30] Bri Hasp: tiles
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: that didnt work either?
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: heh i think we just GCd
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: lol
 [10:31] Snoopy Pfeffer: could we also implement something like the opposite of mega regions??
 [10:31] Bri Hasp: only with an f32 format Neb
 [10:31] Snoopy Pfeffer: I mean 4 servers handling 1 region?
 [10:31] Justin Clark-Casey: picoregions?
 [10:31] Snoopy Pfeffer: yes
 [10:31] Snoopy Pfeffer: to be able to handle many avatars
 [10:31] Snoopy Pfeffer: hi Teravus
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: hmm ok thats Adam land we need to tlak to him
 [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: i guess he crash?
 [10:31] Snoopy Pfeffer: right topic, now lol
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: i was on phone
 [10:32] Baba Sucks: snoopy, you would have to find a way to break up the work or have the servers run a virtual machine
 [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: came back he is gone
 [10:32] Justin Clark-Casey: snoppy: Yeah, you might want to suggest that to Ter - might not be too hard now :)
 [10:32] Snoopy Pfeffer: yes Justin
 [10:32] Kitto Flora: The people working on megaregions: Can we have 'vector osGetRegionSize()' ?
 [10:32] Teravus Ousley: Snoopy: I don't think that it's reasonable to do that in a way that the linden client will like without something like the load balancer
 [10:32] Snoopy Pfeffer: maybe the same code can nearly do that already
 [10:32] Snoopy Pfeffer: yes
 [10:32] Bri Hasp: thats would be handy Kitto
 [10:32] Snoopy Pfeffer: well the outside interface looks like on region
 [10:33] Snoopy Pfeffer: but inside are 4 regions
 [10:33] Snoopy Pfeffer: one*
 [10:33] Penny Lane: Hiya Tera --- mega gratz on the megaregion hack, t'is wonderful :-))
 [10:33] Bri Hasp: keep from crashing off world
 [10:33] Teravus Ousley: In truth, it can be done already in units of 4, but the Linden client will not see it as a smaller region
 [10:33] Snoopy Pfeffer: oh ok
 [10:33] Snoopy Pfeffer: can we not make the viewer believe that it is one region?
 [10:33] Snoopy Pfeffer: while 4 servers handle the traffic?
 [10:34] Teravus Ousley: Did I mention the load balancer?
 [10:34] Snoopy Pfeffer: hm yes
 [10:34] Kitto Flora: Snoopy: the problem is the physics engine.
 [10:34] Snoopy Pfeffer: do we have that already??
 [10:34] Teravus Ousley: No, the problem is the Linden client
 [10:34] Teravus Ousley: not the physics engine.
 [10:34] Dahlia Trimble: I think the load balancer can make it work in 4 cores (last I checked)
 [10:34] Snoopy Pfeffer: and we cannot make the client believe it is just 1 server?
 [10:35] Teravus Ousley: Again, I mention the load balancer! :)
 [10:35] Snoopy Pfeffer: ok :)
 [10:35] Dahlia Trimble: I think it's on forge somewhere
 [10:35] Snoopy Pfeffer: I will look for it
 [10:35] Kitto Flora: The problem with running multiple server machines supporting a Region(whatever its size) is that there must be one Physics Engine for the whole region, and it must runon one server machine.
 [10:36] Dahlia Trimble: dunno if it ever made it into core
 [10:36] Snoopy Pfeffer: some guys working on business regions might need it
 [10:36] Penny Lane: In principle, SL-compatible hacks to the client that allow megaregions to improve should be possible to commit to Snowglobe. IBM would probably support that for their commercial product, now that everyone wants megaregions.
 [10:36] Richardus Raymaker: write bigger teravus. :)
 [10:36] Penny Lane: Bingo,Snoopy
 [10:36] Justin Clark-Casey: the load balancer was in core but got moved into a forge module, on the last attempt to slim down the core
 [10:36] Bri Hasp: I am thrilled with my SuperSim, mega regions a few trivial prim and texture issues but all can workaround
 [10:36] Snoopy Pfeffer: hm I will ask some friends from IBM
 [10:38] Disconnected from in-world Voice Chat

 [10:45] Connecting to in-world Voice Chat...
 [10:45] Connected
 [10:45] Hiro Protagonist: 0.2.2 crashes my region
 [10:45] Bri Hasp: since new version
 [10:45] Michelle Argus is Online
 [10:45] Baba Sucks: Hiro, crashes it?
 [10:45] Baba Sucks: do you know what is causing that?
 [10:45] Hiro Protagonist: no idea Baba
 [10:45] Nebadon Izumi: hello
 [10:45] Nebadon Izumi: sorry guys
 [10:45] Hiro Protagonist: it doesnt even toss an exception
 [10:46] Nebadon Izumi: that crash was my fault
 [10:46] Bri Hasp: same here.. get 'just in time' errors
 [10:46] Nebadon Izumi: i let the log file grow to 4gb
 [10:46] Nebadon Izumi: and log4net threw a fit
 [10:46] Hiro Protagonist: just stack trace outta no where
 [10:46] Richardus Raymaker: i crashed my region because a telkeport failed last time
 [10:46] Baba Sucks: neb, you should break up the log more often
 [10:47] Baba Sucks: hiro, send me the stack trace ;0
 [10:47] Hiro Protagonist: ok, I have to repro
 [10:47] Bri Hasp: we better not crash again I bet once
 [10:47] Hiro Protagonist: it is on a mega region, that could have something to do with it
 [10:48] Baba Sucks: in any case nothing the viewer does should crash the sim
 [10:48] Baba Sucks: but if we can avoid it we should
 [10:49] Disconnected from in-world Voice Chat

[[Category:Chat Logs]]

Using Git

2009-09-17T17:46:34Z

DaveCoyle: removing gratuitous capitalization

This is an introduction to using git for OpenSim core developers.

= Installing Git =

== Linux ==

=== CLI ===
:Git is provided as a package with all modern Linux distributions. Install the following packages depending on environment:
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-core</pre>
::* Centos: see the instructions at http://www.how-to-linux.com/2009/01/install-git-161-on-centos-52/

=== GUIs ===
:[http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-gui.html git-gui]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ sudo apt-get install git-gui
$ git gui

:[http://cola.tuxfamily.org/ git-cola]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ apt-get install git-cola
$ git-cola

== Resolving git hash & revision numbers ==

[[Show_git_version_numbers_-_Windows|Windows batchfile]]

[[Show_git_version_numbers_-_Windows|Linux bash script]]

== Windows ==

On Windows you need to install 2 packages:
* [http://msysgit.googlecode.com/files/Git-1.6.4-preview20090730.exe msysgit] - the basic git port for windows. Install this first.
* [http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/ Tortoise Git] - the git explorer. Install this second.

When '''installing msysgit''' be sure to choose
'''Unix style line endings'''. This will make it so that all the line endings are managed correctly, which will prevent merge issues in the future.

[[Image:msysgit1.png]] [[Image:msysgit2.png]] [[Image:msysgit3.png]] [[Image:msysgit4.png]] [[Image:msysgit5.png]]

= Configuring Git =

Git has both a global config and a local config for each repo. As one might expect, local trumps global. The first important thing to do is set your name and email address, as that will be used in your commits.

On Linux this is done via:

git config user.email YOUR@EMAIL.ADDR
git config user.name "Your Name"

On Windows this done with the config menu.

[[Image:config1.png]] [[Image:Config2.png]]

= Git Repositories for OpenSim =

The urls for the repositories are as follows:

{| border="1"
! Repository !! Developer URL !! Anon URL
|-
|| opensim (main repository) || ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim
|}

== Cloning the Repositry (for Core Developers) ==

If you are a core developer, use the developer url above. If you aren't a core developer, use the anon url above. The initial clone will take a few minutes, as it is pulling the entire change history. Don't be concerned about space, all the change history stored in git takes up less space than a single checked out copy of opensim. Welcome to the wonderful world of content addressable storage.

Unlike with svn, you can define multiple sources to pull from. So if you initially start with an anon tree (which is read only), you can still later define the core tree (or some other remote target on github) and push to that.

=== Linux ===
Run the following on the command line:

git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim

This will create an opensim-test directory locally

=== Windows ===

Right click on the Desktop (or wherever) and 'Git Clone...'

When prompted for a url provide ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim. You username and password will be the ones used for opensimulator.org.

== Cloning the Repositry (for Non Core Developers) ==

git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

This is the equivalent of anonymous svn access.

= Conceptual Changes from Subversion =

Distributed source code control is a substantially different mental model than centralized source code control. If it freaks you out a bit, don't worry, everyone has that same reaction initially. This [http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ blog post] is the best explanation that I've seen of the concepts involved.

For heavy users of subversion you should read the [http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html git / svn cheat sheet]. This provides a very solid basis for making your changes. That being said there are some conceptual changes to note.

* Terminology
** master is the name of the primary upstream branch (in subversion terms, this is trunk)
** origin is the name and location of the tree you cloned from
* All repositories are full peers to all other repositories. Your cloned git repo is all the history of the entire project, available locally. It means you can sync between any 2 clones of the repository, not just between your clone and the master repo. This lets people work together on changes not in
* Version numbers are SHA1 hashes, not sequential integers. This means referring to specific revisions is a bit more interesting. For most of the git commands, you only need to give it the first 6-8 digits of the hash for them to work.
* Committing
** commits are local. This means they are fast (no network involved) and they are committed against the last state of the tree. Any conflict resolution will be handled after commits, during your next pull. This is slightly different than pull-resolve-then-commit model of subversion.
** by default only files you explicitly '''git add''' are put into the commit. To get '''svn ci''' equivalency use '''git commit -a''' to commit all outstanding files (I think tortoise handles this for you)
** after making a commit you must then '''push''' it to a remote repository (probably origin). By default you push only branches you have previously pushed, typically master.

The biggest real change is the Subversion dictates a very specific workflow. Git does not. Git allows for many different workflows, and lets each developer use the one that is best suited to his/her self.

= Using Git like Subversion/trunk development =

This is a set of quick instructions to use git like we do subversion development today. It is targetted for core developers (so assumes you are using the ssh access), though most of it will work for non developers by just changing a url.

This is done by giving the unix commands. These options should all be available in the context menu on tortoise git as well.

== Getting the source code ==

'''git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn co'''

'''Note:''' all other operations assume that you are in the git directory.

== Updating your checkout ==

'''git pull'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn update'''

== Inspecting what has changed in your working tree ==

'''git status'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn status'''

== Committing a change ==

either:

'''git add file1 file2 ...'''

'''git commit'''

or

'''git commit -a'''

by default git does not add all files during a commit.

== Pushing the committed change ==

The first time you do this you'll need to specify which branch to push.

'''git push origin master'''

After the first time a simple '''git push''' will be enough, as it defaults to origin, and now git knows that master should by synced to origin.

'''Important:''' commits in git are local. They are not included in the main tree '''until you push''' them. This means you can create commits when you are not on the network and sync afterwards.

== Setting the checkout dir to a specific revision ==

'''git reset --hard #HASHVALUE'''

This will effectively rewind the tree to the specific revision, and modify the checkout dir accordingly. This is equiv to '''svn up -R#version'''.

git reset can also be useful if you screwed up commits and want to get rid of them

== Resetting the tree to master (i.e. trunk) ==

'''git pull'''

per previous

== Creating a Patch ==

'''git format-patch #HASHVALUE'''

This will create a patch suitable for attaching or emailing from a single commit. You can also specify a range of commits.

This is closest to '''svn diff > patchfile.txt''' for uncommitted changes in subversion.

== Applying a Git Patch ==

If someone has formatted a git patch you can apply it directly (including all file adds, file mode changes, and their change log entry) with:

'''git apply patchfile.patch'''

== Reverting a Change ==

'''git revert #HASHVALUE'''

This directly reverts the change, with a commit message stating that fact. There is no svn direct equiv, though this is often accomplished through: svn diff -R revisions > revert.patch && patch -p0 < revert.patch && svn ci -m "reverting revisions"

== Resetting part of the tree to master ==

'''git checkout -- file1 file2 ...'''

Checkout is an operation that populates the working directory from the git repository. Doing a git checkout (master is the implied branch) -- file1 file2 repulls those files from the git repo, clobbering them in your local directory. This is like '''svn revert'''.

== Diffing Changes ==

Against your most recently committed changes

'''git diff'''

From your most recent changes to a past change

'''git diff #HASHVALUE'''

Between any 2 changes

'''git diff #HASHVALUE1 #HASHVALUE1'''

== Branches ==

=== Creating a Branch ===

To create a new branch based on the current one, do:

'''git branch <branchname>'''

=== Changing Branches ===

To change between branches do:

'''git checkout <branchname>'''

=== Tracking a Branch ===

If you want to work on a specific branch, you can track it, by creating a local version of it on which you can pull and push. If you have already pulled (or fetched) from origin, you should have all remote branches names:

'''git branch -a'''

Will show all branches, local and remote. Choose a remote branch to track then do:

'''git branch --track <localbranchname> origin/remote/<remotebranchname>'''

A new local branch will be created created, which will push and pull to the specific remote branch.

Using Git

2009-09-17T17:45:35Z

DaveCoyle: removing gratuitous capitalization

This is an introduction to using git for OpenSim core developers.

= Installing Git =

== Linux ==

=== CLI ===
:Git is provided as a package with all modern Linux distributions. Install the following packages depending on environment:
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-core</pre>
::* Centos: see the instructions at http://www.how-to-linux.com/2009/01/install-git-161-on-centos-52/

=== GUIs ===
:[http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-gui.html git-gui]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ sudo apt-get install git-gui
$ git gui

:[http://cola.tuxfamily.org/ git-cola]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ apt-get install git-cola
$ git-cola

== Resolving GIT Hash # & Revision Numbers ==

[[Show_git_version_numbers_-_Windows|Windows batchfile]]

[[Show_git_version_numbers_-_Windows|Linux bash script]]

== Windows ==

On Windows you need to install 2 packages:
* [http://msysgit.googlecode.com/files/Git-1.6.4-preview20090730.exe msysgit] - the basic git port for windows. Install this first.
* [http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/ Tortoise Git] - the git explorer. Install this second.

When '''installing msysgit''' be sure to choose
'''Unix style line endings'''. This will make it so that all the line endings are managed correctly, which will prevent merge issues in the future.

[[Image:msysgit1.png]] [[Image:msysgit2.png]] [[Image:msysgit3.png]] [[Image:msysgit4.png]] [[Image:msysgit5.png]]

= Configuring Git =

Git has both a global config and a local config for each repo. As one might expect, local trumps global. The first important thing to do is set your name and email address, as that will be used in your commits.

On Linux this is done via:

git config user.email YOUR@EMAIL.ADDR
git config user.name "Your Name"

On Windows this done with the config menu.

[[Image:config1.png]] [[Image:Config2.png]]

= Git Repositories for OpenSim =

The urls for the repositories are as follows:

{| border="1"
! Repository !! Developer URL !! Anon URL
|-
|| opensim (main repository) || ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim
|}

== Cloning the Repositry (for Core Developers) ==

If you are a core developer, use the developer url above. If you aren't a core developer, use the anon url above. The initial clone will take a few minutes, as it is pulling the entire change history. Don't be concerned about space, all the change history stored in git takes up less space than a single checked out copy of opensim. Welcome to the wonderful world of content addressable storage.

Unlike with svn, you can define multiple sources to pull from. So if you initially start with an anon tree (which is read only), you can still later define the core tree (or some other remote target on github) and push to that.

=== Linux ===
Run the following on the command line:

git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim

This will create an opensim-test directory locally

=== Windows ===

Right click on the Desktop (or wherever) and 'Git Clone...'

When prompted for a url provide ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim. You username and password will be the ones used for opensimulator.org.

== Cloning the Repositry (for Non Core Developers) ==

git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

This is the equivalent of anonymous svn access.

= Conceptual Changes from Subversion =

Distributed source code control is a substantially different mental model than centralized source code control. If it freaks you out a bit, don't worry, everyone has that same reaction initially. This [http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ blog post] is the best explanation that I've seen of the concepts involved.

For heavy users of subversion you should read the [http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html git / svn cheat sheet]. This provides a very solid basis for making your changes. That being said there are some conceptual changes to note.

* Terminology
** master is the name of the primary upstream branch (in subversion terms, this is trunk)
** origin is the name and location of the tree you cloned from
* All repositories are full peers to all other repositories. Your cloned git repo is all the history of the entire project, available locally. It means you can sync between any 2 clones of the repository, not just between your clone and the master repo. This lets people work together on changes not in
* Version numbers are SHA1 hashes, not sequential integers. This means referring to specific revisions is a bit more interesting. For most of the git commands, you only need to give it the first 6-8 digits of the hash for them to work.
* Committing
** commits are local. This means they are fast (no network involved) and they are committed against the last state of the tree. Any conflict resolution will be handled after commits, during your next pull. This is slightly different than pull-resolve-then-commit model of subversion.
** by default only files you explicitly '''git add''' are put into the commit. To get '''svn ci''' equivalency use '''git commit -a''' to commit all outstanding files (I think tortoise handles this for you)
** after making a commit you must then '''push''' it to a remote repository (probably origin). By default you push only branches you have previously pushed, typically master.

The biggest real change is the Subversion dictates a very specific workflow. Git does not. Git allows for many different workflows, and lets each developer use the one that is best suited to his/her self.

= Using Git like Subversion/trunk development =

This is a set of quick instructions to use git like we do subversion development today. It is targetted for core developers (so assumes you are using the ssh access), though most of it will work for non developers by just changing a url.

This is done by giving the unix commands. These options should all be available in the context menu on tortoise git as well.

== Getting the source code ==

'''git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn co'''

'''Note:''' all other operations assume that you are in the git directory.

== Updating your checkout ==

'''git pull'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn update'''

== Inspecting what has changed in your working tree ==

'''git status'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn status'''

== Committing a change ==

either:

'''git add file1 file2 ...'''

'''git commit'''

or

'''git commit -a'''

by default git does not add all files during a commit.

== Pushing the committed change ==

The first time you do this you'll need to specify which branch to push.

'''git push origin master'''

After the first time a simple '''git push''' will be enough, as it defaults to origin, and now git knows that master should by synced to origin.

'''Important:''' commits in git are local. They are not included in the main tree '''until you push''' them. This means you can create commits when you are not on the network and sync afterwards.

== Setting the checkout dir to a specific revision ==

'''git reset --hard #HASHVALUE'''

This will effectively rewind the tree to the specific revision, and modify the checkout dir accordingly. This is equiv to '''svn up -R#version'''.

git reset can also be useful if you screwed up commits and want to get rid of them

== Resetting the tree to master (i.e. trunk) ==

'''git pull'''

per previous

== Creating a Patch ==

'''git format-patch #HASHVALUE'''

This will create a patch suitable for attaching or emailing from a single commit. You can also specify a range of commits.

This is closest to '''svn diff > patchfile.txt''' for uncommitted changes in subversion.

== Applying a Git Patch ==

If someone has formatted a git patch you can apply it directly (including all file adds, file mode changes, and their change log entry) with:

'''git apply patchfile.patch'''

== Reverting a Change ==

'''git revert #HASHVALUE'''

This directly reverts the change, with a commit message stating that fact. There is no svn direct equiv, though this is often accomplished through: svn diff -R revisions > revert.patch && patch -p0 < revert.patch && svn ci -m "reverting revisions"

== Resetting part of the tree to master ==

'''git checkout -- file1 file2 ...'''

Checkout is an operation that populates the working directory from the git repository. Doing a git checkout (master is the implied branch) -- file1 file2 repulls those files from the git repo, clobbering them in your local directory. This is like '''svn revert'''.

== Diffing Changes ==

Against your most recently committed changes

'''git diff'''

From your most recent changes to a past change

'''git diff #HASHVALUE'''

Between any 2 changes

'''git diff #HASHVALUE1 #HASHVALUE1'''

== Branches ==

=== Creating a Branch ===

To create a new branch based on the current one, do:

'''git branch <branchname>'''

=== Changing Branches ===

To change between branches do:

'''git checkout <branchname>'''

=== Tracking a Branch ===

If you want to work on a specific branch, you can track it, by creating a local version of it on which you can pull and push. If you have already pulled (or fetched) from origin, you should have all remote branches names:

'''git branch -a'''

Will show all branches, local and remote. Choose a remote branch to track then do:

'''git branch --track <localbranchname> origin/remote/<remotebranchname>'''

A new local branch will be created created, which will push and pull to the specific remote branch.

Show git version numbers - Linux

2009-09-17T17:44:56Z

DaveCoyle: GIT VERSION LINUX moved to Show git version numbers - Linux: Removing gratuitous capitalization. THERE'S NO NEED TO SHOUT.

One component required to use this process.

'''1.''' The revtag.sh shell script

'''Usage:'''

Copy the revtag.sh into the git reposity, immediately above the bin folder. NOTE! is you perform a git clean this revtag.sh will be removed from the folder structure therefore you will have to copy it back in, I suggest you have a copy of it handy somewhere.

To run the script use the following command '''bash revtag.sh'''

'''The Shell Script:'''  revtag.sh
<blockquote>
echo `git show-ref --tags | tail -1 | sed -e 's,^$.......$.*/,\1 - r,'` `git log -n 1 --pretty='format:%ci'` > bin/.version 
</blockquote>

GIT VERSION LINUX

2009-09-17T17:44:56Z

DaveCoyle: GIT VERSION LINUX moved to Show git version numbers - Linux: Removing gratuitous capitalization. THERE'S NO NEED TO SHOUT.

#REDIRECT [[Show git version numbers - Linux]]

Show git version numbers - Windows

2009-09-17T17:39:45Z

DaveCoyle: GIT VERSION WINDOWS moved to Show git version numbers - Windows: Removing gratuitous capitalization. THERE'S NO NEED TO SHOUT.

Two components are required to use this process.

'''1.''' The Batch File as presented

'''2.''' The revtag.sh shell script

Special Thanks to SMXY (shaun) @ OSGrid for the pointing me in the right direction with the shell script.

'''Usage:'''

Copy the batch file to your desktop and edit the pathing to match your system.

Copy the revtag.sh into the git reposity as commented in the batch file.  NOTE! is you perform a git clean this revtag.sh will be removed form the folder structure therefore you will have to copy it back in, I suggest you have a copy of it handy somewhere.

'''The Batch File:'''  GIT_Ver.bat 
<blockquote>
 echo off :: :: FILENAME: GIT_Ver.bat :: AUTHOR: WhiteStar Magic @ OSGrid :: DATE: September.13.2009 :: REVISION: 0.1 (initial release) :: :: DESCRIPTION: :: - GENERATES Git# & Revision Stamp for Opensim. :: - creates the .version file in the /bin directory :: - EXAMPLE: f42d085 - r10727 2009-09-16 15:06:08 -0700 :: :: INSTALLATION: :: - place this on your desktop for easy access :: - ensure that you have the CORRECT LOCATION defined in the OS_GIT_REPO variable below. :: !!! Example Structure as I use it. :: C:\OpenSim_GIT <--- Top Directory where the SH file is created :: C:\OpenSim_GIT\bin <--- where the bin directory is located :: !!! This must run from the ONE directory above where \bin is located !!! :: :: - CREATE A TEXT FILE called revtag.sh in your OS_GIT_REPO :: -- Place this following line EXACTLY into it. :: echo `git show-ref --tags | tail -1 | sed -e 's,^$.......$.*/,\1 - r,'` `git log -n 1 --pretty='format:%ci'` > bin/.version :: :: DEPENDENCIES: :: - Installation of GIT TOOLS Windows Installation as per http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Using_Git :: !! I installed these two packages as recomended and used the default installations for them :: - http://msysgit.googlecode.com/files/Git-1.6.4-preview20090730.exe :: - http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/ :: :: ==== SET YOUR GIT REPO HERE ==== set OS_GIT_REPO=c:\OpenSim_GIT :: ================================ :: Appending Path to access all binaries used by GIT ::  PATH = C:\Program Files\Git\bin;%PATH%;  echo %PATH% :: echo ON cd %OS_GIT_REPO% :: sh.exe revtag.sh
</blockquote>

'''The Shell Script:'''  revtag.sh
<blockquote>
echo `git show-ref --tags | tail -1 | sed -e 's,^$.......$.*/,\1 - r,'` `git log -n 1 --pretty='format:%ci'` > bin/.version 
</blockquote>

--[[User:WhiteStar|WhiteStar]] 16:42, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

GIT VERSION WINDOWS

2009-09-17T17:39:45Z

DaveCoyle: GIT VERSION WINDOWS moved to Show git version numbers - Windows: Removing gratuitous capitalization. THERE'S NO NEED TO SHOUT.

#REDIRECT [[Show git version numbers - Windows]]

Mono 2 4 on Ubuntu

2009-08-28T21:53:43Z

DaveCoyle: aptitude seems to be a little better about handling dependencies (vs. apt-get)

== Install Mono 2.4 packages on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ==

Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ships with Mono 2.0.1 packages. Here are quick instructions for installing the Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid if you'd rather do that than compile Mono yourself:

* add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list :

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main

* download the file at http://gist.github.com/162751 (easiest way is to click the 'raw' link and save) and save as, or add to if it already exists:

/etc/apt/preferences

* install the Debian package signing keys (you'll get a warning the first time running 'apt-get update'; that's what we're fixing with this step):

apt-get update
apt-get install debian-archive-keyring
apt-key add /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg
apt-get update

* install Mono 2.4 packages:

aptitude install -t unstable libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil \
libmono-oracle2.0-cil mono-gmcs

This assumes you don't already have Mono installed. I didn't check that the package pinning done above in /etc/apt/preferences will work if Mono 2.0.1 packages are already installed. So it may be easiest to remove Mono 2.0.1 first, then do the above.

Submitting code to OpenSim

2009-08-27T16:33:22Z

DaveCoyle: add obsolete tag, since this still references SVN and someone will need to update w/ git info

__NOTOC__
{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 

{{obsolete}}

* There are several guidelines to the patch review process. '''You will need to agree to our [[Contributions_Policy]]''' and be willing to take feedback on the patch. Not all patches will make it into OpenSimulator for a variety of potential reasons. OpenSimulator is not trying to be 'everything for everyone' so, often, it's requested that the functionality be implemented in a module that gets it's own project on forge.

* Please review the [[Coding standards]] and stick to them in your patch. The only exception should be if the surrounding code does not conform to these guidelines (although in that case, a patch to make it conform would be much appreciated). Patches which do not follow the guidelines may be rejected.

Code is submitted to OpenSim via patches attached to entries in our [http://opensimulator.org/mantis/my_view_page.php Mantis bug tracker]. One way to generate these is by using the Subversion command line

svn diff > my.patch

from the root OpenSimulator folder. This will package up all your changes into a nice easily appliable file. If you are using [http://tortoisesvn.tigris.org/ TortoiseSVN] on Windows, you can right-click in the opensim directory and select "Create patch" to create a diff.

* Please run the unit tests (via nant test on the command line) before submitting your patch. Patches that add new tests (either to test accompanying patch code or to test existing code) are very welcome.

* '''Please''' put only one logical change in a patch at a time. Patches that contain more than one logical change tend to be larger, more complex and hence take more time to be applied. At worse, developers will tend not to look at them because it's hard to disentangle all the possible effects.

* In your Mantis, the title line should ideally start with [PATCH]. When you've opened it, change the state to patch included. Once you've put in on a Mantis, you may want to hop on the IRC channels and mention it someone there (though at the moment we're pretty good at getting round to these, since e-mails about newly opened mantis entries are sent to developers automatically).

* Once you've submitted your patch please move the Mantis entry into the '''Patch Included''' state to let us know there's a patch waiting to be reviewed.

* General turnaround time for patch review is 48 hours. though, it could be up to two weeks depending on the situation. Generally, if nobody comments on your patch within 3-5 days, pop into #opensim on IRC and make sure that you remind them of the PATCH.

* If you're looking for an initial piece of code to do, the bugs in Mantis are a very good starting point. You may want to see if there's anybody on IRC to discuss the difficulty of a particular bug (they do vary, sometimes in unexpected ways).

Public Hypergrid Nodes

2009-08-19T13:46:25Z

DaveCoyle: added TOC; added link to gridhop

{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 

__TOC__

== Hypergrid-enabled sims ==

The following is a list of hypergrid-ready nodes that you can use for testing your installation and for linking your world. Please add your public node here if you wish to help build a web of opensims!

For the time being, and until the security concerns are addressed, we advise you to be careful about who you link to.

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
![[Hypergrid|link-region server and port]]
!Organization
!Description
!Grid Location
|-
|'''osl2.nac.uci.edu:9006'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The "UCI Welcome" region connected to OSGrid. It is run by Diva (Crista Lopes) on a machine owned by the University of California, Irvine. You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''osl3.nac.uci.edu:9000'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The "UC Irvine" region connected to OSGrid, neighboring Wright Plaza. You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''ucigrid02.nacs.uci.edu:9000'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid
|UCIGrid is centered at 8,888, 8,888

|-
|'''ucigrid04.nacs.uci.edu:9003'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid, region "Gateway 3000". Link your lower-1,000's grid to this node in order to bridge to grids in the 10,000's.
|This node is positioned at 3,000, 3,000

|-
|'''ucigrid04.nacs.uci.edu:9007'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid, region "Gateway 7000". Link your 10,000's grid to this node in order to bridge to grids in the lower-1,000's.
|This node is positioned at 7,000, 7,000.

|-
|'''www.meanduland.com:9124'''
|Grid Meanduland
|[http://www.menduland.com], Meanduland - by Ayana and Frank Northmead. Residential grid and playground for couples. Quite, peaceful and fun. Regular live music concerts and coming soon - rpg's, adventure simulations, private beaches, sail boat racing, dune buggy racing, and much much more. All welcome, no membership or landownership requirements, you just need desire to have fun and be a good neighbor. Regions available at cost during Alpha and Beta development of OpenSim.
|Centered at 8000, 8000

|-
|'''grid.cyberlandia.net:9000'''
|Cyberlandia
|The "Cyberlandia Gw" region. http://www.cyberlandia.net Metaverso italiano 3D, more to 250 region and 1000 users. You can link to it as a way to link to Cyberlandia.
|Cyberlandia is centered at ???

|-
|'''hypergrid.cyberlandia.net:9000'''
|Cyberlandia
|The "Osgrid Gw" region connected to Cyberlandia grid http://www.cyberlandia.net. Search on map "Cyberlandia grid" You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''regions.ralf-haifisch.biz:9000:Sharkland Tropical 1'''
|Ralf Haifisch on osgrid
|The "Sharkland Tropical" region connected to OSGrid. German welcome aerea, Freebie aerea, region rental, pretty tropical regions
|Centered at 10000,10000

|-
|'''joomla-italia.net:9000'''
|Social Network Italia
|The "SNI City" region connected to SNI (Social Network Italia) grid http://www.opensim-italia.net. This grid is connected with Osgrid,Collateral World,Francogrid and Darwin
|Centered at ???

|-
|'''collateral.opensim-italia.net:9000'''
|Part of Social Network Italia
|Collateral World
|Centered at ???

|-
|'''88.191.79.199:9050'''
|Francogrid
|Francogrid node, connected to "City", behind the welcome land of Francogrid "Orion"
|Centered at 1000 1000

|-
|'''94.23.8.158:9300'''
|Le Monde de Darwin
|The Lost World of Darwin http://www.LeMondedeDarwin.com. [[Image:hypergrid.jpg|200px]]
|Centered at 1000 1000

|-
|'''sg.k-grid.com:9000'''
|K-Grid
|The Kool grid for the Kool KidZ . Feel free to visit us. The main Gateway is located at 3700,3700 so take that in account before any HyperJump. Adress updated 02/07/09
|This node is located at 3700,3700

|-
|'''metropolis.hypergrid.org:9000'''
|METROPOLIS-Grid
|The Region "Center-World" connected to the METROPOLIS-Grid http://metropolis.hypergrid.org . German Grid with a lot of free Content and free SIM-hosting. Connected via HG to the most of the Grids listed here
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''ascent.bluewallgroup.com:9910'''
|BlueWall Information Technologies
|This region is in a good proximity @ (6000,6000) for intermediate jumps to OSGrid from grids in the (2000,2000) range, or any region within 4096 units. [[Image:Hypernaut 001.png|150px|none|thumb|Get your Hypernaut here :)]]
|Centered at 6000,6000

|-
|'''http://myopengrid.com:9005/'''
|'''MyOpenGrid'''
|Myopengrid is connected to osl2.nac.uci.edu "Osgrid Gateway" and 88.191.79.199 9050 "Franco Grid"
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''cuonsim1.de:9300'''
|Cuon-Grid
|Cuon-Grid is a little grid and has some Main Sims with linux themes, server are in Germany. To login in to the grid use this http://sim-linuxmain.org:8081/CuonGrid/index.html. There are free sims for testing.
|Centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''metaversesims.net:9000'''
|Metaverse Sims
|6-region standalone hypergrid linked to several other grids.
|Centered at 9000, 9000

|-

|'''grid4us.net:9020'''
|Grid4Us
|German Grid that is linked to OSGrid and Francogrid.
|Centered at 8500,8500

|-
|'''87.230.89.74:9000 '''
|SCHWARZE WELT
| inworld location of www.schwarze-welle.de , the maybe biggest dark music streaming readio
| 100000 10000

|-
|'''peak.sciencesim.com:9001'''
|ScienceSim
|[http://www.sciencesim.com/ ScienceSim] is a virtual world created for the high performance computing community for scientific visualizations, a number of interesting real world terrains (Mt St Helens and Yellowstone Park) and some astronomical simulations. And some useful, BSD-licensed content.
| Centered at 10000,10000

|-
|'''alpha.bubblecloud.org:9000'''
|Bubble Cloud
|The alpha 00 is the entrance area to bubble cloud grid. Bubble cloud is test grid where anyone can experiment. If you build something please do it in medieval fantasy setting for others to enjoy.
|Centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''opensim.mydyn.de:9090'''
|OpenSIM.de Sim1
|[http://www.opensim.de OpenSim.de], 4 Server (Linux/Windows), hypergrided standalones, 16 Regions, German Users (Deutsche Benutzer), Live-Support, IRC-Gateway, Wiki, FAQ, Howto´s, Downloads. Connected to most of the Grids and some hypergrided standalones.
|Centered at 4400,4400

|-
|'''grid.mydyn.de:9190'''
|OpenSIM.de Sim2
|[http://www.opensim.de OpenSim.de], Many Freebies and a Sandbox, testing Area (Trunk Versions)
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''64.150.180.188:9031'''
|Virtual World Trade Center
|[http://PleasurePlanet.net], The VWTC. A repository for freebie items to share with the OS community. Weekly oar files will be made freely available on 4shared.com.
|VWTC is at 3003, 3003

|-
|'''jamland.de:9300'''
|Grid Jamland
|[http://Jamland.de], German Grid .. 9 regions with Sandbox (Jamland5) Fort (Jamland11)
|Centered at 8000, 8000

|-
|'''condensationland.com:9000'''
|Zonja Capalini
| Condensation Land Grid, 5 regions and links to several other HG-enabled sims.
|Centered at 7789, 7789

|-
|'''condensationland.com:20000'''
|Zonja Capalini
| The Condensation Gateway region in OSGrid, statically hyperlinked to the Condensation Land Grid.
|Region at 3789,3789

|-
|'''66.240.232.94:9010'''
|Snoopy Pfeffer
| OSGrid, Samsara, freebie shopping region
|Centered at 10006, 9999

|-
|'''66.240.232.94:9011'''
|Snoopy Pfeffer
| OSGrid, Snoopies, dance club and event region
|Centered at 10005, 9999

|}

'''PLEASE NOTE The Discussion @ the Top for additional information'''

== External directories of Hypergrid-enabled sims ==

* [http://www.gridhop.net GridHop]

[[Category:Hypergrid]]

Public Hypergrid Nodes

2009-08-19T13:45:56Z

DaveCoyle: added TOC; added link to gridhop

{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 

__TOC__

== Hypergrid-enabled sims ==

The following is a list of hypergrid-ready nodes that you can use for testing your installation and for linking your world. Please add your public node here if you wish to help build a web of opensims!

For the time being, and until the security concerns are addressed, we advise you to be careful about who you link to.

{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
![[Hypergrid|link-region server and port]]
!Organization
!Description
!Grid Location
|-
|'''osl2.nac.uci.edu:9006'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The "UCI Welcome" region connected to OSGrid. It is run by Diva (Crista Lopes) on a machine owned by the University of California, Irvine. You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''osl3.nac.uci.edu:9000'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The "UC Irvine" region connected to OSGrid, neighboring Wright Plaza. You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''ucigrid02.nacs.uci.edu:9000'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid
|UCIGrid is centered at 8,888, 8,888

|-
|'''ucigrid04.nacs.uci.edu:9003'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid, region "Gateway 3000". Link your lower-1,000's grid to this node in order to bridge to grids in the 10,000's.
|This node is positioned at 3,000, 3,000

|-
|'''ucigrid04.nacs.uci.edu:9007'''
|University of California, Irvine
|The UCI Grid, region "Gateway 7000". Link your 10,000's grid to this node in order to bridge to grids in the lower-1,000's.
|This node is positioned at 7,000, 7,000.

|-
|'''www.meanduland.com:9124'''
|Grid Meanduland
|[http://www.menduland.com], Meanduland - by Ayana and Frank Northmead. Residential grid and playground for couples. Quite, peaceful and fun. Regular live music concerts and coming soon - rpg's, adventure simulations, private beaches, sail boat racing, dune buggy racing, and much much more. All welcome, no membership or landownership requirements, you just need desire to have fun and be a good neighbor. Regions available at cost during Alpha and Beta development of OpenSim.
|Centered at 8000, 8000

|-
|'''grid.cyberlandia.net:9000'''
|Cyberlandia
|The "Cyberlandia Gw" region. http://www.cyberlandia.net Metaverso italiano 3D, more to 250 region and 1000 users. You can link to it as a way to link to Cyberlandia.
|Cyberlandia is centered at ???

|-
|'''hypergrid.cyberlandia.net:9000'''
|Cyberlandia
|The "Osgrid Gw" region connected to Cyberlandia grid http://www.cyberlandia.net. Search on map "Cyberlandia grid" You can link to it as a way to link to OSGrid.
|OSGrid is centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''regions.ralf-haifisch.biz:9000:Sharkland Tropical 1'''
|Ralf Haifisch on osgrid
|The "Sharkland Tropical" region connected to OSGrid. German welcome aerea, Freebie aerea, region rental, pretty tropical regions
|Centered at 10000,10000

|-
|'''joomla-italia.net:9000'''
|Social Network Italia
|The "SNI City" region connected to SNI (Social Network Italia) grid http://www.opensim-italia.net. This grid is connected with Osgrid,Collateral World,Francogrid and Darwin
|Centered at ???

|-
|'''collateral.opensim-italia.net:9000'''
|Part of Social Network Italia
|Collateral World
|Centered at ???

|-
|'''88.191.79.199:9050'''
|Francogrid
|Francogrid node, connected to "City", behind the welcome land of Francogrid "Orion"
|Centered at 1000 1000

|-
|'''94.23.8.158:9300'''
|Le Monde de Darwin
|The Lost World of Darwin http://www.LeMondedeDarwin.com. [[Image:hypergrid.jpg|200px]]
|Centered at 1000 1000

|-
|'''sg.k-grid.com:9000'''
|K-Grid
|The Kool grid for the Kool KidZ . Feel free to visit us. The main Gateway is located at 3700,3700 so take that in account before any HyperJump. Adress updated 02/07/09
|This node is located at 3700,3700

|-
|'''metropolis.hypergrid.org:9000'''
|METROPOLIS-Grid
|The Region "Center-World" connected to the METROPOLIS-Grid http://metropolis.hypergrid.org . German Grid with a lot of free Content and free SIM-hosting. Connected via HG to the most of the Grids listed here
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''ascent.bluewallgroup.com:9910'''
|BlueWall Information Technologies
|This region is in a good proximity @ (6000,6000) for intermediate jumps to OSGrid from grids in the (2000,2000) range, or any region within 4096 units. [[Image:Hypernaut 001.png|150px|none|thumb|Get your Hypernaut here :)]]
|Centered at 6000,6000

|-
|'''http://myopengrid.com:9005/'''
|'''MyOpenGrid'''
|Myopengrid is connected to osl2.nac.uci.edu "Osgrid Gateway" and 88.191.79.199 9050 "Franco Grid"
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''cuonsim1.de:9300'''
|Cuon-Grid
|Cuon-Grid is a little grid and has some Main Sims with linux themes, server are in Germany. To login in to the grid use this http://sim-linuxmain.org:8081/CuonGrid/index.html. There are free sims for testing.
|Centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''metaversesims.net:9000'''
|Metaverse Sims
|6-region standalone hypergrid linked to several other grids.
|Centered at 9000, 9000

|-

|'''grid4us.net:9020'''
|Grid4Us
|German Grid that is linked to OSGrid and Francogrid.
|Centered at 8500,8500

|-
|'''87.230.89.74:9000 '''
|SCHWARZE WELT
| inworld location of www.schwarze-welle.de , the maybe biggest dark music streaming readio
| 100000 10000

|-
|'''peak.sciencesim.com:9001'''
|ScienceSim
|[http://www.sciencesim.com/ ScienceSim] is a virtual world created for the high performance computing community for scientific visualizations, a number of interesting real world terrains (Mt St Helens and Yellowstone Park) and some astronomical simulations. And some useful, BSD-licensed content.
| Centered at 10000,10000

|-
|'''alpha.bubblecloud.org:9000'''
|Bubble Cloud
|The alpha 00 is the entrance area to bubble cloud grid. Bubble cloud is test grid where anyone can experiment. If you build something please do it in medieval fantasy setting for others to enjoy.
|Centered at 10,000, 10,000

|-
|'''opensim.mydyn.de:9090'''
|OpenSIM.de Sim1
|[http://www.opensim.de OpenSim.de], 4 Server (Linux/Windows), hypergrided standalones, 16 Regions, German Users (Deutsche Benutzer), Live-Support, IRC-Gateway, Wiki, FAQ, Howto´s, Downloads. Connected to most of the Grids and some hypergrided standalones.
|Centered at 4400,4400

|-
|'''grid.mydyn.de:9190'''
|OpenSIM.de Sim2
|[http://www.opensim.de OpenSim.de], Many Freebies and a Sandbox, testing Area (Trunk Versions)
|Centered at 7000,7000

|-
|'''64.150.180.188:9031'''
|Virtual World Trade Center
|[http://PleasurePlanet.net], The VWTC. A repository for freebie items to share with the OS community. Weekly oar files will be made freely available on 4shared.com.
|VWTC is at 3003, 3003

|-
|'''jamland.de:9300'''
|Grid Jamland
|[http://Jamland.de], German Grid .. 9 regions with Sandbox (Jamland5) Fort (Jamland11)
|Centered at 8000, 8000

|-
|'''condensationland.com:9000'''
|Zonja Capalini
| Condensation Land Grid, 5 regions and links to several other HG-enabled sims.
|Centered at 7789, 7789

|-
|'''condensationland.com:20000'''
|Zonja Capalini
| The Condensation Gateway region in OSGrid, statically hyperlinked to the Condensation Land Grid.
|Region at 3789,3789

|-
|'''66.240.232.94:9010'''
|Snoopy Pfeffer
| OSGrid, Samsara, freebie shopping region
|Centered at 10006, 9999

|-
|'''66.240.232.94:9011'''
|Snoopy Pfeffer
| OSGrid, Snoopies, dance club and event region
|Centered at 10005, 9999

|}

'''PLEASE NOTE The Discussion @ the Top for additional information'''

== External directories of Hypergrid-enabled grids ==

* [http://www.gridhop.net GridHop]

[[Category:Hypergrid]]

Main Page

2009-08-19T13:39:55Z

DaveCoyle: Reverting gridhop addition. This should go on one of the HG-related pages. There's not enough room at the top of the front page for links to everything.

__NOTOC__
{{Template:MainPageQuicklinks}}

{{Languages}}

{{Layout_box2|1=
<center>'''FYI:''' We've migrated the main source repository to git, most of the English documentation is updated, but other languages may be behind. See [[Using_Git]] for more information.</center>}}

=== What is OpenSimulator? ===
{{Template:FrontPageSidebar}}

OpenSimulator is a 3D Application Server. It can be used to create a virtual environment (or world) which can be accessed through a variety of clients, on multiple protocols. OpenSimulator allows you to develop your environment using the technologies you feel work best - we've designed the software to be easily extendable through [[Getting Started with Region Modules|loadable modules]] to build completely custom configurations. OpenSimulator is released under a [[BSD License]], making it both open source, and commercially friendly to embed in products.

Out of the box, OpenSimulator can be used to simulate a virtual environment similar to Second Life™ (including client compatibility). Other environments, protocols and features are supported via add on modules. For a list of available modules check out our [http://forge.opensimulator.org/gf/ forge site].

Although OpenSimulator is still considered '''alpha software''', many people are [http://technorati.com/search/opensim?authority=a4&language=en doing exciting things with it].

=== Features ===
Even though OpenSimulator is relatively young software it already has many useful features
* Supports creating multiple 'worlds' in a single application instance.
* Supports multiple clients and protocols - access the same world at the same time via multiple protocols.
* Extensive ability to customize your avatar, both with custom clothing, skins, and attached objects.
* Realtime Physics Simulation, with multiple engine options including ODE, PhysX, Bullet and more.
* The ability to create content real time in the environment using in world building tools. What you see is what you get.
* In world application development using a number of different languages, including LSL/OSSL, C#, JScript and VB.NET

=== Using OpenSimulator ===
The fastest way to get started using OpenSimulator is to create an account on [http://osgrid.org OSGrid], then download the [http://opensim-viewer.sourceforge.net/ Hippo Viewer] or [http://secondlife.com/support/downloads.php Linden Lab's Second Life viewer] (amongst others) to connect to OSGrid. This process should take no longer than 10 minutes, and will give you a flavor for what OpenSimulator is like.

You can also easily connect to any one of the many [[Grid_List|public grids]] on the internet.

Or you could run a simple standalone OpenSim on your Windows desktop to create and preview content. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8fwqdaCTrc Here is a tutorial showing how to get opensimulator running in stand-alone mode.].

=== Running your own OpenSimulator ===
If you are interested in running your own OpenSimulator server, to host your own 3D environments you'll want to check out the following links:
* [[Download|Getting OpenSimulator]]
* [[Build_Instructions|Building OpenSimulator]]
* [[Configuration|Configuring OpenSimulator]]
* [[Running|Running OpenSimulator]]
* [[FAQ|Frequently Asked Questions in Running OpenSimulator]]
* [[Technical Reference | Technical Reference Pages]]

=== Participating in the OpenSimulator Community ===
OpenSimulator is an [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_source open source] project, and is powered by the community members that devote time and energy to the effort. There are many ways to participate and contribute to the community:
* Participate via [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Relay_Chat IRC] - [irc://irc.freenode.net/opensim #opensim] (for users) and [irc://irc.freenode.net/opensim-dev #opensim-dev]
* Participate via the mailing lists - [https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users opensim-users] (for users) and [https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev opensim-dev] (for developers).
* [[WikiStructure|Contribute to this wiki]], making the OpenSimulator documentation even better.
* Report [[bugs]], submit [[Submitting_code_to_OpenSim|patches]] or submit content contributions via our [http://opensimulator.org/mantis/ mantis bug tracker]
* Create an OpenSimulator related project hosted on the [http://forge.opensimulator.org Forge] or [http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Related_Software elsewhere] on the web. In the forge there are over a dozen registered projects, and it's a great way to further extend the OpenSimulator community.
* Participate to open content creation for OpenSimulator. More details at [[Artist Home]].
* Blog about OpenSimulator, and let us know about that blog on [irc://irc.freenode.net/opensim #opensim] so it can be added to [http://planet.opensim.us Planet OpenSim]
* Participate in one of the weekly [[Office Hours]] for OpenSimulator. We currently have weekly office hours for development, wiki work, and testing.
* Secure project infrastructure by [[Donations|donating]] to the [[Donations|OpenSim Project Infrastructure Fund]].

{{Layout_box2|1=
===Pages by Category:===

[[:Category:Getting_Started | Getting Started]] , [[:Category:Support | Support]] , [[:Category:Tech Reference|Technical Reference Pages]] , [[:Category:Help|Help]] , [[:Category:Configuration|Configuration Pages]] , [[:Category:Users|User's Pages]] , [[:Category:Development | Development Pages]] , [[:Category:Scripts|Scripts]] , [[:Special:Recentchanges| Recent Wiki Changes]] 
}}

[[Category:Main]]
[[Category:Getting Started]]
[[Category:Development]]
[[Category:Support]]
[[Category:Tech Reference]]
[[Category:Help]]
[[Category:Configuration]]
<cleanpage title=hide cats=hide />

Mono 2 4 on Ubuntu

2009-08-18T16:13:05Z

DaveCoyle: should be more reliable now. package pinning is stupid.

== Install Mono 2.4 packages on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ==

Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ships with Mono 2.0.1 packages. Here are quick instructions for installing the Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid if you'd rather do that than compile Mono yourself:

* add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list :

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main

* download the file at http://gist.github.com/162751 (easiest way is to click the 'raw' link and save) and save as, or add to if it already exists:

/etc/apt/preferences

* install the Debian package signing keys (you'll get a warning the first time running 'apt-get update'; that's what we're fixing with this step):

apt-get update
apt-get install debian-archive-keyring
apt-key add /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg
apt-get update

* install Mono 2.4 packages:

apt-get install -t unstable libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil \
libmono-oracle2.0-cil mono-gmcs

This assumes you don't already have Mono installed. I didn't check that the package pinning done above in /etc/apt/preferences will work if Mono 2.0.1 packages are already installed. So it may be easiest to remove Mono 2.0.1 first, then do the above.

Using Git

2009-08-10T17:31:30Z

DaveCoyle: fix url for non-core users

This is an introduction to using git for OpenSim core developers.

= Installing Git =

== Linux ==

=== CLI ===
:Git is provided as a package with all modern Linux distributions. Install the following packages depending on environment:
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-core</pre>
::* Centos: see the instructions at http://www.how-to-linux.com/2009/01/install-git-161-on-centos-52/

=== GUIs ===
:[http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-gui.html git-gui]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ sudo apt-get install git-gui
$ git gui

:[http://cola.tuxfamily.org/ git-cola]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ apt-get install git-cola
$ git-cola

== Windows ==

On Windows you need to install 2 packages:
* [http://msysgit.googlecode.com/files/Git-1.6.4-preview20090730.exe msysgit] - the basic git port for windows. Install this first.
* [http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/ Tortoise Git] - the git explorer. Install this second.

When '''installing msysgit''' be sure to choose
'''Unix style line endings'''. This will make it so that all the line endings are managed correctly, which will prevent merge issues in the future.

[[Image:msysgit1.png]] [[Image:msysgit2.png]] [[Image:msysgit3.png]] [[Image:msysgit4.png]] [[Image:msysgit5.png]]

= Configuring Git =

Git has both a global config and a local config for each repo. As one might expect, local trumps global. The first important thing to do is set your name and email address, as that will be used in your commits.

On Linux this is done via:

git config user.email YOUR@EMAIL.ADDR
git config user.name "Your Name"

On Windows this done with the config menu.

[[Image:config1.png]] [[Image:Config2.png]]

= Git Repositories for OpenSim =

The urls for the repositories are as follows:

{| border="1"
! Repository !! Developer URL !! Anon URL
|-
|| opensim (main repository) || ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim
|}

== Cloning the Repositry (for Core Developers) ==

If you are a core developer, use the developer url above. If you aren't a core developer, use the anon url above. The initial clone will take a few minutes, as it is pulling the entire change history. Don't be concerned about space, all the change history stored in git takes up less space than a single checked out copy of opensim. Welcome to the wonderful world of content addressable storage.

Unlike with svn, you can define multiple sources to pull from. So if you initially start with an anon tree (which is read only), you can still later define the core tree (or some other remote target on github) and push to that.

=== Linux ===
Run the following on the command line:

git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim

This will create an opensim-test directory locally

=== Windows ===

Right click on the Desktop (or wherever) and 'Git Clone...'

When prompted for a url provide ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim. You username and password will be the ones used for opensimulator.org.

== Cloning the Repositry (for Non Core Developers) ==

git clone git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim

This is the equivalent of anonymous svn access.

= Conceptual Changes from Subversion =

Distributed source code control is a substantially different mental model than centralized source code control. If it freaks you out a bit, don't worry, everyone has that same reaction initially. This [http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ blog post] is the best explanation that I've seen of the concepts involved.

For heavy users of subversion you should read the [http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html git / svn cheat sheet]. This provides a very solid basis for making your changes. That being said there are some conceptual changes to note.

* Terminology
** master is the name of the primary upstream branch (in subversion terms, this is trunk)
** origin is the name and location of the tree you cloned from
* All repositories are full peers to all other repositories. Your cloned git repo is all the history of the entire project, available locally. It means you can sync between any 2 clones of the repository, not just between your clone and the master repo. This lets people work together on changes not in
* Version numbers are SHA1 hashes, not sequential integers. This means referring to specific revisions is a bit more interesting. For most of the git commands, you only need to give it the first 6-8 digits of the hash for them to work.
* Committing
** commits are local. This means they are fast (no network involved) and they are committed against the last state of the tree. Any conflict resolution will be handled after commits, during your next pull. This is slightly different than pull-resolve-then-commit model of subversion.
** by default only files you explicitly '''git add''' are put into the commit. To get '''svn ci''' equivalency use '''git commit -a''' to commit all outstanding files (I think tortoise handles this for you)
** after making a commit you must then '''push''' it to a remote repository (probably origin). By default you push only branches you have previously pushed, typically master.

The biggest real change is the Subversion dictates a very specific workflow. Git does not. Git allows for many different workflows, and lets each developer use the one that is best suited to his/her self.

= Using Git like Subversion/trunk development =

This is a set of quick instructions to use git like we do subversion development today. It is targetted for core developers (so assumes you are using the ssh access), though most of it will work for non developers by just changing a url.

This is done by giving the unix commands. These options should all be available in the context menu on tortoise git as well.

== Getting the source code ==

'''git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn co'''

'''Note:''' all other operations assume that you are in the git directory.

== Updating your checkout ==

'''git pull'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn update'''

== Inspecting what has changed in your working tree ==

'''git status'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn status'''

== Committing a change ==

either:

'''git add file1 file2 ...'''

'''git commit'''

or

'''git commit -a'''

by default git does not add all files during a commit.

== Pushing the committed change ==

The first time you do this you'll need to specify which branch to push.

'''git push origin master'''

After the first time a simple '''git push''' will be enough, as it defaults to origin, and now git knows that master should by synced to origin.

'''Important:''' commits in git are local. They are not included in the main tree '''until you push''' them. This means you can create commits when you are not on the network and sync afterwards.

== Setting the checkout dir to a specific revision ==

'''git reset --hard #HASHVALUE'''

This will effectively rewind the tree to the specific revision, and modify the checkout dir accordingly. This is equiv to '''svn up -R#version'''.

git reset can also be useful if you screwed up commits and want to get rid of them

== Resetting the tree to master (i.e. trunk) ==

'''git pull'''

per previous

== Creating a Patch ==

'''git format-patch #HASHVALUE'''

This will create a patch suitable for attaching or emailing from a single commit. You can also specify a range of commits.

This is closest to '''svn diff > patchfile.txt''' for uncommitted changes in subversion.

== Applying a Git Patch ==

If someone has formatted a git patch you can apply it directly (including all file adds, file mode changes, and their change log entry) with:

'''git apply patchfile.patch'''

== Reverting a Change ==

'''git revert #HASHVALUE'''

This directly reverts the change, with a commit message stating that fact. There is no svn direct equiv, though this is often accomplished through: svn diff -R revisions > revert.patch && patch -p0 < revert.patch && svn ci -m "reverting revisions"

== Resetting part of the tree to master ==

'''git checkout -- file1 file2 ...'''

Checkout is an operation that populates the working directory from the git repository. Doing a git checkout (master is the implied branch) -- file1 file2 repulls those files from the git repo, clobbering them in your local directory. This is like '''svn revert'''.

== Diffing Changes ==

Against your most recently committed changes

'''git diff'''

From your most recent changes to a past change

'''git diff #HASHVALUE'''

Between any 2 changes

'''git diff #HASHVALUE1 #HASHVALUE1'''

== Branches ==

=== Creating a Branch ===

To create a new branch based on the current one, do:

'''git branch <branchname>'''

=== Changing Branches ===

To change between branches do:

'''git checkout <branchname>'''

=== Tracking a Branch ===

If you want to work on a specific branch, you can track it, by creating a local version of it on which you can pull and push. If you have already pulled (or fetched) from origin, you should have all remote branches names:

'''git branch -a'''

Will show all branches, local and remote. Choose a remote branch to track then do:

'''git branch --track <localbranchname> origin/remote/<remotebranchname>'''

A new local branch will be created created, which will push and pull to the specific remote branch.

Mono 2 4 on Ubuntu

2009-08-10T15:50:19Z

DaveCoyle: contrib & non-free not needed

== Install Mono 2.4 packages on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ==

Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ships with Mono 2.0.1 packages. Here are quick instructions for installing the Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid if you'd rather do that than compile Mono yourself:

* add the following to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/07default (or create it if it doesn't already exist):

APT::Default-Release "jaunty";

* add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list :

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main

* download the file at http://gist.github.com/162751 (easiest way is to click the 'raw' link and save) and save as, or add to if it already exists:

/etc/apt/preferences

* install the Debian package signing keys (you'll get a warning the first time running 'apt-get update'; that's what we're fixing with this step):

apt-get update
apt-get install debian-archive-keyring
apt-key add /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg
apt-get update

* install Mono 2.4 packages:

apt-get install -t unstable libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil \
libmono-oracle2.0-cil mono-gmcs

This assumes you don't already have Mono installed. I didn't check that the package pinning done above in /etc/apt/preferences will work if Mono 2.0.1 packages are already installed. So it may be easiest to remove Mono 2.0.1 first, then do the above.

Mono 2 4 on Ubuntu

2009-08-05T21:30:51Z

DaveCoyle: instructions for installing Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04)

== Install Mono 2.4 packages on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ==

Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ships with Mono 2.0.1 packages. Here are quick instructions for installing the Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid if you'd rather do that than compile Mono yourself:

* add the following to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/07default (or create it if it doesn't already exist):

APT::Default-Release "jaunty";

* add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list :

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main contrib non-free

* download the file at http://gist.github.com/162751 (easiest way is to click the 'raw' link and save) and save as, or add to if it already exists:

/etc/apt/preferences

* install the Debian package signing keys (you'll get a warning the first time running 'apt-get update'; that's what we're fixing with this step):

apt-get update
apt-get install debian-archive-keyring
apt-key add /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg
apt-get update

* install Mono 2.4 packages:

apt-get install -t unstable libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil \
libmono-oracle2.0-cil mono-gmcs

This assumes you don't already have Mono installed. I didn't check that the package pinning done above in /etc/apt/preferences will work if Mono 2.0.1 packages are already installed. So it may be easiest to remove Mono 2.0.1 first, then do the above.

Mono 2 4 on Ubuntu

2009-08-05T21:30:21Z

DaveCoyle: instructions for installing Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04)

== Install Mono 2.4 packages on Ubuntu Jaunty (9.10) ==

Ubuntu Jaunty (9.04) ships with Mono 2.0.1 packages. Here are quick instructions for installing the Mono 2.4 packages from Debian sid if you'd rather do that than compile Mono yourself:

* add the following to /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/07default (or create it if it doesn't already exist):

APT::Default-Release "jaunty";

* add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list :

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main contrib non-free

* download the file at http://gist.github.com/162751 (easiest way is to click the 'raw' link and save) and save as, or add to if it already exists:

/etc/apt/preferences

* install the Debian package signing keys (you'll get a warning the first time running 'apt-get update'; that's what we're fixing with this step):

apt-get update
apt-get install debian-archive-keyring
apt-key add /usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg
apt-get update

* install Mono 2.4 packages:

apt-get install -t unstable libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil \
libmono-oracle2.0-cil mono-gmcs

This assumes you don't already have Mono installed. I didn't check that the package pinning done above in /etc/apt/preferences will work if Mono 2.0.1 packages are already installed. So it may be easiest to remove Mono 2.0.1 first, then do the above.

Build Instructions

2009-08-05T21:18:49Z

DaveCoyle: ruby isn't required

{{Template:Quicklinks}}

[[Category:Users]]
This page covers building OpenSim from source code on multiple platforms. Please help us keep this page up to date as the project progresses.

==Download OpenSim ==
Check out the [[Download]] page for instructions on obtaining an OpenSim source release.

==MS Windows==

NOTE: on or about May 31, 2009, MS C# Express 2005 is no longer supported. Last release for that date is r9748.

OpenSim requires either the .Net framework version 2.0, or the latest Mono. It supports the following compilers:
* [http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/express/aa700756.aspx Microsoft Visual C# Express Edition] (note: not Visual C++)
* [http://www.mono-project.com/ mono]

Additional note: any Microsoft C# Express edition should work (2005 or 2008)

Additional note: Microsoft C# Express v9 may install .Net 3.5 with resultant path error.
# To avoid install .Net framework version 2.0

Additional note: It is possible to develop on Windows Vista 64 bits with the following tweaks:
# Select OpenSim project properties from solution and choose platform to be x86. Rebuild solution.
# Select OpenSim.exe properties under solution bin folder and choose windows xp sp 2 compatibility mode + run as administrator.

=== Building ===

* In the top-level directory, run the '<tt>runprebuild.bat</tt>' file. This will create a VS2005 solution file, a nant build file and a '<tt>compile.bat</tt>' file.
* If you prefer VS2008, run the '<tt>runprebuild2008.bat</tt>' instead.

* Open the resulting sln file with visual studio and build it there, or
* Run the '<tt>compile.bat</tt>' file. This will build the executable using MSBuild.
* if you prefer to use nant, run nant in the same top-level directory. This will build the executables.

If you don't care about physics (walking on prims, etc), ignore the rest of this section.

=== Running ===

Recent versions of OpenSim come without an <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> file. Copy the <tt>OpenSim.ini.example</tt> file to <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> before making any changes.

Double-click on the <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> executable file in the <tt>bin</tt> directory. This will start up OpenSim in standalone mode.

The debugger in VS2005 C# may be used to step through the code. For those that use a Cygwin shell, you may find that one or more dll's have permissions that cause problems running. Most find that a "<tt>chmod 777 *</tt>" from the <tt>bin</tt> directory solves this.

Physics can be invoked by adding the appropriate line to the [Startup] section of <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt>. For ODE, that would be:

physics = OpenDynamicsEngine

You can also add a command line option to a shortcut, or run from a command prompt with:

-physics=OpenDynamicsEngine

'''''Windows Vista'''''

Some people have reported that to run on Windows Vista, you must first disable Windows Firewall. Under the new "Start" button of Vista, select "Control panel". Then double-click "Windows Firewall". In the window that pops up, on the left column, select "Turn Windows Firewall on or off". You will have to give permission for this to run, then select the option "Off (not recommended)". Click "OK" and exit from the Windows Firewall window.

If you have McAfee SecurityCenter, see the description below.

Once all the security features are disabled, right click on <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> and select "Run as administrator". This will pop up a window asking permission, select "Allow". Your OpenSim server should run in a DOS-like window and accept connections.

'''''McAfee Security'''''

McAfee Security does not allow applications to listen on ports not explicitly specified. You have two options: 1) disable firewall protection all together, 2) enable <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> to be able to open ports.

''Disable firewall''

Open McAfee SecurityCenter. Select "Internet & Network". In the lower left corner is a small link to "Configure...". Select this. In the right side of the window, select the bar that says "Firewall protection is enabled". Here you can select "Off".

''Enable <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> to open ports''

Open McAfee SecurityCenter. Select "Internet & Network". In the lower left corner is a small link to "Configure...". Select this. In the right side of the window, select the bar that says "Firewall protection is enabled". Select the "Advanced..." button. This will pop up a new window.

In the new window, on the left side, select "Program Permissions." In the middle on the right side of the window, select the "Add Allowed Program" button. Use the browser that pops up to find the OpenSim executable and select it.

Finally, select "OK" and exit the McAfee SecurityCenter window.

==Linux/Mac OS X/FreeBSD==

The easiest plaform to get running on the Linux side is Ubuntu 8.10, 32bit. This is what most of the developers running Linux use. If you are looking for the quick path, start there.

=== Ubuntu 8.04 / 8.10 ===

For Ubuntu users on older distributions (7.10, 8.04, etc.) '''you need''' to upgrade your mono to at least 1.9.1. Mono 2.2 is currently the preferred version to run OpenSim with.

You can use the built in packages for mono. However, for better performance, you may want to [http://xyzzyxyzzy.net/2008/05/08/updated-mono-build-script-for-hardy-heron-and-mono-191/ upgrade mono to 1.9.1] ([http://tempvariable.blogspot.com/2008/04/installing-mono-191-on-ubuntu-804-hardy.html Other simple method])

sudo apt-get install subversion nant mono-gmcs libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil libmono-oracle2.0-cil
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

To upgrade the Mono version to the latest stable build Mono 2.0.1, read this page [[Build Instructions/Ubuntu-Mono-2.0.1 | Ubuntu on Mono 2.0.1]]

=== openSUSE 10.3/11/11.1 ===

Install an openSUSE 11.1, 11 or 10.3 with its default options, add the online repositories
when finished installing do an online update with all the latest packages.

In yast install these packages, for running Opensim in standalone mode.
(there is a slight diffrence between 10.3 and 11/11.1 but following should be same)
subversion
nant
mono-jscript
- check that mono-core is installed

just in case you do not already have it installed

sudo zypper install mono-data-oracle

A tip for OpenSuSE 11.1 users - you can install packages from the command line using the 'zypper' tool. For example, to install 'nant', use this command:

sudo zypper install nant

If you just want to use SQLite then jump to last section
within this post.

* Optional mysql - for Opensim running in Grid mode:
Install these mysql packages via yast
mysql
mysql-client
mysql-administrator
mysql-gui-tools
mysql-query-browser

(note that selecting mysql in the Yast2 Installer will select the other packages automatically)

Before building create the mysql database.
/etc/init.d/mysql start
mysql -u root -p -h localhost
(when asked for password just hit enter)

mysql> create database opensim;
mysql> use opensim;
mysql> create user 'opensim'@'localhost' identified by 'thePassword';
mysql> grant all on *.* to 'opensim'@'localhost';
mysql> quit

*note that the '''grant all''' command may differ if you're adding the opensim database to an existing mysql installation.

On current builds set the connection string inside bin/OpenSim.ini after coppying the OpenSim.ini.example file.
If you are changing to MySQL from SQLite, the connection string for mysql also exists in the bin/Region/*xml files.
* It is '''important''' to remember this if you start out using the built-in SQLite database engine.

Build after installation of above in bash terminal. I save it in /opt

su -
cd /opt
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

Or, if you have a current (0.6+), you can simply execute:

make

After this you should be able to continue on starting the diffrent Servers, look in the mysql-config section,or
just run your OpenSim as a Standalone. By - eagleFX

=== Mac OS X 10.5/10.4 ===
* OpenSim is now working on PowerPC Macs! Thanks to DrScofield and those who helped him. Current nightly builds for PowerPC are not working, not sure about Intel so use the 0.5 Build. OpenSim works on Intel Macs. I'm testing on PowerBook G4. Tested these step on 10.5, but not 10.4 but should work --[[User:Mokele|Mokele]] 22:36, 14 February 2008 (PST) (Works on iMac G5 with OS 10.4.11, including expanding to local grid mode. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-15 10:50 (CET))
* Install XCode Developers Tools from DVD/CD Installation Disk or download from http://developer.apple.com/. You have to create an Apple account to access the downloads if you don't have an Apple account.
* Install X11 for 10.4 from the Optional Install from the DVD/CD Installation Disk. X11 for 10.5 is installed by default.
* Install Mono 1.2.5 from http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/archive/1.2.5/macos-10-universal/5/MonoFramework-1.2.5_5.macos10.novell.universal.dmg (The more recent releases Mono 1.2.6, 1.9.1 and 2.0.1 do not appear to work with these installation instructions. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-14 15:56 (CET)) and in Terminal or X11 edit the .profile file and add the following line:
export PKG_CONFIG_PATH="/Library/Frameworks/Mono.framework/Versions/Current/lib/pkgconfig/:${PKG_CONFIG_PATH}"
* Compile OpenSim
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim/tags/0.5.0-release opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

* Download and Compile libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib and libsecondlife.dll
* libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib:
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/old/libsl1550 opensim-libs
cd opensim-libs/openjpeg-libsl
make -f Makefile.osx
cp libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib ../../bin
* Note: The Makefile that creates the libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so does not compile on PowerPC, but works properly on Intel Macs. Looks like a gcc issue with compile options. (It appears to work on iMac G5 with OS X 10.4.11. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-14 15:55 (CET))

* libsecondlife.dll: (for PowerPC Only, see details on this step [http://xyzzyxyzzy.net/2008/02/12/installing-opensim-on-powerpcor-of-eggs-and-virtual-worlds installing OpenSim on PowerPC…or: of eggs and virtual worlds])
cd .. (back into opensim-libs)
nant
cp bin/libsecondlife.dll ../bin

* Edit the libsecondlife.dll.config (PowerPC Only). Remove the cpu="x86" tag in the last dllmap line.

Here is what worked for me (OS X 10.5.7, Intel):

* make sure you have X11 installed
* grab the Apple Dev Tools from [http://developer.apple.com/]
* install Mono Framework 2.4 from [http://www.go-mono.com/mono-downloads/download.html]
* Get OpenSim source:
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim/tags/0.6.5-post-fixes opensim
* Compile OpenSim:
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant
--[[User:Kusako|Kusako]] 08:06, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

=== FreeBSD 6.2 ===
su
cd /usr/ports/devel/subversion/ && make install clean (you may also need to rebuild apr-svn if this step fails)
cd /usr/ports/lang/mono/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/devel/nant/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/databases/sqlite3/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/x11-toolkits/libgdiplus/ && make install clean
cd /opensim/installation/directory/
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

Note: [http://opensimulator.org/wiki/OpenSim:FAQ#System.DllNotFoundException:_..2Flibopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so|Follow the instructions on the FAQ to fix the]
"System.DllNotFoundException: ./libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so" issue, but use "gmake" instead of "make"

For ODE Physics you must do the following:
cd /usr/ports/graphics/libGL/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/graphics/libGLU/ && make install clean
cd /opensim/installation/directory/
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk opensim-libs
cd opensim-libs/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine2/
sh autogen.sh
./configure --enable-shared --enable-release --disable-demos
make
mv ./ode/src/.libs/libode.so /opensim/installation/directory/opensim/bin/

=== RedHat Enterprise Linux 4 ===
sudo vi /etc/yum.repos.d/mono.repo

[mono]
name=Mono for rhel-4-i386 (stable)
baseurl=http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/download-stable/rhel-4-i386/
enabled=1
gpgcheck=0

sudo yum install mono-complete monodoc-core nant
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

=== RedHat Enterprise Linux 5 ===

The instructions below also work on other RedHat Linux flavors such as CentOS or maybe Fedora.

1. Put the [http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono/RHEL_5/Mono.repo Mono.repo] file in the /etc/yum.repo.d/ directory:
$ sudo su -
$ cd /etc/yum.repos.d/
$ wget http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono/RHEL_5/Mono.repo
Naturally use the most [http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono up-to-date link for your distribution].

2. Install Mono and related tools with yum:
$ yum install mono nant mono-jscript mono-nunit
Make sure to use nunit-console2 to run your tests.

=== Fedora 5 ===
* I needed to build latest mono and nant from sources to build OpenSim successfully, the ones available in yum repository didn't work so I had to uninstall and build and configure the packages.

For detailed instructions go [http://ruakuu.blogspot.com/2008/06/installing-and-configuring-opensim-on.html here]

=== Debian 4 ===

For detailed instructions please see [[Debian 4 Build Instructions]]

=== CentOS 5.2 32bit ===

For detailed instructions please see [[CentOS 5.2 Build Instructions]]

=== 64bit ===
Please note that only 32bit binaries are provided in the bin/ directory of subversion. If you want to use 64bit, you'll need to rebuild these shared objects. See [[Installing and running on x86-64]]

=== Physics (Open Dynamics Engine ODE) ===
As installed from svn, ODE will work on most 32 bit platforms. If you get an ODE-related crash, and/or a libode.so not found type of error, you will need to build libode from source.

Remove <tt>libode.so</tt> from the <tt>./bin</tt> folder. (Note that subsequent svn updates may replace it again; best fix is to copy your built <tt>libode.so</tt> to <tt>bin</tt>). Do NOT remove <tt>ode.net.dll</tt>! Download the latest source from:

svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine

OpenSim requires a couple of patches on top of ODE which are not yet included upstream. When compiling, make sure to use the following configure options:

--with-trimesh=gimpact
--enable-shared

Make sure the configure script confirms these choices, and always compile with single precision (I believe that's the default). Try <code> make -k </code> if you get errors relating to drawstuff, test*, or openGL. <code> make install </code> should put <tt>libode.so</tt> in the proper place (usually <tt>/usr/local/lib</tt>), and it should be seen by opensim (<tt>ode.net.dll</tt>)

'''''Note:''' if OpenSim fails to launch with <tt>Exception: System.DllNotFoundException: ode</tt>, after compiling ODE, just copy <tt>libode.so</tt> from its usual place (probably <tt>/usr/local/lib/</tt>) to ./bin/, as per [http://metafuturing.net/index.php/OpenSim_Notebook_1 this suggestion]''

==== Setting up ODE for 64 Bits systems: ====

HOWTO on setting up and Install OpenSim on SLES10 - SP1 64Bit

1. I installed Mono 2.01, added this installation source in Yast2
This distro supports installing packages via YaST. Add the following installation source to YaST:
* http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/download-stable/SLE_10 [^]
For assistance with using repositories and installing packages with YaST, visit the Yast help page.

"nant" was installed also via this operation.

2. I installed subversion from http://software.opensuse.org/search [^]

SLES/SLED10 ->
subversion-1.5.2-34.2.x86_64.rpm

3. I downloaded and installed the lastest SVN version of opensim as usual (like a 32 bit system):
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Build_Instructions [^]

4. I downloaded and installed the Open Dynamics Engine (ODE) to replace the 32 bit version of ODE with a 64 bit version.

I did that with the following linux commands:
(it is expected that you have all required Linux building tools installed):

# cd
# svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine [^]
# cd OpenDynamicEngine
# chmod a+x ou/bootstrap
# sh autogen.sh

I installed/updated SLES10 with these rpm's for autogen.sh to run properly. http://software.opensuse.org/search [^]

SLES/SLED10 ->
- autoconf-2.61-168.1.x86_64.rpm
- automake-1.10.1-5.3.x86_64.rpm

# CFLAGS="-m64" ./configure --enable-shared
# make

I installed gtk2-devel via yast2, and all its dependancies, because make keept failing.

# cp ./ode/src/.libs/libode.so /opt/opensim/bin/

note:
in this directory it had made several versions of the "libode.so" because of running the previous commands several times
so i had to copy libode.so.1.0.0 to /opt/opensim/bin/libode.so

# vi ../opensim/bin/OpenSim.ini (change av_capsule_standup_tensor_linux to 1700000)

The 'chmod' command is required to fix permissions that are wrong.
The change in OpenSim.ini is required to avoid that avatars have bend legs and/or their feet are in the ground.

==== Running ====
Recent versions of OpenSim come without an <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> file. Copy the <tt>OpenSim.ini.example</tt> file to <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> before making any changes.
<code>
cd bin
mono OpenSim.exe
</code>

Note: if you are running a 32bit Server such as Ubuntu 8.0.4 you need the alternative launcher:

<code>
mono OpenSim.32BitLaunch.exe
</code>

* To invoke ODE, add the option:
-physics=OpenDynamicsEngine
to the <tt>mono OpenSim.exe</tt> line

or add <code> physics = OpenDynamicsEngine </code> to the [Startup] section of <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt>. Same deal for other physics engines, when available.

On mono 1.2.6, some distributions may see
Unhandled Exception: System.NotSupportedException: CodePage 1252 not supported
on startup when using mysql. This can be resolved by installing the package libmono-i18n2.0-cil (see http://bugs.mysql.com/bug.php?id=33938).

=== Additional Items ===

* [[GC_NO_EXPLICIT|GC NO EXPLICIT]] - Enable Large Heap in Mono, this has been known to help performance and stability

== Hardware selection guide ==

An often-asked question is "what kind of hardware do I need to successfully run OpenSim?" Unfortunately, the answer is "it depends". The number of regions hosted on a given machine, number of simultaneous avatars on those regions, number of prims, use of scripts, etc., all affect hardware requirements. So, to help you make a more informed selection, some examples of hardware used are listed in the [[Hardware_Selection_Guide|hardware selection guide]].

[[Category:Users]]
[[Category:Getting Started]]

Category:Support

2009-08-05T02:07:42Z

DaveCoyle: see http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Support for support info. it doesn't belong here.

Talk:Using Git

2009-08-05T02:03:54Z

DaveCoyle: mention Git Extensions

Anyone use [http://sourceforge.net/projects/gitextensions/ Git Extensions] for Windows? Supposedly integrates with Windows Explorer. Haven't used it myself, though, but thought I'd mention it for anyone seeking alternatives. --[[User:DaveCoyle|DaveCoyle]] 02:03, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Using Git

2009-08-04T04:05:53Z

DaveCoyle: mention command to run for Linux GUIs

This is an introduction to using git for OpenSim core developers.

= Installing Git =

== Linux ==

=== CLI ===
:Git is provided as a package with all modern Linux distributions. Install the following packages depending on environment:
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-core</pre>
::* Centos: see the instructions at http://www.how-to-linux.com/2009/01/install-git-161-on-centos-52/

=== GUIs ===
:[http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-gui.html git-gui]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ sudo apt-get install git-gui
$ git gui

:[http://cola.tuxfamily.org/ git-cola]
::* Debian, Ubuntu:
$ apt-get install git-cola
$ git-cola

== Windows ==

On Windows you need to install 2 packages:
* msysgit - the basic git port for windows. Install this first.
* [http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/ Tortoise Git] - the git explorer. Install this second.

When '''installing msysgit''' be sure to choose
'''Unix style line endings'''. This will make it so that all the line endings are managed correctly, which will prevent merge issues in the future.

[[Image:msysgit1.png]] [[Image:msysgit2.png]] [[Image:msysgit3.png]] [[Image:msysgit4.png]] [[Image:msysgit5.png]]

= Configuring Git =

Git has both a global config and a local config for each repo. As one might expect, local trumps global. The first important thing to do is set your name and email address, as that will be used in your commits.

On Linux this is done via:

git config user.email YOUR@EMAIL.ADDR
git config user.name "Your Name"

On Windows this done with the config menu.

[[Image:config1.png]] [[Image:Config2.png]]

= Git Repositories for OpenSim =

Current there are 2 git repositories on the system:
* an opensim-test repository, which allows for experimentation with git (this is not kept up to date with the latest svn trunk)
* an opensim git mirror of the svn trunk (this does now allow checkins, it is a direct mirror of the svn trunk)

The urls for the repositories are as follows:

{| border="1"
! Repository !! Developer URL !! Anon URL
|-
|| opensim || n/a this is the svn mirror || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim
|-
|| opensim-test || ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim-test || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test
|}

== Cloning the Test Repositry (for Core Developers) ==

There is a test repository on opensimulator.org in /var/git/opensim-test. This is a point in time capture of the opensim trunk (and all changes prior). It is designed for messing around with to get comfortable with git. Don't worry about breaking this repository.

The initial clone will take a few minutes, as the git repository contains the entire history of the project.

=== Linux ===
Run the following on the command line:

git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim-test

This will create an opensim-test directory locally

=== Windows ===

Right click on the Desktop (or wherever) and 'Git Clone...'

When prompted for a url provide ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim-test. You username and password will be the ones used for opensimulator.org.

== Cloning the Test Repositry (for Non Core Developers) ==

You can use the same approach as above, but '''instead''' of using the ssh:// urls use the '''git://''' urls. This is the equivalent of anonymous svn access.

= Conceptual Changes from Subversion =

Distributed source code control is a substantially different mental model than centralized source code control. If it freaks you out a bit, don't worry, everyone has that same reaction initially. This [http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ blog post] is the best explanation that I've seen of the concepts involved.

For heavy users of subversion you should read the [http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html git / svn cheat sheet]. This provides a very solid basis for making your changes. That being said there are some conceptual changes to note.

* Terminology
** master is the name of the primary upstream branch (in subversion terms, this is trunk)
** origin is the name and location of the tree you cloned from
* All repositories are full peers to all other repositories. Your cloned git repo is all the history of the entire project, available locally. It means you can sync between any 2 clones of the repository, not just between your clone and the master repo. This lets people work together on changes not in
* Version numbers are SHA1 hashes, not sequential integers. This means referring to specific revisions is a bit more interesting. For most of the git commands, you only need to give it the first 6-8 digits of the hash for them to work.
* Committing
** commits are local. This means they are fast (no network involved) and they are committed against the last state of the tree. Any conflict resolution will be handled after commits, during your next pull. This is slightly different than pull-resolve-then-commit model of subversion.
** by default only files you explicitly '''git add''' are put into the commit. To get '''svn ci''' equivalency use '''git commit -a''' to commit all outstanding files (I think tortoise handles this for you)
** after making a commit you must then '''push''' it to a remote repository (probably origin). By default you push only branches you have previously pushed, typically master.

The biggest real change is the Subversion dictates a very specific workflow. Git does not. Git allows for many different workflows, and lets each developer use the one that is best suited to his/her self.

= Using Git like Subversion/trunk development =

This is a set of quick instructions to use git like we do subversion development today. It is targetted for core developers (so assumes you are using the ssh access), though most of it will work for non developers by just changing a url.

This is done by giving the unix commands. These options should all be available in the context menu on tortoise git as well.

== Getting the source code ==

'''git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn co'''

'''Note:''' all other operations assume that you are in the git directory.

== Updating your checkout ==

'''git pull'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn update'''

== Inspecting what has changed in your working tree ==

'''git status'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn status'''

== Committing a change ==

either:

'''git add file1 file2 ...'''

'''git commit'''

or

'''git commit -a'''

by default git does not add all files during a commit.

== Pushing the committed change ==

The first time you do this you'll need to specify which branch to push.

'''git push origin master'''

After the first time a simple '''git push''' will be enough, as it defaults to origin, and now git knows that master should by synced to origin.

'''Important:''' commits in git are local. They are not included in the main tree '''until you push''' them. This means you can create commits when you are not on the network and sync afterwards.

== Setting the checkout dir to a specific revision ==

'''git reset --hard #HASHVALUE'''

This will effectively rewind the tree to the specific revision, and modify the checkout dir accordingly. This is equiv to '''svn up -R#version'''.

git reset can also be useful if you screwed up commits and want to get rid of them

== Resetting the tree to master (i.e. trunk) ==

'''git pull'''

per previous

== Creating a Patch ==

'''git format-patch #HASHVALUE'''

This will create a patch suitable for attaching or emailing from a single commit. You can also specify a range of commits.

This is closest to '''svn diff > patchfile.txt''' for uncommitted changes in subversion.

== Applying a Git Patch ==

If someone has formatted a git patch you can apply it directly (including all file adds, file mode changes, and their change log entry) with:

'''git apply patchfile.patch'''

== Reverting a Change ==

'''git revert #HASHVALUE'''

This directly reverts the change, with a commit message stating that fact. There is no svn direct equiv, though this is often accomplished through: svn diff -R revisions > revert.patch && patch -p0 < revert.patch && svn ci -m "reverting revisions"

== Resetting part of the tree to master ==

'''git checkout -- file1 file2 ...'''

Checkout is an operation that populates the working directory from the git repository. Doing a git checkout (master is the implied branch) -- file1 file2 repulls those files from the git repo, clobbering them in your local directory. This is like '''svn revert'''.

== Diffing Changes ==

Against your most recently committed changes

'''git diff'''

From your most recent changes to a past change

'''git diff #HASHVALUE'''

Between any 2 changes

'''git diff #HASHVALUE1 #HASHVALUE1'''

Using Git

2009-08-04T03:58:22Z

DaveCoyle: add info re: GUIs for Linux

This is an introduction to using git for OpenSim core developers.

= Installing Git =

== Linux ==

=== CLI ===
:Git is provided as a package with all modern Linux distributions. Install the following packages depending on environment:
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-core</pre>
::* Centos: see the instructions at http://www.how-to-linux.com/2009/01/install-git-161-on-centos-52/

=== GUIs ===
:[http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-gui.html git-gui]
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-gui</pre>

:[http://cola.tuxfamily.org/ git-cola]
::* Debian, Ubuntu: <pre>apt-get install git-cola</pre>

== Windows ==

On Windows you need to install 2 packages:
* msysgit - the basic git port for windows. Install this first.
* [http://code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/ Tortoise Git] - the git explorer. Install this second.

When '''installing msysgit''' be sure to choose
'''Unix style line endings'''. This will make it so that all the line endings are managed correctly, which will prevent merge issues in the future.

[[Image:msysgit1.png]] [[Image:msysgit2.png]] [[Image:msysgit3.png]] [[Image:msysgit4.png]] [[Image:msysgit5.png]]

= Configuring Git =

Git has both a global config and a local config for each repo. As one might expect, local trumps global. The first important thing to do is set your name and email address, as that will be used in your commits.

On Linux this is done via:

git config user.email YOUR@EMAIL.ADDR
git config user.name "Your Name"

On Windows this done with the config menu.

[[Image:config1.png]] [[Image:Config2.png]]

= Git Repositories for OpenSim =

Current there are 2 git repositories on the system:
* an opensim-test repository, which allows for experimentation with git (this is not kept up to date with the latest svn trunk)
* an opensim git mirror of the svn trunk (this does now allow checkins, it is a direct mirror of the svn trunk)

The urls for the repositories are as follows:

{| border="1"
! Repository !! Developer URL !! Anon URL
|-
|| opensim || n/a this is the svn mirror || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim
|-
|| opensim-test || ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim-test || git://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test
|}

== Cloning the Test Repositry (for Core Developers) ==

There is a test repository on opensimulator.org in /var/git/opensim-test. This is a point in time capture of the opensim trunk (and all changes prior). It is designed for messing around with to get comfortable with git. Don't worry about breaking this repository.

The initial clone will take a few minutes, as the git repository contains the entire history of the project.

=== Linux ===
Run the following on the command line:

git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim-test

This will create an opensim-test directory locally

=== Windows ===

Right click on the Desktop (or wherever) and 'Git Clone...'

When prompted for a url provide ssh://opensimulator.org/var/git/opensim-test. You username and password will be the ones used for opensimulator.org.

== Cloning the Test Repositry (for Non Core Developers) ==

You can use the same approach as above, but '''instead''' of using the ssh:// urls use the '''git://''' urls. This is the equivalent of anonymous svn access.

= Conceptual Changes from Subversion =

Distributed source code control is a substantially different mental model than centralized source code control. If it freaks you out a bit, don't worry, everyone has that same reaction initially. This [http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ blog post] is the best explanation that I've seen of the concepts involved.

For heavy users of subversion you should read the [http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html git / svn cheat sheet]. This provides a very solid basis for making your changes. That being said there are some conceptual changes to note.

* Terminology
** master is the name of the primary upstream branch (in subversion terms, this is trunk)
** origin is the name and location of the tree you cloned from
* All repositories are full peers to all other repositories. Your cloned git repo is all the history of the entire project, available locally. It means you can sync between any 2 clones of the repository, not just between your clone and the master repo. This lets people work together on changes not in
* Version numbers are SHA1 hashes, not sequential integers. This means referring to specific revisions is a bit more interesting. For most of the git commands, you only need to give it the first 6-8 digits of the hash for them to work.
* Committing
** commits are local. This means they are fast (no network involved) and they are committed against the last state of the tree. Any conflict resolution will be handled after commits, during your next pull. This is slightly different than pull-resolve-then-commit model of subversion.
** by default only files you explicitly '''git add''' are put into the commit. To get '''svn ci''' equivalency use '''git commit -a''' to commit all outstanding files (I think tortoise handles this for you)
** after making a commit you must then '''push''' it to a remote repository (probably origin). By default you push only branches you have previously pushed, typically master.

The biggest real change is the Subversion dictates a very specific workflow. Git does not. Git allows for many different workflows, and lets each developer use the one that is best suited to his/her self.

= Using Git like Subversion/trunk development =

This is a set of quick instructions to use git like we do subversion development today. It is targetted for core developers (so assumes you are using the ssh access), though most of it will work for non developers by just changing a url.

This is done by giving the unix commands. These options should all be available in the context menu on tortoise git as well.

== Getting the source code ==

'''git clone ssh://opensimulator.org/git/opensim-test'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn co'''

'''Note:''' all other operations assume that you are in the git directory.

== Updating your checkout ==

'''git pull'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn update'''

== Inspecting what has changed in your working tree ==

'''git status'''

This is the equivalent of '''svn status'''

== Committing a change ==

either:

'''git add file1 file2 ...'''

'''git commit'''

or

'''git commit -a'''

by default git does not add all files during a commit.

== Pushing the committed change ==

The first time you do this you'll need to specify which branch to push.

'''git push origin master'''

After the first time a simple '''git push''' will be enough, as it defaults to origin, and now git knows that master should by synced to origin.

'''Important:''' commits in git are local. They are not included in the main tree '''until you push''' them. This means you can create commits when you are not on the network and sync afterwards.

== Setting the checkout dir to a specific revision ==

'''git reset --hard #HASHVALUE'''

This will effectively rewind the tree to the specific revision, and modify the checkout dir accordingly. This is equiv to '''svn up -R#version'''.

git reset can also be useful if you screwed up commits and want to get rid of them

== Resetting the tree to master (i.e. trunk) ==

'''git pull'''

per previous

== Creating a Patch ==

'''git format-patch #HASHVALUE'''

This will create a patch suitable for attaching or emailing from a single commit. You can also specify a range of commits.

This is closest to '''svn diff > patchfile.txt''' for uncommitted changes in subversion.

== Applying a Git Patch ==

If someone has formatted a git patch you can apply it directly (including all file adds, file mode changes, and their change log entry) with:

'''git apply patchfile.patch'''

== Reverting a Change ==

'''git revert #HASHVALUE'''

This directly reverts the change, with a commit message stating that fact. There is no svn direct equiv, though this is often accomplished through: svn diff -R revisions > revert.patch && patch -p0 < revert.patch && svn ci -m "reverting revisions"

== Resetting part of the tree to master ==

'''git checkout -- file1 file2 ...'''

Checkout is an operation that populates the working directory from the git repository. Doing a git checkout (master is the implied branch) -- file1 file2 repulls those files from the git repo, clobbering them in your local directory. This is like '''svn revert'''.

== Diffing Changes ==

Against your most recently committed changes

'''git diff'''

From your most recent changes to a past change

'''git diff #HASHVALUE'''

Between any 2 changes

'''git diff #HASHVALUE1 #HASHVALUE1'''

Build Instructions

2009-07-24T05:31:40Z

DaveCoyle: this page needs a TOC

{{Template:Quicklinks}}

[[Category:Users]]
This page covers building OpenSim from source code on multiple platforms. Please help us keep this page up to date as the project progresses.

==Download OpenSim ==
Check out the [[Download]] page for instructions on obtaining an OpenSim source release.

==MS Windows==

OpenSim requires either the .Net framework version 2.0, or the latest Mono. It supports the following compilers:
* [http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/express/aa700756.aspx Microsoft Visual C# Express Edition] (note: not Visual C++)
* [http://www.mono-project.com/ mono]

Additional note: any Microsoft C# Express edition should work (2005 or 2008)

Additional note: It is possible to develop on Windows Vista 64 bits with the following tweaks:
# Select OpenSim project properties from solution and choose platform to be x86. Rebuild solution.
# Select OpenSim.exe properties under solution bin folder and choose windows xp sp 2 compatibility mode + run as administrator.

=== Building ===

* In the top-level directory, run the '<tt>runprebuild.bat</tt>' file. This will create a VS2005 solution file, a nant build file and a '<tt>compile.bat</tt>' file.
* If you prefer VS2008, run the '<tt>runprebuild2008.bat</tt>' instead.

* Open the resulting sln file with visual studio and build it there, or
* Run the '<tt>compile.bat</tt>' file. This will build the executable using MSBuild.
* if you prefer to use nant, run nant in the same top-level directory. This will build the executables.

If you don't care about physics (walking on prims, etc), ignore the rest of this section.

=== Running ===

Recent versions of OpenSim come without an <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> file. Copy the <tt>OpenSim.ini.example</tt> file to <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> before making any changes.

Double-click on the <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> executable file in the <tt>bin</tt> directory. This will start up OpenSim in standalone mode.

The debugger in VS2005 C# may be used to step through the code. For those that use a Cygwin shell, you may find that one or more dll's have permissions that cause problems running. Most find that a "<tt>chmod 777 *</tt>" from the <tt>bin</tt> directory solves this.

Physics can be invoked by adding the appropriate line to the [Startup] section of <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt>. For ODE, that would be:

physics = OpenDynamicsEngine

You can also add a command line option to a shortcut, or run from a command prompt with:

-physics=OpenDynamicsEngine

'''''Windows Vista'''''

Some people have reported that to run on Windows Vista, you must first disable Windows Firewall. Under the new "Start" button of Vista, select "Control panel". Then double-click "Windows Firewall". In the window that pops up, on the left column, select "Turn Windows Firewall on or off". You will have to give permission for this to run, then select the option "Off (not recommended)". Click "OK" and exit from the Windows Firewall window.

If you have McAfee SecurityCenter, see the description below.

Once all the security features are disabled, right click on <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> and select "Run as administrator". This will pop up a window asking permission, select "Allow". Your OpenSim server should run in a DOS-like window and accept connections.

'''''McAfee Security'''''

McAfee Security does not allow applications to listen on ports not explicitly specified. You have two options: 1) disable firewall protection all together, 2) enable <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> to be able to open ports.

''Disable firewall''

Open McAfee SecurityCenter. Select "Internet & Network". In the lower left corner is a small link to "Configure...". Select this. In the right side of the window, select the bar that says "Firewall protection is enabled". Here you can select "Off".

''Enable <tt>OpenSim.exe</tt> to open ports''

Open McAfee SecurityCenter. Select "Internet & Network". In the lower left corner is a small link to "Configure...". Select this. In the right side of the window, select the bar that says "Firewall protection is enabled". Select the "Advanced..." button. This will pop up a new window.

In the new window, on the left side, select "Program Permissions." In the middle on the right side of the window, select the "Add Allowed Program" button. Use the browser that pops up to find the OpenSim executable and select it.

Finally, select "OK" and exit the McAfee SecurityCenter window.

==Linux/Mac OS X/FreeBSD==

The easiest plaform to get running on the Linux side is Ubuntu 8.10, 32bit. This is what most of the developers running Linux use. If you are looking for the quick path, start there.

=== Ubuntu 8.04 / 8.10 ===

For Ubuntu users on older distributions (7.10, 8.04, etc.) '''you need''' to upgrade your mono to at least 1.9.1. Mono 2.2 is currently the preferred version to run OpenSim with.

You can use the built in packages for mono. However, for better performance, you may want to [http://xyzzyxyzzy.net/2008/05/08/updated-mono-build-script-for-hardy-heron-and-mono-191/ upgrade mono to 1.9.1] ([http://tempvariable.blogspot.com/2008/04/installing-mono-191-on-ubuntu-804-hardy.html Other simple method])

sudo apt-get install subversion nant mono-gmcs libmono-microsoft8.0-cil \
libmono-system-runtime2.0-cil libgdiplus libmono-i18n2.0-cil libmono-oracle2.0-cil ruby
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

To upgrade the Mono version to the latest stable build Mono 2.0.1, read this page [[Build Instructions/Ubuntu-Mono-2.0.1 | Ubuntu on Mono 2.0.1]]

=== openSUSE 10.3/11/11.1 ===

Install an openSUSE 11.1, 11 or 10.3 with its default options, add the online repositories
when finished installing do an online update with all the latest packages.

In yast install these packages, for running Opensim in standalone mode.
(there is a slight diffrence between 10.3 and 11/11.1 but following should be same)
subversion
nant
mono-jscript
- check that mono-core is installed

just in case you do not already have it installed

sudo zypper install mono-data-oracle

A tip for OpenSuSE 11.1 users - you can install packages from the command line using the 'zypper' tool. For example, to install 'nant', use this command:

sudo zypper install nant

If you just want to use SQLite then jump to last section
within this post.

* Optional mysql - for Opensim running in Grid mode:
Install these mysql packages via yast
mysql
mysql-client
mysql-administrator
mysql-gui-tools
mysql-query-browser

(note that selecting mysql in the Yast2 Installer will select the other packages automatically)

Before building create the mysql database.
/etc/init.d/mysql start
mysql -u root -p -h localhost
(when asked for password just hit enter)

mysql> create database opensim;
mysql> use opensim;
mysql> create user 'opensim'@'localhost' identified by 'thePassword';
mysql> grant all on *.* to 'opensim'@'localhost';
mysql> quit

*note that the '''grant all''' command may differ if you're adding the opensim database to an existing mysql installation.

On current builds set the connection string inside bin/OpenSim.ini after coppying the OpenSim.ini.example file.
If you are changing to MySQL from SQLite, the connection string for mysql also exists in the bin/Region/*xml files.
* It is '''important''' to remember this if you start out using the built-in SQLite database engine.

Build after installation of above in bash terminal. I save it in /opt

su -
cd /opt
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

Or, if you have a current (0.6+), you can simply execute:

make

After this you should be able to continue on starting the diffrent Servers, look in the mysql-config section,or
just run your OpenSim as a Standalone. By - eagleFX

=== Mac OS X 10.5/10.4 ===
* OpenSim is now working on PowerPC Macs! Thanks to DrScofield and those who helped him. Current nightly builds for PowerPC are not working, not sure about Intel so use the 0.5 Build. OpenSim works on Intel Macs. I'm testing on PowerBook G4. Tested these step on 10.5, but not 10.4 but should work --[[User:Mokele|Mokele]] 22:36, 14 February 2008 (PST) (Works on iMac G5 with OS 10.4.11, including expanding to local grid mode. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-15 10:50 (CET))
* Install XCode Developers Tools from DVD/CD Installation Disk or download from http://developer.apple.com/. You have to create an Apple account to access the downloads if you don't have an Apple account.
* Install X11 for 10.4 from the Optional Install from the DVD/CD Installation Disk. X11 for 10.5 is installed by default.
* Install Mono 1.2.5 from http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/archive/1.2.5/macos-10-universal/5/MonoFramework-1.2.5_5.macos10.novell.universal.dmg (The more recent releases Mono 1.2.6, 1.9.1 and 2.0.1 do not appear to work with these installation instructions. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-14 15:56 (CET)) and in Terminal or X11 edit the .profile file and add the following line:
export PKG_CONFIG_PATH="/Library/Frameworks/Mono.framework/Versions/Current/lib/pkgconfig/:${PKG_CONFIG_PATH}"
* Compile OpenSim
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim/tags/0.5.0-release opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

* Download and Compile libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib and libsecondlife.dll
* libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib:
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/old/libsl1550 opensim-libs
cd opensim-libs/openjpeg-libsl
make -f Makefile.osx
cp libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.dylib ../../bin
* Note: The Makefile that creates the libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so does not compile on PowerPC, but works properly on Intel Macs. Looks like a gcc issue with compile options. (It appears to work on iMac G5 with OS X 10.4.11. --[[User:Magnuz|Magnuz]] 2008-12-14 15:55 (CET))

* libsecondlife.dll: (for PowerPC Only, see details on this step [http://xyzzyxyzzy.net/2008/02/12/installing-opensim-on-powerpcor-of-eggs-and-virtual-worlds installing OpenSim on PowerPC…or: of eggs and virtual worlds])
cd .. (back into opensim-libs)
nant
cp bin/libsecondlife.dll ../bin

* Edit the libsecondlife.dll.config (PowerPC Only). Remove the cpu="x86" tag in the last dllmap line.

Here is what worked for me (OS X 10.5.7, Intel):

* make sure you have X11 installed
* grab the Apple Dev Tools from [http://developer.apple.com/]
* install Mono Framework 2.4 from [http://www.go-mono.com/mono-downloads/download.html]
* Get OpenSim source:
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim/tags/0.6.5-post-fixes opensim
* Compile OpenSim:
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant
--[[User:Kusako|Kusako]] 08:06, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

=== FreeBSD 6.2 ===
su
cd /usr/ports/devel/subversion/ && make install clean (you may also need to rebuild apr-svn if this step fails)
cd /usr/ports/lang/mono/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/devel/nant/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/databases/sqlite3/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/x11-toolkits/libgdiplus/ && make install clean
cd /opensim/installation/directory/
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

Note: [http://opensimulator.org/wiki/OpenSim:FAQ#System.DllNotFoundException:_..2Flibopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so|Follow the instructions on the FAQ to fix the]
"System.DllNotFoundException: ./libopenjpeg-libsl-2.1.2.0.so" issue, but use "gmake" instead of "make"

For ODE Physics you must do the following:
cd /usr/ports/graphics/libGL/ && make install clean
cd /usr/ports/graphics/libGLU/ && make install clean
cd /opensim/installation/directory/
svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk opensim-libs
cd opensim-libs/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine2/
sh autogen.sh
./configure --enable-shared --enable-release --disable-demos
make
mv ./ode/src/.libs/libode.so /opensim/installation/directory/opensim/bin/

=== RedHat Enterprise Linux 4 ===
sudo vi /etc/yum.repos.d/mono.repo

[mono]
name=Mono for rhel-4-i386 (stable)
baseurl=http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/download-stable/rhel-4-i386/
enabled=1
gpgcheck=0

sudo yum install mono-complete monodoc-core nant
[[Download]] opensim
cd opensim
./runprebuild.sh
nant

=== RedHat Enterprise Linux 5 ===

The instructions below also work on other RedHat Linux flavors such as CentOS or maybe Fedora.

1. Put the [http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono/RHEL_5/Mono.repo Mono.repo] file in the /etc/yum.repo.d/ directory:
$ sudo su -
$ cd /etc/yum.repos.d/
$ wget http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono/RHEL_5/Mono.repo
Naturally use the most [http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Mono up-to-date link for your distribution].

2. Install Mono and related tools with yum:
$ yum install mono nant mono-jscript mono-nunit
Make sure to use nunit-console2 to run your tests.

=== Fedora 5 ===
* I needed to build latest mono and nant from sources to build OpenSim successfully, the ones available in yum repository didn't work so I had to uninstall and build and configure the packages.

For detailed instructions go [http://ruakuu.blogspot.com/2008/06/installing-and-configuring-opensim-on.html here]

=== Debian 4 ===

For detailed instructions please see [[Debian 4 Build Instructions]]

=== CentOS 5.2 32bit ===

For detailed instructions please see [[CentOS 5.2 Build Instructions]]

=== 64bit ===
Please note that only 32bit binaries are provided in the bin/ directory of subversion. If you want to use 64bit, you'll need to rebuild these shared objects. See [[Installing and running on x86-64]]

=== Physics (Open Dynamics Engine ODE) ===
As installed from svn, ODE will work on most 32 bit platforms. If you get an ODE-related crash, and/or a libode.so not found type of error, you will need to build libode from source.

Remove <tt>libode.so</tt> from the <tt>./bin</tt> folder. (Note that subsequent svn updates may replace it again; best fix is to copy your built <tt>libode.so</tt> to <tt>bin</tt>). Do NOT remove <tt>ode.net.dll</tt>! Download the latest source from:

svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine

OpenSim requires a couple of patches on top of ODE which are not yet included upstream. When compiling, make sure to use the following configure options:

--with-trimesh=gimpact
--enable-shared

Make sure the configure script confirms these choices, and always compile with single precision (I believe that's the default). Try <code> make -k </code> if you get errors relating to drawstuff, test*, or openGL. <code> make install </code> should put <tt>libode.so</tt> in the proper place (usually <tt>/usr/local/lib</tt>), and it should be seen by opensim (<tt>ode.net.dll</tt>)

'''''Note:''' if OpenSim fails to launch with <tt>Exception: System.DllNotFoundException: ode</tt>, after compiling ODE, just copy <tt>libode.so</tt> from its usual place (probably <tt>/usr/local/lib/</tt>) to ./bin/, as per [http://metafuturing.net/index.php/OpenSim_Notebook_1 this suggestion]''

==== Setting up ODE for 64 Bits systems: ====

HOWTO on setting up and Install OpenSim on SLES10 - SP1 64Bit

1. I installed Mono 2.01, added this installation source in Yast2
This distro supports installing packages via YaST. Add the following installation source to YaST:
* http://ftp.novell.com/pub/mono/download-stable/SLE_10 [^]
For assistance with using repositories and installing packages with YaST, visit the Yast help page.

"nant" was installed also via this operation.

2. I installed subversion from http://software.opensuse.org/search [^]

SLES/SLED10 ->
subversion-1.5.2-34.2.x86_64.rpm

3. I downloaded and installed the lastest SVN version of opensim as usual (like a 32 bit system):
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Build_Instructions [^]

4. I downloaded and installed the Open Dynamics Engine (ODE) to replace the 32 bit version of ODE with a 64 bit version.

I did that with the following linux commands:
(it is expected that you have all required Linux building tools installed):

# cd
# svn co http://opensimulator.org/svn/opensim-libs/trunk/unmanaged/OpenDynamicsEngine [^]
# cd OpenDynamicEngine
# chmod a+x ou/bootstrap
# sh autogen.sh

I installed/updated SLES10 with these rpm's for autogen.sh to run properly. http://software.opensuse.org/search [^]

SLES/SLED10 ->
- autoconf-2.61-168.1.x86_64.rpm
- automake-1.10.1-5.3.x86_64.rpm

# CFLAGS="-m64" ./configure --enable-shared
# make

I installed gtk2-devel via yast2, and all its dependancies, because make keept failing.

# cp ./ode/src/.libs/libode.so /opt/opensim/bin/

note:
in this directory it had made several versions of the "libode.so" because of running the previous commands several times
so i had to copy libode.so.1.0.0 to /opt/opensim/bin/libode.so

# vi ../opensim/bin/OpenSim.ini (change av_capsule_standup_tensor_linux to 1700000)

The 'chmod' command is required to fix permissions that are wrong.
The change in OpenSim.ini is required to avoid that avatars have bend legs and/or their feet are in the ground.

==== Running ====
Recent versions of OpenSim come without an <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> file. Copy the <tt>OpenSim.ini.example</tt> file to <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt> before making any changes.
<code>
cd bin
mono OpenSim.exe
</code>

Note: if you are running a 32bit Server such as Ubuntu 8.0.4 you need the alternative launcher:

<code>
mono OpenSim.32BitLaunch.exe
</code>

* To invoke ODE, add the option:
-physics=OpenDynamicsEngine
to the <tt>mono OpenSim.exe</tt> line

or add <code> physics = OpenDynamicsEngine </code> to the [Startup] section of <tt>OpenSim.ini</tt>. Same deal for other physics engines, when available.

On mono 1.2.6, some distributions may see
Unhandled Exception: System.NotSupportedException: CodePage 1252 not supported
on startup when using mysql. This can be resolved by installing the package libmono-i18n2.0-cil (see http://bugs.mysql.com/bug.php?id=33938).

=== Additional Items ===

* [[GC_NO_EXPLICIT|GC NO EXPLICIT]] - Enable Large Heap in Mono, this has been known to help performance and stability

== Hardware selection guide ==

An often-asked question is "what kind of hardware do I need to successfully run OpenSim?" Unfortunately, the answer is "it depends". The number of regions hosted on a given machine, number of simultaneous avatars on those regions, number of prims, use of scripts, etc., all affect hardware requirements. So, to help you make a more informed selection, some examples of hardware used are listed in the [[Hardware_Selection_Guide|hardware selection guide]].

[[Category:Users]]
[[Category:Getting Started]]

Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-23

2009-07-05T16:02:48Z

DaveCoyle:

Justin Clark-Casey: penny: I think the people to really talk to about this are Nebadon and Charles. They run this meeting nowadays
 Starky Rubble: There's also the question of resources
 Master Dubrovna: I think people at LBSA and here overloaded things this time
 Penny Lane: They were running it ... until it crashed. :P Vicious circle
 Monk Zymurgy: hi OtakuMegane
 Carissa Raynier: hi everyone
 Starky Rubble: all the plazzs are on one of two servers AFIK
 Justin Clark-Casey: hmm, if this is your only opportunity to talk to them then that is a little problematic :) You could also try taking the temperature on this topic on the opensim-dev list
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 OtakuMegane Desu: Hey
 Orion Hax: might a suggest for large meetings to use a sim with less of a prim/script load
 Penny Lane: JCC: I'll talk to CK. He probably doesn't appreciate being cut off in mid sentence every week.
 Starky Rubble: prolly not lol
 Penny Lane: Proper stress tests would be cool, btw
 Starky Rubble: I like to attend for the social aspect but mostly for the background info on current dev thinking
 Penny Lane: Actually looking at the metrics as the load rises, plotting the graphs etc
 Justin Clark-Casey: intel have done some work on this kind of thing in a controlled manner
 Penny Lane: What you don't measure you don't really know.
 Starky Rubble: there are graphs in the corner over there
 Penny Lane: JCC: you mean John?
 Justin Clark-Casey: no, dslake
 Penny Lane: Ta
 Kitto Flora: Right Penny. A stress test that does not gather data and have a path to dealing with problems encountered is of little use.
 Penny Lane: And I'm up for social gathering and chewing the rag too. ;-) But those things sometimes conflict :-)
 Starky Rubble: sure
 Richardus Raymaker: hi starky
 Kitto Flora asks his usual question: Anyone here working on server ode physics/vehicles? (Yes I kow 'teravus is').
 Starky Rubble: Hey Richardus
 Dahlia Trimble: not lately
 Justin Clark-Casey: I believe somebody from IBM made a small change recently
 Justin Clark-Casey: but yeah, nothing apart from that
 Penny Lane waves at Dahlia :-)
 Starky Rubble: hee - I always say Kitto Flora is...
 Dahlia Trimble waves back :)
 WhiteStar Magic: I believe that Snowcrash has a coupleof ideas in regards to using MRM and Vehicle Movements
 WhiteStar Magic: we were discussing that along with a few other items yesterday
 Kitto Flora: Where, ShiteStar?
 Kitto Flora: White...
 OtakuMegane Desu: Lawl
 WhiteStar Magic: in one of teh IRC's
 Brent Seidel: :-O
 WhiteStar Magic: snow is making up a few MRM based courses for people
 Kitto Flora: Pse expand MRM
 Starky Rubble: for the C# cvlasses?
 WhiteStar Magic: Adam MRM Mini Region MOdule
 Wordfromthe Wise: i will try that
 WhiteStar Magic: http://www.adamfrisby.com/blog/tag/mrm/
 WhiteStar Magic: save that till later
 Starky Rubble: Hi Static!
 Wordfromthe Wise: i just run the official 9841
 Dahlia Trimble: anyone try the snowglobe viewer with opensim yet?
 WhiteStar Magic: Not yet... still playing with Meerkat
 paulie Flomar: :)
 WhiteStar Magic: I was gonna install snowglobe this week and play with it
 Dahlia Trimble: I use it with SL but I've been using emerald with opensim lately
 Static Sprocket: Ello Starky
 paulie Flomar: Happeh SL6B!
 Penny Lane: I'm on Snowglobe on SL currently.
 tx Oh: what so new with snowglobe?
 Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: emerald is another viewer flavour?
 Penny Lane: I've found a few crash problems, but nothing major
 Dahlia Trimble: emerald has some nice building and radar features
 tx Oh: i mean why should i try snowglobe?
 Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.6.5 (Dev) .9867 (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur)
 Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:True
 Dahlia Trimble: snowglobe seems to have a higher FPS and loads textures faster but bump maps dont work
 Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: seems to be invisible to Google :) Is that a Linden codename or just the name of somebody else's viewer branch?
 Penny Lane: Nothing particularly new with Snowglobe, other than the map textures coming straight from S3 over HTTP. But it's supposedly a more open LL viewer, in the sense that there are a select number of residents with commit access to the LL SVN for it.
 tx Oh: i would like to see bumpmap applied by user textures
 Dahlia Trimble: snowglobe is that open source viewer that Philip is sponsoring
 Justin Clark-Casey: Dahlia; I meant emerald rather than snowglobe
 WhiteStar Magic: based on LL code ?
 Justin Clark-Casey: Penny: any sense of how that is going? Co-operation working well there?
 Dahlia Trimble: oh lemme try to find the emerald link
 Brent Seidel: Look for GreenLife Emerald Viewer
 Justin Clark-Casey: got it. thanks brent, dahlia
 Penny Lane: Only two residents currently have commit access. Yeah, it's just the LL viewer with more patches and a less onerous acceptance path .... allegedly
 Justin Clark-Casey: only two? Oh, I thought it was more than that
 Penny Lane: JCC: cooperation is going very well atm, but it's early days. So far the LL people who vet patches haven't said "No"
 Richardus Raymaker is Online
 Penny Lane: They will start rejecting patches of course. The big question is when ... at the slightest hint of divergence from LL's plans? Or will it be more flexible? Who knows
 tx Oh: i like to know when the next hippo will be there. as far as i know the obscure 4096 tp limit is eliminated
 Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, that's the issue that interests me, esp. if people try to start to generalize things more for non Linden servers such as OpenSim
 Dahlia Trimble: heh at one time I had some stepping store regions set up on osgrid so I could tp between my islands and WP
 Dahlia Trimble: *stone
 WhiteStar Magic: well... are we Linden Server or not ? Why remain anchored in teh concrete galoshes of LL code ?
 Penny Lane: There's a good likelihood that OGP stuff will go into Snowglobe early. That's not particularly interesting though, since OGP is so threadbare currently.
 paulie Flomar: HG ftw!
 Dahlia Trimble: heh we need grider in snowglobe :)
 Monk Zymurgy: paulie : +1
 paulie Flomar: Anyone playuing with Meerkat viewer?
 Penny Lane: White: we're not anchored to SL at all. The only problem is that we don't really have our own viewer (despite many future candidates), plus the fact that the peeps who use Opensim actually want compatibility with SL.
 Dahlia Trimble: tried it
 Maik Galaxy: yes, it a nice stable viewer..
 Penny Lane: Meerkat's interesting, but for me on Linux, very flakey.
 Justin Clark-Casey: don't underestimate the amount of weight that existing SL code has
 Justin Clark-Casey: and its mindshare
 tx Oh: i get dizzy with all this viewer names droped in
 Justin Clark-Casey: and the fact that they have paid developers :)
 Dahlia Trimble: we have Idealist but the momentum seems to be lacking
 Maik Galaxy: the gemini-viewer is nice for builders
 tx Oh: i made me an own viewer, just for machinema
 Penny Lane: Would be great if there were a concerted push for our own viewer. Idealist certainly sounds likea great candidate.
 tx Oh: it's not linux compatible nor mac
 Dahlia Trimble: it runs on linux
 Dahlia Trimble: should run on a mac
 Penny Lane: tx meant his own viewer :-)
 tx Oh: sure? with wine?
 Brent Seidel: That's the thing. Any "OpenSim" viewer would have to support Window, Linux, and MacOS.
 Dahlia Trimble: idealist should run natively
 Maik Galaxy: own viewer based on meerkat
 tx Oh: my viewer is linux only :-)
 Dahlia Trimble: well not natively, it would require mono and possibley X
 Penny Lane: HGehe
 Penny Lane: libc probably helps too
 Richardus Raymaker: wine is not nice. small font. dont like to run viewer under emulator or something like that
 tx Oh: oh got, more mono.
 Richardus Raymaker: besides that, wine is not stable with SL viewer.
 Richardus Raymaker: noo, not again mono ! :P
 Dahlia Trimble <3 mono
 Penny Lane: Wine isn't stable with anything, really. Even when it works with something, you upgrade either Wine or the app and it's broken again.
 tx Oh: i think the hippo is cool. why not support that in a way?
 Richardus Raymaker: right penny. but iwould not make it worser
 Dahlia Trimble: hippo is cool but it's derived from the LL codebase
 Penny Lane: Wine will never be stable, simply because it's chasing Microsoft's tail lights, and that's an impossible tastk.
 tx Oh: so what? ll viewer is gpl'ed
 Dahlia Trimble: :)
 Richardus Raymaker: which form ? bsd ? gnu ?
 Justin Clark-Casey: I gather the issue is the complexity of the LL codebase and the difficulty in adapting it
 Penny Lane: Some people have a religious problem with GPL. Not engineering, religion.
 Justin Clark-Casey: well, and license too, arguably
 tx Oh: i love gpl, i love debian
 Dahlia Trimble: I think the GPL issue is the desire to use opensim commercially rather than religious
 Static Sprocket: I suspect some developers also have issues with the archetecture of the LL viewers, and would prefer to start from scratch <shrug>
 Richardus Raymaker: i loe linux
 Penny Lane: Yeah, that's true, lot of arch problems there.
 Justin Clark-Casey: static: developerse always love to start from scratch. But a lot of man years have gone into the LL veiewer
 WhiteStar Magic: /??
 Richardus Raymaker: how long is opensim now ? 2 years ?
 tx Oh: thats what i mean. it's hard to stomp something of the ground
 Justin Clark-Casey: two and a bit
 Dahlia Trimble: well Idealist can display collada content alongside prims and sculpties in the same scene, How long would it take the LL viewer to be modified to do that?
 Static Sprocket: Based on previous projects I've worked on, sometimes it takes even more man hours to fully understand an existing project's code, and then adapt it to your goals, then it would take to start from scratch.
 WhiteStar Magic: will LL give out the new code to SL 2 when it arrives ?
 Richardus Raymaker: right, and see how hhard it is to get opensim good.
 Static Sprocket: The man hours arguement is valid however if your goals are minor changes, or changes spread out over a long period of time
 Justin Clark-Casey: Static: that's true. Though often the reimplementers end up just repeating the mistakes of the original :)
 Richardus Raymaker: SL2 ? i missed something
 tx Oh: it's not only the renderer which makes the viewer
 Penny Lane: It's daft to throw good code away, and the detailed prim torture bits of the LL viewer for example are good, and very difficult to re-implement. Unfortunately, Opensim has got inself into the stupid position of disallowing its devs to examine and learn from the LL code, and everyone suffers from it.
 Orion Hax: the problem to me is its not a technical problem its a social problem, the biggest reason to use LL codebase to be compatible to SL so things can move back and forth, its like asking someone to move from there house to this new place but they cant bring anything with, most people wont do it.
 Static Sprocket: Indeed, not argueing for one vs the other -- although, in my personal case, I won't be touching the LL code, because I simply don't want to deal with C++ {and I suspect that's true of some others too}
 Dahlia Trimble: I've already implemented tortured prims :)
 Justin Clark-Casey: static: oh nor am I - I just like to argue ;)
 Penny Lane: lol
 Justin Clark-Casey: er, although that's a contradiction
 Justin Clark-Casey: yeah C++ - quick I guess but you pay for that in more bgus
 Justin Clark-Casey: bugs
 Dahlia Trimble: I dont mind c++ but I'm kinda rusty
 Starky Rubble: On a fifferent note, Do we have any idea how far through the refactoring project we currently are?
 tx Oh: i touch every code.. but i prefer simple k&r c
 Static Sprocket: Well, when I only have 20 hours to donate, I prefer not to spend 5 of them oil'ing up old skills ;-)
 Penny Lane: You mean Diva/Melanie's latest huge changes?
 Justin Clark-Casey: starky: I would say only Melanie and Diva have a good take on that
 Nas Messing: Hi everyone
 Starky Rubble: yes, I figgered as much
 Dahlia Trimble: k&r <3
 Static Sprocket: I'd say about 6% complete, but das jus me :-P
 Starky Rubble: 6? or 60?
 Nas Messing: Hi all
 Static Sprocket: six
 Justin Clark-Casey: hello Nas
 Starky Rubble: Yipes!
 Penny Lane: I don't recall them giving any estimates. It's be done when it's ready, there is no other way ... unless we want to help :-)
 Penny Lane: It'll*
 Static Sprocket: Then again thats 6% of what I personally think needs to be touched, I'm not sure what Diva and Mel's specific goals are
 Static Sprocket: seems like each week, they add more as they complete others <shrug>
 Penny Lane: It's an ambitious goal, that connector system
 Justin Clark-Casey: static: there's enough refactoring work in OpenSIm to power a city for 1000s of years
 Penny Lane: Hehe
 Nas Messing: doea anyone know Nebadon Izumi
 Starky Rubble: heh
 Dahlia Trimble: sounds familiar
 Robert Graf: lol
 Penny Lane: Never heard of him, right peeps? ;-)
 Carissa Raynier is Offline
 WhiteStar Magic: he is in SecondLife right now at the SL6B event
 Richardus Raymaker: who's he :))
 Starky Rubble: nope... a cipher
 Justin Clark-Casey: Nebadon Izumi - is he like Father Christmas?
 Richardus Raymaker: yes. i go see if i can move there
 Nas Messing: i see
 Nas Messing: tnx
 Starky Rubble: The Easter Egg Bunny
 Justin Clark-Casey: Nas: Seriously, he usually is here
 Justin Clark-Casey: Nas: Look for him in #osgrid on freenode
 Justin Clark-Casey: that's irc
 Static Sprocket: He's one of the admin's for OSGrid
 Philippe Debevec: Hi all
 Starky Rubble: He sould be holding the floor
 Justin Clark-Casey: but instead the floor held him
 Starky Rubble: slurp
 Justin Clark-Casey: actually, he is currently in Second Life as SL6B manning the OpenSimulator booth
 Jamenai Luik: Hi
 Penny Lane: You'll normally find Neb here at 1005 on Tuesdays. By 1010 we've crashed though, and he's gone :P
 Dahlia Trimble: lol
 OtakuMegane Desu: And trying not to move there. Otherwise he crashes apparently lol.
 Richardus Raymaker: region full.
 Nas Messing: yes he is on freenode
 Nas Messing: tnx
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 Justin Clark-Casey: np
 Starky Rubble: Why Nas... do you have a problem?
 Nas Messing: no i just love this speakers
 Starky Rubble: heh
 Penny Lane: lol
 Nas Messing: maybe he will give me some
 Nas Messing: hihi
 Starky Rubble: He will
 Starky Rubble: go look around Zaius Plaza
 WhiteStar Magic: theyh are free to copy
 Starky Rubble: most of his stuff is copyable
 Nas Messing: okey tnx
 Starky Rubble: These are copyable too for that matter
 Penny Lane: Separate from Diva's area, anyone know what the state of Cable Beach is?
 Nas Messing: tnx
 Dahlia Trimble: ask jhurliman
 Penny Lane: Apparently he gave a talk, but I missed it
 Dahlia Trimble: he hangs out on IRC
 Justin Clark-Casey: penny: the metaverse U talk?
 Penny Lane: |Yep
 Penny Lane: I'll google, there's prolly a video
 Justin Clark-Casey: penny: yep, there is a youtube video of a login demo
 Penny Lane: Cool!
 Justin Clark-Casey: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePwvlDZRNh4&feature=channel
 Penny Lane: Thanks JCC
 Justin Clark-Casey: penny: from the sounds of it on the cable beach mailing list, he's currently writing documentation too
 Static Sprocket: what!? Documentation!!! pft
 Justin Clark-Casey: ha ha ha. Shocking, aint it?
 Brent Seidel: <3 documentation
 Penny Lane: He'll get disowned by the Legions of FOSS!
 Dahlia Trimble: ewwwww documentation :(
 Penny Lane: Cable Beach is running in OSgrid, someone mentioned. Is that true?
 Justin Clark-Casey: I believe so - though for some reason they are transitioning back to something more like the vanilla servers bundled in OpenSim
 Dahlia Trimble: some of it may be, ask Adam Frisby
 Justin Clark-Casey: don't know the exact details myself though
 Orion Hax: documentations makes great kindling
 Dahlia Trimble: Adam has hacked up the asset server for osgrid quite a bit
 Penny Lane: LOL. Opensim isn't a project, it's a flock of developers. Nobody really knows where the flock is flying, nor what the goals is .... everyone just flies! ;-)))))
 Penny Lane: Seems to work :P
 Starky Rubble: See you all later, have fun everyone
 Justin Clark-Casey: penny: very true. Works after a fashion :)
 Penny Lane: Cya Starky :-)
 Richardus Raymaker: bye starky
 Dahlia Trimble: laterz Starky :)
 WhiteStar Magic: have a good one Starky
 Justin Clark-Casey: bye Starky
 Dahlia Trimble: I should go to and do my daily rl stuff.. bye all :)
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 Penny Lane: Bye Dahlia, tc :-)
 Justin Clark-Casey: bye Dahl
 Brent Seidel: bye Dahilia
 Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia
 tx Oh: hmm
 Justin Clark-Casey: well, I should be off too. Nice to chat, take care people
 tx Oh: ahoi
 Brent Seidel: bye JCC
 WhiteStar Magic: Take Care Jcc
 Monk Zymurgy: cya justin
 Penny Lane: Infinity said today that she's likely to put OpenID into the OGP spec, despite not liking it, just to provide options. I hope that works out, since Opensim has both types of OpenID in
 Penny Lane: Cya JCC
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 Penny Lane: Anyone here on Hypergrid?
 WhiteStar Magic: yes
 tx Oh: whaf do u mean?
 Penny Lane: I've never found a working one, so would like to have a look :-)
 tx Oh: a hg region?
 Monk Zymurgy: you will have to go out of WP..no HG in this simulator
 WhiteStar Magic: There is a Teleportal for you
 Carissa Raynier is Offline
 Penny Lane accepted your inventory offer.
 Penny Lane accepted your inventory offer.
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 Penny Lane: Thanks WhiteStar!
 WhiteStar Magic: and a fairly up to date but not entirely accurate locations card to put in it
 Monk Zymurgy: tx..is your region HG enabled?
 WhiteStar Magic: none of teh Plaza's are HG enbaled right now
 tx Oh: sure, your too
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 tx Oh: i guess i leave
 Penny Lane: Any idea why they're not?
 Monk Zymurgy: i switched it off..while trying to fix the asset problems
 WhiteStar Magic: troubleshooting issues
 tx Oh: ahoi
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 WhiteStar Magic: assets server now has new IP address and routing a bit different and seems to have solved soem issues
 Monk Zymurgy: i will re-enable it later..HG is great
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 Monk Zymurgy: yeah..my region is much improved..i can get back to LSL scripting
 Penny Lane: I tend to be pushing interop at LL on a daily basis, so I love what's been done with HG. It's so miles ahead of LL thinking.
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 Monk Zymurgy: yeah..the concept of taking your appearance makes better sense to me
 WhiteStar Magic: Divan, Melanie and I chatted about HG and HG 2
 Penny Lane: HG2 is HG+perms?
 WhiteStar Magic: there is some new stuff coming very soon to further enhance / improve HG
 WhiteStar Magic: yes and better hgTP
 Monk Zymurgy: HG seems to have perms now
 WhiteStar Magic: They are incorporating my suggested osGetSimulatorStatus idea into the process
 Penny Lane: I hope the Plazas regain HG soon, as it's a showcase feature.
 Monk Zymurgy: you have to have full perms on objects to pass items from one grid to another
 Orion Hax: asset security is going to be an issue from here on out
 Monk Zymurgy: i think maintaining original perms/creator is most important
 WhiteStar Magic: That is a part of the fix
 Monk Zymurgy: i am not sure if HG keeps creator details intact
 Monk Zymurgy nods
 Monk Zymurgy: cool
 WhiteStar Magic: to reatin teh orifginal creator ID in the item
 WhiteStar Magic: right now it loses it outside of home grid
 Monk Zymurgy nods
 Monk Zymurgy: it seemed a bit borked
 WhiteStar Magic: that also causes reolution issues
 Penny Lane: Not really. Look at the web. Do you see many things secured? Less than 0.1%. The web would fall apart if it weren't full visible. And the way I see it, LL's model of access restrictions for normal objects won't work in the metaverse, because it'll cause widescale breakage.
 WhiteStar Magic: stucjk with loading......
 Monk Zymurgy: just keeping a set of flags..showing who was original maker and there copy intent..seems cool to me
 OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
 WhiteStar Magic: but right now it is losing that info
 Penny Lane: So although currently there is huge preoccupation with perms because of the SL precedent, I don't think that's going to scale to the metaverse. At all. Nobody will be interested in clothes that don't travel with them when they world hop.
 Monk Zymurgy: of course ppl will strip this..but they are a fraudsters
 WhiteStar Magic: we all want our stuff
 Monk Zymurgy: i think overcoming fear is the biggest hurdle..rather than the tech
 OtakuMegane Desu: Obviously.
 OtakuMegane Desu: All in all the tech shouldn't be terribly difficult.
 Penny Lane: I'm not talking about fraudsters. I'm talking about Joe Blogs who travels between worlds and doesn't like losing his pants. Or Annie Blogs. Or her daughters.
 Orion Hax: im not saying everything has to be locked down but resonable mesures
 OtakuMegane Desu: It's getting the people onboard
 WhiteStar Magic: Creator ID, Inistial Perms etc....
 WhiteStar Magic: *Initial
 Monk Zymurgy: SL creator seem afraid of what will happen to thier items after leaving SL...
 Monk Zymurgy: but it will be no different to publishing items within SL
 WhiteStar Magic: if someone wants to rip it, they will ... there are dozens of ways to get around ANY security on ANY system
 Monk Zymurgy: sure
 Penny Lane: There are no such "reasonable measures" on the web, yet it works. Only very special items are locked down, and that's how I think it'll work when the metaverse explodes.
 OtakuMegane Desu: If nothing else, it'd be nice if we could have a creator flag. One thing I dislike currently is even with full perm items you can export from SL, it can't retain the original creator.
 Richardus Raymaker: SL creators want good permissions and some DMCA / protection. that what i know for now
 Monk Zymurgy: yep..flags are a cool feature
 Penny Lane: Sure, SL creators want that. But SL creators are on drugs and completely out to lunch.
 Monk Zymurgy: and then perms can be maintainedif people handle the goods corecctly
 WhiteStar Magic: LOL POenny
 WhiteStar Magic: AGREED !
 OtakuMegane Desu: Being able to retain the creator alone might loosen up a few on SL.
 WhiteStar Magic: Too Much Pixel Crack
 Monk Zymurgy: :)
 Richardus Raymaker: yes. and how bad it sounds. i think LL need to make extra option. so creators can set it full perm but not transferable outside SL with Second Inventory
 OtakuMegane Desu: I don't mind people sharing my stuff around but it is nice if I';m at least still listed as the original maker.
 Richardus Raymaker: then you fix that problem to. if its not set you can expect its ok to use
 Monk Zymurgy: they spoke of this extra perm flag over a year ago
 Monk Zymurgy: nothing comes
 WhiteStar Magic: it's old news actually, going back quite some time
 Monk Zymurgy: yeah
 OtakuMegane Desu: Well, given SL seems to have backed away from the inter-grid ideas, that's not surprising.
 WhiteStar Magic: SL wants to remain closed
 WhiteStar Magic: and they do not really want to share
 Monk Zymurgy: i blame prokofy neva ;-)
 OtakuMegane Desu: Lol
 WhiteStar Magic: they want to sell SL to corporates for Big Bucks
 OtakuMegane Desu: Or rather the technology behind it.
 WhiteStar Magic: That is what I meant
 Penny Lane: Oh yeah, maintaining creator and owner information is great, and the vast majority of honest people will respect it. But actually physically preventing distribution is a lost cause. DRM can't work for obvious reasons, and Joe Blogs won;t buy another pair of pants from a creator once he's experienced pants loss on travel. So I think the future of the metaverse is exactly like that of the web --- 99.9% free to access.
 OtakuMegane Desu: The grid itself is a giant lab full of guinea pigs.
 OtakuMegane Desu: And, at times, seems to hold about as much value to LL. :/
 Monk Zymurgy: aye..verry little point for DRM
 Penny Lane: Those guinea pigs have unfortunately created a mindset among themselves in which everything is restricted. It won't work.
 WhiteStar Magic: really, we need better integration with teh viewer or at minimum an HGurl like SLurl
 OtakuMegane Desu: Nope
 Monk Zymurgy: but SL/OpenSim things are reasonable hard to get at already
 WhiteStar Magic: UsingOpenID / LiveID might solve some other issues
 Richardus Raymaker: DRM. bad word :P gives so many problems for simple things
 OtakuMegane Desu: DRM and limitatioins will keep the honest people honest, but they weren't the problem to begin with.
 WhiteStar Magic: Monk... I have tools that can rip anything if I so choose
 WhiteStar Magic: Others can too
 WhiteStar Magic: just depends on how techie and determined you are
 Monk Zymurgy: yeah..but not everyone has the skill/time/inclination
 OtakuMegane Desu: I don't know of any DRM or encryption scheme that hasn't been broken eventually.
 Penny Lane: You don't design for the commercial pirates, that just gets you into an arms race which you wil never win.
 Richardus Raymaker: but legal tools like SI can do it to... at least it sound legal. but yes the name get wiped
 Carissa Raynier is Offline
 WhiteStar Magic: only safe & secure system is one that is Not Turned on or plugged in
 Penny Lane: Yep
 OtakuMegane Desu: True
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 WhiteStar Magic: People freaked cause Meerkat can backup your objects
 Monk Zymurgy: sure..but if a good multi-grid id could be incorporated SI will adhere to it
 WhiteStar Magic: I have scripts that will do that
 WhiteStar Magic: SI will do that
 WhiteStar Magic: Many things will do that
 OtakuMegane Desu: So can SI and copybot
 OtakuMegane Desu: Nothing new
 WhiteStar Magic: so why the hell can't my Viewer have a simple Backup ?
 Penny Lane: Not seen anyone freak at that. If anything everyones dead glad that the FOSS crowd pulled their fingers out finally, instead of forcing everyone to pay for SI.
 Monk Zymurgy: yes..a 'save as' button for your work would be good
 WhiteStar Magic: Screw SI
 Richardus Raymaker: i know its difficuklt. and its in a fog. but protect things is almost useless. but give them free away sometimes to
 WhiteStar Magic: sorry for the ladies here
 WhiteStar Magic: but they are a PITA
 Orion Hax: the fear i think is not that stuff gets copyed, i think the fear is you build something and set it for sale on one grid only to find it for sale on 3 other grids at half the price by someone thats not you
 OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
 WhiteStar Magic: agreed Orion
 Monk Zymurgy: this will happen i guess
 Penny Lane: SI are leaches, simple as that. Libomv did all the hard work.
 OtakuMegane Desu: Ultimately it comes down to money for many.
 OtakuMegane Desu: A lot probably don't care if their work spreads as long as they still get paid.
 WhiteStar Magic: SLmyInventory is teh base they used to do it
 WhiteStar Magic: and guess what, that works and works well too
 Richardus Raymaker: i need to say some money to pay server here would be nice. but get money in sl is more a big dream
 WhiteStar Magic: and it is FREE
 Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.6.5 (Dev) .9867 (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur)
 Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:True
 Carissa Raynier is Online
 Monk Zymurgy: really .. people should encourage some more groups to come to OpenSim, there are many social groups in SL..and also link to already existing forums, that dont yet utilise 3d space
 Richardus Raymaker: some say clear only for ....
 Richardus Raymaker: i have pick in profile
 Richardus Raymaker: i mean some say, only for sl.
 Penny Lane: Yeah, making money in SL is a bit like making money from iPhone apps or making money as a musician on signing to a label. In all cases it's a dellusion, because for 99.9% of cases, you pay more in costs than you ever actually earn.
 Orion Hax: one thought i have is with the original creator embeded into an item is to have mabey a profile page where there shops are listed and if you see it somewhere else it dosent pass the sniff test
 WhiteStar Magic: well... for peopel to come to OS ... we need stability
 WhiteStar Magic: ease of use
 Penny Lane: Monk: people will come when it's easy to being stuff across. Starting from scratch is painful. And of course when there's stability.
 Monk Zymurgy nods
 Penny Lane: Hehe, exactly
 WhiteStar Magic: we need to have an environment where they have something to do
 Orion Hax: SL is going to become less and less inclinde to let stuff leave there network
 Monk Zymurgy: maybe at some point freeze feature in favour of work towards stability..but, we are still in infancy
 OtakuMegane Desu: And more importanly can do it in. Wihtout crashing.
 WhiteStar Magic: Someone is developing a MMORPG to go ontop of OpenSim
 OtakuMegane Desu: Or losing gravity or something.
 Monk Zymurgy: WhiteStar..that is the kind of thing we need imo
 WhiteStar Magic: yes
 WhiteStar Magic: we do
 WhiteStar Magic: but there are underlying issues
 WhiteStar Magic: for one thing
 Monk Zymurgy: i think standalone works better for this type of project..and thats where HG comes into its own
 WhiteStar Magic: Just something I have been digging into on teh side
 OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
 OtakuMegane Desu: HG is going to play a crucial role in the future
 WhiteStar Magic: is how to change the environment, sky, water, terrains and have teh Server push it instead of it relying on teh viewer
 Penny Lane: LL have no option but to let stuff leave their network now. The reason is that they own xstreet now, and they get a commission for every sale of SI on xstreet. As a result, they can't claim that transferring items off SL is against the ToS when they are earning money from the massive sale of a tool that is used for that.
 WhiteStar Magic: Imagine a Sci-Fi Sim with Weird Planetary views, and red waters and more
 OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah. Some more control server-side for environment might be nice.
 Monk Zymurgy: maybe LL will incorporate windlight setting into the estate settings
 WhiteStar Magic: but we shoudl really consider moving Physics to teh viewer and not have teh server do it
 Monk Zymurgy: might be a bit early to build it into OS, if we will be using lindens viewer
 Penny Lane: "You can't only transfer items off SL to open grids if you use the tool that gives us a commision" is not going to stand up in court.
 Penny Lane: can*
 WhiteStar Magic: The server shoudl just be info transfer not function calculation and math
 OtakuMegane Desu: WhiteStar: There's one problem though.
 WhiteStar Magic: but LL code can;t do it
 OtakuMegane Desu: Coordinating the information for physics calculation isn't a tiny bit of data
 Richardus Raymaker: monkyz, that makes it much beter for many servers. and also makes the memory load lower i hope
 WhiteStar Magic: Every real Game System does it on Client
 WhiteStar Magic: SL does it on server
 Brent Seidel: So, what if my client and your client come up with different physics solutions?
 Orion Hax: but that also keeps the client footprint down as well when its on the server
 Monk Zymurgy nods..at the expense of accurate scenes..each client may have a different view of the scene
 WhiteStar Magic: Picture running an MRM on your server and it is doing the vehickles and executing the physicfs... no region bouandaries if all regions are on same server
 Penny Lane: WhiteStar: devolve physics computations to the viewer, yes, just as a way to harness client power. But the region has to be in ultimate charge, since a sim represents a single physical simulation.
 Monk Zymurgy: or thats how i saw it in online games
 paulie Flomar: It would have to be some version of "physics at home" (like folding at home) where clients can help crunch physics data and send ti to the server. The server would have final say.
 OtakuMegane Desu: Most game systems just have to coordinate the location of objects. This would be closer to playing say Street Fighter online. The latency and bandwidth needed for coordinating so much information at high speeds could mkae it horrible.
 paulie Flomar: yeah.
 WhiteStar Magic: and it's good now ?
 Penny Lane: Can't have one client decide there's been a collision with another, when that other says otherwise. The sim has to be authoritative in that
 WhiteStar Magic: There has to be a server control module yes
 WhiteStar Magic: and 2 way traffic
 WhiteStar Magic: coordinator
 OtakuMegane Desu: No, but at present levels distributing the full physics systemn would be even worse.
 Orion Hax: it would be a disaster
 paulie Flomar: this video (of dirt racing) is kewl. :)
 OtakuMegane Desu: There may be some parts of the physics calculations that could be offloaded to clients. But most is still going to have to be on the server.
 Penny Lane: Not all a disaster. Only some aspects of physics have high realtime requirements.
 WhiteStar Magic: agreed
 WhiteStar Magic: but there is better ways to split the load and response
 OtakuMegane Desu: True
 WhiteStar Magic: and take some of the stuff off teh server
 Orion Hax: i think a better idea would be to make use of a server side GFX card
 OtakuMegane Desu: Other things like working on asset distribution would help for server load too.
 WhiteStar Magic: but we come back to being dependent on teh LL Viewer base "for now"
 OtakuMegane Desu: Everything goes through the region then to the client right now, correct?
 WhiteStar Magic: yep
 WhiteStar Magic: pretty much
 OtakuMegane Desu: See, that's...silly when you think about it.
 WhiteStar Magic: it's a choike point
 OtakuMegane Desu: Why not download assets direct from grid to client and the regions simply tells the client where things go?
 Penny Lane: Yep, it's gotta be done. SL's sims are not scalable because they don't attempt any parallelism or devolving computations, and that's how LL wants it, because they sell more sims. But Opensim doesn't want to go there --- we need scalable sim technology.
 paulie Flomar: client P2P? :)
 WhiteStar Magic: agredd 125% Penny
 WhiteStar Magic: There are good working P2P models now
 WhiteStar Magic: even Solaris can kick butt and do more
 WhiteStar Magic: and it is P2P
 WhiteStar Magic: but it has major limits we don;t
 Penny Lane: Is anyone running Opensim on OpenSolaris?
 OtakuMegane Desu: Example: You have a box with a texture. The region tell the client the box's parameters and the UUID of the texture and that's that. The client then does the rest of the work downloading things from the gird's asset server.
 Penny Lane: Heh, I don't actually know if Mono runs on OpenSolaris
 OtakuMegane Desu: grid*
 Penny Lane: Otaku: yeah, that's the Cable Beach model
 WhiteStar Magic: http://www.solipsis.org/
 paulie Flomar: even LL is moving to textures over HTTP, probably from various sources...
 WhiteStar Magic: is what I meant ,.... no solaris
 Penny Lane: I know Solipsis, Jesrad told us about it on MMOX
 Richardus Raymaker: how long can the keep things save if the start already to download textures frome verywhere
 WhiteStar Magic: Worlds and several other platdforms pull textures from teh web
 WhiteStar Magic: wow Major Chat Lag
 OtakuMegane Desu: I think you have it right for why LL designed things the way they did, Penny. And possibly some degree of laziness just like originally storing everything as blobs in the database.
 Penny Lane: Richardus: keeping things safe and scaling the metaverse aren't on the same game plan :P
 Penny Lane: Is Wright about to take a dive?
 Orion Hax: most likely
 WhiteStar Magic: wasn't it about a year, yr & a half ao the opic of stuffing a lot of assets on HTTP servers and setting keys for access to peopel started ?
 Richardus Raymaker: ilooks like
 OtakuMegane Desu: I wonder...if you took the region out of the constant stream of asset data, how many avatars might you be able to support, then?
 OtakuMegane Desu: Proibably
 Penny Lane: Otaku: certainly a lot more!
 WhiteStar Magic: likely a lot mnore
 WhiteStar Magic: NZ is testing an idea with his collectiosn of regions by splitting out the MySql DBS
 Orion Hax: my thought would be to use amazon cloud as a service and people pay for however much storage they use
 Penny Lane: Why the poor little non-scalable sim CPU is dealing with asset downloads, running scripts, and vicinity chat and IM is anybody's guess. Designer on drugs? ;-)
 Penny Lane: Or LL just wants to sell more sims ...
 Orion Hax: or both
 Penny Lane: Heh
 WhiteStar Magic: on cheap, lame hardware that doesn;t work
 OtakuMegane Desu: Lag letting up a bit?
 Penny Lane: Yeah, we'll probably be meeting up in LBSA shortly
 OtakuMegane Desu: Until we manage to lag it into obblivion too. Then it's on to Zaius! Hahaha
 WhiteStar Magic: I think... Honestly, splitting teh MySql System to another Server on it;'s own, allowing access to OpenSim Servers via a backbone Ethernt would certainly improve the capability
 Richardus Raymaker: -
 Richardus Raymaker: if LL want to sell more sims, then simple solution is to drop the price and tier with 50%
 OtakuMegane Desu: I'm thinking the core structure of asset delivery and region coordination is going to have to change eventually. A lot.
 Richardus Raymaker: and think more to customers
 Penny Lane: A sim crawl. It's like a pub crawl where you drink every pub dry, but in this case you consume all the sim resources until they crash, and head for the next one :P
 WhiteStar Magic: Have you looked at Land for Sale in SL lately ?
 Orion Hax: back to physics can we have a set of server side GFX cards process the massive amount of calculations instead of trying to divy it up
 OtakuMegane Desu: Not gonna be easy though
 Richardus Raymaker: must be posisble. not sure if works for linux. i know for windows its possible.
 nurbsPlane9: DynamicTextureModule: Error preparing image using URL http://grid.bubblecloud.org/~osoperator/osgrid_central_osgrid.jpg
 OtakuMegane Desu: Orion: That WOULD be immensely helpful. Especially since a graphics card on a remote server would usually have nothing else to do.
 OtakuMegane Desu: It's certainly possible. But there's not been large enough interest till more recently.
 Orion Hax: the reason i ask is nvidias new toy the tesla computational card
 Orion Hax: some 960 stream processors
 OtakuMegane Desu: Nice
 WhiteStar Magic: but the data still has to be pushed down the wire to the client to run it there
 OtakuMegane Desu: If you could utilize a graphic card for physics though, that'd give vast amounts of headroom compared to what we have now
 Richardus Raymaker: test
 Penny Lane: Instead of buying a hot graphics card for the sim, buy a PS3. Those SPUs are extremely fast, and really wiped the floor on Folding@Home with all other clients. Physics calculation would be ideally suited.
 OtakuMegane Desu: Spend a couple hundred to stick a 4850 in a server rather than a couple thousand buying a second one to handle the CPU loads.
 Richardus Raymaker: dont tell me 4-20Mbit down is not enough ?
 Monk Zymurgy: ps3 runs linux .. would be an interesting project
 Richardus Raymaker: upload. uhmm. opensim at home is anyway not so good
 OtakuMegane Desu: You need to assume about 1mbps per avatar to be safe.
 Penny Lane: Monk: just the physics, not Opensim --- not enough memory for Mono on PS3
 Orion Hax: that was my thought is its not any one process hoseing the system its a 1000 little ones
 WhiteStar Magic: the code is getting less and less performant
 OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
 Monk Zymurgy: ah..has anyone tried to run a client on ps3..i want to try
 OtakuMegane Desu: Tat's something we need to keep an eye on. Opensim development has become freature-creeping lately rather than optimizing what we have.
 Monk Zymurgy nods
 Penny Lane: Not enough memory, nor is there access to the GPU on PS3
 Monk Zymurgy: aww
 WhiteStar Magic: I've been noticing it and so have manyothersthat things are slowing down and getting fatter
 Monk Zymurgy: maybe i will not try then
 OtakuMegane Desu: It actually seems LESS robust than it was. Used to be we were pushing 30+ avatars on this meeting but now it's having trouble in the 20s again
 WhiteStar Magic: there ae issues on this and LBSA regions
 OtakuMegane Desu: The problem with consoles is they actually tend to be very skimpy on RAM.
 Richardus Raymaker: and thats the cheapest part.
 Richardus Raymaker: whats in a console this days ? 512MB ? 2 GB ?
 Monk Zymurgy: not sure richardus..i just had a little fun setting up yellow dog linux on a friends ps3
 Monk Zymurgy: good meeting..but i must run..take care and see you all around :)
 WhiteStar Magic: see ya Monkz
 Brent Seidel: Bye monk
 Richardus Raymaker: bye monks
 WhiteStar Magic: gonna head out to
 WhiteStar Magic: have a good one everuyone
 Brent Seidel: Bye WhiteStar

Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-23

2009-07-05T16:00:33Z

DaveCoyle: 2009-06-23 log. thanks Whitestar!

Justin Clark-Casey: penny: I think the people to really talk to about this are Nebadon and Charles. They run this meeting nowadays
Starky Rubble: There's also the question of resources
Master Dubrovna: I think people at LBSA and here overloaded things this time
Penny Lane: They were running it ... until it crashed. :P Vicious circle
Monk Zymurgy: hi OtakuMegane
Carissa Raynier: hi everyone
Starky Rubble: all the plazzs are on one of two servers AFIK
Justin Clark-Casey: hmm, if this is your only opportunity to talk to them then that is a little problematic :) You could also try taking the temperature on this topic on the opensim-dev list
Carissa Raynier is Online
OtakuMegane Desu: Hey
Orion Hax: might a suggest for large meetings to use a sim with less of a prim/script load
Penny Lane: JCC: I'll talk to CK. He probably doesn't appreciate being cut off in mid sentence every week.
Starky Rubble: prolly not lol
Penny Lane: Proper stress tests would be cool, btw
Starky Rubble: I like to attend for the social aspect but mostly for the background info on current dev thinking
Penny Lane: Actually looking at the metrics as the load rises, plotting the graphs etc
Justin Clark-Casey: intel have done some work on this kind of thing in a controlled manner
Penny Lane: What you don't measure you don't really know.
Starky Rubble: there are graphs in the corner over there
Penny Lane: JCC: you mean John?
Justin Clark-Casey: no, dslake
Penny Lane: Ta
Kitto Flora: Right Penny. A stress test that does not gather data and have a path to dealing with problems encountered is of little use.
Penny Lane: And I'm up for social gathering and chewing the rag too. ;-) But those things sometimes conflict :-)
Starky Rubble: sure
Richardus Raymaker: hi starky
Kitto Flora asks his usual question: Anyone here working on server ode physics/vehicles? (Yes I kow 'teravus is').
Starky Rubble: Hey Richardus
Dahlia Trimble: not lately
Justin Clark-Casey: I believe somebody from IBM made a small change recently
Justin Clark-Casey: but yeah, nothing apart from that
Penny Lane waves at Dahlia :-)
Starky Rubble: hee - I always say Kitto Flora is...
Dahlia Trimble waves back :)
WhiteStar Magic: I believe that Snowcrash has a coupleof ideas in regards to using MRM and Vehicle Movements
WhiteStar Magic: we were discussing that along with a few other items yesterday
Kitto Flora: Where, ShiteStar?
Kitto Flora: White...
OtakuMegane Desu: Lawl
WhiteStar Magic: in one of teh IRC's
Brent Seidel: :-O
WhiteStar Magic: snow is making up a few MRM based courses for people
Kitto Flora: Pse expand MRM
Starky Rubble: for the C# cvlasses?
WhiteStar Magic: Adam MRM Mini Region MOdule
Wordfromthe Wise: i will try that
WhiteStar Magic: http://www.adamfrisby.com/blog/tag/mrm/
WhiteStar Magic: save that till later
Starky Rubble: Hi Static!
Wordfromthe Wise: i just run the official 9841
Dahlia Trimble: anyone try the snowglobe viewer with opensim yet?
WhiteStar Magic: Not yet... still playing with Meerkat
paulie Flomar: :)
WhiteStar Magic: I was gonna install snowglobe this week and play with it
Dahlia Trimble: I use it with SL but I've been using emerald with opensim lately
Static Sprocket: Ello Starky
paulie Flomar: Happeh SL6B!
Penny Lane: I'm on Snowglobe on SL currently.
tx Oh: what so new with snowglobe?
Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: emerald is another viewer flavour?
Penny Lane: I've found a few crash problems, but nothing major
Dahlia Trimble: emerald has some nice building and radar features
tx Oh: i mean why should i try snowglobe?
Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.6.5 (Dev) .9867 (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur)
Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:True
Dahlia Trimble: snowglobe seems to have a higher FPS and loads textures faster but bump maps dont work
Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: seems to be invisible to Google :) Is that a Linden codename or just the name of somebody else's viewer branch?
Penny Lane: Nothing particularly new with Snowglobe, other than the map textures coming straight from S3 over HTTP. But it's supposedly a more open LL viewer, in the sense that there are a select number of residents with commit access to the LL SVN for it.
tx Oh: i would like to see bumpmap applied by user textures
Dahlia Trimble: snowglobe is that open source viewer that Philip is sponsoring
Justin Clark-Casey: Dahlia; I meant emerald rather than snowglobe
WhiteStar Magic: based on LL code ?
Justin Clark-Casey: Penny: any sense of how that is going? Co-operation working well there?
Dahlia Trimble: oh lemme try to find the emerald link
Brent Seidel: Look for GreenLife Emerald Viewer
Justin Clark-Casey: got it. thanks brent, dahlia
Penny Lane: Only two residents currently have commit access. Yeah, it's just the LL viewer with more patches and a less onerous acceptance path .... allegedly
Justin Clark-Casey: only two? Oh, I thought it was more than that
Penny Lane: JCC: cooperation is going very well atm, but it's early days. So far the LL people who vet patches haven't said "No"
Richardus Raymaker is Online
Penny Lane: They will start rejecting patches of course. The big question is when ... at the slightest hint of divergence from LL's plans? Or will it be more flexible? Who knows
tx Oh: i like to know when the next hippo will be there. as far as i know the obscure 4096 tp limit is eliminated
Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, that's the issue that interests me, esp. if people try to start to generalize things more for non Linden servers such as OpenSim
Dahlia Trimble: heh at one time I had some stepping store regions set up on osgrid so I could tp between my islands and WP
Dahlia Trimble: *stone
WhiteStar Magic: well... are we Linden Server or not ? Why remain anchored in teh concrete galoshes of LL code ?
Penny Lane: There's a good likelihood that OGP stuff will go into Snowglobe early. That's not particularly interesting though, since OGP is so threadbare currently.
paulie Flomar: HG ftw!
Dahlia Trimble: heh we need grider in snowglobe :)
Monk Zymurgy: paulie : +1
paulie Flomar: Anyone playuing with Meerkat viewer?
Penny Lane: White: we're not anchored to SL at all. The only problem is that we don't really have our own viewer (despite many future candidates), plus the fact that the peeps who use Opensim actually want compatibility with SL.
Dahlia Trimble: tried it
Maik Galaxy: yes, it a nice stable viewer..
Penny Lane: Meerkat's interesting, but for me on Linux, very flakey.
Justin Clark-Casey: don't underestimate the amount of weight that existing SL code has
Justin Clark-Casey: and its mindshare
tx Oh: i get dizzy with all this viewer names droped in
Justin Clark-Casey: and the fact that they have paid developers :)
Dahlia Trimble: we have Idealist but the momentum seems to be lacking
Maik Galaxy: the gemini-viewer is nice for builders
tx Oh: i made me an own viewer, just for machinema
Penny Lane: Would be great if there were a concerted push for our own viewer. Idealist certainly sounds likea great candidate.
tx Oh: it's not linux compatible nor mac
Dahlia Trimble: it runs on linux
Dahlia Trimble: should run on a mac
Penny Lane: tx meant his own viewer :-)
tx Oh: sure? with wine?
Brent Seidel: That's the thing. Any "OpenSim" viewer would have to support Window, Linux, and MacOS.
Dahlia Trimble: idealist should run natively
Maik Galaxy: own viewer based on meerkat
tx Oh: my viewer is linux only :-)
Dahlia Trimble: well not natively, it would require mono and possibley X
Penny Lane: HGehe
Penny Lane: libc probably helps too
Richardus Raymaker: wine is not nice. small font. dont like to run viewer under emulator or something like that
tx Oh: oh got, more mono.
Richardus Raymaker: besides that, wine is not stable with SL viewer.
Richardus Raymaker: noo, not again mono ! :P
Dahlia Trimble <3 mono
Penny Lane: Wine isn't stable with anything, really. Even when it works with something, you upgrade either Wine or the app and it's broken again.
tx Oh: i think the hippo is cool. why not support that in a way?
Richardus Raymaker: right penny. but iwould not make it worser
Dahlia Trimble: hippo is cool but it's derived from the LL codebase
Penny Lane: Wine will never be stable, simply because it's chasing Microsoft's tail lights, and that's an impossible tastk.
tx Oh: so what? ll viewer is gpl'ed
Dahlia Trimble: :)
Richardus Raymaker: which form ? bsd ? gnu ?
Justin Clark-Casey: I gather the issue is the complexity of the LL codebase and the difficulty in adapting it
Penny Lane: Some people have a religious problem with GPL. Not engineering, religion.
Justin Clark-Casey: well, and license too, arguably
tx Oh: i love gpl, i love debian
Dahlia Trimble: I think the GPL issue is the desire to use opensim commercially rather than religious
Static Sprocket: I suspect some developers also have issues with the archetecture of the LL viewers, and would prefer to start from scratch <shrug>
Richardus Raymaker: i loe linux
Penny Lane: Yeah, that's true, lot of arch problems there.
Justin Clark-Casey: static: developerse always love to start from scratch. But a lot of man years have gone into the LL veiewer
WhiteStar Magic: /??
Richardus Raymaker: how long is opensim now ? 2 years ?
tx Oh: thats what i mean. it's hard to stomp something of the ground
Justin Clark-Casey: two and a bit
Dahlia Trimble: well Idealist can display collada content alongside prims and sculpties in the same scene, How long would it take the LL viewer to be modified to do that?
Static Sprocket: Based on previous projects I've worked on, sometimes it takes even more man hours to fully understand an existing project's code, and then adapt it to your goals, then it would take to start from scratch.
WhiteStar Magic: will LL give out the new code to SL 2 when it arrives ?
Richardus Raymaker: right, and see how hhard it is to get opensim good.
Static Sprocket: The man hours arguement is valid however if your goals are minor changes, or changes spread out over a long period of time
Justin Clark-Casey: Static: that's true. Though often the reimplementers end up just repeating the mistakes of the original :)
Richardus Raymaker: SL2 ? i missed something
tx Oh: it's not only the renderer which makes the viewer
Penny Lane: It's daft to throw good code away, and the detailed prim torture bits of the LL viewer for example are good, and very difficult to re-implement. Unfortunately, Opensim has got inself into the stupid position of disallowing its devs to examine and learn from the LL code, and everyone suffers from it.
Orion Hax: the problem to me is its not a technical problem its a social problem, the biggest reason to use LL codebase to be compatible to SL so things can move back and forth, its like asking someone to move from there house to this new place but they cant bring anything with, most people wont do it.
Static Sprocket: Indeed, not argueing for one vs the other -- although, in my personal case, I won't be touching the LL code, because I simply don't want to deal with C++ {and I suspect that's true of some others too}
Dahlia Trimble: I've already implemented tortured prims :)
Justin Clark-Casey: static: oh nor am I - I just like to argue ;)
Penny Lane: lol
Justin Clark-Casey: er, although that's a contradiction
Justin Clark-Casey: yeah C++ - quick I guess but you pay for that in more bgus
Justin Clark-Casey: bugs
Dahlia Trimble: I dont mind c++ but I'm kinda rusty
Starky Rubble: On a fifferent note, Do we have any idea how far through the refactoring project we currently are?
tx Oh: i touch every code.. but i prefer simple k&r c
Static Sprocket: Well, when I only have 20 hours to donate, I prefer not to spend 5 of them oil'ing up old skills ;-)
Penny Lane: You mean Diva/Melanie's latest huge changes?
Justin Clark-Casey: starky: I would say only Melanie and Diva have a good take on that
Nas Messing: Hi everyone
Starky Rubble: yes, I figgered as much
Dahlia Trimble: k&r <3
Static Sprocket: I'd say about 6% complete, but das jus me :-P
Starky Rubble: 6? or 60?
Nas Messing: Hi all
Static Sprocket: six
Justin Clark-Casey: hello Nas
Starky Rubble: Yipes!
Penny Lane: I don't recall them giving any estimates. It's be done when it's ready, there is no other way ... unless we want to help :-)
Penny Lane: It'll*
Static Sprocket: Then again thats 6% of what I personally think needs to be touched, I'm not sure what Diva and Mel's specific goals are
Static Sprocket: seems like each week, they add more as they complete others <shrug>
Penny Lane: It's an ambitious goal, that connector system
Justin Clark-Casey: static: there's enough refactoring work in OpenSIm to power a city for 1000s of years
Penny Lane: Hehe
Nas Messing: doea anyone know Nebadon Izumi
Starky Rubble: heh
Dahlia Trimble: sounds familiar
Robert Graf: lol
Penny Lane: Never heard of him, right peeps? ;-)
Carissa Raynier is Offline
WhiteStar Magic: he is in SecondLife right now at the SL6B event
Richardus Raymaker: who's he :))
Starky Rubble: nope... a cipher
Justin Clark-Casey: Nebadon Izumi - is he like Father Christmas?
Richardus Raymaker: yes. i go see if i can move there
Nas Messing: i see
Nas Messing: tnx
Starky Rubble: The Easter Egg Bunny
Justin Clark-Casey: Nas: Seriously, he usually is here
Justin Clark-Casey: Nas: Look for him in #osgrid on freenode
Justin Clark-Casey: that's irc
Static Sprocket: He's one of the admin's for OSGrid
Philippe Debevec: Hi all
Starky Rubble: He sould be holding the floor
Justin Clark-Casey: but instead the floor held him
Starky Rubble: slurp
Justin Clark-Casey: actually, he is currently in Second Life as SL6B manning the OpenSimulator booth
Jamenai Luik: Hi
Penny Lane: You'll normally find Neb here at 1005 on Tuesdays. By 1010 we've crashed though, and he's gone :P
Dahlia Trimble: lol
OtakuMegane Desu: And trying not to move there. Otherwise he crashes apparently lol.
Richardus Raymaker: region full.
Nas Messing: yes he is on freenode
Nas Messing: tnx
Carissa Raynier is Online
Justin Clark-Casey: np
Starky Rubble: Why Nas... do you have a problem?
Nas Messing: no i just love this speakers
Starky Rubble: heh
Penny Lane: lol
Nas Messing: maybe he will give me some
Nas Messing: hihi
Starky Rubble: He will
Starky Rubble: go look around Zaius Plaza
WhiteStar Magic: theyh are free to copy
Starky Rubble: most of his stuff is copyable
Nas Messing: okey tnx
Starky Rubble: These are copyable too for that matter
Penny Lane: Separate from Diva's area, anyone know what the state of Cable Beach is?
Nas Messing: tnx
Dahlia Trimble: ask jhurliman
Penny Lane: Apparently he gave a talk, but I missed it
Dahlia Trimble: he hangs out on IRC
Justin Clark-Casey: penny: the metaverse U talk?
Penny Lane: |Yep
Penny Lane: I'll google, there's prolly a video
Justin Clark-Casey: penny: yep, there is a youtube video of a login demo
Penny Lane: Cool!
Justin Clark-Casey: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePwvlDZRNh4&feature=channel
Penny Lane: Thanks JCC
Justin Clark-Casey: penny: from the sounds of it on the cable beach mailing list, he's currently writing documentation too
Static Sprocket: what!? Documentation!!! pft
Justin Clark-Casey: ha ha ha. Shocking, aint it?
Brent Seidel: <3 documentation
Penny Lane: He'll get disowned by the Legions of FOSS!
Dahlia Trimble: ewwwww documentation :(
Penny Lane: Cable Beach is running in OSgrid, someone mentioned. Is that true?
Justin Clark-Casey: I believe so - though for some reason they are transitioning back to something more like the vanilla servers bundled in OpenSim
Dahlia Trimble: some of it may be, ask Adam Frisby
Justin Clark-Casey: don't know the exact details myself though
Orion Hax: documentations makes great kindling
Dahlia Trimble: Adam has hacked up the asset server for osgrid quite a bit
Penny Lane: LOL. Opensim isn't a project, it's a flock of developers. Nobody really knows where the flock is flying, nor what the goals is .... everyone just flies! ;-)))))
Penny Lane: Seems to work :P
Starky Rubble: See you all later, have fun everyone
Justin Clark-Casey: penny: very true. Works after a fashion :)
Penny Lane: Cya Starky :-)
Richardus Raymaker: bye starky
Dahlia Trimble: laterz Starky :)
WhiteStar Magic: have a good one Starky
Justin Clark-Casey: bye Starky
Dahlia Trimble: I should go to and do my daily rl stuff.. bye all :)
Carissa Raynier is Online
Penny Lane: Bye Dahlia, tc :-)
Justin Clark-Casey: bye Dahl
Brent Seidel: bye Dahilia
Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia
tx Oh: hmm
Justin Clark-Casey: well, I should be off too. Nice to chat, take care people
tx Oh: ahoi
Brent Seidel: bye JCC
WhiteStar Magic: Take Care Jcc
Monk Zymurgy: cya justin
Penny Lane: Infinity said today that she's likely to put OpenID into the OGP spec, despite not liking it, just to provide options. I hope that works out, since Opensim has both types of OpenID in
Penny Lane: Cya JCC
Carissa Raynier is Online
Penny Lane: Anyone here on Hypergrid?
WhiteStar Magic: yes
tx Oh: whaf do u mean?
Penny Lane: I've never found a working one, so would like to have a look :-)
tx Oh: a hg region?
Monk Zymurgy: you will have to go out of WP..no HG in this simulator
WhiteStar Magic: There is a Teleportal for you
Carissa Raynier is Offline
Penny Lane accepted your inventory offer.
Penny Lane accepted your inventory offer.
Carissa Raynier is Online
Penny Lane: Thanks WhiteStar!
WhiteStar Magic: and a fairly up to date but not entirely accurate locations card to put in it
Monk Zymurgy: tx..is your region HG enabled?
WhiteStar Magic: none of teh Plaza's are HG enbaled right now
tx Oh: sure, your too
Carissa Raynier is Offline
tx Oh: i guess i leave
Penny Lane: Any idea why they're not?
Monk Zymurgy: i switched it off..while trying to fix the asset problems
WhiteStar Magic: troubleshooting issues
tx Oh: ahoi
Carissa Raynier is Online
WhiteStar Magic: assets server now has new IP address and routing a bit different and seems to have solved soem issues
Monk Zymurgy: i will re-enable it later..HG is great
Carissa Raynier is Offline
Monk Zymurgy: yeah..my region is much improved..i can get back to LSL scripting
Penny Lane: I tend to be pushing interop at LL on a daily basis, so I love what's been done with HG. It's so miles ahead of LL thinking.
Carissa Raynier is Online
Monk Zymurgy: yeah..the concept of taking your appearance makes better sense to me
WhiteStar Magic: Divan, Melanie and I chatted about HG and HG 2
Penny Lane: HG2 is HG+perms?
WhiteStar Magic: there is some new stuff coming very soon to further enhance / improve HG
WhiteStar Magic: yes and better hgTP
Monk Zymurgy: HG seems to have perms now
WhiteStar Magic: They are incorporating my suggested osGetSimulatorStatus idea into the process
Penny Lane: I hope the Plazas regain HG soon, as it's a showcase feature.
Monk Zymurgy: you have to have full perms on objects to pass items from one grid to another
Orion Hax: asset security is going to be an issue from here on out
Monk Zymurgy: i think maintaining original perms/creator is most important
WhiteStar Magic: That is a part of the fix
Monk Zymurgy: i am not sure if HG keeps creator details intact
Monk Zymurgy nods
Monk Zymurgy: cool
WhiteStar Magic: to reatin teh orifginal creator ID in the item
WhiteStar Magic: right now it loses it outside of home grid
Monk Zymurgy nods
Monk Zymurgy: it seemed a bit borked
WhiteStar Magic: that also causes reolution issues
Penny Lane: Not really. Look at the web. Do you see many things secured? Less than 0.1%. The web would fall apart if it weren't full visible. And the way I see it, LL's model of access restrictions for normal objects won't work in the metaverse, because it'll cause widescale breakage.
WhiteStar Magic: stucjk with loading......
Monk Zymurgy: just keeping a set of flags..showing who was original maker and there copy intent..seems cool to me
OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
WhiteStar Magic: but right now it is losing that info
Penny Lane: So although currently there is huge preoccupation with perms because of the SL precedent, I don't think that's going to scale to the metaverse. At all. Nobody will be interested in clothes that don't travel with them when they world hop.
Monk Zymurgy: of course ppl will strip this..but they are a fraudsters
WhiteStar Magic: we all want our stuff
Monk Zymurgy: i think overcoming fear is the biggest hurdle..rather than the tech
OtakuMegane Desu: Obviously.
OtakuMegane Desu: All in all the tech shouldn't be terribly difficult.
Penny Lane: I'm not talking about fraudsters. I'm talking about Joe Blogs who travels between worlds and doesn't like losing his pants. Or Annie Blogs. Or her daughters.
Orion Hax: im not saying everything has to be locked down but resonable mesures
OtakuMegane Desu: It's getting the people onboard
WhiteStar Magic: Creator ID, Inistial Perms etc....
WhiteStar Magic: *Initial
Monk Zymurgy: SL creator seem afraid of what will happen to thier items after leaving SL...
Monk Zymurgy: but it will be no different to publishing items within SL
WhiteStar Magic: if someone wants to rip it, they will ... there are dozens of ways to get around ANY security on ANY system
Monk Zymurgy: sure
Penny Lane: There are no such "reasonable measures" on the web, yet it works. Only very special items are locked down, and that's how I think it'll work when the metaverse explodes.
OtakuMegane Desu: If nothing else, it'd be nice if we could have a creator flag. One thing I dislike currently is even with full perm items you can export from SL, it can't retain the original creator.
Richardus Raymaker: SL creators want good permissions and some DMCA / protection. that what i know for now
Monk Zymurgy: yep..flags are a cool feature
Penny Lane: Sure, SL creators want that. But SL creators are on drugs and completely out to lunch.
Monk Zymurgy: and then perms can be maintainedif people handle the goods corecctly
WhiteStar Magic: LOL POenny
WhiteStar Magic: AGREED !
OtakuMegane Desu: Being able to retain the creator alone might loosen up a few on SL.
WhiteStar Magic: Too Much Pixel Crack
Monk Zymurgy: :)
Richardus Raymaker: yes. and how bad it sounds. i think LL need to make extra option. so creators can set it full perm but not transferable outside SL with Second Inventory
OtakuMegane Desu: I don't mind people sharing my stuff around but it is nice if I';m at least still listed as the original maker.
Richardus Raymaker: then you fix that problem to. if its not set you can expect its ok to use
Monk Zymurgy: they spoke of this extra perm flag over a year ago
Monk Zymurgy: nothing comes
WhiteStar Magic: it's old news actually, going back quite some time
Monk Zymurgy: yeah
OtakuMegane Desu: Well, given SL seems to have backed away from the inter-grid ideas, that's not surprising.
WhiteStar Magic: SL wants to remain closed
WhiteStar Magic: and they do not really want to share
Monk Zymurgy: i blame prokofy neva ;-)
OtakuMegane Desu: Lol
WhiteStar Magic: they want to sell SL to corporates for Big Bucks
OtakuMegane Desu: Or rather the technology behind it.
WhiteStar Magic: That is what I meant
Penny Lane: Oh yeah, maintaining creator and owner information is great, and the vast majority of honest people will respect it. But actually physically preventing distribution is a lost cause. DRM can't work for obvious reasons, and Joe Blogs won;t buy another pair of pants from a creator once he's experienced pants loss on travel. So I think the future of the metaverse is exactly like that of the web --- 99.9% free to access.
OtakuMegane Desu: The grid itself is a giant lab full of guinea pigs.
OtakuMegane Desu: And, at times, seems to hold about as much value to LL. :/
Monk Zymurgy: aye..verry little point for DRM
Penny Lane: Those guinea pigs have unfortunately created a mindset among themselves in which everything is restricted. It won't work.
WhiteStar Magic: really, we need better integration with teh viewer or at minimum an HGurl like SLurl
OtakuMegane Desu: Nope
Monk Zymurgy: but SL/OpenSim things are reasonable hard to get at already
WhiteStar Magic: UsingOpenID / LiveID might solve some other issues
Richardus Raymaker: DRM. bad word :P gives so many problems for simple things
OtakuMegane Desu: DRM and limitatioins will keep the honest people honest, but they weren't the problem to begin with.
WhiteStar Magic: Monk... I have tools that can rip anything if I so choose
WhiteStar Magic: Others can too
WhiteStar Magic: just depends on how techie and determined you are
Monk Zymurgy: yeah..but not everyone has the skill/time/inclination
OtakuMegane Desu: I don't know of any DRM or encryption scheme that hasn't been broken eventually.
Penny Lane: You don't design for the commercial pirates, that just gets you into an arms race which you wil never win.
Richardus Raymaker: but legal tools like SI can do it to... at least it sound legal. but yes the name get wiped
Carissa Raynier is Offline
WhiteStar Magic: only safe & secure system is one that is Not Turned on or plugged in
Penny Lane: Yep
OtakuMegane Desu: True
Carissa Raynier is Online
WhiteStar Magic: People freaked cause Meerkat can backup your objects
Monk Zymurgy: sure..but if a good multi-grid id could be incorporated SI will adhere to it
WhiteStar Magic: I have scripts that will do that
WhiteStar Magic: SI will do that
WhiteStar Magic: Many things will do that
OtakuMegane Desu: So can SI and copybot
OtakuMegane Desu: Nothing new
WhiteStar Magic: so why the hell can't my Viewer have a simple Backup ?
Penny Lane: Not seen anyone freak at that. If anything everyones dead glad that the FOSS crowd pulled their fingers out finally, instead of forcing everyone to pay for SI.
Monk Zymurgy: yes..a 'save as' button for your work would be good
WhiteStar Magic: Screw SI
Richardus Raymaker: i know its difficuklt. and its in a fog. but protect things is almost useless. but give them free away sometimes to
WhiteStar Magic: sorry for the ladies here
WhiteStar Magic: but they are a PITA
Orion Hax: the fear i think is not that stuff gets copyed, i think the fear is you build something and set it for sale on one grid only to find it for sale on 3 other grids at half the price by someone thats not you
OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
WhiteStar Magic: agreed Orion
Monk Zymurgy: this will happen i guess
Penny Lane: SI are leaches, simple as that. Libomv did all the hard work.
OtakuMegane Desu: Ultimately it comes down to money for many.
OtakuMegane Desu: A lot probably don't care if their work spreads as long as they still get paid.
WhiteStar Magic: SLmyInventory is teh base they used to do it
WhiteStar Magic: and guess what, that works and works well too
Richardus Raymaker: i need to say some money to pay server here would be nice. but get money in sl is more a big dream
WhiteStar Magic: and it is FREE
Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.6.5 (Dev) .9867 (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur)
Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:True
Carissa Raynier is Online
Monk Zymurgy: really .. people should encourage some more groups to come to OpenSim, there are many social groups in SL..and also link to already existing forums, that dont yet utilise 3d space
Richardus Raymaker: some say clear only for ....
Richardus Raymaker: i have pick in profile
Richardus Raymaker: i mean some say, only for sl.
Penny Lane: Yeah, making money in SL is a bit like making money from iPhone apps or making money as a musician on signing to a label. In all cases it's a dellusion, because for 99.9% of cases, you pay more in costs than you ever actually earn.
Orion Hax: one thought i have is with the original creator embeded into an item is to have mabey a profile page where there shops are listed and if you see it somewhere else it dosent pass the sniff test
WhiteStar Magic: well... for peopel to come to OS ... we need stability
WhiteStar Magic: ease of use
Penny Lane: Monk: people will come when it's easy to being stuff across. Starting from scratch is painful. And of course when there's stability.
Monk Zymurgy nods
Penny Lane: Hehe, exactly
WhiteStar Magic: we need to have an environment where they have something to do
Orion Hax: SL is going to become less and less inclinde to let stuff leave there network
Monk Zymurgy: maybe at some point freeze feature in favour of work towards stability..but, we are still in infancy
OtakuMegane Desu: And more importanly can do it in. Wihtout crashing.
WhiteStar Magic: Someone is developing a MMORPG to go ontop of OpenSim
OtakuMegane Desu: Or losing gravity or something.
Monk Zymurgy: WhiteStar..that is the kind of thing we need imo
WhiteStar Magic: yes
WhiteStar Magic: we do
WhiteStar Magic: but there are underlying issues
WhiteStar Magic: for one thing
Monk Zymurgy: i think standalone works better for this type of project..and thats where HG comes into its own
WhiteStar Magic: Just something I have been digging into on teh side
OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
OtakuMegane Desu: HG is going to play a crucial role in the future
WhiteStar Magic: is how to change the environment, sky, water, terrains and have teh Server push it instead of it relying on teh viewer
Penny Lane: LL have no option but to let stuff leave their network now. The reason is that they own xstreet now, and they get a commission for every sale of SI on xstreet. As a result, they can't claim that transferring items off SL is against the ToS when they are earning money from the massive sale of a tool that is used for that.
WhiteStar Magic: Imagine a Sci-Fi Sim with Weird Planetary views, and red waters and more
OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah. Some more control server-side for environment might be nice.
Monk Zymurgy: maybe LL will incorporate windlight setting into the estate settings
WhiteStar Magic: but we shoudl really consider moving Physics to teh viewer and not have teh server do it
Monk Zymurgy: might be a bit early to build it into OS, if we will be using lindens viewer
Penny Lane: "You can't only transfer items off SL to open grids if you use the tool that gives us a commision" is not going to stand up in court.
Penny Lane: can*
WhiteStar Magic: The server shoudl just be info transfer not function calculation and math
OtakuMegane Desu: WhiteStar: There's one problem though.
WhiteStar Magic: but LL code can;t do it
OtakuMegane Desu: Coordinating the information for physics calculation isn't a tiny bit of data
Richardus Raymaker: monkyz, that makes it much beter for many servers. and also makes the memory load lower i hope
WhiteStar Magic: Every real Game System does it on Client
WhiteStar Magic: SL does it on server
Brent Seidel: So, what if my client and your client come up with different physics solutions?
Orion Hax: but that also keeps the client footprint down as well when its on the server
Monk Zymurgy nods..at the expense of accurate scenes..each client may have a different view of the scene
WhiteStar Magic: Picture running an MRM on your server and it is doing the vehickles and executing the physicfs... no region bouandaries if all regions are on same server
Penny Lane: WhiteStar: devolve physics computations to the viewer, yes, just as a way to harness client power. But the region has to be in ultimate charge, since a sim represents a single physical simulation.
Monk Zymurgy: or thats how i saw it in online games
paulie Flomar: It would have to be some version of "physics at home" (like folding at home) where clients can help crunch physics data and send ti to the server. The server would have final say.
OtakuMegane Desu: Most game systems just have to coordinate the location of objects. This would be closer to playing say Street Fighter online. The latency and bandwidth needed for coordinating so much information at high speeds could mkae it horrible.
paulie Flomar: yeah.
WhiteStar Magic: and it's good now ?
Penny Lane: Can't have one client decide there's been a collision with another, when that other says otherwise. The sim has to be authoritative in that
WhiteStar Magic: There has to be a server control module yes
WhiteStar Magic: and 2 way traffic
WhiteStar Magic: coordinator
OtakuMegane Desu: No, but at present levels distributing the full physics systemn would be even worse.
Orion Hax: it would be a disaster
paulie Flomar: this video (of dirt racing) is kewl. :)
OtakuMegane Desu: There may be some parts of the physics calculations that could be offloaded to clients. But most is still going to have to be on the server.
Penny Lane: Not all a disaster. Only some aspects of physics have high realtime requirements.
WhiteStar Magic: agreed
WhiteStar Magic: but there is better ways to split the load and response
OtakuMegane Desu: True
WhiteStar Magic: and take some of the stuff off teh server
Orion Hax: i think a better idea would be to make use of a server side GFX card
OtakuMegane Desu: Other things like working on asset distribution would help for server load too.
WhiteStar Magic: but we come back to being dependent on teh LL Viewer base "for now"
OtakuMegane Desu: Everything goes through the region then to the client right now, correct?
WhiteStar Magic: yep
WhiteStar Magic: pretty much
OtakuMegane Desu: See, that's...silly when you think about it.
WhiteStar Magic: it's a choike point
OtakuMegane Desu: Why not download assets direct from grid to client and the regions simply tells the client where things go?
Penny Lane: Yep, it's gotta be done. SL's sims are not scalable because they don't attempt any parallelism or devolving computations, and that's how LL wants it, because they sell more sims. But Opensim doesn't want to go there --- we need scalable sim technology.
paulie Flomar: client P2P? :)
WhiteStar Magic: agredd 125% Penny
WhiteStar Magic: There are good working P2P models now
WhiteStar Magic: even Solaris can kick butt and do more
WhiteStar Magic: and it is P2P
WhiteStar Magic: but it has major limits we don;t
Penny Lane: Is anyone running Opensim on OpenSolaris?
OtakuMegane Desu: Example: You have a box with a texture. The region tell the client the box's parameters and the UUID of the texture and that's that. The client then does the rest of the work downloading things from the gird's asset server.
Penny Lane: Heh, I don't actually know if Mono runs on OpenSolaris
OtakuMegane Desu: grid*
Penny Lane: Otaku: yeah, that's the Cable Beach model
WhiteStar Magic: http://www.solipsis.org/
paulie Flomar: even LL is moving to textures over HTTP, probably from various sources...
WhiteStar Magic: is what I meant ,.... no solaris
Penny Lane: I know Solipsis, Jesrad told us about it on MMOX
Richardus Raymaker: how long can the keep things save if the start already to download textures frome verywhere
WhiteStar Magic: Worlds and several other platdforms pull textures from teh web
WhiteStar Magic: wow Major Chat Lag
OtakuMegane Desu: I think you have it right for why LL designed things the way they did, Penny. And possibly some degree of laziness just like originally storing everything as blobs in the database.
Penny Lane: Richardus: keeping things safe and scaling the metaverse aren't on the same game plan :P
Penny Lane: Is Wright about to take a dive?
Orion Hax: most likely
WhiteStar Magic: wasn't it about a year, yr & a half ao the opic of stuffing a lot of assets on HTTP servers and setting keys for access to peopel started ?
Richardus Raymaker: ilooks like
OtakuMegane Desu: I wonder...if you took the region out of the constant stream of asset data, how many avatars might you be able to support, then?
OtakuMegane Desu: Proibably
Penny Lane: Otaku: certainly a lot more!
WhiteStar Magic: likely a lot mnore
WhiteStar Magic: NZ is testing an idea with his collectiosn of regions by splitting out the MySql DBS
Orion Hax: my thought would be to use amazon cloud as a service and people pay for however much storage they use
Penny Lane: Why the poor little non-scalable sim CPU is dealing with asset downloads, running scripts, and vicinity chat and IM is anybody's guess. Designer on drugs? ;-)
Penny Lane: Or LL just wants to sell more sims ...
Orion Hax: or both
Penny Lane: Heh
WhiteStar Magic: on cheap, lame hardware that doesn;t work
OtakuMegane Desu: Lag letting up a bit?
Penny Lane: Yeah, we'll probably be meeting up in LBSA shortly
OtakuMegane Desu: Until we manage to lag it into obblivion too. Then it's on to Zaius! Hahaha
WhiteStar Magic: I think... Honestly, splitting teh MySql System to another Server on it;'s own, allowing access to OpenSim Servers via a backbone Ethernt would certainly improve the capability
Richardus Raymaker: -
Richardus Raymaker: if LL want to sell more sims, then simple solution is to drop the price and tier with 50%
OtakuMegane Desu: I'm thinking the core structure of asset delivery and region coordination is going to have to change eventually. A lot.
Richardus Raymaker: and think more to customers
Penny Lane: A sim crawl. It's like a pub crawl where you drink every pub dry, but in this case you consume all the sim resources until they crash, and head for the next one :P
WhiteStar Magic: Have you looked at Land for Sale in SL lately ?
Orion Hax: back to physics can we have a set of server side GFX cards process the massive amount of calculations instead of trying to divy it up
OtakuMegane Desu: Not gonna be easy though
Richardus Raymaker: must be posisble. not sure if works for linux. i know for windows its possible.
nurbsPlane9: DynamicTextureModule: Error preparing image using URL http://grid.bubblecloud.org/~osoperator/osgrid_central_osgrid.jpg
OtakuMegane Desu: Orion: That WOULD be immensely helpful. Especially since a graphics card on a remote server would usually have nothing else to do.
OtakuMegane Desu: It's certainly possible. But there's not been large enough interest till more recently.
Orion Hax: the reason i ask is nvidias new toy the tesla computational card
Orion Hax: some 960 stream processors
OtakuMegane Desu: Nice
WhiteStar Magic: but the data still has to be pushed down the wire to the client to run it there
OtakuMegane Desu: If you could utilize a graphic card for physics though, that'd give vast amounts of headroom compared to what we have now
Richardus Raymaker: test
Penny Lane: Instead of buying a hot graphics card for the sim, buy a PS3. Those SPUs are extremely fast, and really wiped the floor on Folding@Home with all other clients. Physics calculation would be ideally suited.
OtakuMegane Desu: Spend a couple hundred to stick a 4850 in a server rather than a couple thousand buying a second one to handle the CPU loads.
Richardus Raymaker: dont tell me 4-20Mbit down is not enough ?
Monk Zymurgy: ps3 runs linux .. would be an interesting project
Richardus Raymaker: upload. uhmm. opensim at home is anyway not so good
OtakuMegane Desu: You need to assume about 1mbps per avatar to be safe.
Penny Lane: Monk: just the physics, not Opensim --- not enough memory for Mono on PS3
Orion Hax: that was my thought is its not any one process hoseing the system its a 1000 little ones
WhiteStar Magic: the code is getting less and less performant
OtakuMegane Desu: Yeah
Monk Zymurgy: ah..has anyone tried to run a client on ps3..i want to try
OtakuMegane Desu: Tat's something we need to keep an eye on. Opensim development has become freature-creeping lately rather than optimizing what we have.
Monk Zymurgy nods
Penny Lane: Not enough memory, nor is there access to the GPU on PS3
Monk Zymurgy: aww
WhiteStar Magic: I've been noticing it and so have manyothersthat things are slowing down and getting fatter
Monk Zymurgy: maybe i will not try then
OtakuMegane Desu: It actually seems LESS robust than it was. Used to be we were pushing 30+ avatars on this meeting but now it's having trouble in the 20s again
WhiteStar Magic: there ae issues on this and LBSA regions
OtakuMegane Desu: The problem with consoles is they actually tend to be very skimpy on RAM.
Richardus Raymaker: and thats the cheapest part.
Richardus Raymaker: whats in a console this days ? 512MB ? 2 GB ?
Monk Zymurgy: not sure richardus..i just had a little fun setting up yellow dog linux on a friends ps3
Monk Zymurgy: good meeting..but i must run..take care and see you all around :)
WhiteStar Magic: see ya Monkz
Brent Seidel: Bye monk
Richardus Raymaker: bye monks
WhiteStar Magic: gonna head out to
WhiteStar Magic: have a good one everuyone
Brent Seidel: Bye WhiteStar

Office hours

2009-07-05T15:59:32Z

DaveCoyle: adding june 23

__NOTOC__
{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 

OpenSim has a number of weekly meetings to discuss parts of the project. All take place on [[Wright Plaza]].

= Meetings =

Meetings on Wright Plaza serve two purposes. One is the meeting described below. The second, and equally important is as a stress test so we can all see how our sim reliability is functioning at each meeting.

Additionaly, others are welcome to use the conference room on Wright Plaza for any other meetings they wish. This conference room is setup for meetings and the more use of it, the more testing and development is enhanced.

The two html-on-a-prim one each side of the main screen are both controlled from the chat channel and can be used to present arbitrary web pages to enhance a meeting.

== Tuesday - '''Office Hour''' ==
This meeting is a general technical meeting for the opensim community. All are welcome to participate, but be forewarned that it is developer focussed, so attention is mostly given to near term development goals of the project, and those that are contributing code to meet those goals.

In general, we tend to follow a fairly simple agenda format for our one hour.

* First, developers are encouraged bring up any subjects they wish. Helping the developers focus our efforts is #1.
* Second, testers and users are encouraged to bring up items of community interest that will help development.

At this meeting, anything previously mentioned is fair for discussion for the balance of the meeting. Lets try to keep it moving even at the expense of getting all questions answered as we have a limited time.

Also at this meeting, we should strive to agree on the "recommended" svn version of OpenSim for the next week. After the one hour finishes, it is fair for anyone that wishes to stay around and meet informally as long as they wish.

'''Up until Tuesday 31st March 2009, this meeting will occur at 1900 GMT/UTC (equivalent to 1200 US Pacific Time and 1500 US Eastern Time).

'''On Tuesday 31st March 2009 and afterwards these meetings will switch to 1800 GMT/UTC (equivalent to 1100 US Pacific Time and 1400 US Eastern Time).

'''This switch is occuring to restore the existing meeting times once many European clocks go forward for summer'''

== Thursday - '''Wiki Hour''' ==
This is a general meeting on the quality of the wiki for OpenSim. You don't need to be a coder to be productive part of this meeting. This is about getting anyone together that is interested in making the OpenSim wiki a better source for definitive information on the OpenSim project.

* Improving clarity on our wiki needs community involvement.
* Developers add features and we need to help them add documentation.

'''This meeting always occurs at 19:00 UTC/GMT (see google calendar below) at Wright Plaza.'''

== Saturday - '''Q&A Hour''' ==
This is meeting tries to drive testing on OpenSim. All members of the opensim community are welcome to participate. Through your testing, we create a better project. Also the possibility to get answers of the questions you would have about setting up your own Grid or connect your region to the OSGrid. This meeting is less structured then "Office Hour" and is focused on the users and adopters rather then the developers.

* First, any announcements by OSGrid admins.
* Second, any information to share that helps other grids.
* third, any user or tester subjects that anyone wishes to bring up.

'''This meeting always occurs at 19:00 UTC/GMT (see google calendar below) at Wright Plaza.''' After the one hour is finished, anyone is welcome to continue meeting for as long as they wish.

= Google Calendar of Events =
Below is a google calendar of the events, shown in GMT time zone. You should be able to customize it to your time zone if you click through to the google site.
<googlecalendar>v6e2o6vtc3mt9lv9ladn420q7k%40group.calendar.google.com</googlecalendar>

== Logs ==
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-30]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-09]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-02]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-26]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-19]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-12]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-05]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-28]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-21]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-14]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-07]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-31]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-24]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-17]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-10]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-03]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-02-24]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-02-10]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-02-03]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-27]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-20]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-13]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-06]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-12-30]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-12-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-12-02]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-11-25]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-11-18]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-11-11]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-10-28]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-10-21]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-10-07]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-09-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-09-16]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-09-09]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-26]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-19]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-12]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-05]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-22]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-15]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-08]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-01]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-06-17]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-06-10]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-04-15]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-04-08]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-03-11]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-03-04]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-02-17]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-02-12]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-02-05]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-01-29]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-01-09]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-12-18]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-12-11]]
* Chat log from the meeting on 2007-12-4 (meeting cancelled)
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-27]]
* Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-20 (missing)
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-13]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-06]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-30]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-16]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-09]]

[[Category:Development]]
[[Category:Office Hours]]

File:Tm06102009.jpg

2009-07-05T15:41:45Z

DaveCoyle: the "2009-06-10" meeting was actually on the 9th

Tuesday meeting at Wright Plaza 6/09/2009

Office hours

2009-07-05T15:40:56Z

DaveCoyle: the "2009-06-10" meeting was actually on the 9th

__NOTOC__
{{Template:Quicklinks}}
 

OpenSim has a number of weekly meetings to discuss parts of the project. All take place on [[Wright Plaza]].

= Meetings =

Meetings on Wright Plaza serve two purposes. One is the meeting described below. The second, and equally important is as a stress test so we can all see how our sim reliability is functioning at each meeting.

Additionaly, others are welcome to use the conference room on Wright Plaza for any other meetings they wish. This conference room is setup for meetings and the more use of it, the more testing and development is enhanced.

The two html-on-a-prim one each side of the main screen are both controlled from the chat channel and can be used to present arbitrary web pages to enhance a meeting.

== Tuesday - '''Office Hour''' ==
This meeting is a general technical meeting for the opensim community. All are welcome to participate, but be forewarned that it is developer focussed, so attention is mostly given to near term development goals of the project, and those that are contributing code to meet those goals.

In general, we tend to follow a fairly simple agenda format for our one hour.

* First, developers are encouraged bring up any subjects they wish. Helping the developers focus our efforts is #1.
* Second, testers and users are encouraged to bring up items of community interest that will help development.

At this meeting, anything previously mentioned is fair for discussion for the balance of the meeting. Lets try to keep it moving even at the expense of getting all questions answered as we have a limited time.

Also at this meeting, we should strive to agree on the "recommended" svn version of OpenSim for the next week. After the one hour finishes, it is fair for anyone that wishes to stay around and meet informally as long as they wish.

'''Up until Tuesday 31st March 2009, this meeting will occur at 1900 GMT/UTC (equivalent to 1200 US Pacific Time and 1500 US Eastern Time).

'''On Tuesday 31st March 2009 and afterwards these meetings will switch to 1800 GMT/UTC (equivalent to 1100 US Pacific Time and 1400 US Eastern Time).

'''This switch is occuring to restore the existing meeting times once many European clocks go forward for summer'''

== Thursday - '''Wiki Hour''' ==
This is a general meeting on the quality of the wiki for OpenSim. You don't need to be a coder to be productive part of this meeting. This is about getting anyone together that is interested in making the OpenSim wiki a better source for definitive information on the OpenSim project.

* Improving clarity on our wiki needs community involvement.
* Developers add features and we need to help them add documentation.

'''This meeting always occurs at 19:00 UTC/GMT (see google calendar below) at Wright Plaza.'''

== Saturday - '''Q&A Hour''' ==
This is meeting tries to drive testing on OpenSim. All members of the opensim community are welcome to participate. Through your testing, we create a better project. Also the possibility to get answers of the questions you would have about setting up your own Grid or connect your region to the OSGrid. This meeting is less structured then "Office Hour" and is focused on the users and adopters rather then the developers.

* First, any announcements by OSGrid admins.
* Second, any information to share that helps other grids.
* third, any user or tester subjects that anyone wishes to bring up.

'''This meeting always occurs at 19:00 UTC/GMT (see google calendar below) at Wright Plaza.''' After the one hour is finished, anyone is welcome to continue meeting for as long as they wish.

= Google Calendar of Events =
Below is a google calendar of the events, shown in GMT time zone. You should be able to customize it to your time zone if you click through to the google site.
<googlecalendar>v6e2o6vtc3mt9lv9ladn420q7k%40group.calendar.google.com</googlecalendar>

== Logs ==
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-30]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-09]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-06-02]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-26]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-19]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-12]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-05-05]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-28]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-21]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-14]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-04-07]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-31]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-24]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-17]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-10]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-03]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-02-24]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-02-10]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-02-03]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-27]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-20]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-13]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2009-01-06]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-12-30]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-12-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-12-02]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-11-25]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-11-18]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-11-11]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-10-28]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-10-21]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-10-07]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-09-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-09-16]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-09-09]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-26]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-19]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-12]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-08-05]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-22]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-15]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-08]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-01]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-06-17]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-06-10]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-04-15]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-04-08]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-03-11]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-03-04]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-02-17]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-02-12]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-02-05]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-01-29]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2008-01-09]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-12-18]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-12-11]]
* Chat log from the meeting on 2007-12-4 (meeting cancelled)
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-27]]
* Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-20 (missing)
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-13]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-11-06]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-30]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-23]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-16]]
* [[Chat log from the meeting on 2007-10-09]]

[[Category:Development]]
[[Category:Office Hours]]