Chat log from the meeting on 2010-12-14

[19:09] Dutchy Daredevil is Online [19:09] Sarah Kline: nebs fault [19:09] Richardus Raymaker: everybody make sometime sa read error sarah [19:09] Nebadon Izumi: heh [19:09] Andrew Hellershanks: Ah, here we are all on top of each other again [19:09] Sarah Kline: lol [19:10] Basil Sosides: megalol [19:10] Andrew Hellershanks waits for objects to rez [19:10] Sarah Kline: aim for a seat up here [19:10] Andrew Hellershanks: I can't see any objects yet. Its taking a long time for things to appear today [19:10] Penny Lane is Online [19:11] Nebadon Izumi: ya so many people logging in at once [19:11] Penny Lane: BOOM! [19:11] Nebadon Izumi: hopfully it recovers [19:11] Andrew Hellershanks: This login lag is getting worse(?) [19:11] Richardus Raymaker: come on nebadon. it worked for weeks the same way perfect :) [19:11] Sarah Kline: hahah [19:12]  Sarah Kline: yes we were sitting here quite happily [19:12]  Andrew Hellershanks: ah, finally the objects start appearing [19:12]  Key Gruin is Offline [19:12]  Vivienne Clary: a nice cuddleing here ^^ [19:12]  UUID Speaker: Casias Falta: 3afd95b4-00ca-06be-edc2-42fcdcaf8e20 [19:12]  Nebadon Izumi: ya sort of sucks [19:12]  Richardus Raymaker: i saw it short back to 1.00 [19:12]  Nebadon Izumi: its being worked on though [19:12]  Andrew Hellershanks: I made it. [19:13]  Andrew Hellershanks: Wait for the seats to appear then sit on one instead of trying to move from landing area to here [19:13]  Richardus Raymaker: yeah. that works much faster [19:13]  Richardus Raymaker: ok its 1.00 and dropped again [19:14]  Nebadon Izumi: the sim is definatly not 100% dead yet [19:14]  Nebadon Izumi: heh [19:14]  Nebadon Izumi: this does suck though we need to work on this for sure [19:14] Penny Lane: It's only sleeping [19:14] Richardus Raymaker: sleeping. need to give it more coffee next time [19:14] stiofain nbmcmedia: nuclearr wasteland? [19:14] Andrew Hellershanks: is this problem confined to git master or is it seen in any of the 0.7 releases? [19:15] Richardus Raymaker: does bigtrash makes this problem worser ? [19:15] Richardus Raymaker: im suprised chat still works fine [19:15] Nebadon Izumi: well even though we cant move seems people can still sit [19:16] Richardus Raymaker: that to [19:16]  Nebadon Izumi: so i guess we'll just role with it for now [19:16] Nebadon Izumi: be interesting to see if it comes back to life [19:16] Richardus Raymaker: is this version haveing new clud fixes ? [19:16] Richardus Raymaker: for now i dont see clouds [19:16] Richardus Raymaker: hi dalhlia [19:16] Dahlia Trimble: hi [19:17]  Nebadon Izumi: ya we are probably pretty close to having 100% fix on the cloud issues [19:17] Dahlia Trimble: nothing rezzing [19:17] Dahlia Trimble: cool [19:17] Nebadon Izumi: but there is a lot of work to do still [19:17] Nebadon Izumi: with improving log ins in general [19:17] Dahlia Trimble: I just tried mesh viewer and no appearance :( [19:17]  Nebadon Izumi: i think the sim might be dead dahlia [19:17]  Richardus Raymaker: dahlia, sim still at 0fps [19:17]  Dahlia Trimble: starting to rez now [19:17]  Dahlia Trimble: cant move lol [19:17]  Nebadon Izumi: ya [19:18]  Nebadon Izumi: not sure why but sim seems dead [19:18]  Entering god mode, level 255 [19:18]  Casias Falta: mouseing up to meeting room and siting worked for me even though i cant walk [19:18]  Dahlia Trimble: cant move at all [19:19]  Andrew Hellershanks: That is how I usually get here. Just cam to a seat and click Sit Here [19:19]  Richardus Raymaker: someone still loading inventory ? [19:19]  Casias Falta: i see kahlia now [19:19]  Casias Falta: dahlia i mean [19:19]  Andrew Hellershanks: just cleaned my trash. I went from 591 items to 313 [19:20]  Nebadon Izumi: guess justin isnt coming today, must be busy [19:20] Dahlia Trimble: who's working on appearance? [19:20] Nebadon Izumi: it will come back Andrew [19:20] Richardus Raymaker: !i cant empty my trash, offocrse it would be fine [19:20] Vivienne Clary: but after relog all is back [19:20] Nebadon Izumi: I know Mic was dahlia, probably melanie and diva a bit too maybe [19:20] Dahlia Trimble: kk [19:20]  Andrew Hellershanks: Oh. Trash keeps coming back? Garbage menu on strike? ;-) [19:20] Nebadon Izumi: we have the ability to empty it disabled on osgrid [19:20]  Andrew Hellershanks: menu -> menn [19:20]  Nebadon Izumi: on purpose [19:21]  Dahlia Trimble: havent noticed appearance commits lately but will look again [19:21]  Vivienne Clary: why Nebadon? [19:21]  Andrew Hellershanks: oh [19:21]  Nebadon Izumi: ya probably hasnt been any directly in a bit dahlia [19:21]  Basil Sosides: ich mach mal relog [19:21]  Nebadon Izumi: because in an open grid if we enable it, it also allows hacker types to delete everyones inventory [19:21]  Basil Sosides: oh [19:21]  Basil Sosides: nu gehts [19:21]  Vivienne Clary: ohhhhh [19:21]  Nebadon Izumi: because inventory delete requests are made by the simulator [19:22]  Nebadon Izumi: anyone who runs their own simulator could potentially modify it to delete more than just trash bin [19:22]  Richardus Raymaker: ohh. thats bad [19:22] Andrew Hellershanks: Shouldn't there be some checks in place to prevent that? [19:22] Nebadon Izumi: so we disabled it grid wide [19:22] Nebadon Izumi: our inventory server no longer honors delete requests of any kind [19:22] Dahlia Trimble: interesing [19:22] Dahlia Trimble: was there a problem? [19:22] Nebadon Izumi: yes [19:23] Richardus Raymaker: is that why i cant delete many times a prim form region with "delete" key on keyboard ? pie menu delete works p [erfect btw [19:23] Nebadon Izumi: we caught it pretty quick [19:23] Nebadon Izumi: few 100 people got whacked [19:23] Richardus Raymaker: aah its back nebadon. the sim is alove [19:23] Dahlia Trimble: when did it happen? [19:23] Nebadon Izumi: about 6 months ago [19:23] Richardus Raymaker: alive [19:23] Vivienne Clary: we can activate it in our sim did I understand it right? [19:23] Dahlia Trimble: oh ok I remember [19:23] Helena Franizzi is Online [19:23] Nebadon Izumi: no Vivienne [19:24] Nebadon Izumi: we will need to re-incorporate it in to the website again [19:24] Nebadon Izumi: we just have not had the time unfortunatly [19:24] Vivienne Clary: sorry my english is very terrible [19:24] Richardus Raymaker: only problem, my trash start to fill and its getting harder to find somnthing back there to [19:24]  Nebadon Izumi: we will have a button on the wesbite eventually to allow you to empty your trash bin [19:24] Vivienne Clary: ahh ok [19:24]  Nebadon Izumi: right now i have about 36000 items in my inventory [19:24] Nebadon Izumi: heh [19:24] Dahlia Trimble: lol [19:25] Vivienne Clary: hihihi [19:25] Dahlia Trimble: 4108 for me [19:25]  Andrew Hellershanks: 36,000? wow [19:25] Nebadon Izumi: oh sim is alive [19:25] Nebadon Izumi: oh i killed it [19:25]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [19:25] Dahlia Trimble: not like my SL inventory that has close to 50k [19:25] Andrew Hellershanks: How many of those items are in your trash bin, nebadon? [19:26] Basil Sosides: sorry, where ist the Trash.bin stored??? [19:26] Nebadon Izumi: Andrew maybe 1500 [19:26] Richardus Raymaker: i cant see my inventory right now. o counter [19:26] Nebadon Izumi: yay im glad sim recovered eventually [19:26] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, oh. Thats not too bad [19:26] Richardus Raymaker: until you have 40 primitives in it and you need to find the right one [19:27] Nebadon Izumi: ya i have over 3 years of things in my inventory too [19:27] Nebadon Izumi: I probably added 5000 items in the past month [19:27] Nebadon Izumi: im building a Sim for UCI [19:28] Casias Falta: can anybody see my ava sorry for asking [19:28] Andrew Hellershanks: I see you, Casias [19:28] Nebadon Izumi: heh i think we can probably see a little too much of it Casias [19:28] Nebadon Izumi: lol [19:28] Dahlia Trimble: anyone want a free santa hat? [19:28] Casias Falta: tk [19:28]  Sarah Kline: yes [19:28] Nebadon Izumi: your naked to me [19:28]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [19:28] Sarah Kline: default av skin [19:28] Nebadon Izumi: i have on your hat already from last year Dahlia [19:28] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [19:29] Nebadon Izumi: ive been wearing it all week [19:29] Andrew Hellershanks: I thought I saw Casias. [19:29] Andrew Hellershanks: oh, there they are [19:29] Sarah Kline: thanks ) [19:29]  Richardus Raymaker: other thing: i think teleports between latest osgrid version and older ones is a bit broken. also neighborn sims that run older version seems to be invisible inworld. anyone seen that to ? [19:29]  Dahlia Trimble whispers: yw :) [19:29] Andrew Hellershanks: yeah. Casias is the naked guy [19:30] Nebadon Izumi: hehehe [19:30] Casias Falta: i will try to get clothing rezed [19:30] Nebadon Izumi: no worries, appearances have been crappy lately [19:31] Nebadon Izumi: still lots of work to do there to get it 100% right [19:31] Nebadon Izumi: its gotten alot better though [19:31] stiofain nbmcmedia: lol wesee ur assias [19:31] Casias Falta: any body got any new info on using voice since last week [19:31] Nebadon Izumi: not much has changed Casias [19:32] Basil Sosides: what about Emerald Viewer, is it alowed to use it in OS? [19:32] Nebadon Izumi: i suppose though i dont recommend using anything thats not a TPV [19:32] Richardus Raymaker: that stil exists ? [19:32] Nebadon Izumi: approved by LL [19:32]  Casias Falta: i tried to get freeswitch working and installed and made ini changes but neither hippo or imprudence would show me an enabled voice button [19:33] Sarah Kline: the viewer is finished [19:33] Nebadon Izumi: if you want to use Emerald, you should be using Phoenix [19:33] Sarah Kline: no work done since the ban [19:33] Andrew Hellershanks: Casias, What version of code are you using? [19:33] Basil Sosides: but my Emerald 2600 still works fine [19:33] Nebadon Izumi: ya there are very good reasons no one should use Emerald [19:33] Dahlia Trimble: is Phoenix allowed by LL? [19:33] Casias Falta: most current that is in binary [19:33] Nebadon Izumi: yes Dahlia [19:34] Sarah Kline: so will Pheonix it runs just as sweetly as em did now [19:34] Vivienne Clary: huhu Samira [19:34] Nebadon Izumi: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Third_Party_Viewer_Directory [19:34] Nebadon Izumi: honestly if the viewer is not on this list [19:34] Samira Samtanko: hello [19:34] Nebadon Izumi: i do not suggest you use it [19:34]  Dahlia Trimble: I used to use emerald a lon time go but stopped long before all the controversy began. Kinda glad I stopped :) [19:34] Nebadon Izumi: there are lots of good options on that list [19:34]  Richardus Raymaker: i dont mis emerald [19:34]  Basil Sosides: what should be bad at the Emerald? [19:34]  Dahlia Trimble: I dont either [19:34]  Sarah Kline: phoenix is now using V2 attachments [19:35]  Richardus Raymaker: nobody hasve seen Tp problems between latest osgrid and older versions ? [19:35]  Nebadon Izumi: there was a lot of controversy with Emerald [19:35]  Sarah Kline: and most of the other TPV are going V2..may be problems here [19:35]  Nebadon Izumi: they were data mining [19:35]  Nebadon Izumi: and using the Viewer to DDoS a website [19:35]  Sarah Kline: for attachments [19:36]  Nebadon Izumi: and other dramas with encrypted files that no one could decipher [19:36]  Basil Sosides: ah ok [19:36]  Sarah Kline: Emerald is old history lol [19:36]  Nebadon Izumi: viewer doing things it should not have been doing [19:36] AEH Solo is Online [19:36] Basil Sosides: i used the Emerald 1.5.0.2600 [19:36] Dahlia Trimble: some people may question the ethics of some of the covert features in emerald [19:36] Basil Sosides: and its a verry good Viewer [19:37] Nebadon Izumi: well all of the good stuff is in phoenix [19:37] Richardus Raymaker: if you use imprudnce then emerald is not nice. also because its 32bit [19:37] Nebadon Izumi: I still think Imprudence is a better viewer [19:38] Basil Sosides: but Imprudence have Grafic-mistakes [19:38] Nebadon Izumi: ya well im not saying you have to use it by any means [19:38] Richardus Raymaker: ? what mistake ? [19:38] Nebadon Izumi: my only suggestion is dont use anything thats not on that list [19:38] Basil Sosides: on the Horizont [19:38] Nebadon Izumi: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Third_Party_Viewer_Directory [19:38] Sarah Kline: stop the viewer wars lol [19:38] Basil Sosides: in High res. Modus [19:39] Richardus Raymaker: kirsten is a bit outdated btw. there's a linux version to [19:39] Basil Sosides: ok lets stop about the Viewers [19:39] Andrew Hellershanks: Interesting. I don't see Hippo on that list but I have no problem using it in SL or OS. [19:39] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [19:39] Sarah Kline: the list is a guide [19:39] Nebadon Izumi: Hippo is not approved [19:39] Sarah Kline: ) [19:40]  Nebadon Izumi: some history about hippo, Hippo viewer is 1 person [19:40]  Nebadon Izumi: always has been only 1 person [19:40]  Nebadon Izumi: Mana Janus [19:40]  Richardus Raymaker: i saw the grid info option works again to get all data. nice [19:40]  Nebadon Izumi: Mana made hippo viewer primarily for opensim [19:40]  Nebadon Izumi: she never intented it to be used on SL really [19:40]  Sarah Kline: it still works well [19:40]  Richardus Raymaker: explains why updates are slow :) [19:40] Sarah Kline: on both grids ^^ [19:40] Nebadon Izumi: it will never be on the TPV, it still works ok, but ya, its pretty much a dead project [19:41] Richardus Raymaker: still some pray to the hippo. [19:41] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [19:41] Nebadon Izumi: i havent used hippo viewer in some time now [19:41] Andrew Hellershanks: hehe [19:41] Dahlia Trimble: im using it now [19:41] Andrew Hellershanks: I will have to start taking a closer look at the copy of Imprudence I have installed [19:41] Richardus Raymaker: a common problem is that nieuwer viewers not seems to run wel on older hardware [19:42] Dahlia Trimble: tried logging in with mesh viewer but I wouldnt rez so I relogged with hippo [19:42] Nebadon Izumi: wierd, ya there is something up with current outfit folder with thev 2 viewer [19:42] Sarah Kline: will osg be compatible with these multiple attachment viewers that we will see more of [19:42]  Nebadon Izumi: you can get 100's of items in the DB in your current outfit folder [19:43] Nebadon Izumi: i got up to like 900 [19:43] Sarah Kline: phoniex now uses same system [19:43] Nebadon Izumi: and couldnt log in anymore [19:43] Dahlia Trimble: can you clear mine? [19:43] Nebadon Izumi: sure let me look see 1 sec [19:43] Copied key for Dahlia Trimble to clipboard: 3f535668-cd80-407f-950b-998496f2799b [19:43] Sarah Kline: i use the outfit folder in SL and its very good [19:43] Marga String: hello together [19:43] Richardus Raymaker: hello marge [19:43] Sarah Kline: but i dont have so many outfits here ^^ [19:43] Richardus Raymaker: but.. any other opensim news ? [19:44] Basil Sosides: i think OpenSim is great [19:44] Nebadon Izumi: dahlia your ok [19:44]  Nebadon Izumi: only 14 items [19:45] Nebadon Izumi: not even going to bother with that [19:45] Dahlia Trimble: ty [19:45]  Casias Falta: sharp threads huh [19:45] Dahlia Trimble: is it possible that the same mechanism which stops emptying trash may affect the current outfit folder? [19:46] Nebadon Izumi: hmm [19:46] Nebadon Izumi: good question [19:46] Nebadon Izumi: i dont think so [19:46]  Nebadon Izumi: have to see what melanie thinks she knows alot about inventory [19:46] Nebadon Izumi: its possible i suppose [19:46] Dahlia Trimble: ya I dont really know inventory at all [19:47] Nebadon Izumi: it doesnt always seem to do it though [19:47] Nebadon Izumi: most of the time it seems to have something to do with crashing [19:47] Basil Sosides: is the Inventory stored on the Gridserver-Databank??? [19:47] Nebadon Izumi: yes basil [19:47] Basil Sosides: ok [19:48]  Dahlia Trimble: I dont think Ive ever been able to set my appearance with V2 on OSGrid. Works fine on my standalones tho [19:48] Nebadon Izumi: I have [19:48] Basil Sosides: robust.exe is handling it? [19:48] Nebadon Izumi: with the Mesh Developer viewer [19:48] Nebadon Izumi: 2.5 based [19:48] Sarah Kline: me too [19:48] Dahlia Trimble: just tried latest mesh [19:48] Richardus Raymaker: does HG already work here or still soemthing broken ? [19:49] Nebadon Izumi: its 1/2 working still Richardus [19:49] Nebadon Izumi: were not quite sure what went wrong [19:49] Nebadon Izumi: were still hunting for why HG is 1/2 working [19:49] Casias Falta: HG is ?? [19:49] Nebadon Izumi: HyperGrid [19:49] Casias Falta: tk [19:49]  Nebadon Izumi: Teleporting between grids and standalones [19:49] Richardus Raymaker: ok [19:50]  Casias Falta: he he which half is working [19:50] Justin Clark-Casey is Online [19:50] Nebadon Izumi: hey theres justin [19:50] Nebadon Izumi: he made it [19:50]  Nebadon Izumi: hola Justin [19:50] Justin Clark-Casey: doh, I forgot it was tuesday.... [19:51] Justin Clark-Casey: hello :) [19:51]  Nebadon Izumi: heh its ok no worries [19:51]  Sarah Kline: hi Justin [19:51]  Nebadon Izumi: the 1st 26 mintues we were frozen at 0fps [19:51]  Dahlia Trimble: hi :) [19:51] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [19:51] Andrew Hellershanks: Is there a version check at the start of negotiation between regions when trying a HG TP? [19:51] Basil Sosides: when i am on my Sim in 500m high, the Horizont flips up and down [19:51] Justin Clark-Casey: uhhhh :) [19:51]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: no, afaik [19:51]  Basil Sosides: but only by using Hippo or Impr. [19:51]  Richardus Raymaker: hi justin [19:51]  Nebadon Izumi: ya i also dont think there is either [19:51]  Andrew Hellershanks: Wouldn't it make sense to include version numbers in case there are incompatabilities between versions of HG? [19:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: I think Diva is thinking along those lines, but it's a complex issue [19:52]  Nebadon Izumi: sounds logical [19:52]  Nebadon Izumi: im sure evnetually it will be required infact [19:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: not only would you need protocol compatability, but you also really need compatible between things like asset serializations [19:52]  Andrew Hellershanks: It would make it easier to get a report of not being able to TP to an HG area due to version differences [19:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I agree [19:53] Vivienne Clary: sorry I have to go, I wish you all a fine day or a nice evening, byeee [19:53] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: anything interesting of note today? :) [19:53] Andrew Hellershanks: That could be part of an initial verison packet. A list of versions for HG protocol, serialization or whatever else could affect HG's [19:53]  Nebadon Izumi: see you Vivienne [19:53]  Andrew Hellershanks: bye, Vivienne [19:53]  Basil Sosides: bye Vivi [19:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: bye vivienne [19:53]  Nebadon Izumi: not really Justin, other than Logins being horrible [19:53]  Sarah Kline: bye viv [19:53]  Nebadon Izumi: and freezing the sim for 20+ minutes [19:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeuch [19:54]  Nebadon Izumi: ya seemed especially bad today [19:54]  Andrew Hellershanks whispers: 20+ minutes? Ouch!! [19:54]  Nebadon Izumi: also been having wierd ODE crash on windows servers [19:54]  Nebadon Izumi: very uninformative [19:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: mmm [19:54]  Nebadon Izumi: just a pop up with ok button [19:54]  Basil Sosides: what can be the reason for Grafic-mistakes at the Viewers Hippo and Impr. [19:54] Nebadon Izumi: something about assertion or something [19:54] Nebadon Izumi: let me remote in [19:54]  Nebadon Izumi: i'll screenshot [19:54] Justin Clark-Casey: ok [19:55]  Andrew Hellershanks: Basil, what sort of mistakes? [19:55] Basil Sosides: the horizont flips up and down [19:56] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: I do notice that in the windows build instructions there wasn't a --disable-asserts switch. Maybe that is an issue [19:57] Basil Sosides: ah [19:57]  Basil Sosides: asserts? [19:57] Justin Clark-Casey: run-time checks that the code is behaving as it should [19:57] Basil Sosides: ok [19:58]  Basil Sosides: Phoenix do not have those mistakes [19:58] Justin Clark-Casey: I'm talking about physics, rather than your particular issue, I think [19:58] Nebadon Izumi: thats the error justin [19:58] Nebadon Izumi: then if i hit ok the sim restarts [19:59] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, were you running with --debug? [19:59] Nebadon Izumi: its not mono [19:59] Nebadon Izumi: --debug is a mono option [20:00] Andrew Hellershanks: That header isn't in OS but is part of some external library [20:00] Nebadon Izumi: and when i hit ok and it restarts sim there is nothing on the console [20:00] Nebadon Izumi: just crashes to prompt [20:00] Nebadon Izumi: ya its a ODE file its referencing [20:00] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I suspect this is occurring now becuase asserts aren't off in the windows build [20:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Problem with an assert in a header is that it might not indicate where in the code the actual assertion is being triggered [20:01] Nebadon Izumi: is that something we can fix? [20:01] Nebadon Izumi: the linux regions run great [20:01] Nebadon Izumi: so far its only crashed like this on windows plazas [20:01] Richardus Raymaker: i know someone else omplains the last time about opensim crash under windows. and i have seen it to it crash with dialog. but it keeps running [20:01] Justin Clark-Casey: hmm, there's no obvious premake4 option to turn them off, though [20:02] Nebadon Izumi: was there previously? [20:02] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't know [20:02] Nebadon Izumi: heh ya me either [20:02] Justin Clark-Casey: did teravus mention anything about that for windows? [20:02] Helena Franizzi is Offline [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: not that i remember [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: there were notes on the wiki [20:03] Andrew Hellershanks: which version of ODE are you using, nebadon? [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: i think [20:03] Justin Clark-Casey: I wonder if they should be turned off in the release dll automatically [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: 11.1 Andrew [20:03] Richardus Raymaker: hehe [20:03] Richardus Raymaker: 99% i use linux for opensim. so hard to say [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: 7750 Justin? [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: i cant remember the # we used [20:03] Justin Clark-Casey: r1755, which is post 0.11.1 [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: ah heh man was i off [20:03] Nebadon Izumi: i knew it had 7's and 5's [20:03]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [20:03] Justin Clark-Casey: I'll have to take a closer look at this [20:03] Justin Clark-Casey: ho hum [20:04] Nebadon Izumi: ok cool, its not the end of the world, means i gotta restart 2 sims once a day [20:04] Nebadon Izumi: not sure if other people are seeing it as well [20:04] Nebadon Izumi: i imagine the probably are though [20:04] Andrew Hellershanks: hm... There is no line 444 in that header file. [20:04] Justin Clark-Casey: Andrew: are you looking at r1755? [20:04] Andrew Hellershanks: I just grabbed the source tarball for 11.1 [20:05] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, it's not that version [20:05] Nebadon Izumi: ya thats actually much older [20:05] Nebadon Izumi: the tarball [20:05] Casias Falta: i am running win servers and dont seem to be getting the error you showed [20:05] Nebadon Izumi: those guys are worse than we are [20:05] Nebadon Izumi: lol [20:05] Dahlia Trimble is Online [20:05] Justin Clark-Casey: casias: how recent is the code that you're running? [20:06] Casias Falta: most recent that is in bin just checked yesterday [20:06] Andrew Hellershanks: I can't see how to get the svn copy of the code [20:06] Justin Clark-Casey: ok [20:06]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: under the develop link on the sourceforge sit [20:06] Justin Clark-Casey: site [20:06] Helena Franizzi is Online [20:06] Andrew Hellershanks: ok. I was at the official site. They don't provide the links there. [20:07] Nebadon Izumi: they are burried in there some where [20:07] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [20:07] Dahlia Trimble: gotta run, bye all :) [20:07]  Nebadon Izumi: see you Dahlia, thanks for coming [20:07]  Sarah Kline: bye Dahlia [20:07]  Casias Falta: cu dahlia [20:07]  Justin Clark-Casey: bye dahlia [20:07]  Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia [20:07]  Andrew Hellershanks: ok, checking out from downloading from svn now. [20:08]  Dahlia Trimble is Offline [20:08]  Justin Clark-Casey: The asserts are turned off in linux explicitly in configure, it might just be a case of turning them off under windows [20:08]  Nebadon Izumi: ah that would be awesome [20:08]  Justin Clark-Casey: though I would have thought the release configuration might have done that [20:08]  Nebadon Izumi: hmm [20:08]  Nebadon Izumi: ya i dont know much about C+ [20:09]  Andrew Hellershanks: so the only reason the asserts don't trigger in Linux is because they are turned off by default? [20:09]  Justin Clark-Casey: probably [20:09] Justin Clark-Casey: is that a bad thing? perhaps :) [20:09] Nebadon Izumi: heh [20:09]  Nebadon Izumi: duct tape much? [20:09]  Andrew Hellershanks: Would be worth turning them on in Linux and seeing if the same asserts showup [20:10]  Basil Sosides: bye [20:10]  Nebadon Izumi: see ya Basil [20:10]  Basil Sosides: have a nice evening [20:10]  Nebadon Izumi: you too [20:10]  Casias Falta: i got to go but for the record my regions running on win are .7.1 dev [20:10]  Basil Sosides: thanks all [20:10]  Casias Falta: cu you all [20:10]  Justin Clark-Casey: not really - I remember teravus saying he explicitly disabled them since they weren't all that useful for us [20:10]  Nebadon Izumi: see ya Casias [20:10]  Justin Clark-Casey: or at least, probably not useful unless you have some knowledge of physics [20:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: bye basil, casias [20:11]  Nebadon Izumi: ya i think unless someone is going to be actively developing the physics it shoud remain off [20:11] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, the assert is triggered from the result of a normalization operation [20:11] Nebadon Izumi: ya its a shame ive not seen Teravus in a while, im sure he'll be back eventually [20:11] Justin Clark-Casey: he's not even on irc right now [20:12] Nebadon Izumi: he could answer the question im sure [20:12] Nebadon Izumi: ya [20:12]  Nebadon Izumi: ive not seen him on IRC in a few weeks [20:12] Nebadon Izumi: might be able to dig out his email [20:12] Nebadon Izumi: im sure its on the -dev mail list some where [20:12] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I don't want to bother him if we can avoid it, though [20:12] Andrew Hellershanks: I think the error is indicating that a normalization operation returned a 0 result. [20:13] Justin Clark-Casey: ideally we needanother physics expert but they're rather thin on the ground :) [20:13]  Nebadon Izumi: heh ya [20:13]  Nebadon Izumi: not one of those easily picked up things [20:13]  Justin Clark-Casey: no [20:15]  Andrew Hellershanks: One suggestion to make. Add an assert on the variable a passed to the function before attempting the call to normalize. [20:15]  Andrew Hellershanks: It may be that the function is getting a bad value. [20:15]  Justin Clark-Casey: Actually attempting to fix the problem will be a last resort, at least for me right now :) [20:15] Nebadon Izumi: ya were probably passing lots of junk [20:15] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [20:16] Andrew Hellershanks: Passing a bad value to the function is probably the most likely cause of the assert being triggered. [20:18] Andrew Hellershanks: Ah. The assert in the header doesn't need to check a as that is done at the top of the normalize routine. [20:18] Helena Franizzi is Offline [20:20] Helena Franizzi is Online [20:21] Justin Clark-Casey: looking at this, I might just end up hacking the dNODEBUG assert into their premake4 lua file [20:21] Andrew Hellershanks: It got quiet in here all of a sudden [20:22] Richardus Raymaker: uhmm, just started to play with VS a few days ago. so C# still new [20:23] Nebadon Izumi: heh sorry [20:23] Nebadon Izumi: diva pinged me on IRC [20:23] Nebadon Izumi: got distracted [20:23] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, hopefully I can take a look at this later - there's a few other things I need to do first. Unless you can track down the problem to opensim, andrew, though I still think we need to disable the asserts unless someone is actively fixing physics [20:23] Nebadon Izumi: ya i agree Justin [20:23] Justin Clark-Casey: if that doesn't suppress the problem then we're kind of stuck [20:24] Nebadon Izumi: it should only be on if active development was happening [20:26] Andrew Hellershanks: VS? [20:27]  Richardus Raymaker: Visual studio 2010 [20:27] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, sounds fine. For production asserts should be off in both Linux and Windows. [20:27] stiofain nbmcmedia: gotta go folks interesting eavesdropping on u hopefully some of u will get to our xmas party in belfast on sunday [20:27] Richardus Raymaker: ok, right now the webkit :O [20:27] Richardus Raymaker: bye stiof [20:28] Andrew Hellershanks: I've been to that sim in SL [20:28]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, I need to go. Should be on IRC later. Bye folks [20:28] Andrew Hellershanks: or area. Maritime club. I think I have an LM for it [20:28] Nebadon Izumi: see ya justin, thanks for coming [20:28] Nebadon Izumi: talk soon [20:28] Sarah Kline: byes [20:28] Andrew Hellershanks: Hard to find out where that assert originates when it is in a header. cya, Justin. [20:28] Justin Clark-Casey waves [20:29] Justin Clark-Casey is Offline