Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-31

[09:26] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSimulator Server  0.6.3.8849  (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur) Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:False [09:33] Richardus Raymaker is Online [09:34] Richardus Raymaker is Offline [09:34] Mystical Brotherhood: hi teher [09:34] Mystical Brotherhood: there [09:34] Nebadon Izumi: hello [09:35] Mystical Brotherhood: how are you doing? [09:35] Nebadon Izumi: doing well :) [09:35]  Mystical Brotherhood: nice! [09:35]  Nebadon Izumi: how about yourself? enjoying the grid? [09:35]  Mystical Brotherhood: yes i am [09:35]  Richardus Raymaker is Online [09:35]  Nebadon Izumi: cool :) how long have you been using osgrid? [09:36] Mystical Brotherhood: nearly a year now [09:36] Nebadon Izumi: oh cool [09:36] Mystical Brotherhood: but i've not been consistent [09:36] Mystical Brotherhood: i have a region connected to it now [09:36] Nebadon Izumi: nice [09:36] Richardus Raymaker is Online [09:36] Mystical Brotherhood: i'm looking for a way to leave a comments box on the region [09:37] Nebadon Izumi: hmm ya there might be some mailboxes around [09:37] Nebadon Izumi: did you check the freebie garden here? [09:37] Nebadon Izumi: i think theres one over there [09:37] Mystical Brotherhood: mailbox! yes that's what they are called! ha [09:37] Mystical Brotherhood: no i didn't [09:37]  Nebadon Izumi: ya i do believe someone left one in the freebie area of this region [09:38] Nebadon Izumi: ya its next to the big roman column [09:38] Nebadon Izumi: in the center [09:38] Richardus Raymaker: brb [09:39] Mystical Brotherhood: sorry infant needed a new nappy [09:43] Nebadon Izumi: hehe cool you found it [09:43]  Mystical Brotherhood: yeah i did [09:43] Nebadon Izumi: :) [09:43]  Mystical Brotherhood: haven't seen a mailbox yet [09:43]  Nebadon Izumi: here [09:43]  Mystical Brotherhood: but i got a seat cushion [09:44]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [09:44]  Mystical Brotherhood: haha [09:44]  Nebadon Izumi: this yellow thing with red flag [09:44]  Mystical Brotherhood: haha [09:44]  Mystical Brotherhood: sorry [09:44]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [09:44]  Mystical Brotherhood: my baby has half my attention! [09:44]  Nebadon Izumi: no problem [09:44]  Nebadon Izumi: this place is a mess [09:44]  Charles Krinke is Online [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: ok well have fun plundering this place [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: i have a meeting to attend in the main building [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: starts in 15 minutes [09:45]  Mystical Brotherhood: i can altr all these things too right? [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: your welcome to attend [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: ya [09:45]  Mystical Brotherhood: its a developer meeting right? [09:45] Nebadon Izumi: should be full perms on this stuff [09:45] Nebadon Izumi: well its open to everyone [09:45] Nebadon Izumi: its our weekly town hall like meeting [09:45] Mystical Brotherhood: but its about development [09:45] Nebadon Izumi: not just development [09:45] Mystical Brotherhood: oh ok [09:45]  Nebadon Izumi: ya we do talk about that [09:45] Mystical Brotherhood: the wiki seemed to suggest taht it was [09:46] Nebadon Izumi: ya we usually open it up to questions about the grid too [09:46] Nebadon Izumi: as long as its opensim related [09:46] Mystical Brotherhood: maybe someone can help me turn on av2prim physics [09:46] Mystical Brotherhood: on my grid [09:46] Nebadon Izumi: ah make sure OpenDynamics Engine is selected [09:46] Mystical Brotherhood: when i try to stand on a cube i fall right through it [09:46]  Nebadon Izumi: and Meshmerizer [09:46] Nebadon Izumi: ya [09:46]  Nebadon Izumi: edit your opensim.ini [09:46] Nebadon Izumi: look for Meshmerizer and OpenDynamicsEngine [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: and make sure they are what is enabled [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: disable everything else [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: there will be a couple choices [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: then restart [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: should be fine after that [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: give that a shot if you have questions let me know [09:47] Mystical Brotherhood: thanks! [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: i'll be over in the building for the next couple hours [09:47] Nebadon Izumi: :) sure no problem [09:47]  Nebadon Izumi: have fun [09:48]  Nebadon Izumi: hello [09:48]  Charles Krinke: Morning [09:48]  Nebadon Izumi: doh looks like were missing a cusion [09:48]  Nebadon Izumi: maybe its just me [09:48]  Charles Krinke: I think I just fubarred a cushion on the couch [09:48]  Nebadon Izumi: is there a cushion missing next to you? [09:48]  Nebadon Izumi: oh [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: lol no worries [09:49]  Compile successful [09:49]  Charles Krinke: I was trying to sit and inadvertently clicked "take" [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: cause your estate manager you can [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [09:49]  Charles Krinke: Guess that makes me a griefer, today [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: ive done it on accident myself [09:49]  Nebadon Izumi: accidently took something in the sandbox once [09:50]  Nebadon Izumi: i didnt mean to take [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: i couldnt fix it [09:50]  Charles Krinke: Sorry about the wind patch last night, I didnt expect so much confusion [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: i felt bad [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: oh no worries [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: i just saw someone reported it [09:50]  Nebadon Izumi: was trying to ping you [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: wasnt a big deal [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: they actually fixed it [09:50]  Charles Krinke: I thought I was playing it real cool and nurturing mcortez along [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: by disabling wind in opensim.ini [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: which i see diva has done in trunk [09:50] Nebadon Izumi: it was nothing you or mcortez did [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: it was Jhurlimans libomb update [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: libomv [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: diva said she cant fix it until she speaks with him [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: so for now she disabled wind by default [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: until its resolved [09:51] Charles Krinke: Well, it could argued that patches need more testing before commit. Sometimes I guess right, sometimes not. [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: ya it likely might have worked [09:51] Nebadon Izumi: then jhurlimans patch would have broken it [09:51]  Nebadon Izumi: inadvertinly [09:52] Nebadon Izumi: so these things happen, not a big deal ultimatly [09:52] Nebadon Izumi: its gonna break from time to time [09:52] Charles Krinke: I tend to take the position that moving us along even at the risk of breakage is better then stagnation of patches. [09:52] Nebadon Izumi: ya [09:52]  Nebadon Izumi: it was very minor [09:52] Nebadon Izumi: really [09:52] Charles Krinke: But, I also admit that as time goes on, this position needs to become more conservative. [09:53] Bri Hasp is Online [09:53] Charles Krinke: Anyway,... I came a little early so I could watch the graphs over my shoulder. [09:53] Nebadon Izumi: ya [09:53]  Nebadon Izumi: i always get here a little early to evaluate the sims stability [09:53] Nebadon Izumi: do some cleaning [09:53] Charles Krinke: good point. [09:53] Nebadon Izumi: feels pretty good today [09:54] Mystical Brotherhood: that's nice system up there [09:54] Bri Hasp is Offline [09:54] Charles Krinke: I havent heard rom Adam other then to read his one or two posts on opensim-dev mailing list, by the way. [09:54] Nebadon Izumi: ya me either [09:54] Nebadon Izumi: bit disapointing no response [09:54] Nebadon Izumi: but we'll see [09:54] Nebadon Izumi: sure he is busy [09:55] Charles Krinke: Morning, Mystical [09:55] Richardus Raymaker: hello [09:55] Mystical Brotherhood: Afternoon Charles [09:55] Charles Krinke: Nebadon: if you or others need to evolve this plaza and remove or delete the treehouse or scriptwerks, I will not stand in the way [09:55] Richardus Raymaker: someone some idea why i have problems with latest svn's to let it run fine [09:55] Nebadon Izumi: k i thought about erasing scriptworks a few times [09:55] Nebadon Izumi: but ive just trimmed it down a bit [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: some of his scripts were abit harsh at times [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: but i left what wasnt effecting the sim [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: we should probably rebuild it though [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: something more up to date [09:56] Richardus Raymaker: again. i did today. its 8943 [09:56] Charles Krinke: Richardus, the wind and the libomv patch last night are a bit "worrisome" today [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: the treehouse is more landmark than anything [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [09:56] Richardus Raymaker: thats the problem 8810 works betetr then everything above [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: it is kinda ugly though [09:56] Nebadon Izumi: lol [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: ya richardus we'll have times where updating stops [09:57] Charles Krinke: If possible, it might be nice if the treehouse ended up as an object in an inventory that I could put on a different sim, maybe [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: while dev breaks everything for a week or 2 [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: then back to normal [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: especially whenever libomv is updated [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: expcet 2 weeks of breakage [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: easily [09:57] Nebadon Izumi: its pretty standard procedure at this point [09:57] Charles Krinke: Richardus. Libomv is the former libsecondlife. All our packet handling goes through it and a different team maintains it [09:58] BlueWall Slade is Online [09:58] Richardus Raymaker: so back to 8810 ? or thes a new version thats ok ? [09:58] Richardus Raymaker: hi charles [09:58] Nebadon Izumi: hard to say [09:58] Nebadon Izumi: ive not done much updating last few days [09:59] Nebadon Izumi: i was focusing on getting oars [09:59] Nebadon Izumi: of all the plazas and my own regions [09:59] Richardus Raymaker: here double hard, i fixt for now my isp problem. but cant say it 100% ok. and the sttill have not fixt it [09:59] Justin Clark-Casey is Online [10:00] Justin Clark-Casey: hello folks [10:00] BlueWall Slade: Hello [10:00] Charles Krinke: Morning, Justin. I hope in the fall, we can figure out the time changes to avoid a double dance if possible. [10:00] Ideia Boa: hej all [10:00] Nebadon Izumi: hello [10:01] Nebadon Izumi: i definatly like having the meetings at 11am [10:01] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [10:01] Nebadon Izumi: this should work out pretty good i hope for everyone [10:01] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, hopefully the confusion is over until Autumn, as Charles says [10:01] Charles Krinke: Maybe change back to 1900UTC in concert with the UK instead o f the US, or something [10:02] Richardus Raymaker: how late is that ? [10:02] Justin Clark-Casey: we changed in concert with the uk this time [10:02] Justin Clark-Casey: at the momnet it's 1900 British Summer Time here (which is 1800 UTC) [10:02] Charles Krinke: Yeah, I was trying to get us used to working everything on UTC and ignore daylkylight savings time, but it is not goiong over very well. [10:02] Richardus Raymaker: its her 20:00 [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: ya well i think we survived another flipping of the poles for now [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [10:03] Ideia Boa: here 20:02 [10:03] Justin Clark-Casey: well, it was triggered by my personal problem with actually getting to a meeting at 2000 BST [10:03] Charles Krinke: yep, thats abou tit. [10:04] Charles Krinke: Ok, normal agenda is 1) "recommended" for the week, 2) Things core developers need to say and ask, then 3) things testers and users need to say and ask [10:05]  Charles Krinke: We might wish to slip in a fourth item, whihc might be, any special announcements [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: oh justin something i wanted to mention to you [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: i think the oar freezing [10:05]  Richardus Raymaker: it seems the linked copy phantom bug is back.. if you link say 3 prims and then copy it. on the mast set the child prims get phantom. unlink it and it ok [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: is if i start a save oar while its still meshing [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: then it freezes [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: have to wait 4-5 minutes [10:05]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: interesting [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: after startup [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: then its fine [10:06]  Richardus Raymaker: but, would be nice to know if there's a betetr version then 8810 [10:06] Justin Clark-Casey: is it now possible to execute commands while things ar estill loading up (apart from scripts?) [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: yes [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: meshing [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: for 1 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: not sure about anything else [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: i can tell when CPU drops to 0 [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: meshing is done [10:06] Justin Clark-Casey: right, I didn't think that used to be possible before the console changes [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: only way to tell [10:06] Justin Clark-Casey: oh ok.... I thought meshing was done early on in startup though [10:06] Justin Clark-Casey: before, for instance, script loading [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: depends [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: on the complexity [10:06] Nebadon Izumi: 15000 prims [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: takes loong time to mesh [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: 100 prims takes seconds [10:07] Charles Krinke: Justin. You might want to glance at the screens over my shoulder with memory usage now and then after the meeting. They are very interesting [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: i can provide you the wright plazas oar [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: its 310 meg [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: or teravus plaza at 475 [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: if you need something heavy [10:07] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't think I could even get that to load on my system. Those files are huge [10:07] Nebadon Izumi: lol ya [10:08]  Nebadon Izumi: you have access to the box [10:08] Nebadon Izumi: feel free to kick a plaza when their empty [10:08] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, thanks [10:09] Charles Krinke: Question: If an oar is loaded on a different region, are the permission and owner bits staying the same? [10:09] Justin Clark-Casey: ckrinke: I see there are 3 mono instances on this sytem, one in debug [10:09] Justin Clark-Casey: charles: yes [10:09] Nebadon Izumi: if you stay on the same grid yes [10:09] Nebadon Izumi: if the user doesnt exist [10:09] Nebadon Izumi: it defaults to region owner [10:09] Nebadon Izumi: i think [10:09] Nebadon Izumi: right justin? [10:09] Justin Clark-Casey: that's right [10:09] Charles Krinke: Justin: Wright Plaza, Lbsa Plaza and Sandbox Plaza all run on this server [10:10] BlueWall Slade: I think Sandbox Plaza is the one running with --debug [10:10] Justin Clark-Casey: I'm grappling with the creator issue in my head right now - it's actually very difficult to preserve that info within the architectyure [10:11] Charles Krinke: I understand, Justin. It also ends up being a bit of political engineering [10:11] Justin Clark-Casey: indeed it does [10:11] BlueWall Slade: hehe [10:11] Justin Clark-Casey: it's all terribly terrible complicated [10:12] Charles Krinke: Certainly, we want to adhere to the dsires of various creators, but there are cases where all that is known is the creator UUID which might not be known on a given grid [10:12] Justin Clark-Casey: yes. There are different ways in which to overcome this, but all are far from ideal [10:13] Richardus Raymaker: hmm, transfer the region uuid as owner ? [10:13] BlueWall Slade: that would end up like tar files w/just the uid on a foreign system [10:13] Justin Clark-Casey: to some extent it is trying to work out which is the least evil and for which problems are likely to go away in the future [10:13] Richardus Raymaker: ugh, i mean the master avatar of the region [10:13] Justin Clark-Casey: well, I'm looking at this issue because for iars I really want to preserve creator info, at least [10:14] Charles Krinke: OSgrid has gone down the path of open source donations for many builds and scripts, which of course, side steps the issues that other grids face. [10:14] Justin Clark-Casey: It's an issue with oars as well but since there such big units it hasn't become such an issue yet, I think [10:14] Charles Krinke: Lets hope the "Nathez": doesnt dock next door [10:15] Justin Clark-Casey: the Nathez? [10:15] Richardus Raymaker: right chrinke [10:15] Charles Krinke: Natchez is a well-known SL build that ended up on OpenLife and created a scandal a month or so ago [10:16] Justin Clark-Casey: Oh right [10:16] Charles Krinke: Ok, anyway... "recommended" ?? [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: at this point for recommended version i say stay put 8849 if you want really stable [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: for now [10:17] Charles Krinke: 8849? 8939? [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: until were past this libomv [10:17] Justin Clark-Casey: have there been issues after the libomv upgrade? [10:17] Charles Krinke: ok, 8849 is fine with me for another week for a stable "recommended" [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: i think until thats settles theres not much point in making a release [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: ya wind is not working [10:17] Nebadon Izumi: it had to be disabled [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: diva says she cant fix it without speaking with jhurliman [10:18] Justin Clark-Casey: oh, so that is a libomv problem rather than a general bug? [10:18] Nebadon Izumi: seems to be [10:18]  Nebadon Izumi: according to diva [10:18] Justin Clark-Casey: ah right. I see she is speaking to him right now on #opensim-dev ;) [10:18] Charles Krinke: the libomv and the wind arrived at the same time and the issues are mushed together [10:18]  Nebadon Izumi: oh very cool [10:18]  Nebadon Izumi: i had not noticed that [10:18]  Richardus Raymaker: teleport problems is because bugs to ? [10:19]  Nebadon Izumi: not sure but likely [10:19]  Richardus Raymaker: hmm.. ok. then i need to step more back [10:19]  Nebadon Izumi: its hard to say but there are a enough bugs floating at this point to say lets not release anything right now

SIM CRASH

[10:25] Richardus Raymaker is Online [10:26] Ideia Boa: here we are again.... :-) [10:26] Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya [10:26]  Nebadon Izumi: sim crashed [10:26]  Dreamer Chen: ! [10:26]  BlueWall Slade is Online [10:26]  Justin Clark-Casey is Online [10:26]  Charles Krinke is Offline [10:27]  Nebadon Izumi: yay i got 1 shoe [10:27]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [10:27]  Fly Man is Offline [10:27]  Justin Clark-Casey: still bald though [10:27]  BlueWall Slade: hehe [10:27]  Nebadon Izumi: theres the other shoe [10:27]  BlueWall Slade: I see none [10:27]  Nebadon Izumi: still no hair [10:27]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [10:27]  Charles Krinke is Online [10:27]  BlueWall Slade: now one [10:27]  BlueWall Slade: hehe [10:27]  Programmer Mohr: so much for drinking and flying... [10:28]  Charles Krinke: Whoa [10:28]  Justin Clark-Casey: wb Mr Krinke [10:28]  Nebadon Izumi: yahooo [10:28]  Nebadon Izumi: hair [10:29]  Nebadon Izumi: ok so [10:29]  Charles Krinke: Aside: I think we need to figure out how to get some non-plaza regions with significant traffic to gain more data on the memory leak/freeze issue. [10:29] Nebadon Izumi: where were we [10:29]  Nebadon Izumi: ya [10:29]  Nebadon Izumi: i hadnt restarted teh plaza prior to the meeting [10:29] Nebadon Izumi: it was running for a while [10:29] Nebadon Izumi: before meeting started [10:29] Justin Clark-Casey: I was actually just about to ask what the situation is with Stefan's 0.6.4 release candidate branch [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: no doubt that lead to the early demise [10:30] Tiffany Sicling: Dradis is using over 800MB now, and it's been up for 2 hours [10:30] Charles Krinke: recent reliability? [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: some of my own regions were running for 8 days [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: before i restarted them yeterday [10:30] Nebadon Izumi: but they dont see many visitors [10:31] BlueWall Slade: anything around lbsa takes abeating from child agents [10:31] Charles Krinke: My current idea is for OSGrid to setup our own version of "Mystery Science Theatre 3000" with old B-Movies on Friday or Saturday nights and encourage visitors on a non-plaza region [10:31] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I run some low traffic regions and they don't have a memory issue over time [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya [10:31]  Nebadon Izumi: Lbsa plaza nieghbors are masochists :P [10:31] Tiffany Sicling: most of my traffic is seen as child from lbsa and other surrounding regions [10:31] BlueWall Slade: it is a good place to test things [10:31] Justin Clark-Casey: I personally think there is a genuine leak rather than a cache problem [10:31] Nebadon Izumi: being its the fall back region it by far sees the most traffic of any region on this grid [10:32] Justin Clark-Casey: but that's more a hunch than a known fact [10:32] Charles Krinke: We need a "biiiig" drive-ini movie theatre to test video, traffic and vehicle physics, all at the same time [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: i could oar up OKC theatre [10:32] Richardus Raymaker: get a scrapheap to then [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: for use on beefier hardware [10:32] Tiffany Sicling: what's weird, is I have another region that doesn't get much traffic at all, was up for a day, was taking 1.2GB of RAM... with less than 30 prims on it. [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: my windows regions [10:32] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSimulator Server  0.6.3.8849  (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur) Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:False [10:32] Nebadon Izumi: dont leak memory at all [10:33] Justin Clark-Casey: Tiffany: that is very curious [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: even my 12000 prim 1050 script region [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: doesnt leak a single bit of ram [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: ever [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: but the plaza regions [10:33] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: interesting. Would it be possible to run one of the leaking regions on windows rather than linux and see if that makes a difference? [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: omg [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: forget it [10:33]  Tiffany Sicling: the region is down, but it's name is Loudenville, Bluewall runs it [10:33]  Nebadon Izumi: its traffic justin [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: my linux regions would run for weeks too [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: but you start packing on people it leaks [10:33] Nebadon Izumi: most of my regions [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: im the only person who ever visits them [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: besides the ocasional explorer [10:34] Justin Clark-Casey: so you don't have any high traffic windows regions? [10:34] Tiffany Sicling sends her regions to the tire shop to fix the leaks [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: no one hangs out there long [10:34] Fly Man is Online [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: sure [10:34] Charles Krinke: How can we get an independent confirmation on a non-plaza regioin that helpps the devs move forward on this memory issue [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: Teravus and SeaPrior [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: are on windows 2003 [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: they leak too [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: just like this region [10:34] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, so it doesn't sound like a mono specific problem [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: i dont think its windows or .net or linux or mono [10:34] Nebadon Izumi: it crosses all boundries [10:35] Nebadon Izumi: big crack :) [10:35]  Justin Clark-Casey: heh [10:35]  Tiffany Sicling: any help I can do, logs, memory stats, etc. on Dradis (suburb of Lbsa Plaza ) I can do, please let me know [10:35]  Justin Clark-Casey: Tiffany: I might ask you if I get any time to work on this, though unfortunatley that might not happen this week [10:35]  BlueWall Slade: Justin I have logs from ther etoo [10:36]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Fly Man [10:36]  BlueWall Slade: so just ask [10:36]  Fly Man: Hello :) [10:36] Charles Krinke: Lets put a 'mall' on Justin's region and label it "next years black dress fashions preview" and then stand back to avoid being trampled. [10:36] Justin Clark-Casey: Charles: maybe you could try running with one of the basic mono profilers again? [10:36] Justin Clark-Casey: ha ha ha [10:36]  Tiffany Sicling: lol [10:36] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, if I ran a high traffic region the problem would really be hitting me in the face :) [10:36]  Fly Man: Yeah, I like the bench already ... [10:37]  Fly Man: Everyone is doing Yoga ... [10:37]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [10:37]  Fly Man: So yeah, what a way to start ;) [10:37] Justin Clark-Casey: there is actually a profiler called live-type which prints out class information stats every time the GC runs [10:37] Justin Clark-Casey: which might reveal if there is some massive object inflation in the system [10:38] paulie Flomar is Offline [10:38] Justin Clark-Casey: but I'm not sure how well that would work with high traffic regions, it's probably something I would try if I were to set about seriously trying to debug the issue [10:39] Justin Clark-Casey: that would actually be a good thing for a tester to try, though it would need a little bit of work to build the profiler [10:39] Charles Krinke: Well, either "we" (OSGrid) have made a mistake in diagnosis, or other standalones and grids are about to hit memory walls also. [10:40] Fly Man: Well, it depends what a wall would be [10:40]  Fly Man: There are some regions that I restart daily ... [10:40] Fly Man: but I haven't experienced high memory [10:40] Tiffany Sicling: I do know when swap file is touched... might as well reboot linux [10:41] Charles Krinke: Well, this ossue just seems to be one that goes on and on and tends to be worrisome. [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: ya i might need to reboot this server actually [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: as well as the windows box [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: seems to help alot [10:41] Justin Clark-Casey: perhaps it might be worth seeing if one of the other core devs can spend some time on it? Do you think this issue has much visibility outside this meeting? [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: making things stable for couple days anyway [10:41] BlueWall Slade: yeah I find Mono 2.2 / 2.4 dies when you get into swap pretty good [10:41] Tiffany Sicling: what's weird is, even after I kill all mono sessions, the memory is still being taken up by invisible something... I have to reboot to recover it [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: ya your cache will [10:42] Charles Krinke: Justin. I dont think so. I think the perception is that we are potentially making a bigger deal of it then is justified. [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: but still even if you flush linux cache out [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: and get the memory back [10:42] BlueWall Slade: 2.0.1 does weird things like consuming all of swap [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: its still unstable [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: until you reboot [10:42] Fly Man: well, the strange thing is that everyone is till at 1.9.1 or 2.0.1 [10:42] Fly Man: and I have seen things happen with that one [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: ya i tried em all [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: and im stuck at 2.0.1 [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: if i want it to run more than 20 minutes [10:42] Tiffany Sicling: isn't there any cleanup ability to clear memory no longer used in mono/opensim ? [10:42] Justin Clark-Casey: isn't 2.4 out soon? [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: ya [10:43]  Richardus Raymaker: suse seems not to have newer one the 2.0.1 [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: RC is out for 2.4 [10:43] Charles Krinke: Perhaps more conversations with SDague? [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: It should be clear as soon as you kill the processes. Something odd is happening in your system [10:43] BlueWall Slade: I migrated up Fly Man, but wnet back because of the swaps space issues [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: buy i find anything beyond 2.0.1 [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: is unusable with opensim [10:43] Snowdrop Short: 2.4 was released yesterday [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: you get ODE errors galore [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: snowdrop: oh right [10:43] Nebadon Izumi: and trampolines [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: anyone tried 2.4 yet? [10:43] Tiffany Sicling: well, the memory thing started as soon as I updated to mono 2.0.1 [10:43] Fly Man: Justin, on 2.5 TRUNK [10:44] BlueWall Slade: I think the GC is having issues when it gets into swap [10:44] Fly Man: and I haven't experienced issues so far [10:44] Snowdrop Short: I haven't been able to build 2.4 yet :-( [10:44]  Justin Clark-Casey: there's definitely a 'trampoline' problem in 2.2, but I'm wondering if that has been fixed in 2.4 [10:44]  Nebadon Izumi: it wasnt in RC1 [10:44]  Justin Clark-Casey: snowdrop: Ah, so no binaries yet? [10:44]  Nebadon Izumi: 2.4 RC1 had lots of trampolines [10:44]  Fly Man: BUT: [10:44]  Nebadon Izumi: also [10:44]  Dahlia Trimble is Online [10:44]  Nebadon Izumi: 2.5 does too [10:44]  Fly Man: I didn't compile with that patch [10:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: I saw a bug report which suggested it may have been fixed at some point, though if it's present in RC1 that's not too encouraging [10:45]  Fly Man: that one that outputs info [10:45]  Nebadon Izumi: 2.5 has major trampoline errors too [10:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: oh man [10:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: somebody should really report that to the mono guys [10:45] Nebadon Izumi: flyman didnt you talk to them? [10:45] Nebadon Izumi: maybe we can relay some info to them [10:45] Nebadon Izumi: they dont seem very receptive though [10:46] Richardus Raymaker: hi dahlia [10:46] Dahlia Trimble: Hi :) [10:46]  Nebadon Izumi: hey dahlia :) [10:46] Fly Man: Yes, but haven't heard back from them [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: Nebadon: oh right? In what way? [10:46] Nebadon Izumi: ah they seem on the war path thats all [10:46] Nebadon Izumi: forging ahead without much input [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: I'm beginning to think that we're the major stresser of mono :) Often when I look up mono bugs I end up seeing our mantis reports quite high up on the list [10:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: hum [10:46]  Charles Krinke: Soundslike us, sometimes [10:47]  Charles Krinke: "forging ahead without much inpuyt" [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [10:47]  BlueWall Slade: jhurliman is proabbly a good person to contact them. [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: ya im not saying its a bad thing [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: just that sometimes they arent really listening [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: just kinda nodding at you [10:47]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, it's tough [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [10:47]  Richardus Raymaker: why is there not some .net to linux C++ converter ? [10:47]  Justin Clark-Casey: almost makes one want to install everything on windows ;) [10:47] Nebadon Izumi: lol [10:47] Justin Clark-Casey jokes [10:47] Richardus Raymaker: so you can run without mono [10:47] Nebadon Izumi: well i am there at the moment [10:48] Nebadon Izumi: only because its more convienient [10:48] BlueWall Slade: I don't even have windows [10:48] BlueWall Slade: lol [10:48] Nebadon Izumi: in my haste to reorganize hardware [10:48] Nebadon Izumi: it was just easier to slap on windows [10:48] Charles Krinke: Its pobably a similar poblem. If a developer runs a unit or integration test and it succeeds, it becomes difficult to visualize the stress we give the software on a plaza like this one. [10:48] Justin Clark-Casey: yes [10:48] Fly Man: Well, Justin knows what we need ... [10:48] Fly Man: and it's called Profiling [10:49] sim core needs and auto memory flush for the sim [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't blame you for running windows - it is going to perform better than mono right now, I shoudl think [10:49] Charles Krinke: ok, so lets investigate profiling a bit on a few regions. [10:49] BlueWall Slade: yes, the interaction between avatars and regions, regions and regions does a lot o fthings [10:49] Tiffany Sicling: yea, I was tempted to trash my server and put windoze on it lol [10:49] Nebadon Izumi: ya mostly for me it was i didnt have time ro recompile the kernel 15 times [10:49] BlueWall Slade: that would trash it [10:49]  Nebadon Izumi: and look for missing dependancies [10:49] Nebadon Izumi: i needed to get the sims running in a few hours [10:49] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [10:49] Richardus Raymaker: but nobody give windows for free, besides that. then im getting stressed :) [10:49] sim core: I run win xp and mac osx now [10:50]  Nebadon Izumi: i need to get more linux friendly hardware [10:50]  Justin Clark-Casey: Fly-Man-: To be blunt, I think what we really need is a core dev to sit down for a few days and analyze the heck out of it [10:50]  Nebadon Izumi: thats my biggest problem [10:50]  Tiffany Sicling: I'm afraid to put a region back on my OSX box lol [10:50]  Justin Clark-Casey: getting the time is a problem [10:50]  Fly Man: Justin, still he/she needs to have info where to look ;) [10:50] Richardus Raymaker: i go put osgrid regions back on stranger server. with linux [10:50] sim core: Osx is good, if not perfect [10:50] Fly Man: And Profiling would help [10:50] Nebadon Izumi: i saw adam and was it 3di or Rex was doing load testing [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: Fly-Man-: True. I hear that profiling is better on windows (though maybe that is with commercial tools) [10:50] Tiffany Sicling: yea, but memory leaks still occur on OSX too [10:50] Nebadon Izumi: the data is on adams blog [10:51] Dahlia Trimble: I've been following some of the Intel profiling efforts but I cant say I understand them very well [10:51] sim core: Indeed, memory leaks are cumulative on both systems ( win/ osx ) [10:51] Nebadon Izumi: http://www.gwala.net/blog/ [10:51] BlueWall Slade: Justin - do you have a url for that profiling tool? [10:51] sim core: Just seems on osx it's more robist when swap files are kicking in [10:51]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: which one? [10:51] BlueWall Slade: I googled, but get some Apple video tool [10:51] sim core: *Robust [10:51] BlueWall Slade: live-type [10:51] Charles Krinke: live-type [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: i think when your dealing in terms of GC 64 bit will always be more efficient [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: in that sense [10:52] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: are you running on mono? [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: 32 bit has to peddle harder [10:52] BlueWall Slade: yes [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: hence macs more efficent feel [10:52] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: if you type man mono and then search for PROFILERS you shoudl see it [10:52]  BlueWall Slade: ok, thanks [10:52] Nebadon Izumi: but getting it up and running on 64 bit isnt always easy [10:52] Tiffany Sicling: eaglefx has issues with 64bit but not sure exactly what they are [10:53] Fly Man: Well, I'm still pressing on the button to get more information about a region [10:53] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: if one of those classes reaches some big number then that would give a good clue as to where a leak may be [10:53]  Fly Man: but that's in line after the OSProfile [10:53] BlueWall Slade: I have to order a new MB so I can get more RAM ni teh box [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: live type prints out the number of objects of each class every time the GC runs [10:54] Nebadon Izumi: oh since were talking about hardware [10:54] Nebadon Izumi: let me show you guys something [10:54] BlueWall Slade: I run really goo if I keep keep some headroom in RAM [10:54] BlueWall Slade: good [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: oh sorry, number of bytes consumed, not number of objects [10:54] Nebadon Izumi: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813121359 [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: actually, might even be interesting to hack the code just to prin tout the top 5 or even the top 2.... [10:54] Nebadon Izumi: i found this motherboard on ebay [10:54] Justin Clark-Casey: hmmmmm [10:54] Nebadon Izumi: for 110$ [10:55] Nebadon Izumi: with 2gb ram [10:55] Nebadon Izumi: its a Dual core 1.6ghz atom [10:55] Nebadon Izumi: 45nm [10:55] Nebadon Izumi: i imagine these might make pretty good region servers [10:55] Nebadon Izumi: throw a ssd drive on there [10:55] Nebadon Izumi: you could probably run a few regions [10:55] Justin Clark-Casey: diva says she ehink the wind module problem may be mono-addins related, but isn't to do with libomv [10:55] Teravus Ousley is Online [10:56] Richardus Raymaker: not so fast, pahge still loading.. nice is to have a I7 board. its haveing 6 ram slots [10:56] Nebadon Izumi: ok thanks for update justin [10:56] Fly Man: But do we have a "Supported version" for this week ? [10:56] Tiffany Sicling: hi eaglefx [10:56] Richardus Raymaker: 8849 ? [10:56] Dahlia Trimble: "Supported"? [10:56] Richardus Raymaker: hi eagle [10:56] Nebadon Izumi: ya i7 would be nice [10:56] Charles Krinke: 8849 [10:56] Nebadon Izumi: but your talking about 800$ minumum [10:56] Nebadon Izumi: for hardware [10:56] Charles Krinke: 8849 is "recommended" for this sweek [10:57] Teravus Ousley: heh, I always recommend running release versions for production systems :) [10:57]  Tiffany Sicling: how is 8849 doing ? [10:57]  Charles Krinke:, too conservative [10:57]  Richardus Raymaker: yeah, board is expoensiev 259 euro here. then 6GB memory and cpu needed. [10:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: anybody here running a production system? :) [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: openlifegrid [10:57] Fly Man: *raises hand* [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: lol [10:57] Nebadon Izumi: jk [10:58]  Justin Clark-Casey: ooh, HomerH just volunteered to look at the wind module [10:58] Justin Clark-Casey: heh [10:58] Nebadon Izumi: everythings 100% and perfect over there :P [10:58] Charles Krinke: good [10:58] Justin Clark-Casey: Fly-Man-: You are a brave man, sir :) [10:58]  Fly Man: I am ;) [10:58] Fly Man: You should have seen my first TV experience ;) [10:58]  Teravus Ousley: http://teravus.wmcv.com/googletester/twf.avi [10:58]  BlueWall Slade: hah - all the "production" people seem to distance themselves from us [10:58]  Charles Krinke: I gotta go do my manager dance with memo wars, posturing staements, political engineering [10:59]  Justin Clark-Casey: they do? [10:59]  Justin Clark-Casey: bye Charles [10:59]  BlueWall Slade: Have fun CK [10:59]  Charles Krinke is Offline [10:59]  Nebadon Izumi: see ya charles [10:59]  BlueWall Slade: naah, Justin - just not many show up here. [10:59]  Teravus Ousley: http://teravus.wmcv.com/googletester/twf.avi <-- Bullet physics plugin test [10:59]  Nebadon Izumi: nice [10:59]  Nebadon Izumi: im downloading now [11:00]  Fly Man: Ahh, good 1st of April joke Teravus ;) [11:00] Teravus Ousley: it isn't quite ready for the likes of wright plaza yet.. but it can do basic things.. [11:00] Teravus Ousley: heh, that was no joke. [11:00] Nebadon Izumi: nice [11:00] Fly Man: Ooo, okay :p [11:00] Fly Man grins [11:00] Nebadon Izumi: if you need some crazy hardware to test on [11:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: They're too busy rebooting their servers ;) [11:00]  Nebadon Izumi: i can offer up my Q9400 CPU [11:00]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [11:00]  Fly Man whispers: Neb, we need to tal later btw ;) [11:01] Nebadon Izumi: k FLy Man [11:01] Nebadon Izumi: i'll be around on IRC [11:01] Fly Man: Neb, need ya inworld ;) [11:01]  Richardus Raymaker: nice mainboard on newegg. but small [11:01]  Teravus Ousley: Cool. I want to get a linux version compiled and then I'll commit what I have and work from there. [11:01]  Nebadon Izumi: oh ok [11:01]  Nebadon Izumi: no problem fly-man [11:01]  Richardus Raymaker: then you need many of them.. = hig energy usage [11:01]  Justin Clark-Casey: why such a lowres video Teravus? [11:01]  Nebadon Izumi: ya well you can on ebay get the entire machine [11:01]  Nebadon Izumi: for 110$ [11:01]  Justin Clark-Casey: or do I simply have too big a screen [11:01]  Nebadon Izumi: wtih 2gb ram and cpu [11:01]  Nebadon Izumi: so for like less than 200$ [11:02]  Nebadon Izumi: you could build a server pretty much [11:02]  Nebadon Izumi: small HD [11:02]  Nebadon Izumi: and mini case [11:02]  Teravus Ousley: heh, lowrez because I wanted a small file :) [11:02] Dahlia Trimble: everyone downloads ter's video at the same time :/ [11:02] Nebadon Izumi: you should try youtube [11:02] Richardus Raymaker: what cpu do you have then ? [11:02] Nebadon Izumi: they really compress em down nice [11:02] Nebadon Izumi: you can download the mp4 from them [11:02] Dahlia Trimble: they let you download now? [11:03] Nebadon Izumi: it will turn a 1gb file into about 100-150meg file [11:03] Nebadon Izumi: ya well [11:03] Nebadon Izumi: they dont advertise you can download it [11:03]  Nebadon Izumi: let me get you some instructions [11:03] Fly Man: K, some issues have been fixed this week [11:03] Nebadon Izumi: http://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2008/04/download-youtube-videos-as-mp4-files.html [11:03] Fly Man: but I still see a simple issue reoccuring: [11:03] Nebadon Izumi: this will allow you to download the low-res Mp4 [11:03] Dahlia Trimble: ty :) [11:03]  Fly Man: "Mantus reports" [11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: http://www.sizlopedia.com/2008/12/20/download-youtube-hd-videos-in-mp4/ [11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: this lets you do HD youtube vids [11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: i use it all the time [11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: ive actually been using youtube [11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: as my render farm for converting video [11:04]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [11:04]  Dahlia Trimble: lol [11:04]  Teravus Ousley: heh [11:05]  Teravus Ousley: maybe I should get divX or something also [11:05]  Tiffany Sicling: I get a black screen and no sound, even with VLC [11:05]  Fly Man: But do we have some other things to talk about ? [11:05]  Teravus Ousley: It uses the 'Microsoft Video 1' codec. [11:06]  Fly Man: Else I will be back onto Profile work [11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: http://cole2k.net [11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: is the codec pack i use [11:06]  Nebadon Izumi: it installs virtually every format known to man [11:06] Richardus Raymaker: can someone try a ping to osgrid from europe ? [11:07] Fly Man: richardus: 95 ms [11:07]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, I think I shall pop off now [11:07] Richardus Raymaker: i have almost 50% packetloss. yes its my isp [11:07] Justin Clark-Casey: hopefully everybody got move of the meeting time back to 1800 UTC for the summer... :) [11:07] Programmer Mohr: Reply from 4.71.184.27: bytes=32 time=86ms TTL=54 [11:07]  Dahlia Trimble: me too.. bye all :) [11:07] Richardus Raymaker: now its ok again [11:08] Fly Man: k [11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: bye dahlia [11:08] Fly Man is off as well [11:08] Dahlia Trimble is Offline [11:08] Teravus Ousley: heh, happy pre april fools.. [11:08] Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia [11:08] Justin Clark-Casey: bye folks [11:08] Fly Man: *waves* [11:08] Fly Man is Offline [11:08] Programmer Mohr: going too [11:08] Justin Clark-Casey waits with anticipation as to what is going to happen [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: lol [11:08] Justin Clark-Casey: on April Fool's that is [11:09]  Teravus Ousley: I guess I was late.. and not early [11:09] Teravus Ousley: go figure :P [11:09] Justin Clark-Casey is Offline [11:09] Programmer Mohr: if someone need a testregion... i have a few.. just contact me [11:10] Programmer Mohr: bye for now [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: ok well i think that about wraps up this weeks meet [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: unless anyone has anything else [11:10] Tiffany Sicling: not at this time :) [11:10]  BlueWall Slade: Thanks! good meeting. [11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: ok well until next week then [11:10]  sim core: Oh right, can anyone tell-me what the 'un-ack' indicator in the 'show stats' command meand? [11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: i'll be on iRC if needed [11:11]  sim core: *Means [11:11]  sim core: I get about half a billion ( really ) of thse sometimes [11:11]  Tiffany Sicling: Great meeting, guys [11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: basiclly it means packet loss i think [11:11]  sim core: *Those [11:11]  sim core: Hum, thank-you :-) [11:11] Nebadon Izumi: or out of order packets to maybe [11:11] Nebadon Izumi: i think anyway [11:11] Nebadon Izumi: un-acknowlesdged [11:11] Nebadon Izumi: is what it means i think [11:11] sim core: Well, happens both on mac osx and win xp [11:12]  sim core: And seems the messages that it creates makes it lag a lot [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:12]  Nebadon Izumi: sounds like packet loss to me [11:12]  eaglefx Binder: will u post it on the Wiki, i came in late. [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: i will [11:12] Tiffany Sicling: I've had packet loss even on a 100Mb LAN [11:12] sim core: That would mean a client oversizing theirs bandwith, maybe? [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: i have the entire log [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: even before we crashed [11:12] sim core: *Their [11:12] eaglefx Binder: Ok [11:12]  Richardus Raymaker: unackB = 2581 here. thats for lets say 1 hour running [11:13] eaglefx Binder: i have been hanging out with SL live Billig chat for over and hour now.. LOL Geeee [11:13] Richardus Raymaker: you always lost some packet. but not to much [11:13] sim core: Sometimes it remains at zero, but most of the time it goes into millions or 10 times more even... [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: ya if its that high thats bad [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: might be router freaking out [11:13] Richardus Raymaker: hm sound not good [11:13] sim core: If it's packet loss, I'll try to pinpoint the problem [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: ya it definatly is [11:14]  sim core: Oddly enough, it's not allways [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: hmm sounds like router then maybe [11:14] sim core: And mostly when people login or logout [11:14] eaglefx Binder: did you talk about the bad stuff that happened since 8938 today? [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: ya i bet your router cant handle the massive influx of requests [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: its dropping packets [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: i have a neatgear that does that too [11:14] sim core: Is it router side or client side? [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: hard to say could be either really [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: my 1st guess [11:15] BlueWall Slade is Offline [11:15] Tiffany Sicling: 8938 kills itself to shell after a osTeleportAgent transfer from it to another region [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: is router [11:15] sim core: So the indicator is not defined for one or the other, then [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: NAT can be overwhelmed [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: almost DOS like [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: the way it treats it [11:15]  Nebadon Izumi: what kind of router is it? [11:15] sim core: I see no droppped packets on the router interface [11:15] sim core: 2701 [11:15] Richardus Raymaker: i have a replaced RV042. not a bad one. but its not easy to see. because without router you dotn use the interent (the same way) [11:15] BlueWall Slade is Online [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: thats good [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: maybe bad cable? [11:16] Nebadon Izumi: any wireless on your net? [11:16] Richardus Raymaker: sorry its a linksys [11:16] sim core: Yes, wireless and ethernet regions [11:16] Richardus Raymaker: no, no not wireless here [11:16] Tiffany Sicling: hehe, linksys [11:16] sim core: Gateway 2701 G [11:16]  Teravus Ousley: k.. I guess I'll go also :P [11:17] sim core: See-you, terravus [11:17] sim core: *Teravus [11:17] Tiffany Sicling: my experience with linksys is they have a small NAT table [11:17] Teravus Ousley: take care. Have a good day before April 1 [11:17] Tiffany Sicling: bye Teravus :) [11:17]  Teravus Ousley is Offline [11:17]  sim core: Wpuldn't it be noted in the router log if it was it that dropped the packets? [11:18]  sim core: I mostly suspect the clients dropping [11:18]  Richardus Raymaker: ok. see you later. time to call isp again [11:18]  sim core: Maybe from the linden UDP setting, maybe? [11:18]  Richardus Raymaker is Offline [11:19]  Ideia Boa: Bye all, have a good day and true April 1 [11:20]  eaglefx Binder: well seems like i got my account back now on SL ... HAHA Geees they are bad. [11:20]  Nebadon Izumi: ok guys i gotta run [11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: before my phone rings again [11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: lol need lunch [11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: take care guys [11:21]  Nebadon Izumi: see ya soon