Chat log from the meeting on 2014-08-05

[11:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello [11:00] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: hey neb [11:00] Dev Random: hello Nebadon. enjoy your sit. [11:00] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: hey RiRa [11:01] Richardus Raymaker: hi bluewall all [11:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: :) [11:01]  Cuteulala Artis is Offline [11:01]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org is Online [11:02]  Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: hi Justin [11:02]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: hi folks [11:02]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Hi justin [11:02]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: just got done updating the OSCC grid to master git [11:02]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: logging in my bots now [11:02]  Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: I was looking at Mantis 7259 (http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=7259) and question whether it really should have been closed. I completely disagree with Sylvia that it's "not a bug" because it *is* a bug, but it's documented. In a 1.0 release either the ideal case: the restriction against two adjacent regions being different sizes should be removed; or there should be some built-in mechanism to prevent two dissimilar-sized regions from being created adjacent to one another. [11:02] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: The average user isn't going to go plumbing the depths of wiki to find out why they suddenly can't walk between two regions (but *can* tp between them)...they're going to instantly assume it's a bug. And it is. And even if we assume Sylvia's comment about "you should have read the wiki first" isn't intended to be snarky, who's to say that someone won't plunk down a var beside one of my regular regions and then I would somehow magically be expected to have familiarized myself with var regions in order to understand why I can't walk over to visit my new neighbour. [11:03] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: nebadon: I just this second may have found out why pCampbot is crashing [11:03] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: nice [11:03] Richardus Raymaker: hi justin. [11:03] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: something on the client side i hope? [11:03] Richardus Raymaker: strange sicnme 0.8 i havenmot got problems with var -> normal var. but this private. hmm [11:03] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: im using 2 computers for my bots today, 40 on each machine [11:03] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I believe it's connected with seting the connection limit on the service point. It causes a problem in an unepxected place internally within mono [11:03] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: one is linux one is windows [11:03] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: so this may be technically a mono bug [11:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: oh that sucks [11:04] Richardus Raymaker: better use windows :) [11:04]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I can get it to stop spewing a certain class of failure if I disable chnging that limit, but then it' sback to only 2 simultaneous connections to a service point until the code is restructed to reintroduce it without causing other issuers [11:05]  Dahlia Trimble is Online [11:05]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: like a massive amount of other timeout I'm seeing on caps - could be that libomv caps system is too aggressive with simultaneous requests - I've already addressed a similar issue on read [11:05]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ho hum [11:05]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok [11:05]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: well it sounds like progress even if your not sure on a fix [11:05]  Ubit Umarov is Online [11:05]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so that is good [11:06]  Sheera.Khan @hypergrid.org:8002: Hiyas :-) [11:06] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: o/ [11:06]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello [11:06] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Hi Sheera [11:08] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: mata: maybe, you should ask kenvc [11:08] Kayaker Magic: I saw a bunch of mantis emails last week, looked like old issues that had been fixed but never marked closed until now. Someone cleaning house? [11:08] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yes [11:08] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it was a script that did some cleanup [11:08] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: nothing to be concerned about [11:08] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it closed aprox 900 resolved manti [11:08] Latif Khalifa is Online [11:09] Kayaker Magic: Ah, but I only got emails for ones I had posted to, so for a minute I though someone was fixing all MY bugs! [11:09] Kayaker Magic: LOL [11:09] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: I guess my point is the whole point of Mantis is to have a place to report issues that shouldn't be there in a 1.0 release and leave them open there until they're fixed [11:09] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: nope, ya anything you ever commented on [11:09]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: you will receive any update to the ticket [11:10] Dahlia Trimble: hi [11:10]  Latif Khalifa: hello [11:10] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Hi Dahlia [11:10] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Hi Latif [11:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello [11:11] Richardus Raymaker: hi all [11:11] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: and when I encounter one, I go to Mantis to find out if someone has reported it; I don't go to see if wiki has a report [11:11] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Justin, you disabled AvatarAppearance messages during last weeks load test. Wondered if your findings similar to ours? [11:11] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: Billy: I did a range of things. [11:12] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: so it's not yet possible to determine what did what [11:13] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Our concern was with the viewer, the message sends VisualParams, that for 100+ avi could cause pproblems [11:13] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: have you made measurements? [11:14] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: some, but at a network level. There maybe othe results I will check [11:15] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: need published data [11:15] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: agree [11:16] Sarah Kline is Online [11:18] Sarah Kline: hi [11:18]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: anyone have anything else they wanted to talk about this week? [11:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello Sarah [11:18] Vivian Klees: hi sarah [11:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i just about have 40 bots logged into load test already [11:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so much easier using 2 computers [11:19] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so quiet this week :) [11:19]  Richardus Raymaker: vacation time [11:20]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: abitary question, why does OSGrid avis not include a suitcase? [11:20]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: because of how we configured the grid [11:21]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: the suitcae is meant to really provide an extra layer of protection for more private grids [11:21]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: where the grid operator also manages and operates all the regions themselves [11:21]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: in an open grid like OSgrid it provides no protection since the grid is open already [11:22]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its only really useful in grids that are not open where anyone can host their own region [11:22]  Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: @Dahlia: do you have any guestimate on implementing the advanced mats part of get/set params? I have a project I want to work on and if it's imminent I'll put it off until it's working....if it's more likely to be months away then I'll do the project without it [11:25] Dahlia Trimble: Mata, sorry, no, there are some issues with it that need to be resolved forst [11:25] Dahlia Trimble: *first [11:25] Dahlia Trimble: there is a problem with the way materials are stored [11:26] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: kk...so probably better I just go ahead and assume it's a long time away (if ever) [11:26] Dahlia Trimble: for now, yes unfortunately [11:27] Cuteulala Artis is Online [11:27] Andrew Hellershanks is Online [11:28] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: perhaps that also explains where there are sometimes some odd quirks when editing them with the viewer too [11:28] Andrew Hellershanks: I was working on something and almost forgot about the meeting. [11:28] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello [11:29] Dahlia Trimble: Mata, materials use some protocol hacks that aren't really well suited for real time editing [11:29] Dahlia Trimble blames LL [11:30]  Dahlia Trimble: so yes I suspect there will bee occasional quirks while editing [11:30] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: which is funny since real-time editing was one of their big "selling features" :p [11:30] Andrew Hellershanks is Offline [11:30] Andrew Hellershanks is Online [11:30] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: it's disappointing but such is life [11:31] Dahlia Trimble: why LL did the materials protocol the way they did is beyond me but I dont think it was very well thought out [11:31] Andrew Hellershanks: Dang viewer still crashes when switching workspaces. :P [11:31] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: maybe something they decided to add later in the design process and had to shoehorn in there [11:32] Sarah Kline: It was a TPV that worked on it. as an addition [11:32] Dahlia Trimble: it was pushed on them by one of the TPV groups but I dont know who was responsible for the protocol [11:34] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: oh...the issue is with the advanced mats part, rather than just with real-time edits in general....gatcha [11:34] Latif Khalifa is Offline [11:34] Dahlia Trimble: anyway it's pretty complex and ugly for something that could have been very simple [11:35] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: I guess that also means bump-mapping, SSS, etc aren't likely to get added anytime either [11:35] Latif Khalifa is Online [11:36] Dahlia Trimble: dont know wny you need bump if you have normal [11:36] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: they map differently in a render [11:36] Dahlia Trimble: but the materials are extensible so a viewer could add bump if they chose to [11:38]  Kayaker Magic: Neb, I have a gadget to give away, shows mantis 6743 bug, can I give it to you to put on the table to hive out copies? [11:38] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: sure [11:38] Dahlia Trimble: what would be bad is if one viewer added new materials/shader types and another did something different [11:39] Kayaker Magic gave you Turning Card Compass. [11:39] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: yes, that would be a nightmare [11:39] albertlr Landar is Online [11:39] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it gives an error [11:39] Dahlia Trimble: it's possible with the materials system [11:39] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: looks like its missing content inside [11:39] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: when you click it [11:40]  Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: would be amazing to have Blender patched into a viewer and somehow manage real-time renders :p [11:40] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: probably have to borrow CERN's computing facilities to achieve that though [11:41] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya that would be very difficult to do something like that [11:41] Kayaker Magic: This compass Neb is putting out, it works if you attach it to a vehicle, it works if you wear it as an attachment and walk around, but it fails if you wear it as an attachment and sit in a vehicle (or a chair) in avatar direction mode. [11:41] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: not so much you need a lot of computing power [11:41] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: complete with full ray-tracingg! [11:41] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: would require a lot of man hours in programming [11:41] Dahlia Trimble: Mata, well good luck waiting for that :P [11:41] Kayaker Magic: This means you cannot use it as a hud in a vehicle. [11:41] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: lol...yeah....need quantum processors first [11:41] Kayaker Magic: Oh, it is missing a help file if you touch it unattached. [11:42] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya no biggie [11:42] Kayaker Magic: Touch it while worn as a hud and it switches between two modes: Heading and bearing. [11:42] Kayaker Magic: Bearing fails to work because of mantis 6743 [11:43] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: probably something with the linkset order [11:43] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: things change when avatar sits [11:43] mattie mcbride is Online [11:44] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: does it work if its linked as a non-root prim? [11:44] Kayaker Magic: yes, in a vehicle [11:44] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: k wierd [11:44] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I think avatars are added to the end of the link-chain [11:44] Kayaker Magic: Yes, that was a fix a while ago [11:44] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: so the root prim should stay the same [11:44] Andrew Hellershanks: How do I get the compass? [11:45] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: oh...that reminds me of an odd bug I encountered this week but haven't rested enough yet to report.....I was doing a script to change the colour of the headband that is part of my hair....when I check the link number using FS and set that in the script, it changes on of the hair flexi-prims instead [11:45] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: there [11:45] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i made it copyable [11:45] Andrew Hellershanks: ty [11:45]  Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: if I use llGetPrimitiveParams to find out the link number if gives a completely different result (which *will* work with the script) [11:46] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org is Offline [11:46] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org is Online [11:46] Kayaker Magic: Is that a FS viewer bug? [11:46] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: I encountered that on 2 different hairs, but otherwise I've never seen that [11:46] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.8.1 Dev          de3421b: 2014-08-02 08:21:25 -0400 (Unix/Mono) [11:46] vegaslon.plutonian @hg.osgrid.org: it is the same in singularity [11:46] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: could be FS. [11:47] vegaslon.plutonian @hg.osgrid.org: the veiwer reported link number is diffrent then the link number in opensim [11:47] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: crashed. Kind of about sums it up right now] [11:47] Kayaker Magic: I've had so much trouble with link numbers changing that I always script to search for the prim I want. [11:47] TBG Renfold: same here [11:47] Kayaker Magic: by name [11:47] Richardus Raymaker: thats how i solved it always [11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: iOdd. CoolVL doesn't seem to be putting the item in to my inventory. [11:47] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, that was my only solution too [11:47] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: just wondering *why* ut happens [11:48] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: (and i don't do enough building in SL to know if the bug exists there too) [11:49] Richardus Raymaker: sofar i have not seen it. but maby did not do the same with link numbers [11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: I haven't had an issue with link numbers changing in SL. [11:49] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: justin: our code base has been changed to such an extent that our measurement would not be relevant..so I am told. [11:49] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: you can still publish data [11:49] Kayaker Magic: The link numbers change every time you add a new prim to a build [11:49] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: right [11:49] Kayaker Magic: that is documented i the wiki [11:49] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I will ask [11:50] Richardus Raymaker: Technical if its the last prim you add it must be added to the existing link set [11:50] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: but once you have a static build shouldn't the number be correctly reported in the viewer? [11:50] Kayaker Magic: So if you put fixed link numbers in your script, they will fail if you change anything [11:50] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, You are finding link numbers changing in recent code? Are you adding the prim to the end of an existing linkset? [11:50] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: if you select the new prim, then the existing linkset - it should add the new prim to the end of the list? [11:50] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: this isn't a case of the number of links ever changing, though [11:50] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: grr [11:50] Seeress Seidkona is Online [11:50] Kayaker Magic: I think new prims go on the start of the chain... [11:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: Radegast doesnt run well under linux [11:51] Andrew Hellershanks: You have to select new prim then original root set to make the number of the new prim 1 after the last numbered prim in the original link set. [11:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: all 22 of my radegast viewers crashed [11:51] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: last prim selected should be root. [11:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: oh well [11:51] Kayaker Magic: Yes, once you stop adding links, they say constant. [11:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: was worht a try [11:51] Richardus Raymaker: yes bluewall, thats how i see it in sl sofar i have watched it [11:51]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i can run 80 clients on similar hardware under windows [11:51] Latif Khalifa: Nebandon, blame mono [11:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yea [11:51] Richardus Raymaker: mono su*ks [11:51] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, I have a prim/script to test link numbers. I'll see if it has broken again. [11:51] Richardus Raymaker: that i know for 2 years [11:52] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: right....so they stay constant but sometimes aren't reported correctly in the viewer if there are a large number....I question is whether that's a viewer bug or an Opensim bug [11:52] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: man i cant beleive they all crashed [11:52] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: thats probably going to skew todays results [11:52] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: sigh [11:52] Kayaker Magic: I don't think it is broken, the LL way just changes all the numbers when adding a new prim [11:52] Latif Khalifa: Nebandon ,why did you switch from Windows? [11:52] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, can you can me a copy of the compass? CoolVL won't let me take a copy of it. [11:52] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: if that'swhat the viewer is expecting then that might be what's going wrong [11:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i wanted to split the load up between computers [11:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: that computer is running linux at the moment [11:53] Latif Khalifa: link numbers don't matter to the viewer [11:53] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: if you select the existing work, then select the new prim last, then the new prim will be the root [11:53] Latif Khalifa: in fact the viewer doesn't even know link numbers exist [11:53] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, ty [11:53]  Latif Khalifa: it only matters to some poorly written LSL [11:54] Kayaker Magic: lol [11:54] Latif Khalifa: One should not write scipts depending on the link numbers anyway [11:54] Snoopy Pfeffer is Online [11:54] Kayaker Magic: If you select a new prim, then an existing build and link, the new prim always becomes link #2. It's in the wiki [11:54] Richardus Raymaker: no you select the new prim first and then the old link set [11:54] Andrew Hellershanks: Latif, If you think that way, I'll get you to put a number in the description of 254 prims in a link set. [11:55] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: yeah [11:55] Latif Khalifa: how do you know that Kayaker? [11:55] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: plus have to do a while{} call to find the one you're looking for every time [11:55] Latif Khalifa: Andrew, do you have to do different stuff on all 254? [11:55] Kayaker Magic: Read about in http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/LlCreateLink [11:55] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: or on attach have it make a list of them all and hold it in memory [11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Kayaker, that is how it used to work. Melanie (IIRC) put in a fix ages ago that addressed that. [11:56] Latif Khalifa: Mata, every time? Ever heard of caching a number? [11:56] Kayaker Magic: Yes, OpenSim does it right! [11:56] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: no point caching if the number changes [11:56] Kayaker Magic: But the right way does change all the numbers every time you link. Just warning you. [11:56] Andrew Hellershanks: huh? [11:56] Latif Khalifa: some lazy LSL coders here I see [11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: Either the numbers change or they don't. THe new link set used to be inserted after the root then the rest of the child prims were added after the new link set but that was fixed ages ago. [11:57] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I agree I woujldn't use link num as a programmer. BUt unfortunately, if the system provides something ppl end up using it [11:57] Latif Khalifa: I think OpenSIm should randomize link numbers just to teach tham a lesson :P [11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: I've not seen a problem with link numbers changing for ages. [11:57] Kayaker Magic: LOL [11:57] Kayaker Magic: Link numbers are SUPPOSED to change when you add new prims. [11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: Using link numbers is a very handy feature. I have an object wtih 254 prims. 200 of them need to be in a given order. Before I changed the script to not require the script in the 200 prims I would have had to renumber them evertime I changed the script. [11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: I would have given up working on the device if I had to keep doing that. [11:59] ladyjo martin is Offline [11:59] Latif Khalifa: or you could make a script to change descriptions of each prim [11:59] Latif Khalifa: it would have taken you 1 min flat [11:59] Latif Khalifa: and solve the problem forever [12:00] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: alright, well it's 8pm [12:00] Kayaker Magic: I think we have a communication problem between the carbon based units/ [12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Hm... that SL wiki page explains why someone implemented linking primsets in OS the way it used to be done. It hasn't worked that way in the years I've been in SL. [12:00] Nebs Metal Bar Stool v1.5 (w/sit & launch): Goodbye.. [12:00] Dahlia Trimble: load test today? linkie for it? [12:00] Mata.Hari @hg.osgrid.org: the ugly bags of mostly water? [12:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok i guess lets jump on over [12:01] Kayaker Magic: lol [12:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: http://cc.opensimulator.org:8002 Keynote 1 [12:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Mata, :) [12:01]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I have bots that might sort of wrk without crashing, or might be hilariously inefficient [12:01]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [12:01]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: kk [12:01]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I just haven't had time to copy that code to your machine unfortunately neb [12:01]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: no worries [12:01]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: will juhst have to try on mine and try to setup on yours in the bg [12:01]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok well I will see you all there [12:01]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: head on over [12:02]  Region found! [12:02]  Region found! [12:02]  Teleport completed from https://osgrid/region/Wright%20Plaza/146/149/32 [12:02]  Nebadon Izumi is Online [12:02]  Connecting to in-world Voice Chat... [12:02]  Connected [12:02]  Latif Khalifa: hello [12:02] acryline erin: hello [12:02] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: 0 [12:02] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello [12:03] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: you still have bots logged on neb? [12:03]  Dahlia Trimble: hi [12:03]  Andrew Hellershanks: I can't move. [12:03] Dahlia Trimble does a vanity rebake... [12:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: give it a second to settle [12:04] Cheopss Forlife7: Hello everyone [12:04] acryline erin: coucou [12:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello [12:04] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I am going to start logging on bots in 6 mins since it now takes longer as I'm running a 10 sec cpsace [12:04] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: space [12:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Latif, making a script to number the prims wouldn't help without knowing the order of them. I would have to write a script to check their coordinates and set their numbers. [12:05] Cheopss Forlife7: coucou Acry [12:05] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok [12:05]  Ange Menges: Hi there [12:05] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: im rebooting my spare machine into windows 7 [12:05] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i'll try to get my missing 20 bots back too [12:06] Mata Hari: lovely....my tp attempt with my OSG avi timed out so all attachments poofed...now have to clear cache, purge appearance, log to plaza, load inventory and pray nothing is corrupted [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: Man. I don't know if it is my viewer, my network connection, or this region. Lag city [12:06] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: all ppl do around here is complain [12:06] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: Mata when i logged into Wright Plaza [12:06] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i saw a bunch of Yellow Pyramids above your [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: I can't move most of the time [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: I'm going to switch viewer [12:06] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: kk Andrew [12:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: movement seems fluid here [12:08] Crista Lopes: hi. testing 123 [12:08] Crista Lopes: no chat lag [12:08] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I wonder why the region your avatar is in renders after the neighbors? [12:08] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ++ chat is great [12:08] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: must have a duff network Andrew, seems ok to me [12:08]  Cheopss Forlife7: hello Grim! [12:09] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: hi cheops [12:09] vegaslon.plutonian @hg.osgrid.org: you are created quicker as a child then as a root agent? [12:09] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its wierd with Radegast [12:09] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: when there is this many avatars, an object scan takes minutes [12:09] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: like 3-4 minutes [12:09] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: child agent creation is only triggered after root creation, unless one already exists [12:09] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: nearly impossible to get my radegast viewers seated with this kind of load [12:09] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: but there is a wierd delay in my local pcampbot tests - possibly a connection limit is getting maxed out somewhere [12:10] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: do others see the neighbor regions rezzing first? [12:10] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: BlueWall that is likely normal [12:10] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, logging in bots to kn 4 to bring it up to max [12:10] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I wonder if there is any way to reverse that? [12:11] Crista Lopes: everyone please take a sit [12:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hello Crista [12:11] Crista Lopes: hi [12:11]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I restored the ability to temporarily disable physics when bulletsim is running on a diff thread, so that can be tested if ncessary [12:11] Latif Khalifa: Crista has two handsome bodyguards :P [12:11] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: Hello all. [12:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: nice [12:12] Crista Lopes: oh cool. No physics? Does that mean we'll all float? [12:12] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: means you cant walk [12:12] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [12:12] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: no, we'll just be stuck in place :) [12:12]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: if only it did mean no grav... [12:12]  Andrew Hellershanks: I'm now on latest singularity [12:12]  Crista Lopes: argh, someone should to a no-gravity physics [12:12]  Crista Lopes: hehe lkalif! [12:12]  Crista Lopes: I feel safer already [12:12]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: I think you can [12:12]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: you can adjust gravity [12:12]  vegaslon.plutonian @hg.osgrid.org: yep [12:12]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: you could in ODE anyway [12:13]  vegaslon.plutonian @hg.osgrid.org: can turnoff gravity or reverse it direction [12:13]  Crista Lopes: cool, I'll have to try it with the oculus rift [12:13]  Andrew Hellershanks: I still can't move around [12:13]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: wierd Andrew [12:13]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lower draw distance maybe [12:13] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lot of avatars here [12:13] Andrew Hellershanks: I can't get it any lower. It is already at 64m [12:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: wierd, you havent had trouble like that in the past right? [12:14] Andrew Hellershanks: Not like this [12:14] Kayaker Magic: Neb, I was looking at one of your bots, and it TP'ed to a spot underwater. There's two of them down there now. [12:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: any viewers hung in memory? [12:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: check task manager [12:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: whenever i get wierd frame rates like that [12:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i usually have a hung viewer [12:14] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Andrew, turn off Netflix [12:14] Andrew Hellershanks: Its getting a bit better. Seems Singularity and CoolVL get mostly hung up during download of the prims in the region. [12:15] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: +Netflix, lol [12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: Billy, hehe. No netflix here. [12:15] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, this is going to take a little too long, I'm just going to start loading up 2, 3 and 4 now. I don't think my crash fix will work [12:15] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: bummer [12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: Its a little laggy but I can move [12:16] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it's a very odd failure - a stream is reported as being disposed where that can't really be the case.... [12:17] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ah, I might as well try putting bots into kn1 as well, can always disconnect a few if actually reach 400 [12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: 113 avatars across the 4 regions [12:17] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its very slow going for me at this point [12:17] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: to get more bots in [12:17]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i can get 1 every 3-4 minutes at best right now [12:18] Andrew Hellershanks: THat's not good [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: well its the radegast object scan [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: takes forever with this many avatars [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so i could log them in fast [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i just cant get them sat down fast [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: when you have 80 windows open [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: you have to go 1 at a time [12:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [12:19] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: im using 3 computers today though [12:19] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so it was a bit faster [12:19] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: unfortunatley mono barfed with the viewer [12:19] Mata Hari: then get all 400 to simultaneously stand up....wonder what the sim would think of the mass of physics calls [12:19] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: My viewer seems to be receiving more AvatarGroupReply, more than avatar adds. [12:20] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: 192 [12:20] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: nice [12:20] Kayaker Magic: Neb, there are 3 of your bots underwater, two of them off-sim. [12:20] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: well, they're already standing even if you can't see that [12:20] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: wierd [12:20] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: graphics at minimum I get 5 FPS max [12:20] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I will sit them if they appear to be causing complete physics meltdown [12:20] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: the ones underwater [12:20] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: are probably sitting on a chair that someone else is already sitting on [12:20]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: just ignore them [12:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i cant tell if someone is sitting on a chair already [12:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: without lots of extra work [12:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i still managed to get 65 in today [12:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so not too bad [12:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: im still going [12:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: doubt ill actually get to 80 though again this week [12:22] Andrew Hellershanks: I've turned graphics quality down as far as it will go and still the viewer is locked up. [12:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it also seems now [12:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: every new one i bring iis a cloud [12:22] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: 211 [12:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: that is definitely not good [12:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so we are already hitting failure point maybe [12:23] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: how long have you been seeing that? [12:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: 1 avatar so far [12:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: right around 200 [12:23] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: Yes, I see all new bots as clouds too. (am on Firestorm) [12:23] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I mean, did you see it last week? [12:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yes [12:23] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: did you see it week before that? [12:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: probably [12:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hard to say I very much doubt its new [12:23] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: well, this may ot may not be an effect of turning off avatar appearance resends [12:24] Cheopss Forlife7: no lost of attachements this time or am I dreaming? [12:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok [12:24]  Andrew Hellershanks: 161 avatars across four regions [12:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: last week it definitely happened [12:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it should be more than 161 [12:24] Andrew Hellershanks: Keynote 1 only reports 2 avatars. Strange. [12:24] Latif Khalifa: 230 [12:24] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: any idea how much the bandwidth cost is on the client -side with so many avatars? [12:24] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: hey, this test made my skin rot away WTH?!? [12:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: for some reason KN1 is only showing 2 avatars on map [12:24] Kayaker Magic: lol [12:24] Andrew Hellershanks: Seems it doesn't properly report online avatars for the region I'm in [12:24]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: for me anyway [12:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, same issue here [12:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: wierd [12:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: maybe because of my bot crash [12:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i had 20 avatars here before everyone showed up [12:25]  Latif Khalifa: it shows 67 "main agents" IN THE STATS FLOATER [12:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and it crashed hard on my end [12:25] Latif Khalifa: oops caps [12:25] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: map says 64 here [12:26] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: I see hair and other attachments! But some avatars, like Avia Bonne, I only see her hat - no body. [12:26] Latif Khalifa: my radar show 249 [12:26] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya last bot again is cloud [12:26] Andrew Hellershanks: nebadon, I TP'ed to 3 and the count of avatars here in 1 went to 1. [12:26] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: 251 [12:26] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: Tester6 and Teste7 [12:26] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: in the last row of KN1 [12:26] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: you can see they are stuck [12:26] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: let me try a rebake [12:27] Mata Hari: Serene: that might be LOD bug...try zooming out and in [12:27]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 255 [12:27] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: rebake not helping [12:27] Mata Hari: Avia was invisible to me until I crossed an LOD camera boundery [12:27] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: OK, yes, after zooming in and out I now see Avia. [12:28] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: And she is cute. [12:28] Mata Hari: that's a viewer side bug...happens quite a lot [12:28] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: 266 [12:29] Mata Hari: can also happen with other assets like animations....the viewer receives it but for some reason never starts to play it [12:29]  Mata Hari: as soon as you relog the animation will work perfectly instantly [12:29] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: map shows 70, but only on one corner, color red. Not sure which one that is [12:29] Mata Hari: so it's sitting there in viewer cache [12:29] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok im not sure if i should keep loading in more or not at this point [12:30] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 280 [12:30] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: since they all come in as cllouds I am pretty sure things are already failing [12:30] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: up to you [12:30] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: I have an idea, turn build on and we can all rez physical cubes in the air and let em go :D [12:30] Mata Hari: but I think if there's a little lag in fetching the data it somehow forgets to trigger showing it on the viewer once it finishes receiving the file [12:30] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I have capabilty to launch bots from your system now but I don't have the ability to abort all the ones coming from my lcoal [12:30] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: so I'm just going to wait until this thing crashes or huge numbers fall off [12:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok [12:32]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 300 [12:33] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: 309 [12:33] Nebadon Izumi: I cant move [12:33] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: anybody else have chatlag? [12:33] Nebadon Izumi: oh there it goes [12:33] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: test [12:35] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok I am loosing bots now [12:35] Dahlia Trimble: did a bunch of bots just die/ [12:35] 7bruno.Spyker @ever.unistra.fr:8002: bonsoir a tous pas de crash encore?:) [12:35]  Latif Khalifa: 1 [12:35]  Latif Khalifa: 2 [12:35]  Latif Khalifa: 3 [12:35]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: just a couple though [12:35]  Latif Khalifa: 4 [12:35]  Latif Khalifa: 5 [12:35]  Mata Hari: t+1m [12:35]  acryline erin: Hello 7bruno ! [12:35]  Dahlia Trimble: 2 [12:35]  Dahlia Trimble: 19 [12:35]  Dahlia Trimble: 7 [12:35]  Kayaker Magic: my last chat never appeared [12:35]  Dahlia Trimble: 3 [12:35]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I lost a whole bunch [12:36]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya [12:36]  Dahlia Trimble: 11.36 [12:36]  Mata Hari: interesting...it at my "12:33" [12:36]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it seems like 200 is the sore point [12:36]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: thats when i started noticing failures [12:36]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: well, about 300 [12:36] Latif Khalifa: it froze for a while... but now it seems back [12:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya [12:36]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: but things starting declining at 200 [12:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: even though it wasnt total fail [12:36] Mata Hari: yeah...it lost some chat but is back to being lag-free chat again now [12:36] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: okay, I'm going to disconn everything from this one system and try spreading load between two [12:36] Dahlia Trimble: test message sent at 9:32 am PDT [12:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok cool Justin [12:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i'll try to squeeze a few more in [12:37]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 313 [12:38] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: walking and testing... testing and walking [12:38] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [12:38] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: clouds look bad on a photo shoot [12:38] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: heh ya [12:38]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: some of justins bots will inevitably be clouds [12:39] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: however none of mine should be, but all the latest ones are [12:39] Cuteulala Artis gave you WallPaper Bloom1024. [12:39] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: I cant cross the region boundry [12:40] Dahlia Trimble: you can cross but it takes a trick [12:40] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: pls don't cross the boundary [12:40] Dahlia Trimble: lol [12:41] Latif Khalifa: are these 4 regions running on 4 physical machines? [12:41] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: ok, can't anyway lol [12:41] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: hmm, sim thnks 216 avs, which is surprising [12:41] Nebadon Izumi: no Larif [12:41] Nebadon Izumi: its a 24 core machine [12:41] Nebadon Izumi: with 64gb ram [12:41] Latif Khalifa: so you could use 1 var [12:41] Nebadon Izumi: but each region is its own instance [12:41] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I do see an awful lot of AvatarGroupReply [12:41] Nebadon Izumi: maybe, maybe not [12:41] Nebadon Izumi: i really doubt you can get 400 avatars in 1 region [12:42] Nebadon Izumi: its more than just connections [12:42] Nebadon Izumi: its physics [12:42] Nebadon Izumi: and how much memory 1 process can access [12:42] Dahlia Trimble: would be interesting to try 1 large region [12:42] Nebadon Izumi: ya we will for sure [12:42] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Don't seem to be able to manage 400 on 4 at present [12:42] Nebadon Izumi: we have aregion setup for testing [12:42] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: though with 346 and counting [12:42] Nebadon Izumi: but I suspect it wont peform better [12:43] Nebadon Izumi: some things may [12:43] Nebadon Izumi: physics would not [12:43] Nebadon Izumi: also memory could be problematic [12:43] Nebadon Izumi: even in 64 bit [12:43] Nebadon Izumi: opensim pukes around 6gb being used [12:43] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 6gb, I have not seen that [12:44] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: crashed [12:44] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 401 [12:44] Nebadon Izumi: I have [12:44] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: yeah [12:44] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: My Firestorm people counter shows 402 [12:44] Nebadon Izumi: Wright Plaza has used that much before [12:44] Dahlia Trimble: 275 for me [12:44]  Latif Khalifa: 404 here [12:44] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 403 at 12:44 [12:45] Mata Hari: 403 is what mine says [12:45] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: +me [12:45] Cheopss Forlife7: wooo! [12:45] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, sims think we are at 405 [12:45] Latif Khalifa: yes 403 + yourself = 404 [12:45] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yes, spreading this bot load between two systems does work a bit better [12:45] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: lol Latif [12:45] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: phew [12:45] Dahlia Trimble: my radar says 399 [12:45] Cheopss Forlife7: thar double more than last year? [12:45] Cheopss Forlife7: that's* [12:45]  Nebadon Izumi: something like that [12:46] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: so, now to see if it's reasonably stable [12:46] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: i.e. don't suddenly get massive bot falloff [12:46] Nebadon Izumi: its a bit laggy for me [12:46]  Latif Khalifa: what's the load like on the server [12:46] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I',m now on kn4, couldn't get to kn1 because full [12:46] Latif Khalifa: chat seems fluid [12:46] Latif Khalifa: 1 [12:46] Latif Khalifa: 2 [12:46] Latif Khalifa: 3 [12:46] Latif Khalifa: 45 [12:46] Latif Khalifa: 5 [12:46] Mata Hari: very little movement lag for me [12:46]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: lag wil prob be worse on kn1 [12:46] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: a tad lag llol [12:47] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: serer is about0.49 load av [12:47]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: which is ok [12:47]  Latif Khalifa: that's pretty amazing Justin [12:47] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yes... a little too much perhaps [12:48] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: At the end of the test do we all get up and dance to properly crash the servers? [12:48] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: still at 402 [12:48] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: lost 2 according to my counter [12:48] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: heh, yes [12:48] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: just want to hold this fora bit longer [12:48] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, there is some falloff [12:48] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600 makes tea [12:49] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: there's a long way to go, but sustaining 400, ieven if unrealistic bots is a start [12:49] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: anyone want a cup [12:49] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: http://nebadon2025.com/loadtest/loadtest_2014-08-05-001.jpg [12:49] Mata Hari: yes please...with milk if you have some [12:49] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: there you go lkalif [12:49] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: Do you have any biscuits, darling? [12:49] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Coming right up Mata [12:50] Dahlia Trimble: cookies? o.0 [12:50] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: dang, forgot the biscuits [12:50] Kayaker Magic: Now you've done it, I'm going AFK to make lunch [12:50] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: still at 402 [12:50] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: but as you can see from viewer stats, not all child agents are properly logged in [12:50]  Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: At what number do you declare an official miracle? [12:51] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 402 at 12:51 [12:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: well 400 is our goal [12:51] Latif Khalifa: 400 [12:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: right now things start getting troublesome around 200 [12:51] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: even in very low load conditions, for some reason pCampbot often doesn't connect children in time for some reason, whic needs investigation [12:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: atleast with appearance [12:51] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: things get very cloudy around 200 [12:51] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I could try turning on appearance resending ;) [12:51]  Mata Hari: ouch [12:51]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, there are myriad issues [12:52]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it must be something with the amount of appearance updates being sent [12:52]  Mata Hari: set the timer for that appearance resend to something really short, too, like 10 seconds [12:52]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: at some point it becomes to much [12:52]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, bots are maxing out your machine too neb [12:52]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: sitting at 90% on 4 cores [12:52]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: perhaps takes longer to complete than the cycle of appearance updates [12:52]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: but bots aren't falling off, which is something [12:52]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so you never get a full update [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: just guessing [12:53] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: neb: these are bots in kn1? [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: someone mentioned something with appearance updates [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: starting to fail around 100 [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: who was that? [12:53] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I cannot see why AvatarAppearance packet sizes vary, especially with the b0b0b0 bots [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yes they are [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: the 3 or 4 stuck as clouds are all KN1 [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and logged in very late to the game [12:53] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: somewhere around the 200-300 avatar mark [12:54] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i stoipped logging them after that [12:54] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: ok, now i see avatarappearance [12:54] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: neb: any diff? I just manually triggered some resends [12:54] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: let me look [12:54] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: no [12:55]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: which bot in particular? [12:55] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: looks like one of them got logged out [12:55] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its Nebadon Tester6, and Tester8 [12:55] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: last row of KN1 [12:55] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: Tester7 got logged out [12:55] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I can'#t lpook atm since if I turn it crashes my viewer [12:55] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: give me a name [12:55] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hes coing back in [12:56]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: Nebadon Tester6 [12:56] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, I'm way overlaoded with tjhis bot stuff [12:56] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: load average of 42 [12:56] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: Nebadon Tester8 [12:56] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: seems to have froze again when i logged him in [12:56]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: kn1 is having issues [12:56] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: oh dang viewer crashed hard on reconnect [12:56] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: indeed [12:57] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i reconnected a bot and it froze the region [12:57] Latif Khalifa: 1 [12:57] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: possible others were logging in at same time [12:57] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: multiple logins are nasty [12:57] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, 7 has no appaerance uploaded [12:57] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it could be that the messages are simply getting lost, even with retries [12:57] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I think there is an issue with overloading the capabiltiy system [12:58] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: 401 still [12:58] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I'm going to risk moving around, and iof I crash I will comein with my linux system viewer [12:59] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: well thats good [12:59] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its a bit laggy, were certainly close to keeping the simulator up without too much disruption [12:59] Mata Hari: I now can't move at all [13:00] Mata Hari: and probably crashed since chat isn't working either [13:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: heh huge delay there [13:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hmm major lag nothing i am saying is coming through [13:00] Mata Hari: oh.///mpw suddenly working again [13:00] Mata Hari: and now not [13:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya I think Justin crashed [13:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: good test though [13:00] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: no doubt got a lot of good data to mull over again this week [13:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: as bad as it was today, i definitely saw some improvement [13:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: bot crashes were not nearly as bad this week [13:01] Mata Hari: and now movement is smooth again [13:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: last week i lost 50% of my bots by this time [13:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: this week i lost maybe 5 [13:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and most reconnected no problem [13:01] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lots of lag though [13:01] Mata Hari: seems to come and go [13:02]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya typical [13:02] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: probably GC [13:02]  Cheopss Forlife7: the best is if you don't lose your ideas Neb [13:02] Mata Hari: at the moment it's silky smooth [13:02] Mata Hari: but for a moment there it was lagging by close to a minute [13:02] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya [13:03]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok,. I forgot my linyux box is also running all these bots.... [13:03] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: welcome back [13:03] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i was saying justin even though this week was far from perfect [13:04] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Maybe you need to distribute these bots sources [13:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it feels improved to me [13:04]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: well, one of my bot programs finally crashed [13:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i didnt loose nearly as many bots [13:04] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: there's no change server side [13:04] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: gotta run, storm coming in [13:04]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and the ones that did drop off got back on fairly quickly [13:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lots of lag though [13:04] Grimley.Graves @hg.osgrid.org: good luck to you all [13:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: see you Grimley [13:04] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: a lot of issues to look at but I'm quite pleased was able to sustain 400 (mainly bots) for a period today [13:04] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: say hi to the wizard of oz for us [13:04]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [13:04] Cheopss Forlife7: bye Grim [13:05] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: now I can make them all start jumping around [13:05] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: and the sims should crash :) [13:05]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: or maybe not [13:05]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: heh give it a shot [13:05]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I think I'll start all the kn1 going [13:05]  Mata Hari puts on crash helmet [13:05]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: lol [13:05]  Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: So this is the dancing part? [13:05]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I've just realized that connected bots don't take on new behaviours... [13:06]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: damn [13:06]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [13:06]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: CPU is 1000% [13:06]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: oh there its 350% now [13:06]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: 270% [13:06]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: did you stop them? [13:06]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: oh, maybe they are sort of moving [13:06] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: wierd [13:06] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: cpu hit 1300% at one point [13:06] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I'm seeing 364 at present [13:06] Mata Hari: they all did move [13:07] Mata Hari: or in KN1 they seemed to [13:07]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its odd CPU went that high [13:07] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: they don't seem to be moving out of place though [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: technically Bullet should only be able to use 1 core [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: but seperated from the main thread [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its single thread [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: strange it jumped so high [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: mybe it was UDP updates [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: for movement [13:07] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ? [13:07] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: alright, back in kn1 [13:08] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ah man, they'vemanaged to mainly jump out [13:08] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: this is only 50 though [13:09] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, sim is not liking this [13:09] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: cpu is way high again [13:10] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: heh ya [13:10]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I'm now attempting to stop them jumping again.... [13:10] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: k [13:10]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: which has revealed a slight problem with that command in that it's doing it very very slowly [13:10] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: I think there are just too many updates occuring [13:10] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: we dont see it actually happening [13:10] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, could be [13:10]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: more than the viewer can process probably [13:10] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it would be a massive peak of updates [13:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: which probably leads to more issues [13:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: resending of packets [13:11] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I think this is going to have to be another sit-down conf [13:11] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: if even 50 bots can do that [13:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: oh absolutely [13:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i never doubted that [13:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: im not even sure we intended otherwise [13:11] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i sure didnt [13:12] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it would be nice to have complete freedom... but not gonna happen [13:12] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lets get as close as we can though [13:12] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya next year :) [13:12]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its good to have a reason to improve things [13:12]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: honestly I feel like this week was a big improvement over last week [13:13]  Mata Hari: I wonder what the outbound traffic has to be like to send all those updates to every single viewer [13:13]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: there are physical limits.... [13:13]  Cheopss Forlife7: oh we can give you reasons every day if you need! [13:13]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: even though its not glaringly obvious improvement [13:13]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: funiily enough there have been no affecting server side changes [13:13]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i see improvement [13:13]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: but as pCampbot is crashing much less frequently that might be the factor [13:13]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I can bring a bot army in next time, maybe enable justin to have more control of his desktops? [13:13] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: last week by now i lost over 50% of my bots [13:13] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: the thing with my bot army is that I am in control of them, which helps [13:13] Mata Hari: would be 400^2 updates that have to get sent I suppose [13:13] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, mass simultaenous client logout may be causing issues [13:14] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: mata: yeah, it doesn't scale linearly, which is a big problem [13:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i maybe lost 5% this week [13:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: no doubt me spreading bot load over 3 computers helped [13:14] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: getting from 300 to 400 is vastly harder than 100 to 200 [13:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: instead of all 80 on 1 box [13:14] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i suspect you will see same improvement with pcampbot [13:14] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, my lcao machine is still way overloaded. Your's is loaded but only a little over load factor [13:15] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: great [13:15] Mata Hari: maybe some sort of capping mechanism by proximity like the viewer uses for avatar imposters [13:15] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: well, having said that, 5 min average is 11 [13:15] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: er, 15 min [13:15] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: even though technically your CPU is faster than my server is [13:15]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and its a true Quad core [13:15] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: my system is running a desktop and other crap as well [13:15] Mata Hari: so only send updates "frequently" for something nearby [13:15] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: bah :) [13:15]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: my server doesnt have the GUI overhead [13:15]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: probably faster bus too on mine [13:15]  Mata Hari: and far less frequently for distant [13:15]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: mata: fancy submitting any patches? [13:15]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its 1333 mhz bus [13:15]  Mata Hari: though then you have to make those calculations [13:16]  Mata Hari: I don't know C#, sorry [13:16]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: while yours has a better capacity for any single process [13:16]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: my cpu has much better throughput [13:16]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: mata: it's not hard t olearn [13:16]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: anyway if it helps i can give you control of my core2quad machine as well [13:17]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: boot into opensuse 13.1 console only no gui [13:17] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: we'll see, I have turned down some bot activities which makes them less realistic [13:17] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i had to boot it into windows 7 today for radegast [13:17] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok [13:17]  Mata Hari: if I didn't have other stuff on my plate I probably would [13:17] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: so yeah, might be necessary to spread even further. I guess it's not so surprising - after all it's hard enough to run 1 full client on a system [13:17] Mata Hari: but there are only so many hours in the day [13:17] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: mata: the same is true for me [13:17]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yea indeed Justin [13:18] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i see similar issues with Radegast too [13:18] Dahlia Trimble: bye all :) [13:18]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: at some point your run out of IO [13:18]  Kayaker Magic: Bye [13:18]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: bye dahlia [13:18]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: no matter how fast your cpu is and how much memory you have [13:18]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I have already put in some experimental stuff to turn down agent udpates [13:18]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: particularly from child regions, which is currently active, and one reason why cpu loads are lower now [13:19]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: we could get very experimental here [13:19]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: as well as agent update sending loads [13:19]  Mata Hari: yes, if child updates were way lower that would help a ton [13:19]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: since no is really moving around much [13:19]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: make it something tuneable that only this region would run [13:19] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hwile the other regions have a bit more available [13:19] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: 397 [13:19] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: there is a siwtch to also start cutting out root agent updates [13:20] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: that I haven't turned on, since it's significantly more noticeable even if the ones going to your own avatar are unfiltered [13:20] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, bot physics has been off for a while [13:20] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it also seems like when logins/logouts slow down or stop [13:20] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: things become relatively stable [13:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: no lag spikes or long pauses [13:21] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: logins are high stree periods because they trigger a very large amount of packet send to the client [13:21] Mata Hari: I was thinking about the inventory fetch issue and the utter lack of any messages in log or console about timeouts...is it possible they're timing out and not getting reported? [13:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yea [13:21] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: amongst other things [13:21] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: logouts are more of a mystery [13:21] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: progressively gets worse as more avatars are present and receiving updates [13:21] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yes, new avatar ends up triggering data send to all existing avatars [13:21] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: attachments will play a role in that [13:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yes I have always noticed that logouts are just as expensive as logins [13:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ive noticed that for years at WP meetings [13:22] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it is odd, and one area I hope to look at in detail [13:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: when everyone leaves at the end [13:22] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it shouldn't be so expensive [13:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: the region freezes almost same as during logins [13:22] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I presume avatars having attachments doesn't make a difference? [13:22] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: you could schedule us human subjects to log in at different times to test the login thing. [13:22] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i cant say [13:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i bet it does make a big difference [13:23] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: co-ordinating humans is horribly messy : [13:23] Serene.Jewell @grid.kitely.com:8002: lol [13:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: reality is chaos [13:23] Mata Hari: easier with cattle :p [13:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: not order [13:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: these tests need to remain chaotic [13:23] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: whichis the big problem, since conf has to be for reals [13:23] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: othewise its unreastic [13:24] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: but the more chaotic you get the harder it is to work out what's happening or control the inputs [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yes [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it is [13:24]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: you and I should have some bot only tests [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: just you and I [13:24]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, I'm going to do some myself, hope to get a bit more time now [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: k cool [13:24] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I will prepare an army should it be required, say 50... bye for now.. watch me logout.. well tp [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: let me know if I can help [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: see you Billy [13:24] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: but still need to work out why this pCampbot is crashing. All I've done here is reduce the frequency, though that might be a clue [13:24] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: bye billy [13:24] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yea [13:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: as frustrating as this is, i really do feel like there has been imrprovement [13:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: the numbers will be the real truth though [13:25] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: it seems reducing the number of concurrent connections allowed to an endpoint reduces crashing [13:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: be interesting to see the trend this week [13:25] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: if the numbers reflect what I feel [13:25] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: so it's either something to do with number of concurrenct connections or setting the paramater. Much more likely the former [13:26] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: it wont be drastic either way [13:26] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, I kleep running out of time to write more reports. Hope to do one for this week (!) [13:26] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: graph production is relatively easy since I have most of it scripted now [13:27] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, count is still 397 which is pretty good [13:27] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: unless there's anything else I'm going to take down the bots and stop stats recording [13:27] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: neb: ? [13:28] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, myu singu isn't crashing on linux. Must be drivers or similar on my crappy old win xp laptop :) [13:29] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: sure [13:29]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: thats fine by me [13:29]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, thanks a lot for coming folks, it's really helpful [13:29]  Mata Hari: okies, I"ll be off then too [13:29]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya thanks everyone [13:29]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: same time next week [13:29]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: tell more friends [13:29]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: lol [13:29]  Mata Hari avaes [13:30]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I will probably have to fether bot numbers a bit. When at 400 nobody can get it [13:30]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya spreading that load might help too [13:30]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: even at 350+ [13:30]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i could still get my avatars in [13:30]  TBG Renfold: np, night al. outta here [13:30] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: its just with Radegast the object scan is horribly slow [13:30] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: so i cant sit down fast [13:30] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: takes forever [13:31] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I'm not sure sittinf down is too crucial as long as you aren't moving [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya [13:31]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: the bots you can see are standing. It's only when they start jumping around that things really go haywire [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i suspect though big avatar piles at landing zone [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: probably does a number on physics [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: increasing cpu load [13:31] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: a lod of my bots overflowed to landing one 1 [13:31] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: lz1 [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: interesting [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: thats good [13:31] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: thats what should happen [13:32] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I think it's only happening on direct login [13:32] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: when I tried to HG to kn1 earlier I just got the "region is full" msg [13:32] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: id be more upset if people couldnt log in at all [13:32] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: that is strange [13:32] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, disconn [13:32] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: that is says region is full [13:32] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: kk [13:32]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya i need to kill mine [13:33] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: nebadon: why strange? Because I'm admin? ( I think) [13:33] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: was the region actually full? [13:33] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: guess its not strange if region was really full [13:33] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i was assuming it wasnt [13:33] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, it was full [13:34] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ah ok [13:34]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: then nevermind [13:34] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: hehe [13:34] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: ok, didn't seem too bad just now on mass bot logout [13:34] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya [13:35]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: the good news is [13:35]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: we havent had a single hard region crash this year [13:35] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: not a one [13:35] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: thats quite impressive [13:35] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yeah, even throughout these load tests it didn' happen [13:35] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya [13:35]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: and regions seem to return to normal once bot load was removed [13:35] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: which are very good things [13:35] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: yep [13:35] Joyce.Bettencourt @grid.avacon.org:8002: great [13:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ok well if I am not needed I am going to hop out [13:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and find some food to chew on [13:36]  Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: yep, thanks neb [13:36] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: me too [13:36] Joyce.Bettencourt @grid.avacon.org:8002: I was nibbling during [13:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: ya thank you [13:36] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: do you have chatlog from prvious meeting btw [13:36] Joyce.Bettencourt @grid.avacon.org:8002: though didnt have to run bots like you all did [13:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: and thanks everyone who came [13:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: good stuff [13:36] Justin.Clark-Casey @hg.osgrid.org: I lost the easy to access one in my crash [13:36] Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i do [13:36]  Nebadon.Izumi @hg.osgrid.org: i can handle it