Chat log from the meeting on 2012-10-30

'''Note that next week's meeting will be at 1900 UTC. This will mean that the US will keep the same local time, Europeans will go back to 7pm (having been at 6pm this week) and people in Asia will see this meeting move back by an hour.

[11:00] Nebadon Izumi: you going to buy something new? [11:00] Connecting to in-world Voice Chat... [11:00] Connected [11:00] BlueWall Slade: I thought the GTX 465 was bad [11:01] Azah Tabor: but it it is good to see you again Blue.. been a while [11:01] logger sewell: so neb did you get hit hard where you are ? [11:01] Qandy Saw: hey everyone [11:01] Azah Tabor: hey Qandy [11:01] BlueWall Slade: I will need to isolate it now between ram, cpu mobo [11:01] Baewyn Celara: Hello [11:01] Qandy Saw: :) [11:02]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Azah - good to see you too [11:02]  BlueWall Slade: lol, using the onboard ati sux [11:02]  Azah Tabor: ut oh.. Andrews hiding in the rafters. lol [11:02]  Andrew Hellershanks: I can't seem to move [11:02]  VivK Lowlag: how recently have the fans been cleaned? [11:02]  BlueWall Slade: well... [11:02]  BlueWall Slade: yesterday [11:03]  Teravus Ousley is Online [11:03]  Teravus Ousley is Offline [11:03]  Justin Clark-Casey: how is progress with the asset service migration/ [11:03]  Walter Balazic: [11:03] Second Life: Unable to rez: problem accessing inventory or locating assets [11:03]  Justin Clark-Casey: ? [11:04]  Azah Tabor: good day Walter.... and to you Justin [11:04]  Andrew Hellershanks: Lots of chat lag [11:04]  Walter Balazic: good day Azah [11:04]  Andrew Hellershanks: Lag seems to have settled down [11:04]  Justin Clark-Casey: hello azah, folks [11:04] Qandy Saw: hello [11:04] Hiro Protagonist is Online [11:04] Baewyn Celara: I'm having trouble rezzing at the moment. [11:04] BlueWall Slade: hi Justin [11:04] Andrew Hellershanks: yup. My two statements came out in reverse order [11:04] Azah Tabor: slight lag on the open chat thou at points [11:04] Baewyn Celara: Says it can't find my assets in the db. [11:04] Teravus Ousley: ok [11:04]  Justin Clark-Casey: practically all asset service requests seem to be timing out atm [11:05] Teravus Ousley: I see gray people. [11:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Then I've seen "items coming in too fast" which usually only happens when I do a bulk upload [11:05] Walter Balazic: hello Hiro [11:05] Hiro Protagonist: Howdeh [11:05] Nebadon Izumi: h [11:05]  Nebadon Izumi: hello [11:05] Qandy Saw: hey [11:05] BlueWall Slade: hi hiro [11:05] Teravus Ousley: hello! [11:06] Hiro Protagonist: some grey, some not so much. Probably getting those from my cache. [11:06] BlueWall Slade: Hi teravus [11:06] Hiro Protagonist whispers: Hiya Blue :D [11:06] Hiro Protagonist: Hiya Blue :D [11:06] Hiro Protagonist: Hiya Teravus! [11:06] Sarah Kline: hi [11:06]  Justin Clark-Casey: hi sarah [11:06] Qandy Saw: Sarah [11:06] Baewyn Celara: Hello Hiro [11:06] Azah Tabor: @Walter.. It just clicked.. Your the one that I spoke to on the forums. lol [11:07] Baewyn Celara: HI Justin [11:07] Baewyn Celara: oh I just had some of my assets rez. [11:07] Teravus Ousley: Somehow this is all going to be related back to the hurricane, right? [11:07] Azah Tabor: erm.. Andrew.... Your naked [11:07] Azah Tabor rolls on the floor laughing [11:07] Baewyn Celara: my appologies if something is missing [11:07] Walter Balazic: yes I'm the one that mentioned the issue in the forums :) [11:07]  Walter Balazic: here's a prime example of what I'm talking about too [11:08]  Walter Balazic: I'm glad Justin is seeing it first hand [11:08]  Justin Clark-Casey: Well, this is due to slow or osgrid asset service timeouts [11:08]  Justin Clark-Casey: so it's an ops issues rather than an opensim one [11:08]  Walter Balazic: precisely why I didn't open a mantis [11:08]  Walter Balazic: and instead put a post in the OSGrid forum [11:09]  Robert Adams: what is the ETA for the completion of the asset server conversion? [11:10]  Teravus Ousley: Got Quiet for a second. wasn't sure if we stalled to oblivion again. [11:10]  Justin Clark-Casey: I don't know exactly. When I spoke to coyled about this he was talking a couple of weeks, that was last week [11:11]  Hiro Protagonist: I've heard a couple of timeframes; initially, it was a couple days or a week. Some said a few weeks. At least one person said a few months. [11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: well, the question would be who is saying these things and on what basis would they know [11:12] Hiro Protagonist: Really I dont think anyone can say with any accuracy [11:12] Walter Balazic: well, can we first come to a clear definition that the asset problem is in fact that there is work currently being done on the Asset server? [11:12] Teravus Ousley is wondering why we're not seeing pending uploads and downloads high [11:12] Teravus Ousley is saying that about the stats [11:12] Hiro Protagonist: Good to have you back Ter [11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: maybe because those relate only to udp asset up/down [11:13] Justin Clark-Casey: where the vast majority of such traffic is textures [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: lol hiro and dan are on the same chair to me [11:13]  Baewyn Celara: nice to meet you Teravus [11:13] Justin Clark-Casey: throug hhttp [11:13] Teravus Ousley: That metric, from my understanding is supposed to represent communication between the Simulator and the Asset Service [11:15] Justin Clark-Casey: currently it represents traffic between the viewer and the simulator [11:15] dan banner: physics are screwed [11:15] Teravus Ousley: Thanks. Just noticing... don't want to derail the train. [11:15] Hiro Protagonist:. [11:15] Justin Clark-Casey: I should think this is all due to holdups from the asset service [11:16] Justin Clark-Casey: ideally such things wouldn't affect scene loop but unfortunatley it would appear they do [11:16]  Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.7.5 Dev          16809bd: 2012-10-26 02:36:58 +0100 (Unix/Mono) [11:16] Baewyn Celara: oowwww [11:16] Baewyn Celara: who has the foghorn? [11:16] BlueWall Slade is Online [11:16] BlueWall Slade is Offline [11:17] Justin Clark-Casey:. [11:17] Walter Balazic smiles at Hiro [11:17] Teravus Ousley: I'm not sure they're representing anything righ tnow with it zeroed out. [11:17] Walter Balazic: nice shape you got there [11:17] Justin Clark-Casey: Possibly this is also excarabated by suddenly allowing many more connctions per simulator to the asset service [11:17] Hiro Protagonist: if anyone's interested, I've got a recipe for reproduction of certain issues that at least seemed as if they might be related to the asset server issue [11:18] Charmaine Andersson is Offline [11:19] Hiro Protagonist: FWIW, assets are streaming in for me, just slowly [11:19] Baewyn Celara: Same [11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, I don't think it's a complete halt, just a lot of timeouts [11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: it seems to have improved slightly now, maybe because the initial storm of requests by lots of new avatars has abated [11:19] Walter Balazic: http://stats.pingdom.com/rcoc14tnw05o/341147 [11:19] Walter Balazic: according to this [11:20] Hiro Protagonist: this is the mantis to which I was referring: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6381 [11:20] Walter Balazic: the response time is 1062ms [11:20] Dahlia Trimble is Online [11:20] Walter Balazic: and there have been 2 service outages [11:20] BlueWall Slade: what does disk/netweork i/o look like on the box? [11:21] Hiro Protagonist:. [11:21] dan banner: access times were down but seem to have went back up [11:21]  Walter Balazic: yes they were down for a day 2 days ago, but they are right back up in the 1000 range [11:21] Walter Balazic: I noticed that when you mentioned that the other day [11:21] Nebadon Izumi: ya I will check with coyled later to see whats up [11:21]  dan banner: yup [11:22] Hiro Protagonist: might be good to see if he's responsive now, while invested parties are on hand [11:22] Andrew Hellershanks: some of the seats aren't working right. [11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: hiro: i mentioned 6381 to diva yesterday. She says she hopes to have a look soon [11:22] dan banner: same for me too andrew [11:22] Hiro Protagonist: Thanks Justin [11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: however, it's not impossible it's affected by asset service - it's very hard to tell what impact it has on everything else [11:22] BlueWall Slade: animations - after the last patches animations are hosed in a different way [11:22] Teravus Ousley: Hello Dahlia [11:23] Andrew Hellershanks: Where there any db migration between 073PF and 074PF? [11:23] BlueWall Slade: sometimes they don't switch states [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: I dont think he is currently online [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: its possible he doesnt even have power at the moment [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: that would be something melanie should fix again [11:23] BlueWall Slade: or, loke you can fly across a sim border and the avatar goes into the standing animation [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: ah yes, he's in NYC [11:23] Hiro Protagonist: Oh yeah thats right, I bet he dont [11:23] BlueWall Slade: ++ jcc [11:23] Dahlia Trimble: hi [11:23]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Dahlia [11:24] Walter Balazic: yeah, if he's in NYC we have outages citywide there [11:24] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: though may have to raise yet more mantis. [11:24] Walter Balazic: power and NW [11:24]  Andrew Hellershanks sees Dahlia's tag [11:24] Justin Clark-Casey: hi dahlia [11:24] Andrew Hellershanks is trying to unbork groups [11:24] BlueWall Slade: I'm not able to do much testing till I get this hardware issue resolved [11:25] Jak Daniels: Bluewall... i can do some testing for you... seeing as I was involved with the previous anim/ao changes [11:25] BlueWall Slade: I can probably add what I have seen to a mantis though [11:25] Dahlia Trimble blushes and tries to hide her tag [11:25] Walter Balazic: I did just open a Mantis about animation state issues incidentally [11:25] Jak Daniels: i'd not tried sim crossings while flying [11:25] Walter Balazic: something that we kind of ignored for a while [11:25] Walter Balazic: on Dan's suggestion actually [11:25] Baewyn Celara: Groups? [11:26] BlueWall Slade: try flying into one, then back in a few seconds [11:26] BlueWall Slade: that seems to always trigger it [11:26]  Jak Daniels: ok i will try that. [11:26] BlueWall Slade: cool [11:26] BlueWall Slade: thanks [11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: walter: the ideal thing would be to go back to aa52c8b and see if the problem goes away [11:27] Walter Balazic: you discussing the anim issue? [11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: that's the most recent animation change, apart from the further changes that aimed to fix issues brought up by that change itself [11:27] dan banner: i think the hopping around going into edit might be older [11:27] Walter Balazic: that has been going on for almost a year [11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: walter: oh, ok [11:27]  Walter Balazic: it's just something we ignored at first [11:27] Walter Balazic: but we are starting to see what it actually is [11:28]  Walter Balazic: we were seeing it whenever we edited an item or built something [11:28] Walter Balazic: and just thought it was some weird thing with building [11:28] Walter Balazic: but in fact it is a fly trigger prior to triggering the intended animation [11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: is 6384 this issue? [11:28] BlueWall Slade: btw - I have seen the issue running w/o an ao or having it disabled [11:28] Walter Balazic: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6384 [11:29] Justin Clark-Casey: walter: ok, it is hgelpful to know if it's longstanding - I had assumed it was connected with the most recent anim issues [11:29] Walter Balazic: no, it has been around about a year [11:29] Walter Balazic: it is just something we have more info on now [11:29] Justin Clark-Casey: odd though, I haven't noticed this [11:29] Walter Balazic: build something [11:30] Walter Balazic: you didn't get the avi hop on edit? [11:30] Justin Clark-Casey: no [11:30]  Jak Daniels: i have noticed it... i just thought it was a glitch with the physics when you rez something, you get pushed away from it [11:30] Nebadon Izumi: maybe its only when your standing on terrain [11:30] Walter Balazic: yes so did I Jak [11:30] Justin Clark-Casey: I've never seen this in fact, but maybe I just don't build in the right way [11:30] Hiro Protagonist: It may require more than a simple prim [11:30] Walter Balazic: oh good point Neb [11:30] Walter Balazic: never thought of that [11:30] dan banner: neb it happens standing in lbsa too sometimes [11:31] Walter Balazic: I can show you it when it triggers prior to the expected animation in a script [11:31] Hiro Protagonist: I dont have a good explanation for why, but I always thought it was somehow related to the mass of the build [11:31] Walter Balazic: yes so did I [11:31]  Walter Balazic: at first [11:31] Hiro Protagonist: seem like the bigger the thing the more I pop around [11:31] Walter Balazic: you know that hug hud thing I use Hiro [11:31] Walter Balazic: if I "hug" someone [11:31] Hiro Protagonist: yea [11:31] Walter Balazic: it flies first [11:31] Walter Balazic: ever notice that [11:32] Walter Balazic: then... it goes to the correct anim [11:32] Hiro Protagonist: oh yeah it does soesnt it [11:32]  Walter Balazic: yes [11:32] Baewyn Celara: yup [11:32] Walter Balazic: I noticed it with a leashing script also [11:32] Walter Balazic: on tugging the leash, it should "walk" [11:32] Walter Balazic: but it flies first [11:32] Walter Balazic: then walks [11:32] BlueWall Slade: lol [11:32] Walter Balazic: so there is something triggering fly before the anim in question [11:32] BlueWall Slade: hard tug [11:32] Walter Balazic smiles at Bluewall [11:32] Walter Balazic: yes I know [11:32] Walter Balazic: :) [11:32]  Hiro Protagonist: that explains why my NPCs are so unpredictable following, hrmmm [11:32]  Walter Balazic: but it is an example [11:32]  Walter Balazic: yes [11:32]  Walter Balazic: and build "pointing" at an object [11:32]  Walter Balazic: is an embedded anim [11:33]  Walter Balazic: so we are making the hypothosis that hop [11:33]  Walter Balazic: is a tiny fly [11:33]  Walter Balazic: then the pointing anim [11:33]  Hiro Protagonist: hmm [11:33]  Sarah Kline: I'm sure i had a thing that did that [11:33]  Sarah Kline: but was in the script [11:34]  Sarah Kline: not connected with the building thing though [11:34]  Walter Balazic: well when we saw 3 different scripts [11:34]  Walter Balazic: all doing a fly then the anim [11:34]  Walter Balazic: we considered it might be something bigger than a script issue [11:35]  Sarah Kline: yes well no idea why it would be scripted like that anyway ) [11:35] Walter Balazic: well it shouldn't be, it should call the animation in question [11:35] Walter Balazic: and that's it [11:35]  Walter Balazic: not fly first [11:35] Walter Balazic: that's exactly the point [11:35] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: I had a thought on your comms issues [11:36] Tiffany Magic: Justin: Yes? And? [11:36] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: In 0.7.4, http inventory is turned on by default [11:36] Justin Clark-Casey: which involves many more http connections, I believe [11:36] Justin Clark-Casey: but I know there's some discussion in linden lab where various routers have a very low number of max connections [11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: perhaps the number of connections is causing comms issues in some situations, though this is very hypothetical [11:37] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin: Which settingi s that? It can be turned off to see if it makes a difference. [11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: you would want to comment out Cap_FetchInventoryDescendents2 and Cap_FetchInventory2 in [ClientStack.LindenCaps] in OpenSim.ini [11:38] Justin Clark-Casey: that would siable http inventory and force viewers to fallback on udp inv [11:38] Andrew Hellershanks: k, ty. I'll check on those settings after this meeting. [11:38] Tiffany Magic: Thank you Justin. [11:38] Justin Clark-Casey: unfortunately, modern ll viewers have a bug/feature where they cannot fall back to udp inventory anymore [11:38] Justin Clark-Casey: but TPVs should still be able to, I believe [11:39] Dahlia Trimble: you can still tell the LL viewer to not use http inventory [11:39] Justin Clark-Casey: There's a chart at http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/lanwan/router-charts/bar/77-max-simul-conn [11:39] Dahlia Trimble: its a menu option under either advanced or develop menus [11:39] Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: oh, that still works? On LL 3.3.x it appeared to be broken [11:40] Andrew Hellershanks: If it was to make a difference is there anything that could be done other than leave it disabled? [11:40] Justin Clark-Casey: maybe if you deliberately change that setting it works, it seemed broken because auto-fallback no longer worked [11:40] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: wel, that would be the next problem [11:40] Dahlia Trimble: still works on the LL production viewer Im using I believe [11:40] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, ok. I'll let you know what happens [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: so that chart shows some routers ahve a really low number of max connections [11:41] Teravus Ousley: well, it's actually a HTTP Recommendation that's usually followed. Two http connections to any single server. [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: like those d-links at the bottom [11:41] Teravus Ousley: Some allow 4 [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: heh, I know browsers no longer follow that and I don't believe the viewer does either [11:41] Andrew Hellershanks: dang it. I remembered a question I was going to ask and forgot it again. [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: a higher number of max http texture cons at once, for instance [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: so this could also be related to http texture fetch [11:41] Baewyn Celara: :) [11:41]  Nebadon Izumi: I need to step away for a bit [11:42]  Teravus Ousley: In windows, there's a registry setting that you can tweak for IE [11:42]  Nebadon Izumi: have to deal with a tree that fell, they need my help [11:42]  Azah Tabor: I know in Firestorm, under the Develop tab at the top, you can uncheck the http texture and http inventory [11:42]  BlueWall Slade is AFK - see you all later [11:42]  Teravus Ousley: ok, neb, good luck [11:42]  Baewyn Celara: ok Neb [11:42]  Hiro Protagonist: be careful Neb [11:42]  Qandy Saw: yes, tc [11:42]  Baewyn Celara: ok Blue [11:42]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: ok - cheers [11:42]  Nebadon Izumi: I'll stay logged in, probably be 15-20 minutes [11:42]  Andrew Hellershanks: My neighbour had some flashing rip off the roof line of their house. [11:42]  Sarah Kline: byes [11:43]  Justin Clark-Casey: azah: yes, could also be worth trying manually for testing [11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: if you're the only person on a simulator behind a particular router [11:44] Hiro Protagonist:. [11:44] Baewyn Celara: brb [11:45] Teravus Ousley: no script events either [11:45] Teravus Ousley: in the simstats [11:45] Hiro Protagonist: time for me to fly too -- we've pretty much covered everything I think can be covered under the circumstances [11:45] Hiro Protagonist waves [11:45] Hiro Protagonist is Offline [11:45] Qandy Saw: bye [11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, I noticed that - not sure when that was last operational. Propbably not for a long while since xengine doesn't count it [11:45] Teravus Ousley: take care [11:45] Sarah Kline: byes [11:46] Teravus Ousley: ok, my concern is we have no reliable instrumentation. The sim stats are supposed to be such that you can determine, at a glance what's wrong with the server. :) [11:46] Justin Clark-Casey: any other opensim topics today? [11:46]  Jak Daniels: justin: quick question about load/save iar if I may... 'save iar first last /' saves the My Inventory folder, but.. [11:47]  Andrew Hellershanks: Oh, thank you for saying iar. Now I remember my issue. [11:47]  Jak Daniels: load iar / puts a My Inventory folder back under My Inventory [11:47]  Jak Daniels: is that right? [11:47]  Andrew Hellershanks: I loaded a ~600M IAR file and some of the scripts in the loaded objects I don't have perms on. [11:47]  Justin Clark-Casey: yes, it's not symettrical, which is awkward [11:47]  Jak Daniels: oh i used --merge on load iar too [11:47]  Justin Clark-Casey: jak: the 'workaround' is to do save iar /* [11:47]  Walter Balazic: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6359 [11:47]  Walter Balazic: any more headway on this Justin? [11:47]  Jak Daniels: ok thanks i will try that [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: probably that's what save iar / should really do [11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: you're loading back to osgrid? [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: walter: need more data to make headway quicker - otherwise it's waiting for me to have time to look at the code [11:49] BlueWall Slade is Offline [11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: Are the perm issues of scripts inside items a load issue (scripts have UUID of avatar from previous grid and were not updated to that of local grid)? [11:49] Walter Balazic: what kind of data do you want Justin, I'll get some people on it for you [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: mm, now some groups comms timeout is holding up the main sceen loop [11:50] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, I saved an iar from a grid I used to use that is now gone. I loaded it in to a different grid running 074PF [11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: walter: the detalis are in my mantis comments [11:50] Richardus Raymaker is Online [11:50] Walter Balazic: the reply to Whitestar? [11:50] Walter Balazic: that's what you need done? [11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: yes [11:51] dan banner: bye everyone [11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: vte dab [11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: bye dan [11:51] Qandy Saw: bye dan [11:51] dan banner is Offline [11:51] Walter Balazic: take care Dan [11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: yeah, it's possible [11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: possibly the adjustments done on oar loading are currently insufficient [11:52] Baewyn Celara: back [11:52] Andrew Hellershanks: justin, ok. I'll see if I can dig in to the database and verify if the old avatar UUID is on some items. [11:52] Andrew Hellershanks: Same avatar name just different avatar UUID [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: well, in theory it should be ignored since you can't have items owned by different people in an object [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: even if that's the case in the asset (which is entirely possible) it should be corrected on actual rez [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: but I'm not convinced right now that this is all happening properly [11:53] Richardus Raymaker: dont tell m you start 1 hour earlyer [11:54] Andrew Hellershanks: That's not what I'm seeing. I'll have to note one of the objects and check the item UUID and dig in to the DB [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, only for this week for europeans [11:54] Richardus Raymaker: crap. nobody warned me. [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: I would have thought the clocks going back would be a clue [11:54] Qandy Saw: =) [11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: anyway [11:55]  Robert Adams: should verify what time it will be next week.... when UTC? [11:55]  Tiffany Sicling: does that have anything to do with giving objects across different regions not working? [11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: We will go back to 1900 UTC instead of 1800 UTC [11:55]  Richardus Raymaker: betetr use SLT time [11:56]  Justin Clark-Casey: so it will remain 7pm for US and go back to 7pm for Euro [11:56]  Justin Clark-Casey: and for anybody in asia it will be +1 [11:56]  Richardus Raymaker: uhm PDT.. grr. now i missed everything [11:56]  Dahlia Trimble: 7 pm? [11:56]  Franja.Russell @marin.us.com: Hello Bruch. [11:56]  Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: giving an object to somebody in a neighbouring region via direct drag? [11:56]  Bruch a: hello Franja [11:56]  Richardus Raymaker: anyway, i got last week a few times this error "ODE crash. Bad arguments(s) (..\..\ode\src\collision_kernel.cpp:705)" [11:57] Franja.Russell @marin.us.com: How are you? [11:57]  Tiffany Sicling: like I have their name up in friends, and I drop an inv to them from inv [11:57]  Tiffany Sicling: *item [11:57]  Walter Balazic: I see that randomly [11:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: dahlia: ug, sorry, 11am in the west coast, 2pm on the east [11:57]  Teravus Ousley: Richardus, check your terrain. [11:57]  Walter Balazic: I just figured that was some kind of presence thing [11:57]  Franja.Russell @marin.us.com: There's conversation on my screen but I see only you Bruch. Where are the others? [11:57]  Bruch a: Thanks i am fine :) [11:57]  Richardus Raymaker: hmm, no terrain is flat. it happend with ode verhicle [11:57]  Teravus Ousley: typically that results from broken terrain, or outlandishly complex objects [11:57]  logger sewell: I do as well but it is sporatic for me [11:57]  Bruch a: they are in the house behind you franja [11:58] Franja.Russell @marin.us.com: Oh. [11:58] Franja.Russell @marin.us.com: Thanks. [11:58] Bruch a: your welcome :) [11:58]  Justin Clark-Casey: ah vehicles :) [11:58] Franja.Russell @marin.us.com: I'm going to wander around to see what's here. Enjoy your day. [11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: I need to look at what group code changes are in place in git master vs. 074PF as I have trouble pulling up group member/role info for a group with 102 members. [11:58] Bruch a: thanks you too :) [11:58]  Teravus Ousley: hmm, well, bad argument means that the plugin did something wrong or there's memory corruption :) [11:58] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: no difference afair [11:59] Dahlia Trimble: using the ODE that comes with OpenSimulator? [11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, that's weird. Arielle pulled up member info on a group here with > 500 members. I can't even get the data for a group with 102 members. [11:59] Richardus Raymaker: yes [11:59] Richardus Raymaker: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6377 [11:59] Arielle Popstar: pulled up one with 1024 members but it did freeze me and a friend for a few seconds Andrew [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: I have a feeling this stuff is being done synchrionously on the scene loop, which is bad [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: did you do that in this simulator earlier? [12:00] Walter Balazic: I just pulled up the LF Land group [12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Arielle, right. I don't care about the lag but I don't get any results and I waited for a minute or so with no joy. [12:00] Sarah Kline: Bye all [12:00] Walter Balazic: it has 377 in it [12:00]  Qandy Saw: bye, tc everyone :) [12:00]  Tiffany Magic: You were still able to do it, Arielle... we can't even open a group if it has over 100 members in it. [12:01]  Azah Tabor: I was able to just open the group info for a group that has 993 members... Snoopies Freebies [12:01]  Baewyn Celara: bye Sarah [12:01]  Arielle Popstar: it was on the sandbox plaza i did it. Should test on a low bandwidth region [12:01]  Justin Clark-Casey: that's probablyi why we're getting these chat pauses [12:01]  Baewyn Celara: bye Q [12:01]  Walter Balazic: :) [12:01] Walter Balazic: your right about that Justin [12:01] Walter Balazic: lol [12:02] Richardus Raymaker: for justin, i hope to test the mantis asap about the sounds.. [12:02] Ubit Umarov: ( hmm changing link on physical prims in core ode is .. hmm lets say asking for trouble ;) ) [12:02]  Arielle Popstar: the freezes maybe an indication of why they wont open at all in other places [12:02]  Justin Clark-Casey: hmm, though muost of them are async [12:02]  Andrew Hellershanks: I want to simplify some of the SQL queries for groups if possible. I think there are times too much data is being returned. A lot of it isn't always needed. [12:03]  Michelle Argus: andrew, right, we are already woking out a concept for refactoring the group module in total [12:03]  Andrew Hellershanks: Michelle, good. [12:04]  Michelle Argus: http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Feature_Proposals/Improve_Groups_Service [12:04]  Andrew Hellershanks: Michelle, some of the changes I thought were going to be major. [12:04]  Michelle Argus: sql's are just one part of that [12:05]  Andrew Hellershanks nods [12:05] Michelle Argus: right, i guess it will a major refaktoring [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: Getting a list of who should receive a group notice shouldn't need more than UUID of who is online or should get notices forwarded to them. It gets full member data. [12:06] Arielle Popstar: a notice or a message? [12:06] Michelle Argus: i also would prefer a methos with some decentral "addons" for some funkions which cause many requests, eg IMs, but this still needs to be discussed [12:06] Teravus Ousley: ok, well.. as I really cannot contribute much more to the conversation.. :) I think I'm probably going to go. Have a great day and rest of the week. [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: bye teravus [12:07]  Andrew Hellershanks: Arielle, the fetch is the same [12:07]  Dahlia Trimble: I'm off for lunch. Bye all :) [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: I need to go as well [12:07] Baewyn Celara: bye Teravus [12:07] Baewyn Celara: bye Justin [12:07] Richardus Raymaker: bye ter [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: see you folks around [12:07] Richardus Raymaker: bye justin [12:07] Walter Balazic waves [12:07] Teravus Ousley: Gnight, May your tapings have an audience. [12:07] Jak Daniels: bye justin... thanks [12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, ttyl on IRC, justin [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey waves [12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: tapings? [12:07] Arielle Popstar: :) [12:08]  Teravus Ousley is Offline [12:08]  Tiffany Sicling: bye all [12:08]  Gennifer Eros: Hello all