Chat log from the meeting on 2014-05-13

 [11:06] Andrew Hellershanks: The fix for event listings does involve both the ossearch module and the query.php file. [11:06] Nebadon Izumi: hey heres Justin [11:06] Nebadon Izumi: ok [11:06]  Richardus Raymaker: hi justin [11:07] Andrew Hellershanks: I need to double check things again. This business of determining what is expected as a separate in the landing point coordinates is a pain. [11:07] Andrew Hellershanks is Online [11:07] dan banner: hey justin [11:07] Mata Hari: hi Justin [11:08] Andrew Hellershanks: I wanted to use / for consistency with other tables and I thought it was working on my machine but isn't working for showing events on the map. [11:08] dan banner: seem to be a few issues with timeouts [11:08] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, I answered your question in the bug report about where to find an offline PHP file. [11:08] Justin Clark-Casey: thanks andrew [11:09] Andrew Hellershanks: smxy replied to my reply making it seem like he didn't realize I was answering a question so I amended my comment to clarify it was a reply. [11:09] Nebadon Izumi: ya looks like maybe some issues with on of your very recent patches Justin [11:09] Nebadon Izumi: I have not experienced it, but Dan and Mata have it seems [11:10] dan banner: ya i updated a plaza as soon as it was mentioned to me [11:10]  Nebadon Izumi: http://opensimulator.org/viewgit/?a=commitdiff&p=opensim&h=bbc1dc6bceb18cc1970109c5069724fba84e9c83 [11:10] dan banner: had same/similar issue [11:10] Mata Hari: Dan happened to come online right after I made my new build so he tried it on a plaza to see if he got the same issue [11:10] Mata Hari: (and did) [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: oops that was wrong link sort of [11:10]  dan banner: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=7165 [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=7165 [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: ya thats what i meant to paste [11:11] Dahlia Trimble is Online [11:12] dan banner: its like instant errors on startup [11:12] Mata Hari: yep [11:12] Mata Hari: also on login [11:12] Vivian Klees: tp's [11:13]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, that's surprising. I will look into it [11:16] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.8.0 Dev          73891c7: 2014-05-09 11:06:33 -0700 (Unix/Mono) [11:17] Justin Clark-Casey: hi robert [11:17] Richardus Raymaker: hi robert [11:17] Dahlia Trimble: hi [11:17]  dan banner: hi [11:17]  Mata Hari: hi Dahlia [11:17] Daisy Duke: hi everyone! [11:18] dan banner: hello [11:18] Robert Adams: hi all [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: so anyone else have anything they wanted to bring up this week? [11:19] Richardus Raymaker: hi dahlia [11:19] vegaslon plutonian: so I hear complaints about people unsitting and being halfway in the floor. Has this been behavior all along or is it recent? [11:19] Vivian Klees: script/error warning with no ext? [11:19] Vivian Klees: text [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: its probably been around a while vegaslon [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: thats why i made this stool at last weeks meeting [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: it gives upwards thrust when you stand [11:20] Nebs Metal Bar Stool v1.5 (w/sit & launch): Goodbye.. [11:20] Nebs Metal Bar Stool v1.5 (w/sit & launch): Hello Nebadon Izumi, enjoy your sit.. [11:20] Mata Hari: oh....ground-sit when prim is elevated.....you sit on the ground, not the prim [11:20] Nebs Metal Bar Stool v1.5 (w/sit & launch): Goodbye.. [11:20] Nebs Metal Bar Stool v1.5 (w/sit & launch): Hello Nebadon Izumi, enjoy your sit.. [11:20] Richardus Raymaker: hold on mata [11:20] vegaslon plutonian: is this a problem that came with bulletsim or has people seen it in ode? [11:20] Justin Clark-Casey: I did want to bring up Mantis 7164 [11:21] Richardus Raymaker: this one mata ? http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=6813 [11:21] Mata Hari: yes [11:21] Andrew Hellershanks: I'm hearing that a 0.8 release candidate was issued. People have been asking me about 0.8 [11:21] Justin Clark-Casey: aren't you following the mailing lists? [11:21] Mata Hari: happened to me the other day with FS [11:21]  Richardus Raymaker: only know 0.8rc1 [11:21] Andrew Hellershanks: I thought I was on the mailing list. I haven't seen anything in a while. [11:22] dan banner: ya smaller the step the harder it is to get up [11:22]  Dev Random: I've had another occurrence of Collision events stopping firing too. [11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: robert: still mad at me about the terrain stuff? :) [11:22] Dev Random: Cant' reliably reproduce it, but I have a simple script where it occurs (yesterday it took 12 hours or so). [11:22]  Robert Adams: another.... argh [11:22]  Andrew Hellershanks wonders if his subscription got dropped when the mailing list host was changed. [11:22]  Richardus Raymaker: i have seen the rc1 on mailinglist [11:22]  Mata Hari: I've tested it with mesh stairs, sculpt stairs and prims stairs....same issue each time [11:23]  Mata Hari: if I increase the step there's a window where it's fine, then when it gets too large again it runs into trouble [11:23]  Vivian Klees: what's the width being used? [11:24]  Mata Hari: 2m x 0.5m step size was the prim set [11:24]  Richardus Raymaker: that never worked very good 0.5 [11:24]  Mata Hari: no, 0.5 deep, not high [11:24]  Mata Hari: stair was 2m wide, 0.5m deep, and the 0.15m high [11:25]  Richardus Raymaker: aah. that must work fine. [11:25] Mata Hari: had trouble with 0.15 and 0.2....when I increased to 0.25 it was okay [11:25] Mata Hari: and 0.3 is fine [11:25] Mata Hari: then again around 0.45-0.5 it has trouble (as you'd expect [11:26]  Dahlia Trimble is Offline [11:27]  Mata Hari: had no trouble at all walking up the stairs in this building which look like they may be more than 0.25 (though maybe they have an invisible ramp up them) [11:29]  Justin Clark-Casey: one thing I was curious about is how many ways there are to hypergrid right now. [11:29]  Justin Clark-Casey: is it just entering URLs directly into the main map search box? [11:29]  Richardus Raymaker: not sure if it still depends on the direction [11:29]  Mata Hari: landmarks will work too [11:30]  Robert Adams: justincc... not mad about terrain... although I think there is a bug in the DB serializer.... it seems to cast to int16.... I haven't tested though [11:30]  Mata Hari: I can't do it via a text link but that might be lingering FS bug [11:30]  Justin Clark-Casey: robert: it still is int16 there. As far as I could see, changing that would mean a new db serialization [11:31] Justin Clark-Casey: and tbh, I wanted to do as little change as possible for now so there's an opportunity to sort it out properly after 0.8 [11:31] Justin Clark-Casey: mata: yeah, I cuoldn't get text link to work either [11:31] Robert Adams: there is a bunch of stairs tuning in BulletSim [11:32] Dev Random: justincc: osTeleportAgent mentions HG TP too.. [11:32] Justin Clark-Casey: dev: good point [11:32] Justin Clark-Casey: I really want to know if changing certain config parameters successfully blocks all the ways that hg teleport can happen, or successfully restricts them [11:32] vegaslon plutonian: just nothing to set stair minimum right now. that is hard coded in based on avatar size [11:32] Robert Adams: http://opensimulator.org/wiki/BulletSim#Avatar_Walking_Up_Stairs [11:34] Robert Adams: you can change the stairs minimum in BUlletSim... it looks for a colision close to the bottom of the avatar and then adds up position and up force.... both tunable [11:34] Mata Hari: I use the default values [11:34] Robert Adams: it has something for making sure one is walking straight into the stairs.... the reason why walking up stairs backward doesn't work in BulletSim [11:35] Nebadon Izumi: I have found that if you walk up stairs on an angle it works better [11:35] Mata Hari: right, but walking straight into a 0.15m step should be flawless(ish) [11:35] Nebadon Izumi: straight up seems to create a lot of friction [11:35] Mata Hari: and more importantly, if 0.25m step is flawless then doing the identical thing with a 0.15m step certainly should be [11:35]  Mata Hari: and it isn't [11:36]  Mata Hari: it seemed to coincide with the change to the avi bounding box/shape a month or so ago [11:37] Robert Adams: ok... that could again be wrong computation of the avatar height... since avatar position is kept as the avatar middle, the stairs has to recompute the bottom of the capsule [11:37] Mata Hari: prior to that it was working fine for a 0.15m step [11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: everything was better in the good old days ;) [11:37]  Mata Hari: lol [11:37]  vegaslon plutonian: ya alot of broken amusement park rides in opensim these days [11:37]  Robert Adams: I'll take a look into that again.... i also need to re-verify the avatar height stuff so feet are at least on terrain and prims [11:38]  Justin Clark-Casey: robert: Is it worth delaying the next release candidate until then? [11:38]  Robert Adams: when are you releasing it? [11:38]  Justin Clark-Casey: there are also a few other things I need to fix [11:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: robert: I was thinking either friday or early next week [11:39]  Robert Adams: I will do avatar height before Friday [11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: cool. I think a new rc early next week is most likely but might be Friday if things look good [11:40]  Justin Clark-Casey: got to resist trying to fix too many bugs, at the risk of introducing problems (like the one I just did yesterday) [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: any other opensim topics today? [11:42] Justin Clark-Casey: I guess not, party time! [11:43] Mata Hari: no, though when you tackle the login issue again I have some other info that might be relevant [11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: login issue? [11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: oh, the latest problem? [11:43] Mata Hari: the inventory fetch getting stuck [11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, that's a complicated one [11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: I suspect that the simulator has to send back a different HTTP code if it's overloaded to throttle the incoming requests [11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: but that's not going to be a simple thing to implement if that's the case [11:44] Mata Hari: on a busy sim it also induced massive chat lag and a total failure to fetch or even send existing cache textures for anyone in the region [11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: it might also be that the osgrid inventory service is getting overloaded and that causes problems without a retry mechanism in place [11:44] Mata Hari: or rather, that issue seems to happen immediately after someone logs in directly to the region vs login plaza and then tp [11:45]  Robert Adams is also looking at the tilted feet problem [11:45] Mata Hari: so I'm guessing it's related [11:47] Dev Random: Robert: is there any debugging info,etc that would help with the Collision problem (http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=7132) ? [11:47] Andrew Hellershanks: Which mailing list announced 0.8rc1? I'm wondering why I didn't see the message. [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: you're aware we switching mailing lists recently? [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: but you should have been autosubscribed [11:48] Robert Adams: if you're willing to have large log files, the detailed physics logging records all the collisions and who they are being sent to [11:48]  Andrew Hellershanks: yes. I was just checking the info I had and confirmed I was already subscribed to dev and core on the new server. [11:48] vegaslon plutonian: I had to pull it out of the junkmail folder [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: I announced to both users and dev [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: and people replied, so it was seen [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: by at least some folks [11:49] Mata Hari: I saw it [11:49]  Andrew Hellershanks: Other people were asking me about 0.8rc1 and all I could say is I didn't know anything about it. [11:49] Dev Random: Robert: I'll take a look... yesterday it happened after 3 teleports total.. all me. [11:49] Robert Adams: Look in OpenSimDefaults.ini .... there if you turn on that logger and can see it stop working, I will look at them for you [11:49] Dev Random: will do [11:50]  Justin Clark-Casey: usually I keep rc1 fairly quiet so that there's an opportunity to winkle out major issues with people who are familiar with how this kind of thing works [11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: but tbh, it's hard enough to get people to test release candidates anyway so probably not a worthwhile tactic [11:50] Andrew Hellershanks nods [11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: if people are asking you about it might be a good sign [11:50] Andrew Hellershanks: yes, but I started to wonder why they had heard about it and I hadn't. [11:51]  Andrew Hellershanks: Strange. [11:51] Robert Adams: Dev: if you put the log files in a different dir, you can zip them all together [11:51] Dev Random: I do. read-only bin dir. [11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: our 'put everything in the bin dir' habit can be a major pita [11:53] stiofain nbmcmedia: hi folks [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: hi stiofain [11:53] Richardus Raymaker: hi [11:56]  UUID Speaker: paulie Flomar: 86003a74-b4d4-45fc-bfa7-46aab9949e94 [11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, anything else quickly? [11:57] Dev Random: grepped 65536 on *.cs, and LLClientView.cs line 4882 looks iffy... [11:57] Dev Random: int simulatorCapacity = (int)(((float)landData.SimwideArea / 65536.0f) * (float)m_scene.RegionInfo.ObjectCapacity * (float)m_scene.RegionInfo.RegionSettings.ObjectBonus); [11:57] Dev Random: looks like it'll inflate prim limit for vars [11:57] Dev Random: anybody care? [11:58] paulie Flomar: Howdeh, all :) [11:58]  Richardus Raymaker: hi pauli [11:58]  Justin Clark-Casey: Would need to be fixed - I expect it should pull the dimensions from RegionInfo rather than hardcoding them [11:59]  Justin Clark-Casey: and one could argue that logic should be in a module rather than LLClientView but that's another issue [11:59]  Dev Random: no point before release though, right? [11:59]  Justin Clark-Casey: it would be a pretty minor fix... but maybe not a crticial issue [11:59]  Andrew Hellershanks: Not sure about that. I have people waiting for 0.8 as they are interested in varregions. [12:00]  Andrew Hellershanks: Has anyone done terrain saves/loads for varregions? [12:00]  Richardus Raymaker: it saves lots of noise if its fixt before release i think [12:00]  Justin Clark-Casey: perhaps a bit more important is the issue with mantis 7039 where some chat distances don't work properly on var regions [12:00] Robert Adams: I wasn't sure about that computation.... there are a lot of odd limits for objects and the computation is not obvious [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: I may try to take a look at that if i get time [12:00] Sarah Kline: i have [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, always a risk of triggering something nasty in the viewer [12:00] Sarah Kline: works ok [12:01]  Sarah Kline: heightmap [12:01] Justin Clark-Casey: though one would think dividing by a bigger rather than a smaller number should be okay [12:01] Robert Adams: yes justincc, there is a need to fix distance commputation of neighbors.... there are still some code places that have that problem [12:01] Andrew Hellershanks: Sarah, Does it save one file for each 256x256 section of the varregion or does it make a huge file? [12:01] Justin Clark-Casey: robert: not going to be a simple fix? [12:01] Robert Adams: related to nebadon's mulitple terrain rezzing also [12:01] Sarah Kline: oh i havent saved out [12:02] Dev Random: Andrew: I have saved and reloaded, but only really using Terragen format. [12:02] Andrew Hellershanks: Sarah, if you are loading, do you have to provide a much bigger file than normal to account for the difference in sizes? [12:02] Sarah Kline: oh my let me think [12:02] Dev Random: Andrew: It was one big file. [12:02] Andrew Hellershanks: Dev, ok. That would make sense. The standard raw format isn't set for bigger than 256x256 [12:03] Sarah Kline: yes you have to lol [12:03] Robert Adams: 'save oar; saves the whole varregion [12:03] Andrew Hellershanks: I'm wondering how varregions will affect the ability to use a viewer to save/load terrain. [12:03] Robert Adams: the file input for terrain should accept larger images for the larger varregions (a 1kx1k image for a 1kx1k varregion) [12:04] Robert Adams: if the sizes don't match, odd defaulting will happen [12:04] Sarah Kline: yes [12:05] Robert Adams: I changed most of the image save/load code to save the larger images.... mistakes could have been made [12:05] Robert Adams: loading a legacy oar into a varregion with the --displace paramter will also displace the terrain [12:05] Andrew Hellershanks: ok. I'll have to try that myself at some point just to see it in action. [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: ok. [12:06] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, I need to go get a bite to eat. Will look at the request bug I introduced after that [12:07] Richardus Raymaker: bye justin [12:07] Sarah Kline: byes [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: bye folks [12:07] Mata Hari: bye Justin [12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: I'm going to look at the mailing list archives to look for messages I never received. [12:07] dan banner: later [12:07] Dev Random: I'm going to fill my drive with physics logs