Chat log from the meeting on 2009-03-24

[10:00] BlueWall Slade is Online [10:01] EL RODO is Online [10:04] EL RODO is Online [10:22] Starky Rubble: Heelo Neb... I am just getting here early and parking... BRB [10:38] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSimulator Server  0.6.3.8849  (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur) Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:False [10:38] EL RODO is Offline [10:38] paulie Flomar is Online [10:39] Valentine MichaelSmith is Offline [10:40] Valentine MichaelSmith is Online [10:41] Nebadon Izumi: hello [10:42] Nebadon Izumi: brb again myself :) [10:45]  Oddly Space: hi there [10:45]  BlueWall Slade is Offline [10:46]  Oddly Space: st like office time? [10:46]  BlueWall Slade is Online [10:46]  Charles Krinke is Online [10:47]  paulie Flomar is Offline [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: hey there [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: soon [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: about 15 minutes [10:47]  Nebadon Izumi: hello charles [10:47]  Charles Krinke: morning. I think I have completely lost track of time zones now. [10:47]  BlueWall Slade: Hello [10:48]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe i got here early [10:48]  Nebadon Izumi: oh hey blue [10:48]  Nebadon Izumi: you were just off my screen [10:48]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [10:48]  BlueWall Slade: I just got here [10:49]  Nebadon Izumi: i restarted the sim a while ago [10:49]  Nebadon Izumi: then logged in [10:49]  Nebadon Izumi: been here ever since [10:50]  Nebadon Izumi: brb got some food cooking [10:50] Nebadon Izumi: starving [10:51] Bri Hasp is Online [10:52] Bri Hasp is Offline [10:55] Bri Hasp is Online [10:58] Nebadon Izumi: so hows everyone doing? [10:58] Alex Wood: doing well thanks [10:58] Nebadon Izumi: :) [10:58]  Nebadon Izumi: meeting will be getting started shortly [10:58]  Charles Krinke: Sim is running. That is always a good thinkg and brings smiles to many [10:58]  Nebadon Izumi: give people a few more minutes to show up [10:59]  Teravus Ousley is Online [10:59]  BlueWall Slade: I'll be afk for a few minutes [11:00]  Tim Ballew: Hi guys. Still can't create a male body shape. :( [11:00] Teravus Ousley: open up invenntory [11:00] Teravus Ousley: click the Create menu [11:00] Richardus Raymaker: Are there mor ethat have seen wierd Teleport problems last week like teleport failed and still you end on the tagret location. but cant move then. [11:00] Tim Ballew: Yep. Not working, though. [11:00] Teravus Ousley: .. new body parts [11:00] Teravus Ousley: .. new shape. [11:01] Tim Ballew: I have some parts that I can make, not all. [11:01] Teravus Ousley: .. then right click on the new shape in your inventory [11:01] Teravus Ousley: .. then choose wear. [11:01] Tim Ballew: I create body shape and nothing happens [11:01] Teravus Ousley: Next, right click on yourself and edit appearence. [11:01] Teravus Ousley: You will be able to modify the body [11:02] Teravus Ousley: .. if you want to do the hair, or eyes.. or some of the other parts, you will need to create the parts in your inventory and wear them first. [11:02] Tim Ballew: It just stared working. That's sort of what happened last week. [11:02] Tim Ballew: At first, nothing. [11:02] Tim Ballew: Then, I was able to create a few articles of clothing. [11:02] Nebadon Izumi: im eating some food but if we want to get rolling lets do this [11:02] Homer Horwitz: Hi :) [11:03]  Nebadon Izumi: hello homer [11:03]  Nebadon Izumi: ckrinke anything you want to talk about? [11:03]  Richardus Raymaker: hi all [11:03]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Richardus [11:04]  Charles Krinke: Ok, Normally the agenda is 1) "Recommended" version for the week. 2) Things core developers need help oon or to say and then 3) things testers need help on or to say. [11:05] Charles Krinke: As we go forward thorugh the meeting, brining up previously mentioned items is fine. I just want to give the core developers "first dibs" [11:05] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSimulator Server  0.6.3.8849  (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur) Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:False [11:05] Nebadon Izumi: 8849 seems quite nice [11:06] Starky Rubble: ok [11:06]  Alex Wood: I'm running 8849 on a closed grid [11:06] Nebadon Izumi: nice [11:06] Charles Krinke: Any objections to r8849 as "recommended" for the week, replacing r8802 of last week? [11:06] Nebadon Izumi: anyone else have any recent expeirences updateing? [11:07] HERCULES Strength Tester: WEAR a copy of the hammer,STAND on the white pad and CLICK the strike pad! [11:07] Teravus Ousley recommends people test the RC [11:07]  HERCULES Strength Tester: WEAR a copy of the hammer,STAND on the white pad and CLICK the strike pad! [11:07] Charles Krinke: good point. We need testers to test and report any compatibility issues (or lack therof) in the client RC [11:08] Teravus Ousley: well, I'm talking about the Simulator RC that lbsa tagged last week [11:08] Teravus Ousley: .. or rather.. the week before. [11:08] Charles Krinke: Sorry. My mistake. [11:08] Homer Horwitz: And the client RC is the official client now :) [11:08]  Homer Horwitz: (and I'm using it, so far without problems) [11:09]  Alex Wood: which client are you referring to? [11:09]  Homer Horwitz: SL client 1.22.11 [11:09]  xiss burg: lol [11:10]  Richardus Raymaker: oh, [11:10]  Charles Krinke: I see. Looks like the official client has now become 1.22.11 on the secondlife.com web site, so we need to starrt testing it. [11:10]  Homer Horwitz: Yep, that was the intention. [11:11]  xiss burg: what is happening here? [11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: this is our weekly meeting [11:11]  Teravus Ousley has IETF streams on in the background [11:11]  xiss burg: about? [11:11]  Charles Krinke: This is a regular "Office Hour" meeting held each week. All are welcome. The subject is "OpenSim Development" [11:11]  Starky Rubble: IETF? [11:11]  xiss burg: hm [11:12]  Nebadon Izumi: sort of just an Open Forum for opensim topics [11:12] Teravus Ousley: Yes, Starky, a standards body [11:12] Starky Rubble: ah ok [11:12]  Charles Krinke: How is reliability in general? [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: its been greatly improved I think [11:13] xiss burg: well...you wont like what i'll say but I just think SL sucks a lot and a completely new virtual world system should be built. SL is full of shit =| [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: far from perfect [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: but the plazas are seeming to run 12+ hours [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: even more [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: 24 in some cases [11:13] xiss burg: a [11:14]  Starky Rubble: Sunday was a good exercise and it went well... [11:14]  Charles Krinke: Teleports keeping appearance properly, now? [11:14] Starky Rubble: yep [11:14] Teravus Ousley: Actually, xiss you'll find people who agree with you who work on OpenSimulator. [11:14] Richardus Raymaker: only need to ducktape my hair sometimes /andor shoes [11:14] xiss burg: you wont like what I'll say but I just think SL sucks and a new virtual world system(a quality one) should be built [11:14] Chris D is Online [11:14] Charles Krinke: How can we get the sim RC to the tagged and released state this weekend? [11:16] Teravus Ousley stares at the half moon for a bit [11:16] Starky Rubble: thinks of cheese [11:16] Charles Krinke: Do we want to tag the next 0.6.* before the end of the month, if possible? [11:16] Richardus Raymaker: avoid 1 april :) [11:17]  Starky Rubble: thats a core dev decision isn't it? [11:17]  Teravus Ousley: err.. well, the RC server could be tagged 0.6.4 if people think it's sufficiently tested. [11:18]  Charles Krinke: It is a core decision, but is significantly influenced by the feelings of this group. [11:18]  Charles Krinke: As most of us also double as guiding the support in IRC [11:19]  Elaine Bennett is Online [11:19]  Nebadon Izumi: im pretty happy with this rev [11:19]  xiss burg: ya [11:19]  Nebadon Izumi: i'll pack up an osgrid release today for sure [11:19]  Nebadon Izumi: more people can get testing it [11:20]  Charles Krinke: Are there significant differences between the simulator RC Teravus is mentioning and trunk? [11:20]  Teravus Ousley: about two weeks [11:21]  Starky Rubble: are there stats on the client versions connecting to the grid [11:21]  Starky Rubble: sorry hosts [11:22] Starky Rubble: whicj OS versions [11:22] Teravus Ousley: Actually, there is client version stats with the webstats module enabled [11:23] Charles Krinke: Since next Wednesday is April 1st, I am thinking of holding a tag and bag for this weekend and aim for the weekend after, that is, the first full weekend in April [11:23] Charles Krinke: "holding off" on tag and bag [11:23] Starky Rubble: do we know what the majority of sims are running at anuy point? [11:23] Teravus Ousley: http://www.wmcv.com:9000/SStats/clients.report <-- example [11:24] Teravus Ousley: I don't think so, Starky. It's sorta Ad-hoc on OSGrid [11:24] Teravus Ousley: Though, for production systems, OpenSimulator developers recommend using a tagged version. [11:24] Starky Rubble: too bad - it would be useful data [11:25] Teravus Ousley: http://www.wmcv.com:9000/SStats/sessions.report <--- session breakdown on one of my Sims [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: ya that would be nice data to collect eventually though [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: maybe in the future that can be incorporated in [11:26]  Starky Rubble: nice - I muddied the question with client tho lol [11:26] Teravus Ousley: hehe, well.. the webstats module is collecting Client Operating system.. :P. But there's no reports with it in it currently [11:26] Justin Clark-Casey is Online [11:27] Starky Rubble: yes... it seems that when making this kind of decision knowing how many sims run the version in question might help [11:27] Nebadon Izumi: Hello Justin [11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: hello folks. Forgot both which day it was and what time it was [11:27] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: hi Nebadon [11:28] Nebadon Izumi: no worries next week were back on 11am PST 1800 UTC correct? [11:28] BlueWall Slade: heee jcc - signs of a busy man [11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: yep [11:28] Nebadon Izumi: cool [11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: tell me about it [11:28]  Richardus Raymaker: earlyer ? uhmm. not good [11:28] Nebadon Izumi: ive been showing up early for those who are confused [11:28] BlueWall Slade: iar ??? [11:28] BlueWall Slade: hehe [11:28] Richardus Raymaker: but it on the irc headed for next week nebadon [11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: massive oars actually, though I hope to do some iar work this week [11:29] Teravus Ousley has been programming to the tune of IETF chats [11:29] Justin Clark-Casey: heh [11:29] Teravus Ousley: they're all on lunch now though.. so all you get is hiss [11:29] Teravus Ousley: and the occasional chair baningin. [11:30] Justin Clark-Casey: you've been listening to things other than the MMOX BOF? (I thought it was starting 1520 PDT) [11:30] Teravus Ousley: no, MMOX isn't until later. [11:30] Teravus Ousley: but there's other things going on. [11:31] BlueWall Slade: the banging is probably peopel taking pop shots at Prokfy [11:31] Teravus Ousley: http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf74.m3u if you want all of the streams. [11:31] Teravus Ousley: heh, she's there, huh? [11:31] Justin Clark-Casey hasn't got a big enough brain to listen to technical chat and do work unfortunately [11:31] Orion Hax: whats the disscussion [11:31] BlueWall Slade: lol, no telling [11:32] Teravus Ousley: apparently, no talking either. [11:33] Teravus Ousley: Homer Horwitz, anything you'd like to add? [11:33] Homer Horwitz: About the stream? Sounds ... quiet :) [11:34] Teravus Ousley: yes, peeps are at lunch [11:34]  Teravus Ousley: .. though, I was talking about the meeting. [11:34]  Teravus Ousley: .. this meeting. [11:35]  Justin Clark-Casey wonders if that is a no [11:35]  Homer Horwitz: I finally started the migration to the new region-modules. Wanted to do that weeks ago... If we want to do a release within the next week, I should wait with the checkin until after that. [11:35]  Justin Clark-Casey: damn [11:35]  Homer Horwitz: :) [11:35] Justin Clark-Casey: Homer: cool :) [11:35]  Homer Horwitz: Region-modules might break after that :) [11:35] Teravus Ousley: Cool :) [11:35]  Teravus Ousley: lots of code to update then. [11:35]  Homer Horwitz: Although I try to keep breakage to a minimum. [11:36]  Teravus Ousley: Just about All forge projects will need to check and fix breakages. [11:36]  Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, +1 on a release before then if possible [11:36]  Homer Horwitz nods [11:36]  Hiro Protagonist is Online [11:36]  Homer Horwitz: The old code will continue to work for a while, so there shouldn't be a hard break. [11:37]  Justin Clark-Casey: even better :) [11:37] Charles Krinke: So, release this weekend? Not release this weekend? I are confused, but can take it either way. [11:38] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSimulator Server  0.6.3.8849  (OS Fedora release 9 (Sulphur) Kernel \r on an \m) ChilTasks:True PhysPrim:False [11:38] Teravus Ousley: Err, I'd wait until Thursday of next week to consider a release that isn't the current RC tagged simulator. [11:38] Charles Krinke: k [11:38]  Homer Horwitz: No problem for me, I'll do most of the work in a separate application plugin anyway, currently. [11:39] Homer Horwitz: So, no need for big merges. [11:39] Teravus Ousley: cool :) [11:39]  Teravus Ousley: that will be quite cool [11:40]  Homer Horwitz: ... can wait with the checkin until after the release :) [11:40] Teravus Ousley: justincc, anything to add to the meeting? [11:41] Teravus Ousley: all eyes are on you justinClark-Casey! [11:41] Justin Clark-Casey wonders if he shoudl perform a funny little dance [11:41] Gaspar Roux: in a cage [11:41] Nebadon Izumi: lol [11:41] Charles Krinke: Ok, let me throw it open and ask any testers what they need to make their lives easiere [11:41] Charles Krinke: be fair [11:42] BlueWall Slade: I would like to mention something about teh Sloodle project [11:42] Charles Krinke: please [11:44] Richardus Raymaker: ? [11:44] Justin Clark-Casey wonders if that is a no [11:44]  BlueWall Slade: Sloodle is a frontend to an education system based on moodle [11:44] Charles Krinke: As I understand it it, there is work afoot to port/use sloodle in OpenSim and BlueeWall is working with the sloodle folks [11:44] BlueWall Slade: it uses objects in SecondLife to communicate to the backend [11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, very nice, looks like a very intersting project [11:45] Gaspar Roux: Are you working with the GreenBush team? [11:45] BlueWall Slade: We are having great sucess, so far. And I think after it is ported, we will be able to open new fronteers with it [11:45] BlueWall Slade: No Gaspar [11:46] Charles Krinke: I also understand Mantis#3326 with problems with llGeteOwnerKey with a linked set may b e the current stumbling block [11:46] BlueWall Slade: one thing - the oar capability has made it easier to work [11:46] BlueWall Slade: yes, but that is probably an easy fix [11:46] Teravus Ousley: yayoarz [11:46] Justin Clark-Casey: cool :) [11:46]  Teravus Ousley: yeah.. bad pun.. [11:46]  BlueWall Slade: we will need to do a little work with xmlrpc handling [11:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: ha [11:47]  BlueWall Slade: lol Ter [11:48]  BlueWall Slade: that's about it for now - just keep watching and when we have a working set. I think we will open som traning classes for those interested in using OpenSim for education [11:48]  Teravus Ousley: Nebadon, would you like to express some of your recent crashes? [11:48]  Justin Clark-Casey: BlueWall: are you posting progress updates anywhere else? [11:48]  Teravus Ousley: whoops, jumped the gun there a bit. [11:48]  BlueWall Slade: hang on a sec [11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: well, the crashes have seemed to lessen [11:48]  Charles Krinke: no problem, its "furball time" [11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: seems like if we let our hardware go to long without a reboot [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: things tend to melt down [11:49] BlueWall Slade: http://www.bessacarr.com/moodle19/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=1 [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey waits for Charles to start wretching [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: but after rebooting the server things clear up for a while [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: this is both linux and windows [11:49] Charles Krinke: [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: of all flavors [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: so we'll likey be rebooting all the osgrid simulator hardware atleast once a week [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: that should clear up alot of nonsense [11:50] BlueWall Slade: http://www.sloodle.org/moodle/ - the developers forums there [11:50] Teravus Ousley: FYI, I'm starting on a Bullet Physics plugin (that's different then Modified_BulletX). Should be interesting to see what comes up and how it compares to the OdePlugin when it's completed. [11:50] Charles Krinke: I am needing to reboot my personal serverss about once a week also, lately [11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: Bluewall: Thanks I shall get a login and take a look when I get a chance. Nice work :) [11:50] BlueWall Slade: a group is working in Reaction grid and Myself and Norse Writer are working here [11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: yea its definatly opensim [11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: doing something to .net and mono [11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: where they never fully let go of something [11:51]  BlueWall Slade: thanks - looking forward to iar's that will help I think [11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: only solution that really works is reboot your hardware [11:51]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: unfortunately I believe rebooting servers is quite common for some big web applications [11:51]  Richardus Raymaker: have discovered that. not simple if you run other things on it for now [11:51]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: yeah, should make it a bit easier to transport smaller globs of content [11:51]  Gaspar Roux: Shittle accretion is more pronounced on highly-trafficked regions, right? [11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: yea well like bluewall said too, mono is doing a great job of emulating windows [11:52] Nebadon Izumi: :) [11:52]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: OpenSim will probably turn out to be not very different [11:52]  Teravus Ousley: YEs Gaspar [11:52]  BlueWall Slade: hippo eating > 1052m here [11:52]  Nebadon Izumi: hungry hungry hippoos [11:52]  Nebadon Izumi: give em some marbles [11:52]  BlueWall Slade: lol [11:53]  BlueWall Slade: hehe - now we have equal oportunity OS [11:53]  Teravus Ousley: Anyway, my hope is that the BulletDotNET plugin will be reasonably performant. [11:53]  BlueWall Slade: crash all the time [11:53]  Teravus Ousley: will give people a choice between ODEPlugin and the BulletDotNETPlugin [11:53]  BlueWall Slade: cool Ter - any highlights about features? [11:53]  Justin Clark-Casey: Teravus: cool. what advantages do you think that it may have over ode? [11:53]  Nebadon Izumi: are you planning on working on bullet now? [11:53]  BlueWall Slade: vehicle-wise? [11:54] Charles Krinke: One can see the memory usage by looking at the statistices panels behind me and see teh RAM approach zero on this server while the meeting has been going on [11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: or perhasp your plans of a ODE Bullet hybrid? [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: charles: someone is slowly pulling out all the ram chips, a la hal in 2010? [11:54] Teravus Ousley: pretty much the same. There's actually less options with regards to 'joints', so likely the Jinja joint capability will be limited. [11:54] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [11:54] BlueWall Slade: hehe [11:54] Charles Krinke: Justin, I think so. [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: sorry, slightly silly mood today [11:55] Teravus Ousley: I think the rest of things should be on PAR with the ODEPlugin features in the end though. [11:55] Charles Krinke: Gotta go pretend I am working at my fritzen-fracken, boring, non-OpenSim job. [11:55] BlueWall Slade: it will be nice to have some options to choose from [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey waves [11:55] Nebadon Izumi: ok charles [11:55] Teravus Ousley: there will be several revisions of it and it will get more stable over time. [11:55] BlueWall Slade: see ya Charles [11:55] Nebadon Izumi: were nearing our time here anyway [11:55] Nebadon Izumi: if anyone has anything else pressing [11:55] Charles Krinke is Offline [11:55] Teravus Ousley: Physics, unfortunately.. is one of the more difficult things to get stable. [11:55] Nebadon Izumi: nows the time [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: teravus: so out of interest, why work on it? [11:56] Alex Wood: by the way, is charles involved with the iphone app? [11:56] Alex Wood: http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2009/03/health-center-uk.html [11:56] Teravus Ousley: Well, so we implement more then a single physics engine fully. [11:56] Alex Wood: http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2009/03/iphone-app.html [11:56] Gaspar Roux: justincc, with IARs, is the level of granularity a single item/object/prim ? [11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: gasper: it will be single inventory item [11:56] Teravus Ousley was thinking recently.. it would make OpenSimulator more relevant, if it had a selection of physics engines. [11:57] Gaspar Roux: Gotch [11:57] Gaspar Roux: a [11:57]  BlueWall Slade wishes the slcclient had find/grep builtin [11:58] Chris D is Offline [11:58] BlueWall Slade: as lot of people could live with basic prim handling and avatar movement [11:58] Teravus Ousley: regex search.. an advanced mode with vim compiled in yeah!