Chat log from the meeting on 2014-08-26

[2014/08/26 11:02] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca: I don't have an oscc account. [2014/08/26 11:02] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: you dont need [2014/08/26 11:03] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: just scroll to bottom [2014/08/26 11:03] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: ok, done. [2014/08/26 11:03] Mata Hari: if he declines will he explode into a shower of body parts? [2014/08/26 11:04] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Neb, can you give me one of those Oculs things here? [2014/08/26 11:04] Nebadon Izumi: sure [2014/08/26 11:04] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: I wanted to bring one to Kitely, went to get one off the table in OSgrid..... OOPS! [2014/08/26 11:04] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: the depends if the door clowsed before [2014/08/26 11:04] Nebadon Izumi: like horribly laggy [2014/08/26 11:04] Nebadon Izumi: is it me or is it real laggy [2014/08/26 11:04] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: yes [2014/08/26 11:04] Nebadon Izumi: what the heck [2014/08/26 11:05] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: no its laggy, i see it in chat [2014/08/26 11:05] Justin Clark-Casey: yes [2014/08/26 11:05] Nebadon Izumi: wonder whats up with that [2014/08/26 11:05] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: hi justin [2014/08/26 11:05] Nebadon Izumi: was really bad for a minute [2014/08/26 11:05] Nebadon Izumi: login it seemed [2014/08/26 11:05] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: hi billy [2014/08/26 11:05] Justin Clark-Casey: let's see if it returns [2014/08/26 11:05] Nebadon Izumi: but yes hang on for Oculus [2014/08/26 11:05] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: menas more reading stuff for justin :O [2014/08/26 11:05] Nebadon Izumi: i'll put them out [2014/08/26 11:05] Mata Hari: someone's inventory fetch stuck maybe [2014/08/26 11:05] Nebadon Izumi: so you can grab it [2014/08/26 11:05]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Hi Richardus [2014/08/26 11:05] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Perfect, thanks. [2014/08/26 11:06] Nebadon Izumi: there you go everyone [2014/08/26 11:06] Nebadon Izumi: if you want an oculus rift [2014/08/26 11:07] Nebadon Izumi whispers: its wearable :) [2014/08/26 11:07]  Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i want a real one !, but beter wait for the fginal [2014/08/26 11:07]  Voice not available at your current location [2014/08/26 11:07]  Connecting to in-world Voice Chat... [2014/08/26 11:07]  Connected [2014/08/26 11:07]  Voice not available at your current location [2014/08/26 11:07]  Nebadon Izumi: heh mata your avatar is blinking like crazy for me [2014/08/26 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: maybe LOD thing when i move camera your avatar freaks out [2014/08/26 11:08]  Connecting to in-world Voice Chat... [2014/08/26 11:08]  Connected [2014/08/26 11:08]  Mata Hari: maybe you're right n an LOD threashold [2014/08/26 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: ya i always upload avatars in much higher LOD than static object would [2014/08/26 11:08]  Nebadon Izumi: it really jumps for you though [2014/08/26 11:08]  Mata Hari: or your GPU is feeling lazy today [2014/08/26 11:08] Nebadon Izumi: your avatar like completely jumps [2014/08/26 11:08] Nebadon Izumi: its not just degrading [2014/08/26 11:08] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: and how's mata inventory ? [2014/08/26 11:08] Justin Clark-Casey: oh man [2014/08/26 11:08] Nebadon Izumi: its like jumping above the chair [2014/08/26 11:09] Justin Clark-Casey: it's easy now there is no inventory ;) [2014/08/26 11:09]  Mata Hari: I think when you upload far higher LOD it still shifts though [2014/08/26 11:09]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: 100% of 0 is 0 [2014/08/26 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: it shouldnt [2014/08/26 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: I never use the default numbers the viewer suggests [2014/08/26 11:09]  Voice not available at your current location [2014/08/26 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: normal for High - Med [2014/08/26 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: i use the maximum value [2014/08/26 11:09]  Mata Hari: ie if you use "from file" of rall 4 and use 100% LOD it will still be switching between copies at the LOD break points [2014/08/26 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: then Low i use 50% of high [2014/08/26 11:09]  Connecting to in-world Voice Chat... [2014/08/26 11:09]  Nebadon Izumi: and lowest i use 50% of medium [2014/08/26 11:09] Connected [2014/08/26 11:10] Nebadon Izumi: that should cure the blinking [2014/08/26 11:10] Mata Hari: think it treats each LOD as "unique" [2014/08/26 11:10] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Neb, when I copy that Rift, it never shows up anywhere in inventory.... [2014/08/26 11:10] Nebadon Izumi: ive never seen an avatar jump like yours does [2014/08/26 11:10] Nebadon Izumi: are you looking in your Suitcase? [2014/08/26 11:10] Mata Hari: I had chilli for dinner last night....maybe I'm just full of beans [2014/08/26 11:10] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Went there first, search can't find it either [2014/08/26 11:10] Nebadon Izumi: hmm [2014/08/26 11:10] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Mexican Jumping Beans? [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: ya its not showing up for me either [2014/08/26 11:11] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i see it just under objects [2014/08/26 11:11] Mata Hari: maybe [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: when i take a copy [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: something seems fubar with inventory [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: thats not good [2014/08/26 11:11] Mata Hari: HG everything is FUBAR [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: its been great for me [2014/08/26 11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: but im not HG [2014/08/26 11:11]  Nebadon Izumi: im a local user [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: and its my object [2014/08/26 11:11] Nebadon Izumi: and when i take a copy im not getting it [2014/08/26 11:11]  Mata Hari: it needs some serious TLC... [2014/08/26 11:12] Nebadon Izumi: HG has been working very well for me [2014/08/26 11:12]  Nebadon Izumi: especially inventory [2014/08/26 11:12] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: donmt worry, later you get 20 copy's [2014/08/26 11:12]  Nebadon Izumi: Justin inventory seems hosed here [2014/08/26 11:12] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: perms to export may be off here? [2014/08/26 11:12] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: Take copy didn't give me a copy [2014/08/26 11:12] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: bluewall. export that works opposite ? [2014/08/26 11:12] Mata Hari: it should allow Neb to take a copy though [2014/08/26 11:13] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i have the oculus (HG) and nebadon not (Local) uhhmm [2014/08/26 11:13] Nebadon Izumi: im taking a copy of my own object [2014/08/26 11:13] Nebadon Izumi: and its not showing up in my inventory [2014/08/26 11:13] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: HG in and try [2014/08/26 11:13] Mata Hari: neat [2014/08/26 11:13] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ohh [2014/08/26 11:13] Justin Clark-Casey: something is wrong [2014/08/26 11:13] Justin Clark-Casey: one moment [2014/08/26 11:13] Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: It doesn't show up in my HG or local account. [2014/08/26 11:13] Mata Hari: it's a new feature to help cut down on asset server usage....if you can't take inventory you can't build up tons of assets [2014/08/26 11:14] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: hehe [2014/08/26 11:14] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: Copy not working for HG, just see continuous blue circle (firestorm) [2014/08/26 11:14] Mata Hari: and think how much less lag there will be too [2014/08/26 11:14] Nebadon Izumi: i wonder if i can rez anything [2014/08/26 11:14] Region found! [2014/08/26 11:14] Region found! [2014/08/26 11:14] Mata Hari: no nasty prims and textures bogging down the bandwidth [2014/08/26 11:14] Teleport completed from https://2013_opensim_com/region/Staff%20Zone%201/126/60/85 [2014/08/26 11:14] Connecting to in-world Voice Chat... [2014/08/26 11:14] Connected [2014/08/26 11:14] Region found! [2014/08/26 11:14] Region found! [2014/08/26 11:14] Teleport completed from https://2013_opensim_com/region/Keynote%201/235/249/22 [2014/08/26 11:14] Nebadon Izumi: i can rez stuff [2014/08/26 11:15] Nebadon Izumi: just not take copies [2014/08/26 11:15] Justin Clark-Casey: it's just here [2014/08/26 11:15] Justin Clark-Casey: keynote 1 is ok [2014/08/26 11:15]  Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: people seem to rez quick when they arrive [2014/08/26 11:15] Nebadon Izumi: hmm [2014/08/26 11:15] Nebadon Izumi: bizzaro [2014/08/26 11:15] Nebadon Izumi: we'll have to see if that remains true once people actually start showing up there [2014/08/26 11:15] Nebadon Izumi: i should start logging in my bots [2014/08/26 11:15] Nebadon Izumi: such a pain [2014/08/26 11:15] Script saved [2014/08/26 11:16] Nebadon Izumi: i cant get as many bots in this week [2014/08/26 11:16] Nebadon Izumi: maybe 40-50 [2014/08/26 11:17] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i did take copy, worked fine. singularity. mata wich FS version ? [2014/08/26 11:18] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: seeing avatarAppearance updates every 30 secs this week [2014/08/26 11:18] Nebadon Izumi: you were able to take a copy of the oculus? [2014/08/26 11:18] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: yes [2014/08/26 11:18] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I have one now [2014/08/26 11:18] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: you took a copy today? [2014/08/26 11:19] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i take a copy few minutes ago [2014/08/26 11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: I think something is holding up inventory operations, possibly hg related [2014/08/26 11:19] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: Still no copy of the oculus here. I'm on Singularity. [2014/08/26 11:19] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: at least i found this under objects. let me test it again [2014/08/26 11:19] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: hmmno, it dont work now [2014/08/26 11:19] Nebadon Izumi: hmm ya this is odd for sure, ive not seen anything like this happen in a while [2014/08/26 11:19] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: keeps in waiting mode [2014/08/26 11:19] Nebadon Izumi: wonder what could be causing this [2014/08/26 11:20] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: blue circle [2014/08/26 11:20] Mata Hari: does anyone have inventory fetch that says it's loading? [2014/08/26 11:20] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: its not for some reason connected with osgrid [2014/08/26 11:20] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: Why do all my folders have "(Unavailable)" beside them? [2014/08/26 11:20] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: Mata thats normal for HG [2014/08/26 11:20]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: My Suitcase should be available [2014/08/26 11:20] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: oh wait its unavailable here [2014/08/26 11:21] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: All except Suitcase, is correct Andrew [2014/08/26 11:21] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: No "loading..." issue here [2014/08/26 11:21] Nebadon Izumi: when you hypergrid only thing available is your Suitcase folder [2014/08/26 11:21] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: That keeps a rogue simulator from copying your things [2014/08/26 11:21] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i can anyway access things. but fodlers show unavailable [2014/08/26 11:21] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: oh, ok. [2014/08/26 11:21] Justin Clark-Casey: I suspect a bad HG request with an extremely long delay is effectively holding everything up [2014/08/26 11:21]  Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: correct, suitecase fin [2014/08/26 11:21] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: excep[t otehr files not blocked :O [2014/08/26 11:22] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: hey Key - you on vacation this week? [2014/08/26 11:22] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: Hm... I'm in a var in another grid and I can't see names of other regions or double click a map tile to TP there. [2014/08/26 11:22] Nebadon Izumi: there seems to be a bunch of red errors on sim console [2014/08/26 11:22] Nebadon Izumi: about HG stuff [2014/08/26 11:22] Key Gruin: vacation, BlueWall? [2014/08/26 11:22] Nebadon Izumi: for Andrew and Bluewall [2014/08/26 11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, that's because threads are being aborted for taking too long [2014/08/26 11:22] Nebadon Izumi: and you too just now Justin [2014/08/26 11:22] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002 whispers: Nebadon, oh? [2014/08/26 11:22] Nebadon Izumi: ah ok [2014/08/26 11:23]  Justin Clark-Casey: some ultra long inv operation is stacking absolutely everything up [2014/08/26 11:23]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Hmm, possibly a misconfig for me [2014/08/26 11:23]  Nebadon Izumi: ya somethings very wrong [2014/08/26 11:23] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: let me check my console [2014/08/26 11:23] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: @Key - OSG [2014/08/26 11:23] Nebadon Izumi: no you guys probably took a copy of the oculus [2014/08/26 11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: I suspect it's a very long hg request [2014/08/26 11:23] Nebadon Izumi: and its just starting to time out [2014/08/26 11:23] Nebadon Izumi: show errors [2014/08/26 11:23] Nebadon Izumi: not sure why though very strange [2014/08/26 11:24] Nebadon Izumi: this is definitely something new ive not seen before [2014/08/26 11:24] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: my robust and asset screens look ok here [2014/08/26 11:24] Justin Clark-Casey: it's proably someone's [2014/08/26 11:24]  Justin Clark-Casey: but unfortunately do not have enough data yet to determine exactly what it's waiting on [2014/08/26 11:24]  Justin Clark-Casey: if you do pure inv ops they are fine [2014/08/26 11:24] Nebadon Izumi: hmm [2014/08/26 11:24] Nebadon Izumi: interesting [2014/08/26 11:25] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: my home regions is ok [2014/08/26 11:25]  Nebadon Izumi: i tried erasing the oculus and it wont erase [2014/08/26 11:25] Justin Clark-Casey: it's probably connected with any manipulation of objects in the scene, including take copy [2014/08/26 11:25] Justin Clark-Casey: or delete sinec that also pushes a copy to your trash [2014/08/26 11:25] Nebadon Izumi: ya [2014/08/26 11:25]  Nebadon Izumi: it wont erase [2014/08/26 11:25] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I am seeing FetchInventoryDecendants every 30 seconds [2014/08/26 11:25] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I had two copies of Singularity running. I used to be able to do that but it is really hard on my computer with recent versions of Sing. [2014/08/26 11:25] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I'm back to oen copy now. [2014/08/26 11:26] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: s/oen/one/ [2014/08/26 11:26] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: mine is still trying to take a copy [2014/08/26 11:26] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: hi [2014/08/26 11:26]  Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: hi [2014/08/26 11:26]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Dahlia [2014/08/26 11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: this does highlight a weakness in how this stuff is done I believe [2014/08/26 11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: scene ops connected with deleting and similar take place one at a time [2014/08/26 11:26] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: In what area, Justin? [2014/08/26 11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: and that wasn't originally written with a scenario where one request could hold for an extremely long time [2014/08/26 11:27] Nebadon Izumi: thats my middle name > Nebadon "this does highlight a weakness in how this stuff is done I believe" Izumi [2014/08/26 11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: AsyncSceneObjectGroupDeleter.InventoryDeQueueAndDelete [2014/08/26 11:27] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002 grins at Nebadon [2014/08/26 11:27] Nebadon Izumi: lol [2014/08/26 11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: that requires a lock on inventory deletes, which prevents any other operation. It then does inv manipulation, which in this case falls through to HG [2014/08/26 11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: if any of those HG ops took a long time it would hold up all other ops, I believe [2014/08/26 11:27] Justin Clark-Casey: hence all those timeouts and aborts on the console [2014/08/26 11:27] Nebadon Izumi: ya [2014/08/26 11:28]  Nebadon Izumi: wierd ive not seen it before though [2014/08/26 11:28] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: It isn't using row level locks? [2014/08/26 11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: hey, my cube finally deleted [2014/08/26 11:28] Nebadon Izumi: oh [2014/08/26 11:28]  Nebadon Izumi: oculus deleted [2014/08/26 11:28] Nebadon Izumi: it recovered [2014/08/26 11:28] Justin Clark-Casey: neb: possiblyu we haven't had a situation where somebody's HG misbehaves in exactly this fashion [2014/08/26 11:28] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: or is that a lock in the code? [2014/08/26 11:28] Nebadon Izumi: however [2014/08/26 11:28] Nebadon Izumi: it still isnt in my inventory [2014/08/26 11:28] Nebadon Izumi: lol [2014/08/26 11:28] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: Nor in mine, nebadon [2014/08/26 11:28] Nebadon Izumi: inventory still has blue circle [2014/08/26 11:29] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: No blue circle here, but no Rift in invetory [2014/08/26 11:29] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: blue circle? [2014/08/26 11:29] Nebadon Izumi: ya next to the cursor its like an hour glass basically [2014/08/26 11:29] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: yes still see the blue rotating cirlce next to mopuse pointer to [2014/08/26 11:29]  Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: oh [2014/08/26 11:29]  Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I didn't see that. [2014/08/26 11:29] Justin Clark-Casey: there are a lot of timeouts to gateway.bluewallvirtual.net [2014/08/26 11:30] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: that's me [2014/08/26 11:30]  Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: ?you think a bigger one will copy better? [2014/08/26 11:30] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: the viewer waits for the oculus. and maby the server wait for viewer respons [2014/08/26 11:30] Nebadon Izumi: heh i think i clobbered the only copy i had in my inventory [2014/08/26 11:30] Nebadon Izumi: now this one wont erase either [2014/08/26 11:30] Justin Clark-Casey: If I were guessing, I would say this is excaberated by ppl now coming from lots more different hg locatios.... [2014/08/26 11:30] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: do you get this one i found neb ? [2014/08/26 11:30] Justin Clark-Casey: wherease before many were coming from hg.osgrid.org [2014/08/26 11:30] Nebadon Izumi: yes it came through [2014/08/26 11:30] Nebadon Izumi: which is kind of surprising [2014/08/26 11:32] Nebadon Izumi: its strange that i cant take a copy or delete a copy [2014/08/26 11:32] Nebadon Izumi: but when Richardus sent me a copy [2014/08/26 11:32] Nebadon Izumi: it came right through to inventory [2014/08/26 11:33] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: 14:33:41 - [HG SUITCASE INVENTORY SERVICE]: AddItem: folder db1fe15a-20d8-4e8b-9302-af1bccc7a3bd (user 4ab4afee-3863-4948-869a-169c0620cb62) is not within Suitcase tree [2014/08/26 11:33] Justin Clark-Casey: some bad gateway stuff to hg.osgrid.org too, thuogh I don't think that's an issue [2014/08/26 11:33] Nebadon Izumi: ya that shouldnt matter [2014/08/26 11:33] Nebadon Izumi: and this Oculus is not from OSgrid either [2014/08/26 11:33] Nebadon Izumi: its from Avacon grid [2014/08/26 11:33] Nebadon Izumi: where i originally uploaded it [2014/08/26 11:33]  Nebadon Izumi: all copies even the one on oSGrid came from avacon grid [2014/08/26 11:34] Justin Clark-Casey: I can probably delete this stuff directly from console [2014/08/26 11:34] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: oh.. intressting [2014/08/26 11:34] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: still dont know how i got it [2014/08/26 11:34]  Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: not suprissed if the creator lockup from your oculus is locking things. because it cannot find osgrid [2014/08/26 11:35] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, direct console delete from scene is fine [2014/08/26 11:35] Justin Clark-Casey: I strongly suspect this is related to hg inv manipulation [2014/08/26 11:35] Billy.Bradshaw @hg.viewtwo.net:8600: I went into edit mode on the large Oculus, and the blue circle has gone [2014/08/26 11:36] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: dont work for me [2014/08/26 11:36]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: does anyone still use opensim32bitlaunch.exe? [2014/08/26 11:36] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: Blue, I stopped using it. [2014/08/26 11:36] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: is this like all the "cannot find creator" messages I see on my console when I log into the temporary grid I set up and where I uploaded my osgrid iar? [2014/08/26 11:36] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: The Oculus rezzed over my head shows all owner details. [2014/08/26 11:37] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: um... in front of me. That is a really big one. [2014/08/26 11:37] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: A user was having issues starting their region with opensim32bitlaunch.exe today, and nebadon asked them to not use it ... [2014/08/26 11:37] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: thats magnus size oculus [2014/08/26 11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: there's also a small change the thread abort has permanently grunked up this sim until restart [2014/08/26 11:37] Justin Clark-Casey: chance [2014/08/26 11:38] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: if that is causing issues for users and no one is using it, we should remove it? [2014/08/26 11:38] Justin Clark-Casey: BlueWall: how is it causing issues? [2014/08/26 11:38] Nebadon Izumi: I sure do know how to break stuff good [2014/08/26 11:38] Nebadon Izumi: lol [2014/08/26 11:38] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: I thought people liked it because it supposedly uses less memory [2014/08/26 11:39] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Justin, in the case of that user, his sims would not start [2014/08/26 11:39] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I used it when I was running a 32-bit OS. [2014/08/26 11:39] Nebadon Izumi: you should not use that when running 32 bit os [2014/08/26 11:39]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Dahlia, that is what I'm asking - do people still use it? [2014/08/26 11:39] Nebadon Izumi: this si the problem [2014/08/26 11:39] Nebadon Izumi: 90% of the poeple using it [2014/08/26 11:39]  Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: definately dont need it if you run a 32 bit o [2014/08/26 11:39]  Nebadon Izumi: are using it for the wrong reason [2014/08/26 11:39] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: *os [2014/08/26 11:39] Nebadon Izumi: pretty much everyone i run into his is using that launcher [2014/08/26 11:39] Nebadon Izumi: should not be [2014/08/26 11:40]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ok, maybe that is the issue he was having? [2014/08/26 11:40] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: 32 bit Windoes [2014/08/26 11:40] Nebadon Izumi: most people don't know why they are running it [2014/08/26 11:40]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I see [2014/08/26 11:40] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I stopped using it on my own machine back when it was announced that OpenSim.exe could work on 32 and 64 bit systems. [2014/08/26 11:40] Nebadon Izumi: for some reason people seem to graviate to that exe over OpenSim.exe [2014/08/26 11:40] Mata Hari has no idea why I do anything other than eat and sleep [2014/08/26 11:41] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: cannot remember if i have ever used the 32bit launcher [2014/08/26 11:41] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Then if it is useful for people runnon on 64 bits, it is still good. [2014/08/26 11:41] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: but why do you want 32bit on 64bit system ? [2014/08/26 11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: I'm not sure memoeyr is really a consideration. It would be simply to eliminate the 32 bit client exes [2014/08/26 11:41] Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: People use it because it is still referenced in docs, I think. [2014/08/26 11:41] Nebadon Izumi: ive only heard one good excuse that still didnt convince me that exe is useful [2014/08/26 11:41] Nebadon Izumi: but one person has a management system that uses that exe [2014/08/26 11:41] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: smaller pointers [2014/08/26 11:41] Nebadon Izumi: they would have to rewrite a lot of their backend [2014/08/26 11:41] Justin Clark-Casey: well, they would have to change, it should be simple enough [2014/08/26 11:42] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: limited to 3 gb process [2014/08/26 11:42] Nebadon Izumi: without a hack [2014/08/26 11:42] Nebadon Izumi: its technically limited to 2gb [2014/08/26 11:42] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I have a management system that can use that exe but I change a setting so it doesn't any more. [2014/08/26 11:42] Nebadon Izumi: i dont think we ship that exe with the 3gb flag enabled [2014/08/26 11:42] Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Dependencies [2014/08/26 11:42] Nebadon Izumi: in windows .net 32 bit cant access more than 2gb [2014/08/26 11:43] Nebadon Izumi: there is a runtime flag you can hack into the .exe [2014/08/26 11:43] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: When I saw the issue, I wanted to have a discussion about whether is was still useful [2014/08/26 11:43] Nebadon Izumi: to make it use 3gb [2014/08/26 11:43] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: seems that it si [2014/08/26 11:43]  Nebadon Izumi: if you have EMT64 extensions [2014/08/26 11:43] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: *is [2014/08/26 11:43] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: ya but theres non .net code in there [2014/08/26 11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: how so? [2014/08/26 11:43] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Neb, I just cammed downstairs and got a folder of skin templates from a vendor, they arrived with no problems. [2014/08/26 11:43] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: 3G is the upper memory limit of the .exe's? [2014/08/26 11:43]  Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: sounds like some coded the b ackend wrong. [2014/08/26 11:43] Nebadon Izumi: my experience without the 3gb flag opensim will tend to crash about 1.8gb of memory uses in 32 bit windows [2014/08/26 11:43] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: If people on 64 bits still use it, I guess it is still in use? [2014/08/26 11:43] Nebadon Izumi: it will never go above 1.8gb [2014/08/26 11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: but why are they using it? [2014/08/26 11:44] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: well, I have some opininions ... [2014/08/26 11:44] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: lol [2014/08/26 11:44] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: maybe they do not know - I haven't used Windows so I'm 100% in the dark about it [2014/08/26 11:44]  Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i heared once soneone told me the 32bit start but the opensim.exe not. not sure whats true from that [2014/08/26 11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: there's no point maintaing something that benefits 5% in a dubious manner but causes support issues for everyone else [2014/08/26 11:45] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Agree, JCC [2014/08/26 11:45] Nebadon Izumi: not tooo too long ago there was no 64bit support in windows for opensim [2014/08/26 11:45] Nebadon Izumi: that time has passed while back [2014/08/26 11:45] Nebadon Izumi: that was why we had the 32bit launcher [2014/08/26 11:45] Nebadon Izumi: the problem is [2014/08/26 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: everyone thinks that is what you run if your using 32 bit os [2014/08/26 11:45]  Nebadon Izumi: its super confusing to newbs [2014/08/26 11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: right [2014/08/26 11:46] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i would suggest just like something else. make it deprecated with some time ? [2014/08/26 11:46] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ++ [2014/08/26 11:46] Mata Hari: ++++++++ [2014/08/26 11:46] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: maby add flag to opensim.exe to limit memory ? [2014/08/26 11:46] Nebadon Izumi: you cant [2014/08/26 11:46] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: i dont want to [2014/08/26 11:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: no, because the people voting for that don't pay the cost of having to manage deprecation [2014/08/26 11:46] Nebadon Izumi: because it causes problems on machines with no EMT64 support [2014/08/26 11:47] Mata Hari grumbles of about lack of C64 support [2014/08/26 11:47] Nebadon Izumi: justin in the abscence of time today im not sitting my npcs [2014/08/26 11:47] Nebadon Izumi: thats ok right? [2014/08/26 11:47] Justin Clark-Casey: ok [2014/08/26 11:48]  Nebadon Izumi: 90% of the time loggin in radegast is sitting them [2014/08/26 11:48] Nebadon Izumi: need to see if lkalif can simplify sitting [2014/08/26 11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: it is posisble to force sit from the console [2014/08/26 11:48] Nebadon Izumi: is it? [2014/08/26 11:48] Nebadon Izumi: ok great [2014/08/26 11:48] Nebadon Izumi: heh [2014/08/26 11:48] Nebadon Izumi: i'll leave you to do that if you want then [2014/08/26 11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: sit user name --regex nebadon tester.* [2014/08/26 11:48] Nebadon Izumi: ah ok nice [2014/08/26 11:49] Nebadon Izumi: wish i new that 3 months ago [2014/08/26 11:49] Nebadon Izumi: lol [2014/08/26 11:49] Mata Hari: lol [2014/08/26 11:49] Nebadon Izumi pretends justin only instituted that today [2014/08/26 11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: that hg asset mapper sure is noisy [2014/08/26 11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: ha, I did that for last year's conf :) [2014/08/26 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: for some reason [2014/08/26 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: i thought that was part of pcampbot [2014/08/26 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, nobody do stuff, but the inv block may have finally clearead..... [2014/08/26 11:49]  Nebadon Izumi: not the simulator [2014/08/26 11:49]  Justin Clark-Casey: dont' all copy stuff at once! [2014/08/26 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: what the hell [2014/08/26 11:50]  Justin Clark-Casey: uh oh [2014/08/26 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: the floor just disappeared [2014/08/26 11:50]  Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: ? [2014/08/26 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: heh [2014/08/26 11:50]  Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I wondered why the colour changed [2014/08/26 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: i think that was justin [2014/08/26 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: dont worry about it [2014/08/26 11:50]  Nebadon Izumi: its likely you wont get it back [2014/08/26 11:50] Nebadon Izumi: so far everything ive tried to erase has gone into a blackhole [2014/08/26 11:50] Nebadon Izumi: never shows up in inventory [2014/08/26 11:50] Nebadon Izumi: even after its gone [2014/08/26 11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: try now [2014/08/26 11:51] Nebadon Izumi: oh [2014/08/26 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: its working [2014/08/26 11:51] Nebadon Izumi: it finally recovered?> [2014/08/26 11:51] Ai Austin: Hi.. juts dropping in at the end of your meeting ahead of the load test [2014/08/26 11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: dammit, I might have had a mouse slip, though i didn't think that happened [2014/08/26 11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: and you're right, not in my trash :( [2014/08/26 11:51]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I have 2 copies of the object. The second one took a long time. [2014/08/26 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: or did you change something? [2014/08/26 11:51]  Justin Clark-Casey: no, the block has cleared [2014/08/26 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: dont worry about it [2014/08/26 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: it was just 1 cylinder [2014/08/26 11:51]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I guess that one was causing the messages on the screen [2014/08/26 11:51]  Justin Clark-Casey: according to my theory that some HG requests were holding everything up [2014/08/26 11:51]  Nebadon Izumi: i canf fix it later [2014/08/26 11:52]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: Justin, what were the messages about the timeouts? [2014/08/26 11:52]  Mata Hari: I wonder if that is in any way related to the fetch hang [2014/08/26 11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: it's a lot of stuff where things unrelated timeout [2014/08/26 11:52] Mata Hari: since once the person leaves the hang will eventually clear [2014/08/26 11:52] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: bluewallvirtual? [2014/08/26 11:52] Nebadon Izumi whistles *what floor* [2014/08/26 11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: very hard to tell what the real trigger is, though I'm sure neb would be happy to give yo system access to look at the logs if you want [2014/08/26 11:52] Mata Hari: lol [2014/08/26 11:52] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: maybe later [2014/08/26 11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, STP threads hanging has also fallen to 0 from about 15 [2014/08/26 11:53] Mata Hari: er......I'll get right on that.....need to read War and Peace first [2014/08/26 11:53] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: hehe [2014/08/26 11:53] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: the wait cursor is gone here [2014/08/26 11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: I suspect it might reutrn though if I'm right and whoever has the bad HG trys inv stuff again [2014/08/26 11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: you wanna put your rift out again, neb? :) [2014/08/26 11:53]  Nebadon Izumi: ya [2014/08/26 11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: now i just took a copy of the oculus [2014/08/26 11:54]  Nebadon Izumi: and its showing up right away in iventory [2014/08/26 11:54]  Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: I cammed to the store downstairs and grabbed a few things with no troubles [2014/08/26 11:54]  Justin Clark-Casey: kayaker: how did you do that? [2014/08/26 11:54]  Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: I took a copy [2014/08/26 11:54]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I will wait [2014/08/26 11:54]  Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: It appears I may be the problem [2014/08/26 11:54]  Ai Austin: I got the Oculus 3D models from downstairs too - thanks neb [2014/08/26 11:54]  Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Just cammed through the floor, clicked on venting machines, [2014/08/26 11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: joe: if you just took a copy it was fine [2014/08/26 11:55] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: some of the items were copy, took copies no problem [2014/08/26 11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: kayaker: I believe that flows through a different code path to the one taken when you do "take copy", "take" or "delete" on objects i nthe scene [2014/08/26 11:55] Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: It's not showing up for me. [2014/08/26 11:55] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ok, I'll take one ... [2014/08/26 11:55] Kayaker.Magic @grid.kitely.com:8002: Now I seem to be able to copy the Oculus! [2014/08/26 11:55] Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: Got the blue circle again [2014/08/26 11:55] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ok [2014/08/26 11:55]  Nebadon Izumi: hmm ya [2014/08/26 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: this delete code was put in about 5 years ago by Adam because of complaints that deletion was causing big probelms :) [2014/08/26 11:55]  Nebadon Izumi: so its BlueWall eh? 0.o [2014/08/26 11:55]  Justin Clark-Casey: at the time there was no hg [2014/08/26 11:55]  Ai Austin: I put a box to give away on our OSGrid and Openvue regions with a readme giving credits. See http://blog.inf.ed.ac.uk/atate/2014/07/30/oculus-rift-dk2-setup-and-test/ [2014/08/26 11:56]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: ok, yeah [2014/08/26 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [2014/08/26 11:56]  BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I'll have to troubleshoot it later [2014/08/26 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: well [2014/08/26 11:56]  Nebadon Izumi: we need to safegaurd against this on our end [2014/08/26 11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah absolutely [2014/08/26 11:56] Nebadon Izumi: this could be exploited for evil [2014/08/26 11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: will need to look into this [2014/08/26 11:56] BlueWall.Slade @gateway.bluewallvirtual.net:8002: I see no messages on this end [2014/08/26 11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: joe: your inv server is reuning (401) Unauthorized for some requests from here [2014/08/26 11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: ah, it's stopped agian :0 [2014/08/26 11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, this stuff needs to be proof against problematic hg, if I'm right about cause [2014/08/26 11:58] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: I have all kinds of hg problems lol [2014/08/26 11:58] Joe.Radik @joeradik.com:9200: My HG very easily could be mis-configured. [2014/08/26 11:58] Justin Clark-Casey: these distributed computing problems are far from easy to tackle unforutnately [2014/08/26 11:58] Justin Clark-Casey: and don't have the stat at the moment to tell how many objects are queued for 'deletion' [2014/08/26 11:58] Justin Clark-Casey: or take copy, etc. [2014/08/26 11:58]  Nebadon Izumi: hmm [2014/08/26 11:58] Nebadon Izumi: Justincc [2014/08/26 11:59] Nebadon Izumi: the force avatar sit worked on Keynote1 [2014/08/26 11:59] Nebadon Izumi: but its not working on KN2 [2014/08/26 11:59] Richardus.Raymaker @hypergrid.org:8002: well, means you need to log more stats :O [2014/08/26 11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: case sensitive [2014/08/26 11:59] Dahlia.Trimble @wwweb3d.net:8002: that http sniffer thingie might help, "Fiddler" I think it's called [2014/08/26 11:59] Nebadon Izumi: oh [2014/08/26 11:59]  Nebadon Izumi: why the heck did it work on KN1 [2014/08/26 11:59] Mata Hari: then you need an army of trained monkeys to sift throught those stats [2014/08/26 11:59] Nebadon Izumi: i copied and pasted the same thing [2014/08/26 11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: on kn1 your avs are tester [2014/08/26 11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: on kn2 Tester [2014/08/26 12:00] Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: I can't find the oculus rift device in the area below us [2014/08/26 12:00]  Nebadon Izumi: ah damn it [2014/08/26 12:00]  Nebadon Izumi: thanks [2014/08/26 12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: consistency!!!!! nggh :) [2014/08/26 12:00] Mata Hari: speaking of KN1....it's that time..... [2014/08/26 12:00]  Nebadon Izumi: ya lets head on over [2014/08/26 12:01]  Nebadon Izumi: bunch of folks there already [2014/08/26 12:01]  Andrew.Hellershanks @login.greatcanadiangrid.ca:8002: See you there soon [2014/08/26 12:01]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok