Chat log from the meeting on 2012-02-14

[11:07] Nebadon Izumi: i need to push out a new release here soon [11:07] Nebadon Izumi: we were trying to track a bug we have been seeing on some of the plazas [11:07] Richardus Raymaker: i hear the 02-03 can be bad. sofar it looks ok [11:07] Richardus Raymaker: the lag bug ? [11:07] Nebadon Izumi: i was hoping this morning we would have had more luck finding it [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: well there have been some times a few of the plazas became unresponisve [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: and some of the show commands on console would create error [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: have to restart sim [11:08] Richardus Raymaker: yes i know that one. you cant TP into it [11:08] Sarah Kline: I had troubles making new regions ...i look forward to next version [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:08] Justin Clark-Casey: those are going to be secondary failures [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: this region is running master git now though [11:08] Nebadon Izumi: i upgraded it last night [11:08] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.7.3 Dev         a9e8bd5: 2012-02-13 19:38:22 -0800 (Unix/Mono) [11:09] Hiro Protagonist: 'sup Walt :) [11:09] Aramis Soren: which mono? [11:09] Richardus Raymaker: hi justin [11:09] Walter Balazic: sup Hiro [11:09] Sarah Kline: Justin when i get same version as you used I'll check that Mantis thing [11:09] Walter Balazic: how's it going everyone [11:09] Richardus Raymaker: i run 2.10.8 [11:09] Nebadon Izumi: its mono 2.10.6 here [11:09] Nebadon Izumi: all the osgrid servers are 2.10.6 [11:09] Aramis Soren: ok so same range we've been used to i plan on reinstalling tonite since hack [11:10] Aramis Soren: i was 2.6.7 but will up to 2.10.6 or 8 now [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: my home server is 2.10.8 [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: runs fine [11:10] Richardus Raymaker: Firessh is btw usefull plugin. its better then putty for me. and faster then starting linux VM [11:10] Aramis Soren: ok ool [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: i just havent had time or much desire to upgrade osgrid boxes [11:10] Aramis Soren: cool [11:10] Richardus Raymaker: 2.10.8 runs fine for me to [11:10] Nebadon Izumi: not much difference between .6 and .8 [11:11] Aramis Soren: yes nice splash pages tho lol we know you're busy :) [11:11] Richardus Raymaker: hi spike [11:11] Justin Clark-Casey: hi ricrhadus,. folks [11:11] Justin Clark-Casey: sarah: yes, I couldnt' reproduce that problem [11:11] Spike Miles: hiya all :) [11:11] Sarah Kline: thats good then ^^ [11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: it's possible some of melanie's changes may have changed the behaviour [11:12] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.7.3 Dev         a9e8bd5: 2012-02-13 19:38:22 -0800 (Unix/Mono) [11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: so you havne't seen the same failure again yet? [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: not yet [11:12] Sarah Kline: yup [11:12] Aramis Soren: it will bubble to the top i bet [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: though, it seems the serialization errors are quiet again now [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: last night before i upgraded this region [11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: this is running on lbsa? [11:12] Justin Clark-Casey: or just wright? [11:12] Nebadon Izumi: there must have been 5000 serialization errors [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: just wright [11:13] Justin Clark-Casey: let me know - I have a chance to look at any issues again tomorro wthough today my time is tied up elsewhere [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: and its odd [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: the ones that happen here [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: no one is here [11:13] Nebadon Izumi: yet every so often like 100's of them all spew at once [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: like its on some kind of timer [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: very strange [11:14] Richardus Raymaker: querry ? [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: but it doesnt seem to sync up with any event i can track [11:14] Nebadon Izumi: not sure Richardus [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: its probably been happening for a long time [11:15] Richardus Raymaker: lol claudia [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: not to long ago justin made a change that made serialization errors print out as errors and not debug [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: and thats why we were seeing them now [11:15] Nebadon Izumi: yesterday he undid that [11:15] Justin Clark-Casey: the sheer amnount of logging might possibly cause a problem [11:16] Justin Clark-Casey: but yeah, I would have thought the underlying cause has been around for a long time [11:16] Claudia Sanz: whats so funny Richardus? [11:16] Richardus Raymaker: the valatine balloons [11:16] Justin Clark-Casey: ultimately, it may be better to not log at all but I'm not quite ready to make that step yet [11:16] Justin Clark-Casey: since it would hide other problems [11:16] Nebadon Izumi: ya, it certainly highlights a potential problem, how bad i dunno [11:16] Nebadon Izumi: but knowing the simulators are dealing with that much bad data [11:16] Nebadon Izumi: can't be good [11:16] Justin Clark-Casey: simulators always have to be prepared to deal with bad data [11:17] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:17] Richardus Raymaker: especially on lower powered systems [11:17] Justin Clark-Casey: since data could come in from any source, particular in this system [11:17] Richardus Raymaker: not sure if the serial error costs bandwidth to [11:17] Nebadon Izumi: ya and unfortuanately looking at serialized data and seeing a problem [11:17] Nebadon Izumi: is very difficult [11:17] Nebadon Izumi: its like trying to find a pin in a box of pins [11:18] Richardus Raymaker: thats hidden in a pile of staws [11:18] Richardus Raymaker: straws [11:18] Justin Clark-Casey: well, all the problems suggest suff encoded with other locales [11:18] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:18] Justin Clark-Casey: the things it's complaining about are floats, so probably comma has been used instead of a decimal poitn [11:18] Nebadon Izumi: or its just really old data [11:18] Justin Clark-Casey: that's what I would think [11:18] Nebadon Izumi: that perhaps didnt get handled when diva refactored serialization [11:18] Justin Clark-Casey: the changes I made would have no affect upon locales [11:18] Nebadon Izumi: i just find it hard to beleive [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: that there is that much bad content from locales [11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't :) [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: it almost seemed to happen every time someone logged in to [11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: people out there are still running 0.7.1.1 for instance [11:19] Aramis Soren: any certain _types_ of scripts involved, or just random usual? [11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, attachment data possibly [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:19] Richardus Raymaker: you talk about comma vs dot in numbers ? [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: probably hair or skirts [11:19] Nebadon Izumi: it tends to only be flexi or lights [11:19] Justin Clark-Casey: you would get a log message for every bad value on every prim [11:19] Richardus Raymaker: i know there is/where some hair around that gave errors in the past [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: what would be nice Justin [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: is if those errors could print the uuid of the item [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: so i could hunt one down [11:20] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, that would be nice [11:20] Basil Sosides: hello...good evening/morning [11:20] Aramis Soren: hi Basil [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: right now i don't even know what does it [11:20] Richardus Raymaker: hello basil [11:20] Justin Clark-Casey: hi basil [11:20] Nebadon Izumi: all i know is there are 100's if not 1000's of them here at Wright Plaza [11:21] Nebadon Izumi: were probably distributing this broken content on massive scale [11:21] Richardus Raymaker: hard to fix that [11:21] Nebadon Izumi: maybe, maybe not [11:21] Nebadon Izumi: if its just a matter of us not handling a certain serialization schema [11:21] Nebadon Izumi: that might not be hard to fix [11:21] Nebadon Izumi: if it truly is a locale issue [11:22] Nebadon Izumi: i dunno thats probably more difficult [11:22] Justin Clark-Casey: I think this is all old data or stuff coming from older versions of opensim [11:22] Nebadon Izumi: probably [11:22] Nebadon Izumi: some of the prims in this sim are as old as OpenSImulator almost [11:22] Nebadon Izumi: like this building [11:22] Nebadon Izumi: some of these prims in this building are here from the day I started building this sim [11:22] Richardus Raymaker: my box with house is also from stoneage here [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: the errors do include scence objt names and uuids [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: nothing [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: although part names rather than root part names [11:23] Sarah Kline: has anybody got the first prim? [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: all the errors i saw displaying nothing about the content [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: I did accidentally remove that message [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: which is back in git master [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: oh ok [11:23] Justin Clark-Casey: for shape deser failures anyway [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: so if i run in ALL logging [11:23] Nebadon Izumi: i will see them? [11:24] Justin Clark-Casey: yes. And it wouldnt' surprise me if the sheer bvolume of messages overwhelms the plazas again [11:24] Nebadon Izumi: ok [11:24] Nebadon Izumi: well here at WP it didnt seem to really cause much of a problem [11:24] Nebadon Izumi: accept 50 pages of spew [11:24] Nebadon Izumi: i'll flip that over after meeting [11:24] Richardus Raymaker: as long it add some extra info from the objects to it you only need to run it short [11:24] Justin Clark-Casey: so it was crashing just on lbsa? [11:24] Aramis Soren: can you disable some other unneeded logging meanwhile? [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: well it did go unresponive here once or twice [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: and also at Zaius Plaza [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: but yea Lbsa got it the worst [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: not surprising [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: and Wright Plaza was the only one doing it when no one was present [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: which makes it easier to catch [11:25] Richardus Raymaker: sounds like nebadon need a debug system where you can ebale only some messgaes :) [11:25] Dahlia Trimble: hi :) [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: its usually just a matter of waiting an hour [11:25] Nebadon Izumi: and i'll see it [11:25] Aramis Soren: you ued to have a lone of WP still around? [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: hello Dahlia [11:26] Aramis Soren: clone [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: nothing i can just fire right up Aramis [11:26] Richardus Raymaker: hi dahlia [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: but its easy to create a clone [11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: you can selectively enable messages from certain classes using the existing log4net config [11:26] Dahlia Trimble: ooou balloons :) [11:26] Justin Clark-Casey: facilities [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: well in this case [11:26] Aramis Soren: yeah just trying to think what might help you pin it down [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: its hard to miss 100's of them [11:26] Nebadon Izumi: i shouldnt have any problem seeing it here [11:29] Dahlia Trimble: OMG a cricket [11:29] Aramis Soren: *chirp* [11:29] Nebadon Izumi: heh [11:29] Justin Clark-Casey: any other opensim issues today? [11:30] Richardus Raymaker: hmm still try to figure out why i lose so many times script changes. [11:30] Richardus Raymaker: it seems to fail with save.. [11:30] Aramis Soren: looks like the state of the Union/Grid is pretty solid [11:30] Nebadon Izumi: I have still not experienced that Richardus [11:30] Nebadon Izumi: and Ive been tearing up Universal Campus [11:31] Richardus Raymaker: maby im just to fast sometimes :O [11:31] Dahlia Trimble: tearing up/ [11:31] Dahlia Trimble: ? [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: ya thats possible [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: ive been redoing alot of stuff Dahlia [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: adding new things [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: i just posted a new version infact [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: couple days ago [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: http://uc.onikenkon.com [11:31] Dahlia Trimble: more? lol it was over 40000 prims bef [11:31] Richardus Raymaker: how long is your campus up normal nebadon ? [11:31] Dahlia Trimble: before [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: ya its still around 40000 [11:31] Nebadon Izumi: but i added a avatar mall [11:32] Nebadon Izumi: and a bunch of avatars to the landing zone for quick start [11:32] Dahlia Trimble: oh I need to go look [11:32] Nebadon Izumi: ya i also added the avatars at Lbsa Plaza [11:32] Claudia Sanz: its quite amazing. Thanks Nebadon [11:32] Nebadon Izumi: so people now have 18 avatars to choose from at Lbsa Plaza [11:32] Nebadon Izumi: sorry 14 [11:32] Sarah Kline: ) [11:33] Richardus Raymaker: campus run dedicated nebadon ? [11:33] Nebadon Izumi: it runs on my home server [11:33] Nebadon Izumi: with about 40 other regions [11:33] Nebadon Izumi: lol [11:33] Richardus Raymaker: hmm. ok.. then thats the same [11:33] Dahlia Trimble: lol [11:33] Richardus Raymaker: besides i only have 17 [11:33] Nebadon Izumi: on that server i have a full on grid [11:33] Nebadon Izumi: that has 16 region mega sandbox [11:34] Nebadon Izumi: i have OKC Sandbox and OKC Sandbox2 [11:34] Nebadon Izumi: (OKC) Theatre [11:34] Dahlia Trimble: I have about 24 regions on a small atom computer lol [11:34] Nebadon Izumi: and a handful of others i use for testing [11:34] Richardus Raymaker: just waiting for a new version. then i upgrade my sandbox to. stil now on older version [11:34] Nebadon Izumi: it has 2 16 region megas [11:34] Nebadon Izumi: a 4 region mega [11:36] Aramis Soren: need to try megas, diva... no time :( [11:36] Nebadon Izumi: they can be handy [11:36] Nebadon Izumi: not for everyone, but i really like using megas [11:36] Richardus Raymaker: i have a mega. need to kick it on in a few days to check it [11:37] Richardus Raymaker: but, mega's are missing functions that are usefull. or work bad now [11:37] Dahlia Trimble: such as? [11:37] Hiro Protagonist: llGround [11:37] Nebadon Izumi: parceling sucks [11:37] Nebadon Izumi: ya ground events [11:37] Nebadon Izumi: don't work [11:38] Richardus Raymaker: Linden tree's parceling/media, sometimes terrain edit seems slow outside the root. [11:38] Nebadon Izumi: trees work [11:38] Nebadon Izumi: grass doesnt [11:38] Nebadon Izumi: grass doesnt work beyond 256m [11:38] Richardus Raymaker: correct nebadon, your right. grass dont wortk. and thats a shame [11:38] Dahlia Trimble: really? trees dont? they're just prims [11:38] Nebadon Izumi: because its reliant on contouring the ground [11:38] Nebadon Izumi: trees work fine [11:38] Hiro Protagonist: trees DO [11:38] Hiro Protagonist: grass DONT [11:38] Dahlia Trimble: oh [11:38] Richardus Raymaker: tree's work fine [11:39] Nebadon Izumi: grass is reliant on terrain contours [11:39] Nebadon Izumi: so it makes its calculation on the SW sim [11:39] Nebadon Izumi: so your grass will end up in the air or under ground [11:39] Nebadon Izumi: or you just cant find it at all [11:39] Dahlia Trimble: hmmm I never use grass lol [11:39] Richardus Raymaker: but also media outside root sim cannot be set [11:39] Nebadon Izumi: it can [11:39] Hiro Protagonist: yeah it can [11:39] Nebadon Izumi: but it has to be done via scripts [11:40] Richardus Raymaker: aha [11:40] Hiro Protagonist: actually you just have to turn disable the setting for limiting media to a parcel [11:40] Nebadon Izumi: my scripts in the movie theatre work well [11:40] Nebadon Izumi: for doing video in megas [11:40] Hiro Protagonist: then it pretty much works from anywhere as it would on an unparcelled script [11:40] Richardus Raymaker: intressting to know [11:41] Nebadon Izumi: I just wish we could set the audio stream to play directly to an individual [11:41] Nebadon Izumi: the same that video can be [11:41] Nebadon Izumi: that would solve a lot of issues [11:42] Richardus Raymaker: is there any sign of better verhicles comeing ? [11:42] Richardus Raymaker: betetr verhicle support [11:42] Nebadon Izumi: nothing planned [11:42] Dahlia Trimble: better? as in more like SL? [11:42] Nebadon Izumi: step one is to make basic improvements to Bullet [11:43] Nebadon Izumi: i don't expect ODE will improve for vehicles much [11:43] Basil Sosides: Vihicle parameters arent complett [11:43] Nebadon Izumi: unless somsone throws some patches [11:43] Nebadon Izumi: i dont think any of the core devs are interested much in ODE, other than stabilizing it [11:43] Richardus Raymaker: less phyics time would be nice. but start to use lower prim verhicles solves the problem too i think [11:43] Aramis Soren: maybe we should bounty for a viewer team? wonder what $ that would take... [11:43] Dahlia Trimble: cause SL vehicles suc.... well need improvement too [11:43] Nebadon Izumi: physics are not in the viewer [11:44] Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya SL vehicles are ok some are better than here [11:44] Nebadon Izumi: boats and planes in SL are a lot better [11:44] Nebadon Izumi: cars are not a ton better [11:44] Dahlia Trimble: ODE is supposed to have good vehicle support but not SL like vehicles [11:44] Richardus Raymaker: sofar i dont see problems with sl verhicles. only problem tehre are the simborders [11:44] Dahlia Trimble: lots of car racing games use ODE [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: ya, ODE has good linking [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: like Ninja [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: some projects use a mix of ODE and Bullet [11:45] Dahlia Trimble: can also do vehicles with active suspensions [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:45] Richardus Raymaker: hehe [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: thats what I meant about the linking stuff [11:45] Richardus Raymaker: that would freak nebadon. racer with suspension [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: it also supposedly does tank tranks really well [11:46] Aramis Soren: baja buggy lol [11:46] Richardus Raymaker: shame movetotarget have the bad habbit objects start to spin if the hit soemthing [11:47] Dahlia Trimble: oh you should be able to constrain rotation in a script [11:47] Hiro Protagonist: anybody but me notice this savino cat isnt wearing any pants? [11:47] Savino Dagostino: this may not be the right forum, but does any have any experience in using IronRuby with OpenSim modules? [11:48] Savino DagostinoSavino Dagostino chuckles Not intentional....can't get out of vapor mode. :) [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: savino: there was some use of ironpython but haven't seen anything in ironruby [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: savino is kinda underdressed [11:49] Mimetic Core: i see man-clam... [11:49] Sarah Kline: got caught with his trousers down [11:49] Savino Dagostino: thanks. Should be somewhat similiar, I would think. [11:49] Savino DagostinoSavino Dagostino laughs.... Rebake doesnt seem to fix the issue, unfortunately. [11:49] Sarah Kline: wear all your basic body parts [11:50] Justin Clark-Casey: savino: melanie put up an region module that I think makes using ironpython easier here https://github.com/MelanieT/opensim-modules/commits/master [11:51] Sarah Kline: inv is not loading always [11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: I haven't looked at it though [11:51] Justin Clark-Casey: I think having something like that in core at some point would be a good idea, to be honest [11:52] Savino Dagostino: I'll take a look at Melanies git. May also ask her next time I'm over at Avination as well. [11:52] Richardus Raymaker: to many languages. onle mis the gree pascal one :) [11:52] Justin Clark-CaseyJustin Clark-Casey nods [11:52] Richardus Raymaker: free [11:52] Savino Dagostino: Since there is so much integration between websites and grids, its a natural match, I would think. [11:52] Aramis Soren: was looking for that link lol [11:53] Savino Dagostino: I'm seeing a fully clothed Savino over here now....is all good? :) [11:53] Sarah Kline: all ok [11:53] Hiro Protagonist: yup [11:53] Richardus Raymaker: it feels like things go slower with opensim. also harder to find problems. thats a good sign to [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: the wardrobe malfunction has been resolved :) [11:54] Savino Dagostino: thanks. Had a broken link to a shape...had to use another shape, even though the first shape is still available. [11:54] Sarah Kline: i have had that on and off also [11:54] Sarah Kline: yes same [11:54] Savino Dagostino: Yep! And no FAA fines to match! :) [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: savino: if you're on viewer 3 there are some issues there with the use of inventory caps on this region [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: I still haven't had time to investigate them - something subtle is going on [11:54] Savino Dagostino: DOH! Lets try FCC...too many gov acronyms. [11:54] Aramis Soren: what do i get when i switch from viewer 1 to 3 now, what breaks/ is missing? [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: multi attachment/layers don't exist [11:55] Aramis Soren: still a need to have 2 installed or skip it? [11:55] Aramis Soren: ok don't use that, haven't done mesh yet but want it soon [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: native linden lab viewer 3 will have profiles, etc pointing back to their website [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: you don't need to go from viewer 2 to viewer 3 [11:55] Aramis Soren: ah right profiles which i can edit in the .xml? [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: stuff like prim equivalent isn't implemented [11:55] Savino Dagostino: Any significant changes to the module design upcoming or planned? [11:55] Aramis Soren: ok cool [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: but viewer 3 is pretty useable with opensim [11:55] Richardus Raymaker: shame LL did not made some commandline parameter to reroute that [11:56] Dahlia Trimble: you can disable http inventory in V3 [11:56] Richardus Raymaker: just like the login uri's [11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: savino: I think there are long term problems that need to be resolved but I don't think changes are imminent [11:56] Aramis Soren: right just need to learn new interface [11:56] Sarah Kline: hehe they woulnt make it easy rich [11:56] Aramis Soren: dahlia don't i want to enable it for faster? [11:56] Savino Dagostino: I'm using Firestorm v3.3.3, which is a variant of LL v3.2 [11:56] Dahlia Trimble: its in develop menu [11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: inventory caps is much faster but not so good if it has bugs :) [11:57] Savino Dagostino: True...fast is only good if its accurate. [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: ya, Its a lot better than it was I think [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: there is s till an issue [11:57] Richardus Raymaker: depends on the size of object you want to hit :) [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: before the caps changes, inventory would almost never load completely [11:57] Dahlia Trimble: I think the URI's are not formed well in http inventory [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: I spent some time looking for it but it's not obvious :( [11:57] Dahlia Trimble: at least thats what I heard [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: everything works inf esom eof the time [11:58] Justin Clark-Casey: but then at other points attachments will stop being attached/links are broken, etc. [11:58] Justin Clark-Casey: It might be some kind of timing issue or some complicated interaction with versionin/caching [11:58] Richardus Raymaker: thats the biggest problem i see with attachments [11:58] Sarah Kline: I find once the inv has loaded the links are fixed [11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: fixed? you mean they change state? [11:59] Savino Dagostino: Is there some form of transaction wrapper around inventory activites? [11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: savino: no [11:59] Sarah Kline: they are not lost or broken [11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: sarah: this is without relogging? [11:59] Sarah Kline: just connected back [11:59] Sarah Kline: yes it seems [11:59] Justin Clark-Casey: hmm, curious [11:59] Sarah Kline: id have to test to confirm [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: I even got to the point of looking through viewer code :) [12:00] Dahlia Trimble: I still havent looked lol [12:00] Sarah Kline: but yes this morning i had missing and broken links that righted themselves [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: that's when you know things are getting complicated [12:00] Aramis Soren: nice to have the option i bet [12:00] Savino Dagostino: Justin. No. Tell me it ain't so! Viewer code...?? :) [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: It's actually quite nice to get some feel for it [12:01] Dahlia Trimble: BUTN THE HERETIC!! [12:01] Nebadon Izumi: lol [12:01] Justin Clark-CaseyJustin Clark-Casey grins [12:01] Dahlia Trimble: *BURN lol [12:02] Sarah Kline: for so long you where not allowed to look at it lol [12:02] Savino Dagostino: Sarah: Same here...self repairing links. I rarely see broken links on a standalone sim, whether the server is local or remote. [12:02] Justin Clark-Casey: interesting. I see broken links on local [12:02] Justin Clark-Casey: but that's only with Fetchinventory2 and the descendents cap on, which is not the default opensim config [12:02] Justin Clark-Casey: if everything falls back to UDP then the issues go away [12:03] Dahlia Trimble: I dont want to look, Ive heard too many horror stories and I dotn want it influencing my viewers ;) [12:03] Aramis Soren: wish i knew 1/10 of what you guys are up on... grr [12:03] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [12:03] Justin Clark-Casey: heh [12:03] Savino Dagostino: UDP...would that imply its related to a packet loss use case..?? [12:03] Justin Clark-Casey: Savino: not the http cap [12:03] Dahlia Trimble: http is tcp [12:03] Justin Clark-Casey: going back to udp overloads the udp link with large inventories, which is why the cap is ultimately the way forward [12:03] Nebadon Izumi: UDP works better, but its also a lot more intensive [12:04] Nebadon Izumi: doesnt scale as well as HTTP does [12:04] Dahlia Trimble: I think the http one can send large chunks and they dont have to use the sim as a proxy [12:04] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, that could also ultimately be done [12:05] Dahlia Trimble: so viewer can talk to a dedicated inventory server [12:05] Justin Clark-Casey: at the moment though, we still have to shuffle through the simulator [12:05] Walter Balazic: *waves [12:05] Walter Balazic: take care everyone [12:05] Dahlia Trimble: bb [12:05] Hiro Protagonist: l8r Walt [12:05] Justin Clark-Casey: bye walter [12:05] Richardus Raymaker: problem with dedicated inventory server. the load is less spread around the world [12:05] Hiro ProtagonistHiro Protagonist is out too [12:05] Hiro ProtagonistHiro Protagonist waves [12:06] Savino Dagostino: However, if the viewer are server are inventory sync'd asynchronously, there could be an issue of them not being in sync and causing visible defects. [12:06] Savino Dagostino: viewer and server* [12:06] Justin Clark-Casey: savino: simulator does no caching right now so it's not an issue [12:06] Richardus Raymaker: ? it dont store data on hdd anymore [12:06] Justin Clark-Casey: richardus: yes, but then the inventory server can be scaled up. It's a dumb data services so that's easier to do [12:07] Aramis Soren: will 2008 VS still be valid awhile or should I just go with 10 express? [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: aramis: 2008 will be fine for a long while [12:07] Aramis Soren: re opensim stuff [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: richardus: it never has for inventory. assets are different [12:07] Richardus Raymaker: ok. think i like 2008 more. [12:07] Aramis Soren: ok thx justin i have full of 08 and wondered if it would be supereded soon [12:07] Richardus Raymaker: ok [12:07] Dahlia Trimble: I like 10 because the fonts are easier to see [12:08] Richardus Raymaker: hmm i have it not installed at all. but 10 i can only use express [12:08] Aramis SorenAramis Soren needs to learn this shit pardon my french [12:08] Justin Clark-Casey: heh [12:08] Richardus Raymaker: ut still not into C# at all [12:08] Dahlia Trimble: oh I just use express anyway [12:08] Justin Clark-Casey: I need to go and do some things so I will see you folks around [12:08] Richardus Raymaker: bye justin [12:08] Dahlia TrimbleDahlia Trimble is cheap :) [12:08] Savino Dagostino: Later, Justin. [12:08] Dahlia Trimble: bb jcc [12:09] Justin Clark-CaseyJustin Clark-Casey waves [12:09] Nebadon Izumi: see ya