Chat log from the meeting on 2012-08-14

[11:43] Nebadon Izumi: your not making any changes to it? [11:43] Richardus Raymaker: Well if you rezz it you change it :O [11:43] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: oh, you're actually rezzing these things to the region? [11:43] Arielle Popstar: oh never seen it do that in opensim [11:43] Nebadon Izumi: changing a linkset in anyway would reset attach points i suspect [11:43] Bri Hasp: afk [11:43] Sarah Kline: lol [11:43] dan banner: yes [11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: not just editing as attachments? [11:44] dan banner: correct [11:44] Sarah Kline: noo [11:44] Tiffany Magic: Yes... set them on the ground to retexture and they don't attach to the right place when you pick them up. [11:44] Richardus Raymaker: well justin, you know its dangerous to edit a wering prim set [11:44] Richardus Raymaker: wearing ^ [11:44] Sarah Kline: same probably happens on LL grid [11:44] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: out of curiousity, why not edit them as attachments? [11:44] Richardus Raymaker: The exploded in the past justin [11:44] Sarah Kline: cos they explode lol [11:44] Tiffany Magic: Editing when attached can cause all kinds of problems. Hit the root prim and it takes off to another region. [11:44] Arielle Popstar: i edit lots of clothes and attachments while wearing them [11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany: That shoudl be better now - i know I fixed at least one bug in that area [11:45] VivK Lowlag: alpha textures tend to explode while worn [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: yes that i have seen [11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: but it's probably still the case that region rezzed items should retain their attachment point [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: when you edit an attachment your wearing [11:45] Richardus Raymaker: lol VivK, but you know wwhen there's alpha when its to late [11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: though that would probablyi require persistence........ [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: it shoots way off the sim [11:45] Sarah Kline: I lost a whole belt and was left wearing one prim bit ) [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: never do that [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: lol [11:45] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: still? [11:45] Simulator Version v0.5 shouts: OpenSim 0.7.4 Dev         6ee17f5: 2012-07-26 21:39:53 -0400 (Unix/Mono) [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: when did you fix that [11:45] Nebadon Izumi: ? [11:46] VivK Lowlag: lol [11:46] Sarah Kline: ) [11:46] Justin Clark-Casey: recently-ish,. and probably with more fixes in the last month or so for the attachment persistence stuff [11:46] Tiffany Magic: It is keeping large hair creators like Damselfly from coming to our grid. [11:46] Justin Clark-Casey: I clo0sed off some race conditions in tha tarea [11:46] Nebadon Izumi: lets find out [11:46] Richardus Raymaker: Thats my experience with wearing things. only safe thing is chang position while wearing. [11:46] BlueWall Slade: I checked it on my grid and it clears it [11:46] Sarah Kline: hehe edit some hair too [11:46] Tiffany Magic: They won't bring in hundreds of styles and colors and have to reset all the attachment points. [11:47] Justin Clark-Casey: tiffany:: It may be relatively easy to preserve the attachment point wheilst the sim is up, but much more involved to persist it across restarts [11:47] Tiffany Magic: However.... he can bring all his inventory into Avination with no problem. So, Melanie has done something on her grid to make it work. [11:47] Richardus Raymaker: It would be nice if that get fixt.. understand you tiffany [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: hrmm [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: actually its not flying away [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: thats good [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: it was probably a little over a month ago [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: i last experienced it [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: on Lbsa Plaza [11:47] Nebadon Izumi: that Dance ball you made Dan [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: if it's occasional then it's hard to tell, but I did fix up some problems in this area to do with race conditions [11:48] dan banner: oh ya [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: due to the fucked up way we store some data [11:48] Richardus Raymaker: its only 4 prims nebadon. find soemthing with more [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: pardon my french [11:48] dan banner: i always rezzed it in the region to edit it [11:48] Nebadon Izumi: rut roh [11:48] Nebadon Izumi: i changed a cube to a sphere [11:48] Nebadon Izumi: and it flew away [11:48] Justin Clark-Casey: ah, ok [11:48] dan banner: oops [11:48] Tiffany Magic: We brought in linksets of 5 from SL... using Second Inventory... and the position held. Then tried linksets of about 150 because that's what hair is, and they didn't hold position. [11:48] Richardus Raymaker: hee where did that go to [11:48] Sarah Kline: no Neb [11:48] Nebadon Izumi: ya that sucker is gone [11:48] Nebadon Izumi: lol [11:48] Nebadon Izumi: i cant even move anything now [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: this linkset is fubar [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: alright, good to know [11:49] Arielle Popstar: i have been having problems with one of your race cars Neb [11:49] Sarah Kline: over to you Justin lol [11:49] dan banner: good think it wasnt your 2500L hair [11:49] Arielle Popstar: had a couple diappear last night on the sandbox [11:49] Richardus Raymaker: what happens arielle ? [11:49] Andrew Hellershanks: SI creates a script that needs to run when the item is imported to set various properties. That may include the attachment point. [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: meh, unfortunatley this probably isn't something I'm going to get to fo r a while [11:49] Nebadon Izumi: can't say I am completely surprised Arielle [11:49] Richardus Raymaker: ohh [11:49] Justin Clark-Casey: but I may take a quick look at the attachment point stuff - really that should persist at least before region restart [11:49] Sarah Kline: teasing [11:50] Nebadon Izumi: its probably up at 5 bajillion meters [11:50] Arielle Popstar: it only rezzes in one of ubits releases [11:50] dan banner: look in the db for 'object' [11:50] dan banner: lol [11:50] Richardus Raymaker: well nebadon proof why we rezz attachments :) [11:50] Nebadon Izumi: Ya [11:50] Andrew Hellershanks: In my "spare time" (um... what is that again?) I can check the scripts created by SI during upload. [11:50] Nebadon Izumi: now [11:50] Nebadon Izumi: let me test something else [11:51] Nebadon Izumi: huh [11:51] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:51] Nebadon Izumi: rezzing it to the ground obliterates the attach point [11:51] dan banner: goes to your hand [11:51] Nebadon Izumi: that doesnt seem right [11:52] dan banner: thats always been like that afaik [11:52] BlueWall Slade: it should keep that in the properties, I guess [11:52] Arielle Popstar: been that way here as long as i can remember [11:52] Richardus Raymaker: or it deletes the attachment point or it dont transfer it to the new object [11:52] Nebadon Izumi: has anyone tested that in SL? [11:52] Nebadon Izumi: it doesnt do same thing there right? [11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, there are threee points where SOG.ClearPartAttachmentData is being called [11:52] Justin Clark-Casey: In theory one could just comment thuose out and see if there are bad effects, but one needs to be careful since I know there are some ways that viewers will crash if they recieve bad attachment data [11:52] Tiffany Magic: It doesn't do the same in SL, Nebadon. [11:53] dan banner: actually in sl the attachement point is stored [11:53] Neovo Geesink: In SL its the same.... IF i ever rezz an Object to Ground which I wore earlier, the next time I have to reset its attachment point, or it is going to one of my hands if I do not select an attachment point. [11:53] Richardus Raymaker: Justin, do you know whats bad attachment data ? [11:53] dan banner: no neovo [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: anything non-zero [11:53] dan banner: i just tested [11:53] Neovo Geesink: Oh, I got it several times... [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: I would guess the trick is to keep the attachment data without telling the viewre about it [11:53] Andrew Hellershanks: what? rezzing an item to ground deletes attachment point? That's bizarre [11:53] Justin Clark-Casey: which would be more complex then simply not clearing it [11:54] Andrew Hellershanks: Isn't it a prim property? [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: not really - if viewers recieve attachmenbt data they're not expecting they can crash [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: e.g. an attachment poitn for an object that isn't actually attached [11:54] Andrew Hellershanks: oh and we don't want that happening [11:54] BlueWall Slade: it keeps it in SL [11:54] Nebadon Izumi: there has to be a better way to deal with that [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: the trick would probably be to keep that data without sending it to the viewer [11:54] Nebadon Izumi: then to destroy everything [11:54] Justin Clark-Casey: yes [11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: SOmething that would be nice to get fixed before official release of 074 [11:55] Richardus Raymaker: SO you need to remeber old uuid and new rezzed prim uuid. and when you take it back transfer attachment point. eep. [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew:: that's not going to happen as this is a very old bug [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: not a recent regression [11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: SI rezzes items inworld during upload. [11:55] Andrew Hellershanks: oh, well. One can always hope. [11:55] Justin Clark-Casey: it's fixable but I don't think it's going to be a one (three) liner [11:55] Tiffany Magic: How is Avination able to do it? [11:55] Richardus Raymaker: does SI remeber atatchment point when you restore SI object ? [11:56] Andrew Hellershanks: Tiffany, at least you now know what's happening. Fixing it is another issue. [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: I tested that the other day [11:56] Justin Clark-Casey: as I said, it's doable but not a one-liner [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: and it did for me [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: but others say it doesnt [11:56] Arielle Popstar: uncrippled viewers can send imported attachments back to the original point [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: my test was very basic [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: i made 5 cubes in SL [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: attached them to different places [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: put them all in a box [11:56] Nebadon Izumi: and transfered here with SI [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: probably not the best test [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: heh [11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: Might have been protected by being in a box? [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: I amazed SI still works [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: isn't it abandonware now? [11:57] Dahlia Trimble: gtg, bye all :) *waves* [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: they stil sell it [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: bye dahlia [11:57] Andrew Hellershanks: bye, Dahlia [11:57] Justin Clark-Casey: ok :) [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: and its still on the LL TPV list [11:57] Richardus Raymaker: bye dahlia [11:57] Nas Messing: bye sweetie [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: but there has not been an update in years [11:57] BlueWall Slade: bye Dahlia [11:57] Robert Adams: bye dahlia [11:57] Sarah Kline: Bye Dahila [11:57] Nebadon Izumi: see you Dahlia [11:58] Richardus Raymaker: Thats what you call get sleeping rich ? [11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: Nebadon, they tightened up the permissions checks in SI so that is why SL still accepts it in the grid. [11:58] Nebadon Izumi: ya [11:58] Nebadon Izumi: that was the last update they did [11:58] Nebadon Izumi: heh [11:58] Tiffany Magic: Nebadon... did you talk to Melanie about how she does it in Avination? [11:58] Sarah Kline: back in 2010 [11:58] Andrew Hellershanks: I have stuff backedup in SI that I can no longer (re)upload [11:59] Nebadon Izumi: right [11:59] Nebadon Izumi: though i think you can still upload that stuff into OpenSim [11:59] Richardus Raymaker: ?? ANdrew ? [11:59] Nebadon Izumi: just not SL [11:59] Nebadon Izumi: my SI backup is huge [11:59] Richardus Raymaker: Woulkd mean my SI havbe some stuff to. long time i looked into there [11:59] Nebadon Izumi: its like 3gb on my hard drive [11:59] Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, I had SI backup some of my directories that had my stuff and stuff made by others. With the extra perms checks, I'm not creator so it won't reupload some of the items I had backed up. [12:00] Sarah Kline: I think I've run out of resets [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: ok, I need to pop off, thanks for the conversation folks [12:00] Sarah Kline: bye Justin [12:00] dan banner: ok justin [12:00] Nebadon Izumi: ok see you justin! thanks for coming [12:00] Richardus Raymaker: i think that problem have many with old SI [12:00] Mike Kayaker: bye all, back to RL [12:00] Richardus Raymaker: bye justin [12:00] Justin Clark-CaseyJustin Clark-Casey waves [12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Now we can start cracking the whip again on you, Justin :-) [12:00] Justin Clark-Casey: oh man [12:00] Arielle Popstar: ;) [12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: hehe [12:00] Sarah Kline: )) [12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Take care. [12:00] Tiffany Magic: Nebadon? [12:00] Arielle Popstar: vacation over [12:00] BlueWall Slade: bye Justin [12:00] Andrew Hellershanks: yea, welcome back.