Chat log from the meeting on 2008-07-08

[7:41] Nebadon Izumi is Online [7:43] Hoffman Effect Teleporter: Teleporter Online [7:43] Hoffman Effect Teleporter: -12 [7:43] Hoffman Effect Teleporter: Blade [7:43] Hoffman Effect Teleporter: Teleporter Online [7:43] Hoffman Effect Teleporter: -15 [7:43] Hoffman Effect Teleporter: Floor7 [7:47] Nebadon Izumi is Offline [7:47] Nebadon Izumi is Online [8:08] Chrome Carter is Online [8:15] Chrome Carter is Offline [8:27] paulie Flomar is Online [8:30] paulie Flomar is Offline [8:32] paulie Flomar is Online [8:44] You: Hiya [8:44] Aran Anderson_TEST: hi, how are you? [8:44] You: pretty good and yourself? [8:45] Aran Anderson_TEST: am just trying to figure out how to set my sim up onto the grid.. it seems to time out on registering [8:45] You: sounds like networking trouble [8:46] You: probably in the configuration [8:46] You: what do you have for external_ip_address in your Regions xml file? [8:47] paulie Flomar is Offline [8:49] Aran Anderson_TEST: -  <Config sim_UUID="37f59c37-4b6a-42c3-9fd4-752fc794712d" sim_name="2142" sim_location_x="2142" sim_location_y="2142" internal_ip_address="192.168.0.102" internal_ip_port="9000" allow_alternate_ports="false" external_host_name="82.44.171.217" master_avatar_uuid="00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000" estate_covanant_uuid="00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000" master_avatar_first="Aran" master_avatar_last="Anderson_TEST" master_avatar_pass="theno1scripter9" lastmap_uuid="52a4bad1-18ff-4030-92c2-38d04e73965f" lastmap_refresh="1215502149" />  [8:49] You: internal should be 0.0.0.0 [8:50] Aran Anderson_TEST: btw i see you are looking for builders, i am willing to help :) (i am James Benedek on the main grid, i helped build 5l5b) [8:50]  You: :) [8:50] You: I'm Lazarus Longstaff on the Linden grid; I used to manage a set of 6 surf sims [8:50] You: Heliopolis [8:50] Aran Anderson_TEST: nice [8:50] You: then I found OpenSim [8:51] You: I rarely go to the Linden grid now [8:51] Aran Anderson_TEST: more fun here eh? [8:51] You: yes [8:51] Aran Anderson_TEST: and free :p [8:51] You: always better to own your own infrastructure [8:51] You: for a suite of reasons [8:51] Aran Anderson_TEST: is all of lsl functions working on this grid or? [8:52] You: no [8:52]  You: only about 70% [8:52] You: mostly vehicle physics is not finished [8:52] You: we use ODE, they use havoc4 [8:52] You: well [8:52] You: actually [8:52] You: you can use any of several physics engines with opensim [8:52] Aran Anderson_TEST: well havok 5 is released now.. why not try and code that in? [8:52] You: but ode is most fully supported [8:53] You: the code for opensim has a license that is not compatible [8:53] You: it is bsd licensed [8:53] Aran Anderson_TEST: btw nice build here [8:54] You: Thanks :D [8:54] You: I've built everything here but the cherry trees [8:54] Aran Anderson_TEST: like a aztec ancient city with a future office tower on top :P [8:55] You: yeah, there's certainly a lot of influences coming to bear here [8:56] Aran Anderson_TEST: brb a sec :) [8:56]  You: kk [9:09]  Tara5 Oh is Online [9:11]  Tara5 Oh is Offline [9:12]  Tara5 Oh is Online [9:15]  Zha Ewry is Online [9:17]  Neas Bade is Online [9:18]  You: HEy Aran [9:18]  You: I gotta run [9:18]  You: Hey Aran [9:18]  You: I gotta run [9:18]  You: office hours at wright plaza [9:19]  paulie Flomar is Online [9:19]  Aran Anderson_TEST: ok, enjoy [9:19]  You: tc [9:19]  You: you know about IRC right [9:19]  Aran Anderson_TEST: i am still gettign the error :( [9:19] Aran Anderson_TEST: i saw it, but i dont have it [9:19]  You: most of our support is done through IRC [9:19] You: get chatzilla for your firefox [9:19] You: #opensim on FreeNode [9:19] Aran Anderson_TEST: ok kool thanks [9:19] You: see ya! [9:19] Aran Anderson_TEST: enjoy! [9:20] Teleport completed from http://slurl.com/secondlife/Bade%20Plaza/104/116/173 [9:20] The region you have entered is running a different simulator version. Click this message for details. [9:20] Strawberry Fride: hehe - been waiting to see someone with that avatar name for too long :) [9:20]  Zha Ewry: Hair matters [9:20]  Tara5 Oh: zha is making herself pretty while Rome burns..... [9:20]  Zha Ewry chuckles [9:20]  Neas Bade: heh [9:20]  You: Hey everbodeh [9:20]  Strawberry Fride: Hi Hiro :) [9:21] You: man, gotta luv our chairs rofl [9:21] Strawberry Fride: ejector seats :) [9:21]  Neas Bade: Zha, well you should work on the attachment save code so you can have prim hair :) [9:21] Zha Ewry chuckles [9:22] Zha Ewry: Well, assuming that I can keep the patching up to trunk, I'll keep that in mind [9:22] Zha Ewry: that and berating lindens about things like LLSD [9:22] Tara5 Oh: yes I am sure we will have that soon neas as Zha doen't usually attend meetings with Bad hair [9:23] Strawberry Fride: I've got to the point where I don't mind so much - as long as it's red it'll do. Though I finally made my first hairstyle on my OS :) [9:24] You: Tara, gotta click the seat first [9:24]  Zha Ewry: And hope it works [9:24]  You: I think she got launched that time [9:24]  Tara5 Oh: wow I got ejected into the sky!! [9:24]  You: Hey, Japan is represented! lD [9:24]  You: ;D even [9:25]  You: HEya Chillken [9:26]  Chillken Proto: Hello [9:26]  Adam Frisby: yo [9:27]  Neas Bade: hey Chillken [9:27]  You: I assume we are waiting to get started, as a number of our regular attendants are not in attendance ;) [9:27] Neas Bade: well, the normal office hours don't actually start for 40 minutes [9:27] Neas Bade: everyone here is early [9:27] You: ahhh ok [9:27]  You: ;D [9:27] Neas Bade: pixel just said she was here, so I swung by [9:27]  You: we're getting popular lols [9:27] paulie Flomar is Online [9:27] Neas Bade: yeh, we might need to start hiding office hours in different parts of osgrid [9:27] Neas Bade: :) [9:28]  You: Bade plaza for instance [9:28]  Finrod Meriman: the IRC message said 11am PST CA start [9:28]  Neas Bade: Finro, it's 19 UTC [9:28]  You: ahhhh the truth comes out rofl [9:28]  Adam Frisby: It's 1900 UTC [9:28]  Archer Mokeev-Blessed: oh hahaha, I actually just thought I'd try if my OSGrid account still worked [9:28]  Neas Bade: which is 12 PST [9:28]  Nebadon Izumi: ok im here now so everyone can beat me for posting wrong time [9:28]  Wright Juran: so you mean I manage to sneak out my dungeon for one of these meetings and I'm early, damn time zones [9:28]  Adam Frisby: Has someone fixed the clock here yet? >_> [9:28]  Strawberry Fride: aah! [9:28]  Neas Bade: heh [9:29]  Hiro Protagonist beats on Neb with a phantom prim [9:29]  Archer Mokeev-Blessed: didn't even realize this might be office hours [9:29]  Nebadon Izumi: adam [9:29]  paulie Flomar is Offline [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: server time is right [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: OpenSIM cant tell time [9:29] Adam Frisby: Haha [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: same on the win plazas [9:29] Neas Bade: the clock is system based [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: time is way wrong [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: apparently not Neas [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:29] Neas Bade: so it means the system has the wrong time [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: its not [9:29] paulie Flomar is Online [9:29] Strawberry Fride: wish that were true for me - can't get my clock on my system time [9:29] Nebadon Izumi: its been this way for months [9:29] Zha Ewry vanishes to go check on other things [9:29] Zha Ewry: (afk, but I'll keep peeking) [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: the Windows plazas report incorrect time also [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: its liek 1.5 hours wrong [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: always [9:30] Neas Bade: silly windows [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: its same here [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: this is linux [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:30] Nebadon Izumi: i cant explain it [9:30]  Neas Bade: I know mono seems to loose time after a while [9:31] Neas Bade: when was the last WP reboot? [9:31] Adam Frisby: The time shown in the viewer is sent as part of login [9:31] Adam Frisby: It's possible we're calculating it wrong. [9:31] Adam Frisby: it's in the original login XML request [9:31] Neas Bade: oh [9:31]  Nebadon Izumi: time on server [9:31] Nebadon Izumi: is 11:18 [9:31] Neas Bade: I bet it has to do with the default days being SL days now [9:31] Nebadon Izumi: its 6 minutes off [9:32] Adam Frisby: Nebadon: It's showing 9:31AM here [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: the sim time is no where near that [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: yea [9:32] Adam Frisby: which is 2 hours off [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: its always like this on all sims [9:32] Adam Frisby: It's 11:25 AM PST right now [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: time is never right [9:32] You: I'm showing 9:31 in my viewer and 13:25 on my local clock (which is correct) [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: yea [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: this server we are on [9:32]  paulie Flomar is Offline [9:32] Nebadon Izumi: the system clock says 11:19 now [9:33] Nebadon Izumi: wow lots of new people today [9:33] Nebadon Izumi: hellow everyone i dont know [9:33] Monk Zymurgy: back..do you think LL uses a central clock to keep the sims on one time? [9:33] Monk Zymurgy: and hi everyone :) [9:33]  Nebadon Izumi: probably Monk [9:33]  You: wb Monk [9:33]  Nebadon Izumi: as all their servers are not in one location [9:33]  Monk Zymurgy: ty [9:33]  paulie Flomar is Online [9:33]  Nebadon Izumi: its possible they just sync the time zone to PST though [9:33]  Nebadon Izumi: on all thier hardware [9:34]  Nebadon Izumi: regardless of geography [9:34]  Nebadon Izumi: that seems like most fail proof method to me [9:34]  Monk Zymurgy nods [9:34]  Garth FairChang: Hi all.. excuse noob appearance [9:34]  Monk Zymurgy: yup ..get the sim to send the right time from sytsem to the client [9:35]  Nebadon Izumi: be right back i need to go Rescue Tess [9:35]  You: are we all still workin here? [9:35]  You: looks like [9:35]  You: I am at least [9:35]  Adam Frisby: Hrrm crazy idea here [9:35]  Monk Zymurgy: i think i am [9:35]  You: whats that Adam? [9:36]  Adam Frisby: but maybe we should build an auditorium for office hours that's got sufficient space/seating -- things are getting a little crowded here when we get 30 people [9:36] Zha Ewry: Seems to still be here [9:36] Adam Frisby: (although it's awesome to hear that OpenSim is running 30 people sanely. hehe.) [9:36] You: Actually, I think Nebadon is doing exactly that at Zaius Plaza [9:36] Adam Genkii: hey guys [9:36] Adam Frisby: Hey Adjohn [9:36] You: Hey Adjohn :D [9:36] Nebadon Izumi is Online [9:37] Neas Bade: a nice amphitheatre with trees would be great :) [9:37]  Charles Krinkeb is Online [9:37]  paulie Flomar is Offline [9:37]  Tara5 Oh is Offline [9:37]  Adam Frisby: I did the Pooley stage LL uses several years ago [9:37]  Zha Ewry is a fan of lakeside mellow spaces [9:37]  Monk Zymurgy nods [9:37]  Nebadon Izumi is Offline [9:37]  Dahlia Trimble is Online [9:37]  Monk Zymurgy: sounds good [9:37]  You: something like that is actually happening at Teravus Plaza ;) [9:38] Strawberry Fride: G2's struggling to get back in [9:38]  You: 17 people in the region by my count [9:38] Adam Frisby: Actually the login thing is something we should fix -- there's a bad lock in the loginserver. [9:38] Adam Frisby: Only lets one user login/out at the same time. [9:38] You: akkk [9:38] Strawberry Fride: aah :) [9:38]  You: +1 fix that [9:38]  Charles Krinkeb: Holy Guacamole, Batman. I hope all the natives are friendly. [9:38]  Adam Frisby: We solved it at deepthink by rewriting the gridservers into ASP.net pages, but a proper fix is probably a good idea. [9:39]  Zha Ewry: Its deeply paranoid, too, it locks for a long time [9:39]  Adam Frisby: Yeah [9:39]  Zha Ewry: (as in across a huge amount of work) [9:39]  Adam Frisby: Maybe there's a sleep in there too that shouldnt be. [9:39]  Neas Bade: there are some sleeps [9:39]  Zha Ewry: I [9:39]  Neas Bade: it has to do with bad circuit detection as well [9:40]  Zha Ewry: ve been taking notes, last few times I was in there, I can see if we could be al ittle more clever [9:40]  Strawberry Fride: there's a lot of locks in the code I've seen - kinda hoping we'll be able to take osme out for the SQL server version... [9:41]  You: are we still live? [9:41] BlueWall Slade: hello! anybody home? [9:41] You: Heya Blue :D [9:41] BlueWall Slade: hello :) [9:41]  You: you make 19 :D [9:41]  BlueWall Slade: hehe [9:41]  Monk Zymurgy: Hi BlueWall [9:41]  Nebadon Izumi is Online [9:41]  UUID Speaker: Adam Genkii, your key is 862ffadf-0c5d-49c4-97cd-6409f63baab2 [9:41]  Neas Bade: locking is definitely suboptimal throughout the code [9:41]  You: Nebadon makes 20 [9:42]  paulie Flomar is Online [9:42]  You: 330 MB allocated to the region [9:42]  Neas Bade: one of the bigger issues is actually the use of generics, as there aren't built in synchronized versions of those containers. That was found to be a killer by an IBM china team [9:42]  Nebadon Izumi: 338? [9:42]  Nebadon Izumi: where you get that # hiro [9:42]  Neas Bade: I keep meaning to dig into that again [9:43]  You: 330 [9:43]  Neas Bade: after the nhibernate stuff is actually done [9:43]  Nebadon Izumi: im seeing 768 [9:43]  You: wp console show stats [9:43] Nebadon Izumi: ah ok [9:43]  Nebadon Izumi: i was looking at top [9:43] Nebadon Izumi: Res = 768 [9:43] Neas Bade: there is mono overhead baked into the top number [9:43] BlueWall Slade: Neas, it's ready for testing?? [9:43] Neas Bade: no, not yet [9:43] paulie Flomar is Offline [9:43] BlueWall Slade: ok [9:43]  You: big exception and dropped 30MB [9:43] Neas Bade: actually, that's a good tech question [9:43] Charles Krinkeb: We are either going to have a really fun meeting and have a record (or crash). [9:43] Neas Bade: would anyone mind if I added RegionID to SOP? [9:43] Hamilton Linden is Online [9:43] Neas Bade: even if it is mostly not used [9:44] Charles Krinkeb: +1 [9:44] paulie Flomar is Online [9:44] Neas Bade: it would make the nhibernate mappings a lot easier [9:44] Nebadon Izumi: hello Hamilton [9:44] You: 21 users counting Hamilton :) [9:44]  Nebadon Izumi: Tess is coming too [9:44]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Hamilton [9:44]  Nebadon Izumi: that will be #22 [9:44]  Tara5 Oh: Hi hamilton [9:44]  You: Welcome back to OSGrid once again Hamilton :) [9:44] Hamilton Linden: Meetings in 15 minutes? [9:44] You: sweet [9:44] You: another record breaker today, looks like [9:45] Charles Krinkeb: Lets get any minor stuff out of the way since many of the players are here. [9:45] BlueWall Slade: Neas, I have one region that I will test NHibernate and PgSQL as soon as it's ready [9:45] Zha Ewry: Ouch! [9:45] Adam Frisby: Hey Hamilton [9:45] Neas Bade: oh, and funny bug I found [9:45] Hamilton Linden: Hi Adam [9:45] Garth FairChang: SL Blog post might help your attendance [9:45] Neas Bade: if you set SitRotation [9:45] Adam Frisby: Well, I dont think the osgrid office hours are published anywhere on the LL end [9:45] Adam Frisby: or really on the opensim homepage either [9:46] Neas Bade: people that are sitting before you log in don't show up with the right rotation [9:46] Adam Frisby: I actually think we need to revamp the opensim homepage again -- it's getting too ... obscure. [9:46] Charles Krinkeb: They are on the gridlist. But, should they be on the frontpage? [9:46] Nebadon Izumi: yay for hover text attachment [9:46] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:46] Adam Frisby: OpenSim really should have some simple links on the front page "Download Here", "Get Help here", etc. [9:46]  Charles Krinkeb: Who should honcho, that, Adam? [9:47] Adam Frisby: "Someone!" [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: its there [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: but it could be made better [9:47] Adam Frisby: It's there, but it's completely obtuse. [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: yea [9:47] paulie Flomar is Offline [9:47] Neas Bade: I think part of the issue is the template is pretty noisy [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: but so is opensim [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: its quite obtuse at the moment [9:47] Charles Krinkeb: Anyone up for some TLC of our OpenSimulator home page? [9:47] Nebadon Izumi: it should also be noted that OpenSIM is not quite for everyone yet too probabloy [9:47] Neas Bade: yep :) [9:48]  Neas Bade: only for the adventurous [9:48]  Nebadon Izumi: i sort of made that clear on the Attach region page [9:48]  Adam Frisby: Well, it cant hurt to make it easier. ;) [9:48] Nebadon Izumi: yea [9:48] Nebadon Izumi: definatly not [9:48] You: Hi Shenlei, WB :) [9:48]  Nebadon Izumi: i'll work on it [9:48]  You: bye SHenlei! [9:48]  Nebadon Izumi: does the Tardis work yet ??? [9:48]  Nebadon Izumi: woot [9:48]  Nebadon Izumi: what is opensim ??? [9:48]  TARDIS Wiki-Lith: Good Question ... [9:48]  TARDIS Wiki-Lith: This just in ... [9:48]  Neas Bade: nah, we should make it harder. Keep people from crowding up osgrid ;) [9:48] Nebadon Izumi: bah [9:48] Nebadon Izumi: guess its not [9:48] Nebadon Izumi: lol [9:48] Adam Frisby: Hahah [9:48] Neas Bade: "get off my lawn!" [9:48] You: Hi Tess [9:49] You: Welcome to OSGrid :) [9:49]  Adam Frisby: Should Neas get off my lawn ??? [9:49]  Adam Frisby: Haha [9:49]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:49]  Chrome Carter is Online [9:49]  Charles Krinkeb: Two questions for the pre-meeting: "Are we doing anything we should not be doing?" *and* "Are we not doing anything we should be doing?" [9:49]  You: we were just discussing sit rotation bugs rolf [9:49]  Nebadon Izumi: heheh tess [9:49]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [9:49]  BlueWall Slade: ahh, the old playing dead trick [9:49]  BlueWall Slade: hehe [9:50]  Adam Frisby: Quick someone take incriminating photos! [9:50]  Neas Bade: yeh, if anyone has any idea on why sitrotation during login might come differently then in world, that would be great [9:50]  Charles Krinkeb: Lets try to focus on things of interest to the greatest number of participants if at all possible. [9:50]  Neas Bade: I've got these logs that people sit on [9:50]  Neas Bade: and they sit sideways a lot because of it [9:50]  Nebadon Izumi: you rezzing noteboard Neas? [9:50] paulie Flomar is Online [9:50] Neas Bade has no rez powers :) [9:50]  Nebadon Izumi: go ahread [9:50]  Neas Bade: ah, ther eit is [9:50]  Nebadon Izumi: i changed it [9:51]  Charles Krinkeb: 1037 VIRT, 768 RES [9:51]  Nebadon Izumi: welcome back from the underworld Tess [9:51]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:51]  You: 357MB by the console [9:51]  You: 21 Avs [9:52]  paulie Flomar: whoa! it's a parteh! [9:52]  You: counting our favorite flying fox ;D [9:52]  Tara5 Oh is Online [9:52]  Nebadon Izumi: hey paulie [9:52]  BlueWall Slade: Hi Paulie [9:52]  paulie Flomar: Howdeh! [9:52]  BlueWall Slade: No Hippo Avie? [9:52]  Monk Zymurgy smiles..hi paulie..great avatar work :) [9:53] Garth FairChang: Hi Paulie [9:53] paulie Flomar: thx! [9:53] Tara5 Oh is Offline [9:53] paulie Flomar: Hiwdeh! [9:53] paulie Flomar: Howdeh, even! [9:53] Tara5 Oh is Online [9:54] paulie Flomar: I see peeps sitting properly! Was the sit bug fixed? [9:54] Nebadon Izumi: everyone might want to do a CTRL+ALT+R to rebake their avatars [9:54] Zha Ewry blinks as appreacne sends her to 2000 feet [9:54] paulie Flomar: yeah, rebake ftw! [9:54] White Board: - So many people.... You need to manual do line breaks here. No word wrap yet. [9:55] paulie Flomar dances with happiness! [9:55] You: ok [9:55]  You: 22 avs [9:55] Nebadon Izumi: hehe [9:56] You: 402MB [9:56] Nebadon Izumi: few more minutes before we get started [9:56] Charles Krinkeb: How should we proceed today, Neas? [9:56] danx2 danx0r: hi [9:56]  Charles Krinkeb: morning, dan [9:56] Nebadon Izumi: hello Dan [9:56] You: Heya Danx0r [9:56] paulie Flomar: Hey, Dan. :) [9:56] G2 Proto: hey Dan, all! [9:56]  Adam Genkii: Hey Dan [9:56]  Adam Frisby: Yo Dan [9:57]  Charles Krinkeb: Hello, G2. Pleasure to see you here. [9:57]  Adam Frisby: What was the record for WP? [9:57]  You: wb G2 [9:57]  G2 Proto: yes its a great day to start regularly showing up with all the cool interop news [9:57]  Nebadon Izumi: 25 [9:57]  Adam Frisby: 23 or 25? [9:57]  Adam Frisby: kk [9:57]  Adam Frisby: Two more then [9:57]  You: I'm showing 24 avs now [9:57]  paulie Flomar: Howdeh, Tara. [9:57]  Charles Krinkeb: We have a ways to go to break Adam's 37 record. [9:57]  Tara5 Oh: Hi paulie! [9:58]  Neas Bade: so, zha, how's the patch? [9:58]  Adam Frisby: Hehe [9:58]  G2 Proto: haha im working on busting that record myslef [9:58]  You: well, Adam did that on a standlone though, right Adam? [9:58]  Nebadon Izumi: i'll fire up other PC [9:58]  Nebadon Izumi: and log in plaza builder [9:58] sculpty_chair_with_sit: started [9:59] Nebadon Izumi: lol [9:59] paulie Flomar: h my!!! [9:59] paulie Flomar: lol [9:59] You: 25 avs [9:59] Charles Krinkeb: I am thinking that we should have "Hamilton Linden" take the floor first when we are ready in order to respect his time. [9:59] paulie Flomar: that was funneh!!! snort! [9:59] Aramis Soren: hi people [9:59] BlueWall Slade: Hi Aramis [9:59] Adam Frisby: Hiro: Standalone, Rev about 3200, Win32 [9:59] danx2 danx0r: haha check out how I'm sitting on this bench [10:00] Neas Bade: hey dan, been a while [10:00] Tess Linden: underworld ? :P [10:00] Hamilton Linden: I'd like to wait for Periapse or Whump to join since they'll be running the Public Open Grid Beta [10:00] BlueWall Slade: lol danx2 [10:00] danx2 danx0r: gotta work, just hanging [10:00] sculpty_chair_with_sit: started [10:00] TextBoard: Interop - OGP builds - Patch from Zha soon

Items for 0.6 release - nhibernate - neas - script stubs - ??

Anything else? - Please announce changes that will break people. :)

[10:01] Neas Bade: hey Lindens, so when can we get a URL bar in the browser so we don't need to have a dozen icons on our desktop to connect to different OpenSims? :) [10:01] AB_Bar Stool: started [10:01]  You: 27 avs [10:01]  AB_Bar Stool: changed [10:01]  AB_Bar Stool: changedlink [10:01]  AB_Bar Stool: avatarsat [10:01]  AB_Bar Stool: runtime permissions called [10:01]  You: oops [10:01]  You: 26 [10:01]  Justin Clark-Casey is Online [10:01]  You: can I get 28?? [10:01]  You: now 27 [10:01]  Hamilton Linden: The test viewer allows you to choose between beta grids but that's not quite what you want [10:01]  Nebadon Izumi: heh well now we are over the previous record [10:02]  Nebadon Izumi: i'll keep plaza builder off [10:02]  Hamilton Linden: Get Pixel to add it [10:02]  Neas Bade: nope [10:02]  AB_Bar Stool: changed [10:02]  AB_Bar Stool: changedlink [10:02]  AB_Bar Stool: avatarunsat [10:02]  Tara5 Oh: Stefan Andersson sends his regards but can't login he is going on holiday with his family! [10:02]  Neas Bade: a fixed list isn't very useful [10:02]  Neas Bade: we need freeform field [10:02] Hamilton Linden: Yeah, I hear you Neas [10:02] AB_Bar Stool: changed [10:02] Aramis Soren: neas someone from channel posted this launcher link [10:02] AB_Bar Stool: changed [10:02] AB_Bar Stool: changedlink [10:02] AB_Bar Stool: avatarsat [10:02] AB_Bar Stool: runtime permissions called [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: like Realxtend has [10:02] Aramis Soren: http://lab.newworldgrid.com/index.php/OpenSim_Launcher [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: thats a good example [10:02] Justin Clark-Casey: wow, crowd city [10:02] Nebadon Izumi: hey Justin [10:02] Justin Clark-Casey: hey nebadon [10:03] You: we're pushing the envelope today sir [10:03] BlueWall Slade: Hi Chrome [10:03] Neas Bade: Aramis, does that work on Linux and Mac? [10:03] Justin Clark-Casey: and how is the envelope holding up? [10:03] You: Hey, there you are Chrome [10:03] Nebadon Izumi: glue is starting to liquify :P [10:03] paulie Flomar: Hey, chrome. :) [10:03] Justin Clark-Casey: lol [10:03]  Hamilton Linden: Hi Periapse [10:03]  You: we've done far worse with half the avs before *winks* [10:03]  Justin Clark-Casey: I see what you mean [10:03]  Aramis Soren: remember when we had to actually lick stamps? hehe [10:03]  Chrome Carter: hello :) [10:04] You: Heya Periapse :D [10:04] Hamilton Linden: Charles I can do a quick intro [10:04] You: we lose one and gain one [10:04] Zha Ewry: Hey Tess, Peri, Jcc, and many others I can barely pan to [10:04]  Dahlia Trimble is Offline [10:04] Justin Clark-Casey: hi zha [10:04] Adam Frisby: Heh [10:04] Adam Frisby: This is cool [10:04] Adam Frisby: <# [10:05] Pixel Gausman: hi Zha (feeling left out) [10:05] Justin Clark-Casey: hey chillken, adam [10:05] danx2 danx0r: got about 3 m mtf in ubuntu on this old laptop [10:05] Justin Clark-Casey: don't often see you guys at this time of day :) [10:05]  Nebadon Izumi: lol [10:05]  Adam Genkii: Hey [10:05]  Chillken Proto: good afternoon (?) [10:05]  Justin Clark-Casey: evening for me [10:05]  Adam Genkii: It took lots of coffee [10:05]  BlueWall Slade: Good $TIMEZONE [10:05]  You: afternoon here [10:06]  paulie Flomar: woots! [10:06]  Charles Krinkeb: Lets let "Hamilton" take the floor for a while and share anything he wishes first. [10:06]  Garth FairChang: Almost afternoon here [10:06]  BlueWall Slade: justin, you have a normal avatar :) [10:06] Hamilton Linden: ok [10:06]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall I do! [10:06] Hamilton Linden: Thanks for all the input and feedback on an Open Beta during Zero's office hours and last week. [10:06] BlueWall Slade: :) [10:06]  Justin Clark-Casey: I'm all black in my view :) [10:06] Charles Krinkeb: shhh [10:06] Justin Clark-Casey: sorrym that shoudl have been I do? [10:06] Justin Clark-Casey: oops [10:06] Hamilton Linden: As you probably saw we "officially" announced the Public Open Grid Beta today [10:06] Tara5 Oh: rebake textures?? [10:06] Tess Linden: w00t! [10:06] paulie Flomar: yay! [10:06] Aramis Soren: *golf clap* [10:07] paulie Flomar howls!! [10:07] Justin Clark-Casey: nah, never works for me [10:07]  G2 Proto: awesome news! [10:07] Hiro Protagonist howls [10:07] Justin Clark-Casey: it's some kind of graphics driver issue [10:07] Pixel Gausman: whoohoo! [10:07] Hamilton Linden: The first round will be for OpenSim folks [10:07] Pixel Gausman: double whoohoo! [10:07] Hamilton Linden: We'll open it up to broader set later [10:07] BlueWall Slade: WOOT! [10:07] G2 Proto: awesome Hamilton [10:07] paulie Flomar: rawr!! [10:07] Adam Frisby: Cool. [10:07] Hamilton Linden: In case you haven't seen Torley's really cool video on the SL <=> OpenSim teleporting and the blog post check it out at: [10:08] Hamilton Linden: http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/07/08/ibm-linden-lab-interoperability-announcement/ [10:08] You: It's a bit cheesy, but hey it is *very* cool :) [10:08]  Hamilton Linden: Periapse Linden and Whump Linden are running the Public Open Grid Beta [10:08]  Strawberry Fride: extremely cool :) [10:08] G2 Proto: love it [10:08]  Hamilton Linden: Hiro: you gotta have some fun [10:08] Tara5 Oh: If people have time to type into the chat line who they are and how they like their name linked I am blogging this Historic meeting!! [10:08] You: lol yeah [10:08] Hamilton Linden: So Periapse do you want to take the floor [10:08] Neas Bade: zha, do you have your patch merged up to trunk? [10:08] You: I was about to add, I think the cheese is just Torley ;) [10:09]  Zha Ewry: And. as soon as we untangle the pipeline, the code should be on the mantis [10:09]  danx2 danx0r: before I crash again -- IRC bridge? [10:09]  Zha Ewry: (DrSco said its merged) [10:09]  Hamilton Linden: oh, he disconnected [10:09]  Nebadon Izumi is Offline [10:09]  Hamilton Linden: so we have a link for the Public Open Grid Beta [10:09]  Hamilton Linden: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Open_Grid_Public_Beta [10:09]  Nebadon Izumi is Online [10:09]  Hamilton Linden: You just need to contact Periapse or Whump Linden and they'll get you setup [10:09]  paulie Flomar: woots! [10:10]  G2 Proto: doing so taoday! [10:10]  Hamilton Linden: We're officially committing to July 31st to start [10:10]  Adam Frisby: Shiny. [10:10]  BlueWall Slade: hehe [10:10]  Neas Bade: hmmm I didn't see it on the internal list except in the notes mutilated state [10:10] Hamilton Linden: but we'd obviously like to do it sooner [10:10] Dahlia Trimble is Online [10:10] Strawberry Fride: Brilliant! :) [10:10] G2 Proto: us too [10:10]  Hamilton Linden: Peripase you back? [10:10]  G2 Proto: :) [10:10] Neas Bade: if you resend there, I'll post it to the mantis [10:10] Neas Bade: it would be nice to get it out during this meeting [10:10] paulie Flomar: Howdeh, dahlia. :) [10:10] Adam Frisby: Yeah that would be cool [10:10]  Dahlia Trimble: hi :) [10:11] Hiro Protagonist: a very quick question if I may, about you folk's successful jump to osgrid: upon arrival, did you get inventories local to this grid? [10:11] Tess Linden is Offline [10:11] Kurt Stringer is Online [10:11] Hamilton Linden: When it starts they'll give you the info for the downloadable viewer and access to the Agent Domain Host [10:12] G2 Proto: cool! [10:12] Hamilton Linden: Hopefully Zha will have his code in before then [10:12] Neas Bade: so, I had a question on Agent Domains [10:12] Kurt Stringer is Offline [10:12] paulie Flomar: 27 agents on here, now. :) [10:12] Hamilton Linden: for the OpenSim OGP support [10:12]  Neas Bade: how would you do hand off between them? [10:12]  Kurt Stringer is Online [10:12]  Zha Ewry: Its working through the path now, to mantis, I hope [10:12]  Hamilton Linden: That's defined in the Teleport Strawman [10:12]  Neas Bade: between agent domains? [10:12]  Adam Frisby: 28 :D [10:12]  Rez Tone is Offline [10:13]  Hamilton Linden: Currently it has one agent domain and supports multiple region domains [10:13]  Adam Frisby: I'd love to get this many avs in a profiler session, be interesting to see what shows up. [10:13]  Hamilton Linden: we have to walk before we run :-) [10:13] Hamilton Linden: Any other questions? [10:13] G2 Proto: fair enough [10:13] G2 Proto: no just thanks for the progress! [10:13] Charles Krinkeb: Absolutely, Hamilton. Thanks for the update so far. [10:13] BlueWall Slade: At this point, what do you need from us as testers? [10:13] Neas Bade: right, but that actually restricts what we can do in the opensim world. As today, because all the handoffs are between regions, inter grid teleport is actually possible [10:13] You: this machine seems incapable of a profile adam [10:14] Neas Bade: it would be nice to not loose that with agent domain [10:14] Hiro Protagonist: Awesome Hamilton [10:14] Hiro Protagonist: And thanks a heap and a stack for all your hard work on this Zha :) [10:14]  Teravus Ousley is Online [10:14]  Hamilton Linden: BlueWall, visiting the Public Open Grid Beta page and following up with Periapse or Whump is what's needed so they can put you on the list [10:14]  G2 Proto: Zha rules! [10:14]  Justin Clark-Casey: +1 on neas [10:14]  Tara5 Oh is Offline [10:14]  Zha Ewry: The agent domain, is pretty thin, but. it's certainly a good point [10:14]  BlueWall Slade: ok, thanks [10:15]  Dahlia Trimble: have a url for that page? [10:15]  Neas Bade: I'm less concerned by how big the agent domain is [10:15]  Aramis Soren: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Open_Grid_Public_Beta [10:15]  Neas Bade: and more concerned that you are locked into 1 [10:15]  Zha Ewry: Right [10:15]  Dahlia Trimble: ty :) [10:15] Zha Ewry: In fact, I'm trying really hard to be death on singletons [10:15] Hiro Protagonist: 29 Avs [10:15] Hamilton Linden: I understand the "I want everything yesterday argument" [10:15] Charles Krinkeb: 29 users, VIRT=1143, RES=860. 9 to go for the record. [10:16] Justin Clark-Casey: still got headroom for more avs I think [10:16] Pixel Gausman: Neas: in theory the protocols are open... so anyone could implement a version of agentdomain, right? [10:16] Zha Ewry: search, and such, as singletons, are anoying today, we really shoudl be not introducing one [10:16] Hamilton Linden: But I think this is a big step forward and we really are looking forward to pushing this interop forward with you [10:16] Hiro Protagonist: 393 MB according to the region console [10:16] Neas Bade: Pixel, no I think you missed my point [10:16] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, 850 according to top though [10:16] G2 Proto: same here Hanilton this is huge news today thanks again [10:16] Aramis Soren: this can only mean Good Things for all [10:16] Neas Bade: it's active hand off that is the concern [10:16] Charles Krinkeb: Hamilton. Our desire it to test in an objective fashion when you are ready. [10:16] Hamilton Linden: Great [10:16] BlueWall Slade: yes, it's great news [10:17] Hiro Protagonist: Awesome news :D [10:17] Charles Krinkeb: We certainly dont want to deploy anything, but rather to test and work out logical details. [10:17] Hamilton Linden: That's all from us Charles [10:17] Hiro Protagonist tries not to hop up and down [10:17] Tara5 Oh is Online [10:18] Aramis Soren: hiro bouncy ball animation in library hehe [10:18] Charles Krinkeb: Thanks, Hamilton. Let me segue to the same question as last week "What are the remaining impediments to get to a 0.6 release and can we do it this month?" [10:18] Zha Ewry: There are a bunch of issues which I think willl really get some good input from the community [10:18] Adam Frisby: Mantis #1696 has the code for interop. [10:18] Adam Frisby: (FYI) [10:18] Hiro Protagonist: FTW! [10:18] Zha Ewry: Its really important that we bview this, not as just the needs of what Linden is doing.. but.. the community in the large [10:18] Justin Clark-Casey: zha: +1 [10:18] Neas Bade: ok, cool [10:18] BlueWall Slade: \0/ [10:18] Hiro Protagonist nods [10:19] Justin Clark-Casey: ckrinke: what was on the board for 0.6? [10:19] Hiro Protagonist: also tho, important to realize you can only play catch with someone else who haz a ballglove [10:19] Aramis Soren ponders that deep thought [10:19] Charles Krinkeb: LSL functions, nHibernate, closing some Mantisi as I recall. [10:20] Hiro Protagonist: we've roughed up mantis pretty good I think [10:20] Aramis Soren: what happened with the griefers last nite? any more trouble? [10:21] Hiro Protagonist: plenteh, but we've swept up and locked down again [10:21] You: nah, just some dumb kids [10:21] Aramis Soren: cool but you had to turn off build here? [10:21] You: their fun lasted about 15 minutes [10:21] Hiro Protagonist: depnds on who you ask, I suppose *winks* [10:21] Justin Clark-Casey: you guys need some police uniforms [10:21] You: hehe [10:21] Aramis Soren: GP Grid Police [10:21] Hiro Protagonist snickers [10:21] Charles Krinkeb: The griefers are causing us to focus on some security issues in the software and thats a good thing. [10:21] Chrome Carter: dark suits wuld be cooler :P [10:21] You: well [10:21] You: since we are on this topic [10:22] You: i wanted to see if anyone thought about getting allowed avatars working [10:22] You: on land manager [10:22] Adam Frisby: It used to work [10:22] You: Shenlei and I are planning a party [10:22] You: for here on OSGrid [10:22] You: we wanted it to be RSVP [10:22] G2 Proto: yes! [10:22] Strawberry Fride: yey! [10:22] Hiro Protagonist: ok Neb [10:22] You: and be able to block everyone whos not invited [10:22] Hiro Protagonist: we need to tewst out on that [10:22] You: i did [10:22] Hiro Protagonist: *test even [10:22] You: it doesnt keep the list [10:23] You: you can add people [10:23] You: but when you go back to list later [10:23] You: its empty [10:23] Hiro Protagonist: oh okies ;) [10:23]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: very nice [10:23]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: the party I mean [10:23]  You: yea [10:23]  Justin Clark-Casey: it' ll be a real stress tester [10:23]  You: yep [10:23]  Charles Krinkeb: Getting back to 0.6. Do we want to aim for a 0.6 this month still? And should this be on the list? [10:23]  You: Adam has volunteered some heavy duty hardware for event [10:24]  Adam Frisby: :) [10:24] Aramis Soren: maybe plan for 2 adjacent grids, more people that way? [10:24] Hiro Protagonist: I think we should keep our goals for 0.6 static [10:24] Adam Frisby: I just realised we could probably use our mailserver for it. We never put it into production, but it's a dual quad core beast. >_> [10:24] You: right now the plan for party is 6 sims [10:24] G2 Proto: great idea [10:24] Hiro Protagonist: we're pretty well aware there's an occasional need to do something in a hurry [10:24] Aramis Soren: woohoo [10:24] Aramis Soren: and more "borrowed" hardware gotta love it lol [10:24] Hiro Protagonist: our job is to communicate that need on that occasion [10:25] Justin Clark-Casey: ckrinke: you know, I'm quite neutral on that topic [10:25] You: how is LSL coming along Charles? [10:25] Justin Clark-Casey: ckrinke: I'm a big fan of just putting out point releases at regular intervals when the code appears stable [10:25] You: i must say i have not been keeping up to date [10:25] Justin Clark-Casey: though I almost think an argument is coming that we should recommend people stay on actually numbered releases [10:25] Teravus Ousley peeks at the total un-acked bytes at 9MB [10:25] Justin Clark-Casey: rather than following head [10:25] Charles Krinkeb: We need about 88 functions to finish fleshing out the stubs. [10:25] Dr Scofield: hi hi [10:25]  Hiro Protagonist: Hello DrSco [10:25] Dahlia Trimble: hi dr :) [10:25]  You: are we still looking at that as milestone for .6? [10:26]  Hiro Protagonist: 29 avs folks [10:26]  Garth FairChang: Hi Dr Sco [10:26]  Charles Krinkeb: It could be argued that we have sufficient, if the artists concur. [10:26]  Dahlia Trimble: noone move! lol [10:26]  G2 Proto: lol\ [10:26]  Dr Scofield: coool [10:26]  Adam Frisby: Someone find 8 more people [10:26]  You: yea it seems to me it could be some time before the remaining 88 functions are stubbed out [10:26]  Charles Krinkeb: 31 avatars, VIRT=1194, RES=769 [10:26]  Aramis Soren: my nose itches ;) [10:26] G2 Proto: stopped breathing [10:26] You: perhaps we should move it to .7 goal [10:26] Hiro Protagonist: I think our LSL requirements were just for stubs - such that no call breaks the region [10:27] Charles Krinkeb: We have had stubs for all since last September. But we must be talking about a different kind of stub. [10:27] Adam Frisby: What about LSL events? [10:27] Hiro Protagonist: it's good our functionality is so high, but I think we're where we need to be for 0.6 [10:27] You: yea [10:27] Adam Frisby: How many of the 33 events do we support? [10:27] Hiro Protagonist: not enough [10:27] UUID Speaker: paulie Flomar, your key is 86003a74-b4d4-45fc-bfa7-46aab9949e94 [10:27] Adam Frisby: That's our major deficiency IMO [10:27] Hiro Protagonist: I think events and current engine refactoring should be a hard and fast 0.7 target [10:28] Wright Juran: Teravus, Stefan is actually going to look to see if he can improve the ack code during his holiday ( I made sure he had lots of homework to do during it) [10:28] Shenlei Winkler is Offline [10:28] Adam Frisby: Haha Wright [10:28] You: i saw MikeM commited a new LSL compiler [10:28] Hiro Protagonist: I concur totally Adam [10:28] You: has anyone tested it yet? [10:28] Adam Frisby: Tell him to hook up with Johan about the ClientStack [10:28] Adam Frisby: Johan's been doing a lot of experimental work there [10:28] Hiro Protagonist: 30 Avs [10:28] Charles Krinkeb: That is one of our current weak points. The testers dont know how to test all the new features. [10:28] You: yea i logged in plaza just to get 40 [10:29] You: 30 [10:29] You: lol [10:29] Hiro Protagonist: 498MB by the region console (ouch) [10:29] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: so login was fine for you? [10:29] G2 Proto: i have friends trying to get in but cant [10:29] Charles Krinkeb: VIRT=1237, RES=823 [10:29] You: i just logged in Plaza Builder [10:29] Neas Bade: Wright, grat [10:29] You: so it is working [10:29] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, we seem to be having issues with logins [10:29] Hiro Protagonist: 31 Avs [10:29] Neas Bade: great [10:29] Adam Frisby: 31. :D [10:29] Teravus Ousley is Offline [10:29] Hiro Protagonist: lost Teravus [10:29] Dr Scofield: justin, logim was fine, movement sucks [10:29] Charles Krinkeb: I suspect we are stressing a number of servers right now. [10:30] Hamilton Linden: Thanks! Gonna split. Cya. [10:30] Charles Krinkeb: Smoke coming out of the top of the userServer. [10:30] You: plaza builder is moving around ok [10:30]  Hiro Protagonist: I think the U service is just choking on simultaneous logins [10:30] G2 Proto: ok cya hamilton thank you and LL [10:30]  Charles Krinkeb: See you, Hamilton, and thanks. [10:30] BlueWall Slade: thanks for all the info Hamilton [10:30] Hiro Protagonist: THanks Lined Folk! [10:30] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I can't alawyas tell whether movement sucks because of my graphics card or because of the sim [10:30] Adam Frisby: Should we be heading to Zero's hours now? [10:30] Hiro Protagonist: *Linden [10:30] Strawberry Fride: seeya Hamilton, and thanks again :) [10:30]  Chris D: Thanks [10:30]  Mike Ortman: woot [10:30]  Hamilton Linden: Zero's office hours are at 1 so not for another 35 minutes [10:30]  Adam Frisby: Heya Mike [10:30]  Hiro Protagonist: 31 Avs [10:30]  You: good stuff [10:30]  You: another record :D [10:30]  Adam Frisby: so let's keep trying to pile on avs then [10:30]  G2 Proto: yeah! [10:30]  You: thanks everyone for contributing to this [10:30]  Adam Frisby: Oh cool [10:31]  Aramis Soren: someone post slurl for that please [10:31]  G2 Proto: we are they cant get in [10:31]  Mike Ortman: whats fantastic is this is the first time ive logged into a heavy sim on this laptop [10:31]  Charles Krinkeb: We need 8 to break Adam's record. [10:31]  Adam Frisby: Hehe [10:31]  Mike Ortman: and im getting 56fps! [10:31]  G2 Proto: wow [10:31]  Dr Scofield: zha code is in the mantis: http://opensimulator.org/mantis/view.php?id=1696 [10:31] Hiro Protagonist: :D [10:31] Dahlia Trimble is Offline [10:31] Mike Ortman: then I turn..and go down to 18 [10:31] Strawberry Fride: what are you running on?? [10:31] Teravus Ousley is Online [10:31] You: hehe sounds like some Dual 8800's [10:31]  Mike Ortman: its a 15" macbook pro with the higherend graphics card :P [10:31]  Strawberry Fride: with all settings set to minimum detail :) [10:32]  Charles Krinkeb: Did we decide if there will be a 0.6 this month? [10:32]  You: intersting [10:32]  Mike Ortman: 256mb 8600m I think [10:32]  paulie Flomar: I say go for 0.6. [10:32]  You: thats pretty good framerate for that machine [10:32]  Justin Clark-Casey: charles: I think it is your call really [10:32]  Charles Krinkeb: And regardless, what needs to be done in the next week? [10:32]  Dahlia Trimble is Online [10:32]  Strawberry Fride: that's what I'm on - 'cept I rarely get more than 10fps 'cos I demand all the settings at max and run at 1900x1200 [10:32]  You: suprising actually [10:32]  Zha Ewry: Between 15-20 here, with full up windlight on [10:32]  Zha Ewry: (and that's laptop, with nvdia [10:33] Tara5 Oh: hey zha will you take me a Windlight photo? [10:33] paulie Flomar: if we could get appearance working better so we didnt have to rebake all the time, that would be loverly. [10:33] Charles Krinkeb: If its my call, then I would say as long as no breakages occur in trunk for the couple of days leading up to a Saturday and reliability is good, we tag and bag. [10:33] You: i used to get those kind of speeds prior to windlight [10:33] You: i have a screenshot of 110fps [10:33] You: in SL [10:33]  You: hehe [10:33] Zha Ewry: Mstly gray, or paritcle cloudy people, Tara [10:33] Justin Clark-Casey: charles: you're planning on a 0.5.9 and then a 0.6? [10:33] Tara5 Oh: hehe that is my problem [10:33] Adam Frisby: 0.5.10? [10:33] Adam Frisby: Nothing wrong with that [10:33] Justin Clark-Casey: adam: absolutely - then we can go on as long as we need before 0.6 :) [10:34]  Adam Frisby: :) [10:34] You: yea me personally [10:34] Zha Ewry: 0.5.25 [10:34] Charles Krinkeb: Do we feel we have 60% of the features functional an average secondlife user would expect?? [10:34] You: i say lets not rush it [10:34]  BlueWall Slade: we should prepare a press release for the 0.6 [10:34] Teravus Ousley notes that we have about 1/2 of the LSL events implemented [10:34] Justin Clark-Casey: well, 1.0 isn't second life complaince you know, charles [10:34] G2 Proto: i feel 60% is close [10:34] Charles Krinkeb: Oh, I know. [10:34] Wright Juran: charles if we release 0.6 this month, then think it should be at the end, when opensim is 1 and half years old [10:34] Neas Bade: Wright, Adam, Ter, and issue if I add RegionID to SOP? It would make some of my mapping stuff a lot easier [10:35] You: Wright Juran = MW? [10:35] Adam Frisby: No Issue as far as I can tell [10:35] Charles Krinkeb: Lets aim for the end of the month for a 0.6 and skip 0.5.9 and just go for it. [10:35] Teravus Ousley: Yeah [10:35] You: heh ok [10:35]  Teravus Ousley: @ nebadon [10:35] paulie Flomar: ok [10:35]  Mike Ortman: quite a bit of movement lag [10:35] You: yea [10:35] You: we just beat the crap out of this server [10:35] You: im not suprised [10:35] You: lol [10:35] Adam Frisby: Well [10:35] Adam Frisby: We beat the crap out of it, and it didnt do anything silly [10:35] Adam Frisby: I'd call that a win [10:35] You: its probably leaking Heat Paste out of the case [10:35] Hiro Protagonist: +1 [10:35] Tara5 Oh is Offline [10:35] Aramis Soren: lol [10:35] Tara5 Oh is Online [10:35] Justin Clark-Casey: there are login issues though [10:35] Adam Frisby: I'd even be willing to say maybe we should tag this particular revision as 0.5.9 [10:36] Adam Frisby: Because it is working fairly solidly. [10:36] Justin Clark-Casey: but the causes could be complicated [10:36] Neas Bade: yeh, login seems to be when we do some big cpu spikes [10:36] Charles Krinkeb: As long as we think about 60% of the features are working, that seems reasonable. That is a total, not just events. But, it would be nice to get at least 2 more events working. [10:36] Teravus Ousley: Yes, good idea [10:36] Wright Juran: neas, can't think of anything, but mail to the list just to see if anyone can think of anything [10:36] Adam Frisby: Hrrm [10:36] Adam Frisby: Could i get some volunteers from here to help me profile the login spike? [10:36] You: personally i think we have far less than 60% complete [10:36] You: hehe [10:36] Adam Frisby: I can setup a new sim in a few minutes with a profiler [10:36] Hiro Protagonist: count me in AdamZaius [10:36] Adam Frisby: if I could get everyone to login to it, maybe we can try find where we slow down if it's on the sim end [10:36] You: sure [10:36] Neas Bade: Wright, will do [10:37]  You: sounds good [10:37] Strawberry Fride: sure, I'm game [10:37] Adam Frisby: Give me 5 mins [10:37] Adam Genkii: sure [10:37] G2 Proto: k [10:37]  Hiro Protagonist: 10 if you need em [10:37]  Adam Frisby: I'll find a server of ours that isnt being used for something, hang on. [10:37] Justin Clark-Casey: well, in the mean time, are there any other opensim issues? [10:37] Charles Krinkeb: Next question: "What as testers can we do to support the developers better in the next week?" [10:37] You: yea make sure its windows [10:37] You: Adam [10:37] Tara5 Oh: I have to go pick up kid from summer camp sorry! [10:37] You: i bet this doesnt go as well on windows [10:37] Hiro Protagonist: Bye Tara [10:37] White Board: - So many people.... - Sit rotation bug - Neas is a slacker, nhibernate still in progress - Patch from Zha - Mantis 1696

[10:37] You: id like to see a good load test with profile done on windows and linux [10:37] Justin Clark-Casey: see you tara5 [10:37] Tara5 Oh: cya soon! [10:38] Strawberry Fride: seeya Tara :) [10:38]  Charles Krinkeb: bye, Tara [10:38]  You: im sure adams using windows though [10:38]  Hiro Protagonist: actually Neb [10:38]  Adam Genkii: Bye Tara5! [10:38]  Zha Ewry: When you're ready, tap me, and I can drop in at least 2 or 3 aves [10:38]  Tara5 Oh is Offline [10:38]  Dahlia Trimble: bye Tara :) [10:38] Hiro Protagonist: given what we've been seeing - I would be surprised if they turned up anything much different [10:38] You: yea [10:38] Dahlia Trimble: I have an alt in the corner ;) [10:38]  You: we'll see [10:38]  Charles Krinkeb: Justin, Mw, Neas, Teravus? What can the testers do in the testing to help your work in the next week? [10:38]  You: granted this is good [10:38]  You: but if someone started building right now [10:38]  Hiro Protagonist: 31 avs [10:38]  You: forget [10:38]  You: this region would instantly die [10:39]  Hiro Protagonist: 542MB by the console [10:39]  Adam Genkii: Maybe test out scripts on Mike's compiler? [10:39]  You: i plan on doing that in a bit [10:39]  Dahlia Trimble: torturing prims while running ODE would help me [10:39]  Adam Frisby: hrrm [10:39]  Teravus Ousley: I'm currently in the middle of a work stint. not much time to devote to opensimulator at the moment [10:39]  Adam Frisby: We've got two mikes now. [10:39]  Justin Clark-Casey: charles: yes, what Adam Genkii said [10:39]  Adam Frisby: Mike from 3Di is officially mike#2. [10:39] You: actually [10:39] You: im a Mike too [10:39] You: lol [10:39] Adam Frisby: Since Mike from DeepThink was here first. [10:39] Adam Frisby: :P [10:39] Adam Genkii: mikem maybe [10:39] Adam Frisby: You can be mike 3. [10:39] Alex Strong: :P zomg i'm ruth! :P [10:39] You: lol [10:39] You: yay [10:40] You: M3 [10:40]  Charles Krinkeb: Sounds good. We'll see if we can make progress on that. Can we have a clue where to start? [10:40] Adam Frisby: Hey Alex [10:40] Adam Frisby beats Alex over the head. [10:40] Adam Frisby: Mwuahhaa [10:40] Alex Strong: I need to get myself a pair of pants i'll keep for at least 3 years [10:40] Teravus Ousley slaps himself around with a large trout [10:40] You: hehe [10:40] Adam Genkii: I think he added some docs to the code [10:40] Adam Genkii: or a txt file [10:40] Adam Genkii: I haven't checked it out yet though [10:40] You: right now i think the biggest region killer though [10:40] You: is building [10:40] Charles Krinkeb: I'll see if we can get some traction on that. [10:41] Adam Frisby: Nebadon: Building should have gotten better after the patch I did over the weekend [10:41] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, I guess reports on the current bottlenecks would be good [10:41] You: like if someone is building while someone else is logging in [10:41]  Hiro Protagonist: timers and loops, oh MY! [10:41] You: forget it [10:41]  You: region = dead [10:41] You: it doesnt crash [10:41] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: interesting [10:41] You: but itbecomes quite unuseable [10:41] You: region requires a restart [10:41] Charles Krinkeb: As i understand it from the testers viewpoint, the two biggest issues are memory consumption and reliability of building with linked primsets. [10:41] Justin Clark-Casey: what do you mean by unuseable? [10:41] You: skiw [10:41] You: slow [10:41] You: unreliable [10:42] Justin Clark-Casey: charles: what is wrong with linksets? [10:42] You: you risk loosing your build [10:42] You: ive had to hack database several times [10:42] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: permanently? (by the sound of it) [10:42] You: to get prim to start [10:42] Hiro Protagonist: Justin: much trouble editing the linked parts [10:42] You: and remove prims [10:42] Hiro Protagonist: especially if you modify the root prim [10:42] You: also [10:42] Charles Krinkeb: I have heard several times that folks doing complicated builds get all bolloxed up. Maybe not linked primsets so much as more complicated builds. [10:42] You: another crash [10:42] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: is this on a region with many prims or fiew? [10:42] Zha Ewry: Root prim is pretty painful t touch [10:42] You: crashes the client [10:42] Adam Frisby: Fokls: I might do this stress test later [10:42] You: fill a prim with objects [10:42] Adam Frisby: everyone going to be around on IRC? [10:42] You: like 50 textures [10:42] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, complicated builds are going to start stressing the boundaries [10:42] G2 Proto: yes [10:42] Hiro Protagonist: I've done some very complex builds over whole regions [10:43] You: then try to move the textures from the prim [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: I would be interested to talk to Shenlei about that some time too [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: since she has done some pretty complex looking stuff [10:43] BlueWall Slade: you can't select all the prims and take them unlinked [10:43] Hiro Protagonist: the linkset is what gets me [10:43]  Hiro Protagonist: I wont even edit a linkset at this point [10:43] You: Shenlei works in Standalone though [10:43] Hiro Protagonist: unlink/relink is reliable [10:43] Hiro Protagonist: linkset is not [10:43] You: i dont think standalone gets hammered like Grid mode does [10:43] You: plus [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: hiro: okay.. might be worth trying to gather a mantis together at some point [10:43] You: her regions dont have neighbors [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: on the linkset stuff [10:43] Charles Krinkeb: We are also getting to the point where we can to mass teleports of 6 or more avatars simultaneously but things get quite slow until the packets all catch up with each other. [10:43] Justin Clark-Casey: start gathering evidence [10:43] Hiro Protagonist: ok justin will do sir [10:44] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: yes,those are good points [10:44] You: yea logging in and teleporting [10:44] You: seem to clobber the region [10:44] You: and if someone is there building [10:44] You: it never recoveres [10:44] Charles Krinkeb: So, I would say another issue from the testers viewpoint is that there are things which significantly lag the region down that could be addressed. [10:44] Neas Bade: neb, yeh, there is a cpu spike on login and logout [10:44] You: yea [10:44] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: oh, so teleporting in at any point causes this iissue? [10:44] Justin Clark-Casey: not just if something else is actively happening? [10:44] You: yes, but its made worse when someone is in the receiving region [10:44] You: and is building [10:44] You: rezzing prims [10:44] You: deleteing [10:44] You: any of that coupled witha login/teleport = bad news [10:45] Justin Clark-Casey: charles: yeah, we're entering the zone now, I feelm where it's going to get much more complicate dto fix these issues [10:45] You: ive lost many prims [10:45] You: because someone logged in when i rezzed or changed [10:45] Justin Clark-Casey: before the bugs were obvius - now they're getting complicated [10:45] Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: okay, that's interesting [10:45] Zha Ewry: OK, off to catch coffiee, prior to zero [10:45] Neas Bade: I think one of the ways we need to address that is some cleaning of our existing structurs to make them easier to understand [10:45] Zha Ewry: See some of you there, and I should be on iRC most of the time [10:45] Hiro Protagonist: Thanks Zha!! [10:45] BlueWall Slade: ThanZha [10:45] Neas Bade: for instance, SOP has become an interesting beast :) [10:45]  G2 Proto: cya Zha [10:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: I'm surprised there is an effect - those guys are coming in on a completely different thread [10:45]  Justin Clark-Casey: neas: yes [10:45]  Dahlia Trimble: bye Zha :) [10:46] Dr Scofield: locks? [10:46] Adam Frisby: Oh random side task: [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: those classes need to be unbundled if possible, I think [10:46] You: well i can tell you [10:46] Adam Frisby: someone should fix upthe wikipedias page for OpenSim. ;) [10:46] You: when im standing on Zaius Plaza [10:46]  RobinG2 Proto: bye Zha [10:46]  You: and someone logs in [10:46]  Neas Bade: I started changing setter/getter stuff to properties [10:46]  You: until they can move [10:46]  You: im frozen [10:46]  Hiro Protagonist: I'll have a look at that Adam [10:46]  Justin Clark-Casey: Dr Schofield: locks indeed :) [10:46] Zha Ewry: Not laggy at all [10:46] You: yea big fat locks [10:46] Neas Bade: I was also thinking about encapsulating permissions in general to a framework object [10:46] You: made of kryptonite [10:46] Justin Clark-Casey: big fat fucking locks [10:46] You: hehe [10:46] Neas Bade: as I think that would help pull a lot of code out [10:46] Neas Bade: of random places [10:47] Teravus Ousley: Heh, I edit a wikipedia entry and every time.. someone reverts it back to what it was. I hate that because I tend to spend a lot of time getting references. [10:47] Justin Clark-Casey: neas: sounds good [10:47] Charles Krinkeb: Have we covered 0.6, testers helping developers & tester requests sufficiently for today? [10:47] Neas Bade: things I'm finding while doing the rest of the nhibernate mappings [10:47] AB_Bar Stool no anim: changed [10:47] AB_Bar Stool no anim: changedlink [10:47] AB_Bar Stool no anim: avatarunsat [10:47] Neas Bade: anyway, need to run away a bit early today. Catch you all online [10:47] You: ok Sean [10:48] paulie Flomar: I'm off. Great meeting! Bye, everyone! [10:48] You: i'll post this to the wiki [10:48] You: the chat log [10:48] Justin Clark-Casey: bye neas [10:48] Neas Bade is Offline [10:48] paulie Flomar waves bye [10:48] Charles Krinkeb: I think we are trying to finish in 5 minutes at 12:45PM PDT [10:48] Charles Krinkeb: Since we started early. [10:48] paulie Flomar is Offline [10:48] You: sure [10:48] You: anyone who is interested in helping with the load test today [10:48] Justin Clark-Casey: I keep forgetting the clock here is out of whack [10:48] BlueWall Slade: yse good meeting [10:48] Charles Krinkeb: Any other issues we need to bring up in the last 5 minutes? [10:48] You: please keep checking the IRC [10:48] Justin Clark-Casey is going to finally get omething to eat [10:48] Adam Frisby: Yeah [10:48] Aramis Soren: can do nebadon [10:48] You: #opensim on irc.freenode.net [10:49] Adam Frisby: I'm going to grab a snack then head to Zeros [10:49] Adam Genkii is going to sleep [10:49] Aramis Soren: slurl for Zero? [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam Genkii: what time is it where you are? [10:49] Teravus Ousley: Grasmere [10:49] Adam Genkii: 4:42AM [10:49] You: geez [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey: sweet jesus [10:49] Hiro Protagonist: See y'all at Zero's [10:49]  Adam Genkii: almost time to wake up [10:49]  Charles Krinkeb: My focus next week will be the same. In this order 1) Linden interop 2) 0.6 release, 3) Testers helping developers 4) Developers helping testers. [10:49] Teravus Ousley: .. or Pooley Stage.. but.. [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey: Adam Genkii: heh [10:49] G2 Proto: sounds great Charles [10:49] Justin Clark-Casey: charle: eh? I never signed up for 4! [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: scandalous [10:50] Hiro Protagonist waves [10:50] You: lol [10:50] Charles Krinkeb: [10:50] G2 Proto: harumph [10:50] Adam Frisby: Seeya folks [10:50] G2 Proto: cya Adam [10:50] Teravus Ousley: hpmurah [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: bye adan [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: adam [10:50] Adam Genkii: Later all [10:50] G2 Proto: im out too guys cya next time [10:50] Chillken Proto: goodnight all [10:50] Dr Scofield: time to have dinner [10:50] Adam Genkii: good meeting [10:50] You: ok, thanks everyone [10:50] Dr Scofield: cya [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: bye adam, chillken, g2 [10:50]  Charles Krinkeb: Thanks folks. Since we started the meeting significantly early, I am declaring the official meeting closed and informal discussions as anybody wishes. [10:50] You: anyone has anything else they would like to discuss [10:50] You: #opensim-dev [10:50] Justin Clark-Casey: er, everybody [10:51] You: is the place [10:51] Teravus Ousley is Offline [10:51] Teravus Ousley is Offline [10:51] Dahlia Trimble heads to Zero's..... bye all :) [10:51] RobinG2 Proto: bye guys heading out with G2 - catch you all soon [10:51]  You: bye dahlia [10:51]  Dahlia Trimble is Offline [10:51]  Dahlia Trimble is Offline [10:51]  Aramis Soren: link again for those who may have missed [10:51]  You: heh is ALbot Dahlias bot [10:51]  Aramis Soren: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Open_Grid_Public_Beta [10:51]  You: lol [10:51]  Charles Krinkeb: Wow. The sim survived and didnt crash. I never would of believed it if I had not experienced it personally. [10:51]  You: yea [10:51]  Aramis Soren: woohoo [10:51]  You: i crashed once [10:51]  Kurt Stringer: Charles: just a request - if we start early in the future - can we change the time in IRC? [10:51]  You: but that was it