Chat log from the meeting on 2011-03-22

[12:03] Richardus Raymaker: cai [12:03] Cai Laval: yes rira thats tablad avatar [12:03] Nebadon Izumi: not sure Justin just logged in [12:03]  Cai Laval: next tab..pics [12:03] Richardus Raymaker: oh you mena picks [12:03] Andrew Hellershanks: Richardus, is it just me or have you gotten smaller? [12:03] Cai Laval: pictures [12:03] Richardus Raymaker: thats something different then pics [12:03] Nebadon Izumi: lol [12:03] Cai Laval: lol not piks [12:03] koggala benelli: so [12:03]  Nebadon Izumi: hello Justin [12:04] Sarah Kline: hi Justin [12:04] Richardus Raymaker: hi justin [12:04] koggala benelli: hello everybody here [12:04] Cai Laval: hello justin [12:04] Richardus Raymaker: dont see a tab pictures cai [12:04] Justin Clark-Casey: hi neb, sarah, richardus, cai, folks [12:04] Andrew Hellershanks: Picks work(ed) for me [12:04]  Cai Laval: lol ok picks.. [12:04] Richardus Raymaker: not sure if that ever worked [12:04] Cai Laval: it did [12:04] Nebadon Izumi: ok sorry guys i need to run out [12:04] Richardus Raymaker: go try that later [12:05] Cai Laval: it does [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: i will stay logged in [12:05]  Richardus Raymaker: ok. be carefull neb [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: Justin i gotta run [12:05] Sarah Kline: bye Nebs [12:05] Cai Laval: bye ned [12:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Wow... meeting hasn't even really started yet [12:05] Cai Laval: b [12:05]  Andrew Hellershanks: Bye, nebs [12:05] Justin Clark-Casey: ok neb, see you later [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: ya keep at it guys [12:05] Richardus Raymaker: you get the captains chair justin. [12:05] Justin Clark-Casey: pfff [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: Justin is here, I will be logged in [12:05]  Cai Laval: look with dutchy ..picks..you see they work rira [12:05] Dutchy Daredevil: *-* Mmm ByE ByE *-* [12:05] Dutchy Daredevil: Neb [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: i just wont be responding [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: i might even be back before hour is up [12:05]  Nebadon Izumi: not sure [12:05] Nebadon Izumi: i'll be sure to read the log once I am back [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: k, have fun [12:06] Nebadon Izumi: anything important IM me or contact me on IRC [12:06] Richardus Raymaker: yes i see cai [12:06] Justin Clark-Casey: we're moving meeting in utc next week so we're back at the old time? [12:06] Cai Laval: so ..mine are lost in space [12:06] Richardus Raymaker: uhh. for me its still old time [12:06] Justin Clark-Casey: yes, until next week [12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: yea, I was thinking the same [12:07] Cai Laval: i can place one..afther ok..they are gone..keep on saying loadinnn [12:07] koggala benelli: me too [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: does canada go to summertime? [12:07] Cai Laval: whats the old time? [12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: It already did. last weekend. [12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: um... not this past weekend. The weekend before. [12:07] Justin Clark-Casey: clocks in us changed 2 weekends ago, clocks in europe will change this weekend [12:07] Andrew Hellershanks: I was UTC-5 now UTC-4 [12:08] Justin Clark-Casey: so then we usually put the meeting forward an hour [12:08] Eryn Galen is Online [12:08] Nebadon Izumi is Offline [12:08] Cai Laval: ahh possible my dinnertime.. [12:08] Andrew Hellershanks: so the meeting will be at 1pm SLT? [12:08] Justin Clark-Casey: or back an hour rather [12:09] Justin Clark-Casey: sorry, 11pm slt [12:09] Justin Clark-Casey: er, 11am [12:09] Andrew Hellershanks: k [12:09]  Richardus Raymaker: am ? my viewe clock says pm [12:09] Cai Laval: 19.00 [12:09] Andrew Hellershanks: so 1 hour earlier [12:09] Richardus Raymaker: ouch, thast a bad clokc 19:00 [12:09] Andrew Hellershanks: frommy point of view [12:09] koggala benelli: here it is 20:00 [12:09] Justin Clark-Casey: yes [12:09] Dutchy Daredevil: in here 1900 utc [12:10] Cai Laval: how we are going to do the dishes .. [12:10] Richardus Raymaker: oh utc [12:10] Richardus Raymaker: i think its still at the same time as today 20:00 RL [12:10]  Cai Laval: gmt? [12:10] Cai Laval: do we move our clock next weekend? [12:10] Justin Clark-Casey: europe does [12:10] Cai Laval: england doesnt [12:10] Richardus Raymaker: 27 is summertime yuck [12:11] Nebadon Izumi is Online [12:11] Cai Laval: hello prinz [12:11] koggala benelli: hallo Prinzi [12:11] PrinzVon Halberstadt: hello all [12:11] Nebadon Izumi: wtf i got logged out [12:12] Nebadon Izumi: anyway gotta run, be back in a bit guys [12:12] Richardus Raymaker: bye again [12:12] Andrew Hellershanks: yup. It didn't even show you as having gone [12:12] Sarah Kline: just saw you jump out of chair and poof [12:12] Cai Laval: lol thought you needed to go...neb [12:12] Justin Clark-Casey: so, anybody have any opensim issues this week? [12:12] Richardus Raymaker: not sure if its opensim.. [12:13] Andrew Hellershanks: Shortly after last weeks meeting I completed the first cut at my asset blobs on disk. [12:13] Justin Clark-Casey: does it work? [12:13] Andrew Hellershanks: I haven't had time to post anything about it in mantis [12:13] Andrew Hellershanks: yes, it seems to be working fine. [12:14] Andrew Hellershanks: The changes are minor and only affect the Get and Store routines. I have a migration file and a PHP script to update the db structure and copy blobs out of the db to the disk [12:15] Justin Clark-Casey: I guess the big question is whether that works better [12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: It detects if blob already exists on disk. [12:15] Richardus Raymaker: aha, cool [12:16] Richardus Raymaker: hmm, basil and cai still cloud. brb [12:16] Andrew Hellershanks: I kept hearing that MySQL indexes can blow up if the db table got too big due to storage of blobs in a table so I was looking for a way to solve that problem [12:16] Richardus Raymaker is Offline [12:16] Andrew Hellershanks: I couldn't use Coyled's SRAS so this avoids dependency on any external code. [12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: It remains to be determined how to make it optional, whether blobs on disk should (optionally?) be compressed, and if they should be serialized so the blobs will allow data recovery by having name, UUID, and some other bits of info in the stored file. [12:18] Richardus Raymaker is Online [12:18] Richardus Raymaker: ok. that looks better [12:18] Andrew Hellershanks: I will check a couple of things later this week and get it in to mantis for comment. [12:19] Andrew Hellershanks: Its amazing how many times a blob is duplicated in the asset table. [12:19] Justin Clark-Casey: ok [12:19]  Basil Sosides: bye all, have a nice day [12:19] Cai Laval: bye basil [12:19] Richardus Raymaker: bye basil [12:19] Sarah Kline: bye basil [12:19] Richardus Raymaker: just now i see you [12:20] Arielle Popstar: waves [12:20] Andrew Hellershanks: A test with my standalone that had under 4,000 items had almost 50% duplication of asset blobs [12:20] Richardus Raymaker: that could speed things up if you can point to existing blob [12:20] Andrew Hellershanks: 4,000 assets [12:20] Justin Clark-Casey: there was once talk of having the uuid of an asset hashed on its contents in order to detect dupes more automatically, but no work was ever done on that [12:21] Justin Clark-Casey: I'm surprised there's quite so much duplication though - 50% seems way high [12:21] Andrew Hellershanks: That is how my blobs on disk works. The content is used to generate an sha1 sum and that sum is used as the name of the file and the hash stored in the table. [12:21] Justin Clark-Casey: any idea what kind of assets were being duplicated? [12:21] Andrew Hellershanks: It probably varies based on content. Another test with more assets was more around 25% or wo [12:22] Andrew Hellershanks: or so [12:22]  Andrew Hellershanks: textures mostly [12:22] Justin Clark-Casey: hmm [12:23] Andrew Hellershanks: The PHP script will generate a report at the end of the number of files/bytes in blobs, and the number of files/bytes actually written [12:23] Andrew Hellershanks: number of assets/bytes [12:24] Andrew Hellershanks: Just [12:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Justin, the discussion you had with Melanie about prim counting gives me the idea that blobs on disk could be implemented in a similar way to make it optionallyl available across all db storage systems. [12:25] Andrew Hellershanks: I just don't know enough about C# to tackle that. [12:25] Richardus Raymaker: how's the status about parcel count ? [12:26] Justin Clark-Casey: andrew: are you doing this at the data layer or at the cache layer? [12:26] Justin Clark-Casey: richardus: those issues should be addressed soon [12:27] Andrew Hellershanks: I modified MySQLAssetData.cs [12:27]  Justin Clark-Casey: to store everything on disk rather than in mysql? [12:28] Andrew Hellershanks: To store all blobs previously in the asset table on disk. [12:28] Justin Clark-Casey: but the metadata is still stored in mysql? [12:28] Richardus Raymaker: sounds logic to do justin [12:28] Andrew Hellershanks: yes, the asset table still has all other info about an asset. Instead of storing the blob the table stores the sha1 sum [12:30] Justin Clark-Casey: doing the same across all systems would be difficult unless once split the asset data servie up further, say into a part which just handles the actual blob storage rather than the metadata [12:31] Andrew Hellershanks: You talked about prim count being picked up through some kind of interface method that would get called where needed. Make me thing the get and store could be handled similarly but I don't know enough about C# or how OS all hangs together [12:31] Richardus Raymaker: its a shame viewers still need to get all data from region. thinbgs would work faster if blobs could be readed from a fast server outside home cponnection as example [12:32] koggala benelli: I must go, bye all [12:32] Arielle Popstar: waves [12:32] Eryn Galen is Offline [12:32] Cai Laval: bye koggala [12:32] Sarah Kline: byes [12:32] Arielle Popstar: there is a small HG isue which would be nice to see fixed in Opensim before the next stable release. [12:34] Arielle Popstar: inability to hg with an avi from an external grid to my own standalone HG enabled region [12:34] Justin Clark-Casey: And even then I think this kind of thing has to be optional right now - for many cases in database storage is fine [12:34] Richardus Raymaker: for a long time last week 1 region crashed. with almost 100% cpu load. long time ago i have seen that [12:35] Justin Clark-Casey: arielle: I think diva would look at those in the first instance, when she has time [12:35] Richardus Raymaker: uhmm, maby better say 100% load for that process [12:35] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't know enough about how hg works right now [12:36] Arielle Popstar: so Diva is the only one who can resolve that? [12:36] Justin Clark-Casey: possibly marck could, though he's v busy right now [12:36] Arielle Popstar: Diva is out for the time being? [12:36] Justin Clark-Casey: until this weekend, she said [12:37] Arielle Popstar: ok [12:37]  Arielle Popstar: i thought it only an osgrid issue before but sometesting i realize it extends further [12:38] Arielle Popstar: some further testing^ [12:38] Arielle Popstar: see the same issue on accounts on other grids/standalones to my own [12:39] Andrew Hellershanks: bbl [12:40] Richardus Raymaker: dont HG much [12:41] Justin Clark-Casey: any other issues? [12:42] Richardus Raymaker: uhmm, i just wait for new version. must first see whats wrong now [12:42] Richardus Raymaker: not really i think. spounds quite week [12:43] Adelle Fitzgerald is Online [12:47] Cai Laval: no ..only some errors flotsam asset cache [12:49] Justin Clark-Casey: heh, at least there won't be much of a log for nebadon to read through :) [12:50]  Eryn Galen is Online [12:50]  Richardus Raymaker: :) [12:51] Dutchy Daredevil: really ????? [12:55] Andrew Hellershanks: Wow... I went away at 12:39 and hardly anything was said between then and now? [12:55] Justin Clark-Casey: I don't think there's much to discuss today [12:55] Justin Clark-Casey: this timezone switching never helps [12:56] Andrew Hellershanks nods [12:56] BlueWall Slade is Online [12:56] Richardus Raymaker: yes [12:56] Dutchy Daredevil: nope if there is no reaction on a question [12:56] Andrew Hellershanks: so its at 0600UTC next week? [12:56] Andrew Hellershanks: err... 1800UTC [12:57] Justin Clark-Casey: 1800UGC [12:57] Dutchy Daredevil: hi blue wall [12:57] Justin Clark-Casey: utc, er, yes :) [12:57]  Andrew Hellershanks: um... [12:57]  BlueWall Slade: Hello [12:57]  Dutchy Daredevil: your on closing time in here it seems [12:57]  Andrew Hellershanks thinks his math is off [12:57]  Justin Clark-Casey: hey bluewall [12:57]  Richardus Raymaker: hi blue [12:57]  BlueWall Slade: lol, I was trying to login for an hour on the experimental Imp [12:57]  Cai Laval: we can listhen ducth:) [12:58] Justin Clark-Casey: that sounds serious experimental [12:58] Justin Clark-Casey: seriously [12:58] Cai Laval: the latest...blue? [12:58] Richardus Raymaker: hmm, the latest i use works pretty ok. maby sometime slogin problem [12:58] BlueWall Slade: I think it doesn't take the input to go to a specific region [12:58] Richardus Raymaker: but a few minutes later it works fine [12:58] Andrew Hellershanks: iirc, it does. [12:59] BlueWall Slade: the 1.3.0 one works [12:59] Dutchy Daredevil: helllo [12:59] Cai Laval: hello dutch [12:59] BlueWall Slade: Justin - I have been digging in the SQLite a little more [12:59] Dutchy Daredevil: do i am in here to been seen ??word ik gezien hier zooo ??? [12:59] Andrew Hellershanks: I don't have 1.3.0 anymore. Just 1.4.0 [13:00] Cai Laval: yes... i do ..see you dutch [13:00] Dutchy Daredevil: do i have contact in here ?? [13:00] Andrew Hellershanks: It's a zoo here? Sometimes ;-) [13:00] Richardus Raymaker: i use 1.3.1 and 1.4 [13:00]  BlueWall Slade: Dutchy - yes [13:00]  BlueWall Slade: 1.3.1 here [13:00]  Dutchy Daredevil: aww i was wondering [13:01]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: oh right? [13:01]  BlueWall Slade: yes [13:01]  BlueWall Slade: the way we have things right now, we will need to compile a lib for each platform [13:02]  BlueWall Slade: I made a 32 bit Linux version today [13:02]  BlueWall Slade: I still hvae to test it [13:02]  Andrew Hellershanks: I'm going to head out for this week. I really need to finish a note and get it sent off. [13:02]  Justin Clark-Casey: ok, see you later, andrew [13:02]  BlueWall Slade: see ya Andrew [13:02]  Andrew Hellershanks: I'm amazed I didn't once have to hit stop on video playback. [13:02]  Richardus Raymaker: bye andrew [13:02]  Andrew Hellershanks: See you next week. [13:02]  Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: so there's a 32-bit/64-bit issue? That would make sense, actually [13:03] BlueWall Slade: and mac [13:03] Sarah Kline: bye andrew [13:03] BlueWall Slade: this is working out though [13:03] Dutchy Daredevil: *-* Mmm ByE ByE *-* [13:03] Dutchy Daredevil: Andrew [13:03] Sarah Kline: bye all [13:03] sim core: Bye, andrew! [13:03] Justin Clark-Casey: bye sarah [13:03] BlueWall Slade: I put a config in for the Mono.SQLite.dll [13:03] sim core: :-)See-you, sarah [13:04]  BlueWall Slade: just like ode [13:05]  BlueWall Slade: I think that Community thing is using the generic things that need the metadata to talk to the tables [13:05]  Justin Clark-Casey: I think people have just been dumping sqlite.so in bin/in the past wihtout actually understanding that it wasn't being picked up by naything [13:05]  Justin Clark-Casey: community thing? [13:05]  BlueWall Slade: hehe, like the monodevelop sux issue?? [13:05]  BlueWall Slade: yes - 1 sec [13:05]  Dutchy Daredevil: dear just a few mb to get [13:05]  Dutchy Daredevil: almost done [13:06]  BlueWall Slade: Community.CsharpSqlite.dll - Community.CsharpSqlite.Sqlite.dll [13:06]  Cai Laval: hmm maby iam wrong..but if we run 32 bit ..its ok to use the sim.exe..and not the 32bit launch exe? [13:06]  BlueWall Slade: those [13:06]  xstorm Radek is Online [13:06]  BlueWall Slade: things dealing with the user / inventory etc. are going through that [13:06] Richardus Raymaker: depends. under linux i simple run opensim.exe under 64bit [13:06] BlueWall Slade: and it uses the generic things [13:07] Cai Laval: we dont have linux.. [13:07] Dutchy Daredevil: like what Blue ? [13:07] BlueWall Slade: that is why it does the migrations on the other things [13:07] BlueWall Slade: the SQLite [13:07] BlueWall Slade: we have to use some optional methods [13:07] Dutchy Daredevil: i only use the console from osgrid [13:08] Dutchy Daredevil: in 32 aswel 64 mode [13:08] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: I didn't think we were using those libraries at all - teravus put them in as an experimental thing [13:08] BlueWall Slade: the first one we are [13:08] Justin Clark-Casey: cai: yes, you can use either [13:08] Justin Clark-Casey: waah? [13:09] BlueWall Slade: public class SQLiteUserAccountData : SQLiteGenericTableHandler, IUserAccountData [13:09] Cai Laval: hmm you can run the 32bits launch exe but you keep on getting a windows error.. [13:10] BlueWall Slade: I am pretty sure that the SQLiteGenericTableHandler is in it [13:10]  Justin Clark-Casey: right, but the community reference is ifdef'd out [13:10] BlueWall Slade: ok [13:10]  Justin Clark-Casey: but SqLiteGenericTableHandler is another class in OpenSim.Data.SQLite [13:10] BlueWall Slade: I will have to locate it [13:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: F12 in your monodevelop? :) [13:11] BlueWall Slade: I'll have to bring it up [13:11]  BlueWall Slade: lo,l I was using gvim [13:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: no, I'm pretty sure the Community stuff was something teravus put in as an experiment [13:11]  Justin Clark-Casey: it's a set of native .NET lirbaries that interact with the sqlite storage format [13:11]  BlueWall Slade: yes [13:12]  Justin Clark-Casey: I'm a little wary of switching to that though because it could be another thing to maintain - I'm not sure how many people are working on it, though I havne't looked recently [13:12]  BlueWall Slade: what I'm thinking - we can make it work on all platforms with appropriate libraries and the config to point to the dll we wawnt to load on each platform ... [13:13]  BlueWall Slade: that can get us working for a release [13:13]  BlueWall Slade: then, we can sort out why we need the optional methods after that [13:13]  Dutchy Daredevil: lol [13:13] Justin Clark-Casey: I believe the mono sqlite adaptors need those methods [13:13] Justin Clark-Casey: it's not something that we're doing directly [13:13] BlueWall Slade: ok [13:14]  Justin Clark-Casey: hmmm, I wonder why we're not doing this mapping already! [13:14] Justin Clark-Casey: urf [13:14] BlueWall Slade: I dont' know [13:14] Justin Clark-Casey: in principle it could just be done for OSX, and leave Linux to use installed libraries [13:14] Justin Clark-Casey: they usually have the right symbols exported, though I'm not sure that's done for every distro [13:14] BlueWall Slade: but, in my searcing, I saw it trying to load a specific so file [13:14] BlueWall Slade: and, it loaded the system lib for it [13:15]  BlueWall Slade: but, that one doesn't have the optional methods included [13:15] BlueWall Slade: so, it fails on that [13:15] Justin Clark-Casey: which platform was this? [13:15] BlueWall Slade: Linux [13:15] Justin Clark-Casey: which distro? [13:15] BlueWall Slade: OpenSuse [13:15] BlueWall Slade: 11.3 / 11.4 [13:15] Justin Clark-Casey: so effectively sqlite was failing for us under opensuse? [13:15] BlueWall Slade: yes [13:15] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I think I heard that before [13:16] Justin Clark-Casey sighs [13:16] BlueWall Slade: but, we have a handle on it now [13:16] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, that's good [13:16] Richardus Raymaker: hmm, explain why i hate sqlite. it gives me headaces. also opensuse. good i neve ruse it [13:16] BlueWall Slade: I looked for the reason it calls for a particular library [13:16] Cai Laval: hm must say i like it.. [13:16] BlueWall Slade: it is in /etc/mono/config [13:16] BlueWall Slade: it is mapping the sqlite3 to that lib [13:17] Dutchy Daredevil: yeap ll [13:17]  Dutchy Daredevil: lol [13:17] Richardus Raymaker: if you dont use your own compiled mono [13:17] BlueWall Slade: so, I made a mapping in our dir to make it pickup libsqlite3_64 on this one [13:17] BlueWall Slade: then on the 32 bit - it goes for libsqlite3_32 [13:17] Justin Clark-Casey: cool [13:17] BlueWall Slade: we need a mac one [13:17] Justin Clark-Casey: at this rate I am going to buy a mac [13:18] Justin Clark-Casey: I'm quite serious - it would be convenient for other things too [13:18] BlueWall Slade: lol, I hvae been searching for cross-compile methods [13:18] Justin Clark-Casey: actually, I just looked at the community sqlite website and activity is high [13:18] Justin Clark-Casey: has a company sponsor too [13:18] Justin Clark-Casey: http://code.google.com/p/csharp-sqlite/ [13:18] Justin Clark-Casey: I believe [13:19] BlueWall Slade: ok, I will look in the dlls to see what is using the optional methods later [13:19] Justin Clark-Casey: heh, I think you might be chasing down into mono :) [13:19]  BlueWall Slade: if it seems the best thing to get to a release, I can continue to get the mapping setup [13:19]  BlueWall Slade: maybe Dave Coyle would build us a mac lib [13:20]  Richardus Raymaker: yes, to many work still with 0.7.02 and get problems i think that are already solved [13:20]  Justin Clark-Casey: I don't know. One part of me says it is simpler to get the mapping going. Another part of me is interested in looking again at the community stuff since this would avoid this kind of problem altogether, but it could be less stable [13:20]  Dutchy Daredevil: all zippers are in here dear [13:20]  BlueWall Slade: maybe it is in mono, but I wonder why they would include a library that diesn't have the optional methods [13:20]  Dutchy Daredevil: all 16 [13:20]  Cai Laval: zippers? [13:20]  BlueWall Slade: yeah - I'll get that tested shortly [13:20] Justin Clark-Casey: bluewall: yeah, it is a puzzle [13:21] Justin Clark-Casey: I didn't get as far as asking, though :) [13:21]  BlueWall Slade: I can test Linux 64/32 and windows 32 [13:21]  Nebadon Izumi: back [13:21]  BlueWall Slade: I wonder if it works on windows 64 [13:21]  Nebadon Izumi: what i miss [13:21]  Nebadon Izumi: hehe [13:21]  BlueWall Slade: wb neb [13:21]  Cai Laval: wb neb [13:21]  Justin Clark-Casey: nebadon: long awkward silences :) [13:21] Nebadon Izumi: lol [13:21] sim core: :-J Welcome back, neb [13:21] Nebadon Izumi: ya sorry i wasnt here to talk everyones ear off this week [13:21] Nebadon Izumi: lol [13:22] Justin Clark-Casey: I think we're all still a bit awry with the timezones too [13:22] BlueWall Slade: neb, did you test the sqlite on windows? [13:22] Nebadon Izumi: no but i will in a bit [13:22] Nebadon Izumi: let me get settled in [13:22]  Nebadon Izumi: i need to scan and email some paperwork [13:22] Justin Clark-Casey: move to 1800 utc next week so that all the times reset to normal? [13:22] BlueWall Slade: ok, maybe later this evening [13:22] Nebadon Izumi: ok sure [13:22] BlueWall Slade: I need to tset something [13:22] Dutchy Daredevil: wb neb [13:22] Nebadon Izumi: so thats 11am PST? [13:22] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah [13:22] Nebadon Izumi: ok sounds good [13:22] BlueWall Slade: I was in another meetinhg but trying to login here [13:23] BlueWall Slade: I was on Imp experimental [13:23] BlueWall Slade: and clicking on the wright plaza link [13:23] BlueWall Slade: and it never would login [13:23] Richardus Raymaker: neb has landed [13:24] Justin Clark-Casey: urf, have to go back and do some real work today after all [13:24] BlueWall Slade: ok, glad I was able to get here to talk to you [13:25] BlueWall Slade: I'll test and push those things [13:25] BlueWall Slade: neb said he'll test on windows (64) [13:25] Justin Clark-Casey: cool. [13:25] BlueWall Slade: I'll ask Dave about the mac thing [13:25] Justin Clark-Casey: yeah, I oinly have win 32 and linux/ubuntu 32, but I think I am going to actually buy a mac [13:25] BlueWall Slade: (unles you go buy one real quick) [13:25] Justin Clark-Casey: dave would be good guy to ask too - we need trustworthy people to compile these things [13:25] Justin Clark-Casey: well, have to buy by the end of the tax year :) [13:25]  BlueWall Slade: I would if I had the $$$$$$ [13:26]  BlueWall Slade: I didn't have to pay taxes, lol [13:26]  BlueWall Slade: being broke has it's advantages [13:26]  BlueWall Slade: :p [13:26]  Justin Clark-Casey: lol [13:26]  Justin Clark-Casey: you can write off the loss against your t